Building Better Combat Patrols

hello and welcome to the PO podcast episode 104 I'm your host Brad this is my co-host Eric how's it going and this has been a miserable week it has yeah but let's make fun of James Workshop to feel better about ourselves all right I mean that wasn't the original intent of this but oh boy did James Workshop give us some ammunition all right so to uh get into this week's episode and the way into it for something topical yesterday Games Workshop gave us an episode idea of sorts by showing off the new combat Patrol for Dark Angels and it's a bit of a travesty yeah it could be cool it sounds like you know oh that would be a good Space Marine box it has some problems that we can dissect and point at some other bad combat patrols and get into what is clearly this episode's title which is building a better combat Patrol sounds good all right so we need a Rules of Engagement if we're going to actually make combat patrols we should talk about what makes one good what makes one bad what seems to be the formula to make one in the first place rules you can't break it's one thing to be like I can make a better combat Patrol I just need to put 2,000 points worth of an army into a box that costs $150 I won exactly yeah we can't do that we have to come up with reasonable ones that Games Workshop could make and would make in a better world so to do that you know we're kind of working around the 500 Point assumption roughly which I went through all of the combat patrols again in preparation for this including some new ones that weren't on our original episodes that covered this topic woof is there a difference from army to Army yeah to bring everyone back in time a little bit start collectings is what we had in eth Edition SL early 9th they were roughly $90 for an unknown number of points some of them were only like 200 some of them were like over 500 points there was no real balance thought into it you know it was just kind of like here's stuff that you're going to want in your army it was entirely from like a modeling standpoint if you put two of them against each other it would be a terrible game so ninth Edition that came out with the idea of combat Patrol we'll make 500 point games the norm make it a good entry point and have our boxes based around this and we'll jack up the price to like $140 to guarantee we have a huge profit margin and even the worst Army could get 500 points of models and I mean that also means that you can face off one combat Patrol against another and it won't be just a complete mismatch failure kind of thing so that your first game experience isn't bad and then they immediately forgot that it was well intentioned and some of them were flat out illegal to play as the box was made for their faction in ninth shout out death guard woo death guard had some fantastic issues then we moved to 10th and a lot of these combat patrols have not been updated for 10th so maybe there's some awkwardness on now leaders exist so you might have a mismatch thousand Sun somehow got even worse due to this but I mean that's kind of understandable like they were designed for a different really a different game because tenth has changed so much that yeah it's understandable that it's not quite following the rules and in the move to 10th edition Games Workshop very cleverly noticed that they had balanced combat Patrol well and you had armies with wild Point differences so it didn't really work so they came up with a solution instead of trying to balance the points they would just balance the data sheets after putting the boxes together they immediately failed but that's a different topic yeah that's huge brain 40 chess and now we're back to things like the Dark Angels combat Patrol which includes 10 basic intercessors which suck ass half a box of Hell blasters because they just couldn't afford to give you the whole box that's probably one of the most disappointing parts to me three blade guard vets that's nice yeah and then a gravis Captain who can lead none of this it feels like they messed up and it should have been the heavy intercessors instead of the normal ones right like this feels messed up in many ways true it's a disappointing combat Patrol but the point is about half the armies have a combat Patrol that people who collect the Army would not be very happy with there are some standouts some we're not fixing today ad ma hey how's it going we'll come back to you admech next time maybe when you get fixed in general we can actually put together a box that's possible yeah let's give them one more data slate before we attempt it yeah but not the only ones that have been problematic there's been some famously bad ones death guard thousand Sons generic space Marines all of those will get touched on when we return to this topic later but I wanted to do some other choices to keep this very interesting and not so formulaic as to do the most basic ones everyone has commented on how bad they are right but let's identify what a combat Patrol should have so looking at the ones people like I'm looking at Jean stealer Cults I'm looking at custodes though there are some Rumblings on that one I think it's still reasonable eldari pretty loved grey kns slaps as long as you're okay with grey Knight models some people don't like the entire range but like it's a good combat Patrol the combat Patrol can't fix if you don't like an army that's just not what combat patrols are for grey kns does a great combat Patrol and then duari another fantastic one it was like the OG example of how good a combat Patrol could be and then things kind of went downhill over the addition it was a focused idea that was well put together and executed so looking at these we can come up with okay you have to have an HQ pretty clear yeah preferably this HQ should not be able to be screwed up and be built as something else that is not true for custodes just because custodes doesn't have that as an option yeah I don't think that that's that big of a deal it's just you know it has to be clear that this was the intended HQ and then like yeah you could do some other stuff you're fine us Games Workshop would prefer they can't screw that up yeah so when available we would like it to be a you can't accidentally not build an HQ then you have to have battle line units from your army it appears basically every combat Patrol does this with very few exceptions and those appear to be mistakes yeah not the rules we want to follow thousand Sons looking at you bud then you want at least one other unit of more Elite status than your battle line and then you would like a centerpiece something like a vehicle a monster something like that yeah something that is like ooh that's the fancy shiny thing in comparison to my these are the battle line so yeah a decent spread of types of models and then we want to talk about things from the value perspective we want it to be at least 500 points of value based on the combat patrols people like and recommend people to buy multiple of originally it seemed like that was their intended design for combat Patrol and I think it was a good intended design so let's focus on actually doing that it hasn't held up for everyone but that should be our let's try and hit at least that tet it should feel like a functional Army when it leaves the box it should not be a mess of parts that don't mesh together in any way you shouldn't have a gravis captain that can't lead any of the units and it is kind of the point here that was good yeah Dark Angels being the example of it needs to flow it needs to make sense and because we're Games Workshop not us we want to make sure they don't get too much value right so it has to be a discount or no one's going to buy it but we want to cap that discount account you're never getting more than 50% off which is an insane value but technically we get very close in a couple armies yeah I think that that's a fair cap like let's not make it more than 50% off just because it's an insane dream to get there yeah 40% off seems to be a standard decent percentage off there are armies that go over Gene Steeler Cults is famously among them and it's why I recommend a lot of that combat Patrol If you're trying to play genan stealer Cults because it gives you a balanced for while being a huge discount on an expensive Army to make it affordable right one of the things is we don't have the internal data for like what the cost to make versus all of that stuff is so like GW can push things to make it a better discount depending on what their actual internal pricings are but like this is a good guideline I think and then we've got we should have at least the character battle line centerpiece and a fourth unit minimum yeah we don't want any anything that's like a massive slant list you know that's here is six characters good luck yeah we also don't want to have like it's a Monster Mash where it would be very difficult to have other combat patrols be prepared for it out of their boxes that is true and it's something that I kind of pushed the envelope on it's a harder one than the others when you're trying to get the discount and the points right in certain armies and it's why genan steers just breaks the rule and goes well past 40% yeah I think that that is one of those when designing a combat Patrol you want it to feel like how the Army could play kind of thing so like tyranid still needs to play like tyranids you can't just be like eh don't worry about it you don't need to have any of your swarm or your big monsters cuz that would be difficult to balance against the other combat patrols but you know keep it in mind of not making a list that's a full tank list would be difficult for grey Knights to go up against Maybe don't do that I'd argue one tank can be difficult for to go up against but within reason kind of thing so then there are some external issues that can crop up the one that a lot of people won't be aware of if they're not aware of the manufacturing backend stuff is shipping things is expensive the bigger the Box the worse it is so you want to keep your combat patrols of a size preferably also for marketing reasons that they're all the same general shape and have identifiability to them duari is the stretch of this there's a couple armies that are in the duari size box but if you ever see that box it is fat it contains a lot and I'm going to say that's basically our size limit and all of these need to be from models that are already existing because you're not designing new models for this discount box nor are you designing refit sprew and this gets into some of the challenges I didn't do thousand suns I know a lot of people would like me to talk about it it's tough thousand Suns is a very boring combat Patrol army with the rules we've laid out I know what list I would pick it's exceptionally boring the problem with thousand suns is you can only have zero or 10 rubric Marines you can never give somebody five because of how the sprew is set up and that really limits your layouts in your boxes and that's how we ended up with 20 zor zor was the solution not a good solution but I wouldn't go that way but it is part of what led to that so we do have issues on that front where like you can't ask for something that doesn't exist I can gripe about it while putting these together but it can't affect the final outcome yeah one of the other things about combat Patrol or value boxes for this matter is it's nice to make it so that buying multiples is still good especially for somebody who's new to collecting the Army one of those problems being like characters can be difficult because you don't want multiple characters of the same thing especially if we're going with the ones that can't be built incorrectly but usually characters aren't that much of a value part that you're too worried about so yeah on any of the normal value combat patrols as long as you want every non- character in it even if the character is totally dead the second time you almost always are fine picking it up they're just not an appreciable percentage of the discount portion right and the more that that happens the less likely you are to get three or four of them kind of thing so keep that in mind so that buying multiples is good another thing that will come up is you have to be aware of what other boxes are currently on sale for these factions this is part of why tyranids and space rings have awful combat patrols right now because you're just better off buying the starter set and getting a bunch of models essentially for free or selling them for a profit online to get your combat Patrol and air quotes for cheaper and that's without getting into the you could also just go on eBay and be the one to buy this cheaper one yeah especially if you're able to find like the ripped apart versions and trading and all that kind of stuff so there's only so much that can really be done in combat patrols especially for armies that are split into multiple sections or multiple subactions like just say chaos demons yeah chaos demons is kind of the centerpiece of wow there's four armies here how do you make a combat Patrol and the answer was simple pick one don't give a and make one yeah and this this is one so we have three lists today and my wife came up with one of them all right when she was putting this list together she was annoyed because she wanted to make multiple themed combat patrols for the different sections of the army she chose to which I pointed out only Space Marines gets that and they do it poorly it is kind of disappointing cuz like I had thought the same thing of like oh I could do a thre set combat patrols for this F action and it would be awesome and that is an entire episode I am good with doing but we can't do it for this one we have to go under the assumption you get one box per Army probably because some bean counter or market research said this will confuse the lease people and guarantee brand identity for a faction whatever term I mean I there are valid reasons to that that I understand especially of like the if you do it all at once that's great but if we drip feed it it'll be long-term profits but yeah let's not focus on that I think that's basically the rules put together yeah so we can get into our actual three factions we're fixing today we can just say them up front we are going to be fixing tyranids Orcs And The Imperial Guard asrom militarum these are three box sets that are not the worst of the worst but are ones that people have complaints about I'll start us off with the list my wife put together because I think it shows off something very fancy ooh fancy tyranids so I don't want to get too into the current combat Patrol other than to show it off real quick it is made entirely of units that are within the Leviathan box set slash in the ultimate edition starter set which is a much better deal than this box you get a tyranid prime two sets of the easyto build version of termagon not the full version that's on sale on gw's website you get five of the Barb guns you get three on Ryan's leap and you get a psycho phage as your centerpiece it is actually a lot of models at 32 which you could argue is a nice theme to it to show that tyrin get a lot of models at a size if you want to play a horde you may want to look at tanins but the actual combat Patrol itself is not good because well you could just get it cheaper elsewhere yeah that won't be true forever but it won't but the Box will change shortly thereafter anyway so it won't matter at that point yeah that's kind of the problem so it's not like it's that bad no it's better than the Space Marine one which is just awful but there are things that can be improved so so let's go through what my wife put together here she originally tried for a couple themed lists before I I asked her to try for something more generic that fit within the rules and she ended up coming up with a very interesting idea to go with her general complaint and that was to take advantage of how tyrin have a lot of older dual build kits yeah or triy build in the case of the hive Tyrant The Hive tyrant's just a weird monstrosity that does fit in the uh box right yes it does speaking of the last tyed combat Patrol included a hive Tyrant so her lless starts off with one as well and then it moves into 10 hormons to fill out our basic troop it's a good battle line she specifically chose hormigon over termagon because it accents the other box that's available well okay yeah she then went for three zoanthropes ooh technically there's a ripper swarm because it comes with hormons and termagon and then she capped it off with a malice spor now points wise if you were to build it just as H Tyrant on foot and what I've listed off it is 600 points which is solid that's definitely exceeding our minimum to a point that I'm like it could be tough to go up against but it's just not so bad it's $265 MSRP for these models which I actually think is $5 lower than the current box Aster I think I didn't run the math again but I'm pretty sure that's the number I had remembered it's basically the same so it's very believable it's 39% discount it's not bad very solid the key to this list it doesn't have overlap with other entry points so it's nice to be able to get more variety because you're the special one this Edition who gets to have more than one box yeah it's one of those like if you already bought this you know intro box you're not doubling up with the combat Patrol you're going to get new stuff and as far as buying a second one goes you could buy this box again and build them all the same way and maybe change up how the hive Tyron is built with wings or whatever yeah and end up with a sane amount of all of these models you could do it a third time and build them as the Swarm Lord three malice spors is a bit much nine zoanthropes might be pushing it but it depends on your taste that would be even okay but here's the real trick she took advantage of the fact that all of these except for hormigon are dual build so you could also build this not as Point heavy as a wing Hive Tyrant 10 hormigon build them as three Venom throes a ripper swarm and then build a toxic instead of a malice spor I did not know that those were the same that's nice this is kind of neat too because the malice spor is psychic the zoanthropes are psychic the toxicrene is the venomous noodle mouth and the venomthropes are the venomous noodle mouth I'm sure this was purposeful when the kits were built but it's something that works very well when you're trying to make a box set that can be built multiple ways and end up with basically different armies that would play differently in play just by building the the other units right but it's all very clearly still tyranids it's not one of these like oh you could buil this in a different way but like it's obviously a dumb way kind of so you can either go psychic with the zoanthropes malice spor or you can go for like a more melee oriented venomthropes toxic spreading out your spores and causing General Havoc that way I like it that does mean buying multiples is even that much better like just buy four of them based on what she was like showing with this you could get away with it and end up with a balanced looking start of an army like really three is like that's a good start you're fine you're not spending all of your money on these but you could do four without being too worried about having extras yeah you would end up with like a swarm Lord a hyp Tyron on foot one with wings and then however you want to build the fourth 40 hormons is a very believable number that was the key it was one of those like a lot of armies four of your battle line weird 40 harag God's perfectly fine and then you know your mix of Venom throes and zoanthropes and Malice spors and toxic all perfectly normal it's a sweet idea it's one of those that like not every kit is going to do that just because a lot of kits don't have these you know dual build options but when you can take advantage of it that's pretty sweet so do we want to uh get into yours I guess yeah I mean I actually kind of had the same but that's just because Orcs are Orcs And kit bashing be kit bashing so uh yeah the current combat Patrol is not terrible it's got a war boss 20 boys three de coptos and a de dread the 20 boys are the new style you're stuck with static arms unless you get into kit bashing their arms different and their arms do have the issue of it's the split load out you don't get 10 normal Loadout boys that's honestly the annoying part about it but that's just how boys are now really yeah you can buy the oldfashioned ones but let's be honest they're old yeah unless you want to be taking a in the woods it's a power move so I had kind of looked at it and was like yeah I could do like a Squig way boys and then like a vehicle and that would be great if we were allowed multiple of these Perfection and it might be a good one to bring up should we do that topic yeah but since that wasn't allowed I went with just kind of like honestly a pretty simple infantry orc list so start off with a war boss and I figured let's still have a group of boys it's not the greatest kit comparatively in kit bashing potential as it used to be but it's still a good kit and like you can't really have enough boys so not too worried about that and then I got Commandos cuz that's like the hey look this is your Elite fun unit kind of thing Eric was never going to not pick Commandos it wasn't the first thing on the list because there were boys but it was basically the first thing on the list then I got some knobs just nice to have those their model is hideous but it's what we got and they've got extra weapons and stuff like that that you can play around with they are fantastic for bits as everybody pointed out as though it makes them less hideous somehow on our ugly models episode but those arms could be useful in fixing the boys that's kind of the thing is like the knobs are fine knobs like we're doing good work there and honestly fun to play but you know we're going to take advantage of the fact that they do have weapons that you can K bash with on the same kind of thing I went with I guess technically they're the Ludas is the box but they build bernas as well so that's the like switch combo yeah you show it off on the box as the burner boys you want them to build but technically they could build them as Ludas yeah and then hey let's grab a truck because you got a bunch of infantry let's do the orc thing put the boys in the truck and off off we go I actually I like the transport idea especially cuz you got away with it pricewise and I could not when I get to guard yeah so this one it's a bit more expensive you pushed the limit I definitely did 286 MSRP so it's like 44% off which is it's higher than the Bean Counter is going to want he's going to ask how important those bur boys is and that's you know that's exactly where it was it was like you know you could take out the Luda kit the bnab boys I think this list becomes a lot less exci it does a lot of the appeal comes from those last couple being in there and it's nice because honestly this is what a 32 model yeah this is a very hoorde heavy looking green tide feeling theme yeah which is why I was like let's put a truck in it like that was like balance some things around to figure out what okay I can use knobs instead kind of thing cuz like this is trying to do the green tide orc infantry but at the same time there's a bit of fun we get the ludos or the bnab boys that are different and then you got Commandos to have some like oh you can actually have some uh big brain plays with the Commandos hey isn't that sneaky or you can just you know play them as more boys that are fancy but um yeah it's definitely up on the higher end at the same time though like some of these are older kits so I feel like the internal argument of like hey do we really want to give away this much of a discount i' be like well a lot of these are pretty old kits so maybe we don't worry about it tooo much let's get rid of some inventory honestly that's a good argument to give the bean counters to get away with this yeah especially if as much as I hate the idea it'd be like oh next year we're going to release a new kit of the knobs or new kit of whatever and it's like well yeah let's put them in sell them the old ones and then sell them the new ones again next year Games Workshop has never done that once Eric yeah I know um how dare you speak such honest truth this list is just barely hitting our Point like 520 maybe 510 depending on if you're using the Ludas but like if you get some extra boys then you could actually build both the burnos and the Ludas oh yeah because it's just boys with the specialty weapons kind of smart yeah so like you could get to like 570 points if you grabbed some things it's just because Orcs have such kit bashing potential that like because you picked knobs and Ludas you get to do some more things and it's nice that without that we're still above 500 points right which means on the tin we can sell it this way but we know that the community can then take over and hype it up past this point for us exactly and it also is you know one of those like hey some people are going to be that much more interested in you know getting this just because they want to do the kashing type stuff so like we can grab that market as well and I just like this list honestly it looks like good fun I don't think you'd want four of them but definitely two or three yeah I don't see any issue with a duplicate of everything in here so to finish it off for a third example I did guard I am fascinated to hear what you did with guard because uh their current combat Patrol we hate it for a couple reasons one of which is still a secret but there's an upcoming project that may involve something but yeah so the current guard box I'm not a fan I'm not a big fan of cadens as we all know there's 25 of them in here and not much else and not much else so you don't like the Walker I actually am a fan of the Sentinel I don't even hate the whatever the new heavy weapon is called ordinance something yeah heavy ordinance something or other I forget what they're called the new heavy weapons but I wanted to redesign it to appeal more to a balance of what guard is and to be more than like 300 points uh yeah that's kind of where I'm interested to see what you did and uh you got to remember you have to have different things including an HQ so like you can't just be like here's three lemon russes and did you just make three lemon russes no okay that was a long pregnant pause on the uh oh Bri forgot the rules no I actually do have this somewhat memorized and I want to talk about price for a second I might be slightly off by $10 cuz I can't quite remember what the field ordinance batteries cost I want to say they're $50 maybe I'm off by 10 bucks here but the point is this box is only worth $240 MSRP it's low 55 so it's only worth $245 with Eric's correction here it's still a discount but we're on the real low end so it's a 35% discount it's not the worst that's still a discount and like if you like these models especially if you were going to buy kadia go ahead but the problem is points wise it's a disaster so if we want to hit 500 point in guard and we don't want to blow past our MSRP limit which to point out very similar to Jean stealer Cults which is all the way up at like 295 or something yeah we could go hard if we wanted to fix guard this way I'll try to hold back a little bit and save that Hail Mary for admech okay if we can get around it let's not push it too far but I would understand guard being on the higher end of you know the discount percentage so we'll start off with the exact same the Five kadan Command Squad and the 10 Kaden shock troops here's my problem I wanted to do c because you it's my box and I get to do what I want so why didn't you because they only made the Caden command Squad so I couldn't find an official GW leader that wasn't terrible to put in this box really I could tell you to Kit bash them that's wild because technically Forge World still makes a resin command Squad you could buy for C get oh that's so hilarious and you didn't want to mix the I didn't want to do the band thing of going just do a tank commander when you could accidentally not build one so this is where we are we still have 10 cadens and a command Squad as much as I didn't want to do this but now we can say I'm in the spirit of this combat Patrol but from here it gets wildly different we're cutting the rest of the combat Patrol and we're going instead with three bulens because I just like the big beefy boys and it gives you something wildly different from how cadens feel it is a drastic change but it's not so crazy kind of thing that like you can play Kad and shock troops next to buer and Squad and it's perfectly fine you could play more bullens and less Kad and shock troops and it gets better sure sure sure but like you know it's it is a drastically different unit but they work well together but it's a nice Point holder it shows off the two different ways you can play guard of like literally a bug bite takes them off the board and something that's just a big slab of meat yeah so we get some nice variety with the bullens and then obviously I'm filling the rest with vehicles because guard should have tanks I agree yes guard should have tanks so we'll do one classic Leman rust battle tank and we'll show it on the box as the battle tank and not the little Chad cannon that you're going to build it as you little meta slave sure no I mean you definitely go with the big fancy looking guns like yeah maybe we even do my personal favorite show off the plasma one on the box because then you can do a nice GW plasma paint job sure might draw some people in and then to finish it off we've got enough money and points left to want to add something else in here I went with the wyvern it's not online only like the manor and stuff which I'm pretty sure people say is like the worst kit ever to build and like will end up with giant gaps all over or something it's one that I have heard multiple occasions and it's on online only which makes me suspect that it's very true and they know it and they know it I was debating doing a chimera to be a transport but it was really awkward because I only have 10 kadan shock troops in this who want to be with the command Squad and they aren't all fitting in a single Chimera together so it just got real awkward and I decided to not go that route and then if you have multiple it's one of those like okay how many of your battle line are you going to have loaded up yeah it's it's okay fair so I went with the wyvern because I always think it's kind of neat looking it's technically a dual build kit but the Hydra is really awful the wyvern looks cool though at least to me honestly I I kind of like the Hydra but the hydra's one of its problem is like also dedicated anti-air right it's literally an AA gun yeah in 40K in 10th edition 40K yeah okay yeah in 10 Edition 40K all those airplanes flying around so this list ends up at 495 points and that's with the Leman Russ as the lemon rust and the wyvern is the wyvern buens is buens so a lot of these could be built other ways yeah it's $275 MSRP for this which is a 42% discount I didn't even go full ham punch my way up to 290 like get really gamey with it this is a very comfortable believable box yeah I was going to say like this is honestly like 500 points essentially for 27 75 MSRP completely reasonable and because you have the two vehicles this should be pretty reasonable in comparison to other combat patrols like if you put it next to Drew Cari which was my check manufacturing wise they look a lot alike you've got 10 troops you've got two vehicles one of which is like a dedicated tank the other one's a transport in this case then you've got the minor difference of like you've got the weird fivan HQ in guard and a three Elite Squad whereas draro is the classic fiveman Elite with a single HQ so it's very similar looking honestly when you put them next to each other like slap them up there and they look very similar next to each other like a wow these guys are evil and spiky and these guys are modern military looking and they clearly have the same idea yeah I actually quite like it so this is one I haven't tried building these so uh do the tanks fit by my count yes okay I could have screwed up I don't have experience with the wyvern and the Leman rust but based on the GW website I'm good by a whole sprew all right okay so everything should fit in the Jakari sized box as long as I didn't screw up well and that's why I was like because we're comparing it so closely to the Jakari one I was like are we like making the new size no the the duari one is extra interesting because due to the shape on the sprew of the Raider SL rager it's just popped out kind of thing they're extra big you could probably get several more sprws in technically but that gets into a weight thing when it comes to shipping and all that so I I tried to just play it by sprew and there's a certain amount of like okay when you're loading the sprws into the box you have to you know be careful to make sure this one goes here and that one goes there instead of being like stack them put them in so this list is also kind of nice because again wyvern dual builds lieman Ross multi-builds has the lemon Ross and all of its things yeah buens can be grins unless someone's going to teach me a lesson and that's not the case but I've always assumed that's the same box I don't know that to be the case but I'm with you and making that assumption I feel like it's a perfectly reasonable assumption and uh then the cadens are cadan yeah they're here it's what you got you know like there's a certain amount that you want to have a battle line so it's crazy because this is literally a $30 difference versus the current box like MSRP $30 difference materials wise this is probably godamn close but it's such a better list and not just such a better list it's such a better guard intro box yes the Walker I do like it it was in an earlier build instead of the wyvern but the lemon Russ is the Leman Russ and the big thing for me is you could buy like three copies of this build one of the lemon russes as a tank commander mag your lemon russes if you want to get fancy but whatever you could build one of the wyverns as a high ra for a little variety and you end up with a very balanced looking Army at, 1500 points for like three intro boxes and then you just build from there on whatever you want right and like you've got enough troops to like do stuff yeah you end up with too many command squads but until they update the rest of guards characters it's either command squads or named characters right now so which I do wonder I mean I I haven't looked at it if a named character wouldn't be better for this specific case it gets into the whole I want wanted to avoid them but you're right on like technically I could have thrown leonitis or whatever his name is in here and he would have done fantastic but you could just go byy him yeah the character versus epic hero thing it's probably better for a combat Patrol to go generic I think all intro boxes should aim for a generic character that you can make your own and then you can go out of your way to buy a named character yeah but it's just because you brought up those problems for I feel like an epic probably would have been better for the but it's not worth it to make the specific change just for guard I like it it's a nice list and it feels like guard honestly all of the lists one of the things that I guess stands out is we tried to have alternate build kind of things like the fact that you can buy multiple copies of the combat Patrol means that you can have multiple loadouts and it doesn't have to be that way like if we were going Marines Marines get extra cheating cuz they get like 10 of the things but like if you're going Marines and you're going with ones that can't be built that many times you can still make it worth buying two of a combat Patrol pretty easily if you don't go out of your way to make it terrible which it sometimes feels like GW just did it definitely seems like that with Dark Angels yeah I think primarily we chose the the three that we wanted and like we've been thinking about I've at least been thinking about the orc one for a while the guard one is very topical for something that our audience will understand in hopefully about a month so yeah I think the next time we visit this there's going to be less of the oh let's just you know have all of these switch hitting kits we'll see I guess that's a question for the audience too of which ones should we aim for next if we were to continue this did you like this do you want to see more of it give us that feedback while you're giving us feedback the rest of the YouTube pleasantries could be quite helpful the patreon we have may become very important with how terrible my week was yeah that's true and uh you you know if GW wants to make these boxes don't worry go ahead yes it's free real estate feel free to copy our homework here GW we'll thank you yeah yeah basically go for it and one last thing before we get out of here book club is coming up if you're listening to us this late into the episode still you're the target audience check out the book it's the fall of kadia by Robert wrath it's going to be pretty awesome to read through I've been hearing so I'm looking forward to it we're looking to do that episode mid April early April somewhere around there yeah we'll have a solid date in another week or two here but feel free to get a head start on us that does it for the topic though if you guys want more of this please again send it our way but let's get out of here for the week sounds [Music] good [Music] n

Channel: Poorhammer

Views: 48,234

Keywords: Warhammer, 40K, Budget, New army, Combat Patrol, space marines, tyranids, value box, start collecting, dark angels, orks, astra militarum, imperial guard

Id: r5AQ1mjhy6E

Length: 39min 15sec (2355 seconds)

Published: Tue Feb 27 2024