Vivec EXPLAINED! - The Most Complex Character - Elder Scrolls Lore

[Music] the elderscrolls is a universe full of myth legend and fact but the hard part is discerning which is which a task which at times is impossible especially when you consider the magical metaphysical elements of the Orbis known as a place where things can be both fact and myth when you consider the time breaking occurrences of dragon breaks and the machinations of gods and beings far beyond mortal comprehension a character that I think personifies the nature of the Elder Scrolls universe more than anyone else is vivec the warrior poet of the tribunal the most controversial paradoxical and enigmatic character that walked Tamriel welcome to fudge Muppet ladies and gentlemen my name is Scott and today I'm going to do my best to explain the full story of vivec beyond any doubt the Ascension of the Divine Tribunal led Asura's cursed into a golden age despite a new ashen skin and eyes of violent red the dunmer took pride in their new god kings their physical changes only proof of the old gods cruelty almalexia sotha sil and vivec collectively known as almsivi were considered greater than their anticipations the good Daedra boethiah Asura and mephala while the ancient Daedra were necessary they were callous disassociated from the affairs of mortals whereas now the elves of morrowind had gods intimately aware of mortal nature as well as the trials and tribulations that have come with it it was the most intimate relationship between God and mortal that ever existed to be able to kneel before a god and converse with them as you would your father to be able to witness the tangible miracles that are performed before you to be able to see the caring intent of your divine leaders it is no wonder that the dunmer have been known as the most zealous of people heresy is unthinkable and even when thoughts of it arise a society-wide subconscious denial occurs it's not like the Donmar are unaware of the controversies and conflicting accounts surrounding the nature of the Tribunal's apotheosis as is said in the book for vacant mephala it is important to remember that vivec is also known to the Donmar as the transcendent evolution of the Daedra that anticipated him black hands mephala a foundation figure for the earliest climber this darker side of vivec does not appear in the popular literature and liturgy but he's instinctively understood and accepted by the dunmer as an integral part of vivexx divine aspect as you all continue to see as we move further in this full story vivec more than sotha sil or almalexia personifies this duality of natures so much so that it is his central theme his very skin is half climber half Dan MA the personification of past and present he is known to be a hermaphrodite possessing the genitalia of both male and female even his very earthly existence serves as some kind of intermediary between God and mortal for in some ways he is both it is so --this sil who describes the nature of vivec best that craves rideable freedom the death of all limits and restrictions he wishes to be all things at all times every race every gender every hero both divine and finite but in the end you can only leave avec as complex as a character like Verbeck is we must start somewhere when delving into the full story and why not from the beginning well at least from what we can tell vivexx early mortal life is defined by supposition and metaphor most of which comes from the 36 lessons of vivec which themselves are mythological and cryptic and serve a hidden purpose but I'll try and tell the essence of the early life events without getting too much into the crazy vivec was born in the ashpit and lands of morrowind a place that at the time went by a different name res Dane this time was before the conquests of raga the gifted before the Nordic occupation so we know his birth predated to two hundred and fortieth year of the first era at least according to the lessons he was the son of an ash man's wife a niche man being a herder of niches the legend has it that the divine form of almalexia came to the niche man's wife and threw her into the ocean water where dregs took her to their castles of glass and coral the dregs gifted her with gills and I quote milk fingers which just for future reference is a thinly disguised phrase that refers to what sits in a male's Underpants this was done so that the Nets man's wife could conceive effect by herself the divine form of sotha sil also came to the niche man's wife saying I am the clockwork king of the three-in-one in you is an egg of my brother sister who possesses invisible knowledge of words and swords which you shall nurture until the Horta tour comes so I do realize we are me minutes into the full story of vivec and it's already starting to get confusing but let me help you break it down firstly this can all be and likely is total mythological fabrication and when you consider that the tribunal have not even become gods yet it kind of doesn't make sense that almalexia and so the seller here at the birth of avec well that is why I specified their divine form you see because of Kim because of Dragon breaks and other metaphysical insanity we end up with many paradox core but apparently equally true events for example without getting into the other rabbit hole that is tiber septim the conventional understanding is that he became tell us the god and retro actively turned sir adele from an endless jungle to fertile forests and grasslands changing the very past so the land always was fertile grasslands and forests so the same version of the timeline that originally birthed Talos is no longer the same timeline he presides over in a similar way the idea in this sermon is that the God forms of sotha sil and almalexia retro actively go back in time and orchestrate the birth of a divine vivec that would make a timeline where vivec has always been divine now you can choose to disregard that and treat the lessons of vivec as just mythological stories made to emphasize his grandeur but it's an interesting concept regardless the preceding sermons continue to tell of a vex divine birth and early life of legend but today I wish to tell the essence of these events the more likely story at least from a skeptics perspective it's probable that the mortal vivec was just the son of a poor niche man and his wife vivec eventually meets narrow bar as a caravan guard and joins him later presumably as they grew close and time went on and as narrow waar gained renown and married almalexia vivec became a junior counselor to nerevar vivec was his most cherished among narrow vows Council along with his other favorite councilor sotha sil now that's what we can piece together that's a plausible telling of events but before we move on I'd like to bring up Michael Kirk bride's piece that he wrote in 2012 called what my beloved taught me now while Kirkbride was no longer working for bethesda at this point and this piece isn't strictly canon Kirkbride did write much of the law surrounding the tribunal and he wrote the 36 lessons of vivec what I'm saying is he knows the characters very well he had large parts in creating them so I'm willing to take this piece with a little more credence and I also think it's a neat little backstory for vivec and it doesn't undermine existing canon law either regardless keep in mind that this origin is not strictly canon so what my beloved taught me is essentially an interview between nair oviya and vivec I'll give you the details this story places vivec growing up in a city of mourn hold during the Nordic occupation he is a hermaphrodite born to an ash man but was later orphaned at this time he went by a different name one unbeknownst to us as a teenager he was a thug in a gang of guttersnipes that were willing to do anything for money whether that be killing stealing or prostitution surviving was a full-time job and done by any means necessary one day a caravan was passing through ends the caravan guard was narrow var who stopped to speak to the boy narrow var saw something special in him at first the boy tried to sell carnal pleasures but became hostile when he realized a narrow var was not interested after a philosophical joust vivec grew to lack nerevar and saw that he had great ambitions chief among them seeking a res Dane free from Nordic occupation he looked to narrow VARs sigil and saw the V he decided to wear this V twice making his new name vivec to clarify ver as in the phonetic sound and then MEK is the name of the letter in a Daedric alphabet hence vivec that is the end of the origin story what my beloved taught me and now we head back to the canon law but i think that origin story just gives so much more character to their relationship and vivax humble yet gritty origins nerevar would become the Horta tour in general for inderal almalexia whom he will later marry becoming in Doral nirav R now if that's confusing at least in this time the climber put family clan names first in Doral nerevar led the climber people in alliance with drew mocked Wharf King and the Dwemer against the Nordic occupants of res Dane together they were successful and formed a great friendship Kaymer and Dwemer were at peace however vivec almalexia and sotha sil doubted that such a peace would last and ultimately they would be proven right upon discovery of the dwellers profane attempts to create themselves a new god called the new medium war was on the horizon then narrow var went back to Vardhan fell one last time hoping that negotiations and compromise might once again preserve the peace but this time the friends Nava in do Mach quarreled bitterly and as a result the Kaymer and Dwemer went to war and so begins the war of the first council which lasted for years but finally culminates in the Battle of Red Mountain one of the most pivotal moments in elderscrolls history it's here that the red moment occurs a dragon break where we end up with different simultaneous contradictory but true series of events if you need more elaboration on dragon breaks you can check out the link in the description below though there is some debate regarding whether or not this was a dragon break believing that it is just a situation where there are conflicting accounts of the same moment but the main evidence for the dragon break is the supposed activation of the Numidian by the Dwemer their mysterious disappearance and also some of the simultaneous truths that vivec is aware of which we will discuss later on the battle involves Nords orcs Dwemer and karma even a sense Khajiit cauldros era but the ultimate result is the Dwemer disappearance and the apotheosis of the tribunal almalexia sotha sil and vivek so to really understand what happened at red mountain we need to dive further into the vex godly character as well as the duality that comes with him part and parcel the Veck is the most public for he is the beloved warrior poet of the true people paradoxically beautiful and bloody vivec is an artistic violence this becomes all the clearer when you understand mephala the vexed anticipation another way of thinking about the anticipation z' is that they are considered primal forms cruel and callous like the harsh realities of nature and life but the tribunal arose to take these same elements and evolve them becoming gods of a golden age in ways you could look at the gods of the tribunal as civilization God's tender caring and protecting but also egotistical and proud the dunmer people are aware of both the darker primal themes of the anticipations within the tribunal and the benevolent faces they present in the same way on some subconscious level we are aware that nature is harsh and and that humans are capable of terrible violence but it's something we don't consciously think about because we're not exposed to it instead we are protected by technology and civilization but just because we don't think about it doesn't mean it's not true or recognized it's a similar thing with how the dunmer view the tribunal they are aware of the primal darker natures but they are not publicly spoken of from the book vivec and mephala as known in the West mephala is the demon of murder sex and secrets all of these themes contain subtle aspects and violent ones assassination genocide courtship orgy tact poetic truths mephala is understood paradoxically to contain and integrate these contradictory themes and all of these subtle undercurrents and contradictions are present in the dunmer concepts of vivec even if they are not explicitly described and explained in temple doctrine as the story unravels you will see more of his shadow but let's touch on the benevolence of vivec that comes with the unbridled ego your experience of avec in the elder scrolls 3 morrowind would likely make this apparent more owens entire society is based around their theology and the temple politics temples statecraft military they are all fundamentally intertwined for the Donmar their houses like how Cinderella that are inseparable me indistinguishable from the temple have the greatest political power the finest of warriors are almost always a part of some religious order such as the Temple ordinator z-- who police heresy with gold envisage of nerevar or the buoyant armatures great Knight like warriors solely devoted to vivec himself attempting to emulate him in the most noble of ways this worship and reverence of vivec is even understandable outside of the temples theological doctrines he has done a great many things for the dunmer people for starters the Tribunal's divine protection assured in a golden age of thousands of years when morrowind was strong and mostly unaffected by outside forces or influences they gave the people the full realization of Veloz promised land he fought armies of akaviri he fought demons he even had a battle with mayor and stay gone as told in the pilgrims path in a battle with mehrunes dagon vivec gave his own silver longsword to the Daedra Lord rather than dishonor himself by fighting an unarmed foe this so impressed the DRA Mora the most honorable and chivalrous of mehrunes dagon Daedric servants that they now share a bond of respect and courtesy with the followers of the tribunal though we must never forget that they are our enemies it's a clear example of the chivalry and honor that Vivica possessed also of note is his infamous battle with the ruddy man a child had found an ancient dead carapace of memory from the times where Molag Bal was chief of the dregs when this child wore the carapace he was corrupted and transformed into the ruddy man when vivec found him near the boys village and on Nisus there was a violent clash of arms and an upheaval of earth their battle created the West gash Wanderers that still go there he is still the sounds of it swords across the crust the grunt of God the snapping of his monster child's splintered legs some may wonder if many of these feats are fabricated but there are clearly some that are as tangible as vivec himself it is said that the mad God share gorath flung a giant celestial rock called Barda at the very city of vivec named for the God who inhabits it there are other tales and other explanations for its existence but all the same vivec used his godly powers to halt the rock in its tracks before it could destroy the city such power is incredible but it pales in comparison to vivexx vanity in the 36 lessons when questioned about the removal of the rock vivec says I would have done it myself so if I wanted a silly heart at all I shall keep it there with its last intention intact so that if the love of the people of this city for me ever disappears so shall the power that holds back their destruction what it first seems to be an act of sparing death reveals itself to be a coercion of sorts a threat for a faith in vivec shall fade along with his power then the rock shall fall and destroy the city and as we know in the fourth era it eventually does and triggers the eruption of Red Mountain symbolically the celestial rock is made into a facility called the Ministry of Truth where dissident priests would be imprisoned and reformed directed by the Grand Inquisitor the zealous theocracy despite this seems to suffer some sort of Stockholm Syndrome as you can hear now now you may ask what wisdom was there in this why did not the Grateful VAX simply set this celestial rock softly down upon nones verdant earth but listen well for there is a reason as with all things the 3do every day our faith is tested by bar Dow and every day we show our love for vivec and the tribunal by keeping it aloft because it is our love our devotion our faith in the tribunal that keeps it hovering above it is proof of not only Verve X might but of the love of his followers the ego plays an important role in the character of vivec and at first you may think it 1 layered and completely derived from a self-important tyrant which is completely true but there is another side to this as there always is with vivec the tribunal without a doubt protect and provide a prosperous morrowind for the dunmer though without their worship and unyielding love the very same power that enables them to do this would fade as it is dependent on the faith and worship of the people by coercing such love with a rigid theological hierarchy and threat of actual destruction in turn funnily enough morrowind is made a better place because the golden age can persevere and the gods have the powers to protect and provide I'm by no means pretending this is not the logic of an utter sociopath but this method does provide the results the people desire as shown in sermon for vivec was always continuing to advance his legitimacy as a god he is his rebuttal when his godly machinations are touted as mere coincidence vivec knew that to retain his divinity that he must make a strong argument against luck he said is not the sudden revelation of corresponding conditions and disparate elements that gel at the moment of the coincidence one of the prerequisites to being in fact coincidental synchronicity comes out of repeated coincidences at the lowest level further examination shows it is the utter power of the sheer number of coincidences that leads one to the idea that synchronicity is guided by something more than chance therefore synchronicity ends up in validating the concept of the coincidental even though they are the symptomatic signs that bring it to the surface thus was coincidence destroyed in the land of the valar tree and philosophical debates are definitely the calling cards of vivec after all he is renowned for his battle prowess both with sword and tongue he made the case that a coincidence on its own may appear as just that a coincidence though he asserts that the sheer number of coincidences points to a guiding hand a God rather him in this debate he forever eliminated the idea of mere coincidence all was moved by greater powers either those against you such as the four corners of the house of troubles or those such as the tribunal those who make life great for you interestingly it is actually this protection and provision by the tribunal that runs antithetical to vivex philosophy and understanding of the universe from sermon six of the 36 lessons I am Veck your protector ends the protector of Red Mountain until the end of days which are numbered 3333 below me is the Savage which we needed to remove ourselves from the ultima above me is a challenge which bathes itself in fire into the essence of a god the savage below is referring to the good Daedra the anticipations that were needed to separate from the High Elves in a time of velov necessary but barbaric and cruel the challenge above relates to the siddik endeavor which is the core philosophy of the dunmer people they say law cons orchestration of Mundus not as a prison like the ultimate do but as a test a test to overcome so that they can be cut into better shapes vivec himself was achieved at least some form of transcendence through achieving divinity and he witnessed the true nature of the universe achieving Kim this is the knowledge that all is part of the one Godhead but one must be able to except this and at the same time be able to retain one's individuality I'll put up a nice diagram I found that quite nicely displays such a complex idea so have a look at that but clearly to be able to achieve Kim Won needs to be able to hand or cognitive contradictions and paradoxes the strange duality where two opposite things are both true methods of such transcendence have been taught by vivec elaborations on acidic endeavour what he calls the walking ways and you may have heard vivec being quoted reach heaven by violence yet despite all this guidance it is still a near impossible feat I guess it's the difference between knowing the theoretical that all is one compared to actually experiencing it and actually feeling it there are further ideas about all of this such as the final goal of amaranth and the further you go down this rabbit hole the more likely we are to step outside the bounds of canon but the essential takeaway here in regards to vivex character is that he made a mistake which he comes to realize as his life as a God goes on you see by himself achieving transcendence along with the other members of the tribunal and by protecting and providing for the dunmer people then he has deprived them of the very same journey when you have living god-kings guiding and protecting you you are unlikely to run into any grave challenges that may as they say cut you into better shapes meaning you are deprived of the opportunity to grow and evolve from the hardships hardships that have been erased with the golden age of living gods vivec would come to realise this and this would be one of the main reasons for writing the cryptic 36 lessons to the layman reader they are mere mythological stories about the birth of a God King his deeds and the justification for his worship but to the keen reader you will be able to see the contradictory hidden messages within sermon 36 of the lessons tells of the final showdown with the Dwemer with the powerful vivec but if you look closely at the first letter of every paragraph it spells foul murder now if you're familiar with the various tales of the Battle of Red Mountain then you would know that the Ashland ER oral tradition says that naira var was murdered by the tribunal after the defeat of the Dwemer the book narrow VAR at Red Mountain tells it best so allow me to read the best bits back in Red Mountain nirav are told de Gotha to protect the tools in the heart chamber until he returned de Gotha earth said but shouldn't we destroy these tools at once so that they might never be used for evil again but naira var was confused by his wounds and his sorrow for he still loved to do mark and the Dwemer people and so went to the fields outside of Red Mountain to confer with his queen and his generals who had foreseen that this war would come and whose council he would not ignore again I will ask the tribunal what we shall do with them for they have had wisdom in the past that I had not stay here Oil de Gotha until I return then nerevar told his queen in generals all that had transpired under red mountain and how the Dwemer had used special tools to turn their people into immortals and of the wondrous power of the heart of lorkhan the tribunal decided that the Kaymer should learn how to use this power so that narrow var might claim res Dain and the world for their people Nara var did not expect or want this so he asked his Queen and Generals to help him summon Azura yet again for her guidance but the tribunal had become as greedy as kagrenac upon hearing of the power of the heart and they coveted it they made ritual as if to summon Azura as naira var wanted but almalexia used poisoned candles and sotha sil used poisoned robes and vivec used poisoned invocations naira var was murdered then Azura came forth anyway and cursed the Tribunal for their foul deeds she told them that she would use her powers over dusk and dawn to make sure narrow var would come back and make things right again but the tribunal laughed at her and said that they soon would be gods themselves and that the climber people would forget their old ways of worship and Azura knew this would be true and that it would take a long time before her power might bring ner over back what you have done here today is foul beyond measure and you will grow to regret it for the lives of gods are not what mortals think and matters that way only years to mortal on god's forever and so that they might know forever their wicked deeds Azura changed the climber into dumber in their skin turned ashen in their eyes into fire let this mark remind you of your true selves who like ghouls fed on nobility heroism and trust of their king and then the tribunal went into Red Mountain and met with de Gotha a dag off earth saw what had been done for his skin had changed as well and he tried to avenge the death of Narva but to no avail he was driven off and thought dead the tribunal found the tools he had been guarding and through study of kagrenac Smith's turned themselves into gods thousands of years after their apotheosis the tribunal are still the gods of morrowind and the old ways of worship are remembered only by a few and the murder of nerevar is known to fewer but his queen in generals still fear his return for the words of Azura linger long and they see the mark of her curse on their people every day it's a great story and it's important to note that vivec himself denies the murder of nair oviya at least when speaking to the nur of rain we did not murder NER 'var the legend that we murdered nerevar comes from a story told by a shield companion to naira var al Andros all who lived among the Ash lenders the Ash lenders have retained a land row Saul's account as part of their oral histories the account is persuasive in some details implausible in others and is in any case false he does however confess to breaking an oath to neuro var and using the tools to become a God and act for which he also shows for a Morse but symbolically similar to how there are darker under currents to vivex divine dual nature there is a darker truth beneath the benevolent face he puts on it seems that vivec would never consciously admit to such a murderous date perhaps it is because it did not happen but as we investigate the 36 lessons more then it would seem that he has a penchant for confessions hidden in his public works so that perhaps he in a way tells the truth but only available to those the secret was intended for more on that soon if we look at sermon 29 the scripture of the numbers we see a list what you do is associate each of the thirty five listed numbers with a word in its respective sermon so for example if you go look at number six the walking ways it says two hundred and sixty-six so because this is the number six we go to sermon six and look for the two hundred and sixty sixth word which is God this forms part of the secret message which when complete with all thirty-five words says he was not born a god his destiny did not lead him to this crime he chose this path of his own free will he stole the godhood and murdered the Horta tall vivec wrote this in the very same texts that profess a divine birth and benevolence their life secret messages that directly confess to the act of murdering nerevar in stealing godhood rather than being born a prophetic figure it also takes a jab at destiny claiming that he was not a victim of divine circumstance determined or preordained but rather he made a raw oyster II will this is thematically in tune with the nature of vivec while he presents as a wholly benevolent God in person as he does in his scriptures he also possesses a darker secret half a duality that he can only speak of in secret messages a subconscious confession in order to satisfy his mind now as you heard Azeris set forth a prophecy of NER avars return something the tribunal fear the nerevarine of which there have been many failed incarnations but at some point something changed within vivec the 36 lessons are believed to be for the narrow very the secret messages are for him vivec realises that stealing divinity was a mistake and it robs the dunmer people of the journey to transcendence he is watched over the millennia as his children withered in the comfort and decadence of a God given abundant he had denied them growth and when he realizes this and as de Gotha grows in power he knows what must be done it is why the vivec ultimately helps the narrow Vereen fulfill the prophecy and untethered a goth her from the heart of lorkhan but consequently ending the age of the tribunal forever the 36 lessons are both a boastful story of all greatness he has done as a god but also an apology of sorts a confession to the narrow Vereen an admittance of guilt so then you must be thinking case closed the tribunal murdered nerevar the ash lenders had heard all right he even confessed through code well not so fast earlier in the video we talked about the red moment in Dragon breaks how multiple versions of events how multiple truths can all exist paradoxically will this all may apply here as a brief tangent I think for vex musings on what it is like to be a God may provide a bit of clarity when he is asked he says this it is like being a juggler things are always moving and you learn to know where they are without even thinking about it only there are many many things moving and sometimes like any juggler you drop something I'm afraid it has become a lot more a matter of dropping things lately there's too much to do and not enough time and I'm losing my touch perhaps I'm growing old it is a bit like being at once awake and asleep awake I am here with you thinking and talking asleep I am very very busy perhaps for the other gods the completely immortal ones it is only like that being asleep out of time me I exist at once inside of time and outside of it it's nice never being dead to when I die in the world of time then I'm completely asleep I'm very much aware that all I have to do is choose to wake and I'm alive again many times I have deliberately tried to wait patiently a very long long time before choosing to wake up and no matter how long it feels like I wait it always appears when I wake up that no time has passed at all this is the god place the place out of time where everything is always happening all at once there are two key insights to pull away from this first vivec describes being a god at least a living earthly God as being both awake and asleep at the same time and he suggests that the other gods such as the Adria and Dedra are only asleep he also refers to the God place the asleep place where everything is always happening all at once it's a place with no time as he says out of time his experience is that he can enter the god place for eons and then return to the waking world the mortal world we experience and no time has passed at all so what this tells us is that Vivek and also likely almalexia and sotha sil a court in this weird in-between state that the other gods do not experience from an Adria or dataries point of view it seems they experience the asleep everything happening at once as Asura's said the lives of gods are not what mortals think in matters that way only years two mortals way on gods forever which also suggests a different experience of time for the gods what can be inferred from all of this is quite simply that for the Gods time is not a linear experience therefore B does not have to follow a in fact B can come before a or C before either vivec and the rest of the tribunal have to experience both the God and mortal perspective as he puts it asleep and awake now this is where we can begin to theorize a little more on the nature of apotheosis and the same would apply to other characters such as Talos ask yourself this when is vivec the mortal no longer vivec the god and vice versa when vivex waking corporeal form ceases to exist does the asleep God form of vivec live on is the removal of the tangible physical vivec from known a death of the God or is it rather just the ultimate separation of a Veck the mortal and vivec the God and if they truly are or become separate beings how does this affect the moral culpability that is to say if a Veck the mortal did the crimes to create the god is the god responsible for the crimes maybe they are as you may say well there is the in God intermediary but what if that's removed like it is in the future is the vivec God culpable there is another out of canon source that involves michael Kirkbride that many such as myself find fascinating called the trial of avec essentially it is vivec being put on trial for the murder of narva after the deaths of almalexia and sotha sil and after de Gotha is defeated by the nur of rain i just want to share this one quote that discusses what we were just talking about vivec uses his water face a condition that makes him cannot lie and says as Veck and Veck i hereby answer my right and my left with black hands Veck the mortal did murder the Horta tor Veck the god did not and remains as written and yet these two are the same being and yet are not save for one red moment know that with the water face do i answer and so cannot be made to lie the exception of one red moment seems to imply a clear separation of mortal avec and god vivek ever since his apotheosis which is interesting so you can ponder on that while we get back to the canon stuff this conversation all harkens back to what we were discussing at the start of the video with vivex supposed divine birth for purposes of designation i will now refer to the physical waking form of vivec as vivec and for the god form i will use his other name Veck so to figure this all out and explore the possibilities of it all being true we may not even have to use dragon breaks in the original timeline we could see that the tribunal did in fact murder Niro var and became gods and perhaps fervor himself was just a normal orphan boy Albert a hermaphrodite but upon ascension to godhood the essence that is vivec changes there is a mortal vivec and a godly Veck the awake and the asleep but the tangible vivec we experience and as he notes himself is an in-between he is a living God something that connects the two but what I'd suggest is that the Veck God which exists outside of time as stated by vivec himself and insinuated by Azura then he potentially has the ability to affect the past along with almalexia and sotha sil who also achieved apotheosis along with vivec so perhaps it is true that almalexia and south of silver God forms the asleep forms retro actively orchestrated the birth of vivec as a prophetic Living God hence changing the past no longer was vivec born and orphaned but instead born a prophesized perfection - grace resident but because the Living God were vac is waking and is also fundamentally connected to vac the god asleep he would have knowledge of this change and so the vivec you meet tangibly both did and did not murder neuro var in a timeline that no longer exists the old world he did murder him to become the God but the God changed things and created a he who never murdered never see what I mean it's similar to the Tiber Septim tallow situation take some time to wrap your head around that but it does explain why there is yet again another duality within vivec and how both versions of events can be true at once then again it's perfectly acceptable to dismiss this you could just believe that the tribunal murdered nair oviya and at the 36 lessons are just made-up stories that conceal a secret dark truth personally out of all of the red mountain stories I believe the narrow var murder story is the most convincing but in regards to the mortal God dynamic there still remains another question vector God exists in a timeless God place if the physical waking for vac almalexia and south are still die that does not necessarily mean that their God forms that exist in this God place also die I mean why would they I think if you're at this point in the video a really helpful piece we made called the complete guide to the gods which is linked below may give you a good primer on the nature of worship and the role it plays in the Elder Scrolls metaphysics but what I'm about to suggest is that Veck I am and set the god forms of the tribunal still live on in that God place in some form they have transcended and are no longer bound by intermediary living god bodies they are no longer quote at once awake and asleep instead only asleep but this changes them fundamentally without an intermediary living God form to connect them they no longer have that Mortal connection in the same way they may no longer have the more concerns and understanding that they once possessed perhaps leading them to be more aloof and in other ways they are more benevolent because they are truly disconnected from their mortal pasts that committed the betrayal and got them there in the first place it's interesting to think about and its implications would be that the tribunal still exists in some capacity they even still receive some worship albert has the false tribunal to moated two Saints who knows if a cult started praying to vac perhaps if big enough he would be able to answer their prayers with blessings for similar reasons it's why the phalam will want to eliminate Talos worship to weaken the very God himself now when I said that vivec force onif eyes the nature of the elderscrolls best a universe incredibly paradoxical complex and contradictory you know what I mean I would absolutely recommend that you have a read through the 36 lessons of vivec because they are some of the most interesting in-game texts I've ever read they are very poetic and stir the imagination and even today people still debate about the various interpretations of them much like real world religious scriptures if you're curious some of my favorites are sermons 1 6 9 11 17 and 28 but they are all pretty cool and you'll like them if you enjoy mythical texts though they aren't everyone's cup of tea now there is a final sermon an extra one a sermon 37 which is really quite interesting because it seems that it was written with the future knowledge of events which would only be possible with a god form in the asleep timeless God place that would allow him to see future events and write of it in his corporeal living God form let's take a look you have discovered the 37th sermon of avec which is a bending of the light long past the chronicles of the hortatory war in constant phases and ruled however they would until apocalypse there is a bending of the light which seems to refer to a bending of time perhaps alluding to how light travels across space kind of how you can look at a star light years away that has already exploded but the light of its old self is taking time to get to earth The Chronicles of the Horta door who wore in constant phases refers to neuro var in the various failed in Carnot's as well as the final narrow Vereen who succeeded then it says until apocalypse which could refer to the eruption of Red Mountain and the desolation of morrowind or it could also refer to some of the out of Canon coder Michael Kirkbride stuff to do with the new medium and nirn but we won't get into that the takeaway here is that it somewhat confirms what we were just speculating about the idea of the god vac experiencing a timeless place where everything happens at once so vivec the Living Kippur your God would be able to gain this knowledge and write the 37th sermon there is a lot to unpack here as is the case with pretty much all the sermons but what I want to share here is the development of the character vivec in this sermon vivec witnesses an alternate life where he had not become a god the light bent and somewhere a history was finally undone avert vivec remembered the laughing of the nets men of his village where the hunts were good he marched with his father in the ash growing strong in the force and sail able to run a junk through silt at 11 he sunk to an ashcan he became sick after red mountain with the nicks blood and fever and was infirm a hundred years his mother survived him and laid his body at the altar of padme she gave him her skin to wear into the underworld he saw an alternate world where he was truly happy and loved and it gives me the idea that there is vivec with a somber longing for this humble existence he also has further revelations the sign of royalty is not this a signal blueshift female told him there is no rat lesson learned alone which essentially is a revelation that Kim is not the be-all and end-all of the journey to transcendence and instead that there is more to be done the sermon ends with for I have removed my left hand and my right he will say she said for that is how I shall win against them love alone and you shall know only mistakes of salt the worldling of the words is amaranth vivec is the she he because he changed gender pronoun to signify a mental change or revelation a sort of rebirth for the doctor and the way I interpret this is that vivec realizes his mistakes and seeks to write them in a new world a world of amaranth for those unfamiliar with the concept amaranth is essentially the idea that a transcendental being as in someone who has faced the Godhead and persists in existence such as one who was achieved Kim becomes the new dreamer which creates a new dream which is a new universe this is a way to escape the universe of the Godhead and the endless kopecks cycles and it seems that it is the realization of law cons test the reason for the Sidique endeavor that all may seem a little too space cake for your liking and it's starting to get a little out there and the line between Canon and conjecture is getting unbearably thin but it's very hard to discuss for Veck in his totality without at the very least skirting some of the Michael Kirk brides outside concepts or relying on interpretation Vivek is my favorite God and character in the elder scrolls the amount of depth and complexity is what truly makes his appeal the duality of his honorable and darken nature's the atrocities he committed but at the same time did not I think he's just one of the most beautiful wondrous characters in the elder scrolls that inspires discussion for what is getting close to nearly two decades after his first appearance in the series I implore you to learn so much more about him and make up your own mind read the 36 lessons and the secret thirty seventh talk to him in Morrowind read Michael Kirk brides out of Canon texts and soak up all you can you may be surprised I know I was years ago at first I was really opposed to some of the crazy concepts but as I researched them more and more I really came to love them but that ladies and gentlemen is the warrior poet for vak explained to the best of my ability there is undoubtedly my new sheron's small talking points that didn't make it into this already very lengthy video but my job here was to bring the fundamentals of the character to the forefront and discuss the innermost themes of this god I really hope you enjoyed this full story of avec please do give the video a like if so because it really helps us out and by us I mean Michael Drew and myself I've seen that some have been confused by the use of the word we on the channel there are three of us thanks so much for watching all the way through my name is Scott from fudge Muppet be sure to comment with all of your takes and vivec theorizing and I'll be back to nerd out with you again next time you

Channel: FudgeMuppet

Views: 624,972

Rating: 4.9374509 out of 5

Keywords: morrowind, elder scrolls, skyrim, skyrim lore, elder scrolls lore, morrowind lore, vivec, vivec lore, tribunal lore, living god, vivec elder scrolls

Id: Ckp4VSoDbf0

Length: 45min 55sec (2755 seconds)

Published: Wed Apr 29 2020