Do Transgender Athletes Have an Advantage in Female Sporting Events? | Good Morning Britain

we are going to talk now about the tennis legend Martina Navratilova who has defended her comments that it is unfair for transgender athletes to compete in women's sport when I've had letters been forced to apologize using the word sheet but said she wants to make sure that women can compete on a level playing field so should transgender women be able to compete against female athletes or does it give them an unfair advantage well joining us now is sociologist and is Cashmore who says sport needs to adapt to accept transgender athletes India willaby alongside admits Britain's first transgender TV newsreader and doesn't think any trans person person should compete at an elite level and from watcher former Olympic swimmer Sharon Davis who thinks trans athletes shouldn't compete in female sporting events so good morning to all of you India will be on to start with you you do not think that individuals who are born into a man's body but transition to become women should then be able to compete against women who were born into women's bodies I mean I feel have to say I feel nervous even talking about it because I'm always afraid that I'm going to get the language wrong well I'm not afraid to discuss because I think it's absolutely vital we discuss it know people want to blow up about the odd word here on there they are doing what they normally do which is bullying people into being silent about a very sensible debate but you know and I mean I know exactly what you mean and I think the roots of all that is the LGB at the moment is more like the KGB in that no alternative opinion is allowed no the facts actually speak for themselves when you look at the record books as well you know I think I looked up last night there are 2000 men in the world at the moment that can run a hundred meters faster than the greatest sprint female sprinter of all time 2000 1500 of the top male tennis players could beat Serena Williams yeah so if even one of them decides to become identified all you have to do you don't have to fully transition or go through any surgery or anything either you just have to say identify as a woman you know you have hormonal treatment to reduce your testosterone levels to the required level but you physically remain the same and then you can compete in the women's yeah it's poor and it's not just about strand as well I mean I obviously I'm not on testosterone anymore I actually have less testosterone than a natural born woman in my body it's more to do with the fact that if you've gone through male puberty the chances are not exclusively but the chances are you're going to be taller broader your stride is going to be greater your reach all of these factors come into play at the elite level where margins really well as bring in Sharon David Sharon you've competed at the elite level of women's sport it seems to me it's incredibly troublesome the journey that this is all going I completely salute Martina Navratilova for putting a head above the parapet she's been instantly shot down she's been fired from charitable organizations in America because of this being accused of being transphobic despite being one of the biggest supporters of transgender people imaginable frankly you would tell me this from a pure sporting perspective from your point of view what is the issue the issue is if obviously you've gone through puberty I mean India said it or really and if you go through puberty you have all the benefits of having a male body and even if you transition and reduce your testosterone you're still going to have those benefits you're going to have the the bone structure the slightly bigger hearts more red blood cells you know that that's a smaller pelvis sitting on a cycle that makes quite a big difference so therefore a female athlete competing with the transgender a female is always going to be at a disadvantage now I actually said competed in the 80s when I was with with the East German system it was a different process but the same aim was all you stood on the block knowing that you just could not beat this person next year no matter how hard you train and that's why I've come out and said what I've said to support Martina as has Paula you know has has Nicola Adams many people are actually saying it come on you know we are not transphobic whatsoever but we understand that transphobic men and women have gone through a really tough process and we very much support them but actually we also need to support female athletes as well so I mean I suppose you're missin the knees if they if we say right transgender women who were born to male buzzards good bodies they can't compete against women in sport how should they can because what you don't want to do is then discriminate against transgender women athletes what is the fair solution do you think yes second question yeah absolutely I mean the difficulty is you can't really hold another category alongside of the Olympic Games because transgender women and men would be such a small category it would be very difficult to have a competitive race but maybe what you could do is have a transgender Games which could be put on across the whole world by the transgendered community the same as they have the transplant games which are really successful and very large so there are lots of options I'm not saying that anyone that's transgender should not be able to compete in sport take part in all sorts of different activities but elite level when we're talking about people's careers or community you know they're I don't know college sponsorship and and scholarships and all those sort of things I think you would be actually removing those opportunities from from females from younger women professor Ellis Cashmore you disagree with both Sharon Davis who's competed at elite level and India Willoughby who is in exactly this position but I can understand the objections of both of them so I think it's completely understandable but here's the reality this is a 21st century a century in which we are embracing gender fluidity the prison service educational institutions the military you name it all the major institutions of society are getting to grips with gender fluidity and they are going to have to accommodate trans people in the future Sport is not exempted how do you make it for here's once to segregate them I separate what do you want to do here's what I want to do I want to i want transgender people to be afforded absolute equality and fairness right that's what I'm hoping there is nothing fair or equal about allowing transgender women who were born to male bulger bodies to compete against women that is now and equal so it's unfair there is unequal there is something of a myth of fairness in sport sport has never been fair you bought into that myth so for a lot of other people but let's face it if I wanted to be a jockey I couldn't be nature and douse her gifts unevenly in society I couldn't be a jockey I couldn't be a basketball player you might make the cut in basketball you're what six foot one and something like that so you might just about make it but you'd still be a small guy on the NBA circuit we just have to come to terms with the fact so yeah so sport is let me on equal so what about this said what about a smile see my rattle of whoever put in that point you take this to the worst extreme right is which is that we know lots of cheating happens in sport for commode Martina has withdrawn that no no I'm not talking about that I think it's wrong to call the transgender athletes Jerry's now deliberate that is his name to procure me finish my question I finish my question the porn is gonna make is this it is not beyond the realms of fantasy that a low-ranking male toxic way okay well let me finish I know searches happen the top 1500 male players in the world would beat Serena Williams accredited affair of all time right so so what happens if one of them decides for purely mmm purely financial game to put his hand up yeah say identify as a woman yeah I'll have the testosterone tree doesn't even need to do that right I'll compete against the woman I'll win tens of millions of prize money I'll be a champion everything and I will effectively destroy women's tennis right by doing this and then go back to being a man in three years time with my career's over okay okay what nothing federated yeah well let's just let me run the scenario past you again so a fifteen-year-old will Colin Colin decides he wants success he wants the fame he wants the money he wants the celebrity status this guy adulation that comes with sporting excellence and for the next twenty years that's the duration of an average sporting career column becomes Colleen and self identifies as a woman a richly garlanded career comes to a close when she reaches the age of let's say thirty five cause the press conference says I want to thank God I want to thank all the people that supported me especially my fans all and I'm retiring by the way I want to be known as Colin right I'm back to being a man do you think that's a realistic look what I do is realistic is bison are which is actually we see so much cheating at high levels but why why same one ever live a facade you don't think that's a big deal I think it's quite likely that somebody might leave society 1970s where you have states such as the East Germans where women were fed Tara's austere own they were forced effectively forced into sex change this is a possibility it could happen and at the end of the day the record books speak for themselves male record or Himes comparison orally quite clearly a discrepancy Ellis my point was the worst case scenario but take the average case in our going on right now I was in America over the last few weeks right in Connecticut the Athletics Championships right sort of 17 18 year-old level are being completely dominated by transgender women who actually are 6 foot 2 3 inch very powerful former male biological bodies how can that be fit here's what happened there the girl who can't the girl who came ate lost out on qualifying for the state finals and a potential $200,000 scholarship because the two winners were transgender women who were just built so powerfully and was so fast she didn't have a chance and I'm not suggesting that there is an easy solution what is a solution then I think we have to embrace inclusivity does that mean for that well that's what that means let me answer the question then be silent inclusivity means that we assigned the person to whatever event their present day sex suggest they should compete okay Sharon II know you further debate here if you are a man now you compete as a man the whole point is that transgender women identify as women and I recognized as such and that no one's disputing their right to identify as a woman but I'm disputing is their right where they defy as a woman and then unfairly compete against women born to female by logical bodies that is the debate it's not about being anti transgender and Sharon you persuaded by professor chaos theory no absolutely not I mean I think that's the argument really is now I think that's the word gender and then there's the word sex and I think sex means the the biological sex that you were born into and that's going to affect you for the rest of your life because that is your DNA your XY chromosomes or your double X chromosome and you're not going to lose that whatever you know you're given or whatever you surprise important that we support the Sharon how do you stand on we've already had this discussion not to do we've already had that discussion once before actually on the radio ten days ago and you know that I stand on the fact that she should be able to compete if she chooses a truth for a woman doesn't individuals about that's not talking about today you

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Keywords: good morning britain, breakfast show, news, morning news, gmb, good morning britain interview, itv, piers morgan, susanna reid, Talk Shows - Topic, lgbt debate uk, transgender sports, Transgender olympics, transgender athletes, transgender rights, trans woman, ellis cashmore, professor ellis cashmore, sharron davies

Id: I75kfAVF64A

Length: 12min 11sec (731 seconds)

Published: Mon Mar 04 2019