Why Old MMOs Feel Better | Asmongold Reacts to Josh Strife Hayes

why old mmos feel better many long-time mmo players fondly reminisce about the days gone when mmos were far less optimized than they are now when the games were more of a struggle to play the old guard complains about today's modern mmo conveniences like tutorials fast travel quest markers mini maps group finders and the lack of need to communicate many say mmos have lost the social soul they had so long ago and simply answers memories however many of the modern advancements people blame i heard that new world's getting a lot of big updates i'm actually thinking it might be time to come back to new world guys and uh new world's dead if you want a [ __ ] on new world can you at least admit that it's commendable that they're working so hard to improve the game think about how many games come out and like they just don't really go very well and they just give up and then to make new world free to play with prime that'd be a great idea i'd love that were added as a result of players directly asking for them is it possible to design a game to be worse and yet in doing so actually make the player's long-term experience of it better can you yes i think so i i think that there are elements of of friction because that's basically what he's saying elements of friction that do make the game more interesting i think that a lot of those can be seen whenever you're talking about the leveling experience of classic wow giving the player a less optimized less immediately fun experience actually result in them remembering the game more fondly and indeed even recommending it to players precisely because of the fact it is less optimized the answer i don't think about i don't agree with being i don't think that being bad for the sake of being bad is a reason that people will continue playing a game yeah i i don't think that but i do think that having some friction and games between interacting and doing certain things it can actually make the experience better i think an example of this is like like i think the original red ridge mountains in wow is like a it's a master class in what made mmos great you had like a lot of mystery you had like at the very beginning you just had you know like oh you're doing a few little quests then you're fighting the orcs and then you get like quests and it's like holy [ __ ] this is level 27 quest and there's a bunch of mobs over there it's like yeah it's not an elite quest but there's so many mobs i need friends i need people to help me right and so it actually made it to where the player had to go and make the decision to even know it's not an elite quest a group quest you got a group for it anyway there is both yes and no it's a paradox of adversities and it's one of the main reasons modern mmos feel the way they do it's also what blizzard was trying to get at when they said you think you do but you don't so let's discuss the actual psychology behind it as usual a massive thank you to all the supporters on patreon and tourists to keep the channel going more information on how you can support at the end for now let's begin ladies and gentlemen welcome i'm josh drafe i've been making videos about mmorpg design for years and one thing that i hear repeatedly from both old players who played the game back in the day and new players who were just discovering them is that older mmos were better now better is a very i they were better for their time for example i think halo 3 is an objectively better game than halo 2. i think it's an objectively better game but i think for its time halo 2 was a better game than halo 3. halo 2 was much more groundbreaking it was much more innovative than halo 3. subjective word it's hard to define it's different for everyone but with so many old games still online like the original everquest or classic versions of modern games being released by world of warcraft classic or old school runescape there must be some element of design some choice beyond just nostalgia some reason people keep going back to older designed games over the years i've tried to make videos explaining mmo design breaking down design elements choices i've covered the idea of the meta the chosen ones i like fast travel end game abundance of mmos themselves micro transactions graphics level scaling but now i think i've managed to distill it down to the simplest most base reason why wouldn't you call it the paradox of adversity within game design it's not the catchiest title i know but it explains why making something better for the player in the short term can sometimes remove its ability to have a long-term impact it's all to do with the human experience of overcoming adversity consider the following if something say a task or a challenge is immediately easy it will have a high number of people attempt it and complete it because it's accessible to a greater number of people and because a great number of people tend to enjoy easier things the task will see a relatively high retention rate you could consider things like sitting on the sofa binge watching a tv show or ordering a takeaway getting dressed in whatever was lying on the floor calling off a planned meeting because it's raining and you don't want to go it's low effort or because you just don't want to go i think that uh i i think it's not about it overcoming adversity i would actually disagree with that because you can look at something like final fantasy is it final fantasy msq is very well loved by everybody and people think it's a great experience and they find it very fulfilling but there's no adversity possible i think that it's fulfillment and for a lot of people they get fulfillment through overcoming adversity but overcoming adversity is not the core fulfillment that they're looking for does that make sense it's about media reward on the opposite end of the spectrum are very hard tasks with very high rates of immediate failure or a great deal of input effort required fewer people will even attempt it let alone succeed and because people don't enjoy failure many will quit if the first few attempts don't succeed this could be leaving the sofa to go to a gym applying for a much harder job than you've currently got cooking a full three-course meal from scratch dressing up in smart or complex clothes or attending a meeting if the circumstances are against you and you don't want to go it could be learning a language or training for a difficult sports event such as a triathlon it's very high effort with a very delayed reward the paradox is the immediate reward for the low effort input is never as high or as satisfying as the delayed reward for the high input process the intensity of the reward and the long-term value of it is directly related to the complexity and difficulty to achieve the process put simply if something is easy to do you'll feel good in the process but not care about the reward in the long term you likely won't even create i would i would probably say that's true yeah it's like you probably remember more things that happened to you that were really hard to do right like whenever i think of like what are a lot of my big memories from like raiding and wow it's never clearing the first boss it's clearing the last boss or killing a boss with my guild or something like that yeah so i think this makes sense yeah sure to memory of either the process or the reward because it's nothing special but if something is difficult to do you'll likely dislike the process of doing it but then the long-term reward of having done it will have more intrinsic value to you and the memory you create will be much more intense this is i think that's generally true but i do worry that there are some games that make things difficult in order to make them difficult i i think that again like things have to be fulfilling to overcome as well you can't just have something be very hard or very annoying or very tedious and then expect people to gain a certain level of fulfillment out of it so it has to be both because like wow has a lot of things that are very tedious or annoying and it's like whenever i finish them i don't feel good about finishing them i'm just glad that they're over yeah it's like there's a there's a balance between the two we want the easy and immediate but we place much more long-term value on the completion of difficulty nobody wants to struggle but everyone wants the feeling and satisfaction earned from struggling and succeeding that's why we got pay to win there it is right there that's what diablo immortal is there for right there that's why eldon ring was so successful elder ring was successful for a lot of reasons but i think that's one of them you're right don't enjoy the process of overcoming adversity but we do grow from it indeed the moments of unplanned struggle often become some of our fondest memories it's very important i would say so a good example of that was whenever remember call out incoming that mechagon run that we had remember the eight hour gruel run well i'm not going to forget that that was certainly not planned at all holy [ __ ] took forever struggle in this context is not life-changing trauma it's not extremely negative experiences that you wish you could remove it means less than optimal unexpected it means more difficult than you originally anticipated it's not extremely damaging it's challenging within the context of the game it's a good chance if you go camping with your friends and everything is absolutely fine you'll likely have an okay trip but if on the second night it begins to absolutely pour with rain and you discover there's a rip in the tent you will likely hate it in the moment but look back on it fondly laughing with the group as you all reminisce the struggle you overcame it's off i [ __ ] hate camping i i i [ __ ] hate it the reason i would like camping if it happened in the winter but last time i went camping it was like over 10 years ago and it was sweaty intense i couldn't get comfortable it was awful from the moments of struggle that we look back on and smile about we defeated the enemy and we see value in that if you ask older mmo players some of their best memories they'll often tell you about all the adversity they overcame standing selling items in the everquest tunnel or the falador bank completing quests without guides phoning friends in real life to organize a raid well it's like figuring [ __ ] out too like doing the quest without a guide like there's a really big factor this is kind of what people are talking about with like the ikea effect it's like you put together the thing yourself so if you feel like you have like more ownership of it and i think that's kind of what happened with uh with like the old quests is whenever you actually figure it out yourself i think that's way more fulfilling than if you just read a guide or you just follow a quest marker or something like that exists in design a goldilocks zone of player difficulty where something is not too easy and not too hard it's just right you're not going to frustrate the player and prevent them from finishing the game but when they do finish the game they're going to feel an immense satisfaction that they have overcome a perfectly balanced challenge so how that's how i felt whenever i beat sakiro uh that's how i felt whenever i beat eldon ring is i i felt good about overcoming the challenge i felt good it's like i [ __ ] did this i succeeded i win mmorpgs well remember when blizzard told you you think you do but you don't you don't i've heard of that and by the way you don't want to that to do that either you think you i wonder how many times i've seen this remember when you had to like spam cities and say need a tank need a tank need a tank during the burning or save days you don't remember that because now you just push a button that says go to the dungeon you don't want to do that here's what they actually meant it's two elements of human psychology combining the abundance of choice meaning we don't stick at one thing i think that like the difficulty and the adversity i think players don't enjoy whenever that difficulty and adversity comes in an artificial way where it's like oh we have to walk all the way to this dungeon or oh if we die we lose something that we have to go back and do the whole thing over again i think that's the kind of difficulty it's like new world i think is a complete [ __ ] case study in that is that a lot of the difficulty and adversity that new world had was entirely artificial it was the difficulty of traveling the difficulty of moving materials around it was not something that was really hard because it was challenging it was hard because it was designed that way when it gets challenging you can easily switch and the value we gain from overcoming a challenge many years ago there weren't as many mmos so you have a relatively captured audience if you didn't like one game you could go to another but you'd very quickly cycle through all possible games the playerbase didn't have great variety and a lot of these mmos were difficult the players would face adversity in all games such as no group finders meaning you had to talk to people and creating a group could take a while no matter who's on the minimap or mini-maps themselves or even in your journal so you had to write down npc's names and locations no marketing yeah it was it was hard like i mean i remember back in the day uh my mom and i we played king's quest and remember that one part in king's quest where you went out into the desert well we actually made like a grid and we tried to map out the desert in king's quest like that [ __ ] was like from way way back in the day and like i still have the grid i still have the map i think it's in the garage boards or global trading systems so it was player to player trade only no tutorial meaning you were placed directly into the world and you relied on the community to help you and many games came on physical cds and took hours i remember me and zack mccorvey we were actually sitting out there asking what lfg meant in wow and we were like what is this and everybody thought we were trolling but we actually had no idea what it was stall with the process often going wrong itself but it's still part of an adversity experience adversity means a difficult or unpleasant situation and overcoming it is a good feeling now the adversity in a game doesn't just need to be the boss design or the gameplay it can be the meta elements such as having to play a game without a guide being unable to switch servers and play with your friends corpse runs experience debt almost cryptic levels of description for both quest guides and item descriptions older games had a lot of adversity within them and as you know while people like the sense of accomplishment which comes with overcoming adversity they don't always like adversity in the moment people quit difficult i actually think that it's i i don't think that oh i think if you brought out a game like this again that like made you lose experience whenever you die and uh you know everything takes forever and there's no quest helper for it i think that game would just die i don't think people would play it i don't think they'd waste their time on it i actually do think that a lot of players have just moved past that they don't want to deal with that it's annoying to them i think that right now players want diversity that is not a that is not an outcome of like bad design they want like actual real adversity things while this there's like a hard fight with older mmos this wasn't a major problem for player retention because the players simply didn't have many other places to go the end result was ahem yeah that's the thing it's like if you quit wow it's like okay now what are you gonna do yeah what are you gonna do now idiot yeah all right that's what i thought come on back let's go player base with a sparse selection of mmos all of which had heavy amounts of adversity and your choice was overcome it or stop playing and if you stopped playing then you simply stopped caring and if you did overcome it you felt intense personal pride but as more mmos were made and player choice increased the designers saw both opportunities and issues if they made the player face too much adversity the players wouldn't push on because they had no other choice they would leave because now they did have choice and this put designers into a strange position they needed to make this people lose interest that's one of the worst things is like that's kind of what i said i was like i thought that like margaret was too hard of a first boss and an elden ring because i thought they were he would push players to instead of trying to overcome him they would just stop playing that's what i was worried about so i i do think there's a lot of experience immediately very easy yeah it's equipment yeah players leaving but in doing so they were reducing the potential long-term connection the player would have to that system because no one remembers the easy accomplishments take the group finder without it players are forced to talk and communicate and connect bombs will form friendships rivalries you have to time your gameplay sessions to your guild the act of forming the group becomes a satisfying ritual itself and when the group is formed it will likely stick together because the process of forming another is difficult that was the scarlet monastery alliance experience if you were trying to level and play the game and you got to scarlet monastery and there was nobody else there and somebody in your group sucked it was actually faster to teach that person how to play the game than get somebody new that's how bad it was yes it was actually faster you had to like yeah take this person like okay here's what thread is like all right didn't you have to use a shield okay all right let's do that yeah the western playgrounds run oh my god it was brutal so good design i think that players nowadays if you had that in a game again i think this is really the best way to look at it is if you had a new game come out that had a functionality like that what would players do because in in classic wow what did they do well they just had summoning warlocks and that problem was completely removed because there was just a bunch of people there and you could easily find somebody and you just had to pay three gold for a summit you see what i'm saying yeah people would quit yeah and like this is just what happens i think that the trying to find trying to find like these points of uh uh like what's like the word for this these like points where it's like oh man like this is a really hard challenge to overcome i think that if the game ever engineers these things intentionally it always is bad i think that new world tried to do that new world tried to engineer friction and so did shadow ants with the conduits and like the covenants and everything they tried to end they had they tried to engineer friction friction is what happens whenever people try to overcome game systems it should not happen whenever the game systems are designed to create the friction itself process of forming the group is the adversity and the feeling of having formed one is now substantial but then the group finder comes in to remove the adversity of forming the group and in doing so also removes the feeling of reward of forming it it's positive for players with very little time but negative for players who valued the process of making the group the lack of quest markers on your mini-map or indeed the lack of a detailed map at all or the lack of fast travel means you now face adversity of talking to every npc finding a quest memorizing the world learning the lay of the land or becoming friends with a class who could teleport you around the act of exploring and progressing was the adversity that was the challenge it wasn't easy but for those who could do it it was fulfilling then the mini maps teleport spells fast travel and icons and quest helpers an auto run came along because leaving the game before even finding the quest due to the difficulty of the process well yeah because people don't want to the thing is people don't want to play a game and feel like they're wasting their time and i think that's what happens is it whenever people are trying to play a game and they're just looking around trying to figure out what to do that's what the problem is and and i i think that like market actually is a good example of this not being the case because basically eldon ring what they do is they say you have to kill this guy and we don't care how you do it but you have to do it so what they do is like you automatically know what you're supposed to do at the very beginning of the game so then everything you do around that is in service of that goal do you see kind of what i'm saying you don't yeah but you kind of do that's what a new player is going to think because you have to kill them so it's important to have players know what they're supposed to do but not necessarily spoon feed them every step in the process of getting there had to be made easier to increase player retention or the players would leave for a game which was doing it again in doing so you are removing the adversity of learning the land at the expense of the player's long-term connection to the land most players simply don't have a very long attention span or a great deal of patience to deal with failure or time-consuming systems so game designers well i think that time-consuming systems is really what people don't have patience for i think people can deal with failure absolutely people can deal with failure 100 [ __ ] percent people can deal with failure uh people will sit there and wipe on a boss forever but what people don't like i think is whenever a system is designed to consume your time whenever it's like oh you've got to run all the way back to your corpse every time that you want to do a fight and wow uh it's like oh you have to run all the way back to the boss for blue smelter demon in or sir alone in dark souls 2. like these are the things that players don't like because i think that for a lot of people including myself i view this as artificial difficulty this is just like basically a time dilation mechanism that makes it take longer for me to achieve my goal i i don't like it it's not fun it's just annoying spoiled by other games well it's not necessarily spoiled it's just that i want to have the challenge in the game be around the challenge in the game not the challenge to play the game to remove any and all roadblocks to failure and this became a double-edged sword because they were now taking the process of adversity and resulting satisfaction and replacing it with a mundane easy process and no emotional reward yeah this paradox of adversity can be applied to lots of mmorpg design elements there used to be fewer mmos so players had less choice meaning you could make your game more difficult you could add in more adversity whether that's the difficulty of the enemies the quest or even understanding the systems the game is made up of players would have to conquer them and so be given the reward for conquering them i think that one thing with adversity with games is that in my opinion adversity is best whenever you give the player the option to use different tools to overcome the adversity so for example like in vampire survivors you can use garlic you can use axes like there's like 15 different combos of weapons that you can use they're all going to help you clear the game you can use knives or something else like this right you can use whatever you want and basically like i look at it like this a good game is a game that says you have to get the number four and you don't have to only use two plus two you can if you want you can use three plus one four plus zero five plus negative one you can do uh ten minus six and you can get four the only thing that you have to do is get to four that's it and i think that's why games like elden ring games like uh path of exile uh games like vampire survivors games like old wow are so successful and so well loved because players found their own unique solutions for solving the problem which makes that overcoming of the problem personal and it gives them more ownership of it whereas like whenever you're fighting a boss a bad example of this in my opinion is yarn the giant in a dark souls 3. dorm the giant if you're not doing uh you know like an overpowered magic build you pretty much need the storm weapon to kill him right like you pretty much do so it's like as soon as you figure that out it's like oh okay so i just use this it's like you know like i just need to find rock and he's scissors or i need to find paper and he's the rock right so as soon as you find that it's solved but there aren't really a lot of other solutions i like it whenever there are a bunch of different solutions and you can choose which one you want to go with in a game yeah it's not satisfying to beat him it's like oh okay i found the magic solution to this i think that in another way it was not satisfying as much to beat riker either in in the elden ring because as soon as you realize that you just had to use the pole arm the boss died pretty fast it was one of the coolest looking bosses and best boss fates in the game but it wasn't really that impressive you just figured it out that was it so yeah it's you can get to the number four by doing anything that is my best metaphor for how video games should go about approaching difficulty ironically now if something is too difficult players will leave and go to another mmo yeah because there is so much choice it is i don't think difficulty is there is the word i think it's tediousness and time-consuming systems that exist for the sake of consuming time that's why i think a lot of people quit not difficulty incredibly ironic that the design which sets up satisfaction adversity is also the design which drives players away in short if you fill your mmo with player adversity systems which the player must overcome it will feel incredibly satisfying when a player advances through it but it is also far more likely the average player will quit before reaching that satisfaction because the process is difficult and if you fill your game with easy systems which remove adversity it is now much more likely that players will stick around and finish your game but also they will feel very little connection to it because they never had to overcome adversity to get there difficult experience means less immediate fun but a stronger long-term appreciation of it an easy experience means more immediate fun but it's just so sad to watch the free-to-play pov man it's so [ __ ] sad eco long-term appreciation of it you only need to look at the modern day video game difficulty mythos to see how we as players value overcoming adversity the pandaren who leveled to maximum without leaving the starting double age taking down the theater of blood while locked entirely inside mauritania let me solo her killing melania wearing only a pot on his head the happy hop performing no hit runs i watched all born games sometimes consecutively randy achieving the level three he did it's an old school runescape finishing the mario games without collecting any coins we value all these and respect those who overcome adversity in games and if that player is us we end up valuing and respecting ourselves so the reason many players have fond memories of older mmos and will tell new players that older games are better is because they contained a lot more adversity and playing them demanded you overcome it giving you as a player that deep sense of satisfaction which comes with doing that they may not be fun in the moment but they are infinitely more satisfying to look back on modern day mmorpgs have removed i would absolutely agree with them it's like whenever i go back and i think of the the moments in time that i was like man this was such a good game or i had so much fun here it was always in the times that i was like in a place where it was difficult and i had to figure out some sort of way to figure it out or to get it to work or something like that yeah i i think so it's like you guys have probably had that same situation so if a choice is optimal a way in the game then why do games to do sex almost force players choice in which way they sell so badly i don't know what that game is so i haven't really played it before uh yeah i have no idea we've mauled it yeah it's like there are some things that again like i i do absolutely think that adversity for adversity's sake is not a i think adversity for adversity's sake is like it it's like you're viewbotting right like there's a lot and there's a big number there there might be a lot of people like looking at it at the beginning but everybody knows it's [ __ ] [ __ ] like that's the way i see it is that whenever you add in adversity to content and there's no real like nuance to that adversity there's no reason it exists other than the fact that it exists then it doesn't feel good it's like in new world whenever you had a quest in town and you had to go talk to some guy or kill some bear that's on the other side of the map and then after you killed the bear you had to run all the way back to town well [ __ ] man that just took 30 minutes with as much adversity as they can because that improves the early to mid game experience the irony of course is you will retain more players but you won't be generating those very human very intense very memorable experiences that come with overcoming an adverse system it's why killing a boss after a hundred attempts feels better than killing the boss after one attempt you have achieved something difficult the irony of course is that most players won't stick around for a hundred attempts they will declare it too difficult move on to a different game well you have to you have to hook them into it right so you make it to where the first boss is easy it's the same as what blizzard does with micro transactions like if the first pack that they give you is only a 200 percent bonus and it's 39 they're not going to do it though the way they do it is that like by the time that let's say like what's the first wall in dark souls 1 probably kappa demon that's what i would assume most people hit the wall on so whenever you're fighting the asylum demon he's pretty [ __ ] easy uh whenever you're fighting the taurus demon he's also pretty [ __ ] easy gargoyles yeah but like gargoyles are a little bit harder than taurus demon but kapper demon is really hard so by the time you get to kaeper demon you've probably already played the game for at least five to eight hours at this point i'm talking about like first playthrough you know and you're not really looking everything up and like min maxing right so like you probably played the game five to eight hours so at that point you are invested into actually trying to figure out how to play the game but if you give somebody one of those really really hard challenges right at the beginning you are going to lose a lot of people because they haven't had time to gain the investment and the fulfillment that they would receive from clearing the boss you know like when yeah like ornstein and smoke by the time that you get to ornstein and smo you've played this game for 20 hours 30 hours at this point probably so you're ready you're invested you're here to win and that's what the most important thing is is that you want to make sure that you invest people into the game before you hit before you hit them with those huge challenges many players ask for easy experience of right now more than the long-term experience and satisfaction gained by conquering a challenge the skill in games design is to find that goldilocks zone where a game is challenging and rewarding while not being frustrating to the point of making a player quit older mmos had much less competition players couldn't just leave for another game at a moment's notice and even if they did it would be just as difficult so that goldilocks zone was much broader for older mmos i think that it's like that's true people leave for a game and play another one but i think people will come back there have been nights where i've uninstalled and reinstalled path of exile three times i'm not kidding like i've uninstalled the game and i'm done with it and i've come back and i've reinstalled it three times in one night okay so like it's kind of weird it was i it's embarrassing to even say that but it's [ __ ] true i did that and uh it's just because i i ended the game and i was like well yeah i can go play diablo three but you know like so i could play wow again but i was bored of playing wow so it's like well [ __ ] i i've got to go back and play this game and it's like there's something about it that like you want to continue to overcome the challenge like for example whenever i played uh like dark souls 2. whenever i quit the game like i beat it once right but whenever i played it again there was never like this nagging like desire to complete it there wasn't like a whenever i finished the game and i i said i'm done playing this i never felt like oh man i want to come back and play this again no i was like i [ __ ] this this game sucks i don't want to play it that was it blizzard said you think you do but you don't what they meant was they believed a modern-day mmo player base would quit classic wow due to the adversity in the game's design the lack of group finder and the lack of quest givers location on the mini-map yeah before they were able to reach the satisfying the good thing though is that players solved all those problems to be fair right like players solved the problem of not being able to get people to scar at monastery by everybody having warlock halts that you would just pay gold to summon people at and then people solve the problem of group finder with things like discord and also with add-ons like and then they also solve the leveling problem by buying mage boosts so blizzard in a lot of ways was right players solved this problem level of wow classic and value the experience that overcoming the adversity gave them modern blizzard designs seems to be remove all adversity at the expense of all long-term satisfaction so the next time you hear an older mmo player saying they want old-style mmos back what they likely mean is while they may not remember the less fun process of playing the game they miss the end feeling of overcoming adversity that the game gave them but what do you i feel like there's also a lot of mmo players out there that they just wish they were 16 again they wish they could just sit down and play a game and not have any care in the world i think that's absolutely a factor too i think that's a massive [ __ ] factor it's like with classic wow i think it's both the game was really good and also it was a lot of nostalgia give me one second all right i think we're good nostalgia is a bigger factor i think so so 30 years ago for me i think that it was uh you know i played the game whenever i started playing like right after i turned 16 right now i think so uh when kovitz started a lot of people uh i started playing well i don't know about that the adversities they had what's this here uh diversity they had they or they had adversities ahead they were well equipped for dealing with yeah i think there's that too right it's like you're going into something and you it's not as dangerous right i think so overall i think that there is a big overlap between people that want mmos old mmo's back and people that want their old life back but i do think that there is value to having mystery in games i think that that mystery in games needs to be very very uh intricately crafted and the mystery of the games and the tediousness of the games and the difficulty of the games cannot be engineered so that means that like for example running back to a boss is not that's not what people really miss they miss overcoming the boss so focus on the good parts get rid of the bad parts i think elven ring did this perfectly you think should modern mmos be designed with fewer features so players have to push through adversity to gain the satisfaction of overcoming it no don't just quit they'll just quit people are like this is a waste of my time [ __ ] this could the adversity be removed to increase early game player retention at the cost of long-term satisfaction or i think what they should do is they should make the beginning of the game easy and then make you hit a wall that's what i think they should do and you continuously make the game harder and harder and harder that way it's like there are some some raids that are like this like eternal palace was like this where uh the first boston eternal palace charleston palace in wow was really [ __ ] hard and most people didn't get past her because she was harder than the next two bosses and i don't want to have a situation where you should have it's almost like getting somebody addicted to something right you make it easy and then you make it harder and harder and harder and once you've got the the [ __ ] hook in them you've got your teeth in there you're you've got them that's whenever you really make it challenging you you make it challenging over time not immediately or should self-imposed limitations such as runescape's ironman mode be adopted by the game industry and made available for self-imposed adversity what's the best design choice here let me know in the comments below thank you again for watching another massive thank you to the supporters on patreon and twitch live you can support from only one pound a month check the video description for links to the patreon twitch twitter and discord and as always have a great day that's a good video i think so i like that video a lot i think that the topic of like video game difficulty is really hard it's really hard to have a conversation around video game difficulty online because people will always say they want things to be more difficult and then whenever they get that they don't like it josh we've watched josh's videos a million [ __ ] times make sure to give it a like give him a sub if you haven't already he makes a lot of really uh really introspective and great wow videos so i would absolutely recommend uh watching yeah we love josh 100 [ __ ] percent we do i'll link the video again you guys can uh can take a look at it [Music] you

Channel: Asmongold TV

Views: 463,116

Keywords: asmongold, asmongold reacts, asmongold wow, asmongold highlights, asmongold youtube, world of warcraft, asmongold funny, asmongold tv, asmongold channel, ZackRawrr

Id: t41ZIREc988

Length: 40min 13sec (2413 seconds)

Published: Fri Jun 24 2022