Salvage Squad 2: Morgan

this week on Salvage squad we've come north to Yorkshire we're here to take a racy little number from the 1920s it's a sports car but with a difference it hasn't got more wheels it's got three it's a Morgan three-wheeler in the 1920s and 30s if you wanted a racy little number but your budget was tight Morgan's three wheel sports car was really the only choice the one we'll be restoring is owned by 78 year old speed freak iris Thompson she's driven fast cars and motorbikes like this 1950s Norton all her life and she's desperate to get her beloved Morgan three-wheeler back on the road where it belongs hello iris pleased to meet you do I need to you've come to see the moggy please where is it come this way great here we are help yourself a lot of memories in there earth it's indeed of some restoration heart mute all two seats it's a hot rock one he's doing was wrong unfortunately looks like the team have got their work cut out this week when iris put this 1931 supersports away in the 60s it was in perfect working order but irises family commitments have meant that the Morgan hasn't seen the light of day since then and it's now in need of total restoration in this state it's hard to imagine the little cars like this with a race winners of their day ultra light and with a big motorcycle engine bolted on the front these tiny bullets could exceed that magic ton making them exciting prospects not only on the racetrack but on the road too for Speed Freaks like iris the three wheeler blended the practicality of a car with the excitement of a motorbike and that's one reason where she wants to see her Morgan restored now I would like to - down the road with the screens down my hair flying in the winds remind me of those days feeling young again and I suppose I want to keep in the family and I would like to see it back to its original if we're going to fulfill our aces dreams we've got to get this rusty dusty Hulk of wooden metal out of the barn where it's been hidden for the past 33 years that means shifting everything else first including irises Norton es - I'll let you have that job Jerry whoa at least irises Supersport three-wheeler is light enough to lift by hand a far cry from the steam engines and water mills the team are more used to here we are folks hey it's like niizuma hear that list hey relations there's that after all very much but it's lovely to see her in the outdoors again but he's the moment the truth iris because there's the trailer there's the lovely car but the deal is to take it away a fully restore it means that you won't be able to see it until it's finished how'd you feel about that well I understand that and I feel very emotional sad that it's actually when your premises become part of our lives and happy that it's going to be restored hopefully hopefully looking forward to the day when it returns let's hope your hopes aren't dashed I don't think without acting so on I think you're all lovely don't speak too soon iris because as the truck pulls up to trailer the Morgan away we discover our first major problem they're slightly wider than the tight berth Morgan who cut the trailer come on Mama's richer this is the first indication that this car may not be all it seems it's too wide for the trailer we provided which is exactly the right width for a standard factory Morgan three-wheeler Oasis car has been modified it could make for a tricky restoration okay what are you gonna get also these gonna get in the way so after a bit of improvisation it's off to the workshop for further investigation in 1909 HFS Morgan built his first three wheeler for his own personal use but there was so much interest in his light nippy little car that he persuaded his father to lend him money for tools in a workshop and the Morgan Motor Company was born his gamble paid off and his three wheeler was so popular it remained in production for the next 40 years we brought the Morgan to the workshop of Brian May in Birmingham an expert in car restoration the first thing he and the squad have to do is assess the scale of the task right well here we go is probably the longest journey it's done in the last 30 years every way I'm gonna stop it here and then I think we're working outside because she's a lovely day oh look at that it's the posh go cause it is actually RS is 1931 supersports is a much more complicated than a go-kart at the front is a 1000cc 2 cylinder motor by engine pumping 10 horsepower to a four-speed gearbox in the back through a long drive shaft the final drive to the single rear wheel is via a simple motor branch a lovely half I will a talk on the face of it the Morgan seems to be in pretty good shape but appearances can be deceptive some of the original screws that attach the body panels to the ash frame of the car have corroded and they're causing the team a lot of frustration this is a nasty come on it's just a girl it more oh just I just feel like why didn't one off hold on a minute right have we gone around the car at least once yeah yeah yeah we should some of them twice right ok alternative plan with us for the grind them no can't grind them I think that will make too much of a mess generate too much heat on the body ugh what about just drilling drilling them out from the top drill heads out oh yeah that'll work yeah good sport we've tried we've struggled yeah yeah love it enough for No I get your work I know you did I'm gonna fill them out drilling the screw heads out must be done with care so as not to damage the timber frame it also means problems for the future when the bodywork is eventually replaced the screw holes will have to be relocated to because the remnants of the old screws will be blocking the way but for the moment it seems the best solution lovely yes oh look at that Wow finally finally red then they fall apart quickly really well once you get drilling within with the bodywork off completely we can see what problems lie beneath and more importantly allocate the main tasks to the team bodywork keep back yeah that's original side panels we're gonna have to throw away are they yeah no section nothing that's been the big job in solo that I didn't want to sort of look at that and we can save that I think but the metal itself is good what you're into this rear springs clear well they can look at me reset yes now here ah we got the wiring here right down to you I only I don't want the job I'm not asking for the job well I think basically it's a case of cutting it out because there's a lot of wiring in there a lot of uh GFR too much and the source of transistors they didn't rate transistors in 1930 Wellman well how about moving on to Jerry's baby here lay another yes well clearly what you're gonna do there do you think that welcome the idea so far it's got to come apart and be looked at yes there's no way an engine can stand around for thirty years even if we could get it running again mmm it's likely to have picked up little bits of rust on the inside yeah yeah good well damage it in the long run so we covered everything oh yes right so I feel a bit get to work right so axles going to tackle the bodywork Claire will unravel the wiring and Jerry will busy himself with the engine and wheels as for the rest of the car there are a whole host of other niggly tasks that have to be done like reconditioning the archaic rear leaf springs I pity that poor sod who's got to do that three wheelers are a rare sight on the road today but in the 20s and 30s they were everywhere why was this well I'm on my way to the Morgan factory to find out as the team get busy dismantling the car it becomes apparent that a partial restoration in the 1960s has resulted in some quite surprising bages we spoke too soon oh well congratulations Jerry you've found a bit of old bus seat there isn't anything vaguely more than about any of that Oh Jordan to it as we're not restoring a bus the seats are no good so new ones have to be ordered from a specialist upholsterers leaving Jerry plenty of time to get on with his main job reconditioning the engine that's lovely thank you fictionally mr. Fester I have thank you ever so much make it a joy no I will meanwhile I'm paying a visit to the Morgan factory where the cars are still hand-built to customer specifications in the time-honored tradition incredibly it's still a family business and my guide around the factory today is current boss Charles Morgan grandson of the founder I'm hoping he'll be able to shed light on the history of the three wheeler and more specifically iris is 1931 super sports so Charles why was it your grandfather plumbing for three instead of four wheels well he liked simplicity and he wanted to get maximum power down on the road and he realized that actually an axle takes away a lot of power so if you drive it straight through a chain the back wheel you really do use that part but also the other reason was because in those days a three wheeler was cheaper to tax than a four wheeler and that was a significant advantage of a pack and he wanted to produce an affordable car you know that you could run all year and 25 quid as opposed to 40 quid it's quite a saving when I wonder charge we have the registration doctor with our car oh great will you actually be able to tell us anything more about this yeah yeah I'm sure we would we've got all our chassis books getting back in the 30s so I'll look it up great yep well the chassis numbers are 53 three let's have a look right so this come back to the dawn it does the more group does in fact I've got 56 there okay three fantasticks what is our tell agree well it tells you it's got a engine yells it's a super sports panhard red eye red yes because at the moment it's green and and aluminium so but she said she'd seen originally yeah panhard red yeah yeah extra legroom haha and sold through our coal more dealer in Leicester on December 1931 with this kind of raced it may well have done probably at a national level 31 and the three-wheeler was very competitive in fact it was so competitive in the late 20s that they stopped it from racing in its class it started off a lap behind everybody else so fast one time at Brooklands and then they just banned it all together and made it race from a box because it was too quick as a car afterwards Charles offered me the chance to drive a modern-day Morgan the arrow eight and I was far too polite to turn him down as I sped through the Malvern Hills it wasn't too hard to imagine just how thrilling it must have been for Eris driving her open-top three-wheeler through the country lanes all those years ago I just hope we can get her car fixed up so that she can feel the wind in her hair once more so far things couldn't be going better for engine expert Jerry as it gives the Morgans v-twin the once-over it's beautiful in there all the valves aren't nibbled on the edges very often you've got cracks in them there aren't any cracks there aren't any pieces out the edges there's no damage in here it's never had a blower or anything like that top of the piston is in superb condition and the inside the bores nice there are no great scratches down it or anything like that so this site pretty much passes muster it's even oily which is superb news modernizing electrics are one of the nightmare jobs of any restoration but Claire's not modernizing this car she's returning it to its original specification when this car came out of the factory in 1931 it had to start it you had to get to the front of the engine and swing a handle around and our goal is to take it back to 1931 so going to have to get rid of this later modification which is the electronic ignition it's actually a lot easier and go back to the hand crank we don't need this anymore most of these wires didn't really seem to do very much I thought it will ever know I really did meanwhile somehow in the time we've been away disaster has struck Jerry in the workshop typical isn't it just when things were going so well and the engine was looking so fantastic the end of the push rods come off and it's just dropped down into the timing case here which means rather than pronouncing the engine with a clean bill of health I've got to tow the whole of the front of it off just to find one tiny little bit of metal that's whizzing around in there I didn't leave it in because if I do when the engine starts it'll chew it up it'll destroy the motor so what was a perfectly good engine 15 minutes ago now requires a total overhaul better start spinning those Spanish Jerry it's a delay we could really do without more than owner irises love of speed was intriguing me how did such an elegant lady end up doing Steve McQueen impressions in her late 70s the answer can be traced back to the Second World War like thousands of other young women including the Queen as a teenager iris had to master the art of driving an army lorry in the auxiliary territorial service her love of motoring was born and she soon progressed onto motorbikes and sports cars including Morgans after the war iris and her Airmen husband Mac found an ingenious way of enjoying her hobby and making money at the same time when the war ended we had the opportunity of going out to the various aerodrums a lot of canadian returning home we wave to buy bikes from them and just became very very involved in buying bikes when that source finished we found that we could also buy vehicles that are being stored throughout the war so we would take off and go by bike bring it back we found an empty showroom stick it in the window and we were literally queueing to buy bikes as well as motorbikes iris started buying and selling sports cars - and that's how the Morgan came into her possession but it wasn't long before Mac put an end to irises thrill-seeking ways I've married my husband who returned back from Belfast and we had started a family and when the first one was born I was grounded outings with the Morgan and the motorbike became few and far between but now at the grand old age of 78 Iris misses the Morgan desperately and she's told Mack that she wants the chance to cruise those country lanes in it again before passing it down the generations to her grandchildren sad because I'm getting to the twilight of my life if you like and it's um I'm gonna have one last Ling back at the workshop axel was making a start on his main task the body panels the Morgan 3 wheelers bodywork is made up of hand formed aluminium panels attached to a timber frame most of the panels on our morgan need replacing it's an arduous task is axial up to the challenge first job is to cut the aluminium down to size this is done using a guillotine but good results this process requires someone with axles impressive hand-eye coordination axl is making one of the panels that runs alongside the passenger compartment these need a flange along the lower edge to attach them to the timber frame this is a tricky process aluminium is quite easy to damage and one false move can take him back to the drawing board yeah that's good the aluminium now needs to be bent to match the curvature of the timber frame with the aid of this precision metal press clever tall lovely that's what it does Ben's mill it's now time to attach the panels to the Morgan go by Colin if it doesn't I'm leaving it right um but a problem from the past is about to rear its ugly head this is the drill time but we've got me a little problem only because it might hit these Oh got all the screws in there I'm not very taken it out all right well what you got to do it I'll turn it on the measure when they drill the new holes through the aluminium panels avoiding the old screws buried in the wood underneath is going to be like a game of battleships axles go into great lengths to make sure the odds are stacked in his favor go big sign saying drill here claps you know I'm like I'd be all over the place otherwise people you haven't really yeah Forrest wants me off no listen up um slightly go to one side then I mean booth time been around it mm-hmm don't make the hole bigger though yup it poor old axle despite his meticulous preparation this was always going to be a very tricky job to get right but at least the chances of Claire hitting another screw must now be next to nil all right actually I don't people be happy it's something you do you girl just push it anything you want Emile you off I thinking right I push the metal through school it ah don't go too far yet here on my right playing on every single one is here what's a tree surprising well no okay try just try this let's try just try putting the self-tapping see it it'll Bend round because obviously got a little hole metal there and put it in it might just skip down the side of it I think I'm right in the center these scrolls are beyond a joke beyond a joke I still like this car let's hope that it's not all as hard as this a restoration is already behind schedule and we can't afford any more delays that was all right yeah would ya sounds like wood again it at last the screws are going in smoothly it's been a trying day for excellent Claire but I'm sure I can brighten things up I'm telling them about a great day out I've had hi you all alright how's it going yeah well a bit bit bit up against it me really don't we get Oh will you been up to I've had to go in the new Morgan we're just absolutely fantastic life for you mate yeah and also while I was there I tracked down the original paint welcomes its pen hard red apparently that is what this car was painted in original so not move Italian listen mate we've got tons to do kudos a favor yes well at least wings the what leaf springs what's with them they're naked and we need them redone we don't know who turning to or what - but you ain't got times do it really well actually could be sorry to do that yeah are you like see you later silly hopefully to the dog again I've very kindly volunteered to deliver the Morgan's rear leaf springs to specialist Kyle Jones reconditioning right let's have a quick look at them yeah they look a bit tired to me because ooh we've been hardened and tempered what Allen and tempered shut the name of dance troupe now unfortunates not it's what we did to Springs when they look a bit tired well let's do our Springs then well looking at them they do look a little bit worn on the main leaf so I think we need to replace the main leaf great far away well I think you're better get me boards on for me leaf springs are a rudimentary but incredibly durable form of suspension a 200 year old British invention originally designed to make horse-drawn carriage journeys a bit less bone-shaking and they're still used on many vehicles today including sophisticated four by fours they are made from layers of spring steel bolted together through the center of the leaves attached at one end to the chassis and to the axle at the other the Morgan Springs need to be reconditioned through hardening and tempering a process of heating in a furnace and cooling in oil they also need new main leaves which I'm going to make now or so I'm told all Springs are made out of the m45 silicon manganese springs Dale cause they are basically this is it and for your mind is what we need is inch and a quarter wide bit quarter thick so looking at the stops it'll talk this is it here bitte along this so on it yeah but we need to cook it off on the guillotine but we have to be really careful because this guillotine can slice through spring steel it's four inches wide and nearly an inch thick that's the magic lever give it a push power push it again that's some power there the hardening part of the reconditioning process requires heating to 1,100 degrees Celsius then the leaves are taken out of the furnace and bent into shape if you put them back on the car now they'd be so brittle they shatter going over the first bump so this is where the tempering process comes in the leaves are quenched in oil then reheated to 800 degrees which changes the metal at a molecular level giving it flexibility after that they're ready to be reassembled which apparently is child's play right this carpeting comic I can it bill at Makar no yeah easy that's the one hey voir to finish springs fantastic just leave it to Suggs back at the workshop Claire was getting in a bit of a tangle with the Morgans wiring I've been lumbered with doing electrics on the car which on a modern can't be a nightmare but this is fantastic I've got the wiring diagram and there's no air conditioning as the CD players no electric windows it just looks so simple it's fantastic all I've got to do is link up the battery the Dynamo the lights the horn and clocks on the dashboard that's unusual one of the main restoration tasks seems to be quite straightforward so let's leave it to Claire while we dig a little deeper into the psyche of the Morgan owner at the 3 wheeler clubs and you'll get together Morgan's got a character of its own unique they're very much like their drivers I think certainly some of these right here that's how it was bought that's the car as it was bought in 1981 and it's been completely rebuilt from those pieces and put back together again took rather a long time between going to work and bringing up the family and so on but it lost its fish these days the tendency is to try and revert back to the original specification and there are cars here today where people have achieved this and other people take a different view they like to keep all the modifications because it's part of the cars life part of its history so that's why they all look different which reminds me our Morgan is wider than your average three wheeler so is that an unwelcome modification or part of the cars character discuss alright well what do you think flavor okay nice yeah it's starting look lovely yes way wide isn't it Brian it is wide yes it is yeah because I've seen a few of these that does look a lot wider than the ones I see well I know the Theo well I mean only about 48 at maximum now this one here is 52 how many really is a bit too wide isn't it Brian I mean we shouldn't we cut it down to make it look like the ones I've seen oh no it would no I don't even though we shouldn't do that no cuz I mean this is original it hasn't been done by budget or anything it's see now that's original tubing and though I would say keep this definitely definitely because I mean it was done for a purpose and we don't know what the purpose is at the moment but it might just mean for stability it might have been for racing no I would say no leave it like it is and if not got it down let's change everyone oh that's right yeah that's right yeah I don't see the point ah you can't be but this white girl don't look at me but it's been done which Dean don't be done professionally and it might have been done by the factory and so I mean that says something's and someone's gonna deliver what he done there so what I keep it yeah Brian gets his way whoever widened the car made a very good job of it and now it's part of the Morgans history and individuality the modification stays engine expert jerry has been up to his neck in nuts and bolts trying to iron out the engine problem that's put the restoration well behind schedule but he's working day and night to get it finished and now the engine is totally overhauled and ready to go back on the car so as a special treat his next job is to prepare the rather tired looking wheels for reconditioning giving Gerry the chance to show off his legendary barn dancing skill only Jerry could make a song-and-dance out of taking off a tire get a move on you big ninny even though she's in her late 70s iris hasn't slowed down and her wish to pass her beloved Morgan down the generations makes me wonder whether her kids have inherited her love of speed judging by this home movie I think the answer could be yes hahaha in this family of strong women it seems fitting that Paris wants to pass the Morgan down her daughter's side of the clan but what does Jillian who's now grown up with a boy and girl of her own think of Motor med mum iris she's very unique she still is the 17 year old who first started riding bikes for her father and delivering them just it has it in her blood which I think probably goes through I think Nicholas probably very excited when you hear the sound of that car you can't help but be excited iris hopes that her grandchildren Nicola and Oliver will be next in line for a go in the Morgan that's if she doesn't hog it all to herself but this car will not be kept as a museum piece in that garage I can tell you that I would think that shortly after you lot have gone that will be out and who knows where I will go with me driving it probably possibly you driving in hey what's going on is this really a creature from another planet well in a manner of speaking yes it's Jerry but there's a very good reason why he's dressed up in 50s sci-fi gear the Morgans Will's have become corroded over the years and shock blasting is the quickest way to take off the rusty surface to uncover the virgin steel underneath it's a violent process chilled iron granules fly out of the tungsten carbide nozzle at 180 miles per hour like a continuously firing shotgun if you make a slip it could be curtains even with the protective clothing but this job seems to be in safe hands let's see what shock Blaster Paul joins thinks of Gerry's handiwork do you got a very good job actually not bad you couldn't almost taken up as a profession well done excellent now we've uncovered the bare metal of the wheels we need to cover it up again to protect it from the elements and this is where powder coating comes in it's not just a simple spray paint job the process is quite ingenious now why is there a wire here that's a her think a ball electro statically sprayed on this powder the new modern form a version explained just dry particles of powder very very fine yeah polyester so this isn't a spray gun in the strictest sense it's merely for flicking it out yeah and it's being attracted to it gauge and charged up every single particle of powder there's like millions of millions of particles powder passing over the edge of the electrode in the gun yeah charge you up and it sticks to it through all its electromagnets sticks to it like the proverbial chill blanket yes air sander off we go come on at the squid squirt basic books normal trigger Oh tiger oh yeah give you a party don't you hear a joke of me fund about six inches away the gentle ball simple as that all right I can do that absolutely great blend that's ready starving and right hip knee up an omelet - under the greasy right all day long as if you feel keep taking in the oven on his gig Oh jeepers never never play mister so maybe cook lunch I won't do it it's just time for a nice cup of tea while the wheel is cured at 200 degrees let's gas mark 6 for 20 minutes this process melts and hardens the powder you look so very hard dinner's ready should be cooked he was just in close wow that's hot look that unfinished article yeah courtesy facing the other we thrilled with that together the silicon side the temperature all right we'll stay so for about 20 minutes well that looks fantastic back at the workshop with the body panels on it's time to see what the car looked like in its original panhard red oh it's really is really thick yeah up and down or side to side boom tight ending up and down those is the same wage type because you get cross boss yeah that's right yeah other side cycles a little out right you go side by side are you better go diagonally now okay with the paint going on the Morgan the feeling grows at the end of the project is finally in sight but even now there are some niggly tasks that still need finishing the speedometer has to be fitted into the dashboard but it's come back from being reconditioned by a specialist with a rather frustrating fault yeah all right we've got one problem the face of the clock won't come off so we can't stick it in this - here we think the problem is where they've reconditioned his clock this black coating they've actually put the face on why it's wet so we can't unscrew it and forgotten scrote accompanying the dash and a compliment - we can't put the Y's in the back from the speedo so in Brian aqaq this ingenious idea of trolley user did you try as hard as you can do with those gloves can I try this I try - I almost fainted you know yeah not really the right thing to do no at a hundred and fifty pounds of time let's go gently using an oil filter remover on this fragile instrument is definitely not in the manufacturers handbook any breakages now could be costly in terms of time and money we've got to break the glass if we announcer so you're going to go now I'm going to go that way yes I'll go it'll turn it that's Clough turn it now coffee's turning this is the olive oil you usually think of braces or they're gonna we're gonna mark the chrome bezel clam bake yeah yeah Andy okay Plan B is using a piece of masking tape to protect the chrome bezel that surrounds the speedometer will it be any more successful than the cloth I wonder okay yeah nope well I think we probably had only how many talk pounds on there but well we've cut through the tape there we have we damage the bezel betts torn it well cracked it actually the bezel has a minut fracture and even after all that effort it's still not budging as we've got to get the morgan back to iris tomorrow there's no time for half-measures so excellent Brian we'll have to take the last resort that's cutting a new hole in the dashboard to accommodate the lug on the side of the speedo then they can feed the speedometer through the front of the dash instead of the back without having to remove the bezel in engineering terms it's a budge a good one but a BA Joule the same Oh lovely whoo-hoo he wears our wills away and there goes giving a little tongue a battle with the bezel has really screwed things up there are now only just hours left so it's time for the team to roll their sleeves up at last the car is back in one piece and it looks stunning and now for the scary bit will Claire's new simplified wiring work and will Jerry's troublesome engine overhaul be up to scratch just needs a final tuning now filter life nearly perfect if slightly brutish v-twin engine note typical Gerry he kept his guessing but got there in the end with the restoration complete we can't wait to watch irises face when she sees how this little sports car has been transformed from this into this but before that happens we're going to make that surprise just a little bit more special while I Wine and Dine iris and husband Mac at a local restaurant the team are about to find themselves on the wrong side of the law but for all the right reasons it's quite late at night everyone's out dinner and we're on our way in we're Aris house while she's out scoffing with its slugs in the dead posh hotel and what we gonna do is a spotter reverse Bergling while she's out we're gonna put them organ back so no piece on the wall oh yeah it's gonna be an earlier point turn - okay somebody that's where he's bouncing straight seams beautifulness hurry up team I'm on my third bottle of wine as it is let's go ouch this is the key but not to the Morgan to the barn is currently hiding him it's the same barn that they rusting in for 30 years now it's transformed and it's waiting its owner iris good morning good morning iris not an it's that fabulous how do you feel Oh anxious yeah thanks active been awake since daybreak well iris I've got to be completely truthful and say to you we haven't been completely honest cuz it's not quite as far away as we said it was really no in fact it's just around the corner if you like to come with me really yeah they're not joking though yes don't believe it gosh go oh good I can't believe it speechless faceless anybody else know about this Oh any beautiful you can't believe it it's alright then that's a second dream come true is it gorgeous gorgeous picture I will the family where the family with Nicollet well then this is a toy car for you ha ha ha look at that sit down is there it sit down and stare it good tiger come on stare it oh yeah driving the car yeah I'm not going to be yours when you big boy and you'll throw up oh yeah mom's be near the stairs yeah so I should Willie so we get it started please please let's get the key little things beforehand fingers crossed yeah not Sylvania centralized yeah if you put your full of accelerator a little bit I will but I wasn't doing till you Tomita we could smell it was living look like we've got a motor mystery on our hands but who are the suspects surely Jerry can't be to blame after he acquitted himself so well overhauling the engine what about Claire with her modified elect race oh no surely mild-mannered master mechanic plan he can't be the culprit oh ah yes which dog what she's not off the hang of every 30 years she's driven a Morgan gets in its pirouettes immediately it's not just a special day for iris how many teenagers get their first driving lesson in a 1931 three-wheeler sports car looks like granddaughter Nicola is following in Iris's footsteps cheese caught the Morgan bug too you

Channel: The Hot Red fox

Views: 22,580

Rating: 4.7557254 out of 5

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Id: RyED5d_2UmM

Length: 46min 59sec (2819 seconds)

Published: Wed Nov 02 2016