Even The Kia Dealer Couldn't Fix It!

[Music] thank you viewers welcome back to the South Main Hall Channel That's the 2015 Q it's a Sorrento it's got the big 3-3 I believe it is a GDI and it cranks but won't start now the ladies had it at the Kia dealer and she's had another local shop here and nobody can make heads or tails of it I guess and I believe that's because it usually starts when they get it there when it dies they go over and they beat on the fuse box and then it starts so I'm told but now it doesn't start at all so it's our stab at it to see if we can't figure out what's going on with it the tow truck just dropped it off and it still doesn't start so that's good and apparently the lady got a little upset at today and punched a hole through the fuse box and it still didn't start so that's even better you don't want to mess with this lady [Music] foreign however this is going to be real embarrassing the gaslight's on and the gauge doesn't move off e is the first thing I notice um let's uh let's give her a little something just to see I hate to be this stupid but let's find out here let's give her a little more of the good stuff here this out of curiosity all right let's light this candle [Music] all right negative Ghost Rider so it wasn't that simple I would think if we were just out of gas which it appears to be or if we've lost power to something and it doesn't have the fuel sending unit's not working correctly something I would have thought that it would have sorted just a little bit right there so we'll put the lid back on that scrap that idea and we will continue on with our diagnosis we'll just do a quick visual inspection here see if there's any rodent damage or something like that and then we'll see what we're missing are we missing spark are we missing fuel are we missing both it is GDI probably jumped the gun a little bit with this but I tell you what I've had enough Vehicles towed in out of fuel to learn my lessons visual inspection looks fine I don't see anything out of the ordinary uh you know like say other than the fuel gauge being all the way down to empty I don't want to go touching anything just yet uh altel's just getting fired up here this is a Kia we're gonna let it go through and do a system scan to see do we have any codes do they give us any direction if they do great if not then so be it and it is a 3-3 so I'll let this go through and do its thing and tell us what's wrong with it right because that's what the big computer does we're waiting for that I gotta do some investigation in here man it smells amazing up here you didn't know what any muffins remember I didn't know what you was making I thought there was some kind of hipster muffin you were making no wow regular old muffin are you taking all of them with you I asked you you didn't explain in detail you didn't ask any questions okay is it too late to ask for some muffins maybe maybe it's too late maybe not we have some Muppets please I appreciate you yeah okay let's see what we have here we're gonna go to the report I'm gonna skip that the survey says limp home mode Force limited power limited RPM ECM PCM relay control circuit open well that's helpful and throttle actuator we don't care about that system voltage so this one I care about the 560 but I really care about this one uh 685 ECM PCM power relay control circuit open I don't know much about the Kias but I imagine that's a big deal and cam timed out like well Let's uh focus our effort here p0685 although all of these are active codes this is the one let's look at 685 and 560. so I know it's not everybody's cup of tea to you know spend time looking stuff up however you have to I don't have the p0685 code set criteria memorized for Kia or anything really that for that matter well we're going to spend a little bit of time here looking to see uh and to get some direction we may have to look up some some diagrams and things like that but we need to look at the code set criteria first and foremost to see what what the thing's made of uh so let's have a look here Joe we'll go write general information uh PCM controls the ground path to the main relay control coil the other side of the main relay coil is fuse battery positive okay let's see what all this says PCM checks the main relay control circuit every 10 seconds if it detects an open or a short we'll get the 685 code so that's good to know um get our stuff here main relay has a fall engine running 685 or we can get these codes here what other codes that we have we had a 2106 and a 2110 so this is helpful to know we have this 2106 can set at the same time which is the forced limited power oh yeah it says right here you ding dong let's see here we'll just keep clicking through these okay gives us our resistance of the control side of the relay if we need that okay it gives us something to look at so the GDs that's your factory scan tool for your Hyundai Kia and go here let's see wiring inspection terminal power control circuit inspection maybe this will give us a okay gives us a few little details there verification component inspection all right so I kind of see what's uh what's going on here substitute a known good PCM that's where every flow chart always ends so that's why we don't use flow charts but we get a little bit of data out of them so let's find a wiring diagram now that we know a little bit about it or we at least know what PCM is looking for which is this is pretty interesting what I want to see what I'm curious about is this PCM power relay what does it what does it turn on and um you know what can we learn from there so let's go right to a wiring diagram let's find a wiring diagram here all right we'll go for a color diagram because they're a little easier to navigate through initially and we want to find the PCM what are they going to call it the power relay maybe we can just cheat a little bit here it's memory power let's try to find the word power relay here power power ground power steering sometimes this works but not in this case reduce um PCM I'm not gonna find it that way let's see I probably I've already skipped past it a few times we have engine control relay sometimes the terminology on protemand is different than what it is a service data so we are a fuse relay box do a pump relay control so we have this engine control relay I don't know if this is the one it's talking about I'm going to pop back into service data and see uh if it gives us some circuit numbers or something there I won't bore you guys with all that but once we find out which relay we're going after then we'll uh we'll go after it did a little poking and I see I see what I see sometimes Hyundai Kia service data can be kind of tricky to navigate of course I don't work on a lot of these so I'm not super familiar with it but here's the under hood fuse box they show which when I zoom in on it it's you can't it's not very legible but they have this EMS box over here which is another part of this fuse box which houses this main relay the the terminology of this thing changes quite a bit through service data so we're going to go with main relay um and then when we click on this box this EMS box which I'm assuming it pulls out um of the main box because it shows all these fuses and then these two relays and I don't know if they're built in or they're integrated we're going to go into the hood and have a look but it says you know main relay fuel pump relay that's all it shows is is the description here um and it shows the fuel pump relay here and a main relay here so that's kind of interesting and then a bunch of fuses you know the fuel pump ECU injectors and I'm curious if when this main relay turns on it turns on all of this stuff is what I'm guessing um this looks like connectors on the bottom so I'm curious to know if those relays are integrated or if they're replaceable um let's tell all the circuits it protects so it would make sense if that was down all this was dead so let's have a look under the hood real quick so this right here is that EMS block and I see it's got a lot of pick marks on it where somebody's you know had dug it out and then I see you know that's the section that's missing from where she put her fists through it um I don't want the vehicle to accidentally start that showed our relays like in this vicinity and I don't know if they're on the bottom of that EMS block so I'm hesitant to pull it out at the current moment let's go back to our diagram now that we've learned some stuff let's just I guess real quick we can make sure that the vehicle doesn't start because that's really important we haven't fiddle with anything other than pull that lid off let's be certain okay so that's good at least it still doesn't start um I think what we need to do we need to go back to our diagram find the relay on there see if this all makes sense to us and then see what kind of testing we can do without fiddling I'm just afraid that the vehicle is going to start we're going to assume that this is the correct relay which I I believe it is and the problem that it's having an issue with is this brown and black wire right here so that's the control side that comes all the way down that should go to the PCM yeah engine control relay here we go so PCM left corner engine and essentially what I would assume is that the ECM is not seeing power on this control wire or you know its desired State isn't you know isn't where it should be so that can be a bad relay we could have just an open in this relay we could have a bad PCM or we could have a bad power feed wherever this wire comes through this should be the power side we don't really need to know where it comes from right now because we can see the power comes in it feeds the control side of the relay and it feeds the load side of the relay and then easy enough to check it feeds this ecu4 fuse so let's go see if ecu4 is hot with the key on if it is and we know our power side is good and then without touching this relay we can go right to the ECM because we should have power here power coming through the coil and then power coming out providing it's not being commanded on so let's go to ecu4 and see if that fuse is dead I'm gonna get a good ground which should be easy our battery's right here has a Mopar battery in it maybe that's the problem let's see ecu4 we have ecu1 ecu2 and that gigantic hole let's just go down any of these fuses here so far everybody's dead okay that fuse is good but all the fuses over here are dead and I'm assuming ecu4 fuse sits over here I could look it up again but the fact of the matter is all of these are dead okay every fuse in that slot is dead all these fuses are not dead I know ECU fuse 4 lives over here these three spares so these are all dead I would be willing to betify as a Gambling Man if I jump her power in these the car would start and run but we're not going to do that quite just yet I'm going to verify the ECU fuel ECU 4 fuses indeed over here somewheres because it's got one and two over there I thought I saw it on another diagram I'll verify that and if it is we know they're dead now we've got to go back and see where the power is that feeds this relay because our relay is not bad but our power that feeds everything is bad your component ly hey look at that actually took us to the right diagram ECU one two and four so I checked all the fuses in this whole fuse box and they're all dead Okay so we're not really concerned with the relay at this point right does that make sense to you because this fuse is dead which is powered from the same power source that powers the re relay but the ECM is not smart enough to know all it knows is this brown wire with the black stripe hey we don't have power on it so let's follow this black wire backwards and that comes from EMS fuse 40 amp you know esq's 40 amp I wonder where that fella is um I really wish the lady didn't put her fist through this thing well because there's one two three there's three 40 amperes ignition two ignition one and then that one so I should just print out the label for that because it's getting annoying okay according to our service data it is the one right up here by the 50 ampere so it's this fella right here that is our EMS fuse what I want to do I don't want to yank on it in case there's a connection problem so what we're going to do is pull the lid off it if we can oh these are a little different than what I'm used to they don't have the removable side must be the low profile ones so I guess in this case we will Yank on it just from the sounds of the problems that the other shops are having fixing this I'm hesitant to just you know start ripping on things over here and accidentally fix it and still not know what it is and then have the lady come in and you know not I mean not upset with me just upset that so there we go we have power there this fuse does not look blown jumper and across the two terminals right now I'll tell you what let me get another 40 amp J case out of a box I've got over here we're going to pull the lid off we're going to make sure that this one is good you'll see what I'm doing so this is a low profile JK's this is your standard one I just pulled the lid off it we're gonna stick it in here okay I just want to make darn sure a that we have a good fuse because sometimes these are hard to see through the lid I want to make sure power is going across it which it is and look are all these freaking fuses lit up now Oh no just one we didn't have power on any of these before or was I not poking them far enough I tell you what let's just see if the thing starts now for some reason foreign however I think I may have been let it Stray by my own testing because I don't think I was getting down in these fuses far enough oh look at that all I'm doing is I'm pushing on this you hear that guys okay so we're doing something here let's take that fuse back out let's put the regular one back in because we know we're good there obviously we're doing something by pushing on the fuse let's see are we pushing on that Big Box because I'm pushing on everything here so let me let me push down on this because we got to be able to follow our Clues here so pushing on the big box enough to make the car bounce does nothing pushing on this EMS block is the trick man if she only hit it a little bit harder she would have got it pushing it here doesn't do anything okay so clearly we're dealing with some kind of connection issue because the vehicle should run when I do that um all right so I'm kind of curious here yep oh no boy these fuses are really deep okay so let's turn in the relay on and off obviously we can all see that right okay so we have direction we don't have an answer but we have Direction um the sucky part is you can see that somebody's been in here this thing has really been fiddled with a lot I think we came up to the same solution or the same We've Ended up in the same areas other people have already been here I don't know how this thing comes out of here but we're going to try to figure that out a little bit but let me get a poking device here see if we can't get this unlatched pull it up out of here foreign I assume it pulls up and out because of the latches that are on it let me get another pick here and see if I can't lift that out there for us that side's coming up and out see if I can't get this side up and out I don't know if it just goes into a connector it's just this EMS box itself is bad with an integrated relay or what it's made out of I assume we're going to find out here there we go so we lift this up and out and it's got two connectors on the bottom of it and one main power feed so let's uh disconnect it here I don't the way the wires hook up to it we're not really tweaking down on The Wire because they're just regular plugs oh I see so it has this this yellow this little indicator here that sticks up that pops down once it loses connection with the main battery feed that feeds it now when we were pushing down right here directly on the box we weren't really tweaking any of these uh connectors here these connectors were just kind of they hang loose in outer space we're not doing any connection tweaking so what I think we're doing when we're pushing on the box is this has integrated relays in here and when we're pushing down on it we're creating some kind of connection or we're tweaking the circuit board one way or another and I think all this lady needs is this EMS block I don't think she really needed this stick or fist through it you see that misses though the tow truck driver told me that's what she did like yeah well because she she knows that she's to come over here and bang on us and get the thing running so she tried banging she's pissed because she just had it at the Kia dealer and had the other shop there and but we we got her figured out we need to em up we got there my guy I brought you some muffins what kind let's have a look muffins what kind is that one oh is that chocolate yes and those are berries so hard to decide see if I can't get up in there without going through my finger there we go there we go my guy sometimes you can see a piece of broken solder we probably have to yank out all the fuses the relay has got to be on the back side here let me take a picture of this oops the little yellow indicator just fell out we need to save that that goes in there it must be okay it's not a big deal I'm gonna take a picture of this then I'm going to pull all the fuses out and we're going to flip it over and we're going to see what we were pushing on when we push on this side it's got to be these solder joints here that we push on if it is a bad cider joint could be just a bad relay I suppose but I wonder if I can see and all we were doing is pushing down here so are we pushing on I mean we couldn't really have been pushing on a relay so here's relay one relay two relay three is all it says you know what are we are we pushing on a relay I suppose I can put the fuses back in it but the fuse is all back in here they're all labeled so that's nice and then we can plug it back in and see are we just tweaking on a relay you know can we duplicate it so let me try that we're gonna plug it in there and plug it in here okay and then well let's see let's just see if we can't I just don't want to get it now I don't want to get it stuck down in there so let's go like this of course now everything's working now we tweaked it too much I just wanted to see if I could tweak on one of these relays and get it to not work all we were doing is pushing down I got to imagine that we were just touching the relay I'm going for it yeah because you can hear everything working now I think what we need to do is Reflow some of that solder on the bottom of this board where they all come through because it sit like this and all we were doing and we weren't really pushing that hard like I say I know we weren't tweaking these connectors because they're not hard part of the box all we were doing is pushing in this vicinity so I'm just going to take the soldering iron and I'm just going to touch each one of these terminals that sticks through here I'm pretty certain on this end one I could see a ring around it so now that's done like I said I just don't feel super great about it I like to see things something tangible instead of all this stuff but did the best job I could so now we know what's wrong with let's stick the baby back together don't forget to stick the little yellow donger back in there all right that's that technically it'll run it would be really nice to give it to her and just tell her if it acts up again then we'll get one but unfortunately that can be super inconvenient especially when I see a bunch of baby seats inside there so I think we're going to err on the side of caution I'm going to take this part number right off this box see if we can get one uh from Kia hopefully you don't have to buy the whole stink and fuse box but I was hoping that by tweaking on it over here we get it to quit again but I know there's going to be the question knowing that all you had to do is come hit the fuse box to make the car run why didn't why wasn't that my first approach and I'll answer that question with we don't we don't learn anything so we come over you know we put our fists through the fuse box and it starts well you know big deal you know what did we do did we move a fuse did we you know what circuit are we looking at so that's why I took the approach that I did I always try to use a sensible or methodical approach to diagnosing no matter what it is because let's say we start doing some testing when we get to a point the car starts at least at that point we learned something we learned that we didn't have power or we had power on you know fuse a b and c or or what have you and then that way there when it comes in again and it doesn't start or when we get it to act up again we don't have to start all over we can pick up where we left off or we can come up with a a plan uh you know that we can you know give to our customer to the other shop that this lady lives next to for them to you know proceed you know if it's dead in her driveway say Hey you know mechanic Joe you know go over and check this one we do have power on this fuse okay we don't good we've already tested everything else we know it's this so that's why I do it like I do it I know it's not how most of you agree and uh you know don't think it's the correct way but that that's how I do it because I want to gather some data I want to know what I'm looking at what's missing and then come up with a plan could have came over could have stuck our fists in it had it running parked it outside and said we don't know what's wrong with it however she's already had that answer uh too many times so now we can give her the real answer of what's wrong with it I don't believe that I fixed it because that's uh not my uh not my forte but I know what's wrong with it and I'm gonna get the part ordered for it that settles it folks right brand new from Hyundai or kia it's 78 bucks I can have one in a couple days they got one in Connecticut if I'd known that in the beginning I probably wouldn't even have torn it apart for that price comes with all the fuses and everything in it that's a you know a great bargain but it's a heck of a lot cheaper than I thought it was going to be and it's a lot cheaper than having to buy that whole box and it's a good price to pay for a little peace of mind our effects who knows might last forever but for 78 bucks and the five seconds it takes to put it in I know that this lady will be happy and she won't be putting her fists through the fuse box again hopefully anyways why don't you guys go down in that comment section didn't have a good one there for you questions comments instead Facebook you guys know what to do just my reviewers if I can do it you can do it thanks for watching [Music]

Channel: South Main Auto Repair LLC

Views: 971,837

Keywords: sorento, start, does not start, kia sorento, why does not start, cranks but will not start, will, no start, no spark no start kia sorento 3.5 catalic, kia sorento dont start, not, kia sorent no start, kia sorent dosent start, kia does not start, starter, 2021 kia sorento, kia sorento review, car does not start, 2013 kia sorento does not crank, 2014 kia sorento does not crank, 2015 kia sorento does not crank, 2016 kia sorento does not crank, new kia sorento

Id: JAJNGg-ANGE

Length: 31min 12sec (1872 seconds)

Published: Sat Oct 01 2022