.357 Magnum vs. .44 Magnum.

[Music] [Music] hi we're out on the ranch today so please bear with gunfire here in the background recently quite a few people have contacted me asking to see a comparison of 357 magnum and 44 magma so today will be part one in a two-part series on the subject now this might seem pretty straightforward but it is wrought with difficulties and the main thing i want to say about that is as we go along today there's going to be a lot of howevers and yabbits so this is one of those presentations you really do have to watch the whole thing that having been said let's start with a close-up of what these two cartridges look like from your left to right is 9 by 19 38 special 357 magnum 44 magnum 45 cold and 45 acp you can see that the 357 and the 44 are virtually identical in terms of case length just the 44 is larger diameter recently someone asked if i'm comparing two cartridges why do i include other cartridges in this close-up display and the reason is for those people who haven't seen these two i'm including others that perhaps they have seen so you can have a basis of comparison in comparing two different calibers to make the test fair you have to use handguns with similar barrel lengths and that's where we ran into our first big problem the only 44 magnum handgun i own is the smith wesson model 29 with a 6 inch barrel i don't own a 357 magnum with a 6 inch barrel however because of donations to the patreon account thank you everybody i was able to purchase this smith wesson model 686 6 357 magnum with a six inch barrel so now we have two smith and wesson revolvers both with six inch barrels the next big problem is ammunition when you buy a 357 magnum ammo you have a range of projectile weights when you buy 44 magnum you have a range of projectile weights but those ranges are not the same the only place i could find that they overlap in any mainstream way was 180 grain so after trips to seven different stores what i came up with was federal powershock 357 magnum 180 grain projectile but i couldn't find this brand in 44 magnum so i have pmc bronze 44 magnum 180 grain projectile and remington green and white box 44 magnum 180 grain projectile i know what some of you are thinking and that's one of those yabbits that's going to come up in a few minutes remember you got to watch the whole thing so now that we have the test as fair as i can make it let's go to the chronograph and see what kind of numbers we get i've got the chronograph set up at 7 yards and we'll start with our federal 357 magnum 180 grain projectile now you'll notice i'm wearing earphones and i normally don't i wear earplugs with every shot i take this is an ear plug case but today i'm going to be shooting quite a few rounds and both the 357 and the 44 are very loud so right now i'm actually wearing earplugs and earphones so let's see how we do 1210 1195 1180 1163 1204 now let's see how the 44 magnum compares and for our 44 magnum we'll start with our pmc bronze 180 grain one thousand four hundred and fifty three one thousand four hundred and fifty three 1467 1449 one thousand three hundred and ninety four now let's try our other type of 44 magnum ammo and now our remittance green and white box 44 magnum 180 grain one five two seven one five three seven [Applause] one four six nine one five zero four and one five zero four now let's go crunch the numbers well i crunch the numbers and something i have to point out is on the last two shots with the remington green and white box you notice that both velocities were exactly the same when you get that at the end of a string it's indicative that it might be a false reading so off camera i shot another shot and got a velocity of 1486 and that's what i'm basing my numbers on so what we got was a mean velocity with the 357 of 1190 with the pmc 44 ammunition we got 1443 and with the remington green white box 1504 so with the pmc that's 253 feet per second more than the 357 and with the remington is 314 feet per second more than 357 that's a lot more now for energy foot pounds if i did my math right with the 357 we got 560 and that's a significant number that's powerful but with the pmc 44 ammunition we've got 832 and with the remington green white box 904 so that is feet per second more and 338 energy foot pounds more than the 357 44 magnum is a lot more powerful than 357 with different brands of ammunition we might have gotten some slightly different numbers but not enough to overcome that much difference however remember i said there'd be some howevers here's one of them in my quest to make this test fair i made it fair in an academic empirical sense but i also made it unrealistic although 180 grain projectiles obviously exist for the 44 magnum it's not what you commonly see at the store and in my experience it's not what the great majority of people who carry 44 magnums are using 240 grain projectiles are far more common the same with the 357 i'm using the 180 grain but when people are using 357s again in my experience lighter bullets are far more common so let's go back to the chronograph with some ammunition that although it might be less fair in my opinion will be more realistic and what i've got is federal american eagle so i've got the same brand for both calibers but with 357 it's a 158 grain projectile and with 44 magnum it's a 240 grain projectile so let's compare these and see what kind of numbers we get and we'll start with our american eagle 357 magnum 158 grains 1377. 1 365 [Applause] 1362 and seventy 1371 one thousand three hundred and forty three now let's try the 44 and our american eagle 240 grain one thousand two hundred and twenty six one thousand two hundred and sixty one one thousand three hundred and five one thousand two hundred and eighty four 1 276. now let's go crunch those numbers now how'd we do with our 357 we got a mean velocity of thousand three hundred and sixty three and with a forty four magnum one thousand two hundred and seventy so the 357 is 93 feet per second more but the real bottom line of measuring power is energy foot pounds and of course more power does not necessarily mean more effectiveness and for energy foot pounds with the 357 we got 651 and with the 44 we got 859 208 pounds more the 44 is still clearly more powerful by a significant margin however in trying to make this test fair i'm using two revolvers with six inch barrels but again is that realistic this box federal ammunition has an advertised velocity of 1080 feet per second and as i've said before the numbers advertised on the box are usually optimistic but we got 1190 feet per second 110 feet per second more than the advertised velocity why is that well with different chronographs you might get different results however i think the real thing here is for a test gun they used what they considered to be a realistic gun a 357 magnum revolver with a four inch barrel even though obviously six inch barrels are available in my experience when people are actually carrying 357s a four inch barrel is far more common by the same token my 44 magnum has a six inch barrel but in my experience barrel lengths like seven and a half or eight inches are far more common so in my quest to make the test fair have i made it unrealistic let's go back to the chronograph with two other guns a ruger security 6 357 magnum with a four inch barrel versus a ruger red hawk 44 magnum with a seven and a half inch barrel less fair but probably more realistic and we'll switch ammunitions we use sig sauer elite performance ammunition so we've got the same brand in the same bullet configuration but for 44 magnets at 240 grain for 357 it's a 125 grain in my experience a very popular projectile weight for 357. and let's see what the chronograph tells us about this configuration and we'll start with our 357 125 grain 1 30 1 394. 1404 1365 1385 now let's see how that compares to the 44 another 44 magnum 240 grain [Applause] one thousand three hundred and thirty four [Applause] 1 374 1392 1343 [Applause] 1364. now let's go crunch those numbers so now how do we do well with the 357 we got a mean velocity of 1 375 and with the 44 magnum we got 1 361 that's 14 feet per second less that's within the variation of one round to the next but remember the 44 achieves that with a 240 grain bullet compared to a 125 so for energy foot pounds we got 987 compared to the 357 giving us 524 that's 463 energy foot-pounds more and that's a lot more but it comes with a couple of caveats one being in comparing the energy foot-pounds and and even more so the velocity of these two rounds just how much difference you're going to get is going to have a lot to do with ammunition and firearm selection and secondly even though it sounds dramatic to say 987 energy foot pounds that's 463 pounds more that's just a number on a page let's see if we can come up with a couple of demonstrations to see how much more effectiveness if any that number gives us with our 180 grain projectiles we saw that the 44 had 314 more energy foot pounds than the 357 did but how will that translate into their ability to break these two dollar concrete blocks well i'll take the six inch barrel of revolvers go back 10 yards shoot the block on your left at the 357 the block on your right with the 44. let's see how they compare well that was interesting now let me set this up again and this time i'll shoot the target on your left with the 357 158 grain and the target on your right with the 44 240 grain so in that iteration it was six shots of 357 magnum versus three shots of 44 magnum so it would appear against the target of concrete blocks those extra energy foot pounds make a lot of difference interesting note this entire block is fractured only gravity is keeping it there it's completely broken now let's try something different forgive the redundancy but for those who haven't seen it before this is the meat target and it's got fresh from the grocer pig ears to simulate skin then pork chop pectorals pork ribs a bag of oranges to simulate lung tissue more pork ribs on the back four layers of t-shirt on the front four layers on the back and then behind the whole thing is the new and improved high-tech fleece bullet stop now in shooting the cinder blocks i use the six inch barreled revolvers but to shoot the meat target i'll go back seven yards and use the security six with its four inch barrel and i've got it loaded with the sig sauer elite performance 357 magnum 125 green jacketed hollow point let's see how this does so how'd we do well did a little bit of damage to our pork chop pectoral a couple of really impressive holes through the ribs on the front just mangled our orange lung tissue and where the bullets hit the ribs on the back broke them now what's really typical when we shoot the meat target with hollow-point ammunition is the bullets will be stopped by the t-shirt on the back of the target in this case they weren't a couple of the projectiles made it through to about the third layer of fleece and a couple made it through to about the tenth layer of fleece so the sig sauer elite performance 357 ammunition ballistically was not that impressive but its damage to the meat target is now let me show you a close-up of what the projectiles look like and there they are and the mushrooming is extensive and one of them lost its jacket now we've got a new meat target set up and i'll shoot from seven yards with a ruger red hog 44 magnum with its seven and a half inch barrel and our sig sauer elite performance 240 grain jacket at hollow point so how'd we do well with 44 magnum only fired three rounds one of which you saw just skimmed the top of the target so it did not contribute in any meaningful way to the damage to the target but of the two rounds that hit centered you can see some pretty impressive impact holes in our ribs on the front our orange lung tissue is just thrashed and there are bits of copper jacket and lead fragments scattered all throughout the target and all throughout the fleece bullet stop and of the two bullets that did hit center mass instead of like the 357 being stopped by the second to tenth layer of fleece these both went through to about the 20th layer of fleece and in my subjective view looking at this target i'm saying that two rounds of 44 magnum did about as much damage as the four rounds of 357 did now let me show you a close-up of the projectiles and there's our 244 magnum projectiles and they are mushroomed extensively now the meat target is made as a simulation for an assailant that you're going to shoot in the chest and i think it's good for demonstrative purposes for typical concealed calibers like 380 acp 9x19 38 special 40 smith and wesson etc but when it comes to 357 and 44 magnums although some people do use them for personal protection some people use them for hunting and with that in mind we're going to shoot the deer meat target now what this is is two layers of leather jacket to simulate skin deer have a fairly thick hide pork ribs two bags of oranges to simulate a double lung shot more pork ribs on the back and for hunting purposes with a 357 a lot of people will like to use a longer barrel when they can so we'll go back to our smith and wesson with a six-inch barrel and although for personal protection in a 357 a lot of people like to use 125 grain hollow points for hunting purposes people will often use heavier bullets and they'll be soft points not hollow points so now we'll use our federal american eagle 357 magnum 158 grain semi-jacketed soft point and i'll shoot this meat target from 20 yards let's see how we do so how'd we do well our ribs out in the front have some very impressive holes in them our extra stuffed orange lung tissue has a lot of damage to it more so than i would have expected from soft point rounds ribs on the back has three hits one's just a nick on the edge but for the two good hits where they hit the ribs shattered them and the big difference between the soft points and the hollow points was the soft points two of these rounds went through to about the 30th layer of fleece one went clear through the fleece bullet stop and i didn't recover it so if you're going to hunt deer with 158 grain soft point 357 ammunition looks like you're going to have good effectiveness and plenty of penetration let me show you a close-up of the two rounds i recovered and here's the two projectiles i recovered and you can see the soft points do have some expansion but not as much as hollow points with the 44 magnum i'm going to consider it axiomatic that the 240 grain projectiles would give you sufficient damage and sufficient penetration in our deer meat target but what about the 180s i'll go back 20 yards and i'll shoot the remington green and white box 44 magnum 180 grain jacket at softpoint let's see how we do with these well we hit the meat target with three rounds one just nicked the edge of the ribs on the front but two hit pretty center and made very big holes completely devastated our orange lung tissue but the main difference between the 357 and the 44 was as where the 357 rounds were stopped by about the 30th layer of police two of our 344 rounds went completely through and the one round that was stopped by the fleece was stopped by the second to last layer so our results are pretty much what we'd expect them to be the 357 was sufficient but the 44 being a larger bullet made larger holes and gave us more penetration and here's the 144 magnum 180 grain projectile that we covered and you can see that there is some expansion but not nearly as much as with the hollow point one of the criticisms of the 44 magnum as compared to other calibers like nine millimeter forty smith and wesson 45 acp is that it has so much recoil that it's slow to get back on target for subsequent shots well at 7 yards i have our six knock down plates and i have my model 29 loaded with the american eagle 240 grain projectile so i'll see how fast i can shoot these six plates then we'll repeat that with the 357 and see if it's any faster now let's try the 357 and i've got my 686 loaded with 158 grain projectiles let's see how it does was that any faster and if so was it enough to matter now some of you might think that this wasn't really a fair comparison as 44 magnums go that model 29 is fairly light the 686 is fairly heavy it has a weighted barrel not only that it's a seven shot six shooter so let's try this drill again with our other 357 and our other 44 and see how they compare and now our ruger redhawk with 240 grain projectiles and let's see how that compares against our ruger 357 and now our ruger security 6 with 158 grain projectiles was that any faster okay couple other things i want to cover in fair warning this is the boring part of the video where i talk now source materials don't always agree with each other but by any source i've ever seen the 357 magnum was introduced in 1935 and was at that time considered the world's most powerful handgun cartridge 44 magnum was introduced in 1955 and was billed the same way the world's most powerful handgun cartridge although there's some debate whether or not it was but what isn't in debate is that it isn't anymore it has been surpassed by the 50 ae the 460 smith and west and the 500 smith and wesson the list goes on but it's still very powerful and as we saw today significantly more powerful than the 357 magnum although depending on firearms and ammunition choices you can narrow that gap pretty close now another interesting thing about these two is their caliber designations 357 and 44. when you buy firearms or ammunition like 40 smith and wesson are 45 acp those numbers represent the diameter of the bar of the firearm 45 acp is 45 caliber however in 357 magnum it's not 357 caliber that 357 is the diameter of the projectile which is squeezed down in the bore to be basically 35 caliber for 44 magnum the 44 is neither the diameter of the bore nor the diameter of the projectile when you buy 44 magnum ammunition the projectile diameter is usually a 429 or a 430 and sometimes a 431 diameter projectile which is squeezed into basically 42 caliber in the bore now i've said that before and some people called me some colorful adjectives and told me how wrong i was well again source materials don't always agree with each other but let's look at the hornady handbook of cartridge reloading turn to the section on 44 magnum and we'll see projectile diameter 430 430 430 it goes on 44 magnum is not 44 caliber there are some 44s that really are 44 but 44 magnum and 44 special and a few others are not now speaking of 44 special another thing interesting about both of these calibers is they are way interchangeable with other cartridges 357 magnum is one way interchangeable with several calibers 38 special being the most well known 38 special is less powerful than 357 magnum so it can make a good alternative if there's something you want to shoot that you don't want to shoot too hard also because it's less powerful it has less recoil less noise and generally speaking less expensive and can make a good training aid for 357 but on the other side of that 44 special being one way interchangeable with 44 magnum although the 44 special is less powerful less noise less recoil it's also less available and in any ammo i've seen not significantly less expensive it doesn't necessarily make as good a training aid as the 38 does in the 357 and speaking of expensive 44 magnum ammunition generally speaking is more expensive than 357 ammo i purchased both of these in the same store on the same day and for the 357 i paid 21 dollars for the 44 magnum was 22.75 a dollar 75 more for 20 rounds not much more but with the american eagle ammunition i paid 30 dollars for this and 37 for this that is more the remington ammunition was over 40 so 44 magnum ammunition is more expensive sometimes significantly so but what about which one of these rounds is better well sometimes you'll hear people make blanket statements that the 44 magnum is useless for home defense because of its excessive recoil well as you saw in our six plate grille it did have a lot of recoil but the 357 didn't necessarily have significantly less using this handgun which i consider fairly light with the more powerful 357 loads i had a lot of recoil and it was not significantly faster to shoot the plate drill with that than it was with the 44. so blanket statements like the 44 is useless are in themselves useless but the real bottom line which of these is better i would say neither of them is better it's just what's better for you your needs your abilities and whatever it is you're trying to do so as always don't try this at home i'm what you call a professional and thanks for watching the 357 versus 44 video [Music] you

Channel: Paul Harrell

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Length: 29min 22sec (1762 seconds)

Published: Thu May 31 2018