Ben: Hey, what's up? Holo, everyone and welcome back to another episode of Simply PodLogical, a Simply Nailogical podcast.
Cristine: Holo. B: Today's episode is brought to you by www.simplynailogical.com, Cristine's nail blog that hasn't been updated since 2016. C: Yes, please. Go there. No one goes there anymore. The blog is dead. We're looking to revive it. B: Well, we're not, but ...
C: We're just kidding. B: You know, we recently had an issue where some ads we didn't like were appearing on some of your YouTube videos online and you went through the process of blocking those ads from appearing on your YouTube videos, but it wasn't working at first and we couldn't figure out why and we eventually realized with some help of people at YouTube or Google that it was actually you were just blocking those ads from appearing on your blog, C: That no one goes to.
B: which no one goes to, instead of the YouTube channel.
C: So there shouldn't be Donald Trump ads on my website now. I'm sorry about that. Ben: Yeah. Yeah, you shouldn't see them on YouTube or the website. But that's an important thing for, if there's any YouTubers listening to this, yeah, there are ways of blocking certain ads on your videos or podcast.
C: Certain ads, but you can't really pick by category, you have to know the URL of the ad it's coming from. So it's actually quite a specific process. B: Okay.
C: Anyways.
B: So that's a bit of a tangent, but today we're kind of talking about your blog because we're talking about Cristine's past life as a nail blogger extraordinaire. C: I have a lot of past lives. There's a child actress. I worked in a car shop. B:You have a lot of current lives,
(C: I went to school)
B: not just past, you know.
C: Yeah, a nail blogger. But a nail blogger.. is kind of where this all started.
B:Yeah. C: So me being Simply Nailogical today, like the name came from my blog, Simply Nailogical. That's the first time I named myself Simply Nailogical.
B: Yeah. Now that it's been like a few years of you being known as a YouTube... person. I wonder how many people still remember the fact that you had built this sort of niche following for yourself and you had built a pretty big following just from posting nail art on mostly Instagram, I think it's fair to say, right?
C: It started as a website and then I eventually used Instagram. But if we go to questions, maybe that'll be the first ...
B: We'll get into all of this. Okay, so
C: We'll give you a history.
B: We asked questions on social media, what you wanted to know about Cristine's past as a nail blogger C: Thank you, guys, for submitting your questions.
B: Yes. Okay. Let's just get into those. B: All right, so first question: "When did you start blogging? Was it more like a hobby at first or did you decide from the start that you wanted to make it a source of income eventually?" C: I had absolutely no intention or realistic perception that I would make any money from doing this. I think at most, in my ... the height of my blogging days, I made at most $8 a month off the ads that ran on my blog. There are other ways to make money as a blogger, but just off the ads on my blog alone, it was like $8 a month. Just ... B: Is that how much it makes now still or less than that?
C: No, I think it made like ... it makes like twelve cents a month now. There's still a little bit. I started it when ... I remember being a student at Corrections Canada, a different government department.
(B: A student employee.)
C: Sorry, a student employee, but I was also a student. I was doing my Masters.
B: You were in grad school still. C: Yeah, and I'd always loved nail art. I did a lot of nail art in high school. I think I've mentioned this elsewhere, maybe in a video. But I just ... I realized that there was a giant community of nail art online that I just like had missed for a few years; I just like didn't know it existed and then I just happened to discover it. I'm like, this is so cool! I want to make a blog. And just because I wanted somewhere to kind of catalog and make a portfolio of my own nail art. I used to do it on Facebook, on my private account, just like sharing it with my friends. Like we all used to post pictures on Facebook. I posted pictures of my nails. Yeah. So eventually I realized like there was an outlet for me to do this on the Internet. And I thought like that's just so cool and so fun and there was other people doing nail art, and I just wanted to join it. So I purchased SimplyNailogical.com in 2014. I think I paid like $10 a year for the domain. B: Sure. Sure, sure. C: And I made an Instagram around the same time, but I didn't really know how to use it in coordination with my blog, because at the time blogging was a much bigger thing than it is today.
B: People actually read blogs at the time.
C: Yeah, like people were reading it.
B: My recollection is I remember like once you were done, your thesis, and you were done with grad school, that's when you actually really started doing this.
C: I'd started it before, but I definitely ...
B: <sneezes> Sorry. C: That's okay. There's many cats in here.
B: There's a lot of cat hair in here.
C: Menchie's behind you. I'd started my blog before I finished my thesis, but I really put way more time into it after I was done school, because all the sudden I was like I need something to do after work. So I started working really hard on my blog. I was doing nail art every night and posting it.
B: People know Cristine's like a project-driven person who needs to be doing something all the time. So all of a sudden when you weren't spending hours a day writing your thesis, I think you just sort of converted it to doing that.
C: Yeah. It was a hobby. There's ... So to answer your question, yeah, it was definitely a hobby. I didn't expect to make any money of it and I had no idea that I would end up on YouTube. B: We probably would have ... You probably would have chosen something else if money was your main motivation.
C: Yeah. B: You probably don't go into painting your nails and posting pictures of them on the internet thinking this is how you're going to make it big.
C: No, no. B: All right, next question: "What made you post nail art on the Internet and not just have fun on your own?" So why ... why even share it?
C Yeah, why even share it? That's a good question. I definitely had fun on my own and I would do a bunch of them before I started sharing it, but maybe it was when ... Like I was no longer hanging around people every day, like I wasn't in high school all the time or school was over and I wasn't seeing my friends on a daily basis. It just felt like less fun to do the nail art and then show it to no one. I don't know. Is that... is that strange? Like I just ... Sharing your art, I think, is important as an artist. There's some artists who prefer to keep it personal and decide when the time is right like that they want to share it, and that's completely understandable, too. But I really just liked the nail-art community who shared their own art. It's inspiring: like you get all these different ideas for how you can create different nail art. So I really liked the community part of it.
B: All right, next question: "When you were first starting, how did you get people other than personal friends to actually read your blog? I had a blog once and it was only ever seen by like twelve people." C: I think only twelve people saw my blog in the beginning. I remember being at work and telling my coworkers to like "Can you go check out my blog? I just posted something." And like they didn't really care, but they were being nice and they went to my blog. I told my friends, my family. I posted on my personal Facebook and like asked my friends to go look, but to be honest my blog in and of itself never really gained any traction. It was Instagram where I started gaining traction through hashtags and getting reposted on larger accounts. And then those people discovered that I had a blog and that's kind of what I was trying to redirect people back to. So I used Instagram to maybe show, you know, it would get more likes and get more attention. Then I'd be like "Please go check out my blog: I have more pictures on there." B: Yeah, but in retrospect, right?, it was much more important to build Instagram, even though you maybe only saw it as a vehicle to bring people to your more detailed blog posts, really Instagram is what built you the audience to actually see your nail art, right?
C: Yes. Yeah. Doing nail art using, umm, hashtags. That was a big thing.
B: Was that the real way of ...
C: At the time to get discovered. Yeah, you use like #NailArtDiaries or different weird hashtags.
B: Or there were like feature accounts and stuff, too, that would post ... C: There was huge nail art feature accounts that would look through these hashtags that you would tag, and then they would find ones that they thought were good and they'd have like 2,000,000 followers. They'd repost it and credit you and then their followers would see that and then see your tag and then follow you as a result/ B: This was back when if you followed someone on Instagram, you would consistently see what they posted.
C: Right. It was in chronological order.
B: Algorithmically now Instagram is a very strange ... C: Things have definitely changed but at the time Instagram I think was the biggest propeller for my following. My blog did very little for me, even though I was heavily invested in like building a blog audience. B: All right and from Miranda Jones: "How do you 'apply' to be a swatcher? Or is it more of a 'being discovered' type thing by tagging brands in your photos?" C: I think there are some brands who do have applications like on their website. I've seen that before; it exists. I just don't think it's that common and I don't think a lot of brands put out call-outs for like "apply to be a swatcher," because they already have an internal network of people that they just happen to have discovered or that they worked with in the past. So it is ... it's not that easy to just like apply to be a swatcher as a position and if you're doing that as your main source of income, I wouldn't recommend that. I think it's more of a passion project and if you love swatching and that's something that you want to do, then that's great. And there are ways to make money off of swatching, and we'll get there in this podcast, I'm sure. But applying to be a swatcher, for me was like a slow gradual process. I would purchase products from nail polish companies that I loved, I'd swatch them all, just because I wanted to, and maybe it was the like organized person in me that just wanted to swatch the entire collection, make a blog post about it, also hope that I get some clicks on my blog post because other people wanted to see that collection swatched by people who weren't associated with the brand, right? So it's good like consumer materials as well.
B: Yeah, and it's almost like brands would just basically notice that here was someone who was taking good pictures of basically swatching already without being paid, right? So. C: Yeah, and that's how I eventually got free nail polish.
B: Yeah.
C: Yeah B: "When and how do you first receive PR and how did you feel about it?"
C: What a nice organization of these questions, Ben.
B: Yeah, so when brands started noticing you were taking good pictures, how quickly did this happen that all of a sudden they're like asking if they can send you product or just sending you product.
C: Not very quickly. I think people underestimate how large of a portfolio I built off of buying products and just out of my love for nail polish: just me wanting to do the work before I started getting PR. I think like ... There was a couple of brands around the same time, so I don't think it was like any one that I can remember specifically. This was like five years ago, too. Maybe four. But I felt incredibly happy, obviously, as someone who spent so ... like too much money on nail polish. I was so happy when brands reached out to me and wanted to send me their products for free, because as a consumer-- which I was; I was a consumer; that's all I thought I was--they would send me their product for free and like that's amazing. I thought like "I don't deserve this," but later on I realized like they want me to, you know, take pictures with them and use it for marketing.
B: Yeah, it's part of their marketing and advertising budget, right?
C: But I felt very honored, especially when larger brands--like mainstream drugstore brands--first started reaching out and asked to send me their new collection. Of course, I was excited about it. Like who wouldn't be?
B: Yeah, no. Of course. It's a good feeling.
C: It's very exciting.
B: Yeah.
C: Yeah. B: It's only you get cynical later on and realize they're just using you for promotion, right? C: Sure, but at the time she's asking how did I feel. I was extremely grateful, honored, and I like wanted to get to work right away, even though there's no employment contract involved at the time. B: Next question: "How did you learn how to use a filming setting? Was it hard, and do you have any tools you can suggest?"
C: So I am NOT a professional photographer or retoucher or videographer or anything and I have never been. I have no background in how to use cameras. I had no idea how to use a DSLR, which is just like a fancy real camera, and I learned it all from watching YouTube. So when I first started nail blogging, I realized my iPhone-- I didn't even have an iPhone; I think I had a Blackberry. My Blackberry pictures were not going to cut it,
B: Not very good; no. C: and I asked my aunt and uncle for Christmas for a small Nikon DSLR, and I asked my uncle to like help me kind of learn the basics. And so they bought me ...
B: They're kind of like amateur photographers. C: It might have been a graduation present. I can't remember.
B: Something like that.
C: Something like that. But an amateur like small DSLR and I watched YouTube to learn about like what's the relationship between aperture, shutter speed and ISO. And I didn't know these things but they're all come key in just general photography, not even just nail photography. But like these things I didn't know and I kind of learned them on the way and YouTube was a big help to me in to learning like how to use a camera. B: Yeah, I guess there is a pretty big jump from taking iPhone ... like the cameras in phones today are kind of amazing.
C: Right, right. B: You can probably get by a lot just on those especially early on, but there is a very significant jump in terms of like the professionalism of what you're producing when all of a sudden ... Like I remem--- That first camera was a Nikon D5300
C: Something, yeah.
B: Or, no, you started with the 3000 series?
C: Yes. Yeah. B: You eventually got a Nikon D5300,
C: Which I still use today,
B: which you still use to this day,
C: because I love it. B: And what matters more is you just have like a macro lens attached to it,
C: I have a better lens, yeah.
B: that all of a sudden lets you get those really, juicy up-close shots of nails.
C: But at the time I couldn't afford or I couldn't justify purchasing like $2,000 worth of camera equipment for this hobby. So I asked for it like as a present. B: Yeah.
C: And then, that's how I, you know, was able to do it. That doesn't mean you need expensive equipment to be a successful blogger. There's many people, like Ben said today, I know, you can kind of tell when it's an iPhone picture, but they're so good these days that people are literally using their phones and that's great. So you ... please don't take this as like you have to invest. I was also really interested In the photography of it and like creating bouquet with the holo B: Mm-hmm.
C: So I really wanted to like challenge my, you know, understanding of photography, so I kind of learned it on my own. B: All right. "Tips for hand posing for photos, please. I try to copy the swatch photos, but I just can't seem to make my fingers do that." C: I get a lot of questions like this. People ask me like "How do you pose so like elegantly?"
B: Do you have to practice your pose?
C: So this is what you've got to do: First you've got to roll out your wrist. B: Oh, yeah?
C: You've got to relax your wrist. Okay? Because I do see in some posing people will get like this like strain and then you do like the claw. And like you don't want the claw.
B: Is this a serious answer? I can't tell.
C: This is a serious answer. You get the claw and then like it's not a good look and looks like you're stressed trying to hold your holo. So okay. So you want to relax your wrist. I don't have a bottle here, but I'll use my phone as an example. B: Okay.
C: And you'll just ... just kind of like gently relax your wrist.
B: Yeah, you've been relaxing it for a bit now,. C: And just pose naturally with your fingers evenly spaced and like it's fluid and effortless. It is a challenge to model your hand like that, but you want to look like relaxed and your fingers are close as opposed to stretched out and like tight, right? B: Yeah.
C: So it's ... it takes practice B: Okay.
C: I don't know how else to explain this. Yeah, it is something that comes with time. I look at my early swatch pictures and like there's always something that I'm going to criticize and be like "This could have been better" or "The lighting is way off." B: I also remember like there were times where you'd be in that back room painting your nails for like hours and hours at a time. Like doesn't that hurt your hand and your neck and ...? C: Yeah. Umm.. the downside of being a swatcher is that like you might get neck strain. I--and still to this day, because I swatch for Holo Taco--but when I started swatching for brands four years ago, I would sit there for six hours straight and, you know, try and get through a collection of ten polishes, and holding your hand in the same position with your elbow that has to be like this and your head has to be tilted because maybe you're looking at the screen on the camera: the strain is unbearable sometimes. That like I had to set a limit for how many nail polishes I would swatch in one sitting and my limit used to be like ten; now it's two. I can only swatch two in a row now before my neck starts to completely kink up.
B: Well, you're getting old.
C: I'm getting older. But like mad props to all the swatchers out there. It is so much more work than I think people realize.
(B: Than people realize.)
C: People realize like "Oh, just take a picture your nails. Done." Yeah, but if you need to take the exact same photo for twelve different shades in the best lighting conditions to highlight the properties of that polish, it's really hard. Consistency is harder, too: to keep your fingers the same, the same way. B: All right, next question: "How did you learn to properly photograph holo? Is there a trick to it?" C: So this is something I learned down the road or like along the line. Soft boxes--like those things that you see in photography, like a big white box with a white sheet on it-- B: Mm-hmm.
C: are holo's enemy.
B: Yeah, that is not good.
C: That is not good.
B: It's good for ..
C: your faces. Beauty. B: Yeah, for portraits or just your hands or normal nail polish,
C: Right. B: but not for holographic polish.
C: But it's awful for holo, because it ... I don't know. It just like ... it doesn't allow the holo rainbows to bounce back, because it's diffusing it. It's ultimately a diffuser. So I didn't learn that for a while. Like I just ... I started experimenting with different lights and I was just so frustrated that like I bought these professional like softbox covers and like they weren't ... they just didn't make the nail polish look that good. Ultimately sunlight is the best, but not everyone can shoot in outside conditions, especially when you're like me and you live in Canada. So some of my tricks--and like I'll spill the tea-- is shoot with direct lights, including your iPhone or whatever phone flash. If you put your phone flash just over your nails, you're going to highlight some of the holo particles and like it does amazing things. You have to be careful not to make your skin too green with the iPhone, so you can use other lights around to substitute it, but the lights can't have that like white, silky cover on them. A diffuser. You don't want a diffuser. B: I think it's less like ... it's not like iPhone specifically as much as it's a directional light.
C: Yeah. B: It can't be this diffused, dispersed light coming from all angles, because like the holographic particles in a holographic nail polish, they're reflecting light that's coming at it from a certain direction, and that determines what color you're seeing. So if light is coming from all angles and you're over-lighting a shot, it actually looks really bad. But that means ...
C: It flattens it.
B: It flattens it. But that means it's really hard to actually light up your hand and the shot and also make the holographic nail polish look good, right? C: It's a science, like you said. There is science involved in highlighting holo. Another tip I'll just give is making sure the surface areas around you are dark. So if you have a white ceiling or a white table, it's going to act like a diffuser and it's not going to let the holo flash or flame be as obvious. So I will ... I shoot on a black desk and I add black cardboard like to the left and behind me,
(B: Sort of like block out the light.) and a little bit above where I'm shooting sometimes to kind of block out all the light sources that might bounce off the holo. So that's my other practical thing.
B: Very, very complex. B: All right: "When and how did you start shooting nail polish porn for other companies? And where did you get this idea from?"
C: Well, is my dad watching this podcast? B: So, yeah, I mean we shouldn't ... we should be clear here: Like you're not the first person to spill nail polish out of a bottle, C: Yeah.
B: but I think it's fair to say that you sort of had this singular style that other brands noticed and started using, too, of spilling nail polish in like a specific sort of way. So like where did that come from? C: I don't know exactly where it came from. I think I remember around the time that I started, there was another nail polish brand, Azature, who was doing these very like sexual photos, and by sexual I mean there was like a woman's nails on top of a man's abs. Like it was using people. It was implied like sexual. Anyways, but it was shot very like dark and the nails were lit up and I thought that was kind of an interesting approach, but I was like, "You know what? If we just took that man out of the picture we can still make the nail polish really sexy." B: "I don't want sexy men in my pictures, I just want sexy nail polish." C: Yeah. So I kind of just played on that idea of what if I just spill the nail polish out of the bottle in the dark? Like everything else is black, all you see is the holo pouring out of the bottle or all you see is it dripping off the brush really slowly. B: Well, iIt's like you shoot it in a very gratuitous sort of like sensual way almost. It is pretty strange to watch. C: Is it strange or is it just fascinating? Like I don't see ... it's not actually sexual, obviously. Like it's just nail polish, but the way the glitter falls slowly, like when you put it in slow-mo or you just like slowly tip it over, it's just so like oddly satisfying to watch, or at least it is for me. So that's why I started doing it and then eventually companies would, you know, see that I use their nail polish to do it and others wanted me to do that with their polish, because it looked like a good marketing thing-- which is not why I started doing it; I just did it because like I liked the artistic component. I liked how ... It was like art to me. I liked spilling it and then companies eventually hired me to make nail pornos for them and I remember charging like I started out $40 for a nail porno like a video So it was a 15 second nail porno video but I would spend hours shooting it and I charged $40 for like hours of work of filming staging and editing it and I think eventually I the most I'd ever charge for nail porno was $200 after some time, and it was multiple different shots It wasn't just one polish and it took me more than a day It probably took me an entire weekend to make him produce that and if that company had hired a real Videographer like which I was not a professional to make the same thing. They would have charged probably like a thousand for that time B: I mean what if they're paying for a commer... Yeah
C: Or, or maybe more
B: I think it's funny looking back how little you knew of your value or worth I think that's kind of a gonna be a recurring theme in this conversation a little bit
C: But it's all part of learning So like I also don't don't regret these things. It was just kind of learning and experience and I was also building my portfolio So that's how
B: Sure. And it's nice to know looking back. It's it's not like you were doing all this for the money So it's just kind of amazing You ended up in the position you eventually did.
C: Yeah.
B: Yeah B: All right. Have you ever had to completely redo a video because you've messed up your nail art?
C: Many times and I think I published..
B: Many? C: Yeah, I think I published a nail art fail video in the peak of my nail art videos Which was a few years ago So yeah, there is a nail fail video that has like just a compilation of eight different times I messed up B: Yeah but, I mean, typically back in the day if you were just likes watching for a company and If you messed up were there times where you just had to like completely redo your nails? C: Yeah
B: And I guess no one's seeing that, right? C: Yeah, I've.. like if I nicked a nail before I got the shot ya. I was really pissed cause I'd have to redo it B: Sounds terrible B: Next question how many bottles of Polish have you actually bought and you haven't gotten from PR?
C: I think people don't realize that because I do snapchat and Instagram story a lot about you know, like every time a nail polish company sends me polish So it does look like I get a ton of nail polish for free Which I do, present-day but, in the beginning four years ago I spent so much money on nail polish I was buying like every new indie collection every new mainstream collection I would go to the drugstore and just like find any excuse to buy a random color that I didn't really need but, it was slightly different than another color I had. I definitely spent probably thousands of dollars before and during the beginning of starting to eventually get free nail polish, ya. Today I don't really spend much money on nail polish, like occasionally, I will but I just I have so much that I really I don't have room for any more right now B: Okay Uh, next question Do you think most bloggers give honest reviews when sent products for free by brands or do they feel some pressure internal or external to rate the product favorably? This is a really important question C: And I think this question applies to just like the beauty community and a broader influencer community than just nail bloggers I like to think that most people are generally honest, but of course there's gonna be people who aren't and are pressured maybe by the brand or are not making the best judgement calls because they want a continued relationship that is favorable with the brand. B: Yeah And I don't know if honesty is the right word to use because it's just like if you're on a brand's PR list and you generally like that brand and want to keep receiving their products and maybe you want a relationship with them Yeah, there is going to be some bias in that even if you don't love something Maybe you won't be more critical than you would if you just didn't have any relationship with them, right? C: Yeah, and there's definitely been times where I was blogging and a company had sent me polish that I was not shy of voicing my opinion of the polish and I'd say like I just think it's ugly, you know?
B: Yeah. C: And I mean I was also,
B: They didn't like that.
C: Yeah, they didn't like that But who was I working for I guess was the question I asked myself and personally I just wanted to I wanted to entertain eventually once I got on YouTube But my blog I out like there is some comedic lines in my blog, too Like I also saw it is just a funny writing outlet I wanted it to have a little bit of personality. So I wasn't trying to take it like too seriously and occasionally I did like make a joke about how a nail polish I didn't like, you know B: Yeah
C: and that doesn't mean that I hate the company in their entirety B: No but, ya, you weren't just giving favorable reviews to everything C: Yeah, I was not. I was the opposite
Ben: I should say like maybe advice to people out there like if it is tempting to just give positive reviews to everything just to have brands like you it's important to remember that the end of the day as an internet presence your your reputation is kind of everything right and if you get the reputation of someone who is misleading your audience into thinking a product is good when it isn't, that that is not worth you maintaining good relationships with brands C: Yeah, absolutely. I think credibility is really important to me and that's something that I, I don't do and I learned over the years how to do it better. How to make sure that I wasn't being biased just because I wanted a brand to like me I always think about my audience first and what is best for them and what message I think I want to share with them. B: Uh, next question from Nailing Painting How do you go from doing unpaid work free products for posts to paid promotions? I feel like I'm not big enough to ask for money, but I don't know where to draw the line Any tips on charging for promoting a company's products?
C: First off, I just want to say Mary Lou nail art I've seen your work. It is SO good! She is so talented Even the profile pics, I remember her nails Yeah, this is a good question and B: It's hard to give exact answer to this to, right? C: Yeah, I think for me It wasn't an automatic shift. There wasn't one day where I like decided: Okay now I'm only doing paid work. It was a slow shift and it changed depending on the brands Because it depends on the relationship. It really depends on like what you have established with the brand previously So I can remember a few examples of where I began to start feeling taken advantage of by brands. And by that I mean like I was doing a bunch of unpaid work for them and by that I mean like I would take swatch pictures or take pictures of their products and They would use them on their website or on their instagrams to promote it and I was not being paid except with product Which I guess they considered a form of payment But slowly over time like there's one particular example that stands out to me. I watermarked all my work. I always did unless eventually someone paid me like to, to own that that photograph But, if they didn't it's my property so I water marked it and you should too. If you're a nail blogger and it's your property, you should watermark photos, but I remember a company that I worked with a lot and Did a lot for their business asked me one day for a favor and just said like "Hey. Do you mind can you just take a picture of this because I need this version of this picture for my website and I'm just missing it." And I was just like sure I'm gonna have my watermark on it though, basically like implying to her I'm happy to give you this favor, but like She's not offering payment. So it will be my photo but happy to still put it on your website I guess and she goes "What does it just come out of your camera with a watermark?" And I was put in a really weird position to be like well, no,
B: But you're not paying for it. C: You don't want, you're not purchasing this from me, so... That's just one example of how I felt like brands were eventually expecting a lot of me because I was giving them a lot B: Mm-hmm C: And that was partially my mistake for feeling that way and then also their mistake for taking advantage of what they could. That being said, these brands are businesses and of course, they're going to capitalize on free promotion
B: Sure. C: when they can so I understand that perspective But at the same time I felt like I wasn't valued or really being respected as a fellow business person Which is what I was trying to do, I realized like hey, I can make a business too But I wasn't being valued I wasn't getting the same treatment in return. So slowly these little instances started to happen And I that's kind of where I drew the line B: Yeah, and actually I think that's a really useful line to draw. If a company wants to use your art like in their advertising, in the listings on their website, there's no way they should be getting that from you for free or in exchange just for product. I think I I can't imagine a scenario where that makes sense. So you should, it's really hard as an artist to know your worth, right?
C: HmMm, yeah B: Yeah, and I think like yeah like you've already sort of indicated You did do a lot for free You established your worth to these companies and then that allowed you to sort of have the conversations to be like You know a lot of people want my photos I'm gonna have to charge you at least even though you didn't charge much at all, especially in the beginning It was just like a sign of respect that they were willing to pay anything at all C: Yeah.
B: And then to have companies that were basically like expecting you to continue to give them free promotion that was a really shitty thing to realize a lot of companies just expected that of you.
C: The other thing, to add to that - I used to charge like $12 for swatch pictures, by the way, just just for some context The other thing is once I started gaining some popularity on Instagram and the brands that I was working with on a PR basis realized that They wanted to take advantage of me even more because they realized that by me receiving their product it meant that thousands hundreds of thousands of eyeballs would see their product and they would ultimately be benefiting from me giving them free marketing.
Ben: Mmm-hmm C: So when I, you know said I now charge $12 per swatch picture which I do not think was greedy and was You know far more than fair and I wasn't even asking them to pay me for my influence I was just charging for the photo itself. Which, in theory, if I didn't have any influence, that's what I should have been charging B: Yeah.
C: But yeah, I just became kind of disheartened and It didn't like hurt my feelings because I ultimately know this is just business and I understand from their perspective Of course, they're going to take advantage of this when they see it But... Yeah, to answer your question If you start having these experiences where brands are taking advantage of you and you can recognize that I think it's important, maybe like talk to a friend, talk to a partner Do you have anyone who's in business or photography or someone in your life
B: But not just external I think, sorry to interrupt you but, a really good point and I remember it made a big difference for you is when you became friends with other nail bloggers and you started very much sharing what you were hearing from other companies.
C: Yes.
B: Right? Didn't you start.. Do you want me to talk about this and didn't you have like a nail blogger union you started at one point? C: Yeah, because I and I still to this day, although I'm not as close with some of them I still have so much respect for my fellow peers as nail bloggers, nail YouTubers, nail Instagrammers Whatever platform you work on
B: Sure. C: But there was definitely so much value in connecting with other people who were doing what I'm doing. So we could discuss like hey what's fair? This brand offered to pay me but is asking you for the same thing and saying that they don't have any money to pay. That's not cool either. Ben: So just to be clear it wasn't like a union. You guys had a group chat where you would share what what brands were telling you about how much they were paying and stuff, right? C: Yes And I think that was important for empowering us as like artists and the people actually producing these and people who had followings like a lot of us had followings that and we all felt similarly taken advantage of for making other businesses successful B: Yeah Cause I mean the hardest thing about being in the position of a swatcher is probably knowing like if you are wanting to charge a brand There's probably a bunch of swatchers that will just step up and do it for free. Right? So it's hard to make that decision So the more swatchres all value their work, especially if they're producing quality work that Small or big brands would even want to use in an official capacity It's good if you guys sort of stick together C: Yes, absolutely. Yeah B: Alright, I hope that helped a little bit Mary Lou Next question from Chrisslypaws How did you manage to get paid for swatching? Did you ask the brands for it, or did they offer it to you by themselves? So I think we covered a lot of this already But did you reach out to brands being like here's my work pay me for it, or did they start coming to you? C: So I don't... Maybe once or twice I initiated it. But generally speaking, no. It was always the brands asking for my work and then I would respond saying I now charge for swatching. Or if you're interested in collaborating with me on a you know in a business sense like here are my options. Here's my packages If you choose to send me PR just for my consideration and there is no guarantee of promotion That's something that I also say and I still say to this day to Random drugstore brand anyone who wishes like a business contacts me and I'll say you can send me your products for my consideration But of course it's never a guarantee of promotion because there's no real business exchange there.
B: No C: But in terms of getting paid, I think the the first indie the first time I was ever paid it was with an indie nail polish company and I do believe that they actually told me like I would like to pay you because I have a request for it was a lot of Polishes and it was multiple photos and I'd already had a pre-existing relationship with them So they kind of sprung that idea first like hey, you know what? why don't I pay you because I have a huge request and I have a timeline and first of all if you're not being paid No brand can ask you to demand a view that you turn around Products on a tight timeline and you must present them in this fashion. Don't, don't listen to that like you are not their employee, unless you are their employee B: Yeah, I mean do you want to talk about this? So early on, when you had a brand that was just first starting to pay you for swatching you had other brands that were still just sending you free product in exchange for I guess they thought you would at least post something if they send you something. Even though I don't think that was ever really a guarantee, there was just an expectation: Oh, I sent Cristine a collection. She's going to post a picture of it.
C: Yeah b: And I remember at one point an Indie, I don't remember the name so I'm not even gonna say who but, they were really mad at you because you posted pictures for a company that paid you to take swatch pictures before theirs. And I guess this Indie didn't like that other Indies collection or didn't like something about them But I remember they sent you like a really nasty email Because you didn't post quickly enough photos they weren't paying for. And I remember at the time how upset you were by it and thinking back now I like wish I could just like Reassure us at the time because I remember we talked about it and you felt bad and you like didn't know if what you did was wrong or not and like I just wish I could like grab us in the past and shake us and be like This person is like awful They're not paying you for anything and they're getting mad at someone who is giving them free promotion. It was insane C: I think that, they were mad just to explain this a little clearly. They were mad because they were coming out with a similar new product as the company that I was paid to do the swatching for. And when I received both of them in the mail around the same time, of course I prioritized the company that was paying me.
B: Actually valuing your work.
C: So, they were paying me. I had a quick turnaround I I did all the photos I did them quick like professional sent them back and then the company uses them and the other company that their competitor who had a very similar product but like I don't know I'm not in the nail polish making like business at that time I don't know who's coming out with what or if any like none of this is proprietary Not none of these people own these formulas They just happen to find the same pigment presumably from the same supplier who came out with it, and then they both found it So they were in a race to get it out first.
B: I guess
C: That's not my problem B: Yeah
C: Like I'm just a, I was a paid swatcher by one company So I did that work and then the other one sent me a really angry email, multiple paragraphs and said they were so disappointed in me and I I cried about it Because I felt like I'd hurt someone's feelings and looking back I realize how unprofessional it was of that company to make me feel like I did anything wrong Because I did absolutely nothing wrong.
B: No Yeah Here's some uhh, I feel like we're talking about some things we've never really addressed or you've never really addressed about You had some pretty strained relationships with how do I put this? Between 2015 and 2016 objectively speaking, you probably did more to promote boutique nail polish than anyone else in the world. I would, I would think. And a lot of companies really benefited from that a lot of small Indies really benefited from that and looking back a lot of them really didn't value you or kind of took advantage of your promotion I think. And it definitely changed our perspective and the trajectory of how you continue to work with brands and companies after that Yeah.
C: Yeah And I also just want to say I I'm not naming names here because it's not my goal and I absolutely do not want to disparage a small business which a lot of these come indie companies are I don't want to ruin or small business because I had a Business relationship that just ultimately did not work out, you know, there was no major personal drama with any of the companies I'm referring to today It's just business relationships or ways of doing things that I ultimately just didn't agree with didn't respect or didn't feel treated appropriately and that's why I ended said business relationship, but I'm not in the business of ruining companies. I know if I say a name everyone's gonna go attack them on social media, and I don't want that to happen So that's why I'm not naming names.
B: Yeah, just we'll leave it in the past.
C: Yeah B: Next question what do brands look for when working with swatches or bloggers? C: Good question. I think they look for clean photos Consistent photos. Good lighting and An extensive enough portfolio that they can see evidence that like, you're really good at what you do and you do enough of it I don't think you can get a brand to sponsor you or send you free product if you have like three photos of your nails on your Instagram Right? Ultimately, they are looking for a history of your work. Like any artist ,like any actress who goes to auditions Like any model, you need a portfolio. So I guess that's kind of what I was doing in the beginning, unpaid. Which makes sense. You need to build yourself a portfolio. Although I just like I was doing it as a hobby I didn't think of it as a portfolio for business until I realized I could turn it into that B: Yeah, yeah you obviously need something for the brands to look at to evaluate whether you either A currently take pictures that they would want to pay for or B You are showing the potential of being able to do that, I suppose. And once you do that, though like what are brands really looking for like we know from like running the business side of things now that, a lot of business is just about keeping things on schedule and consistent and always looking the same So it's not a coincidence that like the sort of bloggers or nails swatchers you see getting paid by companies and that websites are using are just able to take really good consistent pictures and what you're not seeing is behind the scenes. They're routinely delivering them in a timely manner C: And they're professional, I'm assuming B: Yeah, they're treating it professionally
C: And in their interactions too with the brand if you're a prospective blogger you want to be professional with the brands and you want to listen to them, hear their requests And if you ever don't like anything that they say or you want to offer something differently, you do it in a professional way B: And hopefully the brand is professional too
C: Yes B: Okay, next question. What are your experiences with Indie versus mainstream nail polish brand with PR and if something in the order goes wrong I'm 13 and from the land of Nicky Tuto... okay. I think we got the question. What's, what's the difference in your experience between Indie and mainstream nail polish
C: So the difference in working with Indie versus mainstream or their nail polish itself?
B: I don't know, interpret it how you want C: Okay, I have spoken to both indie and mainstream nail polish companies um and I think the the biggest thing is the way they approach the business and It makes sense because when you're an indie producer of anything nail polish, or I don't know craft beer, right? You're heavily tied to your product because it might just be you and one other person developing it You might be doing all the branding and also the production but in a mainstream nail polish company There's a team of maybe hundreds of people They have their own PR agency They have someone else who develops the Polish and there's someone completely different who comes up with the branding concept So they're they're run very differently. And as a result when I speak to each of them they handle the business very differently.
B: And it makes sense right? Like so when we've talked to both Indies and mainstream nail polish fans if we're talking to a mainstream nail polish brand I'm talking to like their PR or marketing person, I guess and when you're talking to an indie you're probably just talking to the one or two people who run that entire business and There is going to be a different level of emotional attachment to the brand because of that C: Yeah, and I don't think like, there is some It's okay to have an emotional connection to some degree with your product because you have a passion for it I'm passionate about Holo Taco. So yes, I have an emotional connection to my product. So I completely understand that. At the same time, if you're conducting a business and you're selling a product and you're working with Business partners in any capacity maybe they're swatchers. Maybe you're hiring photographers, or maybe you're trying to get your product into Sephora. I don't know There is an expectation that in dealing with the business world you need to be able to handle these conversations with professionalism. And I have found just in my personal experience dealing with a couple, not all Indies Definitely not all, but a few It's been less professional And as a result, like I felt somewhat disrespected devalued and it was challenging to work with them on things when I was trying to come at it from a rational business perspective And their reactions became emotionally charged rather than just discussing like factually this isn't gonna work for me in my business plan because ABC so It's it's been challenging sometimes, I found working with a few Indies Definitely not all of them. There's some that are completely like they they run their business like a business B: Sure. And there's Indies that you still have good relationships with even today right? And I should say like we've had good and bad experiences both with indie and Mainstream nail polish or brands in general, right? So like there have been both indie and mainstream nail brands that basically were offering to pay you for a review implying that they were thinking they were paying for a positive review It's not just Indies that are doing that. A big nail brand basically was trying to do that at one point, right?
C: Yeah, I remember that so so there was There was there's one at least one Indie and at least one major nail brand that's like in the drugstore I can think of who after I gave their product a negative honest review on my channel they had contacted me and asked if I would basically do a sponsored video for them and presumably be positive about the same or an improved version of Their product to kind of I guess redeem their brand and have me Simply Nailogical now say that their product is good. And they wanted to pay me for it. I said no to both of those because I'd already decided that I didn't like the product That's what I told my audience and I'm not gonna accept your money just to tell them otherwise. And that happened for both Indie and mainstream.
B: So there's unprofessionalism in mainstream and Indie companies, right?
C: Good point. Yes B: All right, next one without naming names necessarily. Is there a brand that gave you a distaste for doing sponsored content? Was there a brand that was demanding for a good review? So I think we basically just preemptively answered that that example C: Yeah, it's unfortunate But I also understand it from their perspective because if they're thinking at it about it from a strategic Business sense they want to redeem that credibility. They just lost because some random YouTuber decided to say bad things So like it makes sense to me that they tried to make an effort to reach out and correct that but it's against my own code to
B: As long as you can stand behind what you posted and like you gave the negative review for like a reasonable reason because you just didn't have a good experience with it as Any normal consumer would have right? C: Yeah, and if people post negative reviews about Holo Taco, I'm not contacting them asking them to like offering them money B: Change their mind
C: to change their minds. No, like it's normal customers, which I was for a lot these or bloggers are going to have opinions and that's okay. It should it's and you know what the brands who were upset with my review I wish that they just took that and learned from it and maybe invested in like changing their product Just listen to what I have to say Listen to what nail bloggers, swatchers, customers have to say
B: Yeah, or don't if that's otherwise working for you C: Yeah, or don't. But, don't try and pay them off. Yeah B: All right, next question how many collabs with nail polish brands. Have you declined especially now that you have your own nail polish brand? Okay Cristine is drinking her tea. So I'll just say I think anyone paying attention will have noticed that You basically stopped promoting any nail polish What in 2017 or 2018? Around that time like you, you know, you've there was a clear point at which you stopped doing sponsored content related to nail polish and it was when we were first starting to seriously consider if you wanted to do your own nail polish brand, which I think was around C: I think it was 2017. That doesn't mean I stopped using nail polish. Sorry, I mean
B: No C: I used nail polish, obviously but I I Stopped doing sponsored like deliberate dedicated videos for other companies.
B: Or like doing paid Swatches or paid videos in any way for other people?
C: Yeah.
B: Yeah C: But there's at least three major drugstore nail polish brands I can think of that have all offered a proposal to work with me in some capacity. All of which we said no to. B: Yeah, and I guess there's a few reasons for that. Part of it was knowing that you were starting to think you wanted to do Your own thing Another was just, you have set the bar very high for the kind of nail polish you're willing to put your name and face behind. It has to be excellent and there are always doubts that mainstream Drugstore nail polish will ever be able to make nail polish that quality or that they won't be willing to make nail polish that high quality because of cost.
C: That's a good point and I just knew in my heart that you know, even though Giant mainstream brand acts might have been able to pay a lot of money I knew if I promoted their latest collection. It just like wasn't as exciting to me as other nail polishes that I love. So I ultimately like I just didn't feel right about doing it B: Yeah, we certainly turned down a lot of money by not considering those deals though, right? All right. Next question. When and why did you start your peely bag? C: Uhhh.. Because I was doing swatching So, yeah, I think so. Well nail art was a big thing. I wanted to peel off too, but It became so frustrating as a swatcher to change your nail polish multiple times in a day with acetone. Like it's really drying on your hands to do it 12 times a day So I discovered like a peel off base coat many years ago B: That's really what a peel off base goes for is if you want to regularly change your nails, right? C: Yeah, so that's kind of why I think I started it and then I'm like why am I throwing all these out? I think I want to keep them so in my peely bag, there is nail art But there's also just a lot of plain nails from swatching B: Okay Next question in past videos you've talked about calling out websites and brands that take bloggers photos for their product ads How big of a problem is that in the nail community? I'd imagine it's easier to recognize a stolen face shot than a stolen hand.
C: Yes.
B: Good point C: This is a great point and I think it is a huge problem and I see my stuff stolen to this day One thing you can do to try and prevent it is always watermark your photos because Like this comment says if it's not your face It's hard to really know whose nails it is and random consumer X who's seeing this as an Instagram sponsored post has no idea It's your nails and that you didn't consent to your photo being used for some random company's marketing So it sucks when this happens. Watermark your photos, around your cuticle, so they can't crop it out B: Yeah, is that, be strategic with your watermarks?
C: That's the trick.
B: They always try to crop it out. Right? I mean we used to spend more time Searching out people using your your property and your images and getting it taken down There's only so many of the hour So many hours in the day That you can really spend doing that. We still do it and if it's being posted on any sort of mainstream platform There are mechanisms for doing copyright claims and things like that. So it can be taken down, but you're right it's just kind of hard to, most of it that we're aware of is when we see people tweeting about it to either of us, right? C: Yeah, and honestly thank you guys for pointing that out to me because sometimes I'm not watching every ad on snapchat or Instagram and It's really it's it's upsetting. But like I'm I also collect them. I collect all the instances. I see of stolen content I don't know if maybe you'll make a video on it one day, but I collect them. So keep tweeting them to me.
B: Okay. B: Did you meet any toxic nail bloggers or was everyone pretty nice? C: I mean, I would definitely say it's not like the beauty community B: Well, that's a big, that's a big topic right now. Like a lot of people are pushing back on this label that the beauty community writ large is toxic. When really it's just like a few really prominent mainstream people that have huge fan bases are sort of like The most toxic and there's plenty of people who just do makeup because they love makeup.
C: Yeah, no you're right. No definitely. B: So I don't want to just like paint with a broad brush and say the beauty community is toxic because I know a lot of people are sensitive to that right now.
C: Yes.
B: and I think maybe that's analogy it's analogous to the The nail blogger community too, right? There's a lot of people who just love nail polish and are having a good time online doing nail polish But, like in any community there are going to be those Bad apples or toxic people or people who shit talk people behind their back and are into drama and things like that. So I know, I know you've experienced that as well C: I think I I really started experiencing negativity towards me once I started getting more popular And I's noticed that even even brands like small Indies that I used to work with would start talking shit about me online in hidden groups that they thought were hidden and then people would share that with me and be like I don't know if you saw this, but so-and-so said this about you Meanwhile, they were emailing me trying to get my rates and work with me. So...
B: Yeah C: That put a really bad taste in my mouth and just made me like sad B: That was pretty much at the witch at the point where you basically stopped considering working with Indies other than ones you maybe have an existing relationship with because we were seeing a lot of examples of maybe reaching out asking for a sponsored video and then we'd see them in a Facebook group saying like really awful things about you and So it's like oh they wanted to profit from your advertising and they were just saying a lot of really disrespectful shit about you on Not even private like Facebook groups that you can still find C: Yeah.
B: More on like the nail blogger topic though like yeah, I think and you know what, It might be hard to find evidence of this on the internet now, but CutePolish The really giant nail art personality before you went through something similar in the sense that a lot of people in the nail Blogging nail art community.
C: Hated her.
B: just started hating her when she got really popular An aspect of it, It's not like that These people have to like you or her but there's definitely at least an aspect of it that is resentment or bitterness about how like oh you've gotten so popular from doing this and there was one nail blogger that comes to mind who we were a little concerned about and I think you had reached out to her at one point I don't want to say who it is. But like we had credible evidence that she had made multiple accounts on a gossip forum to have like conversations with herself about how terrible you were. And that's just not a good feeling knowing that there are people out there that sort of obsessed with you, you know? So... Yeah C: So, yeas. There were people who didn't like me who still don't like me and that's fine And I've just come to realize or how I rationalize it to myself is that a lot of that is... Since I gained in popularity, like that's what it's correlated to and it's just sad but it kind of it comes with the job in a way. Not that I agree with it And and I don't and I think it's really sad and it used to upset me way more than it does. But I've had to Develop a thicker skin.
B: And it's, it's a good thing you weren't super young when you got this popularity because I think it probably would have affected your mental health way more C: Yeah, that's a really good point. I was already 26 and you know high school was long over for me So that's what the behavior
B: It is a lot like highschool
C: It really felt like very pedr pedr right? Very petty petty very bitter Jealousy.
B: Yeah.
C: And I For the most part just chose not to engage and I think that was the right decision But it took a lot of like maturity and strength To do that because I definitely felt hurt and like I wanted to talk to the person and understand what I did so wrong To deserve, you know the kinds of words they were calling me on Facebook, but I I didn't B: Mm-hmm. Alright, next question. Why'd you stop saying things like "simply peel like no big deal" and just mentioning other ending nail products in general? In the beginning a lot of your videos were based around your favorite brands and nail products like simply peel and on to peel off base. C: Yeah, that's a good question. And I do get this a lot and just more generally why have you stopped promoting brands that you used to promote? And I think just on a high level Like we've suggested already in this podcast there have been business relationships that just didn't work out And it's not necessarily because there was some personal reason It's never just one small thing. It's multiple things that kind of led to me deciding that I no longer wanted a business relationship with this person or this company and I would slowly just stop promoting it because why? Why am I going to grow someone's business who doesn't show me respect or value or has done something to upset me or said something about me behind my back? Which happened quite frequently from a lot of companies and I was really disappointed to see some of that and Not that I want to make an emotional decision and seek revenge. Instead I just decided like I just I don't want to promote these companies anymore. Sometimes relationships fall apart and I think it's it's more professional and responsible to just I'm not going to grow your business any more. That's it. I'm not trying to call anyone out I'm not I never made any drama videos about like what really happened with X company Because that's not my goal either.
B: Yeah We can leave it at that Next question. Do you think Blogs in general are still relevant? There are so many social media options out there that people use to connect and exchange opinions.
C: Is the blog dead? b: I mean the short answer is like no. Like who really reads blogs anymore? Maybe like the one industry or area where like blogs are still a thing is in baking
C: Baking? B: or like cooking
C: Well cuz you need ingredients And like recipes.
B: But, you know what's weird like whenever you look up a recipe for something? There's often like a wall of text before it gets to the actual ingredients and recipe, right?
C: And everyone scrolls by it.
B: Everyone just ignores it
C: I scroll by it.
C: But like people are basically writing blog post and then I guess the Recipe. I gather there's some like SEO like search engine Optimization of reasons why they write this like big long post before they get to the right
C: With a bunch of keywords about like bananas B: I think that's what it is. But but like yeah in 2020 if you're thinking of starting a nail blog Maybe just start an Instagram account, right? C: It's also harder to manage a blog. I think because you have multiple tabs different post updates You need to fill the space better. You need to think of headers. You need to have like all these links working Whereas just running an Instagram is actually a lot simpler and I think today more effective.
B: Mm-hmm or just started a YouTube channel, right?
C: Or YouTube - I mean, that's not, not easy. You gotta shoot videos B: Is the fact that you may have a perfectionist side the reason you make your own swatches for holo taco or you just enjoy it C: So I have to be honest. I don't enjoy swatching It's actually really hard on my back to do that. Which is why I said earlier, I set a limit for myself to only take two swatches at a time, per day B: You take your time
C: and I take my time I have to spread it out for my own health and health and safety In terms of like why it's just me swatching for Holo Taco Because I am the face of the brand it's my brand I am I am super close to my product and how I want it to be perceived I also think that there is an element of nostalgia for people who are like looking at the Oh taco site and like seeing my photos and Those people who maybe followed me five years ago. And remember when I did all the swatches for other companies I almost think it's sort of poetic and I just really like being the one to provide like 95 percent of the content for Holo Tacos, like socials or just like the website. It really feels, because it's my brand and I Love taking the pictures and doing it for my branch. So it's it's it's not necessarily just perfectionist It's not like I think I'm the only one who could take good pictures, but it is my brand So why not have it be my nails? B: And that's why it's like really strange If you see an influencer brand where like there aren't any pictures of the influencer using the product, you know what I mean? Like isn't it strange when you see that? Like so to me, I think to a lot of people it's just a reminder that like yeah Cristine actually loves and uses these products
C: And I'm the photographer the director for all the nail pporns. It's all still me B: Yeah, I mean it is something worth talking about. Especially in the sense that I think people understand it because all the pictures are your nails. But I think it would be helpful to people to see Swatches on different skin tones, for example, that's something we're aware of and we're trying to figure out the best way of doing that C: Yeah, that's absolutely something we want to do. Once we grow enough as a team to expand past just me being the only model.
B: Yeah
C: Absolutely we are going to to make it inclusive. Yeah for sure B: Alright and last question When you started did you ever think that one day you would be as successful as you are in that endeavor? Also the fact that you started your own company Was that ever a goal or was that just an absurd concept for a little baby Cristine back in the beginning of your blog? C: Simply. When I started my blog no, I had no I had no vision that I would start a nail polish company B: Or that you could even make money posting pictures of nails. C: Yeah it was a slow thing that I eventually Realized I could turn into a business and then I already had the passion for it and I'm like hey Why not turn your passion into it into a business because I'd already established it I mean like this whole journey has been crazy I never thought of myself as being a public figure which is what Facebook calls me is "public figure"
B: Oh, yeah? C: Like what? Or a Canadian YouTuber is what Google calls me now Um, and having my own nail polish company is wild. I mean, of course it was kind of a dream but like not really, in maybe 2016 when I discovered like indie polishes and realize how difference the how different the quality was and I really had a passion for a certain type of nail polish. Holo. I just you know over time like sure I'd dream about it But it wasn't really didn't seem like something I could even do like alone but Eventually, I thought that if I ever had a nail polish company, I would name it Holo Taco and I think I've explained this story before and I even reserved like the Twitter for like Holo_Taco in like 2016, just for fun Not because I actually knew this was going to happen and turn out this way but it was just if I ever had one I knew that's what I wanted it to be.
B: And I should say even back to I remember the first year We went to VidCon we weren't even invited. This is like C: We paid $700 for Industry tickets
B: We paid for industry tickets to go We ended up at some industry party and I don't know if you remember this but someone came up to us and pitched the idea of you starting a nail polish line and They pitched it like yeah, I'll be great. We'll just split it 50/50 and you'll just market the nail polish I remember the time was it being bizarre It was someone we didn't know and it there was no reason why they should have been getting 50% of the deal like so it was a very funny proposal but I think that also was like the first Like planted a seed in our mind like like wow, like if you did start a nail polish line, of course It would there would be people who would believe you because they know you would do it the right way, right? so I think like all the way back there was at least a bit of a thought that it could be a possibility and There were a lot of conversations Between that time and when you actually launched Holo Taco with different perspective partners that could have been involved in it. A lot of people reached out on deals That would have made you a lot of money, but that we just felt wasn't necessarily the best fit We really needed to find people to help us make it C: Who had the capacity and infrastructure to meet the demand also was really important
B: But were also willing to meet the sort of quality expectations you have
C: Right.
B: Cause to be frank like we we talked to a lot of like the big producers and labs and most of them were more interested in doing like a kind of co-branding thing like Simply Nailogical X big drug store brand and yeah, like we kind of intimated before we didn't have the confidence that They would prioritize quality as much as we wanted them to
C: Yeah
B: On the flip side Uhh I don't know how much we want to get into this. There are NDA's involved, but we talked to a few Indies way back years ago about potentially bringing some of them on as either consultants or selling formulations or ideas to us because obviously you have a lot of respect for the quality of Polish you see from Indie nail polish makers Ultimately, those conversations didn't really go anywhere. It just didn't make business sense, but We've just we we thought for a long time about how it made sense to launch Holo Taco and we eventually got to the right place and it was after years of Talking to other people about it potentially happening, and eventually we just landed in the right situation. So I hope people sort of Respect or appreciate that we didn't just jump at the first opportunity to sell nail polish with your name on it We really were careful to only do it with the right people at the right time.
C: Yeah, you're right there We had multiple phone calls some in-person meetings With mainstream and and indie nail polish makers to maybe make my own line B: Mm-hm
C: and of course in business You're gonna have multiple different options and conversations before you find the deal that is right for you And we didn't find the deal that was right or that made sense or that I was a hundred percent confident in until maybe I guess it would have been it was early 2018 I think is when we finally Were started speaking to the the people that we are working with now to have made this happen Yeah, so it was a long journey to launch Holo Taco, which launched almost exactly a years old.
B: It's almost been a year.
C: It'll be our first year anniversary coming up. So we're also doing something special for that. I shouldn't say too much But yeah like this it took it's so I don't know I'm just so excited about this and I know we want to do holo taco podcast so I won't speak too much just about Holo Taco, but what I will say just on like indie relationship front is I really Appreciate when companies that I have done work for in the past like or had a collaboration with in the past When I was coming out with holo taco Some of them congratulated me and said like congratulations Like I'm so proud of you or like you've done really well You know and showed me their support when they didn't have to they could have chosen to be really petty about it jealous or mad that I guess holo taco is their competition now. But instead they were really supportive and I know I don't like calling out brands out of negativity But I will call out some out of positivity. So I would like to say, thank you honestly to Fun Lacquer and Cirque Colors are two of the ones that were extremely supportive and Congratulatory of me when I launched Holo Taco They've been nothing but a pleasure to work with. I've done sponsored content with Cirque I've had a collaboration collection with Fun and they ultimately like understood when I launched my brand and they were supportive and I think ultimately I believe and I think so do they, obviously, that there's room for all of us in nail-polish just like in makeup. There's room for so many different makeup companies No one is just gonna buy one nail polish brand I've never bought just one nail polish brand, you know you buy multiple. And you support who you want to support and maybe it's just indie brands because you like supporting small businesses and Maybe you just like go to the drugstore and buy nail polish there
B: In the same way that you sort of individually as Simply Nailogical Very much popularized or helped make more popular the type of high quality special effects nail polish indies were making, the more successful Holo Taco is at elevating that category of the nail polish market I think will also benefit some of the smallish smaller nail polish makers who are doing the special effects thing? so Yeah, it is nice for some of those people that you really helped promote early on to just show some appreciation and just respect of congratulating you
C: I do and I I respect their craft and creativity which is why I wanted to be a part of it So, I mean, I don't think that's an insult of me insulting like their business because I also want to make Holo polish B: No
C: I mean it's a love for a product that we all love. We all love Holo and no one owns holo, obviously.
B: Can't we all just get along because we love holo? C: I think there's room for it and I think it's really important especially for small businesses and and women backed Businesses women-owned businesses to support other businesses and support other women just trying to use their passion and build a business B: So log off of Facebook, don't write any more mean comments Alright Apologies to CutePolish We thought we might have a little bit of time to bring her in at the end of the day to talk about her experience In the nail polish community, but we ran out of time.
C: Shout out to Sandy.
B: Yeah the OG. The original nail art channel on YouTube Alright, I think that's it. Everybody. We went on a while. This was a bit more of an emotional roller coaster C: Yeah I mean, It is my starting point and I know we were gonna talk about Influencer sponsorships, was one of the proposed categories and you guys definitely voted for that. But we just felt that this kind of backstory Made so much sense to explain first because I come from charging nothing to $12 a photo before, you know I was being offered five to six figure deals as an influencer. So before we talk about Influencer sponsorships. I thought it was kind of important to lay this groundwork B: Yeah Actually Maybe that's even some important context of some of the things we said today like when we're going to YouTube conventions and all our friends Are like getting hundred thousand dollar brand deals, and we're like I charge $12 for a photo C: Yeah
B: It kind of changed our perspective on things as well.
C: You learn a lot. I have learned a lot. And yeah anyway B: All right everybody. Thank you so much for tuning in
C: Thank You guys.
B: See you next Taco Tuesday.
C: It's Tuesday. Don't forget.
B: Don't forget. It's Tuesday C: Hope you're all doing well.
C: Yeah, stay safe See ya'll later.
C: Wear your mask... social distancing
B: Yes C: It's not over, the Pandemic is not over.
B: Okay.
C: Alright everybody.
B: See ya'll later.
C: Thanks so much for watching. We'll see y'all later. Byeee
When they talk about someone making multiple accounts just to shit talk her.... Yikes. Hope that person looked for help.
I was catching up on SimplyPodLogical and found this episode very interesting. I always wondered why she stopped using Simply Peel and from what she mentioned I think they took advantage of her/talked behind her back. 👀
That sucks that Cristine got mistreated by indie companies considering how much she did for them. I bought so many things like Unt base coat and nail vinyls based off of her recommendations alone.
Can someone give a summary of the video?
I collect indie nail polish and I am mostly active in the Facebook communities. The indie nail polish community is interesting because brand owners make minimal profit and bloggers do as well. It’s definitely a passion hobby, but all hobbies can have drama. Of course not all communities are innocent, so it was really interesting to get her take and perspective as a blogger. I do remember one time YEARS ago she was roasting a nail polish for looking like cereal puke and all her fans really harassed the brand for awhile. Then recently her fans started commenting on Loud Lacquer posts to recommend Holo Taco instead. With Christine’s fans being younger, sometimes it’s a bit frustrating when she doesn’t seem to speak up and tell them to chill.
Sorry this is probably OT (and very long sorry! feel free to delete) but does anyone know about the refunds/orders regarding Mentality nail polish scandal that happened in 2015? (TW injury/graphic photos of nails on some of these links) This post for the science behind it (I tried to contact her about the blog but I'm not sure my comment went through, it may be worth trying to get to her again) He wrote a BOOK with a discount ass ms paint cover 💀 (reddit thread with a link to the pdf), it sucks to no surprise and is full of /r/thathappened stories/misogynistic bullshit/vague statements about what went wrong but he admits absolutely nothing. All posts about this seem to disappear suspiciously after 2015, I can't find ANYTHING and I'm so :(( (another article here)
I peeked around, mentality's website mentioned a family blog - there's a section devoted to mentality, and he's still making it and doing giveaways? holy fucking shit lol He basically brags about still being around, but he also makes a lot of revealing/incriminating statements, calling the "EPA a real bummer" and that they "survived" through accounting. If I knew the science behind it I'd try to figure it out what he did, I can't believe he's so fucking bold about it all (the meme references... the link to cyberbullying.org lol dude you made people's nails fall off please) But if anyone knows, I'd love to know/read more stuff about it! I found out about it by chance in an ancient reddit thread and it's been killing me
EDIT: this guy has gone so far to cover his tracks it's insane (and is still trying to sue people in 2019 for defamation of character for blog posts lol, he's got his lawyer on speed dial 💀) but there's more info from taken down websites in the wayback archive: Here's a website with more info incl. an EPA report where they mix stuff in water bottles, and a much longer post with really good information (very bad nail damage images, warning!!!) where the blogger points out that they knew their product was causing harm to people but kept selling it anyways and not acknowledging the problem and did not issue out any notices until they (mentality)'s claim to become a corporation went through (so they couldn't be personally sued for damages). The people hurt by their product deserve the whole story with this scandal especially, If he makes it just for his wife and post on his blog whatever... but he's an evil snake who sold product when he knew it was hurting people and kept doing it, yall entering in the giveaway on his site may wanna rethink that lol
TLDW?
I kept getting trump ads on videos! I had no idea that could be controlled by the creators. I thought I was getting them cause he was trolling me hard.
I love her!!! I literally have all of her nail polish!!!