The Mafias Biggest Money Maker - Michael Franzese Tells His Story

you can now follow me and all my social media platforms to find out who my latest guest will be and don't forget to click the subscribe button and the notifications button so you're notified for when my next podcast goes live you know i was bringing in eight eight nine ten million dollars a week i had my own jet plane my own helicopter i had 300 guys under me i had the russian mob guys from brighton beach that were my partners when uh when they wanted to assassinate um fidel castro they came to us to pull it off the cia actually came to the mafia to help them kill castro in cuba at that time i mean back in the days of al capone i mean the truth of the matter is capone controlled a lot of the politicians and a lot of the police it was very corrupt back then and that continued for quite some time i mean look i had politicians that you know would do do things for me i needed licenses for my company the gas company so i could steal the tax you couldn't get the license was hard but i had political help to get i had 18 licenses i was paying politicians to get them for me when rudy giuliani indicted me i was the first major mob guy that they indicted under the rico statute the racketeering statute the day of my arraignment when they were you know they locked me up and then you go to court and they read you the charges and then you get bail they gave me a million dollar bail but rudy was in the courtroom with me and he told my lawyer and me he says if i convict francis on this case he's gonna get double what his father's got i'm gonna give him a hundred years boomerang then today's guest we've got michael francis how are you steven yeah james i mean good start good start you can show me what you want brother james i got you now first and foremost how are you i'm good i'm good uh been here a week now close to a week and uh you know my third trip to the united kingdom and great people are great i just can't understand anybody but other than that everything is great but now you're just going to struggle even more with a scottish man but let's talk about the the tour straight away we'll plug that how many dates have you got booked in we have uh 15 right now that are firm and i think there's going to be about 10 more we're doing 25 altogether we're starting in london july 2nd at the grosvenor big big event big deal and uh we're going to go all through the uk we're going to scotland we're going to wales and we may even hit ireland also so very excited good uh where can people buy these tickets michael they can go to michaelfrancistour.com and i think there'll be a link up someplace and uh tickets are going fast ever since wednesday they've been flying so grab your tickets yeah big fan of yourself i've watched many of your interviews very powerful but out of everybody you probably find yourself lucky to still even be breathing on this planet one of the biggest moneymakers been in prison you've had hits out in your life you've changed your life which is noble thing to do i respect that thank you but first and foremost i always go back to start with my guests where did you grow up how it all began you know i'll tell you this uh james if you would have told me 20 years ago that i'd be doing what i've been doing now i would have said you're crazy right but for me it all started back in brooklyn new york my dad was the under boss of the colombo family one of the five new york cozumester families and so i grew up in that lifestyle you know my dad was a very high profile figure kind of like the john gotti of his day back in the 50s 60s and so you know i knew the environment but my dad didn't want me in that life he wanted me to go to school he wanted me to be a doctor actually so i was on that path and i loved my dad he was very supportive of me growing up um and he got in some real trouble in the 60s he was indicted several times in the state of new york went to trial three times very serious crimes eventually acquitted found not guilty but then in 1966 he was indicted on a big case by the feds for masterminding a nationwide string of uh bank robberies he was a mastermind allegedly he was convicted and sentenced to 50 years in prison and in 1970 after he lost all his appeals they shipped him off to lovemore to do to do his time i was a pre-med student he was going to be a doctor and joe columbo was the boss of my family i got very close with him and a lot of my dad's friends you know and they said mike what are you doing going to school if you don't help your father out he's going to die in prison because my dad obviously you know he's in that life he did a lot of bad things but that particular crime james that he was convicted of he was innocent my dad was no bank robber and i'll take that to my grave so i wanted to help him out we met in the visiting room in prison and i said dad i'm not going to school if i don't help you out you're going to die in here it was during that conversation that he proposed me for membership into the columbo family he wanted me he said if you're going to be on the street do it the right way and he proposed me which is the process that you go through before you become a member that's how it started how much pressure did you feel from your dad obviously you've looked up to your dad very powerful man but he's obviously not want you good in the root because as soon as you join he knows it's dead at prison there's two options in that life you know this yourself yeah how much added pressure on you was it to try and help your dad instead of the dad looking out for you and saying look son save yourself and don't go down the road i went down you know i didn't realize that at the times james it wasn't really pressure you know i wasn't a guy that wanted to be part of that life all my life you know i was an athlete in school i was gonna be a doctor so you know it's not like guys that wanted their whole life to be part of that life for me no so when he said to me this is the way to go i said okay dad if this is what you want i'm ready to do it i didn't feel pressure i really didn't but you know i mean it was just really trying to help him out if that was the way to do it then fine let's do it how was it as a kid growing up i was a kid yeah you know it was i mean look it was different you know we had the pressure of my dad's name out there all the time i had issues in school hey your dad's a mafia dad i fight you know we had that kind of a thing and we had police and law enforcement around us all the time so it was a crazy environment but uh you know you get used to it i guess i don't know you deal with it how long did you have left at med school uh well i was two years into it so i had another two years of pre-med it was it was in college and then i was going on to med school so so i had done two years did you have a big family brothers sisters yeah i was one of seven one of seven so i had two brothers and and there are sisters but uh i was the only one that really got involved in that life my younger brother did but he had a tremendous drug problem so he never went anywhere with it how does that affect your dad does your dad blame himself for everybody has choices in life but i speak to a lot of criminals and understand the majority of people who turn to crime were either bullied or abused when a younger or their dad was never around like people make choices could they try do external things to fulfill an internal problem if you know what i mean like did you blame himself for the way some of his kids went you know james that's the one issue that i had with my dad later on in that he never took responsibility my family was destroyed destroyed and he never took responsibility for that because he always said this was not my fault i was framed i wouldn't have been in jail he would have been to jail anyway because they we we all go to jail but uh he never took responsibility and i don't know if he was out of guilt or maybe he was just you know he was uh he was a narcissistic kind of guy in that respect and he just would never claim responsibility for what happened to his family never i interviewed a man last week who was involved in ira which is the the the army the irish army yeah an island to this day he still thinks like a soldier even though the war is done the peace has been agreed there's no violence anymore and his mind because they're in misery that both sides done to each other the deaths of children family members everything he still thinks every morning that he's a soldier the reason being is because if he comes out of that playroom and his mind all the feelings everything that he has been involved and seen will come to the surface and eventually he's seen men broken by it so he has to convince himself that he's still a soldier do you feel as if your dad had to stay in character because of the things he's seen and done in his life you know i think with my dad his legacy in that life was more important to him than anything he wanted to be known as the stand-up guy that would never hurt his friends you know as far as talking to law enforcement that meant more to him than anything more i hate to say more than his family because he did love his family but his personal legacy meant more than anything so i think that's what it was you know hey i was framed none of this was my fault if i was home none of this would have happened to my family and that's just what he he lived that way and he died that way so what days did you join the family then the family business i i started out when i was 21 i was a recruit you know learning the ropes so to speak and i got made officially when i was 24. and how does what's the process to get made well you know first you have to prove yourself and uh so you're you know two years two and a half years of of doing that and uh the ceremony after you've made your bones and you prove yourself the ceremony was very solemn it was a dimly lit room late at night there were six of us that took the oath that night and you walk into a room and the boss and the underboss and the conciliary and all the captains are there and you actually take an old and you uh you swear your loyalty to kosanostra you swear the ultavo merta meaning you'll never talk about the life never admit that even exists and uh you know they draw some blood from your your finger and um after that night if you accept the oath you're a made guy what is um means it's silence it means you would never admit that you were part of that life or that that life even exists that's really what america is a lot of people think when you take the oath of america you you take the oath to kill people and steal and rob that's not at all you're never supposed to admit that the life even exists to anybody so obviously i broke my oath because i talk about the life but that's what it really is how many families are there five families in new york five families in new york yes and the mafia started in sicily is this correct started in sicily yeah and so out of all the families who did you think was the strongest by the numbers the strongest families were the genovese family and the uh gambino family they both had about 250 made guys guys that actually took the oath uh our family had about 115 guys columbos and lucasies and bonanno is kind of the same thing but you know in terms of of wealth i would say it was probably probably the genovese family is that how you judge that free will from power yeah influence wealth how many guys they have you know i asked my boss at times uh at a time his name was karma persico one one of my boss for quite some time i said how come you don't bring more guys into the family you know why why are we the smallest family and he said well i believe in quality rather than quantity you know i want quality guys i don't think that was really the case i don't know why but you know but look we all had power we all had influence in our own way so you know pretty well worked out what was it like getting power because i know people who do bad here and they get a sense of power but then it's like they get above their station because mentally they feel as if they're stronger than what they really are but eventually they eventually break down because i have seen the strongest men become the weakest and the weakest become the strongest that things can happen in an instance trauma whether it's ptsd but was there any moments that in your own life were you thought this was too much even at a young age you know it's uh it's individual the way people handle it i saw some people of power automatically immediately went to their heads they started acting differently walking differently talking differently because they got that badge now they made guys you know and others i seen just handle it you know hey this is uh i still realize i'm human you know i got more authority now and it all depends individually how you handle it i believe i handled it okay it never really went to my head and it's hard james because now people are catering to you you know you walk into a room everybody pays attention so you got to really try to maintain a balance and it's not easy at times how do you maintain that balance because so many people who you see in the films you read in the books they get took out anyway so they're never as powerful as they make out but how do you maintain a balance of trying to be strong but trying to be responsible and kinda i don't know i don't know how it works but to try and find the balance of prolonging your life past 30 40 years old you know it's an individual characteristic of you i saw the guys that threw their chest out the most and wanted to be the tough guys they were the first to go they never lasted in that life you know the guys that tried to maintain balance in their head you know my father taught me something once that i never forgot and he taught me a lot of good things and he really taught me how to navigate that life because she you know he was the master as as far as i was concerned but he always told me he said michael always be kind and respectful to the little people now he didn't mean that to be offensive he just that was his way of saying it he said the valet parker the guy that takes your coat you know he says treat them right because they're the people that make you strong so i always realize you know you don't walk in and expect everybody to cater to you you'd be courteous to everybody you're respectful to everybody you get more respect in return and you know that's how i tried to deal with my life i i deal with it the same way now and it worked for me back then yeah how did you become one of the biggest money makers involved in a mafia james i was fortunate you know i had a head for business i was very aggressive and i knew how to use the life to benefit me in business and i come up with some different things you know i was kind of entrepreneurial at the time and i did things that they hadn't done before and i understood that there was if you use that life properly it could work to your benefit and you know i just got fortunate you know so do you think being in med school as well being surrounded by intelligent people people who's reading books people who's not involved in that life do you think that helped you in the life of crime being kind of two steps ahead i think so because it enabled me to speak to guys in a board room you know i knew how to carry myself properly i wasn't a dmd's and those kind of guy you know i presented myself the right way because i had an education um so i was able to deal with legitimate people where they weren't afraid of me i could talk and have a conversation we could do a business deal with some guys they walk in their street guys right off the bat they put people off because of the way they talk the way they carried themselves handle themselves so i think i had an advantage you know the education and my upbringing helped me in that regard you were bringing in 2 million pounds per week to the family you were working for do you think if you weren't making as much money for them you'd have been killed i would have been killed yeah you know there's two categories of guys in that life there's the earners which we call the racketeers and then there's the gangsters that that's who they are you know you got street stuff to handle you give it to them they're the gangsters but the racketeers are the guys that bring in the money you know any organization without money there's nothing there money makes the power in our family the colombos we had 115 made guys out of 115 maybe 20 of us were real earnest we were supporting the family we were bringing the money the rest of the guys you know who had a no-show job who's trying to work a living who had a gambling problem so you're really supporting the family with you know the minimal amount of guys so i was in that category you know i was a money maker type of guy so uh would i have gotten killed i wouldn't have had the status that i had they made me a captain in 1988 in 1980 they appointed me as a captain because i was bringing in a lot of money i was taking care of a lot of guys so it helped me rise in the family will you not becoming too powerful though that they thought you were going to start your own family there was an article in the newspaper at one point um i don't even i don't remember the whole article but it said that i was becoming strong enough to break away from the colombos and stop my whole family there was no truth to it whatsoever it was a fantasy article but it got into the heads of some people because i had a big crew you know i was bringing in eight eight nine ten million dollars a week i had my own jet plane my own helicopter i had 300 guys under me i had the russian mob guys from brighton beach that were my partners so it gets into people's heads like hey my father was a powerful guy he was coming out of prison are they going to try to make a move because that's what happens in that life so yeah it started to get people a little bit concerned and and uh there was no reason for it but it happened and i had an incident one night where they they tried to make me understand we're the boss of this family not you and i got the message and i understood but there was no reason for it does that make you feel uneasy it did it it made me feel like i'm bringing in all this money and you're challenging me on it you know what i mean why is that happening but again you get to understand the ex the the ins and outs of that life it's it's a natural thing how much greed is involved how much greed grade yeah with people always wanting more always taking and organizing businesses like a part of it as greg it's ego driven narcissistic also behavior but was there ever a cut-off point where anybody ever says okay i'm going to make maybe 5 million 10 million then i'm out obviously you couldn't get out if you've made an oath but was it ever in your mind because you'd seen so much death like he says i'm just going to escape and try and leave without telling anyone well you know greed is an individual thing it's it's one of your characteristics if you have it you have it i was uh i was telling uh my guy kaz i said cass you know um when i had my crew i would tell them straight out if you want to get made you want to become a a guy in this life a soldier don't stay with me because i'm not going to make you i'm not going to present you i'm not going to propose you because if i propose you and you get made i lose you you're your own person at that point you don't answer to me i said so i'm not going to do that but if you want to make a lot of money stay here because with me you're going to make money well they all stayed because they wanted to make money you know i always believed in sharing the wealth because money and that life brings loyalty it brings you a lot of stuff you know at least for that time so um you know but greed is an individual thing i saw a lot of greedy guys and you know people resented that in that life paul castellano you know he's the boss of the gambino family he was known as a greedy guy in the end he got killed you know because people within his own family didn't like him you know so you you know look that life is very treacherous james very treacherous you gotta you gotta cover all bases you gotta know what's happening around you all the time especially if you're a big earner people are watching you all the time there's a lot of jealousy it's natural you know so you got to really play your cards the right way i always say this if you're a made guy in that life and you die of old age and you die free you've really accomplished something because it's tough to navigate did anyone older than you who'd been in that life kind of get got out of that life ever give you advice to say get out when you can or was it just not brainwashing but you're conditioned into that life to think it's normal it's the people who join the army that to go and fight for wars i don't believe in wars personally but wars do happen does anyone ever take you aside to say look leave no nobody ever told me that i don't know if anybody that ever walked away from that life publicly like i did guys left the life but they cooperated with the government they went into the witness protection program things like that but i don't know anybody that's walked away like i have so nobody advised me to do that it's dangerous to advise you to do that because you're telling somebody to break their oath so um no i i mean i honestly don't know anybody and you know i i want to tell you this too you know when i was making all this money guys would say to me i thought for myself should i stop now you know i got enough money should i stop but then i said to myself you know i was a major target of law enforcement you get as much time for a million dollars as you do for a billion dollars so i'm already i'm already crossed that line i may as well keep making money that's how i thought of it you know why not is that crazy where you're thinking yeah there's never any there's never any glory to it well you're sitting here and you're doing your thing which is an amazing thing to see that that's what one in a million possibly like to be sitting here and still doing what you're doing like it shows what can be done as well and that goes for anybody watching that's involved in a life of crime maybe not as the mafia was a well-run organization probably one of the biggest on the planet very well run that people think in the uk they're big ballers but there's no organization it's just it's it's just weird the mentality of thinking but understand people are a product of their environment and people need to understand that not every human being's bad because you do bad things it's just we do make bad choices because of the circumstances or maybe the pressures of life put as in that we think making a quick buck will cure all the answers but the does it become an addiction as well having that power having the money having it all does that become like an addiction yeah it does i mean it's it's intoxicating no doubt about it i mean look i had my own jet plane i had a helicopter i had houses in three different states i had 300 guys under me ready to do anything i tell them to do you know you walk into a a club they want to give you a ringside table i mean people cater to you so it's intoxicating you know especially when you're young this all happened to me when i was young so i mean i was feeling strong about it i didn't throw my weight around in that way but i felt strong internally um you know so how do you walk away from that plus i took an oath you know you got to understand this the mafia cousin austria in america it it prospered for well over 100 years under some very difficult conditions but why because we had structure we had discipline we had authority and we had consequences for breaking our our oath so we were very organized in that regard very very structured and that's why we lasted more than most of these la you know and we didn't we didn't make our life on based upon drugs we didn't make it on drugs you know so um you got to give the organization credit in that regard because of the like i said the structure the discipline the the the consequences for making a mistake it kept people in line and uh you know i i don't know if you know this but in america at one point in time we controlled a major part of the country i mean we had we had access to the white house you know we had politicians working for us uh we had all the unions you control the unions in america you control the country teamsters union was controlled by us we had over 2 million members you know what that means that means we have bank accounts with hundreds of millions billions of dollars from the trust funds we had 2 million votes for any politician that wanted to do our bidding two million votes that's where politicians live by votes so we controlled the country to a great degree at one point in time yeah because luckily channel was he not was it my landscape he was working with was latch and luciano very close she's not doing 50 years but they made a deal with him because they controlled the docks and they wanted exactly my lansky negotiated the deal to get luciano out of prison because we controlled the docks during world war ii and we needed they needed access to the docks and so we gave it to them we also when i say we luciano at that time he also uh helped uh the allies in italy during a war you know he helped him tremendously so he bought his way out of prison by helping the united states but remember they came to him now how do you figure the united states government going to a mob guy because he had that much power when uh when they wanted to assassinate um fidel castro they came to us to pull it off the cia actually came to the mafia to help them kill castro in cuba at that time so i mean we had a lot of power and i'll tell you this too you know people will say oh come on michael this conspiracy theory i'm telling you right now that it was a mob hit on john f kennedy no doubt and i know this i mean i wasn't involved at that point in time but my father and everybody i spoke to you know told me the whole story what happened so and i believe that the united states government never wants people to know that that's why all of these classified documents that they have will probably never be released because if they tell the truth they're going to tell that the mob was involved and the government don't want the world to know that the mob was able to get to a sitting president i mean think about that come on it's the president now how could the mob take out a president well they did was there such a thing of becoming becoming too powerful too much money too many men working under you where the police just take you out no doubt i mean uh listen and at life you know people of people outside of that life are afraid of power in that life no doubt did they ever take anybody out i don't think so i never heard that but uh you know look power power is a funny thing if you don't handle it right you're not distributed the right way it's it's a problem there's a lot of snitches now i think we live in a very weakened generation there's no loyalty there's no love there's no trust but a lot of people now here in the uk because the intelligence is so good by the police the people who stay out of prison in my opinion majority are informers did you ever would you ever know if any of the more bosses were working with the police at any point to keep them out of prison to keep the mob bosses out of prison you know i think the real influence um i mean back in the days of al capone i mean the truth of the matter is capone controlled a lot of the politicians and a lot of the police it was very corrupt back then and that continued for quite some time i mean look i had politicians that you know would do do things for me i needed licenses for my company the gas company so i could steal the tax you couldn't get the license was hard but i had political help to get i had 18 licenses i was paying politicians to get them for me you know so money talks a lot of times with everybody you know that's the thing but uh i don't think you know i don't think the government ever took any uh any mob guys out not that i know of anyway how many levels of like the top ones are dawns at the boss how many other levels under them are there well you got the boss and you got the underboss who's the second in command you've got a consulary which is a real uh you know a real position and he's supposed to be the adviser to the boss and the intima intermediary between the the men and the boss the men got a an issue they go to the conciliary he tries to straighten it out with the boss and then you got the soldier and then you got the captains excuse me kappa regimes and they're kind of the street bosses the the boss appoints them and then he gives them soldiers to take care of so a couple regime which is what i was is kind of a street boss you can't be a soldier and go directly to the boss that's a problem you got to go to your couple first and and then he goes to the boss for anything so and that's it and those are the levels of made guys and then you have associates which they work with you they understand but they don't have the same privilege as a maid guy so see if you're made what privileges does that give you because everybody who seems to get made end up dead anyway yeah does it give you any privileges dead or impressed well you get privileges within that life see to every made guy anybody that's not made they're a sucker you could be the president of the united states you're not made you didn't take that oath you're a sucker you could be the pope you're a sucker it doesn't matter so all the secrets of that life stay within the maine guys you don't like when i had a meeting with made guys my associates couldn't come in the room we couldn't share information with them you know they don't have that privilege so it was it was different how many big court cases have you walked away from me cause at four well i had uh i was indicted seven times i was i think i set a record by back there seven times i went to trial five times and i was acquitted or dismissed in every case they never convicted me at trial what would you have got if you got convicted on one when rudy giuliani indicted me i was the first major mob guy that they indicted under the rico statute the racketeering statute the day of my arraignment when they were you know they locked me up and then you go to court and they read you the charges and then you get bail they gave me a million dollar bail but rudy was in the courtroom with me and he told my lawyer and me he says if i convict francis on this case he's going to get double what his father's got i'm going to give him a hundred years so if i lose that case i was acquitted i'd still be in jail what were you thinking then if you're going to get 100 well you know i was just shutting yourself well you know what i said to him you know what i said to him because i had i've been to trial four times already and i beat him every time so i stood toe-to-doe with him and i said rudy bring it on i beat you guys four times already let's go for round five it was a dumb thing to do you know to say it like that but um i was just i was you know i didn't like law enforcement back then they were my enemy so i was just ready to fight you know but i'm gonna tell you this james i don't care what anybody tells you i don't care how tough you are whatever you are you could be gotti component don't matter when you're standing in front of that jury and they're reading that verdict it's tense there's only one word you want to hear you know what the word is go in not not that's it you don't want to hear anything other than not and when you hear not you know you're okay does that ever because so many these are like attempts out in your life because if you're doing 100 years you may as well just be dead yeah with the do you ever thinking at quote though what the [ __ ] has my life become i'm gonna tell you this i did uh because you know i went to prison i took a play afterwards but i did exactly 29 months and seven days and solitary confinement i was in the hole 24 7 6 by 8 cell and if i if i thought that was it forever that there was no chance of getting out put me to sleep there's no life you got four walls you know you they take you out once or twice a week to get a shower you're handcuffed you're in there there's no life you get the worst food you're around nobody that you love put me to sleep i i'd rather i'd rather go to sleep and then and never wake up again did you see a lot of yourself and your dad at that moment uh my dad and i were different you know we we had a different mentality in a lot of ways but you know i don't know i mean i had i had a meeting in prison with him one time when he said i may as well die in here i think it got to him at some point in time but uh you know i just i just can't see living like that you know it's more it might be the college way out hey put me to sleep execute me do whatever you got to do but you know i was young guy when i was in a hole i was in my 30s i got to live maybe another 20 30 40 years like this i'd rather die how did you survive being in solitary confinement for me it was all about my faith and my family i want to get home to my family and it was you know i'm a christian you know it's my faith that sustained me during that time because i believed that you know that i was going to get out uh even though they told me i was going to die in jail i believed that i was going to get out and it was my belief in god that got me through it if you don't if you don't have something to believe in there's no way you handle that no way what was like sailor your dad would have known everyone because he would have been involved in mafia probably near enough to start all of it like guys that it bugs his seagull how did he open his first casino in vegas was that hammett started that how much truth to that you know there were casinos in vegas before bugsy siegel small time casinos he was definitely a power in getting you know that major casino opened the first one what happened when when bugsy got killed that's when vegas became in the spotlight you know so he made vegas just by getting killed really because that's when it was all over the news in vegas and you know they had the uh uh the casinos so uh you got to give him the credit for that even though i think he wouldn't have wanted it that way but yeah but for me personally i believe our a private life's a happy life but do you think films like the godfather goodfellas glorified that life and people then thought it was cool and wanted to be that instead of not realizing the destruction that actually causes to everyone because i always say this but everything has a ripple effect you've been in prison not just effects possibly your father your kids their friends everything just ripples through life but how much do you think that plays a massive effect on the mafia then being glorified the movies do that the media does that i mean look godfather everybody looked up to people uh in that life because of the godfather the way michael corleone veto corleone the way they handled themselves the way they carried themselves so people had a very high opinion of the mob because of that movie the godfather no doubt godfather one and two movies like goodfellas and donnie brasco they present a little bit different side but you know what it is when people see money and power uh it's intoxicating and they want to be like that person i'll give you an example i speak to a lot of young kids gang bankers i did here one we were here a couple of days ago and they'll tell me michael you know you had everything you had the money you had the power they told me about the movie goodfellas they drove all the nice cars they had everybody respected them you know i said okay but did you watch the end of the movie who got killed who went to jail whose life was destroyed they don't see that they don't pay attention to that they only see the first part of the movie i always say this james the mob life the gang life their evil lifestyles i don't glorify them they're evil why do i say that i don't call the guys evil i was one of them you know some of them were good guys trust me they had good hearts you know maybe misguided like i was but they were good guys but the life is evil because i don't know any family of any member of that life that hasn't been destroyed and any lifestyle that does that to a family is is an evil life the kids don't get it you know people don't get it they don't see that side of it yeah they're only looking for the glory and if you come from a broken home if you've been abused when you're a kid or if you've not got a mum and dad to have that kind of structure in your life then you'll search for being in a gang because it feels like a family environment yes because every man i've interviewed people always ask me the question do you ever get scared interviewing the people you're interviewing i say no reason being is because what i see is vulnerability any man who holds a gun or an eye for me is fragile because they're so broken they hold a gun in our knife to try and protect himself for not being hurt anymore and that's what i see i see goodness and everyone will i try even though i know there's some bad [ __ ] on this planet we get that but where does that stem from where is it started from like everybody you do have choices in life but the brain is such a powerful tool where you can condition it to be whoever you want to be i believe you can change the way you think and feel and live for so many people in prison who went in bad and came out good are doing so much good there's so many people who we're good but some circumstance in our life maybe losing a kid or losing a loved one can trigger them to them become alcoholics or junkies or whatever we just don't know and life waters around the corner but for me personally that everybody can make change and that's a beautiful thing for it and that's do you ever feel blessed michael that how far you've actually come do i ever feel blessed oh let me tell you something james i never never um take anything for granted with my life i'm the most blessed guy on the planet because i should either be dead or in prison for the rest of my life like all of my former associates dead or in prison that's it and i'm totally blessed every day i realize that to me it's a gift and i'm here i'm alive and i'm free so i don't ever take that for granted there's no question about it to me god has has done amazing with my life and i'm 70 years i'm going to be 71 in two weeks so i got it i'm i'm on bonus time let me tell you you look great though and your dad looked great as well what is that have you any special remedies well you know my dad's uh obviously the dna is good he lived to and he looked like he was maybe 80 when he when he passed uh you know i'll tell you what the secret is for everybody that's listening here's the secret don't smoke don't drink to excess don't take drugs and don't get overweight you get overweight and you buy your you know back and forth you're trying to lose weight gain weight obesity is terrible so don't get overweight and just uh get some sleep you know and try to do the right thing and you'll last that's how i look at it now you know it's worked for me let's put it that way how did you sleep in that life did you sleep much or were you always on edge i wasn't on edge but i i never required a lot of sleep i was a guy my routine was i get a brightener only 5 30 6 o'clock in the morning i have my breakfast guys pick me up i go out and do my thing for the day i come home for dinner spend time with my family and then 10 11 o'clock i'm out again until 2 2 3 in the morning that's that was our lifestyle back then so i never required a lot of sleep for some reason was there a lot why was drugs so much the mafia doesn't ever want to deal with i even know the money that was could be made from it you know in our family and during my time in that life drugs were outlawed i was told the night i got made they said mike you deal with drugs you die that's it no drugs i hated anything to do with drugs because i had it in my family my sister died of an overdose my brother was a drug addict 25 years what he put us through i can't even begin to tell you so i hated anything to do with drugs and my father hated drugs he always told me don't ever get involved in drugs hated it some guys were doing it but i always tell people this and i get people say oh michael you don't it's not true we were not the major drug dealers we're not you know we weren't the mexicans or the colombians or guys that were dealing drugs now the sicilians the mafia in italy yes they were big heroin dealers not us some guys were doing it but not us why i think people felt number one it was it would bring too much heat from law enforcement i think when you seen that scene in the godfather where he said you know they don't care if we gamble or this and that but drugs that's a different thing and quite honestly a lot of us had a conscience we don't want to put we don't want to put needles in young people's arms and we talked about that we're not looking to destroy young kids and who's taking this garbage young kids and the teenagers you know they're the ones you go after so we we weren't we just didn't want to do it how hard does it make her to see loved ones struggling with drug addiction james it's it's how hard is it for me to see somebody i hate it i mean my sister you know i would say this i did more damage to people in that life because of my sister's drug addiction because i would go i couldn't find her i'd go to queens and she'd be in some cd bar with these guys that were all drug addicts it drove me crazy so we did a lot of damage you know to try to protect her and my brother the same thing it's uh it's a horrible thing drugs are a horrible horrible thing it's a terrible addiction yeah i've lost many family members and friends to drugs drink gambling addiction suicide sometimes but the the drinking a drug is for me it's always an escape michael because of what other people's battling internally and it's sad because we see the person the drug addict homeless and me and people judge but they don't know the backstory of that there's so many veterans on the street and fought for their country and nobody fights for them here and i do so much homeless work back in glasgow and for me to try to just give that i was always in life searching for something i've i've been a drug addict i've been a gambling addict and i've been many things in life i've changed at all i'm four years clean not i'm living a life i'm i'm becoming successful and i'm i'm staying on the path but as i struggle every day so now i i used to chase the materials the material stuff back in the day to try and fulfill a void even though i never found that sense of completion but now for me the gift in life is given as soon as you help someone truly help someone from a clean soul there's no better feeling than that 100 i totally agree with you you know when they say there's there's more joy out of giving than receiving i have found that that's what motivates me you know i'll go speak to young kids or i'll speak in a crowd they want to hear the mob stuff you know because there's interest in that but they're more interested in the transformation because everybody's struggling with something in their life and when they see that you can get out of a bad situation it's really inspiring to people and it feels good that you're able to share that with somebody and it has a positive impact on them that's what keeps me going and motivates me no doubt but you know i i agree with you look i can when people go through a bad situation and they're not mentally strong and that's not a knock on them you know it's tough life they'll take drugs to forget what they're going through they'll drink to forget what they're going through they'll do something to distract them from the pain i get it i really do i understand and that's why you don't condemn them all you understand it but uh you know look i i'm gonna tell you this one of the greatest tragedies in america in my opinion is not taking care of our veterans these people went to war they fought for their country for our freedom and they come home and and and they can't get the good medical help that they need they got ptsd they can't get good medical help they can't get good services they should be our number one priority in my view number one priority and we don't take care of them the right way yeah you know and it's a shame because we could they're a wealthy nation they could but uh look you know it's a horrible thing yeah i don't have all the answers i don't you know in in life but uh i wish there was some way i will tell you this you know for people that are listening the biggest problem that we have in america and i think it's probably across the world is the breakup of the family that's it you know the breakup of the family these kids growing up in fatherless homes with young moms that are 15 16 17 years old they can't even take care of themselves these kids what what are they what chance do they have think about it they're thrown into a world where they don't have good guidance good good counseling they got more distractions on their fingertips with these cell phones than we ever had as kids growing up the breakup of the family is the cause of the major cause of all the destruction that we see going on with these generations that's it and uh nobody can tell me different i believe that because it's it's a fact no doubt we're living in our society you know where people are consumed by what they have in their hand and looking at mobile phones watching tv they're forgetting to live and that should be how nature connecting with people like to say we're all human beings we'll breathe the same way we'll also be under the same roof like i believe the world is divided reasonably it's easier to control divide and conquer yes for me but we're all human if you actually speak to an individual and i should just spend five ten minutes with them i don't have almost documentary but i've slept on the street for seven days which we give people understanding what it was actually like and the one thing there's so much food there's so much help i was getting clothing and i was getting so much but the one thing that was missing for me was connection because thousands of people used to just walk past but as soon as someone gave me five minutes of that time then it made you feel good as if someone cared yeah and that was the main ingredient for me showing that he care reaching out to someone are you okay showing me because everybody i get everyone's caught on their own bill shouting later everybody's got their own struggles money struggles mental struggles i get that but when you actually just speak about it then the kind that kills whatever you're suppressing and that's the hard thing like for me life can be it's a beautiful mess but it's all down to you how you want to live it and that's what what i'm trying to get out i believe i'm still young i'm still learning i can still create change but first of all i had to change me and not feel anybody because i didn't want to because i've been there when i felt no one cared so i had to no one was coming to save me i had to save myself i had to rewire the brain and understand why you understand the main thing for me was taking responsibility and that was a [ __ ] michael amazon bastard then you actually take responsibility and that's when you can create change and that's the beautiful thing about it i'm not going to ask silly questions because i know people say did you kill anyone missing that but did you ever see anyone get killed unfortunately i did james yeah i mean that life is it could be very treacherous and you know i saw people die for the wrong reasons that uh you know it just uh it weighs on your mind i mean it weighs heavy you know i'm going to be honest with you you know sometimes it's when i'm sleeping i'll be in a battle with somebody i don't realize it but my wife will tell me hey you know she'll have to wake me up at times i think that's when it comes out in me when you know that the demons come out so to speak because you know it's hard to erase things from your mind it really is and you know in my 20 years in a life i've seen a lot of stuff that was just not good you know not good how do you deal with that night you know i i have uh my wife says i have a gift that i know how to compartmentalize things i think it's it's just survival you know how do you exist in the world if you're always letting bad things pull you back and pull you back and pull you back and a lot has to do with my faith you know a lot of people say michael are you out there doing the things that you do now helping kids and you know trying to be a positive impact on people to make up for what you did in your formal life and i said no i can't make up for that what i did i did what i saw i saw what's done is done i could only do better at this point and as a christian a believer you know we believe that if we sincerely confess our sins and we're sincere about it and we accept you know jesus our savior that our sins are forgiven and now we move forward and that's how i deal with it my faith has if i didn't believe that i don't know how i would deal with it quite honestly you believe in karma you know i don't i don't i don't know if i believe in the word karma but i believe you reap what you saw and that's what the bible tells us you reap what you sow if you're doing bad or you're like to people it's going to come back and get you so for me it's biblical it's what god tells us if you want to continue on that path don't expect good things to happen to you in return so i guess in a way you can call it karma is that why you try and do good now you know what james how do i say this without sounding wrong you know look when i was in that life i didn't get in that life to hurt people but when that situation arose and i was ordered to do something that i didn't want to do but i had to do if i was going to stay in that life and stay alive i would kind of step out of myself this isn't me and i'd handle my business and i'd come back to who i am meaning that i never had a heart that wanted to hurt people that wasn't who i it's not who i am today so you know i think that's a blessing that i realized that i i did things when i didn't because i was responsible to do it but i didn't want to do it i didn't want to do it i didn't feel good about it did you ever think about going back and finishing med school no no why you know james listen i i don't want to take the credit even for going to medical school my mother or my father wanted me to be a doctor more than i wanted to be a doctor i was doing it for them i'd do anything to please my dad and he really wanted it my mom too and so okay yeah i'd be a doctor i mean i had an interest in it i wanted to be a pediatrician because i i enjoyed working with kids even back then you know when my dad went to prison i had younger brothers and sisters i i became their father i took care of them you know they i was like more of a father than that my dad was because he was away so i always had a heart for kids and i said i'll be a pediatrician but was my heart really in it was this a passion because if it was i would have been a doctor today but it was it was more important for me to help my dad so um you know no i could not go back to school i don't have the patience for it i never did and what was it like trying to get out of that life very hard and so very hard because i became much very much a product of that life and that oath meant a lot to me so when i was breaking when i was walking away it was gut-wrenching because i said i'm breaking my oath i'm disappointing my father i'm letting people down it was so hard i felt like i was a betrayer so but i fell in love with this young woman who's now my wife of 37 years and the other challenge was she's a young girl i'm mentally in love with her how can i marry her and then probably go away or get killed i'm going to destroy her life so which what am i going to do i have to make a choice is it her or is it this life because i can't i can't do this to her i can't marry her and make her a part of this whole thing that i'm involved in so i would go to sleep at night i'm getting out of life i wake up i'm back in the life it was and even when i walked away for years i felt horrible i felt horrible about it but then you know for me my faith went out my family went out and now i i came to i've come to terms with it do you then treat young not just yourself but your wife and danger when you come out no because one code that we had that was very strict is that we would never hurt anybody's family and i believed that and people said well michael this guy hurt this family listen there's exceptions to every rule but that guy's dead now you don't do those things so i never worried about my hey look if i would have endangered my wife and kids i i this would have been a whole different situation for me but i never worried about that and they never had a problem the police ever come forward knowing that you are trying to get out to then become a informant oh yeah they they wrote me very hard they told me you know they came to prison they said mike you're a dead man anyway we got word from our informants it's all over the street they're going to kill you cooperate with us we'll protect you your family and i didn't want to do that i wasn't looking to hurt anybody i wasn't mad at anybody i just wanted out of life they put a lot of pressure on me they did the wrong thing and look i talked to the government but i talked to them realizing that what i'm telling them is not going to put anybody in prison because for me the bottom line is i don't want to send anybody to jail i can't do that but yeah i want to talk to you i'll tell you about my life because i want you to understand i'm out i'm really out to get them to leave me alone because what people don't understand it was a major target i mean seven indictments i was under scrutiny from the minute i was walked in into that light because of my father we had the name so they never left me alone i had to get them to understand i'm really out well their thought was the only way you get out is you cooperate with us and we'll protect you and so i said no i can't do that i don't want to put people in prison my father went to jail for a crime he didn't commit i'm not going to do that to people but they didn't uh they didn't take no for an answer that's why they kept me on lockdown for almost three years they were trying to break me do you think that saved john lethal you know no doubt saved my life not only because of that james and in 91 when i got violated and they put me back in i had done five years they put me back in just before that our family was going to war we're going to war this big war within the colombo family and they were trying to pull me back they said michael we need you i had a big crew and everything else and i had already walked away but they were pulling on me to come back in and i was so torn i said how could i how could i betray my guys we're going to war just when i was making a decision i get violated they throw me back in jail i'm in the hole for three years the war lasted for three years 13 guys got killed 63 guys went to jail for a long time and about i think 20 18 or 20 guys became influenced and hurt everybody else so i i got saved by going back to jail i didn't know it at the time but yes yeah everything's about training do you believe that yeah yeah was that part of you for you were going to go back to try and help the family because you had so much power i i just felt like i was abandoning my family and my father put some pressure on me back i never even told my wife this mike stopped his nonsense we need you now the family's going to war because my here's what my father's thinking was if one of the bosses got killed it would have been a a chance for us to take over or get in power because my father's thought was he was always telling me you're going to be the boss one day i'm on parole when i get out of jail i can never really do anything but you'll be the boss and i'll be it really it'll be us in power there's two of us that's what he wanted so when when this war came up this was like an opening for that but i uh and and i had a tremendous pull market back then tremendous how hard was on your dad for you trying to get out of that life it was tough on him it was uh he he didn't want it he didn't understand it it hurt him no doubt but i told him i said look i'm not going to hurt anybody don't worry about that that's not what i'm out i just went out of life and you know when we had private discussions afterwards he understood because if my dad would have he would have never talked to me again and we got close again you know after this was all this nonsense was over before he died but uh initially it hurt him what was the one one reason how why did you maintain why did you still be able to stay alive what was the main ingredient well number one my faith because i believe god had a different purpose for me it's obvious but you know one of the horrors of that life james you make a mistake your best friend walks you into a room you don't walk out again and unfortunately i witnessed that throughout my life in that life so and i had that experience one night when they were trying to scare me you know they walked me into that room i thought maybe i was gonna get killed and when i left the life i said okay they're never gonna walk me in a room again they're gonna have to come and get me i moved out to california away from new york i could have never lasted in new york impossible too many guys i changed my whole pattern in life i was very disciplined i didn't walk my dog at the same time every morning because i knew if they were watching me i knew what they were going to do i didn't go to the same restaurant every tuesday night so if they're watching me they know okay he's here when he comes out we can get them you know i know how they plan things so i was able to counteract everything that they wanted to do i was very disciplined about it very disciplined didn't make any mistakes and so i outlasted all of them they're all dead or in prison every single guy iran went dead or in prison and then when they realized i wasn't hurting anybody the heat came off a little bit you know it came off and i had to be honest with you too james they knew i told him i said look just leave me alone you know if i wanted to cooperate with the government i could destroy a lot of guys i don't want to do that so just leave me alone i'm not going to bother you i'm not going to be in your face leave me alone and i think they got the message there was a next list of 50 of the most powerful men and the mafia and frank was the most powerful the most richest but i think 48 of the 50 were dead but you were in that 50 bucks what was that last week it was the 50 most wealthy and powerful mob bosses in america and they had me on that list i was the youngest guy on the list i was number 18 out of the 50 in terms of wealth and power and it was a huge article in fortune magazine they featured six of us i was one of the six and i always say the list is silly who knows how to make a list like that you know to go but it sold a lot of magazines but here's the the real thing out of that uh that was written in 86. all these years later 48 of these guys are dead there's one that's still alive but he's doing prison time he said he's older than me and then there's me i'm the only one alive and free so you know that's an accomplishment you know yeah listen let me tell you this james i don't sell my former associates short they're very capable guys things just broke right for me along the way there's no question like i said god had a different plan for me but it's not my ingenuity it's not my brightness none of that because they could have got me if they wanted to believe me if they really put the effort into it they would have and you know once or twice i had some situations where i had to move for a while because i knew there was guys out there that were looking out at me but uh it just broke right for me really how hard is it for your wife when you're going through exchanges people trying to kill you police are trying to get you what for them how much pressure actually was put on your way the woman that you love you're going to change your life you want to rush your life try and make it work with the woman you love but how much pressure gets put on your way for you think she's actually going to leave me here and then she leaves you and what have you changed for absolutely i mean look when you really boil this down it's the wives and children that suffer you know a lot of guys when i was in prison i would tell them you know you're so selfish your wife is waiting online two hours for you and you're in here doing the prison time and they're going crazy out there because after the guys are broke the wife's got to get a job they got to take care of the kids it's horrible on the family you want to know the truth my wife is a story i'm not the story here what that girl went through eight years in prison contract on my life trying to get to rebuild my life once i got out i was like a fish out of water in la i was wasn't accustomed to that lifestyle out there she went through hell you know and she stuck with me so really this is all about her me i whatever i got i deserved at that point you know i'm lucky i'm even here but she made a decision to stay with me and as a result she went through hell to do it what did you mean i met her on a movie set i was producing a movie in south florida and she was one of the dancers in the movie i saw her come out of the pool and i that was it lightning struck me i was done forever and now 37 years later that's it yeah and i feel the same way about her right now so what do you think of that that's unbelievable but again well did she know your life at this time she did not she was uh july well i didn't lie i just didn't tell her something i just didn't say anything she uh she was 20 years old yeah she was from anaheim california she knew anything about them nothing at all she thought it was a producer on this set yeah she started to realize something was different there but by that time she was in love with me it was too late so what do you think now michael looking back in your life i i you know i feel very blessed i mean uh you know look the the life that i was about during my time it's not the same anymore you know the government really in the united states they took a big toll on the mob life they took a lot of power away it's different it's a different world now um you know but listen people say do you have any regrets if you had to do it all over again would you do it under the same circumstances to help my dad i would have done it again but being smarter now you know i would absolutely not have done that you know it's not a life you should be involved in but you know i just again james i i consider myself to be very fortunate very blessed uh very thankful that i'm here able to speak to you and uh have my lovely wife here i mean it's uh what's better than that right loving the dream brother yeah what was that what was john gotti like may come you know john was uh he was like you see him he was a charismatic guy no doubt he lived his life this was what it was all about for him he was going to be a mob guy till he died um socially he was a lot of fun you meet him for a drink you have uh nice business-wise he was a nightmare he was a narcissistic guy and he never wanted to lose anything so you had you had your hands full if you ever had to sit down and have a deal with him but um i liked them you know i like them uh honestly but uh again a lot of people say it was very tough to deal with and that's true what about donny brasco the film very a great film probably one of al pacino's best films i believe but how true has that film it was pretty accurate i mean there were some things they took dramatic liberty with uh i admit donnie brasco joe perstone on the street once with the guy he was with they came and visited me at my car lot that i had i had a new car dealership uh i didn't do business with him thank god uh but he became a friend of mine now joe piston you know he and i have friends we've spoken at that we're gonna meet actually at the end of the month uh good guy and i i'll say this about piston to be under cover for six years like that and not get made not get known or anything you got to give the guy a lot of credit a lot of credit there's no question about it now people get mad at me for saying that because so many guys went to prison but that was his job that was a job but the movie itself was pretty accurate i mean i knew all of those guys you know lefty was a friend of mine um and it was pretty accurate yeah same as like samurai bill that he he met 19 models is that correct he admitted to 19 murders involvement in 19 murders yes what's your honest opinion on him i like sammy you know i didn't know him well on the street i met him once he denies it but uh it doesn't matter but um we have a different mentality he and i you know different mentality different thought process about the life now that we're both out of it but i i got to like him you know we did some things together we actually did a a production together and i'll probably do something with him again my life is family he's got a wonderful you know daughter and son and uh so i mean i like him just before we finish i know he says that he didn't like the police at the start but what's your opinion on them now i have many friends in law enforcement now many friends you know i learned you know it's amazing for me how god can not only transform a heart but how he transformed my mind when i finally realized they're the good guys we were the bad guys at least most of the time look and i have many friends in law enforcement and not because i share information we're just friends you know and uh and i believe that look in america they have this whole progressive movement to defund the police those people are out of their minds you've got to have police on the street maintaining order you got to defunding the police is the most ridiculous thing i ever heard you know so uh i'm for law enforcement in that regard i got a wife i got children you know when they walk down the street who's gonna protect them i want the police there to do the right thing so um i have a different opinion now and before your dad passed god rusty so how was the relationship then it was good yeah we we uh we kind of buried the axe on a lot of things we straightened out a lot of things we still had you know my my being upset with my dad was his not taking responsibility for what happened to the family but other than that i understood him i loved him he loved me and that's how it ended up and last question brother you can throw everything in your life like what well not even a question but for anybody that's watching michael that's maybe struggling in life what advice would you have for them you gotta play it straight in life uh you got to do the right thing you got to obey the law even though we don't like the laws sometimes it's not for us to decide um here's my advice in this world we are who we hang out with we have to surround ourselves with the right people people that care about us and want to see us do the right thing and people that are doing the right thing we have to be accountable to the right things and people in life you know when i was on the street i was accountable to my oath to my boss to the street life as a result i got in a lot of trouble i did the wrong thing now i'm accountable to god i'm accountable to my wife my children the people that believe and trust in me it motivates me to do the right thing because james look you can take the boy out of brooklyn you can't always take brooklyn out of the boy you know i still have urges to do things i still can look if i can go back into the gas business and steal the money i do it again i would have no moral problem with it but i'm not going to do it because i don't want to get in trouble i don't want to hurt my family i don't want to disappoint god so but i need those people in my life i need that that accountability in my life to keep me straight so this is what i tell people do the right thing surround yourself with the right people and be accountable to the right people and ideals in your life and you'll be okay last question brother i know hindsight's a wonderful thing but if you could change anything from the past would you you know there's things that i would change and you know personally in my life mistakes that i made that i wish i never did stupid mistakes selfish mistakes i wish i could change them that they never happened because they impacted people that i care about and i love um but would i not go into that life again i would to help my father so i i don't look at that as changing that but just my own personal mistakes that i made that i wish never happened because they hurt people and people that i love so that i would change we've got the big tour coming up michael what do people expect to see on this tour well i can tell you this you know i had a pretty good stature in that life i met up with everybody from gotti to castellano to fat tony to chin all names people would be familiar with and i'm going to tell about my relationship with them they're going to understand really you don't have any mafia here in the united kingdom they're going to get a good uh understanding of my former life no doubt about it i'm not going to hold back we're going to do a q a they can ask me anything that they want about any subject and i want people to understand that and enjoy it but i also want to understand that you can transform your life you can make a difference in life i was able to get out of a very bad situation and i understand people that walk in the door they're going to be struggling with some things i hope i'm an example to them is how when you're determined and you surround yourself with the right people how you can make changes in your life that are positive and we're going to be taking this message we got to we've got a lot of good hosts that are going to be with me uh we're going to be taking this message we'll be dinner shows we're going to do giveaways we're going to sign books we're going to we're going to interact with people we're going to have meet and greets it's going to be a lot of fun yeah the tickets are already selling fast so we will leave a link in the description for people to get the tickets for this tour it's going to be a mega tour and your story is unbelievable from where you've came from to what you're doing now it's a bit of a love story as well which everybody loves but you should be proud for what you've done and what you're achieving brother would you like to finish on up on anything else michael no i want to tell the ladies too this isn't only for guys my wife is going to be there we're going to talk about her story and listen ladies don't ever underestimate the impact you can have on some knucklehead guy on the street trust me because you know they wrote an article about my wife in vanity fair magazine and they put under her picture they put the woman that changed the face of organized crime in america because they said you know i was going to be the boss i met her and life changed in that way so i think the ladies are going to enjoy this also so we look forward to seeing everybody and uh i just want to thank uh everybody here in london the united kingdom all my hosts for being so gracious to us and we look forward to coming back in a couple of weeks and shout out to cars for setting up that center view and putting on such a great tour yes would you like to finish up on anything brother no just that thank you james you know it's a pleasure being here with you and uh hopefully you're gonna come to one of the shows yeah i'm hosting one oh terrific yeah that's even better you know you know what this was a trial run yeah can we sit down i want to teach you a little brooklyn before yeah yeah yeah hosting two of the shows sorry guys are saying yeah terrific so no doubt but i'll be a pleasure that's an absolutely fantastic god bless you and keep fighting a good fight thank you thank you

Channel: Anything Goes With James English

Views: 275,854

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Id: 0FmXISvClLM

Length: 72min 30sec (4350 seconds)

Published: Thu Jun 09 2022