Teresa Beem: A Seventy-day Adventist Who Became Catholic - The Journey Home (10-20-2008)

[Music] [Music] good evening and welcome to the journey home program my name is Marcus Grodi your host for this program and each week I have this privilege of introducing to you men and women who because of their love for Christ were committed to following what was true and in the process they were drawn home to the Catholic Church in a way that they didn't suspect and I think that's very much true for this evening's guest and vak she comes from a non Catholic background that is to a certain extent rare for our guests Theresa beam is a former seventh-day adventists and so she'll be here to tell her story in just a moment and if you've got a question for us I want you to make sure you send me an e-mail at Marcus at deep in Scripture still Marcus at journey home calm even scriptures on Wednesday night I'll tell you about that in a moment but Theresa welcome to the journey home program thank you very much it's great to have you here thank you I mentioned to the audience we don't have seven former seventh-day adventists on the program all that often and I think it's important as we talk about that even as I'm we posed it to the audience hear about their experience of seventh-day adventists a lot of people mix that group up with other groups that actually originated at the same time but have a completely different idea of theology so as we do every weekend the program I invite the guests to start way back at the beginning and give us a little snippet of your spiritual journey well first off I was raised by the most unbelievably wonderful Christian parents I I really believe that if everybody had been raised by my parents there wouldn't everyone would be a Christian they were seventh-day Adventists though and they in their home we were we have six kids in our home and we were loved and adored and because my parents were a multi-generational some of the Adventists they it had become liberal over the the years and so we ended that true I was wondering if that's true for seven day Adventists as well oh I mean most denominations that's what happens right yeah I mean aren't my great-grandparents at least we know that far back for seventh-day Adventists and so they kind of got liberal through the years and so we were protected in our home from the more maybe the more dark a doctrines of seventh-day Adventism but on the other hand we were sent to Adventist churches and we grew up very very very active in our church and my husband and I were just raised in the the schools a lot of people don't realize they have schools you know 7th Avenue schools and so we went from first grade all the way through the university level but graduated and you you relatives were pastors right on both sides oh absolutely very very deeply entrenched in the seventh-day Adventist Church and that but as much as my parents were kind of kept us away we did learn some of the darker doctrines and the reason I I know that is when I was a little girl and I know that I was around four to five that I had a dream where I had my mother's hand and we were in a long line of seventh-day Adventists and we were all being beheaded for keeping the Sabbath by Catholics that is part of their doctrine and so I know that that influenced me from a very early age what a pause for a second I realized the beginning the program we have a problem of the prompter and I didn't get the phone number zone make sure I get them out for everybody if you'd like to call for Theresa again she's an ex seventh-day adventists I'm sure you got some questions 1-800 two two one nine four six Oh outside North America 205 two seven one twenty nine eighty and I think even gave the wrong email address journey home at ewtn.com the dark legend is that what is called the dark well no I was just just the kind of the darker doctrines okay men stand in it the sphere of Catholicism oh absolutely so it isn't so much pointing out the Pope as the Antichrist and all those other things but really feeling that Catholics were out to get you absolutely if they have a prophetess named Ellen White and Ellen White had a vision supposedly had a vision that was three hours she lived she was early 19th century okay and she had been a part of the millerite movement a lot of people may not know that but anyway it's in my book but but she was they had kind of spun off the seventh-day Adventist Church spun off the middle of the millerite movement and she had this dream or it was with vision that in the end times that there's going to be a demarcation between true Christians and false Christians and that the the demarcation is sabbatarian ism in other words if you are going to church on Sunday they believe that in the end times which tune advence is always imminent because that's part of what they there is always an imminent about to come the Lord's about to come and so they taught that when in these end times the Sabbath is going to be the issue and if you're if you're going to church on Sunday and you don't repent of that and become a sabbatarian you're gonna end up having the mark of the beast and then the Catholics are going to spearhead a worldwide ecumenical group that's going to come after seventh-day Adventists and they're going to torture them hunt them down torture them and even kill them and that's why we were taught from just a child up we were some day going to have to be martyred for being 17 so you were you had an entirely different slant on the second coming of Christ absolutely whereas most Christians look forward to this time that sounds like seven demons really don't look forward to the imminent coming because of the what they'll be facing at least in that very before right glory it's great tribulation what's upcoming but it's all based on the seventh day it has the key doctrine so two Seventh day Adventists that's one of the 10 commandments so do they hold to the other 10 do they hold to the other laws of Moses well seventh-day Adventist do believe that we're supposed to keep it we're supposed to keep the Levitical laws of unclean unclean and clean meats so some of the adventist do not as a doctrine they do not eat shellfish or pork but since they have to star also known for their health message which is you shouldn't even eat meat and so most of the Adventists do not eat meat all right but there's a whole bunch of other rules in Leviticus and Deuteronomy and I'm guessing that what they've done is picked and choose deer rights they emphasize seventh-day they emphasize tithing and they emphasize these eating rules but all the other things about the priesthood right they don't I and I know it's been you see that when you were there was problem oh yeah well I mean it all comes down to Ellen White their prophetess because they they are they claim to be very very biblical based which they I mean they study their Bible I mean I've met lots of Baptists that believe they're gonna just really pin the Advent is down in a debate but 70 on just know their Bible the difference is they see it through the lens of Ellen White and they it's just something you're indoctrinated to do and so until you can and I really believe the Lord takes that away from you just it's a grace that he gives to certain people so you know that that they can actually see the Bible for what it actually says and as we discussed before the program I mean we both know some very sincere deeply committed same day Adventist Christians we really do write genuine for lovely lovely people I mean my whole family is you know almost 90 percent of my friends are 70 admins and I love him to death I remember working with a gentleman who was 70 address when I worked in Dow in Midland he was a technician that worked with me and every day he would share with me his morning Bible study and it was long and long and all the verses he went through very sincere deeply committed students of Scripture but as you said very much seeing the the scriptures of course not through Catholic tradition but with a different tradition the tradition that did it begin with Ellen white or began with the Miller rights and then kind of augmented by Ellen G white right well the Millerites believed as the Lord was gonna come October 22 1844 they had a hundred almost anywhere between fifty two hundred thousand people on the East Coast that gave up jobs gave up farms gave up homes to support Miller and and all has an evangelist to spread this word and then when he didn't come they had what was called a great disappointment I mean and it it is really really a very sad as part of check yeah of history that we don't we don't know as Americans but anyway a group of those Millerites just could not give up the fact something happened they believed on October 22 there was a man named Hiram at Hiram Edson that code had a vision that said that the Lord didn't come to earth that day but what he did do is he went from the holy place to the most holy place and that he started the actual judgment of God's people at that time in 1844 and so Ellen White then had all these visions to support this idea and so every single thing is seen through the eyes of Ellen White and so with the Miller 817 know okay so really that was Ellen's that's right White's slant on on that now am I correct in saying that on the one hand that there are actually seventh-day Adventists that recognize that many of the things that L&G white says in her books are contradictory are not a scriptural variety of issues or prophecies have come true but that seventh-day adventists really can't talk about that well I think that they don't believe that I think that they really believe that they're going to come true I think that they would completely reject the idea that that everything she didn't she said wasn't true and they don't see the contradictions are there some that have seen and gotten in trouble for it perhaps yeah me well we'll get to you but I think I mean in a sense of you know 78 just studied the scripture studied history studies and recognized there's problems here well okay assume the Anna's have their own education system and they put out they have all these publishing houses and they put out their own their own books and so in every single time they read anything about Christian history it is slanted to indoctrinate children into what they believe and it is very very difficult especially when you're ruled by fear because when you're told that everyone out there is going to be deceived by the Antichrist you alone you better clean with all your heart to these these principles and these things you've been taught or you're going to be deceived and so that's is that true of the I don't want to name their universities but as a treat even if you go to the one there are any universities yes they're all it is taught worldwide it's one of their fundamental doctrines I mean you know a lot of people think oh well you just were raised in one little area that taught that now these are fundamental doctrines for all seventh-day adventists and you know like we were talking about earlier a lot of Adventist our cultural Adventists they were brought up in the church they feel safe and comfortable as Adventist they really haven't been they haven't been really out in the world to have any of what they believe challenged and so I you know they just accept it that's true and so for most of your young life you just accepted what came down the pike for you and you're part of the family and no I was one of the ones that you were the one I was a rebel that's right guys you know something's wrong with you why can't you just accept this and and I just I don't know what it was I actually loved being a seventh-day adventists I I totally bought into most of their doctrines except for I saw a lot of hypocrisy because seventh-day adventists are not allowed to wear jewelry but the thinking wear Rolex watches they can they can wear beautiful pens I saw some hypocrisy through the years and that kind of opened it up for me after my husband and I got married we immediately started having a family and I got involved with a pro-life movement and I was told I was a rebel because the seventh-day Adventist Church is at its core pro-choice but they will say enter strict guidelines and so that kind of started the crack in my foundation that's surprising I don't I don't think your average person would think of the same as that's pro-choice most of them are pro-life most individuals yeah that's right and and but they have their doctrine is kind of sitting on the fence so you can actually see anything that you want out of if you're pro-choice you can grab the doctor and go I'll see they're pro-choice same with pro-life but what is interesting is that the seventh-day Adventist hospitals do not have to abide by seventh-day adventists guidelines on abortion and some some seventh-day Adventist hospitals do abortions even abortions on partial birth abortions and that was very disturbing to me and so I knew okay there's something wrong with the church that would say everything is based on the commandment of remember the Sabbath day and then they they don't you know that as long as you get it right on Saturday then everything else is all right that's not that's that's a cure good right and again most sevens are pro-life they don't they're not even aware that that the church does abortions so they're conservative on Sabbath they're conservative on dancing and Samaritans drink yeah oh yeah I see laws but but something like abortion issues oh absolutely and that's one of the things that I thought was very very hypocritical my parents were considered very liberal because we got to sneak dr. pepper as kids because you shouldn't you couldn't even drink caffeine that was a no-no I mean you know kid when I you go to kofte academy a lot of kids go up to Adventist academies and you'd sneak off campus and get a dr. pepper and that was really really bad so would you say then that seventh-day Adventist theology was a works/righteousness theology they believe absolutely that the Lord did everything for you but if you love the Lord then you will do as The Avenues tell you to do in order to okay you are saved by God you have to continue to be to continue to be saved you keep the Sabbath I mean you're rejecting you something basic to the Lord in their eyes if you don't keep the Sabbath if you don't keep the service you can lose your salvation from 70s there would be a lot of people to say yes I think my generation and younger would say no but why wouldn't you keep the Sabbath the Lord tells you to in the Ten Commandments why would you love the Lord and disobey Him would be their their argument so the rebel that you be and you you know you your eyes are raised on the pro-life issue what happened then I mean was that was that the this got you go when we left the Adventist Church we we had the world open to us we just wait a second wait a second you I mean there was a lot between oh well we just basically just we just looked at the scripture the Lord came in and just opened her eyes it's all I can say because I I really honestly loved being a seven Davis there was I was very involved in the church I I wrote for the church I was very active in in Sabbath school that's their Sunday school I was in choir I was so active and I actually loved it it's just there were some things that bothered me on the side and I thought that if I was you know I would reform the church yeah your goal was not to leave the church no absolutely bring it back in one and then at one point my husband and I just looked at each other and we said this is just so wrong this is just so wrong we have to leave and so just in faith but it really broke my heart I knew that it was appetizing my family and my and my brothers and sisters and because you were vocal about some of these things you were discovering and well I wanted them to know why we were leaving that it wasn't because avid us believe you can you don't leave the church for doctrine reasons that you leave it because you've been hurt somebody hurts you and they they cannot put their arms around or their brain around fact someone would leave them leave on doctrines and so that's you know we sat them down and explained or at least we wrote to them and explained why and then once we left we had a world open to us because we didn't know and we just want to embrace all our brothers and sisters in Christ and so my husband is a travel nurse so whenever we moved to one little section because but we move about every six months to a year and I would stake out all the different churches and we really honestly go to like four different churches a week even then we get a Methodist Church and a Lutheran Church and so that was that was really really wonderful I'm curious were you discovering their theology or just getting the ambiance of the worship well I wanted the ambiance of the worship but I didn't realize the minute they start talking it brought questions because one one would say one pastor who could read the Greek and Hebrew in the original language and love the Lord and where spirit-filled would tell us this isn't essential this is I mean you know you cannot be baptized as a baby then another one would say oh you must speak in tongues and so we would be getting these confused messages and so I will I'll never forget you know there's just so many different things going on they had we had parallel thing is happening but one thing that just really pushed us over to to thinking more seriously about Catholicism was that we had a pastor that I went to is a wonderful Baptist pastor with his in Div a Christian apologist he's really really a wonderful man and I trusted him and I said okay tell me I read the Bible slightly different than what you're saying and I read the Bible slightly different from the Methodist pastor that I go to how do I know how if I am within the boundaries of good reason and he looked at me and he said well you must stay in the boundaries of Christian tradition and immediately okay I didn't I didn't have the follow-up question but I thought it which Christian tradition you have the Lutheran's you have the Calvinists you have you know I mean really I mean it just my mind had never gone there before in a serious manner and at the same time one of the really really neat things was that we as soon as we left Adventism we got online and we we entered a catholic protestant yahoo group that was a discussion group and it turned into a debate but anyway and one thing we noticed is that the catholics used the scripture in the debates and we were going this can't be true we've been told that they through the description that long ago but they were using scripture they were using christian history which no one had ever used that before and they were using logic and when i say the catholics I mean this upset me greatly but the Catholics were hitting him over the fence and I mean not I mean they were just a little they were they were just phenomenally put well put together arguments and my husband and I would download those that just argue and cry and say and we finally to the point where we believed that these guys on there such as david brock and and chad Makin's were making it up we just thought they are really not representing true catholicism and so that stirred us into picking up the Catechism and starting to read it and it started snow what would a seventh-day adventists have thought if they found somebody in the church was reading the Catholic Church catechism in general oh they would just be horrified they were just that you need to be deceived you know that they would be praying for you I mean that's what you were all brought up no okay so you got the Catechism your hand are you still feeling that though I was terrified my husband was so much more yeah this is you know he was very very cool about it but I was terrified I I was much more in love with the Seventh Avenue Church than my husband anyway and so um so I was really scared but as I progressed I realized you know these are beautiful beautiful gem like I feel like I found the pearl of great price these are wonderful doctrines and you have to step out in faith sometimes I can't remember one of the early church fathers said that you in order to you you must believe in order to understand and that just fits it perfectly I had to just go okay these this is just making too much sense but I can't believe him in my heart I can't go there emotionally and the Lord eventually you know took us in that direction and and ironic that you use the room pearl of great price I think that's the name of one Alan G White's books if I'm work I think so I can't remember I might be wrong and then I might be one of the Mormon books I could I grew up kind of give some both but it's interesting that there are all these other groups out there think they have found that one great pearl and as you said the one place you didn't expect to look or wanna look in fact were afraid to look I was the one that you found was really hitting it over over the fence and in a very honest way and open way which is why all the guests here on the show that's why we're we're here well it's also unique to your husband and you were at the same stages at this it's not always the case right I mean you're both being open that's a great blessing yeah so many of my friends who are going out of some of the Adventists that the church itself into just mainstream Protestantism they are their spouses staying in the administration and that is very very difficult and so we were very truly blessed so you're reading the Catechism you're getting really inspired by it I mean at what point do you decide you really get that needle is gonna really move in that direction or was that really add the Ken well we just didn't believe what the people on the line were telling us and so we finally decided to go to Catholic Church and find out we were good we were gonna say okay you guys are you guys just don't know what your church believes so we they don't have Sunday school but there was no so our CIA and that we joined in absolutely having no concept of ever becoming Catholic we just wanted to see if if these people weren't saying what the truth was about what Catholics believed and so we we I just remember going into father earnest and this is just how Protestants really have no concept of what Catholics believe because I the first thing I did is I was shaking and I went to father Ernest and I said if I become Catholic can I still have a relationship with the Lord he just looked at me and left and so you know bless you guys hearts those people that work in our CIA are so patient with people who have such misunderstandings because I drove them all crazy with with all my questions and they were just so phenomenally patient and they explained it and yes the Catholic Church did believe what they had said online and then we started reading the early fathers and I know you've heard this probably what three or four thousand times okay once you've read the early Christian fathers they are Catholic and their beliefs and there were seven day Adventists they weren't seven oh and of course the Ellen White even says that they were deceived that even one generation you know the people that the that the the Apostles laid their hands on and said I'm leaving you are the person that's going to go on with this truth somehow in that one generation they got it all messed up so and that's just phenomenal my my husband and I came up with a an acronym it's it's the the French word for mail a beautiful mail is our bow and we decided to you know if the Catholics were right about these three things it does not matter if they're wrong about every single thing now we have come to believe that they're not but my husband had we had some problems with Marian doctrines you know just a lot that everybody else does and but we got this core down bow the Bible we did a study of the the history of the Christian the Bible had developed and we thought I was just truly devastated when I found out this precious Bible was disassembled by the performers who were the ones that were saying Sola scriptura they rejected the Church authority and they said the Bible is our only Authority and then they decide well I'm going to take this out and I mean can we do this today Ellen could Ellen White to it then you know the minute you in fact I remember reading you and maybe it's in your book where there is a particular curriculum used in the seventh-day adventists that's kind of a condensation of the Bible that it includes in it lng rights writings and not even distinguishing whether it's the court from scripture from L&G why they call the bible and they say it's a paraphrase but they call it the clear word but they treat it much like a Bible you know a lot of times when someone comes into the church it's given as a present to them so so there you are you're you're looking at well you said bow they were the four things right well at the Bible and these are a little out of sync because most important to me was well it's my husband was the Eucharist when we both understood the Eucharist my husband said he wants everyone to know because he couldn't be here that he cannot even speak about the Eucharist without tearing up he that is such a phenomena belief it opens up a world of understanding God and how he looks at us in the Eucharist I it's just the porthole to understanding so many wonderful things about Catholicism and then there's authority and the minute you know the my friends online said go through the Bible start I mean starting in math you go through and look for the authority and it's there and you know you're never taught to look at it you know as a Protestant you never you just never see it that way but if you actually go through and you start searching for for Peter he's there and then unity and the the fact that Jesus the last thing he said to his disciples I think it's in John 6 or something like that John where he's giving his guess M&E all speech well in John 17 is a big prayer right and and he said just stay together stay unified and the one thing that we noticed about all the presidents is they say there they say that they're unified in spirit but the minute something comes up that they don't like they break apart and so other divisions and seventh-day Adventism or is it one unified group well they break off until a lot of splinters maybe they've had several to have the reforms of the adventist and they have the seventh-day Adventist Branch Davidians and all right we're going to take a break in a bit but before we go there I just want to let the audience know that you and your husband Arthur in fact wrote a book it's okay not to be at seventh-day Adventists that's like a funny question you know for most of the audience it's okay not to be a seventh-day adventists the untold history doctrine that attempts to repair the temple veil so this book is available at amazon.com right if you want to find out more your husband wrote this long before you thought about the Catholic Church we were Protestants when we were at that disclaimer but there's nothing in there that you said particularly that would be a problem I don't think so I don't think so and you're hoping to do a Catholic version eventually yes absolutely but I do think that the Catholics and Protestants have a different verbage and so sometimes there's misunderstandings and but I don't think that the heart of it in any way would go against Catholicism all right Thank You tree so let's take a break we'll come back just a moment keep your questions [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] welcome back to the journey home our guest tonight is Teresa Beamer husband Arthur was supposed to join us but he wasn't able to be here because he was called away because of his traveling nurse so but before we get back into the discussion I want to remind you that this Wednesday evening on EWTN radio I'll be hosting deep in Scripture that's 9:00 Eastern Time my guest this week will be Patrick Madrid each week I asked my guest to suggest a favorite verse from st. Paul I haven't quite gotten it from Pat yet but we'll find out Wednesday night so please join us and we'd love to have your phone calls and emails that would help enliven our discussion and that's on EWTN radio again this Wednesday night at 9:00 p.m. Eastern Standard Time Teresa before we get into we've got a number of emails and phone calls but the title of your book again is it's okay not to be a seventh-day adventists and I think most Catholics would agree with that so why should a Catholic read this book well the seventh-day Adventist Church is huge people do not realize this but they're sent there 20 million plus and they are doubling their membership every decade around every decade and the biggest pool that they pull from in membership is the Catholic and the Baptist's so I think that anytime that you encounter some badness you need to be aware of what they believe especially because they are afraid of you you know when when they look at you they look at somebody right now they look at somebody that's very deceived and they must get you into the the seventh ominous Church so if a Catholic starts saying something that makes sense to them do they immediately believe they're being deceived oh absolutely oh yeah they're they're programmed to believe that you have been deceived and they must get you into the seventh-day Adventist Church because if they don't then you're going to be one of those people that are going to turn around and hurt them later and so this book not only tells the history of the seventh-day Adventist Church and the doctrines and it's it's very well sourced but in the end of it explains how do you reach a seventh-day adventists what what do you do how do you say how do you act because the interesting thing is about Adventists they're not like a lot of anti-catholic haters they're scared of them they're a lot more scared of a Catholic than the Catholic would be of them so you know I would love to see some Catholics adopt some of the evidence at least in their prayer life to help them because think of the fear I mean I grew up with such fear and most admins do of Catholics and I just think that's it's it's very sad the certain extent are they from your experience you said their education system so and closes them to isolate themselves from other thinking I'll even more so than some of the others sex like Mormonism or Java witness I mean I don't know you know but they're pretty close they have a lot of little towns that they kind of just stay in their little towns like Loma Linda California and Keene Texas and Hagerstown Maryland all right yeah the centers in Michigan I know once I was familiar with when I used to work in Michigan all right we have an email comes from Barbara and Oklahoma and she writes dear Marcus and guests are seventh-day Adventists Trinitarians if so how can the Trinity be accepted and Sunday observance not since both our teachings perfected by the Catholic Church and not clearly laid out in the Bible God bless you do Thank You Barbara female seventh-day Adventists are Trinitarians now there was a debate when they first started whether and there were some early seventh-day Adventist that we're not Trinitarians and even to this day they believe that Michael the arch ain't the Arch Angel is actually Jesus however they are solidly Trinitarians I don't know how you mesh the two but if I remember right that's very close to Mormon standing and and Jehovah's Witness yeah yeah I could get a mixed up myself all these programs run together after 11 years but so I mean I'm trying to wonder you probably never were taught this but their justification as that emailer is asking since it isn't clearly biblical I mean what tradition are the basic other than the words of L&G white yeah that's that's all they're doing that's basically basically what she's her visions I mean you know she claimed that she had an accompanying angel that would come down and explain to her texts from the Bible that everybody else was you know debating about and she's you know she had the clear authority of God to interpret these hard texts and so it's just accepted without inmost eyes with just out any debate all right I've got a caller from this is Robert in Arkansas hello Robert what's your question for us yes good evening Marcus good evening Theresa and welcome home worship on Saturday and it's so why thanks for me seventh-day Adventist observe the rest Sabbath rest of the Jews from Friday night Friday night sundown til Saturday night sundown and so that is they take that from the Ten Commandments which says you know remember the Sabbath day that to keep it holy 7 you know 7 days shall you labor and do all your work but the seventh is the Sabbath and so that's where they get it from and they just clearly don't progress into it the New Covenant all right but as you mentioned before that really emphasized this I mean does Ellen White L&G white claim to have had you know a clear prophetic message from God that this was the key absolutely she had a vision and where where she saw in the last days in heaven the great books opened and and there in the heavens and everyone will be able to see this is the two stone tablets and circling in the circling the seventh-day Sabbath with a halo so that everybody understands that is the because everyone I mean most Protestants and Catholics keep all the others it's just that is the one that they have quote to an Adventist have rejected the posting thing from for me you know I don't know if it's true for the audience is that when we know in history these different groups that arose to follow a charismatic figure I know Joseph Smith and and the Mormons and then the founder of the Jehovah Witnesses and in these these different groups even even you know John Wesley and some of these great charismatic leaders that led groups to break away from one church to form their own I mean what was there about Ellen G white I mean did they all follow her at the beginning is everything she said they just took without a question well the times were that women were seen as somehow more godly been men and even the youth were seen as more pure and so Ellen White embodied both she was she started having visions at 18 and being both a woman and a youth they just saw her as somehow embodying what what the times were telling them and really America was quite a charismatic time that was it charismatic time for all the area and a lot of people were binding themselves around these type of visionaries all right well it's all covered in your book right yeah right yes absolutely good so if you're interested in more about the details you can pick up Theresa and Arthur's book take this next email Farrah from Charlotte North Carolina she writes I have many family members who are seventh-day Adventists but no matter how I explain it using Scripture they don't seem to want to understand why we Catholics celebrate mass what is the best way that you suggest for explaining the mass and why we must celebrate it thank you Farrah for that question you know I am just not sure you can I mean the truth is I think seventh-day adventists need to feel they need to feel safe outside of their ideas and the best way to reach a seventh-day Adventist is to love them is to not debate doctrine with them until they they feel really really safe that you aren't gonna be one of the ones that's gonna turn around and hand them down so I my suggestion would be just to pray for them you know that is there's going to have to be the Lord is going to have to open up their eyes and I think that that loving them and praying for them is the best way you can do and just be as benign as you can because I think the more you argue with them the more they're going to be entrenched in what they believe all right a call from Michael from Louisiana hello what's your question for us tonight Michael when was the time that you felt that you know you wanted to become a Catholic and be baptized and out of that field it was when I was in our CI a and my husband and I were at the point in our CI a you had to make a decision and I mean it was logically completely laid out for us we knew we were going to be because we had to because this was the truth but it was hard for me emotionally because I because of my background and I looked at ours and I said well we need to make a decision you know it's coming up to these you know the different things that they have progression points they have and we looked at each other and we said this is truth I had loved the Lord my whole life and so to me it wasn't a matter of giving my heart to the Lord or having this born-again experience it was that I loved the Lord so much that I could not accept things about him that were untrue and we were so eager to find out what what does God really really like and the more we studied about the Catholic Church the more like I was telling you earlier I we felt like we were at the end of national treasure when they the movie rights and and that they lit this lamp that was just opened up this treasure so everybody could see through this this fire and we realized we had struck gold with this incredible and I you know I feel like I could just be such a wonderful spokesman for Catholicism because I I mean we weren't raced around it and to discover truth after being in a lie your whole life is just phenomenal it just it just changes your entire life thank you I think I've had many Catholics who have written about the journey home program and they hear testimonies like you're in yours and they are very grateful because your own enthusiasm for discovering this great gold pearl of great price helps them appreciate sometimes this great faith it we can take for granted after a while we give become so accustomed to it I'm almost anesthetized yeah and we need to be awakened to the beauty of this faith that we have so that we don't misrepresent it to our neighbors right and that's what's got us in lots of trouble in the past anyway we don't represent as well as we should we have an email from Joan and Brazil Joan great lawyers from yes she writes dude hello Marcus and guests could the guests comment on the current state of the seventh-day Adventist community in the USA my impression is that young members are not as attached to Ellen White's teachings are the members going else or is the community growing Thank You Joan for your and so where she comes from there's a large contingent of seventh-day Adventists said the Adventist ISM is exploding in South American Catholic areas unfortunately and right now the seventh-day Adventist Church in North America is holding its own but to her question about that's Ellen White there are a lot of people my age who do not completely agree with everything she says at least they say that now the minute you attack her is saying you know what she said was wrong a lot of them will quickly return to their roots and their traditional beliefs but they will say that they just see her as inspired writings rather than authoritative writings but then you ask them can you be saved if you go to church on Sunday in the last days can a person really love the Lord and be a NBS Sunday quote what they call Sunday worshiper and they will very quickly go back to the way they were raised fact something I'd like to offer for the prayers of the audience I actually had a former guest on the program I won't mention the name of the guest for his privacy but you know was a seventh-day Adventist and went through all the hoops that you're talking about and realizing that seventh-day adventists was not right and he came to the Catholic Church became very involved in church eventually went back right and I think part of it was that he was discouraged by what he found in the church he was expecting to find what he saw on paper and he didn't quite find all of that was very discouraged about it but but I'm still puzzled by given he saw all the flaws what is it that draws a person back after they've seen all that and I'm wondering it's because on one hand it's so ingrained down deep there's always a little voice but also there is the fellowship there's right the family there's the connections that are still mourning for you my guess isn't your own sense a lot of your old family and friends very are not happy with the decision you made yeah that's right and and some of the avenues are very conspiratorial they are always think a conspiracy beneath everything that happens in government and because Ellen White had you know projected all this was going to happen it's very very easy for seventh-day Adventist to say well she's right look at the state of things today you have to admit Ellen's prophecies were correct because she said things were going to we were gonna have a great ecumenical movement and the Pope is going to say such as such such and such and indeed I mean you know these things happen but I don't think that she you can say that she made this great prophecy I think that these were self-fulfilling actually anyway all right let's take our next caller Pat in Nebraska hello what's your question for us yes hi hi Marcus hi Theresa Theresa my question is concerning the Eucharist do you and your husband see the Eucharist when you read about Jesus on the road to Emmaus with the two disciples when he expounds on the scripture and yet there still don't recognize them and yet when he blesses the bread and breaks it and hands it to him then their eyes are open thank you Thank You Pat we could not that was one of the texts that my husband and I found on our own you know so many of it the text our friends had you know our our online friends had told us well look at this look at this I remember when we saw that text we were looking we looked each other and we thought oh my word could this be the Eucharist and so yeah that was when we discovered it was phenomenal it was really phenomenal thank you I think we have another email or our producers getting ready there okay there we go comes from Deborah Charlotte Theresa and Arthur I am a former Adventist currently experiencing a conversion to the Catholic Church let us say Deborah that you're in our prayers we're asking everyone to hold you up in prayer can you discuss how you made the switch from the Sabbath to Sunday thank you God bless Deborah well at first you know when we left Adventism it was very very hard we got really lonely because we didn't we were we weren't going to church with the Adventists but we were still keeping the Sabbath but when I started doing history which is laid out in this book I spend several chapters explaining how the the Sabbath turned into Sunday I mean and it was not the Catholic Church that did it I mean others are told that Constantine was the one that unilaterally said no we're going to change the the Sabbath from sad to Sunday and if you read Christian history that's just simply not true the early apostles kept the day of the Lord Sunday as a day of resurrection a day of commemorating the resurrection and if you if you look for it you can find it in Scripture and so that would be my suggestion as is looking for inscription you'll find it let me clarify something you just said they just you said it wasn't the Catholic Church that did this well it wasn't as as the Seventh day Adventists or even a non Catholic might say the Catholic Church which was quote created after Constantine that imposed all this other church traces its roots all the way back to the beginning and this was the process from the very beginning we see the roots in Scripture but that one email earlier was exactly right I mean that the church has this authority to follow the spirit that Christ gave to the church talked about it in John 14 15 and 16 that the church would be guided into truth yes it would discern these things so the issue of the Trinity which isn't specifically spelled out was something that the church guided by the spirit affirmed and recognize anything with the divinity of Christ and a number of other issues including the issue of the Sabbath and this is a part of the authority of the church and it's funny that groups like this will criticize that audacity of that and not look at the own list of things that L&G White has laid out that they've got to obey that aren't clearly in Scripture but she said them right right and that's true with many many other groups because that was part of your own journey of discovering that for yourselves which is pretty amazing what I think about well I think so too we're very happy about it this we do have another email Jean in Alabama writes Teresa what is the seventh-day Adventist view of the sacraments they have the traditional two sacraments they've all Protestants they have baptism and the Lord's Supper now they celebrate the Lord's Supper always with the foot washing that's the only difference that they are that they have than other Protestants is that they always have the foot washing service first and then you have the grape juice the little wafer that wouldn't be wine of course no absolutely they believe wine is they will fight to the death saying Jesus did not drink alcoholic wine that he drank o grape juice so their Greek scholars still argue that I mean oh yes they sure do and then I assumed that that they would see the Lord's Supper as completely just symbolic symbolic yeah and do they believe in baptism regeneration no I think they they it's symbolic right again points to your faith is just a visible sign of your faith but the other sacraments what about marriage do they see it as a sacrament no they would they're they see Mary as as idolatry Oh Mary Jimmy I'm sorry Oh marriage I'm sorry oh no that's not a sacrament well you did bring Mary we never mentioned that you know what about Mary for you and your husband and your journey into the church that has been my husband's I for some reason didn't have a more different I didn't have a difficult time with that my husband really really did but the more we researched it and the more we read that Mary is is nothing is nothing more I mean everything she's but but she is a symbol of the church itself and once he understood that and once what he went back and saw Eve the mother of all living and then Mary the mother of the church it just starts to make sense and so he's but it is we're baby we're baby communities that's right and so some of these things are still we're learning it takes a while to get the language down pat when you've gone through seventh-day adventists and then check out every four churches a week for how long right yeah and the Catechism is pretty large but very good okay within your book it's okay not to be a seventh-day adventists that the audience if they're interested can find on amazon.com really could got about a minute left let's say we got a seventh-day Adventist watching tonight would you like to say a word to them why they ought to consider making the same journey that you and your husband made well seventh-day Adventist say their biblical and they say that nothing is more important than truth and so much of what you have been taught as the Seventh day Adventist is not the truth and I not that you were lied to because I I believe that generation after generation just tells the same information not realizing that it's not true I would suggest you go back and read the early fathers Ignatius Clement Irenaeus Polycarp and find out what the earliest Christians believed and I think that it that would be my open their heart and just as you said you know we're not asking to anything more than love Jesus Christ and seek after his truth in his fullness that's what we want a full intimate relationship with Christ Teresa thank you very much you say hello to Arthur oh sorry you couldn't join us and thank you for your book and thank you for your witness and thank you for joining us my guess is as Theresa said this is a growing growing growing group of Christians I mean doubling every decade you said that we need to be praying for them that they would discern the fullness and come fully home to Jesus Christ and His Church god bless you [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music]

Channel: EWTN

Views: 224,065

Keywords: Catholic, EWTN, Christian, television

Id: rscyUXjWsss

Length: 56min 23sec (3383 seconds)

Published: Sun Jan 18 2015