London Gangster's Brutal Prison Fight Stories - Kevin Lane Part 2 - True Crime Podcast 583

about 11 or halfast 11 that night I had to fight of him about 2:00 in the afternoon around that time so by the time I've gone to the Box my eyes as it's swollen shut it's like a split tomato now you can see all the Flesh of the Tomato you can see all the Flesh of my eye and I was sitting there and pit was her name was a nurse she came came in and she standing behind all this French this Roman uh Legion of formation of three two and one and she goes Kevin it's pit here she goes give him something to cover himself up with there we go and she goes I said all right pip she's going to get out of the way she comes right Kevin right thank you pip and they wouldn't turn the light on in the strip cell although there was a perspect glass roof to it where psychologist could walk around there and write reports on you like an animal in a cage so she's sewing me up under a torch because they didn't want to turn the light to give me an advantage or some type of Advantage but um you can see a bit more in the you know uh not Advantage don't what the correct word is but nonetheless they wouldn't turn on CU it would help me and they sold me up under torch and she stuck the needle in with no anesthetic nothing and I remember nearly passing out thinking my God this is hurting me you're going into raw flesh sewing it up eight or nine hours later sewed it up I'm sweating nearly passed out she got said sorry Kevin I've got to do it again it's not straight and she weren't doing it to punish me because pit was a sweet little lady and she did it again and it reminded me of the film like rainbow except I did nearly myself it was so painful and uh that was in the in the strip cell so violence of two different sorts so and me up without an anesthetic that weren't Pip's decision we should have had to inject me in there and they already had an needle in there which I didn't want in the first place cuz that's dangerous so now you saw him up without a needle without having another needle in his face that he could grab and uh it would w a little curly one like [Music] that all right I'm here with Kevin Lane part two you saw us through his life story and he is a master Storyteller it was a really gripping account decades in the UK prison system we've also seen him recently on banged up on Channel 4 he was an absolute start he was in the trailer getting the phone out of his Kea and um we've got an event coming up Cambridge Country Club Feb 23d Kevin and his mates going to be taking to the stage link is in the description box please come along there going to be loads of us to it's going to be an amazing night so today we're going to follow up with this part two and the structure is Kevin's going to go over his prison years again but he's going to tell us about the most insane Stories the beefs the fights some of the UK's most dangerous prisoners so sit tight for the next couple of hours and huge thank you for coming back on Kevin thank you because it's not normally something I do is it this is a first for me in that I'm just talking about prison violence I've spoke about prison violence that have been parted to impr prison myself or things that have happened but never just selectively that topic and it's a large topic out there people are just so amazed by what goes on in there so um I'm not glorifying it but it's a topic where people have an interest so of course I'm going to discuss it probably on this only occasion and we do this to scar The Living Daylights out of young people in the hope they won't get involved in drugs and crime and end up in prison absolutely absolutely because when it happens in the prison even if you've not been parted to that but you're aware of it it turned my gut a lot of times and uh you wouldn't want to be party to it I can assure you or live in that in that in that house where it's taking place and it's a large house with a lot of people let's just set the table then for some people who've not seen part one perhaps I'll just go over a little bit of your story so how old were you when you first went into the prison system 22 and that was a 2-year stretch we kidnapping and then your next long stretch what year was that when you went in 1995 and you served how long I served in total for that nearly 24 years but I served 20 years in one go on that one and then I was released and recalled twice so on that first one then going in as a young person what did that feel like were you intimidated or did you know people was it natural to you I went in we got I got arrested for a kidnapping which I've spoken about at then uh and and the Met gentleman nearly died he could have died um but so I went into prison for committing an atrocious act on somebody um but I was not a I went in with my best friend Marcus L he's done Boral he's seen some stuff in there and tough toughness in Bal aren't they so he was aware of what to expect and he says to me you can't behave out here like you're behaving there Kevin I went you about I can behave how I'm going to behave outside or inside um and which I did all the way through my sentences right way through for the murder which may be what set me aside uh in the eyes of this the screws and a lot of the cons as well so I did see a lot of violence and I was party to it as well all right so you know he's saying you got to behave in a certain way take us through that first day a smile because I believe in your School M so I'm thinking the old school ways is you leave everything for the pur people behind or you're going whatever you got you leave I've gone in with this kidnapping it said uh uh security boss Kevin Lane I had a security company I had 120 BLS working for me nightclubs and pubs I've gone into the Nick as a security boss at a young age and the big edlines are there so when I've gone into the Nick they got two holding tanks and I've got it a holding tank I'm sitting with my best mate Miss GE is coming he starts skinning up I didn't puff but my mate did and other people did and I asked him I said a all mate I said you going home I said ain't you meant to leave that for the people behind he went yeah but I ain't I'm taking home with me he got up and he walked out of the holding tank and he went into the next tank right I looked at my best mate and he's looking at me he's going Kevin no like that any I'm out of the traps I've gone straight into the next [ __ ] cell excuse my friend so I've gone into the next cell and uh I said if you don't hand that puff over I said I'm going to that many times you think you're surrounded now and it over overcome the puff give it to him he's left the prison and as he's leaving the prison we're in a holding tank on the on the BL ground floor and he's sh out and I'll see you again I'm going to do you and all the rest of it I think about 17 day no it's a very short period of time after that he came back into the prison and within minutes of him com back on the landing he was in elf care with 17 stitches in his head with a table leg put straight over his head and he was straight into uh Healthcare it's quite a big Stitch over your head that is um and then he went on the numbers private protection so all right so you're you're on your first day you told the story what happened from there but what happened to you personally where did you go next after the holding cells went straight onto the landings I was locked up with my best mate never done bird before um went into the cell started teaching me back gam and press UPS he was cheating all the time I worked out after a while I was on the deck all the time and I said but you said I couldn't do that last time so but in the meantime I'm doing press ups and such um and it was an old Victorian prison reading back in the days very tough Nick for for yps um and the violence I see there was why violence to begin with volatile there was on the ones uh they' be sweeping the floor next thing you know the barell would go off one of them's got a bucket around the head major gashes to his face you get it with a galvanized still bucket they're heavy they let alone with water in that is some punching power it caves their faces in sometimes split to beastes nose broken knocked all their teeth out broken their jaw all mop levels the degree in in in violence can change by hitting them with a mop or a mop bucket but the kids ain't thinking about that at the time they're just thinking you've walked over my floor wall up off goes the bell and then of course it starts going up the ladder a little bit more doesn't it but at the time it was things like that I remember I was um I came out of I was on the bus I'd been remanded that's right so was going back into the prison and I had a suit on uh like I got now I've always worn suits since I was young my best mate Marcus had bow a suit off me to go C and I'm sitting there cuff to this other this uh copper right and only a bat but I still cuff to him in the back of the in back of the the uh bus a screw actually like copper and he's gone your old Bill mate Ina when I old Bill mate you got it completely wrong yeah your [ __ ] old bill your old bill is gone right sorry you know I apologize for swear I'll get it in in control now but he's gone you're you're fing o bill and I said I ain't no bill mate and I said when we get back to the Nick I said we'll sort it out won't we and you'll see I in old bill so he got taken one way I've got taken another didn't get to see him obviously the screws got on it but I did get to see him when I came out of the upstairs toilet and it was slop out then where you got to go toilet in a bucket and put it down the solution there so in the morning the next morning I've come out the the threes Landing I was up on the threes which is you used to have to get invited up onto the threes uh and you had to pick of who could come up there and if you didn't belong up there what you doing up there so I went straighten up on the freeze anyway with my best mate and then as I'm coming out I've seen this Geyer Tyson oh my God you couldn't make up so I've had a rail there we go with two Tyson I've only just realized that there we go and one of them was called Tyson in red in prison big stocky fell he was hence I called him Tyson and I said you the one I thought I was old bill D right because I I said was going to punch his heading when I see him it went off there and then and I've hit him a few times and we were on the third Landing that's what just made me think about that I've gone to put him over the over the onto the net he still about to full two Landings onto the bottom net it have hurt him I thought broke a few bones I had him right up over the bleeding uh banister he was just going mate and I remember uh old screw pulled me off and another con otherwise he was a gonner well he's going to healthcare anyway and that was he he didn't come back I can assure you after that he had his life History flash through his his his uh face in in a few seconds second so that got that got stopped and then he didn't want no trouble after that but by that time I've come in reception I've sorted that problem out the Gaz has come back in he's got put in in healthcare this big heavy he's been waiting on The Landings and then I get I go down to it's all new to me the prison because I'm thinking oh Le just men carry on here like like they do on the streets there's there's this is where all happens you're not going to get nicked for it for fighting in prison we do get nicked for it don't you I mean that's a fact um I remember you didn't see much water and sugar at that time it happened but not a lot not as frequent as it does now but except with oil and some of the viewers are asking they might ask this in the comments what is this thing about water and sugar why I put water and sugar together it scars it sticks to your face Sugar's sticks scars with a burning hot water yeah it makes it go like um not like crackling but it burns like a it's like a Napal of sorts causes terrible dysfun dis scar into your face cuz some of our guests have described it looks like people's faces are melting off yeah it does yeah very much so it does with the Napalm but with that as well it just goes inflamable red uh and it's it burns cuz of the sugar uh I haven't seen that too much to be fair thank I I'll say thank God but yeah I haven't seen a lot of that so you've asserted yourself in the beginning are people thinking I'm not going to mess with him now or is it not like that was it Gladiator school it was still pretty much Gladiator School in that I've gone in I've weighed a couple of people in um straight away when they were big lumps uh you've got me on some stories here now so I my fault you got to behave as you you don't have it gares you don't have it wrong if there's a right stink about you then you give it to them or they shouldn't be on the landing so I've gone down to get Mount there was like 250 a week wages less than that and two names come over the the the board over the counter I'm with my best mate again Markus he's going L that shaking his head again I've took the two names and half ounce of backy because he smoked I've give it to him he's G give him you can't start working for the screws giving people good hidings I said but they're no good in they these [ __ ] oh God these fellas are no good aren't they and um he going to done what they done they be broke into the the child box where people was leaving a bomar's bar or something for the disabled kids and they broke in and started stealing it all so men that have got nothing left in their count on very minimal wage and giving something to the disabled kids for Christmas and stuff was broke into that went down very badly so this is at a time when prison violence was actually not only condoned but managed by the prison staff so I I didn't realize what I was doing at the time and I never did it again after that uh for the staff uh it was more like for the for the lads really so I came back from I went to the god Squad with my mate Marcus you get out of his cell of an evening for cup biscuits right on a Monday evening so he went to God Squad to get out and my best mate used to call the uh the vicard said all right you pie he's called him the pine liquor Vic priest he used to call him so we us to go down and see Vic priest have a cup of tea and when I come back you used to have this where caps in the old days right down across your broom like Army boys they were and you couldn't walk across the center and if you walked across the center not round it where it was marked you'd get bent up and screamed at and uh TI to the SE and nicked and probably a good hiding back in the days proper good hiding thrown downstairs and all sorts depending how how your luck went I've come back I got the finger like that so I go off with his screw he's taking me to a door he's open the door open the door that's one of the fellas I've gone in there battered him and he was screaming screaming in a sense where you wouldn't have thought there's anybody in that prison cuz you didn't hear one Bell anybody shout nothing it was like definely silenc in a church cuz it they knew what was going on on The Landings and they knew if you got CAU screaming and shouting by some of the screws there you'd get a bit of an night time from them I then came out of his cell went a bit further down I was Tien to the The Landings one's recess in there I've gone in there there's a G having uh Earth and Kip on the bleeding on the toilet but the door opened in so as I've gone to the door I've gone wh on his head pulled it back off pulled it off I left him in the toilet on the floor after having a good iding for stealing the kids sweets that are disabled um to my understanding of prison violence started very early in and the understanding of if you do things to women or children you got battered and the staff is up for letting you battering them that's why they had to hold in tanks where the screws would give you the nod once to say he's no good he's in for this or he's in for that and they'd get done in reception that all stops now he get segregated when you come into prison and pretty much nine out of 10 times in high security you're not putting a holding tank of others you're putting the Single Cell well I was I was putting a single cell and I was segregated even if there was people sitting in the in like a holding tank one tank that would have been so R in prison in 1992 for me he was in there burglars you murderer here and there old lifers that are murderers and they could tell you about some of the old stories but pretty much at that time it was 50 cuffs the odd slashing not a lot of slashing then though bit of water mainly grotesque violence with apparatus Sur them like I say a mop or or stuff like that um I remember when I was Jim orley I was given a job with FY Quinn FY was a boxer we boxed for the home counties together and I bumped into him in prison little fly white he was anyway but Andy little fell and there was two this is so ironic there was two Indians that came in I can't it's only just thorned on me I was party to these Two Fellas and I've never even told anybody this it's only just dawned me sitting here with you so these two cab drivers are of Indian descent and they're taking some school girls in their cab and they driven him to a park and they had raped raped him yeah and uh left him not in a very well State left him for dead they was in on the PA of protection wing and frany was in there and used to have to hand the slip P SS out them days you wor the prison stuff so we didn't talk to him F his handed them their stuff but he's he's having a laugh and a crack and taking a Mickey out of them to me and I'm laughing anyway next you he bang he's got a right smack in the back of his head by one of them unbelievable but what's going on here it taught me a lesson and I'll tell you why I come running out of out of the little uh gym room that we was in and it was like a sleeping Butler we put fruit stuff for a hatch so I've gone running in in the survery and I've it this I've gone to it this one of these fellas about 18 19 Stone there big lumps overweight and he's got a big uh water uh it's got like a you know if you do your showers a handle it's got like a rubber thing it was one of them and he's got it above his head and he's leaning back so I've gone back like that and as he's gone to me as have on further away I've stepped forward and hit him he's gone straight over on his back side no sooner than that one of the fellas out the shs come running for me so all pedophiles and sex offenders I realized very quickly stick together I oh my God I said I'm going to get knocked out and raped here and I remember itting him turning around I had another one coming at me I H him there was three people off the cuff bang bang bang and they all went over and then little FY came in and he got stuck in he ain't shy I got to tell you there was about 11 of them were some in there now and if FY hadn't been with me my name might have been Sheila right now I got to tell you I never forgot it but it taught me they all stick together it's like sh shank is it to you yeah yeah I was thinking I'm in a fine mess here I got to tell you Stanley I remember when Mr berit the screw he's going Kevin what's going on here when I come out of the the shells go and turn them shells on and he went and turned the shells on stay didn't and let us get stuck into him that's something else that happened when they after he punched Fannie so we got stuck into them gone on a visit sometime after screws know what's going on you had an inward to the visit and you had an outward door so I'm in one side I think I was going in coming out and tell I was coming out cuz he brought these two Indian fellas again back into the same area where I was to have it with them again so they got another good eyding a pair of them I was on my own I'll tell you that was a bit close so that kicked off again there and then uh the screws come running in and like those they went all punched up and all things like that I've gone into my visit after that round in going into the visit and and staff gone yet can have you visit split up and say they going have you visit now Kevin unbelievable so it's it's bit like Gladiators where it's controlled by the staff and they're letting you dish out the punishment and they party to it you have to be an animal not to want those predators to get some kind of convict Justice they have it coming far less in the prison system years ago than there is now Sean there's far more of them in the prison system now cuz they are protected um that shame it was the fellow up in [ __ ] that got done for killing the two young kids what was his name with him in his misses and she's out now what was his name um two young school girls who had the Manchester Tops on not bber not Bamba um B sorry it was um not anyway my mate got canteen banned for coating him off out the window down at Healthcare just giving it to him verbally can't B that's how they protect detected now disgraceful [Music] yeah so that type of violence in Reading in 1992 I was accustomed to was was there any situations in Reading whereby you thought they were going to get the better of you yeah great big Geer that big the duct to come into martiel what was the be over with him he carried a well let me tell you he had a mattress rolled up under his arm yeah one arm how big he was and that's all because I did Melle I've been banged up with my Cod first time in own time I've ever been locked up with someone and all my other time in my sentences have always oh my murder child banged up even in single sales on even a Decat but I just got me own sale that night he got a cleaner cell and he's putting this big fell in with me and I said he ain't coming in here I said I've just got a first sale put him in someone else or put him on a single Cale and he's gone to screws don't worry about him I'll deal with him and stepped in he went straight back out a great pace of kns he went flying I've come running out he's out there bleeding kicked off on the wing all the staff come running down and uh I didn't get nicked but he didn't come in with me and the next day he said he's apologized and can we just get on I said yeah course can I think he realized then that the game was up for him and it was as easy push over but people would look at me and think I was a college looking boy from the countryside did not see what would erupt for me like a Tasmanian devil type of situation where go [ __ ] where did all that come from at great speed and I was pretty pretty capable of looking after myself um from just a a light switch explosion I don't want to Big myself up but that's what it was like me as a young kid I didn't really realize it at the time and did you have a fitness routine in Reading prison to keep in Prime shape oh God so I got the gym order job in there and it used to go to the workers and I got the job with a worker never forget it if you was gimm orley and you had to use the the prison gym as well as an inmate you had to attend at least one circuit a week in that gym for you to attend the gym normally but as a uh a Jim orley you had to lead every circuit that came in that door for that day so your first circuit will be at 8:00 your next one will be at 9:15 10:15 11:15 back to the wings you've done three circuits in the morning 3 in the afternoon at least and that that's the same circuit so some another class come in you've done it with them you got to do it with the next person again it's the fittest i' one of the fittest I've ever been your stamina must have been up here through the roof but then that led on for me L later on in years in life when I went into prison for the murder or used to train to fight multiple persons namely the Muffy so that one Squad would come in to wear you down then the next Squad would come in or they'd have like a few of you teamed up 11 of you 10 man KNL and you'd be fighting with them and they'd be saying stop stop stop I've never heard that before we get to that stretch were there anyone who came at you with weapons in Reading no yeah a mop a mop and a squidy I've seen people do ninja moves with the mops and brooms and stuff in yeah when they're flying around their headed yeah yeah had above his head and he's aiming it at me I can assure I thought you a it me with that mate because the scenes are so CU people can't hang thems obviously so people can realize you can throw them above your head and not woring about eating a ceiling did um what about people that you were aware of where you were housed in reding did you hear of anything really horrific happening any of those people two slash there was a slashing when I was in there over what drugs it's always over drugs pretty much yeah a bad debt you ain't paid uh that was over he got his completely face slashed his face was flopping about like two bits of fish wet fish right through here he went right through a whole side of his face there and it was flapping and the blood was pouring spitting it was was it a double I can't remember if it was a double but I know it went right through and you get a double it's a terrible cut isn't it cuz they can't s that back together properly it leaves a big scar that was surrendered blood was blood everywhere cuz it takes a while before they get the hand over it and all the rest of it and put something on it whil there's a lot of screaming going on that's the only slashing I see in there at that time I see a few stabbings were the guards attacked in there or did they attack anyone normally attacking other people they had control of it then there was known for giving beatings up but KH still did attack them yeah um but very very rarely did the screw get attacked considering to what they get attacked now you attacked a screw back then and still so much now but not as much and depending on what prison you're in you either going to healthcare and you're standing there or you're going to get a right beating in the in the strip box or the box as they call it you're going to get such a beating in there and you're naked and they would come back and beat you again were you were you sent to the punishment earlier in Reading any any many times yeah I hit a g in there you hit a Giza yeah I hit a g in there what was that over it was meant to be a grass I just H him yeah and I got caught for punching him I got three days in the S which went bad really you know three days in there thought I do my time in here and I'll get out and I can hit him again if he's still on the landing so how old were you when you got out reding I got baale after the police were caught out lying and writing down the descriptions wrong from people saying it looks like him but it's not him they put it looks like him it's him so I got Bail after six months I spent a short period in there to begin with then I went back about 14 months later on a trial the reason why it took so long for different reasons but I went back again and then I got convicted and I went to bulington so on the same sentence uh 14 and a half months back in and I went in there what was your first day late well again um I went I went into a new prison this time 6 weeks old it was so they were still setting it up to have pretty much run out the Gaff to a degree because they're helping the screws run in the sense where they're looking for people to work in the prison only 6 weeks in there was looking for new new cons to do this or do that it's pretty easy well they had Peter fil was here on a spur on a house block and another spur here and another spur here and the abuse and the torrent that was going on back and forward so much because you would never normally have them house together in the same same house block look where they was getting abused out the window so much one bloke set fire to himself in his cell that when I was there and he was going up 10 to the Dozen him I could see his cell and that you know to see him and he SL he slashed his throat and all sad but sounds like he had it coming had it coming slashed his throat couldn't live with him and set fire to himself so they you know they had to move them off pretty much get that segregated cuz you couldn't have under the same house block but in the same breath that shows you how many of them was in there then to have one spur in a house block the one spur faulty or if they doubled up try you know might have been a lot more but however they didn't have a whole house blocks why not like two house blocks out of four in the prison terrible so our champion that CA to CNN people uh feared of coming into prison because the fear of coming into prison did I think had had an impact on people's thought pattern I think it frightened off some people that maybe would do it uh he's more so because they they didn't have that fear the fear of coming into prison the stories of getting slashed or or or sugar in your face or beating by the staff beaten by the cons you don't hear that much no more but it does happen but not like it used to it's all been industrialized all right so you're established now you're in the second place what was it called this other one Bullington bullingdon and are you just getting into a routine there like you did at the previous one reading got into a routine there and again only open 6 weeks but then about 6 weeks after me been in there my father died passed away so they made me a d category to go to the prison I owned my own house um I had a bus two businesses I had two children I wasn't a Flight Risk I had very little left on parole so I wasn't likely to run off when I got all of that so they de categorized me and I was on barel and all before so everything stacked up to tick giving me a de category to go to my father's funeral so I went to my father's funeral came back absolutely plastered that K me through the gate I went into the back into the landings um after a few hours of sleeping in in reception I hope you're enjoying the podcast I've got some exciting news to announce Michael Frances is coming back to tour the UK in 2024 the remade Manor the Michael Frances story Michael Frances once named one of the 50 most significant mob bosses in the USA by Fortune Magazine and a former member of the notorious Columbo crime family will take you deep into the world of organized crime sharing captivating tales and insights into the mafia's past present and future join us for an unforgettable evening with Michael Frances the original good fellow as he exclusively sits down with myself Sean Atwood with me as the host there's going to be a no hols bar exploration of Michael frances's life including his numerous arrests and jury trials that ultimately led to who is pleading guilty to a federal racketeering charge a 10-year prison sentence and $15 million in restitution you will have the unique opportunity to ask questions during an audience Q&A session making this event a mustsee for True Crime enthusiasts and anyone curious about the underworld don't miss this explosive in conversation with Michael Frances live on stage in the UK this exclusive inperson event will be held in various locations in the UK Island and Scotland Link in the description box below this video if you want to grab yourself a ticket back to the podcast cheers and they Decat me and because they Decat me to go to my dad's funeral I was in sent to a decory open prison and I landed there the first day I landed there now people are meant to be behaving in the dcat nick you meant to be not get C fighting and all the rest of it so I arrived in there on a Thursday and it was in the summer and I went out on the football pitch and this is true although uh I don't really have anything to do with this person anymore different reasons Brian Hur was there and uh I had to run him with a pal called Benji he was about six foot BL Benji's about 6667 big lad and all big bodybuilder now but Big L exer uh was chasing the ball I fell over chasing the ball and I me effing B I went he thought I was talking to him I was talking about my shoulder CU I tore all the ligaments in it when I fell over so we stood up we had a set two that didn't go very well um got split up I don't think Benji expected a little lad like me to be able to be quite capable um took him by surprise he ended up on his on his back I've ended up on top of him got split up I got sent to hospital cuz me like I said i' hurting it I went to the hospital I went to the the little Club at the hospital bought a load of bottles of pills went back to the uh the prison in the cab nip through security cuz it was just dead you had to go to the house to report but by then I was back so I've gone back to the the dorm and I remember the lad saying listen it's off he's been up looking for you he's obviously he's not going to let it go he's not an idiot and I went no problem so I got me arm uh in all strapped up like this and then got it out the strap and Benji's come up to have another go and he came in we had another go we ended up out the dorm on the penny outside um he then got to H tail it back to his room because it's quite a kafuffle when two BLS are going at it all right wakes up the whole dorm as well as in the house and there's the house was only outside of my window where the the screws are so he that my first night in the bleeding Nick I've gone back there and then the next day they said right listen call it a truce I no problem not a truce but listen he's got he just got to Decat he's long term you just got here and uh just leave it that I you right no problem right but you know so I just arrived in a Decat Nick and I thought my God uh is this how it's meant to go on and it did go on like that I mean I was handed a Knife by Brian L he said right it's going to go off I said I don't need that I'll use me hands give him the knife back and then had had to set two after but that was into a Decap prison so already it's violence right the way through even though you're going home and you're meant to be on on your best behavior it shows it's still there so you've touched on something that is a consequence for young people here as well it's like the effects on your family members like my mom had to come 5,000 miles she she came and visited me God bless her in America and just seeing her you know how a sunken face what I'd done to her you mentioned that your dad died while you were in prison I can't imagine how that must have felt I mean was it expected or was it I was told over the phone you just told over the phone was he was he a young man still at that 47 47 so then the worst of it was that he didn't had phones on The Landings like they do now and we used to have to make a phone call in in in the office attached to the the free Spurs you know in a t- shape you come out and there' be an office in the bottom so you'd go in there book a call so I got a phone call to the mother of my children at the time Kim pel and she she realized I hadn't been told and they had phoned the prison twice for me to speak to my dad before he died and they didn't Jack it up I didn't Jack it up get the call organized but when I founded up and it was something time a few days before my dad died that I got the call and then Kim said you don't know do you and I said no should we better sit down your dad passed away but he was at his deathbed so my boys my boys I want to speak to my boys my other brothers was there but I wasn't so I never got to speak to my dad before he died dad was quite hard I remember sitting in that cell staring at the window just looking no TV nothing like that just staring thinking about the years very hard in the aftermath of that Kevin how did that affect you psychologically well I cried uh 8 and a half months later and when I got home I got parole eight I did like 15 and a half months something like that I did out of 16 out the two should I say you only to do 16 unless you got to do added days but I did two weeks proo and I remember g i we just bought a new house so was living in the house and uh I just sitting down there and it all came over me and I just tears started rolling down my face I was upset of course when I was told in the prison but not visibly to people very difficult do you think you contain it that for that long because you were in shock for that long or because you couldn't show weakness in prison I think bit and bit both that you've been been molded in a manner where you've taken that many blows as a young kid terms of emotionally missing your father and things like that we not seeing him when your mom and dad split up to go into prison being taken away from you again would have been taken away from me as a child but to be taken away permanently was a bigger bang to me and it did really hurt and it just I think the impact of that just came out of me all those months later and for young people who get into crime and don't think about their family members what do you say to them in the context of what you went through with your dad try imagine sitting in a room with an empty chair opposite you and say right I just want to say a few things to my d dad anything and you watch what comes out and then swap seats I forget what a psychologist terminology for this is I've done it and then speak pretend you're your dad and there's a few things that you think your dad might have wanted to say to you very powerful because I tell you what you go to prison and your dad dies that's the only conversation you're going to have with your dad because the things you wanted to say to him you won't have got to say and there's no game back once they're dead so think about your actions and how long you're going to spend in prison because if you might be there for 30 or 40 years you won't be around when your dad dies or other members of your family or children well said and what was your family support like at that point in time you're getting visits yeah I was really lucky I mean no problem with the visit side I had two beautiful uh children yeah I had a baby and a little three-year-old Aaron and Tommy Kim visits family friends visit there was no problem there and then when I went to a Decat of course um that was even visits are easy there nice visits you could I went home I arrived there like I say on the Thursday on the Sunday I went straight across the field aranged someone to pick me up Shawn wheeler and he's dead now God Rest his soul and I went to Dave Wolf's christening and I went to a christening sneaked out sneaked back in without the prison I would gone so that shows also how dangerous it could be because I remember thinking if I wanted someone and they was in a dcat I'd go in and get them cuz I've come in and out of this place like no one can believe I've had my pals in the same Nick bringing them in 20 bottles of vodka a Time selling them for2 a bottle every 14 days I them Chinese every week coming in 60 quids worth of Chinese over the field and more vodka I was earning a fortune in there but I was sending vodka and Chinese bloody mental ten for the Chinese and then 20 pound of vodka but um I didn't need to of course however this violent side of things can also show you that people can come into prison and shoot you and stab you if they wish and get out of it which has happened since so what was your life like between the two sentences Go I mean going towards your big sentence quite problematic still I got released I was on bail had a few instances in pubs with people um again is it ca you had a baby face yeah baby face people thought that they could they look at you they don't know you they don't know what eruptions inside you like a massive volcano just start and think wow and I think blood they just don't expect it it catches them off off guard very quickly because it's is like a light switch explosion or it was back then uh and it was quite serious and extreme and fast so when that happen part from me either knocked out or they injured um after they think about it think wow where did that come from I saw it and I was on was um a skinny kid and big tough looking guys would pick on him and like lightning and it'd hit him so hard they poo themselves [ __ ] them or ended up with damage to their face caved in faces broken jaws straight over and all don't you haven't got to be big block to knock people over you got balance and speed and you can punch they're going yeah yeah even if you just hit him enough to knock him out and not forcefully bang him straight over which is what I had then cuz I've been working since a child I was in um a bakery when I was 13 carrying 25 kilos bags of flour and I was 13 unloading them from the trucks and then I went to a chip shop carrying the same pretty much in 50 or 100 bags of potatoes you're 13 so you get quite broad shoulders and you and you can with that comes I could bang so I could bang they went to sleep or they got injured so going in for the long stretch then I imagine your psychology must have been very different because now you know how much time you're going in for a really big one and that's really affecting your thought processes versus going in on the shorter ones it it do but I started to see the knife crime when I was in in the dcat when I got sentenced to that in that a couple of instances like I just said there was uh another one with a knife was involved fell pulled a knife on me in C in the canteen in the what in the dinner que that happened um not in the dinner Que in the in where we used to get a not D what they call it the dining hall uh he was an Indian and something had happened [Music] and it was he had brushed into me for his dinner and didn't even apologize oh sorry mate it was just like w up and where's your manners and he said something uh I've jumped up hit him split all his eye he grabbed a knife uh he got jumped on um that was in the dining H knifing situation I'd had another knifing situation with knobby Pearson he's dead now got rest of his soul and he was walking to so this is where it escalated started to see the knife in crime so I'm walking past the showers in flip flops in a dressing gown and it's the only time that well I don't do it anymore that if I in prison I wore boxer shorts to the showers if I got flip-flops on because as I was going to the showers there was a black leg called Toby and I never forgot it the first I landed in the open Nick he walked straight to the front of the que and I went there's an fing Q here mate and the fellow as we've G leave it leave it you just got you leave it just got here and I thought when I'm standing here what gives him the right to push in front of me or the whole queue I I'll shut off shut I won't have it again that's what I was like so as I walked past the little recess where knobby was in there watching his plates this to's gone get your gear and get out my way old man I've reversed back up what did you just say got in there I had a wash bag under me arm next thing I'm fighting in there naked scrapping with his keys he must have thought he's trying to Shag me so I've ended up on I've ended up weighing him in and on top of him giving it to him and then come and got pulled off of him so then I went to the shower anyway gone back to my digs and his pal come up now and I forget where he was like light skinned but he weren't white he was like a Greek or malti or something like I can't remember like fergo Sharky a bit darker he's coming and I remember being on top of him on the floor again with a scalpel and it was just above his face and it was a scalpel and uh that got stopped pulled off of him he's got sent out the door uh that one got asked to be left and I was in in a Decap prison meant to be released into society but that shows what type of violence is around Sean extreme violence a scalp or above your face he's holding me hand and I'm trying to get it in him because they were going to you know not they but he he had started on an old man that was wer my argument but I said what are we doing telling him to get his gear out his own way and it went off dangerous places and it's even with the staff there was an so there kitchen so or whatever he was and he had been more for verbal and abusing cons as I've come past the servery to pick up I said went no when his Lo a bit said can I have a bit we're like he said no you ain't so I just took it right I said that's what I've chosen it was on the that's what I've chosen he's going to punch your fing facing and I I said are you talking to me it's a screw so I walked back to where he was put my dinner down on the survery give him a left and a right grabbed his face put it in the in the grub pulled it down jumped up on the survery to go through and I got pulled back through it so at the time and then I got then put in grenon which is a prison across the road it was a therapeutic prison full of beasts and pedophiles you have to mix with really really really mental cases in there um and I got confined to my quarters after going over there in a cell and confined me to my quarters cuz he threatened me and that was it confined to my quarters and that nothing happened there yeah but talking about that prison grendon so you're seeing that extreme violence in a Decap when you a be going home and everyone behaving himself doesn't happen like say people have been shot in Decap prisons now from people coming in outside and I went over to grenan and they call it Terry Ellis did doing time with um with the Beast I think at time doing time with the Beast and great read I read it great read but I wanted to know what actually took place in those in the that Gaff and there's been so many deaths in there inmate against inmate and one of the years I think 1990 can't put my finger on the year but anyway I remember it happened there was a rape his second time around in thereit the most atrocious rapes I they all tell but what he was doing was just tell he had his head jumped on that many times all his brain matter came out and he just head was squashed to bits but the blow kept jumping on it and jumping on it and jumping on it um and there and there for therapeutic reasons and then there's been a couple of deaths in grenan me to be a therapeutic place to to release you into society but mixing people that you shouldn't be mixing with sitting there telling you about the crimes they've done and if you shown any animosity towards them you got chucked out the prison I mean that's disgraceful because I think it's pretty much anybody in the norm thing is impulsive what you're talking about and and not want to show that but as a result of that they've had two deaths there that I'm aware of extreme deaths stabbings and all that wasn't where Robert morsley killed his was it morsley killed someone in he cut their head off didn't he he done two in one Nick y I don't know if it was in grenon was it I don't know he took the Fell's head off with a shovel as well um might be Sean yeah I was with Bob was you yeah I was with Bob in [ __ ] in the cell next to how about that he used to talk to me clever man we just interviewed his psych of uh psychiatrist Dr Bob oh okay yeah and what did they say Dr Bob was really making progress with modley and they shut him down and D him out Bob yeah cuz he just F he' kill again but he only kills pedophiles and people like that yeah cuz he was abused as a child yeah they want to look at that really the deaths and the murders so that one when I was in Franklin just going so I've leaped from that type of crimes in as a young man seeing the stabins sugar once in a blue moon literally the the attacking was still pretty much where people would had a onet to one in them days it wasn't like gang attacking people uh if you had a like me me and uh Benji he didn't come for me with two or three of his poers he come for me on his own afterwards but a set two and what happened happened and he went his way and I went my way the next day it's long gone them days pretty much so take us through it then slowly then how how it evolved you've gone in on the big one and what was your first day like going and know your head must have been wrecked after you've been sentenced for such a long I was put into B Marsh SSU after being put into wood they upgraded me straight away put me in the in the block and then sent me straight to the unit and I thought God what am I going into here now because I remember there was another Geer he got deal for killing the opir with Milton kees in 2015 and he was in a black Budgy suit at the time and I didn't like the look of him creepy looking to him and then these big heavy metal chairs I'm on the freeze land no I was on the ones cuz you had to be Lo no was was on the ones there actually aat on the ones someone dropped a chair on the third Landing big one just missed his head he would have been dead I'm pretty much sure that he ended up getting cut anyway slashed I've gone into there then I was put into the into the uh segregation the unit taken from there to B Marsh the D Landing in Bal Marsh the screw said to me Georgie Shipton said it to me he said it's gone off here today Cu uh don't get involved said Do Your Own Thing I said I'll do what I want to do is what I said to George in terms of I didn't know you at the time and U it' gone off there that day we had a big Mar uh football player called Marcus he was on the run from America his Brotherhood got shot he bought a bit of weed they went back to complain about the weed only a smoke and his brother got shot and he got charged with his brother's murder that was the law in his State terrible he came over here on the Run had' gone off on that spur that day all the fellas would be the door 10 or 11 of them there wasn't 11 but say there was 10 of them cuz I would have been 11th on the spur if and um there's been unlocked singly to get their water an evening they didn't have plugs sockets and that in the cell and so it went off the first day there I think well just arrived here I've just read Parker's Tales it talks about glass jars being rammed in people's faces and stabbings and cuttings for what have I come to I've come to Monster Mansion and they've just put me in here and told me it's gone off I see the biggest black Geer I've ever seen in my life like The Green Mile it was Marcus he come walking out of his cell to get his coffee I thought my God look at the size of him he used to kill M with his feet they couldn't get away with him was running around in the unit he go bang and get him how about that his feet were like that honestly so that was quite an eye opener you know like sometimes people want to make their name off challenging a big guy did that happen with Marcus did people threaten him to try and fight and no did he they they looking at him thinking course they pull my head off he pull my off will pick me up with one hand like you would want to fight him unless you act to you would of course if you had to I mean I'd say yeah I F i' fight him if I I don't want to fight him but I will if I have to like fight or flight but I don't care how big you are I will fight you and uh and there's lots there lots of people of that that that stamina like a lot of Chuck West was like that did you see him in action never I just never I see him put about 240 K on his chest and just go wallet wallet wallet and put it down I thought blood's going to bend the bar in a minute he was real cool Marcus and he was real the laidback but um I never see him in action at all I never see any violence in the unit apart from what I was involved in myself so which you know sorry um that normally with staff fighting with them in a unit or other cons that a little bit further down the line and did you have your own sell at this point always in the unit you always get your own sales um never know double sales there no I ended up in the block two weeks after going into the special secure unit I I told with the member of Staff who' been threatening me and they'd been threatening me give me our time and i' been they threatened to kill me they got me down the block there in the scrubs they said we kill you for get you down here when he stopped there to go I to go toilet may have picked one of the other fellas that was charged in this case super Gass from there didn't know it was a Super G at the time so he was in there and then I've been threatened like I say by this group of screws Georgie shipped said why you keep threatening we ain't done nothing then we got back to the unit and he's performing like a bleeding idiot this idiot so I'm in a strip room with him taking my clothes off my cuffs are off now aren't they I'm not double cuffed or anything he got gobby I've H him he went straight to sleep and he hit the wall and slid down it of course the have screws it's happened that quick he's not that and then he's hit the P the Bell gone all it's all over nothing's going to happen he's put his arms around on me but they come steaming into you in the unit or on The Landings they're not asking any questions doesn't matter if you're both standing there quiet calm as anything you are going over bang they hit you wall up straight to the floor at a great pace and not at a great force jump all over you rip your arms up your back and your legs and everything create a struggle instead of okay you're all calm just put the Cuffs we're going to walk you no you're going down and you're going to get it and that's what happened to me and I was taken to the strip box my clothes taken off of me I said if you cut my clothes off I'm going to get one if you the first chance I'll get my clothes are dear I mean at the time though I think they said listen don't cut his clothes off because he obviously means business you have one sitting in a sleep still and he's got quite a few injuries to his sleep few teeth knocked out stitches and a Fran of cheekbone so that left my mark with him and the other staff thinking well he he can have a go and he's pretty Lively but nonetheless I still got threatened after there by a few other members of staff and they ended up exactly the same as him asleep or in a bad way the the Goon Squad come every time for you after those yeah yeah you get unlocked six-man Squad then it goes up to 12 or 10 I think you're pretty active you can fight not one but you can keep going hard for them to get you under control um but I had like a three man squad three blos come in on me with a team behind him uh and I knew the three of them actually and I didn't want to actually hurt any of them because I liked them there was in the units you only seen the staff in the unit I thought these ain't bad chaps these two of them at least and the other ones are right but uh I did try to stab them with a pen it was going into their body armor body protection stuff metal pen it was that did fighten him um Kevin you said you there's times when you got this like tornado in your brain this hurricane in your brain so when you're figh in the Goon Squad is it full it's going full on tornado in your brain at that point is it do you feel like you're releasing some kind of press pressure or what what's the what's the thought process I used to get think the thought that they were threatening me I won't be threatened so Matthew Williams he escaped out of parast there's no violence to him in terms of physical violence but he's danger with his brain and they went in on him to wrap him up for no reason was a joint decision in the unit not to work that's it we're not going to clean the Gaff you clean it as a result of that they've gone in there and wrapped him up I got the hump over that and I remember getting on the bell and saying to run of the screws pattern was his name and I said you know when two boxers are in the ring and the bell goes off you yeah I said the bell's just gone off go and get your kit on walked to the back of the cell took a jump off that my mama knitted me and waited for him to come in and that was a rage that I'd work myself up into thinking I want you not the other way around where I'm oh my God the ma coming in on me no I want to fight you and I'm bringing it to you that creates a different thought pattern with the people that are coming in to fight you because they know that you want it you want to get stuck into them and uh that does put you on a bit of uneven par with them especially for instance if you've doing this regularly to to the extent where on one of the occasions I took the shield man out and I organized it in my cell where the door would open but it open onto the my metric box where the my clothes used to have to be stored to it open it wouldn't open fully and they had to turn this The Shield like that they got big shields in they with angles on at the side to get you penned in well as they tried to come in on me I'd put a few boxes there they hadn't thought about and uh when the door had open give me chance to run kick the bottom of the The Shield left hook helmet come off hit the ceiling knocked him spark out they're pulling him out by his feet while they're trading me with CES and punching and I'm standing there trading with them remember I got a big split across my eye and they open up like a tomato they to pull him out and they were shouting out stop Kevin stop never forget it um Wayne har was next to me John cers was there a lot of other people was in there so isn't me just saying it John cers said he's never heard have seen a fight go on for so long with a muy like that en nor in on you wrapping you up not pull the fellow out at your feet and then keep trading with you it was quite a battle that one I laugh about it now but it's very serious of course at the time it's not something to be laughed about it's extreme emotion and it's very sad and that's what I'm curious about is your inner world because when we interviewed bash and shout out to bash congratulations on getting married recently bash told us he has a fight and the tension goes but then slowly attention inside him builds up and when he has the fight the tension's gone again and it's kind of this cycle that's gone throughout his life do you have anything comparable like when you're fighting the Goon Squad do you think you're releasing some kind of tension or anything only the anger I've got him me then afterwards I get upset very upset unless I'm still angry sitting in a strip cell for very long periods of of time you're only meant to be in the box which is concrete gray concrete everywhere a slab like that like a bench for you to lie on if you're lucky you're not being violent or you're on strip cells they give you a mattress or you get a blanket a little mat a little nappy and a little like the little monkey uh in simbad jackets like that like a little monkey you would wear and depending on what level they've got you on if you're being violent you get nothing and you're stripped naked sun goes down you're cold you lose track of the days when you're in there and when you're in there you can become angry still but after that if you're not in the strip box and you're out of there a sadness can come over me God BL why why is this again why does it always have to be this so I don't believe in the yard stick I believe that you shouldn't beat people to make them learn you should show compassion and more open Palms You' get far better that way I do believe that I really do and if Government should adopt that attitude in some a lot of aspects countries that need your medication to save their children and people out country say you would't be alive if it weren't for Britain they gave his medication that you needed you wouldn't be so inclined to want to attack that country would you you have an ally with them wouldn't you anyway it's long that's a different subject but I to get upset a lot after the violence or I was still angry when I'm in strip boxes and they're bringing in my food and I'm naked there and they're bringing in my food in Shields like Roman legion coming in and you're laying there and they're saying to you right keep calm Kevin keep your arms at your side at all times don't move your arms go yeah bollocks like you know and they're coming in putting your food down and going back out in in Roman legion formation and I think what is all this about put my food down and just get out will you or in that instance I told you about when we had when I was all split open that was done by Kosh and about 11 or halfast 11 that night I had to fight him about 2:00 in the afternoon around that time so by the time I've gone to the Box my eyes long as it's swollen shut it's like a split tomato now you can see all the Flesh of the Tomato you can see all the Flesh of my eye and I was sitting there and pit was her name was a nurse she came came in and she standing behind all this French this Roman uh Legion of formation of three2 and one and she goes Kevin it's pip here she goes give him something to cover himself up with there we go and she goes I said all right pip she's going to get out of the way she she like Kevin right thank you pip and they wouldn't turn the light on in the strip cell although there was a perspect glass roof to it where psychologist could walk around there and write reports on you like an animal in a cage so she's sewing me up under a torch CU they didn't want to turn the light to give me an advantage or some type of Advantage but um he can see a bit more in the you know uh not Advantage don't what the correct word is but nonetheless they wouldn't turn on cuz it would help me and they sold me up under torch and she stuck the needle in with no anesthetic nothing and I remember nearly passing out thinking my God this is hurting me you're going into Raw flesh sewing it up eight or nine hours later sewed it up I'm sweating nearly passed out she go so sorry Kevin I've got to do it again it's not straight and she weren't doing it to punish me cuz pit was a sweet little lady and she did it again and it reminded me of the film like rainbow except I did need it was so painful and uh that was in the in the stre strip cell so violence of two different sorts sewing me up without an anesthetic that weren't Pip's decision we should have had to inject me in there and they already had a needle in there which I didn't want in the first place cuz that's dangerous so now you sign up without a needle without having another needle in his face that he could grab and uh they would want a little curly one like that but he didn't want something could be plunged so they sewed me up without anesthetic this is fascinating Kevin so you said fighting the Squad Burns off your anger and then you have an anticlimax and you feel sad and I imagine it it builds up again was there how long did that cycle for did there come a period of time where you stopped fighting the staff when I realized that if I hit one of them and broke their jaws I can get a two strike lifer and then I thought you never going home Kevin how old are you at that point I done I was 37 yeah 37 do you know do you know how many years into that big sentence 10 years in 10 years in and I kept fighting I 18 moves in four years so I've been bouncing around the block all the time prisons all the time onto the landings they didn't want me in the blocks when I was in the units they couldn't send me nowhere for all the fights I had because they said lame will use extreme violence if he tells you he's going to use it he will use it don't tell Lane black is white because you've got a problem um he's good for morale he's good for uh the wing but he will not suffer bullies and like I say if he says he's going to he does it he said also said Lane drinks managing I started drinking in the units so when I came out of the units I went on to The Landings and they're thinking God he's having parties not only can he fight he's in there of people who can fight who are well-known faces or they're just decent people these Kevin's made friends with we ain't going in on them cuz they're drunk so used to let me have my parties so everyone was banged up on time anyway and behind the door and there was no violence imagine the violence they must have thought was on tap if they wanted it but luckily it never was when they said you don't suffer bullies what did they mean by that were there some stories of people you dealt with yeah uhing he's dead now for I can't mention his name but he was an Informer and he was a bully in his own way of life as well he sent a makeshift bom and teddy bears inner teddy bear to his his former partner and children it was a bomb though but it was a makeshift one and stuff like that I mean so much so when he got killed his C- defendant chopped his hands and fingers and all that off chopped his hands off his feet off and that was his Cod defendant so they had have fallen out but this man was meant to being an Informer in the prison system and he was in the unit and I was told of him being in the unit and Danny magnamar and Liam mot and the boys he said Kevin there's always a grass in the unit to be careful so when I landed there I was taken there over lock up I was met in reception with three arations and the Sea of screws wanting me to kick off cuz I said when I come to that unit I'm going to smash it up and I was interviewed by two members of Staff down in balar special secure unit they come down here to make it a smooth transition into the unit I said I don't care about your unit I'm going to smash up and burn up when I get there you got put informing in there that's going to be getting it I thank God he's always fighting in unit down here he's pretty Lively he's coming up there and we've just had the unit opened up after the Escape just got all new restrictions Michael har was the new Home Secretary it was been looked at and scrutinized in Europe as the most heavily uh videoed uh building in Europe at the time inhumane it was classed as and they were sending me into it so I've landed there I've got unlocked after arriving there about half hour later I've looked to my right and I've seen this fell about 63 64 walking along into shadow box and he was a Jordy or he weren a Jordy he from middles bar but same same old different jockey so to speak with the accent and I walked up to him give him a right straight away I always walking long FR a left and a right like that so I give him a right I could see was unconscious in my mind's eye now on his feet and I caught him with a left hook as well bur him mind I was doing a thousand press UPS a day Army press UPS I'll do 50 ones there straight ones these on these ones Swan Dives I could do 50 of them at any time no problem whatsoever I could do 100 and wink at you all right and I weren't bouncing they were proper press up all the way down was looking looking up when I did them so my arms are like iron so when you hit someone it's not like being hit with us this round the face you're being hit with that that has a lot of extra penetration or when you hit someone that's what I try to say to boxers make your arms rock hard so when you hit someone it vibrates through their bleeding their body he was on sle for asleep for minutes he was the first instance for me going into the units against him mates I came out of the um wait I had to fight of him coule of times actually put him to sleep on both occasions in the unit um he started getting big found a bit of weight around found his chances foolishly and he didn't end up well for him but when I came out of the units went on to The Landings my name was already Lish because there's this new young kid who looked like a college boy in the countryside 11 stone 7 11 stone s in the unit fighting the Muffy being quite successful with him and knocking out Giants putting them to sleep for a night a few minutes where they actually WR was sasit a fell at the time I just thought it was business as usual no different to weighing people outside to weighing them in in prison no difference of having a fight with loads of Dorman and then getting weighed in and then saying right I'll have you now then me and you not all of you me and you and then that same would happen and same again so I was pretty much used to that type of getting overwhelmed by Muffy and getting a bit of a a kick in at that time although you're doing well taking them out you go back and take and sort them all out individually after that or thereabouts you're used to that typee of fighting I got a good iding once off 11 Bloks but I took the fight to him again I took definitely I took two out and the third one I was on the penny by then what was that over they started on my brother at a burger then uh thinking he was with someone that he wasn't with and I just turned around and see my brother went into him and then kept going into him and ended up getting a good ID in I went back and got him though after I finished convalescence by broken ribs and all sorts but I'm used to that type of thought pattern where you're getting fairly beaten but you won't give in and however I was quite successful with it but I was a little bit older in the units then when I came out the out the units onto the landings there's a lot of violence there it started in it's not there not just focus on my violence for a little bit let's focus on uh some violence that I was witnessed to in there around what year are we at now well early do from 1996 97 97 say you're just seeing the normal violence on the land is against cons slashing not Mak them any stabbings I had seen any oil in or Waters at that time and then around about 2,000 operation Trum tried and young kids were coming in massively in 2006 they were just flooding The Landings it's where the parents went to the police and said you got to stop our young kids killing each other black on black rightly so as well so then they started coming into the The Landings and then still got their problems with someone out is's on another house block or another spur CU they've killed someone or you're related to or it's your brother even and that's happened in there so with that what they do sign up to Islam you must have attack another Muslim but again they was they still did carry on the attacks then if you had a problem with one of them and you got a problem with all of them and then you have to fight a pack of wolves attacking you which has happened with a lot of people in the system never happened to me and I had fights with people who were well known in there but luckily I was considered in a manner where please don't take this the wrong way but I was well liked in there by all walks of life of all colors terrorist as well who liked me and I like the personality of that terrorist hard as it is for you to imagine that I see a difference in some people when you're living on the Landers with them so for instance Terry Conan i' I've maybe deflected a bit there but Terry Conan was in for killing uh boxing trainer Davis with jump up John and he was having a bad asthma attack bad asthma attack and Healthcare had been about 30 odd minutes coming for him door drove the car into Glasgow Airport didn't he he was a real doctor in that I went and got Abdul and took him in to see Terry congan Terry Conan's attack got worse when I produced Abdul he's thinking Dr de you've tried to kill my Countryman he doesn't talk to him because he watch STS like that like a lot of people in there um but I always found him inas fascinating and wanted to talk to him and I enjoyed enjoyed his conversation he was like told talking to a doctor who was really really calm and Placid unbelievable um he I brought him into the cell Terry Conan's face has changed and he's looking at Dr de say what are you doing Kevin they called bang up and Abdul refused to be locked up you're going to have to bend me up and you want me out of here you're going to have to remove him by force I'm not leaving this man so you see one extreme is trying to kill by buying up to his fellow Countryman and mine cuz I'm off Scottish and then the next he's he's he's been offered violence by the star and he wouldn't leave so I see that in there where you've got con signing up to Islam and they going down the FR down the church or the we called the mosque at the time it was a church and there'd be more people in that service on a Friday afternoon with weapons ready to attack each other then there was in there for praying and it went off on I I say two but it was three FR is on the Trot in [ __ ] where it went right off stabbings where staff was down there waiting for it to kick off because they knew this was the only place that these Lads could get at each other because it was their Friday prayers and they just went hell to lever stabbing others to bits in a place of worship that's when I started seeing the violence escalate to a degree where you think there's no sanctum and there should have been cuz i' had never seen violence in the church and all the years I'd been in there up until that and then I see the Napal where they're boiling up butter or olive oil get enough bottles of olive oil to make a pot or ghee to boil that into oil straight in your face I see the the Ministry of Sound bomber little fell I forget his name now come to me in a minute he had oil pulled over his head and water should I say in the kitchen in Frankin on the ones on one of the Spurs was that over a drug thats in being his no he cuz he was the attacks he done so he was attacked by some of the lads up there Jordy Lads and then as a result of that one of the Ministry of Sound bombers he was a doctor as well or something like that real like uh the Milky bar kid type appearance really softly spoken quite a good personality really intellectual conversation you could have with someone like that he went and boiled oil and as a Revenge attack tipped over giza's head it was getting out on the Monday that happened on the Friday and his head went like crackling and he he died he was in intensive care and everything his head went like crackling and the scream is like a lobster screaming but 10 times as loud very frightening was that one of the most frightening things that you happened around you he seeing that type of extreme violence in every Prison from there on in let you know how people were fighting their battles so every good uh General picks his battlefield but not every good General can pick what Weaponry has used against you whether it be a form of a a ice pick that has been made in the workshop with Jagged edges so when it comes out it rips all he guts out at the same breath and a friend of mine had one of them and he was going to stab someone in Long Len and I said what are you going to do with that he because I'm going to stick it straight through him I said well you will do with that why was he upset that is an argument over religion and there had been attacks on people fights and that was going to that was was the next level and I said you ain't you're doing life now you'll never be going home if you kill him I took it off of him and put it in a bin it made me shiver yeah thought my God what are you going to so they're giving lifers murderers and serious criminals access to a metal shop where you're making weapons to kill yourself Matthew Williams I told you about and Andy Rogers they made a gun makeshift gun in in uh Parker in metal shop they reckon could have worked how about that dangerous he so Kevin as you're seeing the violence escalate you gone from being a young person you're maturing as a man how are you navigating that it sounds to me like you've got the respect of the older generation you got the respect of the different races but are you finding it trickier to navigate as the consequences escalate around you for people found it trickier to navigate where where I see the at the time arguments on both sides if like you was wrong you say look Sean I think you're wrong mate but you're not going to stab him that ain't happening how can we resolve this it don't have to go to that I mean why does it have to go to such extremeness unless he stabbed you or something then you know the rule the gloves are off and it's I'll make a stand with you so did you become more of a mediator for people and more diplomatic as you matured definitely I could say would have to come this violence why does it have to come to that or come with this uh yeah definitely immediate definitely when it came to the bigger sides the bigger people was going at each other have you got any stories of mediation you know long stories where perhaps you de-escalated a situation there was a fellow called Burma he was given a contract to cat stab Peter ot to Peter oo is a m character Justice in this country and uh largely known he's got he end up serving most of his time before he gets out it's miscarriage of Justice the one of the Fells or a person who got killed and Peter was reportedly responsible for that although I would like to say his Cod defendant was caught with the same shotgun that the fellow was killed with and it was withheld from his evidence and all stuff like that so look into the case deeply before you persecute someone so the family of that one of the deceased had reportedly put up 20,000 to have him SLA stabbed or stabbed in the eye and this kid called Burma was uh given that job um allegedly one of the other people involved uh or I spoke to about at that time we had a chat about what was going on he was I'm not going to mention his names because he's become friends with Peter and they sort it out he was reported to be issuing that contract and I spoke to this paline in prison at the same time said what's going on it can't be right surely not right and over money he don't even know anyway so uh this Burma used to sleep in bed he slept in bed next to the laundry room on the ones and without him realizing we'd known he' been asked to commit this contract out on Peter and uh what can we do about it Kevin I said well what do you want to do about it there's no speaking to him because he's already taken the hit on you um you know it's going to happen what are you going to do um before that incident happened before his door was opened it wasn't P I'm not saying it was P there was other people involved at the time would he gone in there and done what was going to be done I went round to the ones and before that door was opened I've gone into the laundry seeing the lads in there waiting to go when the doors open going stab him two bits come back out of there with the tools put them in the laundry bag straight into the washing machine okay uh or get rid of them whichever way they were going to get rid of them okay but wanted to get any DNA that might be on there of and whatever uh the door got unlocked late and I was in there talking to the lads and as a result of that TOS went away and that keys are in that CS very lucky man and he didn't know he didn't know that the time he was just be to get served up severely in bed stabbed to bits and it would have been on top it would have been screaming straight away so it would have been a 30 second frenzy have attacked 42 frenzy stab stab stab stab stab stab stab just stab stab stab quick as you can take 30 seconds is a long time to be stabbing someone but he'd have been asleep he's always known for being in his bed to sleep so the first four or five plunges would have been in him very serious any other stories of situations where you've saved people's lives or save them from being really hurt I've saved a kid's life who was going to hang himself once from being bullied he was going to be hanging himself put a stop to that why were they picking on him that happens in the system it's taxing bullying people want you to a bit of C off of your steel off you there was a big friend called Sharpie and longy was his name Jason long or Jay long he done he was putting curve when he was born been all through the system and Sharpie had nicked his tobacco out of his cell just picked it up and walked out of it and little longy went him got a hot pepper bottle strapped it to his hand but like Kevin faka did Kevin fak did the same in Frankland he stabs screws come out his cell he had a vendetta against screws hatred for him and uh I think one of them him a beating or something happen and he stabbed them to bits woman included with a hot pepper sauce bottle and caused some severe damage to them staff then he died cut a jug and things like that um longy did the same to Shari Shar is about 22 stone bench PR 220k a big lump of a man dangerous he beat a copper a knuckle duster and Hammer tied up in the basement trying to get him to open up a safe in his house and killed him and his dad is the um the boxing in Wakefield um Sykes that's who his dad was syy syy right we've done a few podcasts about syy right well he's shot his boy if I got this white he meant to be Sharpie called sharp um he's a big lump Jay stabbed him in the neck it must have been like a bit of a beas thing to Sharie cuz he weren't like that realized he was bleeding and chased longy down the landing and he could move this bleeding Sharpie I swear to God he could move and he's chased longy down the landing and sha he was a Jordi screw used to take mellow tan give him a bit of a tan but he looked as black as you could ever imagine but I like sha he was prop good crack and uh prob he jumped in front of Sharpie and stopped him on his own he would have had it with him and all and I've respected him for that sure on so that was quite a dangerous run but when Kevin faka stabbed the staff my God he went on a frenzy plunging them to bits same as like David Bieber who got shot for shoot got nicked for shooting the police officers in New York he tried to cut a woman prison officer's head off in Long Lon about two years ago yeah tried to cut her head off he was asked to kill me and he said he come and told me there a contract on me I thanks for telling me Dave appreciate you telling me so I'm telling you I don't you'd find out and then we'll have a problem cuz you think I'm plotting you there was four people asked to kill me and all four of them were told me why was there a contract on you the informers in my case wanted me shut up in relation to the evidence that I had acquired saying that they had informed on me in the system and they were working with the police so it's desperate to getting me shut up and that material was disclosed to me to me at court two of the Old Bailey as well as other numbering agencies within the criminal justice system so there was hits against me no one ever tried to kill me though in prison and all those years I stayed in the same prison in the same cells I three police Osman warnings in prison and I know for a fact that was there were Osman warnings and hits given on people in prison regularly and they get carried out none of them ever got taken out on me at that time and I think it's because one I was really well liked and people see me for being the man I was where I was really fair and I like people don't go where you from I liked you and I decid against you if you was white and this person was black because I I see the goodness of this man I really like him and I think you're wrong I didn't give a monkeys where you come from what's right is right and what's wrong is wrong and so like David bab he says Kevin like Victor Victor little Victor castigo he said Kevin he said you you I like you Kevin he said in you never hurt no one unless you fight if you have to fight and so that's why people were telling me I had a good name in there but I did have a lot of fights we've got a lot of viewers in America Kevin and they might be wondering what an Osman warning is could you explain what one is and what happened the first time they came and and said that to you there's a serious threat against your life that the police haveed information that you are going to be killed someone's going to make an attempt on your life and they've checked out those threats so the threats were coming from the Informer in my case and like I say he wanted me shut up and he came into money and he was put 50 Grand on my head and then it went up to 100 and then two years ago went up to 200 Grand and that was offered out to the seat Community they come and told me so it seems I'm quite lucky enough to get told all the time but very dangerous because these are imminent threats by people we've got nothing left nothing to lose for instance if you in prison and you get off of £200,000 and 50 or £1,000 £50,000 of that is going to be put up with loded with someone and you're get the other 50 as soon as that attacks committed on me £100,000 to you in prison is a lot of money if you've got a family or F on drugs and they still didn't get taken so I'm very lucky although there was people I probably could say that if they had to come across me they would have stabbed me but there was a lot of terrorists in the system that were com beting acts of multiple stabbings aache attacking and still when I was on those landed I didn't get attacked and I think that was because a lot of people would have come to the fold with me if if it had happened to me although I didn't realize then at the time I walk those Landings on my own and I'll be prepared to fight one two or three or 10 people on my own if I had to uh but I think what saved me was one that I was well liked and secondly that people knew that it would go right off if I was multiply attacked by the is Islam Islamic terrorists um because one they had an opposition anyway and secondly I got on with a lot of people black and white and I'd have had black and white coming to my my my age should I say if IID have needed it so we spoke to a lot of people on the podcast who've had Osman warnings who were in the public domain but you were in prison how does it work if you get an Osman warning prisoner the guards just come to your sell and take you to a legal visit and the cops have to brief you what's I got called I got called into the governor's office and told it was a threat against my life I tell say it was new right so going to get got got s oh oh no I'm good go for it you're lucky at all cuz there ain't none left while you're doing that I'll just tell the viewers don't forget Cambridge country club February 23d link is in the description box below this video Kevin Lane and guess it's going to be a cracking night be a great night and there be other people there that aren't on the on the uh flyer but there be a lot of guests there so you get told this warning it's an imminent threaten against your life and you're going to get killed or someone's going to try and kill you and you walk in The Landings with people that are in there for killing people so it's uh willly Wonka's chocolate factory for murderers when you received that first Osman warning did you know right away who was behind it yeah I've been told that they're trying to get me killed I've been told by people that money's been offered these are people higher up in the chain of command in the prison system and people directly have been asked themselves so when you're getting asked by someone who's been directly asked you know it's pretty strong and you know these people as well I never changed all I did was though I was just maybe a little bit more conscious about my movement so instead of having my head in the phone all the time I might just have the phone out but because I was aware that you cannot stop yourself from being attacked in prison end off you have not got eyes in the back of your bus hooks or the back of your head and you know you can be cutting something up someone can walk past you cut say come in the kitchen walk in stab you walk back out it's as simple as that unless you've got an armored plated shield around you you are going to get stabbed if someone wants to stab you or hurt you fact that's a fact some I never had that and for the young people that think there just like super tough guys who are immune to getting any harm done to them how is that ridiculous or absolutely absurd doesn't matter how big you are 6'6 20 stone there's ladge in the system now I'm aware of that big that have been Mass attacked by multiples of other people and stabbed that person number of times or those people a number of times because hasn't hasn't happened singularly it happened multiple times to multiple people good against and for and severe stabbings face neck wherever as well as oiling it happens and they're just going like a pack of wolves like you said earlier G like a pack of wolves and they know that you're going to come back at them and you're going to have something to say about it they still come at you with lots of weapons and they do it in front of Staff sitting where sha is because they've taken their orders or they're so angry with you they just can't wait to get into you cuz all they see is red friends but he's very very frighten there's no protection in prison to a certain degree whereas you will get stabbed if someone really wants to stab you or do the most atrocious acts of violence against you so turn on the Millennium what prison we in by then I was in Long Len I went there in 2000 and I remember watching the World Cup sitting on a rying machine where Johnny uh what was his name he kicked the kicked the shot kick the ball over the post what's his name the rugby player Johnny anyway I remember watching him kick that ball over for the World Cup final and getting used to the violence in there so it was renowned for having rabbit Warren in the new in the old Wings where he could touch each side of the the wall and you had six hour Evo there was a dead end down there and star didn't like coming down there they sat at the end of the rabbit Warr and be a little square to be a rabbit Warr little square like here and another rabbit Warr down there a lot of violence a lot of TV rooms that aren't even monitored can't be watched lot of dark areas showers for instance and sometimes you wouldn't have stuff on the threes only be on the twos a lot of opportunities to hurt people badly and when the opportunist opportunists Avenues of attack were reduced in terms of they can only get you on the gym or visit visit was frowned upon people's loved ones there but I would have have someone going in on a visit ifart to get them as the only players I could get them or exercise on the weekends where normal location cross each other out on the exercise field so three and a half times around Long L exercise field at that time was a mile on the measuring stick but on there was a football pitch and people used to bury their weapons out there it went off twice once I was there on the field one of the occasions people from my wing and another Wing friends of mine and other people two sets of friends of mine were fighting it escalated I think there was 30 odd people in the block and put back up on the wing locked up because there was no more block cells where kicked off on the field dogs prison uh guard dogs running around let off the leads biting people biting staff because they were just going mental people getting slashed stabbed on the field like a football frenzy of people going at each other in the mix white prison shirts or black jackets with prison officers in their dogs running around off the lead biting people my people are slashing and stabbing like you imagine it it was Carnage how did you navigate that if you were friends with both sides stay out of it stay out of it people try and rope you in yeah but what do you do when I like you and I like you you a mental you both can't short your arguments out will you you're both mad so that went down mad because it was too started off over too bright brothers that I knew not Blood Brothers but black brothers and as a result of that it just kicked right off twice not a few stabbings nicy stabbings at all it kicks off once in Franklin a little time after that and there was a dispute again shout out shout out to Ricky Kleen he's told us a few Frankland stories yeah I don't to tell you about the times I caught him in a Cell kissing someone stop doing that Ricky stop doing that Kevin was jealous you was kissing me earlier he never done that Ricky he's a good laugh and I have some good times with Ricky but so Franklin it was like Braveheart was it it kicked off on gwing on there once and people were unconscious laying down on the landing staff had to evacuate that part of the wing let the frenzy carry on and it went on for a long time and on about minutes long time people was unconscious on the floor and I know people that ran past him and as they ran past him they stabbed them whilst they was asleep you're going to have another one wallup I haven't heard of that before in prism where people are getting stabbed cuz they're unconscious and they're on the opposing side is that cuz the feud ran so deep they got involved in the feud and it was to do with Warren slany start with him and some blocks come around to put it on Warren stey um and the whole house block evolved erupted so when we was talking earlier and that went on for about half an hour before the staff got control of the wing again quite a long and there was a standof and like one party down here and this party up here and it was quite quite severe the other one kicked off and I told you about the rapist earlier so there's a group of lads that took some girls to a park and raped then and shot them and left them for dead in ready and that's the same group that I was aware of as well they came into the dispersal system one of them came into Whitmore he came out of the second segregation not segregation protection brings and he came on to the main Landing I haven't got the permission to mention my friend Pal's name but he came to me his mom was doing a bit of time that'll help identify him to let him know I'm speaking about him because he was proper Storch without mentioning his name that would identify him to a lot of people and he said Kevin Zak on there that was involved in that lot that you was telling us about he said but only made them give him a [ __ ] I we get in there and do him he said but such and such he said if anyone goes through him what go was them they got to go through him I said well tell him to meet me out on the yard and bring two of his mates of him I'll meet him out on the yard in a minute otherwise saying it's it's going you're not protecting him because you know his brother he's bragging about he only made the girl give him a blow job he wasn't involved in the shooting and all the rest of it he's getting it I said so get in there give it to him it's a bit of like um I remember him telling me after he said Co three of us went in on him he said was hitting each other he was trying to hit him thought the Mad friend he give it to him he got to beat him I said you better get off the wing he got off the wing so when I was talking to you about the one that happened on Franklin that to do with one slay any different incident but a little while after on a new wing one of these rapists turned up there as well and came on normal location CU he converted to Islam and it was on normal location the lad says get him off the landing if he ain't gone Scout as a Anis was said tell him he's off the landing otherwise when opens up it's going off these are long Wings these were like big wings like barns anyway needless to say unlock came he's Stam because he's got the Brotherhood behind him protecting him he think he's got card Blan to do what he wants it went right off there was people find snooker balls chairs snookered knives it kicked right off and again there was that many people involved in the in the the riot where it was a proper Street kickoff off they had to lock people up off on the wing cuz the block was full they couldn't feel the segregation and there was that many F fighting in there there was behind their doors for a long periods of time before the prison was able to ship everybody out get enough buses to the prison to ship people out to blocks around the country to be able to empty the block so you imagine the state that was in within the prison people have been involved on that Wings Them Wings fighting and the two different wings I told you about but they might have had had a around stabed some of my mates so they'd be locked down on their wing but some of their inmates have got to come off there to go to work with in other areas where you might bump into him if he was a gym wardley or if you worked in the kitchen or if you on visits to go off again Carnage biggest style Carnage it was like human Warehouse Carnage Ian blink MacDonald tolds us some stories about Warren sany they teamed up together against some other people yeah there no problem whatsoever why to make one on his own against someone Ian blink McDonald game he's known for having a fair tear up Ian shout out to Blink out see glas at the Frances show soon yeah he'll be day so he sat down with my Uncle Ian did I was away and he said you Ian blink mcon he goes yeah he said I'm Kevin's uh to he had a good drink with me Uncle up in Scotland fair play to in and all um I'll probably see you at Michael franchise he depending where it is which one I come to Scotland is well known for knife crime where before it was in in the UK like they was up there the knife crime I've seen in prism is not just across the face where you're putting a knife on someone sticking it all over them cross the throat eyes slashing slashing people to Pieces eyes the eyes yeah the eyes the eyes bad really lucky I know people have got across the eye yeah um they're lucky didn't go in there didn't go in very lucky other people that see uh Dwayne Chambers for instance he got stabbed in the eye with a with a spike right in his eye went right into his brain and it affected him for a long long time where he was um in a state where he was really really couldn't look after himself oh so it caused brain damage brain damage yeah he's far better now and far capable of looking after himself than he was when it happened but he got stabbed to bits and he was dangerous twne but was he blinding that eye he was he lost sight in it as well I believe oh if I've got that wrong I apologized but I believe he was blind in that eye and it affected like I say his brain and he was stabbed right into his eye right into his brain matter when I see him the effect that that had on him afterwards was that over something serious or was it Dwayne was known for carrying out contracts on people the argument he had over that I'm not a liberty to say what it was over I'm not saying it was over a contract he carried but it was definitely over something that other parties weren't happy about or had agreements with and Wayne walked those Landings as he did every day on his own and game he' have a blade on him all the time Dwayne did no problem pretty much all the time as other people carry blades all the time in prison shanks I never but that there's one of those instances there where he's got straight in the old Dome bone in the old cabbage he's crab walking after that and dribbling and can feed himself and all sorts and still put back on the land you it happen again if he wants to say something about it which he would have done soon as he got better or he might have mileed out when I see him I was hoping he'd mild out a bit CU I like dway did you come across yammy Uncle yamy shout out yeah know yumy come across him in the system did you never see anything that he he talked about of doing because it never happened in the prison's eyes in when it happened with him yeah um I think he's had his times in prison isn't he he's such a positive guy isn't he he just radiates warmth and enthusiasm and he's happy gol lucky on his how he lived his life in prison he was heavily on drugs in prison which he talks about so I'm not bad mouthing him here his lifestyle there wasn't the lifestyle he leads now and so that's good fair play to him and it shows people you can change your lives he's seen both walks of life in prison with the way he led his life in there and it has been quite problematic for him and others at times which he accepts so it's good to see him on the path he's earning now earning a straight living he's doing good great on YouTube people subscribe to yumy B TV on YouTube his stories are brilliant he he but he's getting a Liv out of it which was before he was committing contracts in prison for drugs how easy is it to execute a contract on someone or put a contract on someone in prison de easy bag of gear life is cheap life is cheap look there's a bag of gear would on D one him slashed problem bag of gear so a gra Arin whatever gra Arin was at the time in there you've got someone slash to bits and how often is it they want to go all the way on these contracts all the way is a big thing there was five murders in 2015 I believe in high security estate they were pretty much Avenged attacked or pedophiles gentleman had his penis cut off and stuck in his mouth one um that's quite bant in Franklin isn't it he had his he was disbound and then cut his penis off right I was there in that year when that happened well he won't be doing anything else to any kids no he won't but then there's been other people like that had some same sort of stuff taken to him just feel pure angriness hatred um yeah not good so when you look about the murders in there whether it's staff or inmate you don't get the statistics reported in the manner on the the the local news because it isn't local news they don't want it on the news do they because it it shames the prison and they lose uh their stats so it's people say why aren't all these on the news the prison hides a lot of it don't they they have to because they're saying they don't want to put people off and coming in there to work I had a young lady she's starting at at prison and she asked me if I can give her some advice I said right first of all how old are you and then I've seen her profile she's a pretty girl and of thought she's going into an environment where men are starved of affection they're going to be playing up to her very difficult um what advice can you give someone to say You' got a husband because you better get used to you being Le people leing all over you and it will affect you coming know where you've seen people hanging or cut that's going to affect your livelihood so it's hard to give people advice in that manner but it must affect their lives PDS post-traumatic stress I've got to tell you I think that happens on a lot of Staff side more than cons don't know why that is cons claim p uh pts and they come said they can't work they're just a lot of them just milking the ticket that other people are milking already they could go to work there's nothing wrong with them just one they've been in a long time in prison they don't want to work get a few quid but I know for a fact a lot of Staff take it a lot worse than cons do lot of the staff I think all the staff we've interviewed have had PTSD and have had serious health and mental health and addiction and alcohol issues yeah I had those issues when I was in there and I was enjoying myself on my parties when I used to get drk on Hooch um how old are you when you got out 47 47 and what was your biggest challenges as you were facing the gate none none were you psychologically ready post- release plan yeah no challenges challenge was getting on with my life that weren't a challenge it was a a thirst for life I was a sponge wanted to get on with it I couldn't wait I was excited make up from this time make up that that didn't go down well when I became single after a while and I think I slept with about I think it's 14 or 15 girls consecu different girls out of 16 days different girl every day how' you manage that Plenty of Fish Play No it w I didn't do none of that it was from I went on match.com match and I knew girls that I knew yeah and I said like I'm free I'm just become single no strings attached attach straight sex just want to meet you have a good time if we don't end up in bed we don't but let's just go I'm been starved of women company and then W up G for being so honest uh I just went out and enjoyed their time their personality and they up in bed anyway yeah but catching up on life for me wasn't about that it about enjoying Society trying to step away from the violence i' seen been breathing and living and eating every day in my life because it's it's on the land as it's facing you you can come out of a door turn left bump into someone he's had a bad day or he don't like you or you've had a rail with him before and next you know he's been plotting you and he stabs you to life there and then right you've caugh him on a bad day so to get out into society it was a breath of fresh air and think wow let's see what he's got to enjoy you're going full tilt on the adrenaline from what you just described like you said anything can happen getting out into society is there like an adrenaline com down do you have to adapt no you become more guarded I was more guarding in on the xide outside than I was on the inside more guarded more guarded to stay out even though the threats are less is it more people more people outside that don't know who you are or do know who you are and trying to avoid road rage trying to avoid someone you've bumped into uh trying to avoid situations where you don't want to go because it could be peaceful protest about climate change you end up in front of a pis police officer being pushed to the front and next your naing arrest for public disorder or you hit you over a caral whatever whatever's gone on being in situations where I don't want to get nicked so so you've had to become very strategic to adapt to society so you don't go back yeah cuz I in the land you walk in the jungle in prison you know violence is in front of you it's staring at you you just get on real life and adapt that it's one of the con one of the consequences as leading your normal life but now it can go off straight away and you're ready for that you're ready for that without walking around I was ready for that of just having a laugh but in a flickor instance I would turn to violence if I had to to defend myself or something like that what other way days have you changed as a person since you got released certainly more considerate against people there's a gray area in in in in life uh I now want to I don't want to exist I want to live life I definitely feel that we need to consider other options of other nations before we go attacking um there's a lot to be said about talking I think Obama was a great great president he had a nice way about him he's inviting he could talk to people I think a lot of other Governors Governors presidents around the world or uh Prime Ministers don't have that easygoing nature or or they're too strong in other areas if the world was more understanding and forgiving and been able to communic some people can communicate people really well but how hard is that for you to put into practice so since your release for example have you been in a situation where someone's got in your face they're never going to listen they don't want to listen so I've either got to B them or then get done for bad behavior I had a kid the other week give me a cutle of clumps like didn't know not bad about it I say that I got a bad knee so if I literally made a move my knee goes without me even and I'm on the penny and uh he was getting aggressive in my face what how did it start so I was I went to open a wine bar and believe me I've already had people say look Kevin I said this and leave it he bragging to me that he tacked a set of clippers off of a spur on a house Block in Bal Marsh and he told them he wanted 300 back for it I said he's listening to him talk all this time and I think he'd had some cocaine he's cheer me you quite a bit and I said to be honest you m I said this is [ __ ] talk I said I don't like this type of talk I said I wouldn't have with people like you in the prison I said said taxing people for their Clippers they're the only Clippers in the wing I said and he said well I said I don't want to talk to you mate I don't like it um he's gone away he's then come back and said well I got to apologize to you mate he's only about 9 and a half Stone wet with a camel skin Crum on and something like that I look at him thing let M I'd have hit you a little while ago now we're passed that you've been aggressive I'd B you and he's gone have I got to be have I got to apologize to again he's done it again and put his face forward [ __ ] off like get away from me like it's coming into my face face um run him away end up on the penny he got picked up and slung out give me a couple of clumps he get out then that type of thing you've got to watch and the days of really yone what you're threatening me you're being violent my answer to you is you're going to sleep that's the difference now you have to wait to be assaulted or almost going to be assaulted and defend yourself and then if you cause them damage you would go to prison for that because you've used excess excess fence to defend yourself I've had that done to me before since you got out in prison I said I used too much force to defend myself and I was put in the block and then set on the lay down for four weeks that was with my hands and uh with these people intoxicated on whatever and they in your face like that they start that stuff and then they're the first ones to snitch you out as well when it goes you know this little gentleman um he's on a Basher phone he say the register where he lives I just let him know that now cuz I was going to go and turn up and knock on his door and say you know that instant happened uh the other night and would you like to discuss that with me now what have you got to say about it being aggressive towards me and all stuff like that and then see what he had to say without causing him any violence of course but just to let him know the basion number he had came up as a basion number if it had been his home address I'd have been knocking on his door in a friendly gesture of course but he' have been very friendly in the sense H I want to talk to you about what happened the other night you can explain yourself and then then and then see what Happ and film it of course to show that someone's actions how can you insulate yourself from that is it impossible you just have to KN do events like open m bars well I went to a place in London it was it's a VIP and was given a guest table and that in there of a par of mine Ryan uh who actually owns Cambridge Country Club and the Dorman recognized me when come in and head Dorman and put a Dorman with me so I don't need a Dorman to look after me well I do because that is a prime example where the Dorman got no listen mate behave yourself and left it so you do need Dorman with you to look after you to stop other people's I've had people come up to me when I'm in Brig house is a place up in new Yorkshire tell me they collected a debt that day loves violence got hit overhead with a baseball back smashed them all around yet he said I love violence I blown all my Knuckles still I said it don't interest me mate I said I've seen that much of it it don't interest me I said I don't want to talk about it so having someone to look after you and steer clear of those uh type of conversations I've taken on board but it's almost like you're a magnet for those people because of your past yeah you are and I'll probably I have to I have to justify that with the conversations I have about the violence and people think I like it but I don't like violence I was just pretty good at it many years ago um I can still hold my hands up now to a degree but it's not something I canone and I I do prefer I'm always like come on we really got to like that you know I don't look for violence people say Kevin looks for it he goes out his yes pleas he no thank and he's quiet but I got a very fast temper Kevin you must have hours and hours and hours of stories and I really appreciate your cander today and I've just sat here absolutely mesmerized and I know there's going to be loads more stories coming out for the first time at Cambridge Country Club on February 23d why should people come to Cambridge on February 24d Kevin you going to have the likes of Kenny Collins there Matt leg just watch that movie the the uh the robbery I've never watched him because he's my friend and I know that the information on there is misinformation there's a lot of stuff that isn't reported on there that is actual factual and they have to report Kenny coming across Kenny because he drove past the hat and garden when he had to drive past that every day just for you lot who didn't know that and he wasn't caught by that car cuz that can't went registered his name it's registered someone else in Bristol but we'll let him say that that car took him back to Kenny but it never however there' be people there that uh the cars some of the cars from banged up you've got Nick Yaris who was on death row you've got Sophie wallers she's in the tribute band of of that sings around the world Fleetwood Mac they get asked all around the world and other people of that ilk I mean Mar he's coming he's an investigative journalist I'm sure there'll be people for him and against him but I'd like to talk to him there and many other people going to be an excellent night like Kenny Collins will be able to tell you how he became a burglar he came became a burglar because there was no rues on the buildings at the time of the war so you're climbing over and helping yourself the stuff you need when you're hungry so it' be nice to hear people's lifestyle not just about the crime they've committed how they've turned their lives around and and some some other podcasters criminologists and so on and so forth it's going to be an excellent night Q&A there's two restaurants there there's two big bars I'm going to have knes up after and shout out to Matt leg as well who's going to be done Matt leg and Peter Fury of course there have it right Peter is great company he's great to be interviewed isn't he so collectively please get your your backsides down there there's not many tickets they are going and most tickets sell out uh the last two weeks before but we're way over halfway now and there's plenty of VIPs coming so get down there ticket link is in the description box below this video if you're listening on the audio platforms Google Eventbrite Kevin Lane and guest and it'll come right up and we hope to see some of you guys there and I can't thank you enough brother absolutely brilliant give us a man yeah nailed it nailed it delivered yeah congratulations to sea with his baby oh thank you big big Ziggy big Ziggy it's great so you've got H was that for um bang on two hours was it really yeah never if you're looking for a gift my new book sit Downs with gangsters is available worldwide on Amazon we've interviewed over a thousand people now and we CED 10 of the hardest hitting stories to go in this book each chapter features the story of one of our podcast guests those stories are Shane Taylor knife Maniacs Redemption John Elite Mafia Hitman for the gambino crime family Joey Barnett 35 years in UK prison Ian blink macdonald6 million pound bank robber Chad Sandu Asian Smuggler in Spanish supermax John Lawson the hit team Commander David McMillan International Smugglers thae death row prison escape John Abott San Quentin prison shootouts and Escape Michael Frances Columbo crime family cappo portrayed in Good Fellas and Wildman English enforcer in Arizona Prison Link in description box on YouTube available worldwide on Amazon also my next book Untouchable Jimmy savl is getting published in December 2023 so check that out as well it will be available worldwide on Amazon thank you for listening cheers

Channel: Shaun Attwood

Views: 66,836

Keywords: Michael Franzese, true Geordie, London gangsters, unilad, ladbible, joe rogan, jre clips, Valuetainment, Sammy the bull, james English, gravano, vice, koncrete, LADbible TV, djvlad, @LADbible TV, Russell brand, larry lawton, VLAD, VLADTV, no jumper, gangsters, prison channel, after prison show, lockdown 23and1, Diary Of A CEO, andrew gold, piers morgan, gb news, moats, dodge woodall, yammy b tv, ricky killeen, royal family, the royal rogue, meghan markle, prince harry, royal tea

Id: EM2nDT4LqCs

Length: 126min 23sec (7583 seconds)

Published: Sun Feb 18 2024