How the 22 Wins - 9mm versus 22 Long Rifle

hi this is mark Laughlin with the ambidextrous channel has no intention of confirming what you already know to be true otherwise what use would be it but we're going to talk a little bit about caliber Wars not 9 millimeter versus 45 but nine millimeter versus 22 long-rifle okay yeah no contest right no contest really let's consider how they might be closer than you think let's look at for example my Hellcat with with a 111 round mag and a round in the chamber my Hellcat weighs loaded weighs 655 grams now the P 17 with if it has just one round the chamber chamber but otherwise is empty waste 340 grams now if you subtract the weight of the Hellcat loaded with 1111 +1 rounds and the P 17 with just one round the chamber we get a difference of 315 grams now it turns out that the weight of 1p 1716 round magazine weighs 79 grams so remember we have 315 grams left over from our difference between the Hellcat and P 17 so how many magazines are equal how many magazines of 22 on the P 17 are equal to the weight of the Hellcat with a total of 12 rounds so 315 divided by 79 gives us three point nine eight magazines that's let's just round that up I mean two four four magazines so four magazines is a total of sixty four rounds so a Hellcat with twelve nine millimeters weighs the same as the P 17 with 65 22 now that works out if you figure 65 divided by 12 we get five point four one rounds of 22 per one round of 9-millimeter okay that sounds pretty good definitely we have a round count advantage on the 22 but let's look at the total grains of the actual bullet this is a this one 9-millimeter round that is a 115 grain bullet this is a critical defense this is a CCI mini mag and has a 40 grain so let's say what's over comparing one 115 grain bullet to 5.4 40 grain bullets so that's 216 grains versus 115 grains that's kind of an interesting comparison so when we look at the fact that five point four rounds of 22 are available versus one round of 9-millimeter we get not quite double the actual lead going downrange okay let's look a little more terminal ballistics this think of the kinetic energy so five point four rounds of this which has 128 foot-pounds gives us a total of 681 foot-pounds of energy delivered versus this 115 grain 9-millimeter critical defense round is 332 foot-pounds so now we are actually at double the kinetic energy when we when we look at this as being five point four of these versus one of these now that's that's interesting enough but yeah you may say that this 9-millimeter it's one shot for a stop potentially well as I mentioned in the and this is kind of where I got into this I mentioned I quoted an article that mentioned and I'm gonna quote it again here because I think it's pretty pretty interesting felons hit with a 22 long rifle that's one 22 long-rifle we're in cast incapacitated by just one shot to the torso our head 60% of the time now primarily due to better shot placement compared to just 47% of the time for the 9 millimeter or 51% of the time 44 for the 45 ACP so don't underestimate a stopping power but then they mention a word of warning that 31% of the felons were not incapacitated no matter how many times they were hitting the torso with the 22 now of course head shots were another matter so anyway the failure rate of not incapacitating the aggressor is a little higher about twice as high on the 22 now I've got the data that's behind that claim and I'll include a link down in the description if you want to go check it out this is based on some data by Greg elephants on the 22 the average number of rounds to incapacitation is one point three eight the average number of rounds until incapacitation on the nine-millimeter were two point four five so it's taken almost almost twice as many nine millimeters to incapacitation hmm that's a little bit surprising it sounds all great sounds like okay we should all be switching to the 22 because clearly the nine-millimeter is not effective now the data miss perhaps skewed by the fact that police almost all police use nines 40's and 45s you're going to rarely ever see a police officer or anyone in law enforcement using the 22 long rifle and police have a little bit different row than civilians they cannot just they're not just trying to disengage they must subdue or actually even or potentially even kill an aggressor civilians which are perhaps more likely to be using a 22 they're probably more interested in just scaring off an aggressor or doing a covering retreat from an aggressor but then again we got to think that you know if you've seen my video only hits matter there's a big question mark at the end of that hits aren't the only thing that matter you've got to remember that no matter whether you fire a 22 at someone or a 9-millimeter at them and even if you completely miss them their physiological reaction to that is going to be the same pretty much regardless there's going to be crouched the heart rates going to go way up they're going to have a loss of muscle control motor control tunnel vision on you who they consider the threat auditory exclusion all these physiological factors that you're gonna put on them whether or not it's nine or or 22 and they're gonna be making a rush probably for cover now let's look at some other things of course one or another reason 22 maybe is more effective is that it's such light recoil that practical accuracy is easy with the 22 a little more recoil on the nine-millimeter especially with you if you're running one of them you know new super compact micro compact nines and then also there's they're louder try shooting both of these without your protection the 22 and the nine-millimeter now the 22 long rifle out of a pistol is going to be about 152 decibels the nine-millimeter is 160 which if you know how the logarithmic logarithmic scale of decibel systems work that's almost twice as loud to the human ear and I'll include a link down below to some information on that so less decibels of the 22 perhaps can help aid you as a gunfighter because you've already haven't as if you're in a self-defense situation you are also dealing with auditory exclusion so that's already a problem for you in your situation and adding the deafening effects of the muzzle blast of the nine-millimeter say over 22 is going to exacerbate that so maybe using the 22 long rifle instead improves your ability to hear things around you to communicate with your teammates whatever now another thing is is that you become proficient with your firearm you have to practice with it and which you're going to which of these are you gonna better practice more the 22 versus nine-millimeter the nine-millimeter is gonna cost you about six times more per round than the 22 say about 30 cents for the nine versus say five cents for easy calculation of the 22 so if you say you've got a budget let's see your budget for practicing is $60 a month that means if you have $60 a month you're gonna bet a practice with 200 rounds of 9-millimeter a month versus 1200 rounds of 22 a month now over a year that translates into 2400 rounds of 9-millimeter sounds pretty good or 14400 rounds of 22 now which do you think you're going to be more proficient with 22 or 9 now so we got to think is does the kinetic energy allegedly kinetic energy capacity of the single 9-millimeter round does it out perform say the single kinetic energy of the 22 round but a 22 round paired with improved marksmanship skills most people and I think myself included find that they can shoot the 22 faster and and be still be accurate than they can the 9 and still be accurate how many seconds does it take you to put five rounds of 9-millimeter onto the a zone of a target and then however however many seconds that is then let's do a test to see okay in that timeframe let's see how many 22s we can put on the same target I got a quote here you can fire 10 accurate shots from the semi-automatic 22 pistol or rifle and about the same time you can fire 5 or 6 shots from a centerfire handgun or rifle so they're saying you can fire almost double the number of shots of the 22 versus a centerfire now I'm not sure if it's quite that much but I'm certainly is going to be easier to fire this rapid and keep it on target than it is the 9 now the other thing is is if you have to shoot from awkward positions from behind cover you can't get like a locked wrist or anything and so that's like recalling pistols gonna manage or if you're holding up like a ballistic shield you know how to protect yourself and then having to reach around that and she from one side of the other in again and kind of awkward positions it helps to be a light recalling pistol now let's go back to what we talked about earlier the fact that in the courting of the data that Greg elf Ella Fritz found discovered he I mean he does a massive amount of research on this is that you know I mentions that there's a thirty one percent chance that this will not incapacitate the attacker versus I think it was like 13 percent for the nine-millimeter now that sounds maybe not as good but the thing is what they found is in in a clods clods lifetime study of defensive gun uses he has yet to find a single case where an armed citizen was killed by a criminal after the criminal had taken at least one twenty two round in the case of civilian defensive gun uses the criminal almost always flees after the first hit I have been uh m''d unable to find any gunfights that prove Claud wrong that's pretty powerful that adds credence to the for the civilian at least of the 22 now of course for law enforcement were they they're not just trying to you know stop an aggressor they're trying to apprehend the aggressor and so they they have to kind of step lean into and take and capture the aggressor or kill them whereas the civilians we're we're only concerned about stopping the attack or getting away and getting ourselves away from from the aggressor so it's kind of different roles and looking at it from that way the 22 is looking awfully promising now I'm gonna include a links down in the description about using the article using the 22 for self defense by Gregg Ella Fritz now you really need to check this out and then go check out Gregg's amazing resume this guy has credentials out the wazoo I don't think I've seen anyone anyone else on the planet that has the credentials that he has for from gun fighting knife fighting grappling you know Jitsu I believe I mean it comes to self-defense at gun fighting and he's a trainer he's gone to a lot of the big major training courses just just check out his resume you'll be blown away it's amazing I'll include a link of that to his resume down the in the description so this guy is some serious credentials way more than me I'm kind of sitting I'm kind of a you know I kind of started this channel based on you know being ambidextrous because of my experience in paintball but that's nothing compared to what this guy has as far as real world experience and training and he's also been a police officer since I think I think it was like 1995 so been in the business a long time let's look at some other things the for some users you know racking the slide is a whole thing and and you know the cycle is slide on nine-millimeter specialties Compact nines is there it takes a pretty pretty decent amount of force you're probably 15 or 20 pounds of effort to to rack the slide whereas the track to slide on this little 22 light kel-tec PA 17 well I can do that off the front sight with my little finger you know just rack the slide it's like super easy no strength required at all and then which is really nice now one of the advantages of that is if you end up with bloody hands you know if you've seen my video and I'll maybe I'll throw a link into the video the bloody hands video where I experiment with different pistols trying to operate to operate them with bloody hands and I found that something else is you just could not rack the slide with slick bloody hands now the advantage of the 22 is that it's so light that you could think it'd be really really slick and it's such a light pole it would be no problem racking the slide now the other thing would be you know there's some concern you know that people say that the nine centerfire are going to be more reliable less malfunctions than the twenty rimfire and okay let's say we give that credence and say that's true still because of the ease of racking the slide on the 22 dealing with malfunctions on the 22 is probably going to be faster and easier so if we try and do sing some failures let me just say I do a stovepipe drill and we have to clear it with a nine-millimeter versus a 22 it's just going to be a little bit easier and faster with the 22 now one other thing was that they've shown testing that says that the the nine-millimeter is more reliable and that can go like you know maybe twenty thousand rounds between you know failures malfunctions versus the say the 22 maybe goes 1,500 maybe 2000 rounds if it's if things are going well without malfunctions now the now that test I'm not sure about the actual details of that test but if you check I bet my bet is that the test is without cleaning from start to finish and I suspect that if you were to clean these pistols every say 200 rounds the rimfire would perform a little bit better on the reliability testing so that's another factor to think of you know you're not going to be like in this extended 20000 round gunfight so basically if you clean the 22 keep it clean I think we'll narrow the gap the reliability gap for malfunctions between the two now just as a side note just before doing this video shooting some of the b-roll footage I put another 600 rounds through the kel-tec p17 so that puts as my last video was shown you know putting us at 1050 so now we're at 1650 rounds with no malfunctions on the Cal Tech P 17 so it's proven pretty reliable but the same goes for my Hellcat again nope no malfunctions on it either I do run good ammo through boast I'm running CCI through the 22 and while this is my carry load I run either sig elite nine-millimeter or CCI blazer on the Hellcat plus all my firearms are lubed with sentry solutions tough glide now you'll get some people to say I would not trust my life to X whatever you know and that almost always when people say that they're covering up full context or covering up opportunity cost you know you see the guys that are talking about yeah won't have a carrier gun that's not you know thousand dollars a Kimber or whatever you know and but yet they're driving around on a pickup with bald tires you know it's it's no you gotta maintain full context you've got when you dedicate some resources to making a pistol older reliable those are resources RB take taking away from some other areas of your life then maybe are more important like maybe oh you got a child maybe you should have a little bit better child carrier you know child seat for to keep your car children safe in the car things like that and another thing for more of us die of heart attacks than from murder how many you I mean you guys have Aedes in your house or in your vehicle I don't either let's just be honest that a lot of this I wouldn't trust my life to X is mostly just a rationalization that we do so we can buy cool [ __ ] yeah hey I'd do that too but like I said I don't have an AED and I got lots of guns yes doesn't make sense but that's what we do and then how many gun owners that say they won't trust their life to X but do little or nothing to maintain their own physical fitness there's a lot of people that do that now another thing about the 22 is if say you do have to do some shoot and shoot somebody in self defense in a court of law afterwards I mean it's it's not gonna make probably make a big difference but a nine-millimeter is gonna be like you know it just maybe weighs a little bit more against you then maybe if you were Karen 22 just kind of made the 22 like shows that I really don't want to hurt anybody you know that kind of thing now another thing is that for for those of you are running suppressors now typically your centerfire cartridges are going to be running the Browning design where you get the barrel that locks tilts and rotates down and stuff so the barrel is having to move and an order for this the gun to cycle reliably it's got a bit of a handle that suppress around there and that barrel moving around and that extra weight affecting things so a suppressor may affect your reliability on your centerfire pistols this is me speculating I'm just making [ __ ] up but but some of the 22s like like the kel-tec p17 they had a fixed barrel that are blowback those really shouldn't have that issue reliability issues in that regard now they may have there's going to be some more back pressure so maybe like on the P 17 some more blast coming out from the ejection port gases coming out of it then if you didn't have the suppressor on there but but nonetheless I think the reliability for suppressed 22 is going to be pretty good how about here the life of your firearms now how long does it take a 22 barrel to wear out I don't know it's probably hundreds of thousands of rounds maybe half a million now I'm nine yeah you know maybe you know thirty forty thousand rounds so longer barrel life I mean it's not a big deal but something to factor into this whole equation now let's look at let's get a little more off the deep end and look at four we're setting up our Z day stash and you're the survivalist getting ready for Z day the World War three you know the EMP or whatever and the twenty two survivalist he buys a hundred thousand rounds of 22 he gets five twenty two pistols in five twenty two rifles and he spends about six thousand five hundred dollars and he's got a hundred thousand rounds of twenty-two now to equal the number of rounds with say a nine-millimeter the nine-millimeter survivalist if he buys a hundred thousand rounds and gets five nine-millimeter pistols and five nine-millimeter carbines the estimated cost will be about thirty thousand dollars that's not insignificant difference and then the other thing is if you're thinking about Z day we should look at what the some of the lessons that we can learn from Aleppo and Syria now the sniper war that's been going on in the urban environments there now if you want to imagine a worst-case scenario for American cities you know post the cove in nineteen and the the riots and all that if America goes the Aleppo direction well there's some lessons to learn from that now the Syrian Syrian sniper engagements are typically 50 to 200 yards now uh most of them are using some pretty ghetto 7.62 by 30 cartridges and rifles but really there's no reason at those ranges especially if say 50 to 125 yards not to use the 22 now why one is that it's quieter be much more difficult to detect the position where the shot your shot came from so look the less noise of the 22 less maybe a little bit less sonic crack it's going to be beneficial now the Israeli Defense Forces we're using 22 for a while for riot control and what they found was that they had to give it up because they found that actually the 22 was far more lethal than they thought now the other thing is if you needed to do if you're in Syria and you needed to do an assassination and you and say you're going into someone's house and just behold sneaking into the bedroom to assassinate someone this is going to be less likely to rouse the neighbors not saying that that's what we're going to need to do but if you're thinking into the world kind of stuff maybe the 22 now another thing is that if you're the sniper and you need to move around you can carry a thousand rounds of this with ease try carrying a thousand rounds of 7.62 by 39 be a little bit of a load kind of similar to the whole lessons we learned from Aleppo in Syria is the if you're in the end of the world situation or it's borderline and you're approaching the end of the world situation are still some rule of law but it's you needing some food to survive and you need to go out do some hunting maybe some poaching in the say in the city park or something you're gonna be able to do that with the 22 and be less likely to be noticed than you are with a centerfire cartridge and with the 22 could even use say CB caps take squirrel and it'd be like basically equivalent of an air rifle so you know light and compact carbine like it take down 10 22 or one of the bullpup 22 conversion kits or the Henry survival and you have quite a pretty neat little package for hunting poaching you know feeding your family and maybe even simple sniping urban combat warfare that kind of thing of course yeah the real combat rifle is going to be better in some situations but sometimes maybe not attracting so much attention is a good thing I mean just to kind of illustrate how much easy your the 22 is to use then say a center fired five five six or seven six to is if you go to get you earn your rifleman patch at a project Appleseed mark rifle marksmanship clinic you'll find that by using say a Ruger 10/22 it is significantly easier to earn the score with a 22 now part of that is one the you know less recoil part of it is you you're over a two-day period you're like up and down up and down and kept lifting and moving this rifle about you know two days in a row so there's a lot of physical exertion of manhandling the your your rifle and so a light or rifle makes things easier as well and then it's also just less tiring the fact that it's not quite as loud even though you're wearing ear protection of five five six or seven six to is going to be a lot louder and that is just a little bit wearing mentally whereas 22 is is not nearly so tiring to shoot so anyway don't discount the 22 this is something I never thought I would actually be kind of arguing for I'm not really I'm not really sure on this yet and I hope everyone else won't make me do some experiments and report back share your own videos on this thing and that's you know explore the idea make sure you think of everything all the factors not just the fact that this has a heavier bullet and as a may a mount probably about the same velocity as most of these but has more kinetic energy versus this we got to think of all the actors training weight reliability it's just a lot that goes into this not just this makes a bigger hole than people than this if this is stopping attackers with a 67 percent reliability versus this is 47 percent given the other advantages of this you know I'm not ready to do it yet I'm still carrying the hellcat nine-millimeter but getting to the point where I'm like maybe I should carry this instead maybe I should carry the piece 17 I bought it to be a practice you know pistol to practice to practice cheaply and then hopefully some of that skill would translate over to my 9 but maybe I really should just practice what the 22 and just carry the freaking 22 it's Marc Laughlin with the ambidextrous I do these like share and subscribe thanks for watching

Channel: AmbGun

Views: 31,372

Rating: 4.772109 out of 5

Keywords: rounds per weight, Keltec P17, 9mm vs 22, 22 long rifle, p17, springfield armory hellcat, hellcat, kinetic energy, 9mm, pistol training

Id: kR3THJW5smQ

Length: 29min 40sec (1780 seconds)

Published: Sun Jul 05 2020