>>> FEW FALL-OUT ON THE CRIMINAL >>> FEW FALL-OUT ON THE CRIMINAL PROBE OF RUDY GIULIANI AFTER THE FEDS RAIDED HIS OFFICE. GIULIANI HAS BEEN TAKING RISKS. HE’S TALKING ON HIS RADIO SHOW EVERY DAY THIS WEEK. HIS LAWYER REPORTEDLY OFFERING TO BRING HIM IN FOR QUESTIONING TWO MONTHS AGO. THAT’S AN INTERESTING DETAIL. BLOOMBERG REPORTS THE OFFER WAS CONTINGENT ON PROSECUTORS MAKING CLEAR WHAT SUBJECTS, WHAT TOPICS THEY WOULD BRING UP. AND THE FEDERAL PROSECUTORS WHO REALLY HOLD ALL THE CARDS IN THIS SITUATION SAID NO THANK YOU. GIULIANI’S LAWYER E-MAILS, QUOTE, WHY ARE YOU DOING EVERYTHING THE HARD WAY? THIS GIVES US SOME GLIMPSE INTO WHAT GIULIANI MIGHT HAVE SEEN COMING. IT WAS BIG NEWS WHEN YOU HAD THE RAID, BUT HIS LAWYERS HAD REASON TO BELIEVE THERE WAS SOMETHING COMING. DOMINION VOTING SYSTEMS IS ASKING A JUDGE TO GO FORWARD WITH THE DEFAMATION SUIT AGAINST GIULIANI. DOMINION SAYS GIULIANI IS IGNORING EVIDENCE ABOUT JUST HOW MUCH FINANCIAL HARM HE CAUSED THE COMPANY, DESTROYING THE RESALE VALUE, FORCING DOMINION TO SPEND OVER HALF A MILLION DOLLARS ON SECURITY FOR EMPLOYEES, ALL A PART OF THAT PUSH TO OVER TURN THE ELECTION. JOINING ME NOW IS A FORMER SDNY PROSECUTOR. THANKS FOR COMING BACK. >> THANKS, ARI. GREAT TO BE HERE. >> LET’S GO PIECE BY PIECE. IN THE NEGOTIATIONS, WHAT DOES IT MEAN WHEN GIULIANI’S SIDE SAYS, HE WILL COME IN, BUT HE WANTS A TOPIC OUTLINE. WHAT DOES IT TELL YOU WHEN SDNY FELT NO NEED TO GRANT THAT? >> YOU KNOW, I HEARD YOU WROTE GIULIANI’S LAWYER ASKING THE PROSECUTORS WHY THEY ARE DOING IT THE HARD WAY. GIULIANI KNOWS AT SOME LEVEL HE HAS AT LEAST SOME DISTANT MEMORY THAT THERE IS NO EASY WAY HERE. THERE IS ONLY A HARD WAY. AS YOU SAID, ARI, HE DOESN’T HOLD THE CARDS ANYMORE. THIS IS AN UNEVEN, UNBALANCED POWER DYNAMIC, AND HE DOESN’T GET TO SAY WHAT HE WANTS TO TALK ABOUT AND WHAT HE DOESN’T WANT TO TALK ABOUT. IT IS JUST NOT HOW THIS WORKS. SO THERE HAS BEEN A LOT OF DISCUSSION. WILL GIULIANI COOPERATE? HE WILL NOT GET TO THERE IF HE CAN’T GO IN THE FRONT DOOR OF 1 SAINT ANDREW’S PLAZA WHERE HE USED TO PRESIDE AND GIVE A FULL ACCOUNT OF EVERY UNLAWFUL OR SHAMEFUL THING, EVERYTHING HE’S EVER DONE, YOU KNOW, FROM THE DAWN OF TIME UNTIL TODAY. AND, SO, IT REALLY IS A FULL AND COMPLETE NO HOLDS BAR DISCLOSURE THAT IS REQUIRED IN ORDER FOR HIM TO GIVE HIS ACCOUNT AND TO EVEN BEGIN TO EXPLORE THE POSSIBILITY OF COOPERATION. SO HE SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN SURPRISED BY THIS REACTION FROM THE PROSECUTORS. >> YEAH. AND WHEN HE’S ALSO HAD THIS DISTANCE WITH DONALD TRUMP, I WAS CURIOUS AS TO YOUR VIEW OF HOW SDNY WOULD LOOK AT THIS BECAUSE WE TALKED ABOUT THE WHOLE IDEA OF WAS HE HIS LAWYER OR NOT? AND HE KIND OF WAS, BUT THEN HE WASN’T PAID. THEN TRUMP PUBLICALLY THREW HIM UNDER THE BUS AND SAID I DIDN’T DIRECT HIM TO DO THAT. THAT’S TRICKY BECAUSE DONALD TRUMP LIES CONSTANTLY. THERE ARE MANY DAYS WHERE HE LIES MORE THAN HE TELLS THE TRUTH. THE FACT THAT HE SAID THAT DOESN’T MEAN IT’S TRUE. I WANT TO BE CLEAR. BUT IT COULD BE WORSE FOR GIULIANI. GIULIANI’S ADMISSION THAT HE WAS NOT CONDUCTING FOREIGN POLICY BUT HELPING TRUMP PERSONALLY IS EXACTLY WHAT MIGHT MAKE THIS SORT OF SCHEME PROSECUTABLE. IS THAT -- IS THAT TRUE IN YOUR VIEW? DOES SDNY CARE ABOUT THAT LEVEL OF DISTINCTION? IF THEY HIM ON MORE THAN ONE LEVEL KIND OF THING, THAT’S MORE THAN ONE ISSUE. >> I THINK THAT’S A HIGH LEVEL ISSUE. AS YOU AND JOYCE VANCE SAID EARLIER ON THE PROGRAM, A CLIENT WHO IS FACING CRIMINAL PROSECUTION WOULD BE WELL ADVISED TO KEEP THEIR MOUTH SHUT. HERE GIULIANI AND TRUMP, OF COURSE, ARE EITHER ILL-ADVISED OR SIMPLY TAKE THEIR OWN COUNSEL AND HAVE BEEN SPEAKING FOR YEARS. SO GIULIANI HAS PROBABLY ESTABLISHED OR HAS ESTABLISHED SEVERAL ELEMENTS OF EVENTS AS WE HAVE DISCUSSED. AND SOME OF THESE STATEMENTS, SURE, THEY HAVE BEEN ALL OVER THE PLACE. IS HE REPRESENTING TRUMP OR NOT? THAT’S NOT A FULL QUESTION AT ALL. HE MAY HAVE BEEN REPRESENTING TRUMP. BUT WAS HE ALSO REPRESENTING FOREIGN INTERESTS? THEY CAN BOTH BE TRUE. AND IF THEY ARE, HE WILL BE GUILTY OF A FARA VIOLATION. >> YEAH. YOU’RE TALKING ABOUT FOREIGN LOBBYING. >> CORRECT, YES. THANK YOU. >> AND BRIEFLY, I’M ALMOST -- NO, I GET IT. I’M ALMOST OUT OF TIME. BUT YOU WORKED IN SDNY. WOULD THEY GO THIS HARD AT A RANDOM, NON-FAMOUS, NON-TRUMP LINKED PERSON IF IT WAS ALL OVER JUST THAT FOREIGN LOBBYING VIOLATION? >> I SUSPECT THERE IS MORE GOING ON. THIS IS NOT JUST A PAPERWORK FENCE AS SOME HAVE ARGUED. IT GOES WELL BEYOND THAT. BUT AS YOU ELUDED TO, IF HE WAS REPRESENTING TRUMP, THAT IS A PROBLEM. IF HE WASN’T REPRESENTING TRUMP, IT COULD BE A PROBLEM. SO I THINK EVERY WHICH WAY HE TURNS, THERE COULD BE LEGAL PERIL. BUT I DO THINK THERE MAY BE MORE AT STAKE THAN JUST A TECHNICAL FARA VIOLATION. >> THAT’S WHAT I’M WONDERING. I HAVE THE EASY PART, WHICH IS JUST ASKING THE QUESTIONS. BUT THE QUESTION I ASK IS THIS ALL OVER FOREIGN LOBBYING, WHICH IS NOT NOTHING, BUT ARE THEY GOING THIS HARD WITH THE SEARCHES FOR THIS LONG BECAUSE
