Escaping Mormonism: Interview w/ex-Mormon Missionary, Joseph Warren (Adam's Road Ministry)

hey what's up everybody welcome back to c4c apologetics i am i'm super stoked if you've seen these interviews you know pretty regularly i'd be like hey i'm excited hey i'm you know honored blah blah blah but today i'm like really stoked because we got uh uh joseph warren here from adams road ministry matter of fact on if you watched the interview with dr lynn wilder who was the ex-byu professor who came out of mormonism one of the questions out there was from an individual and yes i do read all the comments even the ones where they ridicule mock the yell they curse things like that but this one i just i couldn't leave alone it said this video talking about the dr wilder video really doesn't paint a clear picture as a former missionary if you want to know the truth about the church of jesus christ of latter-day saints ask somebody who actually knows what they're talking about the picture painted here isn't clear well folks today's guest is somebody that truly knows what goes on on the missions trip and uh joseph i'm just so excited to have you here because we can we can answer this question this comet this critique as well as hearing your testimony and how god has pulled you out into the mormon church so i thank you so much for being with us today man yeah thanks daniel so is there anything you want to just let our viewers know up front anything about who you are your background family things like that before we jump into the questions um i mean i'm guessing probably a lot of it will come out in the questions and stuff but i guess i would want to just maybe start out just by saying like anybody that's watching this or listening to this just understand that anything that i'm saying or daniel is saying like it's because we love we love you and so if you're an lds if you're a member of the church of jesus christ of latter-day saints and you're listening just please i hope you that you feel like the genuine and sincere love that i have for you because you like the ldas people were my people and so i and i'll explain like how that was my background and how i have a heart for for you so amen amen never want to neglect the fact that this is all done in love but love does carry truth and i'm very excited to get into your testimony so i i got about 32 questions but i had to narrow it down to about 10 or 12 of them well good like i said you could talk as long or as little as you'd like to do but right off the bat all right so could you tell me and i'm going to read the questions verbatim so that the time stamps and the description match up with what i'm saying but can you explain what happens in an ods church service each week is there structure amongst all lds churches as to their teaching and their liturgy and things like that what happens yeah okay so i think because of covet i think this might be different now but so when i was uh in the lds church um so it's a three-hour block and basically it's broken up into one hour sections and uh first one and then there's kind of like some variations of in what order but basically you're going to go to what's called the sacrament meeting which is like the entire congregation meet together and grouped in families and stuff and this is when like the leader of the mormon church in of that congregation is called the bishop and he will kind of open up the meeting he'll have some hymns which um they're not allowed to have like guitar or drums or anything like that you can have uh so they have piano and organ typically that's what their hymns are led and so really very traditional type of service and then they'll open it up for um what they call talks and it's where they have assigned a different like member of the congregation to uh speak on a certain topic and they have like i don't know 10 15 minutes something like that so uh so basically rather than like in a christian church you're gonna expect to see like like the pastor or one of the pastors to come up and and share like a sermon type thing but that's not how um it is in the lds church so so at any different given sunday somebody else is going to be speaking of the congregation so it's like two or three sometimes four maybe talks and um and then they do it's called sacrament meeting because then they take communion for them communion is leaven bread and water and then they pass that um they have like the youth pass that to the congregation and then some more songs and that's pretty much it and then you break off into like men's like men's group and women's group and then also sunday school which is typically that's pretty much like uh in a christian church sunday school um just divided in different ages and stuff so so that's every every sunday um those three hours on top of that you have tons of meetings and stuff depending on what your role in the in the congregations now when you mention the talks that just certain people give instead of the preacher are they like tailored to a specific topic or do they just talk about whatever they want to talk about is it more experiential testimony stuff um it depends um um every time that i got asked to give a talk i was given a topic but they they really encourage you to make it personal and give like personal any kind of like stories or anything like type of thing and definitely your testimony so you would end you would usually end your like you would you'd share a certain amount of time on whatever that topic was and then pretty much end it with your testimony um to make it a personal thing so the testimony is pretty important within no ds church is that correct definitely yeah okay yeah so then oh sorry i know what i just say the only difference is the first sunday of every month they call fasted testimony meeting where um it's the same exact meeting except instead of those different talks then they allow anyone in the congregation to come up and to share their testimony like you were just saying like testimony is really important that's when like the entire meeting the entire hour block is used for uh for sharing testimony as far as the sunday school lessons are concerned you said it was pretty similar to just the normal church if you will are those like leaders in the ods church that actually give those is that centered around a a particular teaching guide or what what's that yeah uh definitely a teaching guide and and uh and you asked if it was the leadership so one huge thing about the lds church the structure is that they call their individual members um they give them certain callings in the church to uh to operate so somebody just from the congregation is going to be teaching that class so the way that they keep on tabs of what's being taught is they have a manual and whatever sunday it is whatever lesson plan they're supposed to follow if you went to any congregation of the mormon church anywhere in the world that day it would be the same lesson taught and all of that is from the top down that's what i was wondering because from my studying jehovah witnesses are very similar that no matter which kingdom hall you were to go to or which ward you were go to you'll find the very similar teachings on the same days if you will so i was curious if it's the same way within the lds church so now you you went on a missions trip before right i did so could you explain a little bit first what is the purpose of an lds missions trip and then how does one get the the ability to go is somebody recommended nominated do you just request it how does all that work okay yeah so uh so when when i went um and so i served my mission um in 2004 through 2006 and since changed but when i went it was when you turn 19. if you're a male and you turn 19 it's expected for you to go because in the lds church the and by the way those that the lds viewers i'm sorry like i know the big thing about like you want to say the church of jesus christ of latter-day saints but just for brevity we're going to say lds or mormon but not in the derogatory like yeah we don't mean anything by it but just as a clarification so so that that's a good point i didn't i didn't know that so do sometimes they take it derogatory if you don't say the church of jesus christ of latter-day saints instead of the audio church okay well uh in just recent yeah just recently the uh the the prophet of the lds church said that basically um you can you can call it the full name or you can call it the church or you can call it the lord's church but um so we're just and so we're just going to call it like daniel and i are just going to call it the lds or mormon church but but please just we don't need any like you know offense by it so thank you for clarifying that bringing that up because i honestly didn't know that so i don't want to offend them right off the bat so thank you for bringing that up yeah it's just they they just like that respect so all right so okay so um 19 years old you said when they got selected yeah so that's when i went but now they've changed it to 18 years old so um yeah but so basically uh when you turn 19 if you're a male then you uh you get interviewed to see if you are matching the worthiness standards because there's high high standards of worthiness for anything that that deals with uh with any type of calling in the lds church so to go on a mission you have to have this like uh this status of of worthiness and that's that's found out by different questions that are asked about your personal life and about you following the commandments of the lds church and stuff like that so if you pass that then you you submit your papers and basically just like you just say like okay i want to serve a mission and then you don't know where you're going to go and you don't get a pic they do ask you questions about like if you speak another language or if you prefer to stay in the states or if you want to go abroad but ultimately it's the decision of the lds prophet and his 12 apostles and they and they they determine where you go and then you get your you get your papers and then and then you go and the purpose of it is for evangelism because you're basically giving up two years of your life uh to focus the entire those two years like you don't have hardly any personal time and um it's very grueling and you wake up at 6 30 and you work all the way until i believe i think 9 9 or 9 30 is your is lights out i can't remember wow exactly yeah and so you're working um like oh man just like at least 12 hours a day yeah um every day and so and your whole purpose is to bring people into the lds church because i believed it was the only true church so i poured my whole entire heart into it yeah so 12 plus hours every day yeah now is it true hello that's my wife so is it true that uh like i've met some mormons on their missions trips that they couldn't either a drive they couldn't drink coffee can't drink tea very restrictive in a sense like that yeah yeah they it just it really depends on your mission and everything so i went to orlando florida so uh so here we were typically on like the bikes for the most of the time but but some areas were really large so we had a car but you there were a lot of restrictions but you're in you're in a church-owned car you're staying in the church-owned apartment and um and then i mean it's a life there's a whole lifestyle of that two years so i'll try to like kind of touch on what's important about that but you're constantly being moved to different locations every six weeks you could be moved to a different location like a city you mean or yeah yeah like the orlando mission was our mission but we're covering like um multiple cities and and all the areas around orlando and stuff all the way um all of central florida basically so so for six weeks you could be in one city and then suddenly move to the entire other side of the coast and um wow and yeah and so it was really difficult because you start getting attached to uh like your companion like you're always with somebody else another missionary that's why you always see them by in twos you'll be probably seeing that two threes sometimes um they have to be within eyesight and earshot of each other at all times um in that except for in the bathroom so that's the only exception so very restricted what's the purpose of that being within eyesight just keeping each other accountable yeah i definitely think that and also safety and stuff um like we had rules where like we weren't really supposed to touch children and i think part of that is so that somebody can't accuse you of like touching a child inappropriately or something like that and then yeah and then getting lawsuits i think i mean definitely safety accountability and also just i mean it was just control and honestly like to keep that control over you um was helpful to keep you focused on what you what your purpose was so so like uh like for instance weren't allowed to like touch the opposite sex except for like a handshake so um that really helps protect you from exactly like the accountability thing yeah so if you guys can just anyone listening you can imagine being with somebody that you don't choose for uh and all day basically um and you have to sleep in the same room as well so like you always like are with them never can get a break it was a good preparation for marriage for sure of course that would be more like an arranged marriage like when you don't get to choose the person right but there was really good advantages of like i learned a lot from my mission and um and uh so let's see then you're like yeah you're just out on the street you're knocking on doors you're being rejected almost all the time oh really yeah very few people were like kind to us um and and so by the way just to the listeners i really just this is a strong thing i just encourage you to be loving and compassionate when you see the mormon missionaries or jehovah's witnesses like like understand the huge sacrifice they're homesick they're lonely they're depressed and i'm speaking in my own experience i went through those things and it was so awesome when somebody showed me even just a small amount of love even like a drink of water sometimes like those spanish people that we went to their house and they would actually like cook us food and it was just so cool like we're strangers and just their culture is so awesome that they were like well we don't want to listen to what you say but we'll cook you a steak or something okay sure so that was just really cool and i i mean all these years later i remember that even though they didn't want to hear the message so um but yeah your entire purpose is to bring people into the lds church and um those that are already lds you're trying to encourage them and help them to stay strong if they become inactive in the church you're trying to reactivate them and of course they're baptized in converts yeah now one thing i don't know if i'm just assuming this or not but i know what kovid i i think a lot of ods missionaries are doing things through like facebook and social media things like that so i was uh somehow an lds member on a missions trip accidentally sent me a friend request and i was like oh okay let's let's let's pray about this and uh so his name will remain nameless but we were doing some good talks and it seemed like i was asking him questions that he really didn't have answers to and he had made him mention that he was talking to going to talk to his uh like missions leader or something like that do you what what is that um yeah he's probably referring to his mission president so okay yeah so there's um there's an elderly couple that will be assigned to a particular mission and they're over they're in charge of all those missionaries there and so uh i mean i'm trying to think of how how many missionaries they're enjoying i mean at least 100 maybe more wow um that they're responsible for and that they kind of um govern and basically they're the ones the mission president the one that decides basically where the missionaries are serving within their mission so so i wonder if that for certain things i wonder if it would make sense because it got to a point to where communication was just cut off it was like i was blacklisted yeah is that just me assuming things or have you known that to be the case when there are questions legitimate questions being asked that makes an individual question it that the the uh what do you call it the missions president just pretty much cuts off communication with that individual is that a legit thing or am i assuming that it's a real thing uh so when i was a missionary basically like you have your people that you call investigators the ones that are investigating the lds church and you're trying to to help them and get them in and give them like certain amounts of um uh man what did we call them um of uh let's see like like uh like we played we'd say like uh you need to read this chapter of the book of mormon this week and if they didn't then they then they were progressing toward becoming an lds member and therefore we had to make the difficult call to cut them off and um stop wasting our basically wasting our time with them because they weren't ready yet not not that it was a waste to be with them but it was a waste of our time because we're looking for those who are ready to accept them against church so when somebody if they encounter a christian and they start asking questions that cause them to start questioning their faith that would look as an immediate threat and they would either be moved or or be told like just just stop talking to them so that is a legit thing then it is yeah so we had to blacklist certain people and then basically when you get moved to a different area and you come into a new area there's uh there's a book that has all the information of all the people that missionaries in the area have taught before because basically you're coming in with a like totally new and then you have to continue where they left off and so in the book it'll say okay this person they were taught all these lessons and then they were blacklisted so you give them a couple weeks and then you might try contacting them again and see if they're wanting to uh join them in the church or not so blacklisting could either mean that they were confrontational or it could even mean that they just weren't interested in progressing toward joining the lds church and instead we're yeah causing loss of faith and stuff like that yeah i know years back there's a couple uh lds missionaries again names will remain nameless but uh they were able to come over for like three saturdays in a row and we just swapped questions just swapped ideas i got the i learned a lot as far as you got to find out the background of an ods missionary first because they come from different walks of life one grew up in the lds church they're like sixth generation mormon another one just came into it like a couple years back or whatever and so we're able to have some really great you know just discussions if you will but then all of a sudden they wouldn't return my text they wouldn't call me they wouldn't stop by the house and so i and it's happened pretty frequently with some of the people that i've been talking to so i was very curious about that yeah well and and that happens a lot and hopefully you're encouraged just to know that i mean god's word doesn't return void and also like paul says that our job is to plant water seeds god gives the growth and you know in in my story i mean um i didn't receive christ until after my mission was done but throughout those two years there were a lot of christians that planted seeds in my heart and yet even though god was working in me like i still outwardly i still defended the alvin's church and um was afraid to let that go and so from outward from the outward perspective they would probably be like oh man i don't think i planted a seed there and yet they did it you know so i hope that that's encouragement to you and to others that are listening that you know that like the word god is powerful it's sharper than a two-edged sword and even if they don't believe that it's sharp it is and it is cutting them and god's word will do is you know we'll be powerful amen i i i love greg coco and what he has to say and the fact of gardeners and harvesters and the fact that greg cockle uh best advice for me was you just want to put stones in people's shoes yeah leave them with something to chew on that they can't get rid of until they actually address it and so yeah thanks for the word of encouragement so all right so that's a good analogy yeah greg coco he's he's awesome like that his book tactics we interviewed him uh yeah while while on your missions trip yeah did you convert any now some of these questions were questions that when i was like hey i'm about to get this guy what you want me to ask and they're like oh you got to ask him this so this is a a big question that came up okay now there there's a few different parts to it so if you want me to break it down that's fine let me know sure while on your mission trip did you convert anyone to mormonism if so what religious background did they typically have and what is the typical success of converting one during a missions trip so three questions did you convert anybody if so what religious background did they have and what's the typical success rate okay yeah those are great questions and i would say that it totally varies depending on what mission it is the area and everything so exciting for me in orlando it's a melting pot of cultures so there's so many like different so uh so the first question okay so did i convert anybody to mormons yes um i didn't really i stopped counting because i i got to a point where i i i didn't want to convert people to mormonism but i wanted to convert people to christ more and all right so i kind of just stopped um so i really don't know what my count was even though that's a big thing when you get that off your mission and then you're like like you know kind of not really bragging but just kind of like with your with your buddies like hey how many did you convert yeah you know yeah exactly so uh um and i want to touch back on that of of how i've dealt with and contacted those people since then um that's excellent yes please do okay so i'll hit that one later a little bit later but um okay what religious background they typically have um there were a lot that were christian uh but or said that they were christian but um i can see now they didn't know the bible and so they were kind of more cultural christian i would say um but uh i think like i guess the majority of the ones i converted were probably just nothing they just uh or i didn't know or i don't really know what they were but as soon as they tasted what i was offering in mormonism they were very hooked and and then left whatever they had and then the last one the typical success um um and that really just depends on where you are but uh because like south america is like they get like hundreds of converts but um but no retention so they don't really stay in mormonism but they'll they'll just get the number for it uh but yeah and where i was um i would say it was it was pretty good like like pretty good harvest for the lds church we converted quite a bit of people as a mission um for the two years that i was there right wow okay so yeah so there are a lot of people joining the la church but i think a lot has changed now i mean like this is i mean this was in early 2000s a lot has changed now where uh there's a lot of people leaving a lot more people are leaving um the lds church but unfortunately they're leaving for atheism and agnostic and they are losing faith in everything so so i i think i'm going to be asking you that question oh are you okay i i don't know because as far as like those leaving the ods church and well let's talk about it now real quick uh why are they leaving the ods church well a lot of people are leaving because the lds services has come out with um and come out clean with the polygamy and joseph smith um they have like that what is it ces letters or something i i haven't read them but i know that it's the it's them basically saying like exposing stuff that joseph smith did um polygamy and mostly and uh and other stuff and things that for a long time they had denied and so basically just like okay yes this did happen but it doesn't stop us from still believing that he was a prophet so that's how they're trying to counter it but that's shocking news for when those when those things came out online it it just threw so many people through a loop that revered joseph's meant highly and they didn't know what to do about it so a lot of people are just leaving because of that because of the internet and and being able to research like the actual church history and stuff like that and unfortunately and like i said most of them are becoming agnostic and atheist because the problem is in the last church you're taught not to trust the bible very much like it is your can it's part of your canon you accept it as part of your scripture but it's with the caveat that it wasn't translated correctly and you're never told what is and what isn't translated correctly so you kind of read the bible with just kind of some doubt like a grain of salt yeah you don't really just fully invest in it like you do with the book of mormon as a lds person so when you lose faith in the structure of the lds church and um the leadership and stuff like that what do you have left you basically you don't trust the bible um and you've been taught as an lds person you've been taught that if one part is false then all of it's false and so when everything crumbles you have nothing left and it's just and you're hurt and you're and you're like um from being deceived you're like it's it's like the death of a loved one you go through all the grief and the depression and all that stuff and it's a very difficult process to go through and and then are you going to open yourself up and and trust in god again it's just very difficult so so what what we what adam's road do what our ministry does we try to focus on the bible and try to get an lds person to just read the new testament if they can find if they can see what the what the new testament offers and see what jesus is offering them then we know that that will lead them out of the lds church because when you when you have jesus you have everything you need therefore you don't need anything else and then you realize i don't need this church anymore i don't need to go to the temple and i don't need a prophet because jesus is all those things therefore that's all i need so so then they leave and they leave because they have a relationship with christ and and so that's that's what our goal is to try to do is to help people um go through that process we're not trying to make people leave mormonism we're trying to get people to find jesus and then let whatever happens happen and that success rate has been very uh very powerful and huge because like i said before the word of god is powerful and it speaks to everyone and it will affect everyone's heart and so um so anyone that's listening that is hearing uh this podcast um a challenge that we give everyone is to read the bible as a child and we really encourage you that if you've gotten this far on the podcast and if there's one thing to take away from it's that it's just to go into the bible and and to just trust it as if you were a little child reading it for the first time and it will change your life amen amen that's actually a uh a great segue into the next question oh good you set that up like you were on a t-ball or something how did you mr joseph warren find the truth of the gospel and receive christ as your savior what led to your conversion to christianity yeah okay so this is going to touch on micah's story um which i know you're going to have him on your podcast at some point so uh because micah micah wilder he was a mormon missionary in orlando and so right before i met him he had had a baptist minister he had um like he had a run down with him and was challenged to do exactly what i just asked you guys to do read the bible like a child and when he did that that caused him to um become a christian he became a born-again christian while he was a missionary but that was at the end of his mission i met him at the very beginning of mine and through the whole two-year process of my mission he and i we met right at the beginning of my mission and we became like best friends and i just stuck by him like glue and he taught me things that he was learning and encouraged me to read it myself and so the way that i came to know jesus was through the power of the word of god as i read it myself as my friend had encouraged me and invited me to read it and to approach it like a child it was difficult at first because like we're reading the king james version bible and uh so it's old english and so it's hard to understand already yeah just because i don't speak val and v and whatever uh i don't speak us now in this way and but uh but also i had to set aside all the the what i had been taught that it wasn't translated correctly and that it wasn't um and that it was corrupted by the catholic church and stuff like that that i had been taught i had to throw all that away and approach it like like i want to be talking and i want and i and basically i had the prayer in my heart that that god like the holy spirit put in my heart to to just desire god's truth above anything else no matter what it meant no matter how it affected my beliefs i just i came to that point where i was like i just want to know the truth and uh and so then god started to unveil that truth to me through his word and reading it um just each day it transformed me and it changed me to stop focusing on like i said earlier stop bringing people into the the church per se but i just wanted to serve people to love them because i was feeling i was feeling god's love pour into my heart in a way that i never felt before and like i want to share this love with other people because this is mind-blowing and i've never felt it like this before and so i i just tried to to pour that love into other people and to point them to jesus now of course i wasn't a christian yet but god was working in me and using me even while i was still this sinner that was destined for hell because i had broken god's law and yet he was using me as he changed and so people started to see that change in me while i was a missionary um some of my investigators like some of the people i was teaching like i stopped focusing on like you got to come to church you got to get baptized instead i was like look just just read this chapter like of the bible and just check this out and they started noticing that other missionaries started noticing that and so i don't want to tell much about micah's story any more of that than that but basically uh there were there were things that happened in our mission where any missionary that was following this um we called it uh we called ourselves love elders because okay yeah because we were focused on love and then okay and then lovingly we called the other missionaries number nazis that were in the mission [Laughter] not to their faces of course i guess that's not much better i don't know but we just but we there was this there was this division that happened in the mission that was led by micah as he was being changed and he was teaching us other missionaries uh the power of god's love because he was in a leadership role in the mission so he was it's called his own leader where he was in charge of like you know um uh 20 or some sometimes less 20 missionaries or so i was a district leader so i was over like 10 or so missionaries and so he was teaching all of us the power of god's love and encouraging us to love and serve and don't worry about numbers just focus on bringing people to jesus and pointing them to him and then i started doing that and other missionaries started doing that and the result was that missionaries were demoted from their leadership position so they couldn't spread this any longer our mission president felt threatened by that obviously because you know the whole power of the lds church is to bring more members in i mean that's what they want and i recognize that i can understand that and so we weren't trying to be rebellious but we were being moved by god's love and changed by it that we couldn't we couldn't stay silent about it and so um uh anyway so again i don't want to say any more about micah's testimony i won't spoil that but um he basically led me to christ like god god drew me to jesus through micah through me seeing the change that happened in him and me wanting to follow the path that he was walking just like like paul talks about like follow me as i follow christ it was like i was seeing something changing in him and i'm like i want that in my life and uh it didn't happen until i got off my mission that i finally surrendered my life to christ but that process was a very long process through those two years amen you know we had talked to dr jace lyle who's a presuppositionalist talked to jay warner wallace he's an evidentialist and it sounds like really the experiential aspect of apologetics is partly what drew you is the fact of uh micah's testimony in the change in him in a very different chain from what you're used to with the ods church but so yeah i understand that whenever somebody leaves kingdom halls they're excommunicated what challenges did you face personally when you left the ods church from friends family work things like that okay yeah that's a great question and and i think it varies depending on the individual and the situation they're in um because i've heard of a lot of people that like lose their jobs that are thrown out of their house depending on their parent situation like i have a good buddy that when he left the lds church and didn't say anything against it but just said i just want i just only have faith in jesus now they're like because you're not lds anymore like you can't live here and thrown out and have had minimal contact for the last three or four years um and because he wasn't allowed so so that's really tough so luckily for me um it wasn't that severe in that physical aspect because basically i get off my mission and then two weeks later i'm back here in florida to be a part of of adams road which micah had started and that's i mean i can get that a little later and stuff the way that that formed but um and then i and then i just i've lived here in florida ever since my family's all in utah so so there's a distance there but if i were in utah it would probably be much more severe if i was like living you know near my family um so basically uh you lose everything and just like jesus says like you have to be willing to renounce everything to follow christ and he says i don't come to bring peace i come with a sword to make the people of their own household be their enemies and that's really what happened for a while like when i told my family what had happened i lost those relationships and uh they were hurt they were like they're heartbroken i mean just i mean if you're if you're a parent and you're listening i mean and you have sons and stuff and so like and kids and so if if you imagine if they were grown and then they then they left the christian faith that you raised them in that would break your heart of course you still love them but i mean just imagine like that that's the gravity that uh that my parents went through when i left it and um all my siblings they were looking up to me like i had six in my family um and i'm the second oldest um and so when i went on my mission it's it's like something that like when your older brother goes onto missions like you look up to them and you want to be you want to serve a mission to be like your brother and so i lost that um them looking up to me that reputation in my family and in my congregation and all the people that that saw me grow up as a kid and knew me as this like really strong loving um uh loving of the lds church a passionate member of the lds church um strong in the faith person and then to give that up that was shocking for them um i was engaged to uh my mormon girlfriend that had waited for me for the two years and so i had to also face that cost and all of it was so like it's so difficult to give all that up because of how much i love those people i didn't want to hurt them and they couldn't understand that i had found something that was so much more valuable i mean it's just like how jesus skipped that parable of the man that finds like a treasure and then in a field he buys the field and like sells all he has to buy that field because that is the only thing that matters like when i found jesus that that's that treasure for me and like nothing else mattered and so even as much as i loved my parents and as much as i loved like that fiance and my siblings and all my friends and my life yeah i loved jesus even more and it was as as the hardest thing to do in my life to lose myself uh to take up my cross to follow him but i knew that what i was gaining was was better and um and so i hope that like as people are hearing this type of stuff that they can have compassion understand that when somebody in the lds church and they when they lose their faith for christ they truly lose everything and but it's worth it and it's only worth it because you have jesus it's not worth it just to leave mormonism and lose all that stuff but to gain christ um is worth the loss of anything amen eternal life you got security going to heaven with god after this and you have a new earth but from understanding you know i saw your wife come in so you are married now right yes so yeah do you have any kids uh we don't have any kids so yeah but so uh that was katie so she's the she's the sister of micah so that's kind of like basically yeah basically like after uh micah is his like he started sharing with his family and stuff and yeah and so he shared with his sister and she came to christ while she was a senior in high school in utah a very strong mormon high school and everything and so she also went through that same cost of losing all that stuff but then of course getting christ and then she came out to florida to visit and like to see her brothers and then she saw me and so i was like that's awesome so that's awesome y'all been married for how long yeah so uh let's see 2007 so this so this will be 14 years this fall nice awesome congrats man yeah thank you well i hate to go in a little more somber of a note but oh that's got to be a follow-up question to just the struggles that you and a lot of other ex-mormons go through is the fact from my study you can correct me if i'm wrong by all means please do because i don't want to be saying things that are incorrect but yeah within the lds church the or the teachings i should say the only teachings really found within outer darkness are those that are deemed sons of perdition in the fact that it's my understanding is sort of the the mormon concept of hell if you will and only sons of perdition gets sent there and according to the lds teachings that someone that has fully accepted the ods church and the lds gospel and this and that and they leave the church then they are deemed sons of perdition and they go to outer darkness is that accurate in is this a fear tactic similar to the jehovah's witness where salvation is only found in the governing body yeah yeah that's a great question and i would say it really depends on who you ask because i think so i think certain people in the lds church might have a different view of it i'm so i'm trying to think of the official like official stance and doctrine of it um and i think what you're making reference to is in the doctrine of covenants there's a chapter where it says a section where it says that uh um that those who have like it's like received the power and uh rejected it so which in context i believe is talking about the priesthood and therefore would go with what you're saying that you have to be an lds member and then have turned away from it in order to qualify some tradition yeah they kind of make it difficult to go to hell to their version of health to outer darkness um in their doctrine because even even like people that stop going to the mormon church or stop drinking coffee or something like that and aren't worthy of the temple anymore they're still going to like the second degree of heaven because there's three degrees um but the very top top tippy top is you know the very worthy lds members but even the lowest member or the sorry the lowest kingdom of heaven is for the like murderers and rapists and terrorists and uh hitler yeah and then and then you have the sons of perdition with the devil and his angels and those who have left lds church and fight against it so they would classify i think i believe as anti-mormons um no would go there i think it's your tactic for sure when i uh i first came across uh sisters in the lds church on a mormon mission trip i i've never known that there were a thing as mormon sisters if you will you know so that was interesting to me but whenever i talk to them or any of them missionaries knocking on my door it really seems like i'm banging my head or talking against a brick wall when i'm trying to explain biblical grace why does it seem so difficult for us to really get through what is true grace because according to the book of mormon doctrine covenants really the articles of faith grace is not really grace we all know the passage in nephi for his grace you're saved through faith after all that you can do but then in the articles of faith in like verses one through three it talks about all the different things you have to do why is it so hard to explain biblical grace to an lds member yeah oh so that's a great question i think it has uh two parts um one is the ant actually answering specific about what grace is and why they have a difficulty um why you have a difficulty speaking through that but also just the generalized thing is that they use the same terminology that we as christians use so when i was a missionary i would say grace but i meant something different and when and if a christian doesn't understand and doesn't know what they're actually saying and speak mormonise as uh almost to say then uh you will be talking past each other and think that you're agreeing with each other yet not and so we have a really good uh resource on our website on our website is adamsroadministry.com and we have a page called ministeringto mormons which just gives lots of tools of ways that you can look at things and approach things and love and speak gently with compassion and one of those things is to have a terminology uh chart basically explains like if they say this this is their terminology that they might be using and of course this is what the bible says and as a comparison and so that would be a really good resource uh so for instance for grace as as when i was lds what i what i would say grace i'm talking about either salvation as in resurrection so um so salvation is when is that jesus died on a cross and gave resurrection to everyone as a gift that's what salvation is as a free gift exaltation is what we would what we as christians would call as salvation because that's it that entails like living with god in the next life forever in his presence and but for that you have to work for it so they can technically say i'm saved by grace it's a free gift there's nothing i can do to earn it and they're talking about resurrection and that's how they're able to talk past christians but if you were to say what do i need to do to be exalted to or to live in god's presence after i die is faith enough and they would have to say no and so that's how you can kind of cut through by lovingly ask a question like that so another thing is that grace according to um in the back of their their canon of their scripture they have a bible dictionary that defines grace as the enabling power to to do what god has commanded them or something like that so basically grace is what god gives you to follow the law of of the lds church and see what and see that's a gray area for because for christians we would say that grace enables us to um to live godly lives after we're saved and that's called sanctification and so it's kind of a it's kind of a version of that i think um that that in their mind that they're trying to they think that they're saying the same thing but they're not because they're putting the cart before the horse and they're saying you have to do all this before christ grace is sufficient for you according to the book of mormon it teaches that like you have to deny yourself of all ungodliness and if you've done that then christ christ is sufficient for you and therefore it's putting you cleansing yourself of all your sin before christ's grace can kick in and obviously that's opposite of what the bible teaches all right now i think you explained it very clear dr wilder uh talked a little bit about it in our interview but how you put it together i mean for me it was just like a light bulb moment because if i can repeat and rephrase to make sure that i understand properly is grace is really just the aspect of the mormon belief that jesus's death and resurrection provided resurrection for everybody either terrestrial telescope or celestial kingdom type deal and salvation is the ability to gain exaltation going through the temple endowment ceremonies ordinances things like that is that correct i think so i mean i think yeah um i would say i would say salvation is the first one this isn't part of the question but it but it begs the question for me and if you want to just bypass it by all means let me know but uh now i understand in the lds church well president learns of snow and i believe the church still holds his stance that as man is god once was as god is man may become and they teach that people within the lds church can gain an exaltation status have their own planet with celestial marriage and have spirit children and sort of be like god is today but we could be god with another planet uh right how does that not seen illogical with the same view that an exalted lds member can live with god if an exalted member actually is distinct from god and has her own planet you see what i mean yeah yeah i know i've actually wanted the same thing um and just to clarify so when i was lds the way that i would explain what you were just saying about like um about uh becoming a god and different stuff like that um the way that i would have explained it as a missionary was that well if god is our father which they believe that he's like an exalted man who has become and is literal the father of theirs of their spirit bodies that existed with him before they came to earth and if he is that then wouldn't we want to be wouldn't he want us to be everything that he is just like you as a father want your son to have the uh and to be like you in those ways in good ways so so that's how they would explain it they don't think about it as like exalting yourself but they think about it as um as becoming like god who is their father of course it is exalting yourself and of course it is uh it doesn't make sense that you can be your own god oh and then also clarify one other thing they they never believe that when you attain that status of god it doesn't make your god any less of a god so basically there's this constant like succession and he's always going to be their god even when you're a god and you have your own people there's like a grandfather god's i mean for lack of a better term that's kind of how that how they see it so they don't ever they don't believe that you attain the level um equal to their god because he's always constantly progressing and regretting as you progress however you can get to where he was that type of thing so it is confusing but yeah but uh anyway but that doesn't really matter too much but just to clarify just so that if an lds person's listening like i you know we're giving the benefit of the doubt of an actual explaining it the best we can um and not misrepresenting it um you know anything accidentally but uh i always i asked my mom the same thing i was like mom if if you uh and dad or like if you guys are on your own plan and then if i were to join back in the lds church and i become um and i go through the temple and i get married in the temple so i progress and i become my own god how are we an eternal family together like i wouldn't be with god because i would be on my own plan and you would be on your own so how are we an eternal family together how am i with god and they don't really have an answer to that they don't really i don't know if they barely thought it through or if they really care because family is the most important thing to them honestly for a christian it's just like you're just gonna bask in the presence of god you just cannot wait to be just to be with him you know like whatever i'm doing i don't care i just want to be with him i just want to feel his presence i want to see him i want to be there with him i don't i don't want anything else and but for an lds person that sounds might like that might sound boring to them because they think that there's something greater and it's because they have uh they have a a like a a small view of god and they they their god is so small and he's not this all-powerful you know being he's he's just like this exalted man that they can become someday so it's not an unattainable like like amazing huge thing that you can't even comprehend it's like in a box and you can comprehend it and therefore it's not that glorious um and that's and i'm not making characterizations of like all lds people i'm just saying like that's how i viewed it and and how i view it now you know the difference of that now that that begs another question but i'm not going to ask it it's either first second or third book of abraham is when it's talking about the creation account it talks about a plurality of god's uh yeah not not the elohim the trinity that we would see in scripture but and then if god is a god is a exalted man then there has to be a god above him and then it breeds a polytheistic religion if you will of some sort of sorts but i yeah we could talk about stuff like this all day and i would love to but anyways so all right so we talked about biblical grace versus mormon grace but mormon knocks on her door mormon missionary what is the best way we can effectively be used by god to reach this mormon or these mormons because they're in pairs okay so i mean number one is to love them and to make sure that um that uh like you're speaking the truth but in love so like if you think about like how uh how delicate like a little like a little blade of grasses and jesus said that oh the prophecy in isaiah about of that jesus fulfilled that he wouldn't even break a bruised reed um you see a blade of grass that's that's bending and that's ready to break are you gonna be harsh with it or gentle with it and it's important to see these uh lds missionaries coming that they're lost and they're broken and they need jesus and so so you have to think about how how would they perceive love if like and put yourself in their shoes and be like if i were to knock on somebody's door how would i want them to approach me or to react i'm sorry react to me yeah because dude it is scary man to knock on strangers doors especially now with cohort and stuff i don't know how they do it but i don't think they do anymore but like it is terrifying and like it is i mean they're uncomfortable you're invading their pro like their privacy and their home and like and it's scary and like you get yelled at and you get like like guns threatened on you and like um sworn at and like chased and it yeah i did i did i mean micah talks about like he had dogs sick on him and he had people pull guns on and my eyes had somebody threaten it but i mean it's scary dude and like and and uh so they're putting themselves out there so okay so come from that perspective and then the other thing is the very important thing is that we as believers uh jesus said that um that the defining attribute for us to be shown to the world is love that god is love and that we that uh people will know jesus disciples if we love one another therefore if a non non-believer comes to your door wants to talk about god and you have christ in you like what should your reaction be i mean like it's hard enough to start a conversation with somebody like in line at walmart or something you know to share jesus dude this guy is at your door and he wants to talk about god with you it's like and then you slam the door on their face no but that's what happened so many christians slam the door i had lady i had a lady yell at me she was like like you're a false disciple of jesus get off my door bam slam the door or like yelling scriptures like yelling roman scriptures at me in anger and it's like it's like wow that is the huh that can't do anything to help you find the truth can it no and honestly it did the opposite i was like walked away and my companion and i looked at each other and were like dude of course this church is true and that's why this is evidence because look we're being persecuted by this christian lady we obviously have the truth and they're mad about it so it just dug me deeper into my religion but when i had people that showed me love the love of god um that's what melted my heart and so um the amazing thing is that uh i was taught on my mission that it's all about love and god is me discovering god's love for me which was christ christ's love for me which was the cross and then my love for god was to show others god's love for them so so what we encourage people to do is to vitamin like if you can't do an appointment right then like like schedule a different appointment or something um arrange for to feed them and so like load them up with tons of food and like find out their favorite meal and like cook that meal or something and then and then let them share their message and um and after they've shared their message like listen like listen like politely and stuff and uh and then be like okay you know really appreciate it and you'll see their zeal you'll see they're like how they they're passionate about their religion and about god but it's in ignorance like paul talks about in romans 10 about the jews that it's an ignorance but they they don't have uh the knowledge of christ and but you do so then you can be like let me share something with you and and just share the the simple gospel jesus and make it personalized to you share um verses of scripture that have affected you personally those are all things that you can do if you only have a short amount of time with them which i do sometimes with with mormon missionaries or something then exactly what you said to put a a stone in there in their shoe don't put don't make the stone be anything about joseph smith the book of mormon and the corrections of it polygamy uh becoming a god someday anything uh racism of the mormon church like anything like that don't put any of those things in put a stone in their shoe of something of a scripture in the bible especially in the new testament that makes them think because ultimately you want to push them into the word of god and let them read it themselves and let them discover it themselves seeing uh when i talked to dr wilder she had made a reference that most mormons they will though they don't really put much stock in the bible like you said unless they have a jst and they see his notes if you will but what they will put stock in is the words in red the words of jesus christ right and so one of the things that she uh pointed out which i thought was wonderful advice is the fact of jesus had told the apostles that he would establish his church and the gates of hell would not prevail against it and that being the case if jesus established his church upon the apostles teachings there's no way that the church would have been able to go apostate if the gates of hell couldn't even prevail against according to jesus's own words um so i love what she said then you made mention during that time is use the testimony use your own testimony because mormons are very experiential it's all about their testimony the burning of the bosom if you will so i love that but one of my problems is i think i'm blacklisted so how can i get off the blacklist so i'm blacklisted too so what happens so what i so what i do is uh some some ex-mormons um try to hide the fact that they're mormon and try to like pretend and then like kind of hustle them almost in a way or they like pretend like they don't know anything about it and stuff but i don't do that i come straight out and i say like look i was a mormon missionary i served i i grew up in the elias church i loved it with all my heart and this verse is one of the ones that speaks to me it's one of my life verses that affected me as one of my favorites is first corinthians 1 18. the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing but to us who are being saved it's the power of god and the reason why that's powerful to me is because when i was in this church the lds church i saw the cross as foolishness and now i've been changed by it and i see it as the power of god this is the power that god has changed and done in my life and that jesus has changed my life and i know he can and yours and then i would probably like encourage them to to like open the bible um or if i have more time maybe ask them a certain question um like a question i like to ask missionaries is you know i love ephesians two eight and nine um and i know you've probably heard it before um and i know that you probably would counter it with james chapter two which talks about faith without works is dead thinking that they may be conflicting with each other but if you take the just look at ephesians 2 8 9 and 10 actually through 10. and i just i'm wondering how do you reconcile your beliefs with this teaching that it's a free gift obviously they go to james too and then i like to go into james 2 with them and be like let's look at james 2 and in context and you can explain and show that the two examples that james uses of faith and works and even when he says this you you can see that someone justified by works and not by faith alone you can see the uh the context is with rahab and with abraham and both content both of those stories has the person declare something out of faith faith in god and then they act on it and therefore that's how works are tied to um to that justification rather than rather than doing nothing because they kind of think that that that we as christians are saying have faith but faith that not that doesn't have works to follow and as you and i know and in ephesians 2 verse 10 it says that we've been prepared for good works to do the uh because we're christ's work god's workmanship created in christ jesus to do those good works so we're saved by faith and that results in works and i try to like go through that and like so that's how i can make sense of it how do you make sense of it you know and that was a very long version of it but i would do it really short you know uh but just that that's what i mean like just type of questions like that just to make them think and and it doesn't matter what they say even if they try to defend it because you planted that that little rock in there so yeah i i have to admit it though i was early on i was the one that slammed the door in missionary's face but then i realized like you had pointed out dude god is sending them to my door to witness i don't have to knock on their door they're coming to me and i could talk about jesus is so yeah and like you said one of the best ways i it sounds like is just loving them you know and two commandments sayings all the law and the prophets love god and love your neighbor as yourself and so it doesn't matter if they're christian or not we should still love them and then love does declare the truth with grace so you know it is interesting because i've always looked at lds missionaries as the individuals that really had their stuff together not only practically in just right living morality wise but also according to ods theology so i was i was flabbergasted when i would talk to a bunch of missionaries and they wouldn't know teachings of kolob or how i would hide a co-lab songs hymns or they wouldn't know about the plurality of marriage within doctrine and covenants and just a lot of these obscure teachings why do you believe that is that most seem to be ignorant and i don't use ignorant as a bad word negative word it's just a lack of knowledge why does it seem like most of them are ignorant of these teachings yeah and honestly that's it's a great question i don't have an answer for that because um i mean the only thing that i didn't know that i learned later on was that joseph smith was a polygamist like we we accepted that brigham young was but as a missionary even i believed that joseph smith only had one wife so later on after i left the lds church and stuff and i did research on it when i learned that that shocked me but i think uh yeah honestly i don't know but i think that there's there's a lot of like um like you grow up in a bubble type of thing and you just like i don't know i honestly don't know how missionaries cannot like don't know well let me ask you this when when you were on your missions trip did you know any of these teachings already um yeah i knew i knew kolob um i knew the plurality of wives and doctrine covenants because i read it um uh what was the third one so you know plurality uh just a bunch of different things you know exalted gods things like that yeah it might just be a sense of just like within the christian church you have people that just don't study they don't read scripture they take their face seriously if you will but i just imagined i looked at missionaries more as like on the next level of uh of faithfulness and they would have but right so yeah it's just amazing maybe those are just stones to put in people's shoes as far as hey i never heard of that yeah well check out kolob in not only that the three kingdoms marriage and the writing about emmanuel swedenborg and in his heaven and hell book that was contemporary at the time of joseph smith and maybe those are just stones i don't know but yeah so two more questions i'll let you go okay hey that's fine it's great the understand lds church believes it is the only true church one apostate for years until joseph smith came and established it from my studies joseph smith was in a meeting with methodist presbyterians and i think baptists and they were arguing over doctrine joseph smith said which is right is any of these right and then god revealed to him really essentially the lds church my question is when you were challenged by micah was there anything that you studied that made you realize that the lds church was not the one true church and if so what was that yeah um i only studied the bible um when i was when i was a missionary like i think today they might have a little bit more uh leniency of what they can read and and watch and stuff like that but for us like if we saw what we classified as anti-mormon literature like like we felt like it would burn our skin if we touched it i mean honestly like there was one time where i went into a christian library uh which i didn't know or a christian bookstore which i didn't know it was at the time um me and my companions wandered in there and and i saw a book that said something like the truth about joseph smith or something like that and i felt like i felt sick for the whole rest of the day like uh like it really like it was a mental thing that really really messed me up so i didn't study anything else i poured into the word of god and and the the big thing for me was the book of hebrews like when i got to the book of hebrews and i realized that the whole entire i thought the foundation of the lds church was based on christ and i read hebrews and i realized the foundation of the earliest church of priesthood temples the prophet high priests and i saw that all of those things were fulfilled in christ and to see jesus fulfill those things through through the book hebrews i was like then what do i have left and that was one of the moments where it was like the only thing i have is jesus that that's the only thing remaining so it was it was a tr it was a tragedy for me at the time because i was like like shook to my core but at the same time uh it was powerful that was that was one of the eye-opening things for me so so no anti-mormon literature i only read the bible and that's the conclusion that i came to the book of hebrews i i could definitely see the parallels there so that's what i'm going to put in my pocket so yeah all right so the last question that i have again a lot of these were posed by people that were excited about your interview is a two-part question really did you run across any ex-mormons on your missions trip who were resistant to any religion and you were talking about how they become atheists or agnostics uh once they come out the lds church if you did come across them how do you recommend their reached yeah that's a great question now is this is this only referring to you while i was a missionary or like even since then well i would be curious to see as far as your missions trip and then also if you tie into now today uh modern day how would you reach that okay yeah um yeah we did run into some uh because uh basically we would go to a house that that would say like a part member family or something like that and that meant that one of the spouses was uh active lds and the other one wasn't and some of those situations were that that one of the spouses had left or something but they've given themselves to like i don't know they were smoking and drinking and and had no um had no like uh religion or anything so oh i gotta ask you a question real quick about that so you had mentioned that brought that up so yeah hypothetical but i imagine it's happened uh say say me and my wife were married in the temple say i left the lds religion right left the church or no no we'll say she does okay because i'm working on exaltation yeah to become a god of my own planet she leaves the lds church is there any hope for me and her still to have this celestial marriage and and have spirit children or is all that known void now because she left um so if she if she's removed her name from the records and like canceled her baptism then she doesn't have any hope left but you can still be sealed to other women so okay you uh as the priesthood holder you can you can be sealed to um multiple women in the next life yeah no thanks i love my wife you know what dude it's so funny uh and and this story is is in micah's book which i i do want to plug in just a second but um because uh because he he shared with like uh like a couple waves of missionary like um you can have eternal marriage you can be with your spouse like forever and like the guy told him like dude his life's long enough and it was an older couple and i remember that it's pretty funny uh okay that's just tongue tongue-in-cheek i don't mean any offense to the listeners um uh okay so so how would you reach those ex-mormons that are now yeah yeah yeah um it's tough man honestly one of my sisters she left mormonism she thought then she she said she had become a christian and and now she's saying that she's agnostic basically so it breaks my heart and that question you know hits me really deep because it's what's happening in my family and um the i guess the way to reach them is the same way to reach anyone that's lost um i'm i'm trying to uh just to pour god's love into her to show her uh show her acceptance because knowing that knowing that any uh the lds church um like siblings or friends or anything might have like judgments and condemnation to throw on her because of that um i want to show her forgiveness and compassion and grace that god offered me when i didn't deserve it so um it's important to not like push not push it on him i i felt like for a long time that i was a bad christian if every time i had a chance to talk with her i didn't try to share jesus with her and and realizing that if i've shared it with her uh and she knows what i believe and she knows and she's heard the truth then i don't have to keep like trying to shove it down her throat you know like like you have to come to a point where basically i'm at the point where i say god like i'm okay with my sister being agnostic right now like like i know you're i know she's in your hands i want her to be saved more than anything but i can't change that i can't force it and you're the one that has to do the work in her heart and um and it has to be in your timing so so like i can't so i can't like dictate to you what to do with her so uh it's the same with my mormon family i mean honestly i approached them her the same way i approached them is is that i'm okay that they're in the last church right now because i believe that they'll be saved someday and i love them and in the meantime i'm going to keep loving them keep praying for them and when you offer chances to share god's word i'm going to take them but um but i'm not going to try to to push it and uh what it's done is it's um it's it's uh repaired those relationships so if it's with somebody that that they can develop a relationship with that's what i would encourage them to do and to use that relationship to pour god's love into them and eventually level level wind you know like level conquer god's love will conquer and and will will melt their the ice in their hearts and uh and they'll see that nothing else satisfies about christ jesus so that's what that's what i would say amen and like you said that's huge as far as an ex-mormon because more often than not they're going to be really excommunicated they lost their church family probably friends things like that so really just showing them love showing them grace showing them mercy just he said just loving them and just telling them the truth and being there because that's what christianity is is love is forgiveness is mercy and so you know that's that's really great so that's pretty much all the questions i had is there anything that you want to go over cover anything you want to plug anything you want to rehash out before we end the interview buddy yeah thank you yeah so um so i've made mention of micah's book and i want to make a huge plug for this because it's going to be coming out this uh this summer lord willing and but right now it's available for pre-order on amazon so it's called passport to heaven and it's basically if anybody listening has read the book unveiling grace by lynn that she most likely talked about this is um the preamble of that book so it's basically what happened before everything that happened in their family and it's just the two years of micah's journey as as a missionary and how god's word transformed him and what and what that entails so i just i highly recommend everyone to check it out to pre-order that and and uh where can they get that you can uh well on amazon for sure uh for now um but it's gonna be available anywhere the books are sold i believe in in may or june i think may uh so this summer anyway but our website our ministry website is adamsroadministry.com and there's links to the book on there um but there's so many other things on our on our website um we have so many resources for uh if you if you want to be able to like speak to the lds people in love and compassion uh the page like i said called ministering to mormons um we have this thing called the bible topic guide list where we took all these topics of the uh that are that are important to lds members and we compiled all the bible verses that we could um into that topically so that so they can be a great resource you can our download for free and what we do is we put god's word to music and then and then give it um as free of charge so we have 10 albums that you can download for free from our website um or you can listen to them right there um then there's uh tons of like um there's videos um there's books that we offer we offer free bibles uh from our website that people can order um we have shirts that say jesus is enough because that's a really huge like tagline of our ministry and so and we take all the proceeds from those sold t-shirts to uh to benefit needy children through compassion international and food for the hungry and so again that's a link on the website so you can just like explore the website there's plenty to check out uh testimonies are on their video um and i know you're gonna be interviewing each of the guys and and girls and stuff um eventually so so i don't want to say any more of their stories or anything like that but um uh let's see the oh so the last thing is that we're a traveling ministry so we do travel around the country if anyone listening would be interested in having us like share our story and share our music at your church um you can contact us on our ministry website and email us and yeah we're currently booking right now this tour i don't know what's going to happen lord willing we're going to be able to go this summer but with koaved yeah i don't really know uh we didn't go last year because of kovid but you know uh god has a plan so and his words are going to keep going forward so um yeah but i just encourage all the christian believers to just like truly walk um in the shadow of christ and like really just just take up your cross and follow jesus and the way to do that is to fulfill the great commission there's so many lost that are out there that that need christ and it could just be anywhere like when we go to disney world we wear jesus enough shirts and we try to talk to people in the lines and stuff and you get the cool conversations when you're looking for it and when you're willing and um when the missionaries come to your door please love them if you have mission mormons in the family or in your friend's circle please love them and and share truth with them so that's it man amen definitely i appreciate it man that was awesome and for those of you this interview did answer the question or the comment critique that if you really want to know what's going on talk to a mormon missionary and we just did so joseph warren thank you so much for your time here i know you're a busy man thank you for your thoughts and just letting us get into your brain and into your hearts and just know we're going to be praying for the family and i'm praying for your personal situation for just salvation for them to come to the knowledge of the truth and the love of christ so again man i i totally appreciate it for those of you still watching go ahead check out adam's road ministry check out the book passport to heaven all these other links tools they're just another apologetic toolkit toolkit you can put in your tool belt to go ahead and just be effectively used by christ to reach a lost and dying world so that they can find the truth of the gospel so thanks for checking out until next time god bless

Channel: C4C Apologetics

Views: 406

Rating: 4.52 out of 5

Keywords: god, jesus, yesua, yhwh, theist, theism, deism, deist, christian, christ, messiah, meshiach, mashiach, nazareth, atheist, atheism, bible, canon, scripture, biblical, scriptural, adams road, adam's road, unveiling grace, unveiling mormonism, lynn wilder, wilder, micah wilder, byu, brigham young, outer darkness, lds church, mormon, mormonism, mrm, utlm, ex-Mormon, LDS missions, LDS mission's trip, Joseph Warren, Adams Road Ministry, Adam's Road Ministry

Id: 7erAOQ53WjU

Length: 84min 22sec (5062 seconds)

Published: Thu Feb 11 2021