Brian Glaze Gibbs on Killing 6 People, Being Enforcer for Fat Cat, Getting 10 Years (Full Interview)

all right here we go we have uh infamous street figure brian glaze gibbs in the building thank you for joining us vlad thank you for having me absolutely um you know there's been a lot of a lot of talk about you a lot of rumors uh there's a documentary that you actually put out recently as well inside of mine the killer exactly as well as a book that you put out beyond lucky brian glazed gibbs story exactly but we're going to go ahead and do a sit down and kind of go through your whole story uh from the very beginning so let's go ahead and start so you grew up in east new york no i was born in the backseat of a police car in the bedford stuyvesant section of brooklyn new york and what happened with that was um my family member called the am lambs like called 9-1-1 because my mother was going to labor and back then the police got there first and they see that she was about to deliver so they took her opposed to waiting for the amlams and this so happened i was delivered in a backseat a police car and took him to kings county hospital okay well where did you actually grow up brooklyn new york the bedford stuyvesant section i started out growing up and then by the time i was like 11 12 years old and in sixth grade we moved to the east new york section of brooklyn okay and east new york is a very notorious part of of new york uh i've been through there a few times and i've always driven very quickly through there i didn't stop and hang out uh mike tyson came from there right mike tyson came from brownsville brownsville isn't that considered east new york though brownsville and eastern yorks no you can't tell in brownsville that east new york is brownsville brownsville east new york is you know right it's close by so it's still brooklyn it's close by but people are very now don't get the mix up with the two east new york is east new york brownsville is brownsville okay but they you know what they both shitty areas okay okay and you grew up uh with your mother uh was your father around as well no my father was around but then again my mother had you know common law and great man um worked for the transit authority um learned a lot from him you know initially being a young knucklehead kid we didn't appreciate the value that he brought to the table but it took a while for us to understand like you know he was there and he was more of a father than my biological father ever was and i love him to death now because of the things that you know he was dead it is you taking care of kids that's not yours and you becoming part of a team and we you know we was as much of a family as we could be gotcha and you have some siblings as well yes i have brothers and sisters how many total and what for my mother i have is me and my brother and my two sister for my father ah man i can't even say at what point did you really start getting into the streets because i know in your documentary you talked about selling fake chains was that sort of your first you know dabble into the streets or were you doing something before that you know what it's like um when you leave the bedford-stuyvesant section of new york like brooklyn it's like you leave in the suburb going into the concrete jungle and when you get to the east new york section you're right it's totally different so selling fake jury was a start but it was like we was out there doing anything anything to make a fast buck brother was selling the fake jury and you know burglary burger was the first crime that you know i can recall getting into okay and that was breaking into houses breaking into houses um you know climbing terrace you know um sneaking into people that left a terrace door open you know yeah any entry like anything that you can do that you can basically right now be invasive and go un you know detected that you can get in somewhere steal some things rob the place and get out of there okay and you're also robbing people on the train oh yeah we did a little bit of that too man we did a lot of that yeah you know even with that being said it's like you know the crazy part about that being young being dumb and wanting to take shortcuts because once again you get on a train and sometimes we used to get on a train sit next to a victim because what you do is you size them up and you look at them you look at how they dress well dressed uh you see somebody with a nice watch you know look like money so basically what i used to do is i'll sit down with somebody else to sit down next to another one instead of you know right there to the side of them and the game was always mister my man right there got a gun give it up and you have most people when you approach them like that you know what they're afraid and they'll give it up and you you know i don't have a situation whereas one guy that we was in the subway station and i put the you know stop mister don't make a move my man got a gun we'll blow your head off give us everything and this gentleman like literally my man approached pull out the gun he slapped it away and he say just like this word for word don't you guys think it's kind of too cold to be playing and he kept going and me literally i bust out alive because it was funny it's like this individual like slap the gun away and base you right now don't you think it's kind too cold to be played that's gangster yeah that's gangster legit gangster yeah okay now there's a situation where you robbed a lady's house and i guess you stole her mother's wedding ring i'm out time out time out by that time i was one of my guys one of the guys that my little crew that we was down with you know right now is like you know after a while like you know you're right we used to do all that stuff but it came to a point in time yeah one house that was hit part of what the crew that was down with they stole you know they stole a bunch of stuff but the lady said that word only thing she wanted back was the ring that belonged to her mother and if she get that back you know she don't care about nothing else so the key was my guys didn't pay that message any mind so she had a nephew i guess like you know more or less like just came home and i guess somebody pointed my boy out and they pointed him out and say like he's part of that little crew and they snatch him up and you know i guess like beat the living daylight of him and left him stranded butt naked in the bronx for dead okay so they kidnapped and tortured him yeah he couldn't have been tortured but he he survived he's survived he's alive and well i see him on my timeline every now and then yeah he's still here okay back then we was probably like 14 15 years old after you saw your friend get get kidnapped and tortured like that did you say okay maybe this whole robbery thing isn't for me yeah it was burglary but like burglary but what it was is then blind it's like to me when i decided it wasn't for me because we was in like we were going to the linden plaza area we're from cyprus so linden plaza is approximately like you know six to eight block away from us and if you look at london plaza it was much neat brand newer than our projects and you had approximately five big building and the first floor started from where our floor stop back the sixth floor and it's like skyrise and they got balconies and people that we was under impression because you live in linden plaza oh man these folks are rich well you know what it was no richer than our family but the perception is everything so to me was we used to have inside people used to be friend people and their friend they'll go out there hang out with their friends and they'll leave the balcony door open so what we'll do is they go to a friend house and we'll climb their terrace you know two floors up three floors to the side because we already know that balcony door is open and to me when you're looking up in the sky and i'm like man you know the more you did it a couple of times and i said nah i'm not doing this because once again only thing they take is one slip one four one mistake and that's it it's over with yeah i mean you're dead yeah you're dead you're dead oh you jacked up pretty bad yeah for the rest of your life exactly in a wheelchair or whatever so then at 16 you're robbing a white couple with a gun i was robbing all along but just so happened that was my first arrest when i was 16 like you know at pratt institute pratt institute's institute college institutes in brooklyn new york um basey and you know great area nice area and the key was it was like the day after christmas let's sit back and think about it who the hell at the day after christmas you go out rob but you're greedy you're hungry you're desperate that's where people do desperate things so i go out there and rob this couple and as soon i put the drop in them anti-crime brooklyn north task force out of nowhere freeze put your damn hands up don't move like oh [ __ ] that was my first arrest okay so before then you never got arrested before i never got arrested man how many robberies and burglaries had you done by that time uh it's no telling um give or take you know burglary probably like i don't know but before that probably about 20 30. okay robbery like i said right now man i was robbing people in high school man and so robbery i can't tell you how many bootleg robbies that i had but i'm talking about real robbie when you got real money you know probably he's in like the 20s okay and a lot of these were armed robberies or all of them were armed robbers motion was on robbery and sometimes a lot of times right now is it all depends on the situation circumstance a lot of times right now you can bluff people you can act like you have a gun so it depends on the situation someone's ah robbery some woods i got a gun and you really didn't have a gun okay but you did have a gun part at the time yeah apart of time yep or your man had a gun yeah my man had a gun how many times do you actually did that actually involve a shootout of some sort um most of them didn't they never really involved shootouts you know back then the gun play wasn't that big back then it was like really not necessary because once again you know when you like really the gun play didn't come in effect until 1984 with bernard i guess on the train when he the vigilante when these guys try to you know rob him and he went crazy and shot up everybody or whatever so before that nobody was even when you go on a robbery very rarely especially from the younger generation back then in the 70s you know going to the early 80s gun play was very rare right i okay right so at 16 you try to rob this white couple the cops swooped in you got arrested and charged with armed robbery right and then you got sent to rikers island no i didn't get sent to rexella what happened was that was my first offense so right now is i went through century booking i took the weight it was another guy that was with me i took the weight forward said he didn't have nothing to do with it and i got let go but a week later january 2nd 1980 got another robbery and i was doing the same time i was telling you about initially we approached this one gentleman and we approach him and say mister don't make a move and my man pulled out the gun and he slapped the gun away from us and he said don't y'all think it's time it's kind of too cold to be playing so that was during the same time that we got that robbery that same day so we busted for the robbery that the guy slapped no no we didn't get busted for that was another robbery because we went ahead he got away we laughed about that we wouldn't got somebody else so when we robbed them like i said right now i was in transit new york transit authority in manhattan you know they're not dumbass got arrested okay and you were 16 at the time i was 16 at the time so that was my second arrest within a week and that sent you to rikers yes that sent me to love arizona rikers allen okay now can you put a juvenile in rikers island technicality i was 16. and right now is rikers island is 16 and up ah so i wasn't a juvenile you know you know i i wind up getting you for offender for my first case but technicality i was considered to be adult okay so now you're in rikers island yes and you end up doing three and a half years no not that no you go deeper than that i that time what happened is being that i got arrested the week prior in brooklyn now i got arrested a week later in manhattan that was the first time i went to rikers island spent the week went through hell and had to get bail out okay and then you went back in no when i got belt yeah when i i got bail out from that i laid up for a week and then my mother bailed me out and i was okay but you would you end up going back to rikers eventually yeah eventually yeah it's time went on yes i went i was righteous island was like my second home i was in and out like through 80 and 81 i went through there several times and well you said in your documentary that you did three and a half years yeah i did three and a half years after after okay after my arrest in january 80 i got bail out so when i got bail out um ain't like my life changed i was still out there doing stupid things robbery you know burglaries and i caught a few more cases in between that then on july 31st i caught my last on robbery case and then that's when i wound up getting three and i got um two to four in queens and two and a half to five in brooklyn and i went away in july 81 to november 84 for a total of three years and four months got it got it okay now you described rikers as gladiator school oh man yes yeah i mean i've interviewed a number of people like uh casanova two times spent a lot of time in rikers he called it gladiator school um you were involved in stabbings um yes i was about eventually i was involved in stabbing eventually like you know um i probably stabbed like what you know probably five people but initially like let's get let's let's go back whereas the first time i went to reich's island purdy hell um the first time going over that bridge getting there going through the whole process being straight strip search search going through the system it was like totally totally different you talk about a whole cold noisy violent vibing it's like even you in the bullpen in a reception area and you're watching guys getting sodomized getting a dick sucked in the bullpen or whatever no i'm saying this this is a 1980 these are the [ __ ] that you've seen or whatever any and everything goes so to me it's like i'm i'm a kid i'm 16 years old and like to say that i wasn't scared i'd be lying i was scared to death and you think that would be enough to say man later for this [ __ ] i'm not going back but that wasn't the case the key was i got there and i even got jumped i got beat up by a couple guys you know and my co-defender that was with me at the time he didn't even help me so it was like a valuable lesson i laid up for a week went to in and out of my cell you go to the mess so you can't eat because the food tastes like [ __ ] you know you you're on rikers island right because islands on the water right there across from laguardia airport and i'm telling you when you're in that cell at night you boo hoo you know i'm being me i'm crying like a little girl i want to go home but nobody you can't let the other hand makes hey you say that or whatever but you over there in there crying like a little girl i want to go home but that's not reality we'll wind up happening a week later i got bail out when i got bail out it was like man like you know you escaped from hell okay and you actually saw people getting raped oh man yeah were guys trying to approach you for that type of thing nah like for unfortunately no no i didn't have that problem you know because once again it's like literally you know like it all depends like you got weak and people exploit the weak and the key was like you know i'm young or whatever and then see one thing about reich's island that was an adolescent adolescent supposed to be 16 or 20. but you have guys there like 25 30 they lying about their age because they don't want to go to c95 they don't want to go to hdm they don't want to go to the men's house why because guess what if they step out of line these grown men would kill them so what they do is they was like predator they was exploiting the young cats so they could you know they fully developed i'm like [ __ ] back then i was like a puny little thing but the situation like nah i never had that the most happened to me was i got beat up and robbed and got my sneakers you know i got a pair of shoes taken so they take a pair of british works for you they give you a pair of pumas adidas or they take a pair of pants for you they give you a different pair of pants or whatever that's it but that's the most that happened to me and after a few times from in and out of riker's island getting my ass whip or whatever when i got there and you know i start getting used to it soon so i get there automatic you said example somebody do anything or say anything disrespectful you get them first before they get you and that's how you build your reputation okay so you get out in 1984 and now you have a felony on your record by the time i go by the time i got in 84 i already had four felonies four felonies on your record so getting a job a regular job a nine to five was pretty difficult you know you can get some [ __ ] detailed jobs but you can get jobs right but not not a real job not a real job not a real job so you get right back to the streets again yeah eventually it's like initially when i got out after doing three and a half years i actually remember that day um i got out i left green haven and when i went from green haven which is a max a joint they sent me to a county jail because while i was in jail it was a racial right and i wind up catching a new case because i stabbed this guy in in the mess or because right now they try to attack me and they miss so i caught them in the meso and stabbed them and i got 150 days in the box 150 days lost a good time in a brand new court case so when i got released from my state bid i had to go to dutchess dutchess county jail to do a bid for promoting prison contraband so once i did that bid i was released and went back home and i can remember that day it was like the end of november 1984. um i left the county jail um took a cab to on metro north got on a train my mother and brother picked me from the train station i can remember going home in that little cat you know they picked me up we going home and i remember that whole day man like being released like i stayed in my sipers apartment and look out the window man everybody else went to sleep and i just stayed up and i can remember that you know that day me and my brother got dressed went to see my parole officer and you're just so happy you're in a natural high to be free we went to the ukel avenue train station we got on a crowded a train going to 42nd street to see the parole officer and as we get on the train it's crowded so as we on the train like i'm watching like everybody bumping into you no excuse me know anything i just came from environment that if people come in certain your space excuse me pardon me now these people on this train is bumping into you all up in your space so my brother he'd been home you know probably like a year and a half so as they pushed up on him he's elbowing him boom get off me boom get off me and i'm like looking at him yo calm down man it's not that serious because i was still in that natural high and i was just happy to have my freedom all over again so a lot of things didn't really bother me okay so you get out in 1984 and this is sort of the the epicenter of the crack epidemic [Music] 1984 that's about when crack has really established itself all over the country and new york was was thriving in terms of uh in terms of crack in the attics and so forth which wasn't really the case in the 70s at all the 80s is what brought all that yeah it was heroin before so now you have crack which is comes with more violence more ammunition everything now i guess at the time there was a war going on with the jamaicans there was a war going on with jamaicans and that was like jamaican is like you know i'm talking about even before i went away like jamaican you hear about the shower posse or you hear about the rankers or you hear about different organization and to me these guys most of the time was like older jamaican and most of these guys had like experience in their own country that they was trained by the cia so now they're in america and they got some real down weapon and they would like them saying literally gun you down so they didn't play so what happened was before i came home i knew the a team that it was a group i was hearing about while i was away we used to form and got established and their objective was to keep the jamaicans out of the east new york area especially around the cypress hill avenue area cypress hill project area okay so you end up joining up with the a team yeah that was oh yeah you know initially when i came home they want to murder me they want to kill me because i had rob one of their members before i went to jail like one of guys was an older guy and he was walking around the neighborhood when i was 17 he had a bunch of [ __ ] on his neck so you know i'm talking about right now i didn't know who he was so to me that's what we use into he's in the stick up so to me like i've seen this guy you know walking around with all this [ __ ] on his neck you know so i approached him and when i approached him his name was panama so i was 17. he's probably back in his 30s so when i approach him look man pull out my little 25 give it up and he like yo man you must be don't know who you know who the [ __ ] i am i say look if you don't give it up i don't give a [ __ ] who is i'm gonna shoot the [ __ ] out so what he did was he gave it up but the different about the [ __ ] like he's trying to front and the boomer clot and all that i took all that [ __ ] it was fake so it was faith it's like you know you got me about to shoot your ass over some fake jewelry but see nobody know that so that's the difference is he trying to act like he was more important than what he is and i robbed him for a bunch of fake jewelry that i didn't even need to make no money off okay now you're rolling with the a team and you guys are making money and i guess you guys were kind of sharing a block or an area with the dominicans yeah um initially like i told you beforehand when i came home the a-team was plotting to kill me because i robbed at panama so panama was down with those guys at the time and what wind up happening panama did some foul [ __ ] we wanted to remember the leader the 18 family member so he left before they killed them so that's what took the death penalty off my head so eventually as time went on like the a team had to set up that certain section of the project that if you didn't live on that side you were not allowed to walk on that side so just so happened i'm hearing all this [ __ ] and i'm like come on man i'm not gonna be afraid to walk on any part of that project so this so happened being me and having a you know i didn't know it at the time i had a death wish back then i didn't even know that so what i used to do is i used to go on that side with my gun and my waist and walk through there hoping that's one of the guys to come up to me and say well you can't walk in inside and that that would have happened i'd blast them in the face but fortunately that never happened but as time went on um i went to visit one of my friends that was doing 25 of life upstate in auburn and what he was telling me you know what man listen man like the leader i know him like you know yo this is what i want you to do you go talk to him one on one so what happened one day they was all on southern local it was like one summer day and i approached him it's like probably ten of them when i approach him you know i said look man can i have a minute your time so he came to this side and we started talking i said listen man i don't have nothing against you all your people as long as you or your people don't do nothing to me and my family we don't have no problem so basically right now is we shook hand and we left as that so i left and time went on he came back to me he said look man you were crazy [ __ ] you came to see me buy your damn self no gun no anything and the key was we're right we strapped we i'm deep but yet and still i'm saying man this [ __ ] is crazy and from that point on he said i want you to be down for me and he gave me a name he said you know what i'm gonna call you bugsy bugsy seagull like the black bugsy seagull because of like but only that i did was being straight up i just went to him by myself and told him what it was and then he put me down with them okay how did the glaze name come come about the glaze name came about i'ma give you something that nobody else know right first of all you know when my first nickname i had was sugar bear and when i was in like junior high school the girls they used to call me sugar bell like you know wanda artis or melva you know um helen you know they used to call me sugar bear so i was cool with that but when the cats the five centers started calling me sugar bear i wanted to whip they asked me don't be calling me no sugar bear you know so anyway what happened was the first name was black spider it was a cat from my project named bennett and he's like the rank he said you know your name is black spot i'm saying don't call me that [ __ ] so my buddy domino me and still rest in peace curtis gibbs my brother him was close his name was domino sugar my brother name was kool-aid so he said i'm gonna give you glaze and you know ma i said okay cool i'll take that long's ain't no glazed doughnut so that's where the name glaze came from okay so you and the a team are are doing your thing you're making money and i guess you're making as much as like 60 000 a day give or take like i said right now initially when the a team they had they owned they were split splitting the block with the dominicans and what happened was when l sun wanted to put me down they had a vote because most of the 18 was five percenters so when he made me a full partner a lot of these guys like they didn't agree with that because i wasn't one of them and i wasn't five percenters so what he did was he came with me with a proposition like look man like you know he tried to be political correct and didn't want to go into details about the disagreement what he wanted but the vote was these guys felt like i was an outsider i wasn't one of them or whatever so the agreement was i became head of the security so when i became head of security and i used to be over there providing security for the block making sure nobody got robbed making sure all transaction went well and everything was smooth what happened was and then i caught a few guys one guy caught he was selling fake you know fake drugs like to our customers so i shot him in the ass so sent the message never came back and during that period of time as i'm there i'm watching like the dominicans because the a-team was sharing the spot with the dominicans so i'm watching like how they was coming into the area and for some way i just picked up these guys is not even from here they was coming all the way from you know washington heights they was coming all the way from the bronx manhattan you know and having territory in east new york and that didn't sit well with me so what i did was after analyzing it i just went to the leader a team and said look man this is what i'm gonna do i said what we can do is take over the whole [ __ ] and we take over the whole block 24 hours a day seven days a week it's ours but if you don't want to participate what i'm gonna do is i'm gonna get my man tucked i'm gonna get a couple other guys and we're gonna take over and what we're gonna do when we take over y'all got you know i'm saying your days and your hours y'all can keep that but we gonna take over the bus initially he said you know what go ahead i said if it's retaliation we'll take care of it but if no retaliation we good so he thought about it and i guess he had a meeting with his group and they're like damn what if this [ __ ] is successful at doing it so what wound up happening we wind up taking it over okay and you and king tut were friends from since you were kids sixth grade six when i first moved from the sudbury we moved to the ghetto me and king tut walter johnson we moved into i moved into the same building and you know he lived on him and his family lived on the second floor me and my family live on the sixth floor and we didn't speak nothing we didn't end what happened was we was going to we was going to public school 214 on picken avenue and back then we had to be bus to school so i was going in the orientarium to wait for the bus and he was going out the oratory to get on the bus and as i'm walking past him this you know pretty boy you know he just showed to check me boom and when he showed to check me i dropped all my books opposed me being a typical kid and picking up my book i went after him grabbing the headlock and stopped pounding his face they broke it up put his buff in our auditorium we started talking and we became friends since okay and i just want to go on a tangent a little bit here king tut was tied into the tupac shooting exactly yes he was he was tired okay can you talk about that at all yeah i can talk about that you know he was tied into that tut was like you know turkey got a hell of a name you know notorious stick of kids and even with that like since i've been home when i came home um i went to visit him in oaksville cause he got life centers now and you know me and him face to face on a visit and we talk about that whole tupac situation and when we talk about that whole tupac situation he's like look man you know me he said i'm telling you straight up top i didn't have nothing to do with the tupac [ __ ] and you know what i'm listening to him and he told me from the beginning even way back then that what's his name on jimmy henchman they set him up so that's what he told me from way back then and as you listen to it and you got to remember that's what came out later on and if you sit back and think about it i know tuc i can remember being kids we got into a fight with some older guys and they was whipping our ass and i'm telling we got we you know both got guns on us we're probably like 15 16 i said let's get these guys so i started shooting at them and tut was shooting up in the air am i looking at this cat like nah that's not him as far as like he'll rob you but he's not going to shoot you he's not he's not a killer you know gotcha okay so you guys had a situation where your drug spot gets robbed but i guess a guy named crazy clyde crazy clyde that was dominant brother yes all right so he robs your drug spot and i guess you kidnapped and tortured someone to find out what happened no you know who what happened was he the spot got robbed before and then it's like simultaneously get robbed again don't get me wrong it's in new york city crime happened but when i was listening to the workers as they tell a story something didn't feel right about it so what i did was i took the workers one at a time out individually and basically right now i just used a different tactic i took my gun put it in a mouth tell me the truth and one by one all them told me what i want to hear that crazy cly robbed the spot and he said to tell us that the same guys that robbed it before rob it again bingo so i got my answer so is sybil mim somehow tied to crazy clyde yes that was his girlfriend okay okay so that's crazy clyde's girlfriend yes so tell me about the situation how you ended up meeting up with civil ship with civil uh mems um what happened was when crazy when i found out that crazy was responsible for robbing the spot what i did was i paid him back then we didn't have cell phones dan we had pages so i paid him he pays me back y'all he won't call me back and i'm saying look man the same guys that robbed the spot before robert again what i want to do is i want to pay you five thousand dollar piece it's supposed to be three guys i wanna give you five thousand a piece for you to take care of him he said cool so we made an arrangement for me and him to meet up so it just so happened um we set up a date i met him by cypress hill projects across the street at this bodega so we on in front of the bodega so it just so happened i'm thinking it's going to be him so he came and he got civil with him and he got this other guy big bronco with him so i got my driver so as we did we discussing it and i'm trying to explain to him look you know this will happen that's what i need you to do that's what i want you to do so during that period of time you got sirens cops you're going back and forth because that area is hot so i just asked him i said look man you strapped you got guns yeah man i said come on man let's put that [ __ ] up go put it up and let's go over this area and let's scope the area and see if we can find these guys so you know what you look who you're looking for whatever so for some reason he told bronco to come with him to put the gun up and he told sybil to get in the car with us and i'm looking at the driver the driver looking at me and we kind of like scratching the head like like damn what's going on with that my intention was i know i want to get him i'm going to get him that's my whole attention so now he threw a monkey wrench in my program so she wanted to get in the car with us so as we drove off and you know we went like you know um up to like you know picking the hemlock and we got there i told him pull over and it's like probably like one ish in the morning and i went to the store and i got a bottle of period water and a pack of double mint gum and i got back in the car and he drove up and said pull up he pull up to the side of the welfare building and i just told her get out so i went out of the passionate side got her out of the back seat of passionate side and i said get out so she got out and i pull out my gun it was like a 38 long and i'm saying why did your man rob a spot so she's telling me i don't know what you're talking about i said come on don't lie to me y'all like the barney and clyde the key is if he do something you know everything that he do so like i was just trying to just get information out of her but in that moment as i'm talking to her it's like i pulled the trigger and when i pulled the trigger you know it hit her in the stomach and she went down and fell in the fetal position i'm like oh [ __ ] because that was not my intention to kill her i was like how can i say got caught up in the moment trying to get more information to confirm what i already know but i shot her so that moment i'm saying to myself oh [ __ ] i'm going to jail she's going to tell so that's when i'm saying i'm not going to jail so i want ben and now and putting a gun to a you know in the temple and pull the trigger and even in that moment when that took place it's like i knew that's what i had to do to protect myself so i got back in the car and the driver is shaking up i said look this is what we're gonna do we're going back to euclid sutter we're gonna wait for clyde and we're gonna finish him off and we're gonna go from there but guess what you didn't do nothing you didn't see anything so you don't know nothing so we went we left her there and we went back to southern euclid as we went back to southern euclid it's like we got there and as we got there it's like cop cars everywhere so i'm like what the hell is going on and like prior before we left they was going back and forth so now i got a gun on me with a you know with her body on it now and i want to get him but it's like timing so automatically you know what let's get out of here so we got out here took the gun threw it in the pond and switched went back to laguardia airport and switched to rent-a-car she had two kids or more more than two kids she had more than two kids she had more than two kids i say three of i'm not sure i know she has seven okay so here's this woman who has three or four kids you're in the car with her and amari that's the driver yeah that's the name i utilize okay he's in the car with you you're trying to get information out of her you shoot her in the stomach and then realizing that if she survives she's going to testify against exactly then put the put the gun to her head and kill her yes what did you do with the body at that point cause you guys are in the car yeah we're in the car no see that's why okay when i got the store we went the block and when i we went up the block next to the welfare center i got out and i got her to get out the car so we on the sidewalk we on the street at the time and as i'm questioning her and i'm asking why did your man why did cly rob the spot and she's we don't know what you talking about you know no i said come on y'all like the bonnie of clyde you know if you he do something you down with him or whatever so my objective is like i say how can i say i i was not that was not my tension see a lot of times people say something's premeditated i had no intention of getting her i had every attention get in the clyde so once i pulled the trigger and she fell and i'm like ah [ __ ] and once she fell i put the gun to her head and squeezed the trigger because i'm saying to myself nah i'm not going to jail so you just kill this woman and you shot other people before yeah but but this is the first person you've killed that i know yeah exactly that that they that they know of that i did yeah you know no let's keep it straight that i did well that you did okay but one one murder it doesn't matter i got several members one murders too many right what did you feel in that very moment when you executed her you know what like literally man you know i couldn't even say i wasn't there like literally like when you lose yourself i lost myself i was gone you know it's like then i you know what did i feel i didn't feel i was gone it's like i went i crossed the dark side i was like you know because here it is when that situation happened you had because i was that close when i pulled the trigger you had brain matter like stuff flew into my face like that's how close she was so it's not like you know what did i feel it's like i was going like that individual that i was it's like i i was going i lost my mind i was not in the right state at that present time i was a sick individual during that period of time in my life were you sober when all this was happening i didn't get high you didn't get hydrated i didn't get high i got high at my early age hanging out you know smoking weed i didn't smoke weed this is this crime happened in 1986 the last time i spoke a joint when i was doing a bid doing thanksgiving in 1982. the last time i had any type of dana drink was probably in 1979 1980 because no and that's what my guy says everybody just hang out with me man if you got high you really have been crazy i didn't get high yeah so you kill this woman and then amari the driver gets picked up by the police yeah he got what what happened was right after we did it and right after like i told you we went back to southern euclid and you know i told you cops was everywhere and to me i'm like they can't know what we just did but it was too hot for us to stay there because i got a gun with us you know and it got a body on it so we went back to the airport you know we threw the gun in the lake and we exchanged rent a car and during that whole period of time i always listen you don't know nothing you don't see nothing don't say nothing you don't have nothing to do with this don't admit nothing and you write what what i'm happening i dropped him off at his girlfriend house i went somewhere to um this young lady house because i was trying to give me alibi and basie right now where's the alibi was gonna be look where was you saying that you know i got to your house around 11 o'clock how do you know you got this house eleven o'clock eyewitness news channel seven was on okay when did he left he didn't leave until i left he took me to work you know saying six o'clock in the morning that was gonna be my alibi but guess what she had pneumonia she was in the hospital so she couldn't be my alibi so when i dropped him off after you know i couldn't find an alibi so what wanted happening he worked for general motors this kid had a good job working for general motors and austin like terrytown new york next to sing-sing and what he used to do on his days off he came back to the hood opposed to him like you s you escaped the concrete jungle but he kept coming back so when i told him you don't know nothing they wanted he'd come back down and when he came back down they picked them up and when they picked him up they told him look we know he didn't do nothing we know glaze is through you got a chance what happened so he took advantage of that he told him what what happened right and he made a deal with him he made a deal with the police and was the deal basically testify against glaze and they're going to drop charges against them no the deal was like i said right now is you make a deal you confirm it because they didn't have no witness he's the only witness that actually seen what took place so basically the deal was f you know we got him a lawyer that's how i knew he made a deal because when he got arrested i got him my lawyer and when i got to my lawyer you know what you pay me for when he pointing a finger at you okay so did they charge you at this point or it took a little no what they did was um once he got arrested i was up at auburn correctional facility seeing one of my buddies he had 25 life and you know i called back home and when i called home my mother was saying that you know somehow some some detectives stopped by and was looking for me and what i was telling her i said look don't worry about it i said what i'm gonna do go to my lawyer office monday and we go see what they talking about so what what i'm happening is i got back down and as i got back down to the city um that was a crazy day man march march march let me see first second 1986 when i got back down man i got shot at twice that night and notion and uh no string and um sent mark and another group tried to kill me and then you turn around in cyprus somebody else tried to kill me but we'll want to happen i got picked up the very next day and they picked me up for jonathan maxwell penn murder and they picked me up for silver men's murder and that right well and then when you talk about the shootouts i guess uh sybil's brother got into a shootout with you yeah we got into um a few shootouts you know basically right now you know like i said yeah he defended his sister honor you know but like that's the crazy part about it was with the guy made so rest in peace and like i say black like i told you that i [ __ ] up on that one like i said i [ __ ] up on all of them but the guy wasn't built like that but he was defending sister honor right i guess uh sybil's baby father oh yeah baby face he's a gangster he and like he was like the real deal he was already on a run for bank robbery and he killed i guess a security guard in the bank so he was already on a run but you're on a run why the hell you hanging out in cyprus man i would pick more places to be than cyprus so he's there so while he's there you know like i say that you know okay he's looking for me so a couple of times like you know i heard i got the word that yo this guy's supposed to be looking for you he's a dangerous individual whatever and the funny part about it when i got one of it you know okay cool like let me go look for him i used to go back to the area look you're looking for me here i am not knowing like a few times this cat one time like you know um this gentleman came up on me and asked for a light and i'm saying but i had my hand on a 44 like i'm saying um magnum so when he asked for light i got my hand on it so it's like right i don't smoke man but not knowing that was him so that's how close he was well eventually you did get picked up yeah and you turn yourself in yeah after i ran out the court after i ran out of court like the the crazy thing about it how they wind up doing it sometime with the justice system they took a lie and match it with the truth because despite that amari got arrested and he said i was a trigger man the government the state they need corroboration evidence his word wasn't good enough so they need something to match that to bring me to trial or to arrest me that's why when they picked me up on march 2nd for the jonathan maxwell murder and the civil men's murder you know right now i laid up you know went from one precinct to another present and they my lawyer murray cutler called and they had to let me go why they had to let me go because of fact i'm not saying anything they didn't have nothing so it took a few months later silverman's brother lied to me and say that she saw he saw me at a crowd you know what happened was he said he was going to a crowded white castle restaurant on atlantic avenue and that i saw him and when i saw him i'm on like you know atlantic avenue you got three like highway going to do one way another go another way and as he was crossing he said my window rolled down and he said i'll point out like pull out a gun and start shooting at him on a busy intersection and he ran into this restaurant white castle fully crowded especially on a friday night going to saturday morning did i ran after him into the white castle and i pull him and pull out my gun i'm going to kill you the same way i kill your sister so that never happened you got a bunch of people there this crackhead was able to say that i told them that and they arrested me for that that was the cooperation well but amari was still set to testify again no but he couldn't testify because it was only his word they didn't even charge me i wasn't even in charge they had a mari so they didn't pick me up until a couple months later after this incident took place because it was nothing there okay but apparently amari was too scared to testify against you eventually when it came down to trial when it came down to the actual trial once like what happened was amari got arrested and like you know what march the first part of march 86 um when they picked me up they didn't have nothing they couldn't hold me so april like the end of april april of 86th in april they wanted to pick at me and tut up because the guys say that we try to kill him but they wind up using what he said to corroborate what mario was saying and that's how they was able to charge me on the murder so when i was going to court me and tuck was going to court for the tent murder after we got bail out and as i was going to court tech got into an incident with the um court officers and they kicked them out of court so now i went downstairs to see what the hell was going on because my lawyer wasn't there so as i got back on the elevator it was a detective that was on the elevator and when he was on the elevator he had a foul and his friend first of all he had a foul in his in his hand but i ain't really paid the mind so one of the detectives hey hey bro how long you been at the 75th precinct that's my present so now i'm looking at this guy then i look at the file that he had in his hand and she said with men's name on it so to me two and two equal four so they went to the same courtroom that i went into so that's what they was going to do they were going real they was going to arrest me for the silver men's murder but i ran out what did you do to omari to get him not to testify against you because he had a deal in place already yeah he had a deal in place but you know once again it was like you know you know like i say he decided it was a guess it was in his best interest not to testify it was in his best interest did he decide or something done to him to convince he was no i couldn't touch it you know the funny part about it before the actual trial like we were separated from one another he was an adolescent i was an adult but they put us in the same bullpen they shouldn't have but we talk and you know right now certain things would arrange and like i said right now man like you know he knew he was wrong so he dropped it the funny part about it before i started trial i was in a bullpen because for some reason like i built up a reputation and the correction officer they put me in the bullpen with him and crazy and he said glaze okay you can't do nothing you can talk to but you can't do nothing and to me that's their job they trusted me that enough and i had that type of respect that i went in the bullpen with them i didn't do anything and amari didn't testify crazy didn't testify you went to trial and you were acquitted for murder yes even though i was guilty you even though you were guilty and because you're acquitted you could actually talk about it now yes because there's no there's no double jeopardy situation to this day do you feel a sense of guilt over killing a woman who she was involved but she wasn't the one that actually robbed you let me tell you something right now man each and every day like i said right now is you know my thing is um uh her brother like passed away a few years ago and before he passed you know just so happened it was a guy you know he was a hell of a figure in new york at the time and i flew to new york then and we was together and while we was together he picked me up from the airport and we was going to visit somebody in off the kill correctional facility and he said yo man i just got a call from light and light say oh man i heard glaze looking for me he wanted to see me or whatever so basically he told him he said man i don't believe that [ __ ] so what he did was while he's on the phone he called a guy he said yo man like what are you talking about glaze looking for you man he said yo man i heard he looking for me he want to see me oh i don't know what's going on and you can see and you can hear it in his voice or whatever he said hold up man let me call glaze mind you he hung up but i'm in the car with him you know he just picked me up from the airport so you know me and him talk then he called the guy back he said look man he said glaze like i talked to him he said look man he want to tell you strip top he's sorry to what happened to your sister he's not looking for you he's not looking for anybody or whatever his thing is right now he regret what happened because i did the bottom line is like this vlad i took mother i'm saying i took you know sister the key was i allow myself to get caught up in this [ __ ] i allow myself to become something and i destroy life and he took the death of my mother to help me realize the life that i destroyed and that type of pain when it hit home you don't want to wish on your worst enemy man so with that being said no i why i'm looking for that man for to tell him i'm sorry i can't do nothing to that situation i'm sorry that was the [ __ ] that i did back then was some low life [ __ ] that should never happen okay so you beat your murder case and you get out and you're essentially a free agent at this point and there are some guys in queens that are making a lot of money pappy mason and lorenzo fat cat nichols yeah now were they in the same crew together cat was the man cat was the big cat was the cat cat was the was the main guy that was it papi worked for him yeah pappy had his own [ __ ] um cat is a chess player cat was like you know initially when pappy came home and pappy got down with cat or whatever cat knew that pappy was a wild card so being that pac-man was a wild card he basically right now as as you know pappy proved himself he gave papi it's his own little area his own little space but pat was loyal because he knew he was a wild card but he kept him close but not close enough to him and what want him happening like you say you see what happened he packed me brung up brung down a whole foundation okay we're going to talk about that in a second so but even before that whole situation happened these guys were suspected of killing brian rooney a parole officer okay this was a 1985 1985 yeah cat so so there's already a lot of heat on this queen's crew yeah and you're not a queens guy you're a brooklyn guy you're essentially an outsider over there i am me and pappy both queens don't like you know the funny part about it is man when everybody's talking about prejudice and racism or whatever prejudice would never exist stop existing because you got it among your own nationality and people don't understand all of us like especially among our people we're a bunch of country bunkers most of our family migrated from the south and they went to california they went to chicago they went to new york so the key is like while we beefing east coast west coast that's a bunch of bs okay so fat cat puts together the round table and the round table consists of who the round table consists of initially was fat cat pappy supreme kenneth mcgriff and gerald prince miller dance was a fishy member and once i got involved i became a member and bugout became a member so it was six of us six people terms of you know just just to kind of understand who the biggest figures were was fat cat and supreme on an equal level was one bigger than the other negative cat was the man the bottom line is right now cat was like probably the biggest figure on the southeast border you know so the key is like um cat was more or less like the mentor basically right now is like with prim prim and prince they you know good guys they had their ups and down and when prim could be a millionaire at one moment and then something happened you know you lose everything cat was the one that always brought him back out always put him back on his feet always front of him package to get back in the game okay so fat cat was the biggest figure there cat was the man all right and everyone had rings i guess yeah everybody cat you know right now was gave us all like you know he you know like like i said right now country bunking if you ever want to meet fat cat or whatever i'm talking about like you know now before he was like big chubby guy now just you know he got muscle everywhere he's a he's a you know workout freak and his thing was he got you know him you know pappy prince prin myself and bug out it's like 40 000 ring round table ring and you know like right now it was amazing when i got my ring and i got arrested for the evan burns murder and i went through right now i had my rings on like you should see man as far as like you know the response that you received from other guys like oh [ __ ] well your ring said eminem money stood for money and murder and that was your crew yeah that was my crew and why'd you call it that you know because that's what i was about at the time you know i was like you know into like i said right now i'm making money and the bottom line was like if anything or anyone got in our way we got them out of our way by murdering them and my thing was with my guys it's like if we miss a hit you know i used to chastise them what the hell i need y'all for i give a bunch of chick my money i can do the murder my damn self and you were essentially the chief enforcer for fat cat yeah all right and you were helping run the drug operation anytime what i needed whatever need to be done i did despite that he it was his organization and that's what people just asked me why you didn't take over i was in greedy the bottom line he gave me opportunity and i was doing great for myself for what of making forty thousand hot day what is there for me to take over the bottom line was like you know to me you take care of people people take care of you all right and and this was all cocaine or other drugs as well you see people don't understand bro like the cocaine cocaine was good but the money is you got to do both it's the dope and the coke because once again you kidding me don't get me wrong crack was good and you learned a lot from that [ __ ] but to me what helped me to make 40 a day was the dope i'm saying period so you doing both all right the heroine yeah okay and where where are these drugs coming from uh we had a connection especially with the iran was with you know this guy chinese guy named john and despite he was chinese he was getting it from the pakistan and he was getting some good [ __ ] all right so this whole thing is running millions of dollars are being made and then pappy mason gets locked up pappy was locked up pappy got locked up back in what i say october 1985 after the bryant rooney murder he got locked up then pappy laid up from october 1985 and he went to trial in february of 1988 and no january 1988 and when he went to trial for the rooney murder he got a hung jury so they lowered his bail for 500 thousand to three hundred thousand and he got bail out and once he got bail out he was out for ten days so the d.a rushing back to trial because when he got arrested he got arrested with a derringer and his boots so they took him back to trial and they convict him on that derringer so that you know that's just to put the hole back on him so once he went back in that's when the burn should happen okay so the burns thing that edward burns he was a nypd rookie officer 22 years old and there was a guyanese immigrant that lived on a drug block and would always call the police [Music] and i guess his house had been fire bombed already a couple times so edward burns was stationed in front of his house to essentially protect him and then that's when the whole situation happened but like you say that guy needs was never in jeopardy the key was right now when that hit was made the cop was the target the guy needs was never that was not even in the play or anything it was just like right now catching an officer off guard and this so happened edward burns the [ __ ] the crazy part about that was i think a night or two before that it was a lady it was a young black young lady that was in the car and they didn't do it because it was a young black lady so a female cop it was a female cop it was a young black female cop that was in the car so right now is that's why they didn't do it well what had happened that night was two guys were lookouts one guy uh walked up uh mcclary so they say snuck up on the driver's side of the car another guy tapped on the window to distract him to wake him up to wake him up oh he was asleep to wake him up okay and as he looked over at the other guy mcclary uh shot him multiple times five times i believe and killed him at which point all hell broke loose and and they said that pappy mason was the one that ordered the hit yes can you talk about that part yeah i could talk about that part um even when that happened that day that night that morning rather i just left that block and it was me bug out i left there i probably had like 40 50 000 cash on me that day and when that happened it's like the very next day i got a call a page i was getting paid and the page i was getting like you know like back then like 9-1-1 so when i call it back it was a guy that had this bodega that mean bug out was down on so he got huge spanish guy i could barely understand what he was saying but he was saying cops was everywhere so as he was telling me like you know cop was everywhere so i'm trying to say you know what they must be have seen something that a sale was made don't worry about it something's gonna happen they're gonna leave but i didn't understand what was going on at the time because i just gotten up but as i sat in my cypress headquarter and then the news like you know came on where as far as like you know the radio station we interrupt this program and they start talking about a rookie police was executed execution style on 107 inward i'm like whoa oh [ __ ] now that's why the heat is on so during that period of time my mind is racing like for something to happen of that magnitude in our area chances are i would knew about it ahead of time based upon my position but i didn't know so i was kind of feeling warm and fuzzy about it that that hit didn't come from us so all day long i stay home i stay at my sniper's apartment i'm getting calls from everybody i'm getting calls from people on bikers island people in prison pappy called me back and forth with cat girlfriend because nobody heard from cat so what want them happening i waited till the end of the night when it got pitch black and then i went to queens because queens at that time was so hot that you can take a cigarette and lit a cigarette off the ground because that's how it was and when i went out there that night and i met with everybody at cat sister house i said look this my way of thinking whoever did this [ __ ] they did it to make our area hot they trying to take over or whatever and they put us like in the fire making people think that we're responsible for this [ __ ] so i said look once i find out who's responsible for it they gone i'm gonna kill them all and at that very moment after the meeting i got pulled to the side when i got pulled to the side it was like look i did it and that hit came from pappy i'm like oh [ __ ] and see i talked to pappy earlier and you listen to pap and you listen to our communication no indication enough well papi was locked up during that time right he was back locked up that's why like i told you to hit happen because he got remanded back and they sent him the trial and he got convicted of having that derringer in his boots why would pappy mason order a police officer to get killed on a block that he was associated with knowing the repercussions of something like that you know what man like that's a billion dollar question because once again that's why we got the round table in place the round table in place for reason the key is right now where it's like when that's the difference that's why you got you know you got people you can talk to when you take [ __ ] upon yourself and you make a move like that and you don't consult you got here it is thinkers and you got doers and sometimes you don't have somebody like pappy is a doer obviously he wasn't thinker because he just lost himself and he's lost four good cats they've been in jail since 1980 1988 31 years he destroyed a whole organization behind that one move well all four guys that were involved in that they got picked up like a week later you want to hear something block like you said they got picked up a week later guess what when they picked them up they picked me up first right they picked me up first and what they did was because during that period of time everybody from the city from the 103 preset to the 113 present to my priest and 75th president they they they came together who did this [ __ ] everybody say brian glaze gibbs brian glaze gibbs is the one they bet they like they pension this this is the person that was crazy enough got the balls enough to do with it so guess what they picked me up when they picked me up it was three guys with me pappy uncle and two other guys and guess what they let them go and they charged me with a murder that i did do but during the same time burn got killed that was a murder that i did but they let these guys go and they took me through the whole system and next to you know while i'm on rikers island next to you know they start having a reward i think the reward got to like 40 000 that's when you know some of the family members turned these guys in for that reward and everybody name came up except for who brian glaze gibbs happy name came up happy name came up everybody named but my name came back up on it okay so the four guys were ultimately charged and i guess there was a videotaped confession where they talked about bragging about what had happened they talked about how pappy mason put him up to it and they all ended up getting 25 to life yes and they're still in prison to this day are you still in prison all four of them all four of them okay and the repercussions of this went way beyond new york worn drugs uh oh yeah the war on drugs was sort of based on this this murder of this rookie cop uh president ronald reagan personally called the burn family to offer condolences and then when george h.w bush started running for for presidents he actually had the badge of edward burns on the campaign trail and he would show it as he was talking about being tough on the uh exactly and all of this happened in in a situation that you were you know not personally associated with this situation but you're part of that whole crew so i was guilty by association technicality well right around the same time that edward burns got murdered there was a whole situation with clifton rice yes now i guess he was there when a friend of yours got robbed yes exactly and i took it personally it's like even right now probably simultaneously during the time that edward burns being executed i shot and killed you know i'm saying clifton rice and what wound up happening with that situation was like i had got back from queens to brooklyn and to me like i was just watching it's like i don't know late in the morning and you watching people as they enter an exiting and as like i'm watching you know him entering and getting close to me he's like you know okay cool we actually slapped five and he walked past me and he walked past me and dawned on me that when i was incarcerated fighting the civil men's murder he was there when a buddy of mines was robbed and he didn't do anything to stop it he didn't prevent it so to me that was like come on that's a no-no whereas if you was there and you could prevent something from happening you didn't do anything or whatever you're guilty you're part of it so at that present time yeah i i i did some stupid [ __ ] i you know more or less like went after this individual and you know did you know murder him that night now that morning because of something that happened in the past with one of my friends so this is the second person you murdered um no because like right now if you're going by the timeline by that time there's a few more before him okay because ultimately you you admitted to five murders later on and two attempt murders later on uh is that five plus sybil or is that five total including sybil six including civil six including civil so how many other murders happened in between the sybil and the clifton rice murder um maisha um maisha no maurice bellamy a guy that his father the the maurice mel bellamy his son was implicated cat and papi in the parole of murder and maisha is like cat girlfriend happy before clifton writes one okay well the guy that was involved in the the parole officer murder where he was going to testify against somebody yeah basically right now he don't want his statement like like i don't know i think he's still in his statement was like like you know cat gave the order pappy was there but his state was all wrong like he kind of like made up a story and got himself convicted and from my understand i think he's still in jail but what happened was like all along sit back and think about it papi was the only one indicted for officer on parole officer um rooney murder then as time went on cat got indicted for rooney murder then once cat got indicted for rooney murder it was like now it became a sense of urgency you know something got to be done and the plot was to kill a family member to have this guy come down to the funeral and what we was gonna do is we're gonna tranquilize like the officers like you know the correction officer the cops that bring them down we're gonna hit them with like you know tranquilizer and we was gonna execute this guy but the guy never came to the funeral i went to court as he appeared in front of the judge and said look they shot and killed my father they want me to come to the funeral i'm not going anywhere all right and then maisha i guess was stealing drugs and money yeah my issue was staging fake robbery like you know you know they'll drop off large sum of money a large sum of drugs and she hit the workers and basically right now where it's like if cat in jail cat was married cat had a bunch of different girls or whatever and myisha just happened to be one of them so basically right now where it's like she staged a robbery one too many that you know cat decided it's time for her to go so you were involved and i guess the kidnapping and murder of this girl maisha yeah yes okay so now this is the second woman that you're responsible for killing yeah and then there was clifton and then there was the i guess the father where he's been me yes yeah who am i missing now keith reedy and artel benson what happened to those two um keith reedy was part of the allah justice crew and a lot of justice crew they were responsible for throwing a fire bomb in fat cat mother house and they were responsible for my um one of my guys christopher brothers on hollywood being murdered so that happened with you know he was part of that so when he was going to war he's part of the camp right now the firebomb situation oh man they uh well a war was happening and someone threw a molotov cocktail inside fat cat's mother's house yes and in the process a bunch of the family members got burned but fat cat's sister who i guess was in a wheelchair couldn't get out of the house and she died in the fire yeah you look what you say see only one person what what up happening was during that period of time i just left there i left that place mama house probably like 45 minutes to an hour ago and when i left mama told me a poser going upstairs she was on the couch and she lay down and as she lay down on the couch and then next thing she knows she heard something then she see that you know the cocktail came through the house or whatever and what she was trying to do and mama was a petite thing mama was probably like five feet five feet at that and right now she tried to put the fire out and once she realized that she couldn't put the fire out and these guys were shooting at the time once she realized she couldn't put the fire out she alert her husband who was mom was 71 her husband was 75 her daughter that died in the house was 51 was in the wheelchair her great-great-grandson was four one was ten one was twelve and out of everybody the 10 year old got burned real bad and you know what blade it wasn't up until like last night i thought about it why the hell did he got burned real bad and he dawned on me you know why he got burned real bad out of everybody he was trying to save his damn grandmother and i didn't you know how what i'm just trying to say sometimes you'd be too close to the situation you understand what's going on but when you start reminiscing start thinking about it everybody else escaped but he knew that she couldn't get out so he went back to try to save her that's why he got burned so bad because he was trying to save his grandmother that was in a wheelchair how did fat cat react to something this horrific happening you know what like honestly calm very very calm and it's ironic because once again i took it personal i took it more personal than he took it because once they threw that fire bomb into his mother home and you sit back and think about like what happened every and i i'm looking at it his mother could have died his stepfather and his you know you know um nieces and nephew granny says and grand nephew and when i went to see him i had certain things set up that you know when i'm on a night visit with him in shawanga max a joint he's up at the very front and me and him talking and i told him my plans i said look at this particular time i got my guys they was dressed up as housing new york city housing fedex and ups and at this specific time they would be going in to people homes in what they're going to do when they get into these homes they're going to murder everybody father mother grandfather ground kids everything and he told me no despite his sister was laid up in a casket despite he could have lost his whole family and he looked at me and told me no i'm saying hold on wait my way of thinking back then is look we got to set a hell of an example we gotta let these individuals know first of all what rules or what part of the game you involve civilian innocent people these that's like a no no you don't involve innocent people in this his mother didn't have nothing to do with this his you know step pops his you know niece and nephew didn't have nothing to do with it but yet and still they didn't give a [ __ ] they went ahead and threw that fire bomb in there because the guy that was responsible for kidnapping his wife told these guys the fiber center that i was going to war with look y'all want glaze i want cat glazed live at this address i never lived there but yet and still y'all shooting y'all doing some l.a [ __ ] that drive-by i don't believe in that you're doing a drive-by you don't even see nobody one o'clock in the morning you throwing cocktail you sh come on man all right so then at one point new york finally just had enough and they started something called operation horse collar operational yes where entire buildings in cyprus hill projects got shut down and raided and i guess they actually found dead bodies inside the buildings that was the rumors bloodhead blood let's let's get real man like you know like when you listen to some of these stories and like that's what i heard because once again was when they came doom day was edward burns got killed in february of 1988 and they put together the federal task force and they came up with operation horse collar and on august 11 1988 they came with the federal raid they hit new york they hit um new jersey they hit alabama they hit virginia they hit everywhere and just so happened when they picked everybody i wasn't there i was nowhere around so i was officially i got a call that morning six o'clock that morning august 11 and the call in other end say look i don't know whether they're looking for you are they looking for me but fez is everywhere and like that's when you hear the rumors about they found like a bunch of money drugs and a bunch of dead bodies who the hell gonna keep dead body in an apartment man let's get real that's what i was thinking well 30 people got arrested but you were on the run and you're actually featured on america's most wanted you know what i didn't see that part you know like i say anything i didn't see it but i heard about it you heard about it yeah okay and you actually tried to get plastic surgery done at one point yes i did man yes i yes i yes i did man like i'm here i tried and i had a guy line up in new york and he was gonna do it then was the afterthought okay if i do it then i know what you look like then you're going to kill me like no you know but it became sometimes your reputation could perceive itself i try to get them in la no well and then you were finally arrested yeah unfortunately uh how do they catch you they caught me in on south carolina i'm about to have our anniversary november 10th man um the crazy thing about it is this like the way i used to travel i should travel like first class open tickets so i can travel anytime i want to travel not knowing that would come back and bite me on my ass so in november 88 on like i said right now i was down there and you know because i had a newborn i had my son my son was born august 1st that's what stopped me from being at the raid in the first place because on august 11 he had a doctor appointment that's why i was in new york anyway but they would have went to the cypress address i've been left that address alone so as that day november 10th i woke up that morning kind of you know right now feeling kind of good and what happened was i wanna i said well i'm leaving that day so my wife was at my mother home we had got a baby mansion built from the ground up and i went to a barber shop and i went to got my hair cut and as i was in barbershop my sister dropped my mother off because like a unisex so she was in there waiting and something that she had said to herself well at least if they pick up my son he got a haircut the only mother would say something like that or whatever so anyway when i was finished and she was finished i was dropping her off in town and as i'm taking her i noticed like i was being tailed i'm like oh [ __ ] the feds and it's like right now man like it's just so obvious so i wound up dropping off but they got off me they call themselves trying to play it off they put somebody else on me so i wanna getting my niece and my stepson at the time put them in the car took her to mcdonald we in south carolina we went to the mcdonald's and like literally as i got to the mcdonald's i'm about to take them out the car i see the same i'm like oh [ __ ] they got me and i got an id on me but the id was in my jeep under my benzie box we used to have this you know the busy box you can put in and put out so i had an id and the id my name at the time was wade johnson and i got it from california when i was on a run see and i kept that in mind like damn i'm about to get arrested if i try to produce that id and you give it to the feds they can give you five more years for lying to them so i just left that there i took my stepson and my niece into the mcdonald's as soon we got into mcdonald black they jumped from behind the counter everywhere and slapped three sets of handcuffs on me and arrested me okay and what were you being charged with initially initially 21 usc 848 on career um criminal um career criminal enterprise cce continued criminal enterprise on 21 usc 846 conspiracy drugs and 21 usc 841 distribution that was an issue charge okay and fat cat was still awaiting trial himself as well during that time fat cat was already arrested on august 11. they brought him and pappy back down when they arrested all 30 everybody they burned them down for state joint when they got to the bullpen they see that you know their mother was there his wife his girlfriend his you know his nieces everybody happy mother everybody was arrested during that same period of time and they all met in the eastern district courtroom okay so now you're being charged along with your whole crew basically yeah and then there was a situation where you and fat cat talked about who was gonna go to trial first yeah that was the situation what happened was when i got picked up on when i got picked up in um south carolina i got a lawyer i paid this guy barry krell he's top notch down there and basically the first thing kevin's mouth look man i can get you out but you got to make a deal i'm like get the hell out of here man so we had a hearing and doing that hearing during the whole process hell of a presentation and what kind of jammed me and jerked me was the fact that where you get your income from well i'm unemployed you know i i leach off my mom's but what jerked me was because the government was saying when the raid happened law enforcement i got we got somebody in you know the agency in the u.s you know the fbi somebody tip us off somebody tipped me off that's why i didn't get arrested up there but my defense was not i had an open ticket you know so to me that's what it was like i had an open ticket first class ticket so when the judge ruled he said look man you got an open ticket not just an open ticket or open first class ticket i'm a judge i make a decent salary and to me anybody that can get an open ticket in this first class that mean they don't value money so that's the [ __ ] that sync being denied me bail so by that time the state you know new york had dropped a couple of bodies on me and you know i got denied belle and got extraordinary back to new york city and that's when like you said with the conversation with me and kat whereas like once you get there and once you see everything that's going on and i got a lawyer um murray cutler his son represent um john gotti bruce cutler and he came to see me and that's my lawyer so i'm paying him to take the case he told me straight up top look man perry mason couldn't get you out of this man i'm not taking your money you know you don't don't pay for [ __ ] that you've done only way you're not getting around this one you know i'm saying period so he was honest with me you know how many lawyers were to take your money and say like later for you know you done but that's the relationship that we have so when i went to cat i said look they want you they want me they want pappy they want john let your moms your wife you know seeing your nieces and nephew let everybody go against us like happy moms let my you know we mean this main country we had the same father you know said different let them go against us we gonna get life cat you know look at me my eyes and say nah you go to trial first and let's see what i got against you then i go to trial and like i say vlad as i'm listening to that y'all i hold up timeout man you already got 25 life i don't got [ __ ] and to the degree that's the second time that he saved my life because it got me to think outside of the box well you apparently pled guilty to five murderers and two attempts all right initially i just played guilty they dropped the 848 and they just gave me the drug charges but what happened was new york city the homicide detectives they had a pissy fit they didn't like that they felt the feds would let me get away with murder so what happened we wind up going back and revisit the situation because what new york city was saying at the time that i averaged one murder a week from the time i got acquitted june 22nd 1987 until the time i got arrested november 10th 1988 that i averaged one murder a week so it's like oh wait a minute you starting to see what direction that was going in y'all trying to give me every unsolved murder that was out there based upon my reputation so what we did was we came back and changed that indictment in a round that i played guilty to racketeering so i played guilty to racketeering the drug charges including the five murders and two two attempt murders so once i did that then that's when everything changed well you i guess admitted to murders that they didn't even know that you were responsible for exactly exactly okay and not only that like see that's a different like you know right now you might talk about rap snitch cooperation the key is this right now what i talked about i did cooperate any time you sit down and talk to law enforcement agency regards what that's cooperation that's a snitch that's a rat and i can accept that but the key is not nobody can say guess what glaze put me in jail blade testified against me people going to come back and say well you didn't testify because your co-defendant pled guilty pappy went to trial my brother country mark gonz went to trial herman brother went to trial i never took a stand see it's a different and people that i did admit to i was involved with crimes and murder they was already dead so you mean to tell me we gonna take dead victim and bring it back from the cemetery and put them up on charges no that's not gonna happen no i've made a statement about and right now all the [ __ ] that me and kat did together all the [ __ ] that i was responsible for what he did and i did i had to come clean because when he made a deal if i say we didn't do that then he put it on me then i look like a liar then it's no deal okay did you talk about what pappy mason did me and pepe do you famous see that's the difference me and pappy never really conducted any business the bottom line is i didn't work for papi i worked for cat so that's the difference well you ended up getting eight years and eight months and no i got 10 years 10 years 10 years but based upon good time i did eight months eight years and 17 days okay the average person is going to look at someone who pled guilty to five murders and getting 10 years in prison as just craziness it is crazy like i didn't make the rules black the key is this everybody talk about the game we talk about a game a game this is the game the drug game this is a street game and the key is what everybody talk about you play what do you play sports yeah what'd you play i played tennis you play and what else wrestled wrestle okay cool when you play what you did you played the what to win to win so the bottom line right now is here it is basketball football tennis wrestling spay domino when you play in that game you plan to win so to me how many time even being younger being immature that you know what here it is you know you about to lose so before you can lose what happened man y'all cheating i quit that's the same [ __ ] with the game everybody start talking about rules and regulations it's no rules and regulation the game if you get a million one years and you die in jail you lost if you basically right now is get a you know right now it's got die of a balanced death you lost so when everybody starts talking about the [ __ ] game who to say right is right and wrong is wrong who to say right is not wrong and wrong is not right all this [ __ ] people start talking about is a bunch of [ __ ] even i'm gonna bring up a personal scenario when they talk about nikki barnes nikki bond was a great [ __ ] i met nikki barnes as kid nikki was 30 years you know saying older than me and when i met the late great nikki barnes or whatever he took me like because you know i was wild i was young and he took me on his wings and when he took me on his wings and what a lot of mother didn't like that highly intelligent into his own little private world see everybody talking about oh well nick flipped he told on god he did this and that you give all these [ __ ] a chance right now all these street guys all these people that's talking about being true to the cold you go to each and every one right now and the government giving them a deal to get the hell out of there you know what they're gonna do they're gonna make a damn deal only person who's not gonna make a deal is [ __ ] how with pappy mason you know why because howard pappy mason is too caught up everybody worrying about what people are gonna think and what people are gonna say you know when you start talking about the only thing i'm mad about me brian glazed give and what i did with the cooperation what i'm mad about i was too smart to get caught up in this [ __ ] in the first place i should have been working being a good guy from the very beginning but i was fronting you fall in love with the wrong thing the [ __ ] street well i've interviewed a lot of street figures over the years i interviewed little d from oakland he was the crack king of oakland by like i know the story told that's what story phillips mitch felix met you nephew felix yeah kind of his nephew sort of like a play nephew but yeah definitely uh associated with felix mitchell when he got caught up at like 20 years old he took a 30-year uh well i i i don't think it was a deal i think he blew trial and got 30 years didn't tell on anybody and obama pardoned him uh obama gave him a few years off at the very end but he ended up doing damn near 30 years uh you know we'll go ahead and play the clip about how he basically was offered deals was offered to tell on people but based on the way he was raised he knew that once he got caught he knew the game he knew the consequences he knew the consequences it was those conversations with my older partners who told me man you jump off the porch you get caught up for whatever you choose to do you gotta accept the consequences because if you tell we gonna kill you see that's what i that's the offer i come from a bunch i come up under the different cloth you know and so i heard guys saying to me like man how can you do all that time i didn't i don't it wasn't a choice i didn't have no option didn't nobody make me do what i did i did it because i chose to do it so i had to accept what came with that you know i recently interviewed convertible bert from miami similar situation uh he was you know he was selling a lot of you know moving a lot of cocaine and crack he ultimately got caught did 25 years in prison didn't tell anyone got out did his time the way you have to move back then you know you really don't really own none of that stuff because you can't pout you can't you can't account for it so you know when it go bad everything go this way that way you know what i'm saying most street guys would look at you and say that you're a rat hey like i said right now guess what i accept that i'm not here to prove a point about whether i write i didn't the key is i made a deal anytime you sit down talk to like you're like right like for example like i told you beforehand they try to give me a murder a week from june 87 to november 88 and even right now is guess what i remember when i made a deal for racketeering and then when i was able to sit down and talk to them they bring up all the murders that's supposed to have did and one murder like it was two murders in particular they like you know well you killed two people on june 17 1987. um i killed two people on june 20 june 17 1987 in the fourth green section of brooklyn okay so to me you got a bunch of people around so i'm actually i said detective brew when did i turn myself into you you turn yourself into me look at his record may 5th 1986 okay did i get a bell no you did not get a bell so okay when did i get acquitted june 22nd 1987. so sir you telling me i killed two people in brooklyn north um homicide in the fourth green section on june 17 1987. so that mean the war in the reichs island let me out kill two people and let me come back so when you sit back and think about it it's like to me like like you say black you're right uh when you cooperate and you sit down and talk to these people it's a deal so to me i'm not here to like battle about did i write did i cooperate nobody gonna come along and say brian glazed kid put me in jail brian glaze gibbs you know testify against me you're not going to hear that so me and my objective is later for the [ __ ] how do we stop the snitching how did we stop these kids from making that multi-billion dollar prison system their permanent address look to me i don't give a damn what nobody thinks at this present time you know why i don't have no problem with that i am comfortable with my own skin everybody tempers were getting in trouble prize will keep us there everybody want to play that tough guy [ __ ] oh i didn't rat i didn't do any of that or whatever but guess what man everybody each his own the game is the game the game is how you play the bottom line you play to win and you know what i'd have been in there with life you know dying in there sitting by my toilet bowl on medication going blood blood blood out of my damn mind and you know what i'm good with that man so rat snitch guess what i had not had nobody came to me personally when i'm in new york when i go back and visit people nobody came to me personally and you're right you're a snitch well freeway ricky ross is a regular guest on my show okay hi rick and and uh he was one of the biggest drug dealers uh really in america okay you know his his drug operation was tied into the iran contra scandal and so oliver north yeah yep all that and his plug uh louis blandon was the one that ended up telling on him he was working with the government ended up testifying against him and freeway rick ended up getting life in prison okay so if he got life in prison how is he home well he eventually managed to beat the case oh okay he he showed he basically uh showed that the continuing criminal enterprise charge they got him with was somewhat of a double jeopardy situation so he was able to to basically get that life sentence down to like whatever uh 15 okay because like i say once you get life for the feds you're not giving that [ __ ] back now i'm just saying it's very rare okay he ended up he ended up he ended up getting it getting part of his charge reversed and he ended up getting out he's been out for a little while now so when he first got locked up he was angry here is this guy that he made millions of dollars for and that he trusted and so forth who ended up telling on him and then he reached a point during a sentence he had a moment of clarity when he realized that snitching is a part of the drug game so if you're going to be selling drugs and doing those types of activities you have to accept the fact that you will get snitched on you can't just look at it as oh this guy wasn't loyal or this this wasn't supposed to happen and i trusted him if you're going to be selling drugs on any level you will get told on and you have to go into the game with that realization i accept if you in the drug business somebody's gonna snitch on you okay and once he realized that that's when he said okay the mistake was actually his own and then he started working on getting himself out and that's what ultimately got him out if he was just still angry about being snitched on he'll still be in prison to this day and see that's a great point and that's another thing too is like to me like i look at that like you say right now was initially being in love with the street being part of the street culture i didn't kill witness i didn't stab witness so right now the most hardest decision when i made that decision it's like oh wait a minute here and that's the difference whereas i can remember me and pappy mason having that conversation when i told him i said look this one i'm about to do and it was just me and him and we in the attorney conference room and mcc on the ninth floor just me and him i said look this is what i'm about to do bro i said if you feel i'm wrong you can take the razor out your dread and cut me a cup of my throat like glazed hazy i love you like a brother yo what everybody gonna think what everybody gonna say but just like i say blood like nobody gonna come along and say like you know like i say i did sat down and talked to the prosecutor i didn't talk to nypd i'm not going to say the abortion i did but the key is nobody going to say i want the jail because of glaze you know how many people gonna say [ __ ] as much [ __ ] as he know why nothing ever happened to me it wasn't about that and seeing that's what i don't get caught up into that when we start thinking what people think and feel about you then you're in a world of trouble so at this present time me to you hey whatever somebody do that's on them everybody got to be accounted for their own action what's your take on takashi 69 telling on on the rest of his crew and all these guys you know you said that your statements didn't get anybody locked up his statements got a whole bunch of people locked up and like i say it's a different time in era i don't really know nothing about them the key is regardless what like i say is nothing that i really can say about that individual because to me it's a different time and error like i told you right now i don't know nothing about this gang [ __ ] i don't know nothing about him i never followed his music um like i said i saw him you know who he is with the colorful hair and the tattoo or whatever but in all honesty he did what he feel was best for himself yeah well brian glaze gibbs i appreciate you sharing uh the story you and we talked about this throughout the interview there are six people that you killed that you've admitted to over the years those people have children those people have grandchildren have grandchildren they they had parents that may or may not be alive today they have siblings they have close friends they have wives girlfriends people that that loved and respect do you feel any sense of remorse over that whole situation yes yes yes like i say i hate myself because of that the key is i was brought up in the christianity environment i allow myself to become a lost sheep and came astray like you know here it is right now i'm glad like the change in fact in my life is when my mother died when i lost my mother the key was and then you ever reflect like even when i got sentenced and i had to go in front of the judge judge edward corman and to me i had to come clean i can't blame fat cat pappy anybody for what i did i did what i did because that's what i wanted to do because i want to be down i wanted to be cool so i destroyed life i was part of killing people hurting people all for the wrong reason i had people following me all the cause of the wrong reason and to me like i said when my mother died you took my pain that was so painful you wouldn't even want your worst enemy to feel so even right now numerous time i have reached out i send word back you know i apologize i'm sorry because once again later for the nonsense i was a sick individual that allowed myself to get caught up in some [ __ ] a temporary high even with amari that was deal with me i wanted apologizing to him a few years ago because he didn't know what i was gonna do he was just a victim as everybody else i didn't talk it over yo mari look this one about to do do you want to be down you don't want to be down because some people call it premeditated how it can be premeditated when you did something and you didn't know was dude you was going to do it until after it was done so my message to the victim victim family i'm sorry if i had a chance to do it all over again trust me none of that [ __ ] would have happened that was some plain stupid [ __ ] man well over the years i've interviewed a number of people that have committed murder for various situations uh i interviewed ben jay of the new boys uh it was a group a group called the new boys once the group didn't work out he started selling weed in vegas a guy rushed into his house trying to rob him with a gun he ended up killing him it was just one dude you know what i'm saying so far you know what i'm saying you know i'm saying he came in you know what i'm saying but then boom you know i'm saying shoot and this [ __ ] went falling like went falling i shot that [ __ ] cause you still had the gun in your hand the whole time yeah and he never noticed it never noticed it i just boom just shot that [ __ ] there was another situation i just interviewed jason williams uh the basketball player oh the basketball player for the nets right yep the limousine driver the limousine driver he had a limousine driver at his house he was showing him and a bunch of other people's gun collection accidentally pressed the trigger and a shotgun went off and killed killed the driver i take responsibility i'm not going to say somebody did that that and that i supposed to look down the barrel i was showing people guns here goes a gun look at this one you know this coach gave me this this is beautiful this and when i went to slap the gun closed the handed i didn't even know that mr gestafi was in the house there the gun went off and hit mr gestafi in the chest and uh it killed him instantly both these guys as they're describing the situation they're they're crying they're you know the you know tears are streaming down their face you could tell that it's killing them inside that someone's no longer alive and this whole situation is is really weighing on them heavily you're telling me this story there's not a lot of emotion that's coming with this and you know what it's like right now yeah years this is something i've been battling with for my life this is something i've been battling with over 30 years the key is right now is this like i tell you right now is i don't have to put on the scene up front and like you know light camera action and you see tears the bottom lines right now if you see some of my other interviews like right now is when certain things hit you it's not an act you come with it and to me regardless of what like i say the only thing i got is my word as far as like my action my behavior i'm very you know i'm saying remorseful for that because once again who am i to say who living who died black i'm not god i [ __ ] up and i could admit that and this like i say throughout my years i've been beating up myself for over 30 years based upon my behavior so with these guys or whatever you know what you know like you know like comparison there's no comparison everybody react differently or whatever when we start sitting back talking about it or whatever even right now i got a clip i wish i could give you from inside the minor killer or whatever when i started talking i stole these people legacy i took moms away i took you know i'm saying come on who am i to say who living will die so i don't got to pretend with you that's not what this is all about the whole key if i had a chance to do it all over again or if i can trade my life for their life guess what we wouldn't even be here yeah well brian glaze gibbs i appreciate you sharing your story and one of the the themes that we really try to do on vlad tv is not to glamorize it's not glamorous these types of situations you you did a lot of crimes you you killed a number of people you sold a lot of drugs which indirectly killed a lot of people and you didn't walk away from this a multi-millionaire uh you did a fair amount of prison time some people would say not enough but still you did i mean from the top of my head sounds like close to 15 years altogether yeah and you have this weighing on you to this day something that will never go away and you i would assume you're always watching your back to a certain degree because a lot of times people don't get over murders you could apologize and you could say i'm sorry and so forth but that doesn't take away someone's father not being there that doesn't take away someone's someone's brother or sister uh being there so this is something that you have to live with and it's not something to be proud of and this you know blind i like that because it's not this is not uh uh this is opportunity is this right now what i'm into whatever is coaching counseling training i'm into right now it's like i said right now telling my story and letting these kids know this [ __ ] is not make-believe you know what back then i was playing grand theft auto live with my life and we didn't have a reset button to hit i had a death wish and didn't even understand it so my message to them guys look do the right thing the first time you know develop working habits or work ethic go out there and build a career that's what it's all about and what i'm trying to say right now is as you get older and you're able to reflect back upon life and your mistakes you see the do's and the don'ts you see the wrongs you see what happened or whatever so even now when you're saying like now trust me it's like a revelation man i sit back and think you got plenty i'm living regret for the rest of my life when you say looking over my back you know i pay attention anyway that's that's what got me to where i'm at this present time so the key is right now when i'm in new york i'm in loud whatever i do what i need to do and i don't get caught up into that i don't get high i don't do anything out the ordinary but like i say when i go back to new york city when i go back in brooklyn when i go back to my old neighborhood cypress if i go to queens if i go to harlem or whatever you know what to me why don't worry about anything because of the fact is i came clean the key is right now is if it's meant for me god the day we're born is the day that we start to die and god know when is my time to go and to me long as i'm able to right my wrong now and when my day come i can say that you know what hey i had a great life you know do i have plenty of regret you goddamn right do i wish i could start all over you god damn right but that's not reality only thing i can do speak my truth now and tell my story and hopefully you got somebody paying attention i get so many response from my dm on my instagram brianglazegibbs i get so much on my facebook brian you know what they telling me oh man thank you for sharing your story and i commentate with this younger generation why i'm open book i'm not gonna sit here and [ __ ] anybody i'ma tell you the truth because the truth should set you free

Channel: djvlad

Views: 1,824,880

Keywords: VladTV, DJ Vlad, Interview, Hip-Hop, Rap, News, Gossip, Rumors, Drama, Brian Glaze

Id: rimfUaQKnCI

Length: 108min 54sec (6534 seconds)

Published: Wed Dec 04 2019