You may be seated. Hello, Your Honor. Hello. This is the case of<i>
Salinas v Cantu.</i> Thank you, Jerome.
Good day, everyone. AUDIENCE: Good day. Mr. Salinas, you claim your doubts surrounding
the paternity of 2-month-old Lily
are warranted. Yes, Your Honor. While you admit to a drunken
night with the defendant, you don't believe her child
was conceived that evening. That is correct, Your Honor. Ms. Cantu, you say Mr. Salinas
has never even met your child and now needs to grow up,
stop partying, and step up to be
Lily's father. Yes, Your Honor. So, Mr. Salinas, why do you
doubt Lily is your child? 'Cause we only had sex
one time. (AUDIENCE GROANING) JUDGE LAKE:
Without protection. Well, it takes only one time. SALINAS: Without protection. JUDGE LAKE:
Well, you know that's
all it takes. I understand. So I need you to give me
a little bit more as it relates to your doubts. (SIGHS) Well, the night
we had sex, I invited her out and she
didn't come through, went out with some friends,
had some drinks. Later that night I hit her up asking if she wanted
to hang out. So she told me to come by
and we talked, we messed around,
we had sex. That was it,
just a one-night stand. The next day she woke me up
told me that she had to go to class and she also
told me that she was off and on with
this other guy, so... (AUDIENCE MURMURING) ...you know, I just took it
from there but... JUDGE LAKE: Ms. Cantu? Yes, Your Honor. So you had a boyfriend but you
slept with Mr. Salinas? Well, what happened was Mr. Salinas had messaged me asking do you want to hangout
and whatnot. And I hadn't seen him
in over a year. When we first met when I moved
to Corpus Christi, um, we were kind of in
the same lifestyle. We both liked to party, we
were probably young,
you know? I was in college, and that's kind of what you
do, you experiment with that. And, um, as time went on,
as I was getting closer to finishing, my college
career, that kind of faded and I really didn't
party anymore so I didn't really hang out
with him as much. A year goes by and I decided
to hang out with him because I hadn't seen him
in such a long time. We ended up having sex.
He knew about the guy that I was on and off with
for about three years, the whole time that
I was in Corpus. So, you know, I was on
and off with him. At that time me
and Mr. Salinas had sex, I was not in an
exclusive relationship so I did not cheat
on anybody. So when you woke up and I said
I got to go to class, what was this he's
talking about, "And by the way
I have a boyfriend." what did you actually
say to him? I don't remember saying
"Oh, and I have a boyfriend." I do remember telling him that
I do have a class because I am in college
and, you know, I kind of had
to get things going, I didn't want to do nothing,
just lay around all day. And so,
Mr. Salinas, you maintain
that she said that she was dating somebody. I understood that that she was
off and on through
her Facebook and everything like that so I just didn't take anything,
you know, too serious. Because the truth is
you believed she was also intimate with someone
else during that time. Yes. (AUDIENCE MURMURING) So, Ms. Cantu, were you afraid
of getting pregnant at all? You didn't use protection
with Mr. Salinas. Well, Your Honor,
the day after because I did realize that we had
unprotected sex the night before,
the day after I did the responsible thing
and I went to go take the morning after pill, you know, just assuming that
they would work. And I went about my day,
went to class thinking that everything was good. Just because, you know,
I wasn't in an
exclusive relationship, I'm young, it doesn't...
You know, people do it
all the time. And, you know, so... But you understand that
there are STDs. Yes, I do understand that. (AUDIENCE CLAPPING) There is a potential that you
could make a little person. Mmm-hmm. Mr. Salinas, truthfully, I understand your doubt. If she slept with you
unprotected for
the first time, she's probably sleeping with
the other person without
protection and therefore
there could be doubt when she turns up pregnant. How did you actually find out
she was pregnant? I got on Facebook one day
and I saw her comment saying that she was pregnant. JUDGE LAKE: On Facebook? This is the evidence. JUDGE LAKE:
This is your evidence? Yes. Jerome, will you hand that to me, please. So wait, after this day,
this night you had together, you didn't talk anymore
or you were still talking? No, I didn't, we just had sex. We didn't talk anymore. I understood that she was
kind of on the rocks with this other guy.
I made it clear to her I didn't want a relationship
or a commitment till I was 25 or 30 so... All right, so you
went your separate ways? SALINAS: Yes. Until one day you are on Facebook and you see
this post? SALINAS: Yes. And it says... (JUDGE LAKE READING) CANTU: It wasn't until
I had went to my doctor's and had my first sonogram
at nine weeks, and that was from that picture
right there, that I had found out
the exact conception date. And what was that? That was September 8th and that was the exact same
day that we had sex. And so... AUDIENCE: Oh! I had also gone back
to the doctor. I told the doctor, you know,
I took the morning after pill and he had told me, "Well,
if you've already ovulated "or if you're in the
process of ovulating "when you take it,
it won't work." And I have the proof to show
that research, too, that the pill didn't work
because I was ovulating. Let me see your proof. Thank you, Jerome. It indicates that
the morning after pill may not be effective
if you're ovulating. CANTU: Mmm-hmm. And you contend that that possibly could be what happened
in your case. Yes, Your Honor, I do.
I believe that that's what the possibility is
considering the fact that me and Mr. Salinas had sex
on the exact day that the doctors said my
conception date was. How close to the
date of conception where you with your ex? It was still in that
same time period. I'm not sure if it was within
those three days... (AUDIENCE GASP) And so I... JUDGE LAKE:
So, during the window of conception... Yes, Your Honor. Have you had a DNA test
for your ex? No, we haven't. We haven't had a DNA test
from my ex. He denies the baby
and he told me that he did not want anything
to do with her, that it wasn't what he wanted
or needed and I needed
to take care of it. So, Mr. Salinas,
why have you not tried to get to it know Lily? Been there for her? If you know you're a
real possibility. Well, when I saw the message, or rather the post
on Facebook, I immediately messaged
Ms. Cantu asking her if there was a
possibility that I might be the father,
and she said no. She said that she had taken
the morning after pill, that she'd been having
intimate relations with this guy before and after
we had sex. (AUDIENCE GROANS) CANTU: Your Honor... And that's not how you
remember it? CANTU: No, no, no, no. What do you remember? CANTU: I remember it
specifically this way. He had messaged me and
asked me, "Do you think
that the child "that you're carrying
could be mine?" And I said, "Well, to tell you
the truth, I didn't think "you were at first
because the day after
we had sex, "I went and took
the morning after pill." However, after talking
to my doctor and they did the math
and found out that my
conception date was the exact date
that me and you had sex, so you are possible candidate.
And plus, the morning after pill
isn't effective if you have already ovulated
or if you are ovulating, <i> and so I told him that he
does have a possibility</i> <i> of being the dad.</i> JUDGE LAKE: <i> Why do you think
he refuses to see Lily?</i> CANTU: He always said that
he didn't really have the means to do that. He was working at that time, and so it kind of doesn't
make sense to me that if he knew that there was
a possibility that he could have been the parent
to this child that he didn't put money
aside to possibly seek out... If this is...
If this is his child. So, how far away from each
other do you live? Well, we live three and half
hours away, and after doing some research
I did find out that basic bus fare
is only... Is less than 100 bucks
to do that. So if you have a job at the
beginning and you knew that eventually you're gonna
have to go there, then 100 bucks really
doesn't sound like much to find out if he had a child. (AUDIENCE CLAPPING) JUDGE LAKE: <i> So not much when
there's a beautiful
little child.</i> Mr. Salinas, $100. You couldn't pull
that together to go up and see
this child? At that time, I really
couldn't afford it. I had a minimum wage
paying job and I was out doing
my music and I still really didn't... Wasn't sure if she was
mine or not. I didn't want to put
forth the effort and taking steps to see
all for nothing, so... So with this minimum
wage job, you still couldn't
save up $100? No, I didn't
have that... (AUDIENCE MURMURING) I didn't have that job
for very long. Have you thought
about Skyping, FaceTime, anything to get to know
this child? I just don't understand how a
child comes into the world that possibly could be
your child, and you can't find a $100 to go up and see the child. I, I don't understand it. JUDGE LAKE: So you've
never seen the baby? SALINAS: No. JUDGE LAKE: Never. AUDIENCE: Oh! And the first time
you ever lay eyes on this little girl that
could be yours is on a picture
in my courtroom? AUDIENCE: Oh! That is correct,
Your Honor. I mean, just look at her. <i> She's beautiful!</i> SALINAS:<i>
She's beautiful but...</i> I don't know if it's too early
but I still don't think that my features have
come out on her. She looks a lot like her
so bad. And I never even seen
what the other guy looks like. When you look at her you see
no resemblance. I mean, if I try maybe the
eyes and the nose but... I still don't know. After she told me she took the
morning after pill, she was in a relationship
with this guy, and then months after
she's pregnant, while she's pregnant
she comes and visits me and tells me I got to change
my life, I got to stop doing the stuff
that I'm doing, having fun... And I just really didn't
feel like... I really didn't feel like,
I guess, taking those steps to see, all for nothing, if she
wasn't mine. And so it just wasn't worth
it to you to make a couple of adjustments. I mean, just let's be honest. If it comes out today that
you're her biological father, you're gonna be able to live
with the fact that you missed all this? (AUDIENCE MURMURING) I'd like to hear from your
witness, Ms. Cantu. CANTU: Okay. Please stand, ma'am. State your name to the court. Karla Cantu. JUDGE LAKE:
Ms. Cantu, you are... I'm her mother. JUDGE LAKE: Her mother.
What do you know about this? I got a phone call
from my daughter letting me know that
she was pregnant, and so... So when she told you that she was pregnant,
did she also tell you there were two
possible fathers? No she didn't. She did not tell me. She told me later. She told me later. So, Ms. Cantu,
were you ashamed,
were you embarrassed? It wasn't necessarily
that I was ashamed. I found out I was
pregnant October 3rd, a week later I had told my mom because I was, literally I
know how to approach my mom and I was, at that moment,
I didn't have
health insurance, so the next day I went
and applied for
health insurance. I was trying to get all my, all my ducks lined up because
I knew that I was gonna be taking on this responsibility
and I wanted to make sure that I was prepared before
I even presented this to my mother and so, you know, I... A week later I call her
and I tell her, and at that time I still
didn't consider Mr. Salinas a possible
candidate because of the fact that I had taken the
morning after pill. I hadn't seen my doctor yet to know about the factors... About me ovulating and it not
being able to work and whatnot. So that's the long answer for no, you didn't tell her. CANTU: No, right. You know, she didn't
tell me because she knew the type of person I was. She knew how hard I had
worked all my life to sacrifice, to give
them everything that I never had so that they could grow up
to be those, you know, perfect kids
that I thought. So here I was thinking
I was doing the right thing and they... But they, yet,
they never got to see that. And so you, you feel like as much as you
tried to be the example and be a professional woman and do the right thing
for your kids, and take them to church
and give them everything you possibly could, you feel like the one thing
you didn't give them is an example of what
a healthy relationship is and what a woman
operates like, moves like... (AUDIENCE CLAPPING) ...within a healthy
relationship so that they
could model that. Because do you believe that
there were esteem issues or something going on with
your daughter that lead her... Absolutely.
I think that... I think there still is
self-esteem issues. I think that she, you know, I think that she
was searching for that love, and I think that there are
a lot of girls out there that are looking for
that love because there's a lot of single
parents raising children these days who try to
do what I did thinking they were doing
the right thing. Probably did what I did. So I'm the first person
that is... JUDGE LAKE: You did
the very best you could. Right. And you know what? Your daughter loves
you for it. Thank you for your testimony.
You may be seated. So, Ms. Cantu, what are your
hopes today? Well, Your Honor,
I really do hope, you know, this is not about me, this is not about Mr. Salinas, this is not about my mom, this isn't about anybody
in this room except for my daughter Lily. And she deserves to know
who her father is. She deserves to know
who her father is <i> because I know if she is
anything like me,</i> <i> in the future she's gonna
wanna know.</i> <i> She's gonna go searching
for him</i> <i> 'cause she's not gonna
feel complete or whole</i> until she knows where
she comes from. And so I hope out of this, you know,
if Mr. Salinas is the father, that he can step up
and take responsibility, but not only that,
but also look at this as a serious thing,
that it's not just,
you know... I look at kids nowadays
that are just like, "Oh, I get to dress up my baby
in nice doll clothes." You know, this is a
serious responsibility and so I really... So Mr. Salinas, what are your hopes today? I actually hope she is
my daughter. JUDGE LAKE: You do? AUDIENCE: Oh! Because if she is
that other guy's I'd feel bad for her
'cause he don't want... You said because
if she is that other guy's that you'd feel
really bad? Yeah, because he
don't want to be there
for her. If she is mine I want to
be there. I have a loving family
to offer her. They would accept her
with open arms. JUDGE LAKE: Jerome, I think
it is time for the results. (AUDIENCE CLAPPING) These results were prepared by
DNA Diagnostics and they read as follows. In the case of<i>
Salinas v Cantu,</i> as it pertains to whether
2-month-old Lily Cantu is the biological daughter
of Mr. Salinas. Mr. Salinas... You... In the case of<i>
Salinas v Cantu,</i> as it pertains to whether
2-month-old Lily Cantu is the biological
daughter of Mr. Salinas. Mr. Salinas... You... are the father. (AUDIENCE CHEERING) SALINAS: That's awesome. Well, I think that says
it all. You said, "Awesome." This is awesome.
Great day. Aw, that's... That's wonderful to hear. How do you feel, Ms. Cantu? I'm just... I'm happy
with the fact that he wants to be there for her and, you know, he wants to be
a part of our lives. And I just hope that
everything will work out and that, you know,
everything will happen for the right reason
and she'll have the best life that I can give her. JUDGE LAKE: That's perfect. That we can give her. I truly believe,
I truly believe that it will work out because everyone involved
has that intention. And I do believe you're
willing to do the work necessary to make sure
it does work out and put her first. I wish you all the very,
very best of luck. Take care of that
beautiful little girl. Congratulations, Dad. SALINAS: Thank you. Court is adjourned.
