Brother Bob: Thank you for being here! Thank you for being here and being our studio
audience today here in our Burlingame studios. We appreciate it really, very much. I’m Brother Bob Pellien. Welcome to everyone here. Welcome to everyone viewing us on the Internet
as well as on Direct TV channel 2068. Thank you all and welcome. As you know, on this show, That’s In The
Bible, we explore the Bible’s teachings on all things relevant to salvation and eternal
life. As it was mentioned earlier, questions do
really pour in from all over the globe, and we always turn to the pages of the Holy Scriptures,
and we get our answers directly from this book, from the Bible. Today we actually have three questions, but
all of the three questions that we’ll be addressing, they have the same interwoven
theme. Let’s take a look at the first two questions. Idris: Why God, as a Father, had to send His
Son, Jesus to die for our sins, including mine? In the world today, nobody can be guilty for
anybody’s sin. We all pay penalties for our sins. So why does Jesus have to die for my own sins
if He’s innocent? Jon: And my question is, If Jesus is not God,
them Him dying on the cross—what significance is that? How does that save us from our sins? Brother Bob: Those are very good questions,
do you agree? Audience: Yes. Brother Bob: Our final question was written
from Cathy, written by Cathy Do. She’s from Hampton Park, Australia, and
she had a very similar question. She wrote it in via e-mail and she simply
asked the question that was very much like that. She asked “Why was Jesus Christ crucified?” Well, thank you very much Idris. Thank you very much Jon. Thank you very much Cathy, and even all of
the others that have reached out to us via e-mail or letters with questions all along
these same lines. The biblical event where our Lord Jesus Christ
was crucified on the cross is – well that’s not a secret. That’s very well known almost to all people
and of course especially those within so-called Christianity. But what’s unclear to many, which prompted
these kinds of questions, is why. Why did that happen? Even though there might be some that they
can site the verse in the Bible, for example 1 Corinthians 15:3, that says that Jesus died
for our sins, it still leaves many perceiving it to be incomplete of an answer. Many still beg for more of an explanation
because they really want to understand fully. So, since many already know that Christ died
on the cross, they already know, they have heard that He died for the forgiveness of
sins. In order for us to really understand why,
what’s that all about, there’s some important preliminary information that we got to receive
first. For example, what’s sin in the first place
and why is that so bad? What kind of consequences and results does
committing sin actually bring? So let’s answer those questions first and
we’ll kind of be taking the questions that they have addressed there and answering them
in kind of phases. First, what’s sin in the first place? Let begin turning to the pages of the Holy
Scriptures and we do so at the outset of our study, reading 1 John 3:4. Definition of sin, if you will. Whoever sins is guilty of breaking God’s
law, because sin is a breaking of the law. Very simple and direct biblical answer, right? Sin, according to the Bible, is when one breaks
God’s law. And when it comes to laws, we know that ignorance
of the law is no excuse. That’s a very common saying as well. Therefore, since we all live under the law,
it’s our responsibility to seek, a responsibility to learn, a responsibility to understand how
to live within the confines of the law. What are the consequences if one sins or breaks
the laws of God? How bad are the results of that? This is very important. I’m going to ask you to please remember
this as our lesson unfolds. Consequence of sin? 59:2 the Prophet Isaiah writes this: It is because of your sins that he doesn’t
hear you. That’s so important, audience. Please remember that. We’re going to come back to that. If I will ask you during the course of our
study, what happens because of sin? What’s the answer? He doesn't hear you. It is your sins that separate you from God
when you try to worship him. There’s a consequence to sin. A separation from God. According to the Bible, those that commit
sin are – there’s a dividing wall that’s now there. We’re separated from God. He no longer hears, he no longer listens. One then could be praying, one then could
be worshiping, doing all kinds of things, but when that wall of separation is there,
that’s it. A person is no longer acceptable to God and
He said, “I won’t even hear.” But, of course, then one might think or say,
“Hey I’ll just pray. I’ll just ask God to forgive me.” But we can’t forget what we just learned
here. He’s no longer listening to the prayers
or listening to the worship to whom, for whom, those that have committed sin, those who have
violated His laws. So a sinner has no more relationship with
the Creator because of sin that is divided and separated from God. Remember that because that’s an integral
part of the unfolding of our answer to the questions that we have heard from those posing
questions for our study today. So it was asked earlier, what’s so bad about
committing sin? Why is it so serious? Why is it so tragic? Why is such a brutal response such that God
will no longer even listen, we will be separated from Him? It is because of sin we’re separated, but
it gets much more worse than that. We know that when one breaks the law he’s
got to pay for it, right? Agreed? Audience: Yes Brother Bob: You go to pay for it. When anyone breaks the law, what’s the payment? What’s the price to be paid according to
the Holy Scriptures? We often read this verse because it’s so
important, but let’s go ahead and do so once again in our study for today. 6:23: For the wages of sin is… Read it with me audience. What does it say? Audience: Death. Brother Bob: Death. The wage or price to be paid for sin is death. The Bible makes clear that the payment for
committing sin, it’s not an insignificant payment. It’s death. Now here’s one might be thinking like this
for example, “Hey. Come on. That’s not so bad. I thought it was going to be much worse than
that. I’m going to die anyway so I guess when
I die my sins are all going to be finished. It’s all going to be paid for.” Not necessarily so because is death, the
mere ending of our biological existence, is that the full payment for sin? The death that we all know is when a person
stops breathing, right? Somebody says you’re going to die, everybody
knows what that means. The wage of price for sin is death, but not
just the ending of our breath. What death then is the Bible calling the payment
or the price to be paid for sins that we have committed, and how long is the payment? How long is this sentence of the punishment? We turn to the Bible yet once again. In the Book of Revelation 20:14,10: Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake
of fire. This is the second death. The devil, who deceived them, was cast into
the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever
and ever. It’s not merely then just the ending of
our biological existence, the ending for our breathing, but the Bible mentions a second
death, and that’s a very serious event, that’s a second death in the lake of fire,
and one would be tormented there. The sentence is eternal torment. That’s very tragic. That’s very serious. Breaking God’s law brings about place, let’s
say, places a person into such a horrific predicament that we would find ourselves in
because of sin. What we need is to find a way out of that,
right? We got to change that. We got to find a way so that we don’t have
to face the consequence because facing that consequence and avoiding that consequence
has to become, and I think everybody here would agree, has to become the top priority
of a person who has committed sin. Do you agree? What do you say? Audience: Yes. Brother Bob: That’s got to be top priority
for sure. This is where one will see then and this is
where the role of our Lord Jesus Christ starts to enter in and become so extremely important
to understand. OK. So a recap of our initial segment of our study. 1. Committing sin or breaking God’s law is
no trivial thing. 2. The moment one commits sin – knowingly or
unknowingly- We become what? What happens? What happens to our relationship with God? It becomes what? It’s severed, it’s separated, severed,
cut, or whatever word you want to use. It is no more. 3. There’s a price to be paid for that and
that price to be paid is a death, second death, eternal torment in what the Bible calls a
lake of fire. This is serious stuff. This is very, very important. When people ask those questions that were
posed and they asked, “Well why did Jesus die on the cross?” Because of what we have just discussed, it
makes the answer to their question so vital. They got to know it. Let’s ask two more important questions before
we learn and get to the real meat of the significance of what our Lord Jesus Christ did there on
that cross. And to give a better perspective all about
that subject, let’s ask another question, which is how many people are in that horrific
predicament in the first place, having committed sin, been separated, from God and are on their
journey to the lake of fire and eternal torment? How many people have committed sin? What do you think studio audience? Some? Most? All? None? Audience: All. Brother Bob: Wow. You have certainty in your answer. You seem very, very sure. Are you really, really sure of your answer? Audience: Yes. Brother Bob: 3:23 in the book of Romans. for all have sinned and fall short of the
glory of God, You’re correct. All have committed sin. Everyone, therefore, is in that – whether
you want to admit it or not – it’s a biblical truth everyone has sinned and whether or no
we would not want to admit it, we could none of us raise our hand and say, “Hey, I’m
perfect. I’m good enough already. I haven’t committed any sins.” We are all in the horrific predicament of
needing to find a way out of that predicament and be saved from the punishment that is due
to us because of our humanity, our human weakness and propensity to sin and violate the law,
God’s law. So what’s our options? We can all pay for our sins. You can pay for our own sins, but that wouldn’t
be wise. That would mean that we’re going to be cast
into that lake of fire that we read about and be punished forever. So that’s not a good option to choose. Can someone else pay for our sins? Can you pay the sin of the one sitting next
to you? Can I pay for your sin? Can you pay for my sin? There is a law regarding sinners. A law of God pertaining to those who have
committed sin. What’s the law of God pertaining to sinners? I’m going to ask the audience to please
remember this. We’re going to come back to this too. What’s the first one I said we’re going
to come back to? Isaiah 59:2 right? What happens because of sin is, what? OK, you go that one already. Separation. Now the law of God pertaining to sinners. Deuteronomy 24:16: “Father’s shall not be put to death for
their children, nor shall children be put to death for their fathers; a person shall
be put to death for his own sin. So let’s remember this. Is it an option to get out of the horrific
situation because of sin? Can we have someone else answer for our sin? What do you say? Audience: No. Brother Bob: No. God’s law states very, very clearly there,
and I’m going to ask you to remember it. It’s very important. We’re going to come back to it at the very
end. God’s law states clearly a person shall
be put to death for their own sin, meaning God does not allow anyone to pay for the sin
of somebody else. So when I ask, what is the law of God pertaining
to sinners? What’s our answer? Everyone has to answer for their own sin. OK? Got it? When we can understand the fairness of that,
you agree it’s fair? Everyone’s got to answer for their own. Nobody can be punished for the sin of somebody
else. That’s fair, right? We can easily agree with that. We can understand the fairness of that law. In fact, even laws of governs, a lot of laws
of government that are patterned after that principle in order to be just, in order to
be fair. Now there might be some, however, that when
they hear these verses in the Scriptures that we’re reading, they would say, “Well if
that’s God’s law, then how did the Lord Jesus, pay for the sins of other?” You get the point? Seems like there’s some kind of conflict
there, they would say. Did Jesus break God’s law? Is Jesus exempt from following God’s law,
following God’s justice, God righteousness? Are we accusing Jesus of breaking that law? It was God’s law that said nobody can answer
for the sin of somebody else. Are we accusing Jesus of violating the law? What do you think? Of course not. In 2 Corinthians 5, I will read how this came
to be. In 2 Corinthians 5, there’s a lot of important
information contained here in verse 21. Christ was without sin, I’m going to come back and ask you that
again a couple of times too. Was Jesus innocent or guilty of sin? Audience: Innocent. Brother Bob: Innocent. Very clearly and directly stated here. Christ was without sin. Forgive me if I pause again. We read Romans 6:23, right? For the wages of sin is death, … Jesus didn’t commit any sin, right? Should He die? Seems like He should not die, right? But did he die? That’s what brought about the question that
all of us viewed from the videos, right? Why did He die? Christ was without sin, but for our sake God
made him share our sin in order that in union with him we might share the righteousness
of God. Dear friends, we asked earlier, did Christ
break God’s law? He did not. He did not break. We’re sure of it because what was the first
sentence here? That’s why I paused and emphasized that. What was the first sentence? He committed no sin. Sin is a violation of the law. Christ did not break God’s law. It seems like we’ve got a conflict here
if you’re really paying attention closely. Does Jesus not have to – is He exempted
– does He have not to follow God’s justice, God’s law, God’s righteousness? The truth is that Christ, of course, follows
these laws and commands and righteousness of God. But I thought that no can die for the sin
of somebody else? That’s God’s law. But here, Apostle Paul said that God made
Jesus share our sin in order that once we entered into union with Him, then we’d be
able to share His righteousness. We need some more explanation about that,
agreed? Yes. We got to understand that because that seems
to create a conflict. Jesus didn’t commit any sin but He’s made
to be sin for us? Then He gets nailed and crucified on the cross
for it. It seems there’s a violation of God’s
law. So our question now is how did He do that? How does he share our sin? How did Christ then pay for the sins of others,
saving them from the horrific punishment that we read about together, and at the same time
not violate or break God’s law? How did He do that? How did He fix that conflict? OK. Don’t forget that question. Therein is the real response to the questions
these people have posed to us. But for the fullest of understanding of the
response, we’re going to have to answer and give you some additional important information
first. For example, some additional key information
that will help us understand the response is, well one of the keys in understand what
Christ did is knowing first the only way that God will pardon, the only way God will forgive
someone who has sinned or has broken or has violated his Law. Unfortunately, that a lot of people who believe
that they’ll be forgiven for breaking their law by just praying to God. “OK, Lord. Please forgive me.” Then presto. Automatically I’ll be forgiven. Or maybe by doing good deeds, I’ll be forgiven. Having a deep strong faith or then I will
be forgiven. Changing my way of life. Well then, I’ll be forgiven for my sins. God will forgive me. God is very nice. We have to remember, because of the sin that
was committed, that’s why I told you to remember that, what happened because of sin? We’re separated from God. We read Isaiah 59:2. What did He say? I'm not going to listen! I'm not going to accept their worship! That's a horrific condition! So one cannot just say: I’ll just pray.” The major problem here is sin. It’s not something that can be ignored. It’s not something that can just be covered
up. It’s not just something that can be erased
by being a good deed doer. So how can one receive the forgiveness of
sin? We have to understand these points first before
we move on in the sequence of our study. For example Hebrews, the responds in 22, 9:22
of Hebrews it says: Indeed, according to the Law almost everything
is purified by blood, and sins are forgiven only if blood is poured out. Sins are forgiven only if blood is poured
out. The Bible did not say, “Sins will be forgiven
by being a good deed doer. Sins will be forgiven by being a nice guy. Sins will be forgiven by praying or doing
this or doing that.” That may be nice things that true servants
of God do, but those are not the things that bring about the forgiveness of sin. But what is? Shedding of blood. That’s the way, that’s the only way sins
are forgiven. Nobody can change that. That’s the biblical truth. It’s only if the blood is poured out. Pouring out of blood, of course, symbolizes
a sacrifice that has been made. But it’s not just that anyone’s blood
that can be poured out, and then presto, sins are forgiven. Whose blood? Whose blood only will bring about the forgiveness
of sins? Let’s return again in the book of Hebrews
9 this time verse 14: how much more shall the blood of Christ, who
through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without spot to God, cleanse your conscience
from dead works to serve the living God? You can see it’s only the blood of Christ
that can be used to pardon or forgive someone’s sins. No one else’s because everyone has committed
their own sins. No one can answer for the sins of somebody
else. We need to answer for our sin. If one is fortunate enough, then, to be redeemed
or under the saving umbrella of the blood shed by our Lord Jesus Christ, then that Isaiah
59:2 element that we began our study with, gets changed, right? God will then accept that person’s worship. They’ve been forgiven, they’ve been cleansed
as that verse showed clear there if you caught the very end of the verse 14. It’s not on the screen anymore. But so that they can serve the living God. That was the end of that verse if it’s there
again? There you go. They’ve been cleansed from their conscience
from dead works or sin so they can do what again? Because of Isaiah 59:2 and was separated,
but now that’s been cleansed. We can now do what? We can serve again. The horrific tragedy is fixed under the umbrella
of the blood shed by our Lord Jesus Christ. Committing sin is no trivial thing, not a
small thing. Receiving forgiveness is also a serious matter
and one should not assume, it’s dangerous to assume, that one can just be forgiven by
the whims of their own ways and in their own desires. In the Christian Era, forgiveness can only
be brought about through the sacrifice or the pouring out of Christ’s blood. That’s what we read together. What specifically did Christ, pouring out
of His blood, do? Who did he shed His blood for? Who benefited from the sacrificial death of
our Lord Jesus Christ? What did Christ pay for with His blood? Allow me to read from the book of Acts 20:28,
the Bible says this: Take heed therefore to yourselves and to all
the flock, over which the holy spirit has appointed you overseers, to feed the church
of Christ, which he has purchased with his What does it say audience? With what? With His blood. He purchased or redeemed with His blood. The Church, the Church Of Christ was purchased,
the Church was paid for with His blood. Those inside the Church then, they’re horrific
and tragic end has been fixed. They can now worship God. They can now pray to God. They can do good deeds that He will find acceptable
to Him. They’re saved from their horrific life long
sentence because God forgives them due to the blood of Christ. With that information, remember it because
now let’s go back to our question that we left off with a while ago regarding, how did
Jesus share our sins? How’s that? Did he die for our sins? Shed His blood to purchase and redeem the
Church Of Christ? Because I thought we’d read Deuteronomy 24:16, which clearly said that nobody can do that. Nobody can pay for another’s sins. We all saw that on the screen. We just now learned that Christ paid for the
sins of those in His church. He shed His blood to purchase. It’s the Church Of Christ. That’s paying for someone else’s sins,
right? Isn’t it? It’s as clear as can be because the church
– it’s not a building with the steeple and some cement – that’s not the church. That’s our house of worship. That’s the chapel. The church is the people. How did Jesus then die for the church, answer
for the sins, share the sin of the people without violating that law of God? We don’t accuse Him of violating that. Christ did so by creating something with the
church so that the sins of those in His church would be considered as His own. Therefore, allowing Him to pay for the sins
without violating God’s righteous law. This is so important. What did Christ create with His church to
accomplish that? What did He do? What did He create with His church? Ephesians, in the book of Ephesians 2:15: having abolished in His flesh the enmity, Forgive me I pause. The enmity. What’s the meaning of that word “enmity”? What word do we get from that word “enmity”? The state of being enemies. If two people are enemies, there’s enmity
between them. They’re in a state of enmity. Mankind has been separated from God because
of sin. We’re in a state of enmity with God. We are considered enemies of God because of
our stubbornness in sin. But wait a minute, what did the Apostle Paul
state here? having abolished in His flesh the enmity,
that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself
one new man from the two, thus making peace, Peace was made. Christ created one new man with His church,
thus establishing peace. That enmity was abolished. The ordinance abolished. The ordinance, second death, lake of fire,
payment for sin, death, they’re abolished. Peace with God is established. Where? In the church. In the two mentioned here inside the Church,
Christ said He created in himself from the two one new man. God does not view Christ and the Church Of
Christ now, as separate. He views them now, together as just one. How is it? How is it that Christ and His Church make
up just one new man? We read this verse often Colossians 1:18: And He is the head of the body, the church,… The two are no longer two in the eyes of God. The one new man created by Christ is comprised
of a head and a body. Christ being the head, and the church being
His body. These are terms that we can all easily understand,
right? Because we all have a head, we all have a
body, and if we’re ever caught by the authorities breaking the law with any part of our body,
be it hands caught stealing, our feet caught trespassing, we’re going to go the authorities
and say, “Excuse me officer, it’s my hands that were stealing that. Not me. It was my feet that was trespassing. Not me.” They’re connected. The head’s responsible for what the body
does. It’s not separated. Here, what did the Lord do? He joined that head to the body, Christ being
the head, the Church being the body, the Church being composed of people that commit what? Audience: Sin. Brother Bob: Who has committed sin? Some? Most? All? Audience: All. Brother Bob: All have committed sin. That’s why Christ I allowed, not only allowed,
but He’s the only one that’s allowed to pay for the sins of those who are inside His
body. He’s answering for the sins of His very
own body. Suppose someone would say, “I’m not interested
in any of that. I’m expecting that Jesus is going to answer
for my sins too because I believe in Him even though I’m outside of the body. The Church Of Christ.” What are they actually trying to make Jesus
do? They’re trying to make him violate the law
of God, right? Jesus won’t do that. He will answer for the sins of His body only
and that body is His church, the Church Of Christ. If He were to pay for the sins of those who
are outside of his body, then that would go against God’s law and He will not do that. He will not answer for the sin of somebody
else. Somebody may wonder, however, why is forgiveness
of sins and being saved only possible in the condition of being in the body of Christ,
His church? Isn’t Jesus the Savior for all people? Doesn’t He have the authority over anyone
and everyone? That’s always what people say and it’s
so nice to hear. But it’s not biblical. It’s not biblical. Just in case anyone was wondering that then,
what – people already know that Christ is the Savior. They might already know that He’s the Savior
and they think that He has the authority over any and all. Let’s turn to Ephesians 5:23: For a husband has authority over his wife
just as Christ has authority over... What does it say? Audience: The Church. Brother Bob: “Anyone and everyone who just
believes it just a good deed doer.” No, no. That’s not what it says. That’s what people preach, but that’s
not what the Bible says. Christ has authority over the church; and Christ is himself the Savior of the church,
his body. Clearly, Christ has authority over the church. Christ is the Savior of His church and, because
we’ve learned in the other verses that we have read and we can also see in that verse
we just read there, the church is His body and that’s why this is the reason why Christ’s
death, Him being crucified, Him dying so horrifically there on that cross is so significant. It was to give the people in His church a
way to have their sins forgiven. We can’t do it on our own. We can’t. if we’re going to do that on
our own we’re going to answer in the lake of fire. That’s not the plan. He wants us to be saved so he made the salvation
plan. What’s the Lord Jesus Christ condition for
those who are outside because maybe somebody with be thinking, “Well, this is now kind
of exclusive. This is some kind of closed salvation club,
this Church Of Christ? What about anyone who is outside the church
but they want to benefit from what Jesus has done." To finish up the pronouncement of the Lord
Jesus, this is so simple and clear to anyone who wants to be saved. What is it? I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved,… There’s a simple instruction. He referred to Himself as a door. Gave the instruction to enter in. If you want to be saved, the Lord Jesus says,
“If anyone,” emphasize the word “anyone” in your mind. It’s not exclusive. It’s not discriminatory. It’s open for anyone who wants to be saved. If one says, “Yeah, I do want to be saved
because I am a sinner and I don’t intend to experience the horrific punishment that
is due me.” Then enter the body of Christ because they
had answered for it. If you can’t command the head to answer
for your sins. If you’re outside, because God made it very
clear law, nobody can do that. Nobody can answer for the sin of somebody
else. Christ brought it to the cross and nailed
it there. Be part of this body. Be part of His church and enter. We’re able to see very clearly that there’s
no discrimination, then, entering the Church Of Christ. It’s an open invitation and that’s why
members of the church invited all of you in our audience today, those of you viewing us
on the internet, viewing us on Direct TV, viewing us on channel 49 there in the Philippines. Although people who that Christ’s death
is significant for anyone who just believes in Him, we have learned that His death is
significant only for those who have followed His instruction to enter into His body, the
church, that He gave His life to redeem and purchase with His blood, that brought about
the forgiveness of sins. This is what we believe. Why do we believe this truth, beloved brethren? Why do we believe this? Because... Audience: That’s in the Bible. Brother Bob: Precisely, because that’s in
the Bible. We want to thank everyone for being here. We want to thank those, our friends, who have
posed these questions that we have addressed today. Thank all of our guests who are watching us
on all of our various media outlets. We want to thank our live studio audience
for joining with us. If and when you are ready to learn more about
the fundamental teachings found here inside the Church Of Christ, visit incmedia.org. Here you’re going to find various series
of programs all dedicated to answering your spiritual questions. You can also follow us on our Facebook pages
at Iglesia Ni Cristo News and Updates, as well as our Facebook page Iglesia Ni Cristo
Media. There you can view more of our shows and see
how the Church gets involved and interacts with the community. If you want to find a house of worship that
is nearest to your home, please visit iglesianicristo.net, well you can visit to iglesianicristo.net. If you have any questions that you’d like
answered on this show, please e-mail them to answers@incmedia.org and we’ll get to
them in our future shows. Thank you all for joining us. We’ll see you again next time on... Audience: That’s In The Bible! Brother Bob: Thank you very much for joining
us!
