What Does It Mean to Be a Strong Woman in the Church? | Jonathan Pokluda and Jennie Allen

[Music] portes how we're doing if you - joining us from somewhere else in the country we are so glad that you are Dallas I love you so excited to be with you this evening that bumper you just heard and watched means that we are back in this series are still in this series asking for a friend and the question tonight is what does it mean to be a strong woman in the church come on okay so yeah so some guys just thought okay well I see your face you're like why did I show up okay and here's why you showed up God in this Providence and his sovereignty has you here because guys we have some work to do and let me let me tell you how I found that out and so we do this podcast calls called views from the porch and I yeah check it out David's very excited about it David your little red in the face during an ask for sunburn I know he was sunburned if you were wondering yes and so views from the porch everybody listening is like whoo yeah anyway views from the porch and so you know that we talked about biblical womanhood a couple weeks ago and we recorded that a little while back and that went live and and I know that a lot of you haven't heard that and so about 11 o'clock the other night I guess Monday night I was going to bed and I got an email from a friend that I really trust and she just said hey JP I think you missed an opportunity to encourage women and he goes she said so much so that I would considering pulling the podcast down and I and I prayed about that I thought okay I really trust this friend of mine and then I got an email from another trusted friend that said something really similar and I didn't have time was 11:30 now okay at nighttime my my that's that's past my bedtime and so I'm thinking okay I'm not gonna go back and listen to that this evening but Lord I'm just gonna trust that you sent some servants to Karen and asked that that be taken down that evening and I went back and I listened to it and if I'm completely transparent with you there was just some like I'm like yeah you know it's a conversation and so there's always things like I really wish I would have said that better I wish I'd have been tighter I wish that would have been clearer you know where I'm a I'm a verbal processor so I'm kind of all over the map but at the end of the day I'm just like you know what that could have been better but also there was some confusion in my heart and so when I have hurt friends and I don't fully understand why I assume that I have something to learn okay and when I've hurt someone someone is hurt by me or or they're hurt and I can't and I'm listening to them and I don't fully understand why I assume that there's some work the Holy Spirit wants to do in my heart and mind to listen and to learn from friends and what I've learned through this process is that there are a lot of women who are hurt just by what's going on right now and that really grieved me when I say what's going on right now I mean I just mean in our culture like maybe you feel oppressed or lesser than in any way and I hate that because I don't see that in God's Word and if I'm reading that or if I've ever communicated anything that could be interpreted that that I've missed the mark by such an incredible chasm and so as we talk about what does it mean to be a strong woman in the church I thought that I I don't know if you guys know this okay let me just be transparent about some I'm not a woman okay and so even furthermore to put a puncture and an exclamation point on the idea that I have a lot to learn on this topic but I thought that I would invite one of the strongest women in the church I know would you please welcome to the stage my friend Jenny Allen Jenny Allen is with us this evening friends so excited you're here thank you for joining us and and so you welcome to go there you had a microphone and so you've been someone that has sharpened me I mean you even in talking to me just you know where I've missed it and helped me see and in some of those conversations so I'm really I just appreciate I want to thank you and your husband Zach for you guys Stuart in your time in this way I'm excited to learn from you my hardest to listen as well this evening and just and thank you for being with us and so if you don't know Jenny leads one of the strongest movement of disciple in our day called if gathering you could you just tell us a little bit more about that yeah are there any if girls out here okay you a lot of you may not have heard of it so it's it's beautiful movement of God where women all across the world said hey I want to lead in my local church in my community for the good of people and for the glory of God and so it's a discipleship movement we provide tools for women all over the world we reach 120 something countries we're just reach over a million women every year when we livestream and what we're trying to do is truly raise the value of discipleship we believe that's how Jesus changed the world and life on life face to face over coffee this is how the world still can change and so we put tools in the hands of women in their local churches to make disciples and to reclaim that value of discipleship it's just a little bit more about who you are and so you live here and as you and your family just recently moved to here and so I think we have a picture of your family if we can yeah that up there there's your team Alan right there yeah so yeah my kids are growing up it's it's amazing some of them actually one of them just to SMU and so he's a freshman so I don't know if college kids are allowed to show up at the porch but he might make a showing and then our youngest we have 18 down to 10 and our youngest Cooper obviously it did not bring him into the world he is adopted from Rwanda and our house is awesome I love this conversation because I'm raising two men and I'm raising two women and so we talk a lot about these issues at our house too so I know you know and I was thinking JP so when the podcast aired I'm gonna give you some credit because he actually asked me before the podcast was taken down and that was a little bit of a mess he asked me weeks before that and and so he had a heart for this to happen and and for us to have this discussion and and what I know to be true is that what you know the reason that I don't say yes to things like this because I have a really clear mission it is to teach this book to preach the gospel I actually believe life is really short and we're all gonna be in heaven really soon and some of you are so young you don't think that way yet but you will because you'll watch your children grow up before your eyes and they'll be your age in a minute and so I feel like life goes really fast and so when I'm you know I just stick to this I stick to the book and I stick to Jesus and I want people to be saved and that's how I spend my life and when JP asked me before I even knew about the podcast I was like you know hey I don't know this is a little bit loaded it's a little bit loaded because I I think um we could get derailed here from just preaching the word and and if we get too caught up on our differences but this is what I thought about when I decided if I was gonna do it or not the first thing I thought about was all the women I meet as I travel and speak all over the world and so many of those women are in some way holding back with their gifts for the glory of God in some way they have set on something they are they are not leading like they could they don't want to appear too strong they don't want to appear too prideful and you'll hear in a minute that's some of my story but in some way they're holding back and I'm thinking to myself holy crud that's half the church like this should bother us more than half the church if half the church is sitting on their gift so I just want you to raise your if you're a female and in any way you have held back on your gifts or passions or personality or felt like I'm too many women in the room yeah that's a lot of hands so so that's half the church that's holding back and I'm not talking about with opinions or ideas or on Twitter I'm talking about in your heart for the glory of God for the gospel to go forward for the kingdom to be built you're holding back in some way and then we have another half of the church because I'm knowing okay this isn't just women I'm gonna talk to you I speak to a lot of women this is men too and then I'm thinking about you and I'm thinking you know what almost every guy I have ever met is for me they're for me therefore women they love women they were birthed by women we need we need women for sure to live yes and so I have felt I've been privileged to feel a lot of support by men I'm gonna talk about my marriage in a min I have a great husband who believes in me and supports me and he has actually pushed me out further than I would want to go or be comfortable with and so I've seen men before when I'm thinking that when I look out at most of you most of you want to make women happy true I know because I can smell cologne from right here [Applause] so the goal when I'm making the decision I'm praying about it and I'm thinking about you want me to come kick what the hornet's nest with you JP um I'm thinking to myself you know what this matters because if there's this much division there's a reason for it and if it's the church then guess what the reason is the enemy like if there's division and confusion and when they're holding back and men are confused and clumsy over what it looks like to support strong women and to help build strong women and believe in strong women then there's a problem so I said yes and then the podcasts and then you know what I see right now is just this beautiful opportunity for us to talk about what this looks like and it's not easy and it's not always black and white and there's different personalities and there's different gifts and there's different ways this flushes out but but I get excited because I think it's needed I love God and his beauty and Providence because just to make this clear in case it's not this is not in response to the podcast this was on the calendar long before we ever even recorded that podcast just as we were moving through the series asking for a friend this is the number one question that got questions org gets if you don't know about that resource it's an incredible resource I commend it to you and so you mentioned your husband I want to talk about Zack in a minute I'm a big fan he's been a a really just incredible voice of the Lord you know I think has come in my life at such a really key time I want to talk about Zack in just a minute and more about your family but before we do so you're traveling the world you're seeing you're exposed to lots of different churches lots of different gathering your disciple Amman you're seeing women be being discipled and really unleashed in the body of Christ did you always think that you would do this is that has that always been the plan not at all in fact I was probably one of the shyest kids ever which is funny now but I was just I wanted to make people happy I had an idol of approval and it was very important to me to please the people around me it probably started with my dad and it really bled into every part of my life and and so you know if you have strong gifts or you you have a strong personality in any way or a passion to a deep passion to see you know God move around you and all that comes out and bubbles over you're gonna get in trouble sometimes and so early on I think I've learned like hey don't be strong like put that back in and don't have too crazy of dreams and don't have too much passion and just put that in your back pocket and so I did and I did for a long long time and I remember I grew up in a in a church that was super conservative and I didn't have a lot of role models of women that were using their gifts to in a big way to impact the kingdom and when I say big way I just mean in a full way I don't mean like I don't think everyone should go start a movement or nor organization or or write books I think that we should all be about using what one living out the good works that God prepared in advance for each of us to do so we know that the Bible promises that and then too we should be faithful to the gifts and the talents he gave us in fact if we aren't that's that's bad stewardship and we know Jesus told a parable about that and it didn't go well for the people that didn't steward that well so we've got to steward our gifts and we've got to use that to the fullest bar but our ability but when I when I was younger I think it was intimidating to me to I think down deep I knew I I was holding back but I didn't know what it looked like to to love God to have courage to do hard things to have passion for God and to still be tender and kind I just didn't know what it looked like to to have all these big gifts and to not cause so much trouble with the bottom line and so as I'm as I move forward in college you know I just begin to exercise those gifts and people started being saved I would teach the Bible to a group of eight or ten girls and and people would be like I want to know Jesus and so we prayed every see cheese and I just saw fruit and I kept going I kept using my gifts but I had this rule well it's funny so I actually did I wasn't saved until I was about 17 years old at can't cut cans and yeah yeah and y'all know the crosses at the end that I had seen him every year cuz I've gone most of my life in the last my last summer there was I was 17 years old and I looked at the crosses and I for the first time I saw my son and I went home immediately from that and I I wanted to teach my Bible and so I started doing it to my friends and they were so annoyed and they were like you needed chill and and so I got a bunch of freshmen girls because I was a junior and they would think I was cool and I put him in a room and I there wasn't Beth more like I mean Beth more wasn't on the scene then and there weren't role models of women with teaching gifts and so I I start teaching him the you ready for this I was a brand new Christian the Book of Revelations that's where I open nice jojo's easy one smart where everybody starts havin ever taught it since and since I've been to seminary um so I start teaching my Bible because that's just that was my gift that's what God made me to do I didn't I didn't know that women could do that I just didn't know they couldn't so I just started teaching my Bible and making disciples with that gift and and so as it went I would get a fern and say hey that's your gift you need to do more of that and so I kept doing it well then I realized oh gosh I would very much like a man and I don't know if a man is gonna respond to all of this this and so I just I remember just being really insecure that I was just too much I was too much for people and and so I you know I constantly was editing myself and and that's godly let me let me make a clarification we are not talking about ungodly strength we're talking about god-given holy stream what significant us sin yeah and this book spells it out right and we weren't talking a minute about Philippians 2 and it smells about it's like are we doing this for the good of others you all for the most part I was doing it for the good of others I didn't know you could get famous doing that I didn't know you could publish books doing that I just loved God and I wanted to tell people about him and so in that strength and in it but then you know God opened doors and things begin to grow and all of a sudden before we knew it you know sorry but I do meet a man and I meet a man and he actually interesting fell in love with all my strength and my passion that's good check and then and I can't go into marriage just a little see I'm being a strong woman yeah yeah right is it all right if we talk about marriage is that okay okay good does anybody want to get married in here [Applause] you know Paul was funny about that he actually said it's better if you don't I I don't know um I'm just saying but I love I love that God brought me this man and we had to grow up together a little bit I was I was in a place of fear and insecurity because I was in my 20s y'all 20s fear and insecurity they go together it's just it's part of it so if you feel that you're not alone it is just part of these years and so we had to grow up together as a couple now and it was funny when we got married all of a sudden all the things he loved about me became a threat and now my strength was very threatening to him and I he's sitting right here and he tells the story way better than me but it shut me down it because you know what I wanted to be a good wife and I didn't want to cause trouble and I wanted I wanted him to to love me and so I said on my gift I put it away and I said on my passions and I held back and and what's interesting is a woman I really respect after about five years of marriage you know really challenged me on it and she said Jenny this is idolatry there's a name for this it's idolatry like you're choosing your husband over god of the universe you're saying I care more what my husband thinks of me than being faithful and obedient to this whole book because I wasn't seeking something ungodly I was just seeking to use the gifts God given me make him known and and it became unhealthy and so anyway in our marriage we ended up in counseling and in our you know about five or six years in and and it was the best thing that we ever went through because all of a sudden we could hear each other and what my husband heard from me was my wife has strong gifts and strong passion for God and she wants to serve Him and she's not because of me and I think this conversation is so big because what if that were true of your wife of your daughter what if that storyline were true yeah if the women in your life would say I'm not fully serving God because I think that you won't find me attractive yeah or I think that I'm too much and and these strengths are going to cause you to be get insecure can I say something right there so I think because one of the things that my friend said to me and that was hey I feel like you communicated that you don't value a woman being you know excelling in the workplace or leading or even being a CEO and in a gosh I would never want to communicate that and so I would I would want to clarify that publicly right now I'm a dad of two daughters whom I love very much I can't imagine just loving something as much as I love my two daughters and if one of them grows up to you know gets married and has kids and stays at home and you know is is what we think of when we think of a homemaker or you know words will fail me but if that's what she does I will be incredibly encouraged by that and think man that's fantastic and likewise and equally so and I mean it when I say equally so if one of them you know advances through a corporation and leads the company I would be so encouraged by that and in in Titus 2 verse 10 chapter 2 verse 10 it says that we are to work with excellence so that the teachings of Christ our Savior is attractive and and I don't think that's just a verse to men and women whatever you do professionally I hope you're amazing at it so that whenever a promotion comes about that that the your boss or supervisor who may also be a woman is choosing someone that you're the clear and obvious choice that hey this is who should be promoted like that I hope all of you everyone listening is the hardest-working employee for the glory of God both men and women that that would be true so I just you know just to clarify that insert that there okay so I want to actually say right now to that that sometimes I would say most of the time that we're thinking that we're limited or we're thinking we need to sit on our gifts or we're thinking we can't do the thing that God wants us to do it's not because someone told us we couldn't it's because we've believed in our mind we shouldn't and so so much of this tension and why I believe it's of the enemy is is there so much unsaid we never talk about these things like I love that you just stopped me JP like hey I just want to clarify in case some of you out here had these aspirations these aren't ungodly because I think sometimes we just get confused we get confused about what it means to be a man or what it means to be a woman in the church and so when we don't talk about it it gets confusing and I would say that represents a lot of what was going on with me as I was setting my own boundaries I just thought I was too much for my friends my junior year and I'm too much for my husband and I'm just gonna sit on all this and I don't know what else to do but I but I want to say to you I just I wouldn't be here if I didn't see it happening for so many women and I don't think it's all guys fault I think a lot of it's our faults girls like I think we do this in our own mind sometimes that we limit ourselves and I know then that the obvious question everybody wants to know the answer of is what about roles and positions in the church right like that's the loaded part but I think we oftentimes get so distracted by that that and we find ourselves sitting on our gifts and our passions and our abilities that we we are missing all the work that God has for us and and you know my view on that is every local church is gonna have a different opinion about that every local Church in Dallas Texas just about has a different opinion about that so wherever you go scripture just says don't be divisive you know like if you commit and submit to that church then then be all there and be humble about that and understand that that those elders have prayed about that and they're not anti-women they just you know this is where they landed but that's not the biggest issue when I'm when I'm thinking about men and women and using our gifts the bigger issue to me is the way we view each other the way we value each other and and I think what what Zach heard with a third party president was gosh my wife feels like she can't be all that God made her to be with me and so what began to happen is we I mean our marriage just went to a different level and we began to just pray together and say god we wanted to serve you with everything we have anything that you want from us we we want to do it and so what that took the form of for a long time was a church plant in Austin Texas that went on to become the West Campus of Austin stone and we led that church and my husband led that church beautifully and and and then you know can say this about Zach real quick so because you're a strong woman but zach is no shrinking violet I mean zach is a strong man he is a strong voice in my life and so I want I know you're talking and taking us on a journey but I want to hear about now what it looks like to colabor through you know this platform that God has entrusted to you guys and and I do you know Zach was pastoring in church and and has an incredible ministry himself so yeah and and that went on for about 10 years and about 10 years into it was when everything shifted and that collating shifted in a way that we never would have foreseen and my husband actually handed off leadership the church to Boston stone and he we became members there he's in private equity now which is an odd thing for a pastor to move into but that's what he did and and he's a starter basically he started a church because he's a great starter and then he starts companies because he's a great starter he's a great entrepreneur and so he moved into that well at the same time the same time God was opening doors for me to use my gifts I've been teaching my Bible more and and doors were opening and things were happening and all the sudden I was given more and more and more opportunity and I remember coming home after I had received the opportunity to publish several things with a publishing house and he had sent me on this publishing retreat and I came home and it was it was more than just one little book it was like a career that they were kind of offering me and I came home and I did not know if I wanted to do this I I had been a stay-at-home mom for years and I didn't know if I wanted to enter all this and I brought it to him and he was quiet because he thought okay I don't know what that's gonna be like if my wife goes out and has a platform and leaves all these people with that what's that gonna be like and and then I'm here you know what what what is what's gonna happen in four three days he prayed about it wrestled and then he came to me and I'll never forget this he said Jenny one day I'm gonna stand before God and I'm gonna be accountable for your gifts and I'm gonna be accountable for how our family built the kingdom of God and if this is the best way for us to build the kingdom of God right now I'm all-in and the years that have followed he has meant that I would say there's barely been a day that he has not said and I want you to know the dude his way stronger than me he tells me no all the time all the time and it is you know we're figuring that out what that looks like - but but you know what it isn't hard because here's the thing we love this book we love our God we're a team on a mission and and how this book says marriage looks is laid out and and we live it in that way but it also tells us how to be believers like the whole book just talks about what it looks like to colabor together and bill the kingdom of God together and it's constant humility it's constant laying down our lives for each other and for the good of other people in the world and and so we're you know we're figuring that out together yeah I love that I love that so let me ask you as you think about marriage and ask you a loaded question okay so that's just a heads up on this I'm gonna mention the S word okay what S word so what what does submission look like what does submission mean yeah that word to me that's yeah oh okay so here's the thing about that word to tell us the thing about that we say something that you're probably not expecting it is my it's one of my favorite words it is the greatest protection in my life as a strong woman who is doing her best to please God who was trying to raise four kids and not screw them up I like you I love them I don't care if you follow Christ nearly as much as I care that my kids follow Christ so I don't want to sacrifice my kids on an altar of ministry I don't I don't want to be responsible for all the decisions of do I take this speaking event or do I you know what do I do with all these different things I love submission submission protects me all the time so there's you know I bring things to Zack and I say hey what do you think and then he decides and then he's accountable before God it's gonna be awesome I can't wait Jenny you shouldn't have done this his fault and and I believe is about the woman you gave me yes [Applause] heard that I read that somewhere but I tell you what like I I also know I talked to women all over the world if that word has been used like a pistol to their heads it has been used where they feel threatened all the time where they don't feel safe in their relationships they don't feel safe with men they don't feel safe with their dads they don't feel safe with their boyfriends they don't feel safe with their husbands I hear this story all the time so the fact that that word has a bad rap makes sense to me yeah it makes sense to me because here's the problem guys we're divided but there's reasons on it for both sides right where men have used submission as control can say something here I'll ask you guys a question so not rhetorical mr. question according to the Bible should women submit to men according to the word some guys not in their head okay so I want to make it abundantly clear what it says in the answer to the question is no it's a resounding no with with this follow up Ephesians 5 chapter 5 verse 22 says wives submit to your husband's not women submit to men that's different okay and so this is not like you're not you're nuts you know coming as a single woman thinking okay now because the Bible says I have to submit to all men that's not what the scripture says in fact it goes on to say as they mutually submit to each other so there's even further context given there and so a question that we're asked all the time that I get all the time you know what does it mean from guys what does it mean to lead in a relationship and I'll give you a really simple answer then I want you both to hear it I want I want both sexes to hear the answer this question it means in purity it means you know protect what God has said is important that you would flee sexual immorality all other sins a person commits sir or outside the body but whoever sins sexually sins against their own body do you not know that your body is a temple the Holy Spirit who is in you whom you've received from God you are not your own you've been purchased by a price the blood of Jesus therefore honor God with your body and so is your in a dating relationship men you're looking out in all ways that you can to her best interest and I know we talked about and joke about in the church you know what it means to guard your heart but it means that you guys are progressing that you're both aware of where you're going that there's not manipulation Romans 12 says love must be sincere that you're not playing games hard-to-get trying to you know you'll manipulate each other that's not love that's a counterfeit love and so just as you consider should women submit to men the answer's no description says wives submit to their husbands and goes on to say there's a mutual submission there in the Covenant of marriage I'm sorry to interrupt you know that's so so clear and important because I do think that all these myths right we have built on the words of God we have added to the words of God and we've gotten so confused and we wonder why we're confused and we put godliness attached to things that that Jesus would be appalled that you know I mean abuse attaching submission to abuse I mean these these are not things that that the the writer of the writers of the Bible and that God meant this this is where we have taken things in and caused hurt and I think that's why this does feel loaded sometimes is there has been so much hurt and and so I was reading in Philippians 2 this morning and I just thought this was so perfect for today it says because this is just true for all of us it says complete my joy this is Paul complete my joy by being of the same mind having the same love being in full accord and of one mind do nothing from selfish ambition or conceit but in humility count others more significant than yourselves let each of you look not only to his own interests but all so did the interests of others have this mind among yourselves which is yours in Christ Jesus who though he was in the form of God did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped but emptied himself by taking the form of a servant being born in the likeness of men and being found in human form he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death even death on a cross therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name but this is the mind where I have whether we're and I think sometimes with with when we're talking about men and women we look at these very few verses that address and then in women rather than the whole Bible that addresses Christians and above our identity of our gender is our identity in Christ and so whenever however you treat women whether it's you know I mean I think about the issue of pornography if we truly believe these are our sisters these are for image bearers beside us like like it changes the way you view that the value of women how you esteem women how you see them as your sisters colabor co-workers building the kingdom of God together it changes the way you live it changes the way you do everything and and that's that gets me excited because I think what if we haven't even come close to realizing that at the church yet you know and I think for women a lot of women end up feeling more valued at the workplace than they do at the church yeah and and as these conversations happen I'm seeing this little light in woman's eyes where they're like hey so you think I have something to contribute you think I could play you think I can help here and and it's happening I mean it's happening yeah I would just say here and I know that significant of you don't go to church here and a lot of you do here at watermark and so just was recently tasked with the elder by the elders they said hey as you think about the you know these opportunities I want to make sure that the women here in this body have every opportunity to use their gifts in this body and so that's something that our elders are constantly thinking about and and praying about but I want to say I want to say this too to what you said because this is spurred on a lot of conversations in the podcast and one thing the I miscommunicated and was not clear on was a statement and the context I was talking about the fallen world and and I said you know I think that there are a lot of guys that are intimidated by a strong woman in a you know something that you've said and other friends have said to me is I think that's a huge fear of women is hey if I exercise strength or demonstrate strength then I'm not going to be seen as attractive by men and if that's true it's the result of sin in the world that I hope men would look for a strong woman like you talked about Zach that they wouldn't be intimidated by that I think just to talk to the men for a minute the the reality is a problem that every man every man I know attraction what they view as attractive is tainted by sin okay and I don't want to be accused as overstating something so let me let me clarify when I went out what I mean when I say every man I know what I mean is every single male I've ever met in my entire life okay what they are attracted to is tainted by sin especially if you have viewed pornography which is the vast majority of you and so you have to understand that that there needs to be this earnest prayer going on in your life that you would be asking god help me to be attracted to what you're attracted to that God who looks at the heart and would love would love a woman to represent him well in the workplace to to be strong in the workplace or in life in general that you would be attracted to what God is attracted to not intimidated in any way by that and so that's what I meant but I'm not sure that that was clear so well and that's why it's so it's great to have these conversations and our hope is that you're going to go out and have these conversations together and I would just recommend men listen listen because I think sometimes in fact I've talked to so many women even preparing for this night who said I always have opinions but I don't I don't want to seem too strong I don't want to I don't want to be combative I don't want to come off as prideful or arrogant and I'm thinking do you guys really just want duds like what do you what do you want you're like like you want people that think and that have opinions and that that have feelings and that will push you and that will make you better and and I'll tell you what let me let me tell you let me tell you where our marriage is now we are so madly in love I feel like you need to come up here and that firm this truth I mean I'm not kidding I feel like our marriage like every I'm gonna brag I think every single one of you should aspire to the marriage I have because it is that good my daughter my 16 year old is like mom I need to go to counseling and because you all love each other too much like that's what she wants to tell her counselor I'm like good luck I'm sure they're gonna feel very sorry for you um but we are like we are madly in love and you know why not because everything is easy in fact can you imagine these two really strong people married to each other it's really messy a lot but it's because we are absolutely single-mindedly focused on building the kingdom of God together and it is the most fun way to live and and we're not competing and I look at all these movies right now I mentioned this on Instagram recently I'm watching movies and I'm thinking why is every movie be based on people that are cranky because someone in their family succeeded you know Incredibles to like oh there's all these movies right now that are coming out and like he thought at home like crying cuz some they're like it could be a man or a woman or a child and what I what I had to post something cuz I was like guys not family doesn't have to be that way it could be that if somebody in your family wins you feel like you all won because you were a part of it literally I mean tonight my daughter got my my youngest daughter got locked in the bathroom and I think she might still be there because both of us are here she's still in the bathroom are you serious what you said will address it later well I will wrap this up we'll wrap this up but here's the beauty is he fed them dinner tonight and one of them is launching the bathroom but besides that and I think we're team on a mission and I don't know right now my daughter is regretting but she signed up for this mission but but in life like this is how we work if somebody wins if some of if if my son wins the state championship that was a picture from the state championship in Texas this year my son wins the state champion it's big deal then our whole family thinks they won the state championship yeah and that's how this should be is that we're building the kingdom of God together collating men and women across the church doing the best we can to pour out our gifts to see each other succeed to see the other one and if there's anything holding them back it should bother us and so anyway yeah it went to what you said you know you you mentioned this you just said JP guys don't want a passive insecure girl they want a strong girl and I just here's what I would Sears how it was responded that honestly is by my observation this is my opinion now based on my observation some guys do because of their own brokenness in sin in their own spiritual journey and they haven't gotten to this place where the Lord has you know sanctified them to be attracted to what he's attracted to and and I think it is a result I'm so passionate about um just this idea of what pornography is doing to dating I would just tell you if you're listening and you're looking at porn I know I know more than half of you are you got to stop it's it's it's ruining your marriage long before you even found your prospect I'm talking to guys and girls alike men and women alike if you're looking at pornography the enemy is using it to ruin you and and you have to stop and I'm not trying to put guilt and shame on your shoulders and I'm not just saying stop go figure it out I'm saying hey we as the church we are here we want to help you come forward in in a minute there'd be folks up here that you can talk to please come and talk to them but guys I want you to go home and beg God beg him to give you eyes to be attracted to to see what he sees as beautiful that you would do that just beg him say Lord would you please answer this prayer that I would see as attractive what you are see us attractive what you see is beautiful God because I will tell you the other greatest frustration in leading a young adults ministry over the past 12 years especially in talking about believers is just so many amazing women who guys aren't asking out and and and you're not taking initiative and so please I just please reject passivity men and an initiate so yeah I think about what's possible this is how I'm wired one of the ways I'm wired is I always picture things in a big swath so I picture even this room and I think about Dallas and I think about all of you and the reason I risked kicking this little hornet's nest a little is because I feel like if this whole room was Unleashed to to use their gifts to before each other instead of in any way using each other or competing with each other or putting each other down or posturing against each other but you literally saw each other until there was you know something more that in general you just assume we're collating at a minimum we are coal laboring and maybe we should make babies together one day and I should put a ring on it but in the meantime we are Co laboring and I just think the damage that a room like this could do for the kingdom of God and not in that order by the way I just want to say put a ring on it and make babies together I second yeah so that that's I thought is our hope I mean JP and I talked a lot about this before he got up here and in both of us just we want you guys to be brothers and sisters in Christ we want you to be for each other and and two we want to see the kingdom of God built through your gifts and and wherever that's being held back we we don't we want to pray against it and find it any other hopes for the the church as you think of men and women in our generation anyone closing closing thoughts around that you know I have these four kids that I mean I can't pick if I like boys or girls better cuz God gave me to both and I I love them so much and I'm watching my 16 year old grow up and and she would say mom you're I worry sometimes that that she felt like gosh things took away from my childhood like ministry or or you were gone some or whatever and she said mom don't you know the reason I want to help people in life is because I watched you help people in life and so we've got to realize that that these little people that we're gonna raise one day and some of you can't imagine that but the day will come faster than you know that a generation is coming and they're watching us about what it looks like to be godly about what it looks like to obey this book about what it looks like to be co-laborers about what it looks like to be married or what it looks like to be single and and this book says you know what it looks like running our guts out deferring to each other's needs it looks like caring about this kingdom that's coming and not ourselves and not looking to our own interests but to look to the others and to remember that there's this is all going somewhere this is all going somewhere and it matters and so what I see in this room is not a bunch of singles or a bunch of young adults I see collab or than I want to build the kingdom of God because it matters and in your lives matter and I think we are better together I know we are better together and so you know I thought about how to end the night too and I was thinking about all the the guys and I just want to say one more thing to you that in so many ways you're doing a great job in so many ways you have fought for your sisters you have fought for the girls you care about in your life and I think largely and we were talking about this backstage I think largely you really do want the women in your lives to thrive and to win is that true say something cuz all the women would love to hear it yeah I think that's real women and I think I think sometimes we just get to smile and assume the best and run hard and win it is time if it is time for you to meet that man you know what he's gonna be running I mean remember the old story he's gonna be running right beside you you're gonna see that and you're gonna find out you can be teammates together and in it is it's it's complicated but it's also super simple seek ye first the kingdom of God and all these other things will be added to you and I'm not necessarily talking about marriage I just mean you will get to live the works the good works that God prepared in advance for you to live it's a verse I respond I go back to and in fact I've gone to my community group and I know you and Zachary in community as well and I've just told the guys in my group I said hey I struggle with discontentment at times and I just need you guys I'm gonna bring to you just my discontentment my junk and I just need you to just show me this first rub my nose in this verse Matthew 6:33 I need to see it I thought it in just with this verse it's it's in the the first book it's actually the first chapter of the first book probably the first page of your Bible it's Genesis chapter 1 in verse 26 God says then God said let us make man kind in our image in our likeness so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds and the air out of the birds in the sky rather over the livestock and all the wild animals and over all the creatures that move along the ground and this is 27 I want you to pay attention to it says so God created mankind in his own image in the image of God he created them male and female he created them and and so I want you to know women that you have infinite value because you have been created in the image of God himself and and men I want you to know the same that you have infinite value life humans mankind has infinite value because we have been created in the image of God and there has to be a respect that happens before each other we didn't even have time we're out of time we're past time and we didn't even talk about just the abuse that is happening in the context of relationships and in first Thessalonians chapter 4 it says that God is the Avenger of such things and I'm not trying to scare you except for I believe the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom and so as you consider how you date and treat each other how you treat the opposite sex just understand that the scripture says God is the Avenger of such things and we're talking about this because we love you guys so much and it's just a joy to journey with you and this is a place you know one of the things that happened that just really grieved me probably the thing that caused me the most grief over the podcast is a friend said well you know I think people come to me because they don't feel like they can approach you or there's not you know a place that can I just say David and I and and Garrett and whoever has taught but David and I sit up here and if you come on Sundays Todd does the same thing and we stay here till the last person I mean we we stay here until this place is shut down trying to talk to people I get dozens of emails a week and I never want there to be a wall between us and you that if you ever have a question or you're wrestling with a verse you know start with your community group I hope but especially if it's something that we said that you would come to us and we would have that conversation and invite you into that I want you to know you are invited into that I love you guys Jenny would you would you pray for us so I thought it'd be cool if the guys prayed over the women tonight and just lift your hands up if you're a guy and women receive this because they're for us largely they are for us so god we pray we pray that in your kindness and in your love god that you would heal the brokenness that perhaps in many ways each one of us has caused and God we pray for any division that has separated us God we pray that there would be nothing that would stop your gospel from going out through your church that we would in all ways count each other's interests higher than our own and that God we would take whatever privilege we've been given it and give it away I just thank you for all the men with their hands lifted high guy then and you know their hearts you know each one of them I thank you for the ways that that they have they will and they can advocate for these women and god I pray I pray that this would become the church would become the safest place in the world for women that women would be able to run freely with the gifts they've been given and together we would cause a lot of good for your kingdom god that's ultimately what we want we want God your kingdom to come your will to be done on earth as it is in heaven and Jesus name Amen [Applause]

Channel: The Porch

Views: 43,030

Keywords: the, porch, dallas, watermark, church, young, adults, christian, christianity, ministry, movement, jp, todd, wagner, david, marvin, jonathan, fort, worth, ft, el, paso, women, woman, female, jennie, allen, jenny, if, gathering, womens, fear, live, your, purpose, kingdom, benefit, ladies

Id: 7P7gEkZ7Bgs

Length: 51min 30sec (3090 seconds)

Published: Wed Sep 05 2018