- [Narrator] The following interrogations of two 16-year-old killers have never been seen before on YouTube. - [Brian] I just killed Cassie. We just left her house. This is not a joke. - [Torey] I'm shaking. - [Brian] I stabbed her in the throat, and I saw her lifeless
body just disappear. Dude, I just killed Cassie. Oh, oh. That felt like it wasn't even real. I mean, it went by so fast. - [Torey] Shut up, we
gotta get our act straight. - Face me. Okay. - [Narrator] Just four days
after filming this video, Brian Draper sits alone
in an interrogation room. He gets up and looks outside
before shaking his head and sitting down to play the air drums. (blowing nose) (tapping) He takes out his wallet and
reorganizes its contents. At first glance, it might seem he's not taking this seriously, but as his questioning goes on, it becomes abundantly
clear that he's trying unsuccessfully to calm his nerves. And Brian has more than
enough reason to be nervous. Four days prior to the
taping of this footage, a sweet local 16-year-old
girl named Cassie Jo Stoddart was brutally murdered while housesitting for her aunt and uncle. When the homeowners arrived
back at the residence, their 13-year-old daughter
stumbled upon the horrific scene of her cousin's bloodied body
on the living room floor. The question echoed in everyone's minds, who would have committed
such a heartless act upon the vulnerable young woman? Authorities immediately started looking into who Cassie was with in the days leading up to her death. On the night of Friday,
September 22nd, 2006, Cassie did have some guests over. Her boyfriend, Matt Beckham, and two classmates, Brian
Draper and Torey Adamcik. Brian and Torey departed
the get-together early, but shortly after they left the power in the house went out. There were also strange noises
emanating from downstairs. Eventually, some of
the lights in the house started to flicker on and off. The couple was feeling very uneasy and Cassie hoped her boyfriend
would spend the night, but his mother declined. She did offer that Cassie could come sleep over at their place, but the responsible teen
reluctantly stayed behind to fulfill her housesitting duties as Matt's mother came to
pick him up around 11:00 p.m. The next morning, when
he tried to contact her, there was no response. With the knowledge that
Cassie's two teenage pals, Brian and Torey, were
some of the last people to see her alive, detectives went to Torey Adamcik's home on the 24th, the very same day her body was found. He told them that after saying goodbye to Cassie and Matt on the 22nd, he and Brian had gone to see a movie at a local theater before
spending the night at his house. Investigators found it
curious that he was unable to describe what the film had
actually been about though. Reportedly, a similar
unrecorded initial interview took place with Brian that day as well. The police then brought Brian Draper in for questioning on September 26th. Torey would be brought in the day after for a second interview as well. Torey's parents were in the
room with him this time. The interrogator's first objective here will be to try and corroborate or discount the suspect's alibis. Brian is agitated and fidgety as he waits. He puts his hand over
his face and slouches, subconsciously trying to make himself small and less noticeable. The interrogators enter the room and immediately establish
a friendly and calm mood, likely putting an already
anxious Brian more at ease. (door opens) - Hey, Brian.
- Hey. - Okay, we talked to your
folks and (indistinct) they're filled in, and they're comfortable with the fact that we'll
sit down and kind of, you know, the other night
we hashed over some things about where you were, all
the details and stuff. And as you well know, as you recall, you're one of the last
three people to see Cassie. And so it's just so important
and critical that we just answer some questions and we
get by some of those things. And so we kind of prefaced
that with your folks, they're good for you sitting in here. I want to remind you that, of course, you're not under arrest, okay? You're free to leave. And if you don't have
to answer any questions that you don't want to at any time, you can walk out that door and go hook up with your parents, okay? So you're not, we're not making you stay here for any reason. - [Narrator] Torey's
interrogation started similarly, with him also being strategically seated close to the door, in
a move that makes him feel free to leave whenever he wants, which, although technically
true, is a false comfort given the gravity of the situation
he's gotten himself into. Unlike Brian's more closed off mannerisms, Torey gazes intensely at the interrogator, which indicates an intense curiosity. - We're gonna start about, I know we talked the other night about, you know, first of all, why we're here, and we're investigating a homicide. - Yes. - That Cassie Stoddart was murdered. - Yes. And because of the fact
that you were, you know, one of the last three people there, and you had knowledge of
her and stuff like that, it's common course that we want to go and interview people and
find out what you know. We'll go ahead and start first, I mean, I guess as I
recall, the statement before that you've known Cassie
for about how long? - Um, 10th grade. - Okay. So you've known
her for a little while. - Yes. - [Narrator] Brian and
Torey differ in many ways, but their darker interests
just happened to converge in a way which created the perfect storm for this awful crime to take place. According to Brian, when he met Torey, the boys started talking
about how it would be cool to commit a crime inspired
by the "Scream" movie. - So what is your
relationship with Cassie? - We're friends. - Okay. Is it, have you ever
dated or anything like that, - No. or just straight kind of friends? How often do you see her,
maybe, during a week? - Uh, every day at
school, but this would be my third time hanging out
with her outside of school. - Okay, let's talk about Friday, and I think the date was the 22nd. - [Narrator] The
interrogator will now attempt to gather information
and establish a timeline leading up to Friday,
the day of the murder. - And that was the night that you guys went up there to visit. Can you tell me about, a little bit about, maybe at school or something, how you learned or how you come to go up to Cassie's place or out to
that place she was housesitting? - She told me on Thursday. - Okay. - That she was having, uh,
babysitting the house, basically. - Okay. - Housesitting. - Okay. So you guys decided to go and plans are made, it's Friday. What time do you get ready?
What time do you end up, how does it work out that
you and Brian head out to-- (crosstalk) I'll just refer to it as
Whispering Cliffs, okay? - Yeah.
- Fair enough? - [Narrator] Whispering
Cliffs is the street address of the home Cassie was housesitting. Torey's mother is helping
him recount his timeline. - Mom, what time did I
leave from our house? - [Torey's Mother] Um.. - On Friday? - [Torey's Mother] It was after I got back from taking Jamie to the game. - It was about 6:30 or 7:00? - [Torey's Mother] Yeah, 6 30 ish. - About there. - Okay, between 6:30 and 7:00. - Yeah. - You left your house. - Yeah, and I went and picked up Brian, - [Torey's Mother] No,
no, 7:00. Probably.. yeah, between 6:30 and 7:00. - Okay. And, um.. - Picked up Brian. - You were driving your red,
that red, is it you, or.. - Yeah, yeah. - And that's your car you
get back and forth in. So you drove that to Brian's house. - I picked him up, and then.. - About around what time
do you think it was? - Uh, I don't know. Maybe 7:00. Between 7:00 and 7:30. - [Narrator] In reality, Brian and Torey had planned to kill Cassie
on that very Thursday he talked about. They film themselves in a car that night, saying that they'd snooped
around another girl's house. But she wasn't home, so they were going to call up Matt and Cassie. In that tape, Brian spoke:
"They're our friends, but we have to make sacrifices. So, um, I feel tonight it is the night, and I feel really weird and stuff. I feel like I want to kill somebody. For whatever reason, they didn't go through with it that night. - [Torey] There should be no
law against killing people. I know it's a wrong thing, but, - [Brian] You might just want to. - Hell, hell! If you
restrict somebody from it, they're gonna want it more. - [Brian] We found our
victim, and sad as it may be, she's our friend, but you know what? We all have to make sacrifices. Our first victim is going
to be Cassie Stoddart. She's going to be alone
in a big, dark house out in the middle of nowhere. How perfect can you get? I
mean, like, holy shit, dude. - [Torey] I'm horny
just thinking about it. - [Brian] Hell yeah. - [Narrator] At school the next morning, Brian recorded a short video
of Cassie by her locker. - [Brian] Have you seen Torey? He's supposed to meet me here at 7:30. It's 8:19, he's an hour late. You don't even care, do you? - Not really. (Brian laughs)
- Okay. - And so at school I told
a whole bunch of people that they were gonna
party there and stuff, and that she's gonna be home alone for the whole weekend. - Okay, how can that, let's just talk a little bit about that. Why, why did you, like
a whole bunch of people, what does that mean? Does that mean 10? Does that mean 20? - I told a group of 10,
I believe it was like eight or nine, I don't know. (indistinct) - Okay. - And I was talking to them and stuff, and they said that they
would, (indistinct) that they would tell
her friends and stuff. - [Narrator] It was
actually just Matt, Brian, and Torey who came over
on the night of the crime. Although we can't be sure
if Brian actually told a bunch of the other
kids that Cassie would be alone at the house that weekend, it seems like something he
could have easily made up, hoping to make the interrogators believe that any number of students could have had the necessary knowledge to take advantage of Cassie's vulnerable situation. And in fact, interrogators
would deliberately bring this point up to Torey the next day, asking if the party was
common knowledge at school. This already sets him
up to be more at ease, because the logical progression
in his mind would be: "the more people who know,
the more suspects there are, and the less focus there will be on me." Well, nice try. - Did you tell other people about this? - Yes. - Okay, so it's maybe
common knowledge at school - Yes. - That she was gonna
have a few people over. - It was. - But it really wasn't gonna
be this big, wild party (indistinct) or anything like that, right? - [Narrator] Torey responds very quickly, anxious to accept that extra cover. - Did they say what time the party was supposed to begin? - Well, I said I'd be there around 8:00. - Okay. - [Narrator] Torey mentions
planning their trip to Cassie's at school that Friday. - You hooked up with Brian, and you said, "hey, we should go to this. We
should go to Cassie's place." - Yeah, we were planning
that during school. - Okay. - [Narrator] In reality,
he and Brian had indeed used their class time that
day to plan the night out. But it wasn't concerning
fun activities with friends. Instead, they taped
themselves saying things like, "hopefully this will go
smoothly and we can get our first kill done and then keep going." And, "I'm sorry, Cassie's family, but she had to be the one. She's perfect, so she's gonna die." - September 22nd (indistinct) - We're skipping our fourth hour, we're writing our plan right now. - Our death list. - I'm sorry, Cassie's family, but she had to be the one. We're sick of her, and she's perfect, so she's gonna die. (laughs) - [Narrator] After school, they linked up before heading out. - I see, okay. So I
called Torey around, um, 7:45 or something like that. And then he came and got
me at around eight o'clock. - [Narrator] The interrogators confirm some details about the vehicle they took, as well as some phone calls
they made around this time. Not only will they check that these calls were actually made, but they also may look for
cellular tower location data, to confirm that they were made from the spots the boys say they were. And this will become crucial as the phone calls get closer
to the time of the crime. Brian and Torey eventually found their way to the Whispering Cliffs residence. And you'll see that the interrogators ask very open-ended questions about what happened when they arrived. This is a common way to let the suspect apparently control the narrative, while also paying close
attention to what they add, omit, or even alter
in the timeline of events, as compared to what the
interrogators already know. This helps to establish their general trustworthiness, or lack thereof. - Then what? - Uh, then we saw Cat, Cat. (laughs) Matt! On the front porch, and
he says, "hey guys--" - Is that, like, up on the balconies-- - Yeah. - Up like on the second level? - The balcony, and he says-- - So he come out, he come out of the house
to greet you? Okay. - And so, we were inside
the house and we're like, "holy crap," and it's
a huge house and stuff. And so we went-- - How do you get into the house? - You go up a balcony,
then, and it's like that. - So you ended up entering the house at the same place where Matt was standing and greeting you. But did you notice there
was a lower door, too, and a garage door? - I did, I did. - Okay, you didn't go in that door, you went in the second level? - Yes. - Okay. And then what? - Well, we.. - You guys went into
the house at the side. Both together, Torey was with you. - Yes. - [Narrator] The interrogator is starting to thumb through notes. He's attempting to distract the suspect and make communication more difficult. But the suspect doesn't seem to notice. - Okay. - Inside the house, it
was really big and stuff, and we thought, "this is cool," you know? And then I remember asking Cassie, uh, "where is everybody," you know? She said, well, I'm not sure. So we sat down, I remember
she had a big, uh, video-- - So you sat, so you went there and you
went into a first room. Did you go into a living room? A hallway? - There was a living
room on the left side, and there's a staircase. - So what's the first thing you did when you arrived there? Did you just go into the living room, - No. - Did you go throughout the whole house? - I walked around. - Checked out the house. - Yeah. - Okay. Was you escorted by anybody or-- - I was. Matt. - Okay, so Matt, like-- - He walked me around and stuff. - He was just kind of showing you, so you basically looked at
every room in the house. (crosstalk) - There's a lot of rooms in there, yeah. - Okay. - There's tons of them. - All right. - Um.
(clears throat) So you arrived there. What, what happens when you get there? - She, Cassie and Matt gave
us a tour of the entire house. - Back up just a little bit.
So you pull in the drive, did they greet you at the door? - Yeah, and then Matt
was outside on the deck, and he waved at us, and then
he went inside the house and we just walked up
the stairs and walked in. - Okay, so you walked up the stairs, you saw a basement door going in, maybe, and the garage door. - Basement? - See, this is the garage door right here. - Yeah. - Was there a door
here? A little man door? - Oh yeah, there was. - Okay. So you went by the door,
but you went up the stairs. - We went up the stairs. (crosstalk) - So they greeted you there. - Uh huh. - You went inside? - Yes. - And what happened? So you went inside. - Uh, we walked around
(indistinct) the entry hall. And then we got the tour
of the entire house. - And did they take you on that tour? - Yeah, they did. They showed us around. - [Narrator] The interrogator
made sure to call attention to the lower entrance to the house, and the fact that Brian and Torey became well-acquainted with the layout of basically the entire home. Because of this exploration, they learned of many entrances and places to hide. Later, when they left the home, they would make sure to leave a back door, which leads from the
garage into the basement, unlocked so that a sneaky re-entry could be made without
alerting Cassie or Matt. A bit further into his
account of the get together, Brian starts talking about
going through a movie collection at the home, and the investigators
zero in on this topic. - And then I saw he had
a big video collection, so there was a whole
bunch of movies and stuff. And then, I think-- - Did you look through those movies? - I did. - Okay. Do you like movies? - I, yes. - What kind of movies, what's your favorite kind of movie? - I like horror movies. - Okay, so you like horror movies. - Yeah. - What's your favorite movie? - My favorite movie? Uh, what, what genre? - Is what? - What, well, like what category? - Oh. - There's lots of them. - Is there? What would you say is your
favorite movie of all? - All time, my favorite
movie would have to be.. (tapping) There's lots of choices. Um, to be honest, I would
have to say "Halloween," my favorite movie. - Okay. It's a good one. - Good movie, it is. - That's a pretty good classic. - Yeah, it is. - [Narrator] For any other interrogation, asking someone their
favorite movie might seem a little off topic, but for this case, it is absolutely relevant. Not only does it serve to get the suspect to relax and talk more comfortably, but it's actually a theme that comes up again and again in this case. - Did you, I mean, did you pick a movie? Were you going to watch a movie? - I wanted to watch, uh,
"Domestic Disturbance," but that's not what Torey wanted to watch. So he got, uh, "Kill Bill:
Volume Two," I believe. - Okay. - We watched that. - Did you watch the whole movie? Did you guys all go in the
living room and watch the movie? - Yes. And I, I was on the couch that was on the far wall. And Matt and Cassie
were kissing and stuff. - Okay. - And Torey was right by the
TV, and they had a huge TV. - [Narrator] Brian says they
watched a little of the movie, but then around 8:50, he
was feeling a little bored and said he should probably head home. Matt purportedly said he needed a ride, and Brian says Torey promised
to come back and get him. Brian starts talking about
when they left the house, but then the interrogator cuts him off to bring up an unexpected subject. Brian had earlier
described the other friends enjoying popsicles at the house, and now the investigator asks
what they used to open them. - When they were eating popsicles, what, now were you in the kitchen? Were you, what were
you using to open them? Were they have these
ones that you have to, you have to cut the top open, or do you tear them with your teeth, or? - Uh, you had to cut the top of them open. - Okay, so how were they opening the popsicles? - Uh, I remember there
was a knife in the drawer that had like a child.. thing on it. - Okay. - And Matt was like, "oh yeah," um, I'll show you how
to open it and stuff, and he opened it for me. And then he did it. - Okay. So did you
touch that knife at all? - Uh, I think I, I think
held it first, yes. - Okay, did you see them using the knife? - Yeah. - Okay. All right. And then did, was it laying
on the counter when you left? Was it put back in the
drawer, was on the counter? Do you know where it was? - I think it was put back
in the drawer, actually. - Okay. But you, but you saw that, and Matt showed you, Matt apparently helped you get
that knife out of the thing? - Yeah. - Okay. And then why did you handle it? - (stutters) I, oh, oh, I
was trying to find, like, a pair of s-scissors, and
I found that and I'm like-- - Okay, okay. (indistinct) - [Narrator] This answer goes outside of Brian's prepared story
and he's getting nervous. - And, but you didn't have a popsicle stick of your own-- - I did not have a popsicle stick. - You just helped them open theirs. - Yeah, I helped them. - All right. - I'm not a big fan of
those kind of popsicles. (laughs)
- Okay. - The interrogators wanted to know if and why his fingerprints would be on a knife in the house. And now, they're about
to transition into asking about another key place in the home that would be strange for Brian
and Torey to have touched. - So you're downstairs, you got the popsicles out
of the freezer downstairs, is that where you got the popsicles? - Yeah, the freezer. - That's where they were? All right. Well, did you see
any other room downstairs? Was there, did you go in the-- (crosstalk) - Yes, yeah. - Tell me about that room. - That room was kind of cool. It had like a couch, had like TV in there. They had like a fridge,
like a microwave, I believe. - Okay, so you check out that room. Do you notice anything about
that room that's, I mean, was the lights on in
it when you were there? - Uh, the lights were off. And then-- - So you guys went back, opened the door-- - Y-you turn them on.. And I remember thinking it
was kind of out of, you know, the way of the house. - A weird place for the room? Okay. Did you notice
anything on the walls? Do you know what a, do you know what a-- - Like paintings, or whatever? - Well, you know, maybe like that, but do you know what
an electrical panel is, like the breaker box that
you turn the breakers on in the house? - Like the steel-- - Yeah, it's like a steel panel door, and then it's got breaker switches. It turns the power off to everything. Have you ever seen one
of those on the wall? - I have in my house, yeah. - Okay. Do you remember seeing one on the wall in that room? - I didn't even think of it, no. - Okay. You didn't think of it, or you didn't see it? - I didn't see it. - Okay, but you might've.. if the door would have
been hanging open on it, you probably would've noticed it, maybe? - Well, yeah. - Okay. So you didn't like, didn't like, shut the door on it? It was open? So your fingerprints
wouldn't be on that panel for any reason, you don't remember, like, shutting the door or putting your hand up on the door, or putting
your hand against the wall? - I walked in there. - I don't think my
prints would be on that, because I didn't know
exactly where it was, so. - Okay, so, but you didn't recognize the electrical panel in there. - I didn't recognize anything. - It's something you certainly wouldn't be fooling around with normally. - I mean, no. - So you, I mean, you
would probably remember touching something like that,
'cause they're dangerous. - Probably. - Yeah, okay. - Yes. - [Narrator] These question
suggest that investigators have already found Brian's
fingerprints on the panel in the downstairs room, and
they are silently gathering inconsistencies to use against him later. Torey was also specifically
asked about this room, but said he just looked
through movies there. The reason investigators
are so fixated on this room and the panel is because
this lower level of the house is where the buildup to
the murder took place. You see, what really happened
after the boys left that night was that Brian and Torey
parked down the street and returned to the
Whispering Cliffs residence only about 15 minutes
after they had said goodbye to their friends. While in the car, they had filmed their gleeful anticipation of the crime they were about to commit. At around 9:53 PM,
Brian spoke on the tape: "Um, unfortunately we
have the grueling task of killing our two friends, and they're right in that
house, just down the street." They talk about how they've
waited for this a long time and are now ready. - [Brian] The time is
9:50, September 22nd, 2006. We know there's lots of doors and there's lots of places to hide. I locked the back doors,
that's all locked. And now we just gotta wait. - [Narrator] They put on
dark clothes and masks before equipping their knives and creeping back into the home. Once there, Brian and Torey wanted to scare Matt and Cassie
as much as possible before actually going through with their horrible plan. So they used the electrical panel to flip the lights on and off as the couple sat watching TV upstairs. They also made loud noises, even throwing two ashtrays
at the bottom of the stairs in an attempt to lure
Cassie and Matt downstairs to check out what was going on. But they were unsuccessful. This is what the boys were
really doing that night. But of course, as the
interrogation goes on, Brian tries to cling to the story that they went to the cinema. However, it's clear
that police likely have eyewitness accounts of
people seeing their car parked in the neighborhood. And so, Brian is desperately scrambling to explain this away. - Tickets for the movie. - Oh, okay, so you're going to go get tickets to go to the movie. - And so-- - You didn't park anywhere, though, in between, so there'd be no reason for, like, a neighbor- - We stopped for like 15 minutes. - To see your car. Where at? (stutters) - To, to find, to, to phone call Matt. - Okay. So was this in the
neighborhood, just not far down? - Yes. - No, it was like, maybe 20
feet away from the house. - Okay. - Then, uh, Matt wanted us
t-to come back and get him. - So this is just probably me not understanding, but,
so, you leave the house and you're just, like,
you're 20 feet down the road. - Yeah. - [Narrator] The interrogator keeps saying it's probably just his
fault for not understanding. He's not directly calling out how little Brian's story makes sense,
but rather using this method to have him repeat key details
and find any inconsistencies. - Then you called Matt. You hadn't been, you hadn't
been gone from the house for, what, a minute or
two, right? I mean.. - No, we didn't call Matt yet. - Okay, so you stop there and find the cell phone. - Yeah. - How long did you stop there for? - Uh, five minutes. - Okay. What were you doing? - We were talking about
the movie and stuff. - Okay. Talking about going to a movie? Okay. - Okay. - Talking for about five minutes. - For five minutes. - Okay. - Then, you want me to keep going? - Sure, yeah. So you didn't make the phone call from
there, you kept rolling. - No, we got to the movies and got our tickets and stuff. And then we called Matt-- - Back up and slow down just a little bit so I can make sure and
get all the details here. You find the phone, and you guys talked for five minutes there. - [Narrator] Brian is clearly
trying to speed through this dishonest section
as fast as possible. His description of their supposed trip to the movie theater is similarly dubious. And now the interrogators
will start to get very specific about locations, positions, relative times and chronological
sequences of events. This suggests they already have a timeline they are working with and want to snuff out additional
flaws in Brian's story. - We wanted to see "Click,"
but it started at 9:45 and we watch movies a lot, you know. - Uh huh. - And we like to see the whole movie, so. And I think the only
one playing was "Pulse," and that was at 10 o'clock. - Okay. - So we went inside there. I remember calling Matt
inside the movie theater. - So that was about, was it still 9:45, or was it a little later
when you called Matt? So we can match up that phone call. - Maybe 10:26, I think. 10:26, 10:27. - Okay. - [Narrator] The phone calls with Matt during this time period
are extremely eerie. Once we know the context, Brian and Torey indeed told
him they had to speak quietly because they were at the movies. In reality, they were
directly below the couple in the downstairs room,
lying in wait and trying not to give away their position. - Who sold you your ticket? - I remember it was a guy. - Was there anything particular about him? - He was just the guy
at the movie theater. - Okay. Did you, did you know him? - No. - And so we got, so we got go, you buy it from the guy it's 9:45, rough. Do you think it's 9:45 when
you go inside the lobby there? - Um.. - So someone sees you there, they're going to see you at 9:45? - Probably.
- Okay. - Okay. But where's the movie at? - Uh, I think the movie's
on the right side. - Okay. And then, where at? Is it the first theater,
do you guys turn and go in? - Is there any way you can help us out with a map of the theater
to show us kind of where the movie was in there, so we know? - Um.. - And again, we're just trying to confirm, you know. You can do
that page if you want, just flip the page. - Yeah. All right. Box here, parking lot over here, that's where we parked by the way. - And you're absolutely,
unequivocally positive that you two went into "Pulse," you two bought tickets for "Pulse." - Yeah. - [Narrator] This is an
attention grabbing technique to redirect the suspect to
this particular interrogator, who, up until this point,
has been mostly passive. This is a classic technique when asking, "are you absolutely sure
of XYZ?" to get the suspect to commit to a fact-based answer, which suggests the interrogators
know something contrary and they want an explicit
lie or contradiction. - Yeah. - Okay. - And so he, and he
asked you about the guy that was taking the
tickets, just so we know. Do you remember what color hair he had? Do you remember anything about him at all? - Uh, I didn't even-- Do you remember anybody else there, working behind the counter?
Did you recognize anybody? - No, I was just talking to my friend. - [Narrator] Some sources
claim that the investigators actually interviewed the employee who worked the ticket booth that night. And it was a female who
knew Torey and Brian from going to school
with them, and confirmed that they had not been there
at all on the Friday night. If true, this obviously
directly contradicts Brian's claim that the
employee was a random man he didn't know, and explains
why the interrogators keep touching on this point. - Now, as soon as you bought tickets, you went in there at 9:45, but the movie hadn't started, 'cause it starts at 10. So you had to hang around in the lobby. - Well-- - For 15 minutes, right? - Well, no, we went to the bathroom. - Okay. - And then we went to the theater. - Okay, so you-- - You only need to go in there like a few minutes before it starts. - Sure. Okay, so where at
do you sit in the theater? If you could just draw-- - I guess I don't understand about the, you go in and buy the ticket, still 9:45. - Yeah. - Correct? And then you buy the
ticket, but you're inside. - Yeah. - So then you go to the bathroom? - Yeah. - Then you come back out.
Now, they're not letting you in the movie until 10 o'clock. - No, you can go in the movie, like, (stutters) probably ten minutes before it s-starts. - So they were sitting you and everything, so it wasn't like waiting
till 10 o'clock, right? - Uh, we had to wait a little bit because there was a movie in
there before, I think. - Okay. - Is what happened. - All right. - So you just hung out the lobby? - No. - No. - We stayed in the bathroom, then we talked about some stuff, and then went to the theaters and stuff. - [Narrator] Both interrogators are playing off one another here. One seems to not understand
that you can enter a theater a few minutes before a movie
starts, while the other does. Although Brian is being
accurate, and anyone who has gone to a movie knows
it would be reasonable to enter a few minutes
before the starting time, the interrogator pretending
not to understand this deliberately pushes the issue. It seems that they are
really trying to get Brian to admit to hanging out in the lobby so that they can then see
if witnesses confirm or deny their presence that night. But Brian finds ways
to dodge this by saying they were in the bathroom or dark theater. The interrogators are
actually taking turns with "hard cop, soft cop," which
keeps Brian off balance. He doesn't have a rapport
with either interrogator, and therefore is unable to
relax from this point onwards. - Do you remember what the
coming attractions were? The trailers, you know, in the movie when you're sitting there watching it? - I remember-- - Where'd you sit inside the movie? On the next page, just go flip the page. (crosstalk) Just draw a movie house,
a big square movie house. And I want you to just kind of give us a general location in the room. - Okay, stairs. We
always sit in the middle. - I mean, you always do, but did you, did you this time sit in the middle? - Yeah. - Okay, was there was there
a lot of people in there? - Uh, it wasn't like, you
know, a full house or anything. - Estimate how many people
you think were in there. - Half. - Like, 10 people? - No. - Five people? - More than that.
- 20 people? - Uh, I remember.. Well, it wasn't like, full. Maybe half of the theater, probably. Not-- Oh, like half would be packed. I don't know, just maybe if
I ever have to say a number, I'd say about 30. - About 30? - Yeah.
- Okay. Say this is the whole big building. This is the whole thing,
this is where you go, this is the little ticket
booth maybe right here. And then, you know, you
can go to this theater, or this theater's back here. Which way did you go? - I think it was the
right, it was the right. - Okay. So you went to the right. And then do you remember
where the theater was once you went to the right? - Uh.. - Just kind of give me the
general location in the building? Was it clear at the end?
Was it right in front? - Uh, I-- - You just don't remember that? - I don't know. - You don't remember seeing
the sign or anything? - I remember-- - 'Cause there's a lot of movie theaters in there, right?
- I went with these two guys. Yeah. It-- I just followed them and they went to the theater. - Okay. - [Narrator] The interrogators
continue to question Brian about the movie theater before they take a clever new approach to
determine whether or not he was actually there: Question him about the movie itself. Here's where his lies come to a head. - I'm trying to ask you to give some details about the movie. Do you remember any, like,
the coming attractions? The trailers, the previews- - I don't remember the
trailers. I do know that um, what I saw, it's kind of like a, kind of like a sequel to,
uh, t-to "White Noise." - Okay. - But there was no original
characters or anything. - So what was the movie about? I mean, you watched most of the movie? - Uh, I don't know. Well,
there was a girl there. I sat, it was, she's maybe
two seats away from me. - Okay. What side of
you was she sitting on? - My, my, my right side. - On your right side? - Yes. - Two girls, right? - Uh, there was a girl.
And she had a friend, yes. - [Narrator] Like Torey,
Brian doesn't remember any specific details
about the movie at all. Now he's going to make up a story that he was distracted
talking to some girls, and that's why he wasn't
paying attention to the movie, even at one point making the bizarre claim that he followed one of
them out of the theater while she called her dad. - So you were talking to them? - Yeah. - Okay. So if we got all
of them, they would know. They'd remember that conversation. - Yes, they would remember. - Did I recall you saying
that her name was Heather? - I remember her name was Heather, yes. - Okay, what about the other
one? You remember her name? - I didn't really talk to her at all. - Okay. Do you remember where they went to school or anything? - Um, I thought I heard them
say Highland, and that's-- (stutters) But I'm not exactly sure exactly which school they went to now. - Okay. What did she look like? - Well, she was pretty
attractive, of course. Uh, she was wearing tight jeans. She had, I think it was brown hair, and it was probably about to here. - Okay. So that would say
probably what? 5'3, 5'4? - Um, she was pretty
short. I would say 5'5. - Was she-- - Well, she wasn't that short, because she was probably up to here, to me. She was probably 5'6, 5'7. - What color was her hair? - Uh, it was brown. - Definitely brown, or it
was it strawberry brown, or? - It was like my (stutters) sister's hair, so it was, like, brown, with like strips of
blonde in it and stuff. - So you're pretty confident
her name was Heather. - Mm-hmm. - Just not sure if she
went to Highland or not? - Yeah. - I'm not positive she went to Highland. - Okay. - But you haven't seen her at Pokey. - No. I've never seen her before, so. - So she either goes to Highland or-- - Century. - Century. - Or she came from out
of town, I don't know. - But you heard her say Highland? I mean, something gave
you the inkling that-- - I guess. Yeah, yeah. Well, I don't-- - If you don't remember, that's fine. (crosstalk) But if she said Highland,
then that kind of helps us a little bit. - Okay. - Okay, good deal. - [Narrator] Brian seems to recognize that he's backing himself
into a corner here. If he commits to saying
she goes to Highland, because they could easily
talk to any Heathers who attend that school
and verify this story. So he backtracks, and says he's not sure. The interrogators have
been nice enough thus far, but here's where they really crack down. - So you don't remember anything, any details about this movie? You know, how long were
you in the movie for? - Uh, we were in there maybe 20 minutes, and I called Matt. - Okay. - And, uh.. - You called him, or Torey called him? - T-Torey called him. - And do you remember what time that was? - Uh, it was maybe 20
minutes into the movie. - [Narrator] The phone
call being discussed is actually the phone
call Brian and Torey made while they were hiding in the basement. - So at 10:20, if the
movie starts on time. - Well, not exactly 20
minutes, but you know. Yeah. - So around 10:20, you think? - Yeah, I'd say I remember
checking his phone to see what time it was at, like, at like maybe 10 minutes into the movie. And it said 10:12. And then I remember we
called him at least probably 10 minutes after that. - So you were sitting
inside the movie house-- - Yes. - When you called and said
theater movie was going? - Yes. - Who did you talk-- did you call, make the call or did Torey? - He called, he called, he called, yes. - Torey called Matt. - Torey called Matt. - Okay. And so you don't know what they talked about? - No. - Did you hear any conversation, what Torey was saying to him, or did he tell you about the conversation? - Uh, I remember, I remember he said if he still needed us to pick him up or something, and he said no. That his mom was going
to come before that, before we got back to his house. So I, I remember (stutters) he asked him if we wanted us to come and stop by the movie house. And then he said that he
had to go home with his mom. That's what he said. - Okay. - How long did you stay at move? You end up going back into the movie after you've been out with Heather while she's making
phone-- Where's Torey at? Is he still in the movie?
He's watching the movie? - Yes. - Okay. And then you go back in and you sit next to Torey again? And then how long do
you stay at the movie? Did you finish out the movie? - I think we waited five minutes, and then I remember seeing the credits. I remember seeing the credits. - So at the end of the movie.
- Yeah. Okay, so what's the movie about, I mean, you're a movie buff, so these are things that
you pay attention to, right? - [Narrator] The interrogators
begin asking Brian about more details of the movie. They're still trying to
establish his presence there. - At least give us parts of the movie, any characters you can hook us up with? Can you describe somebody in the movie, describe what happened? Anything. What's the whole premise, or the plot, of the movie. What's it all about? - Ah, well, it was
s-similar to "White Noise." - I don't know "White Noise," so you're going to have to give us-- - Like I said. - Okay, you have to give you some details. - Okay. It's about a guy, his wife, um, - I don't want to know what
"White Noise" is about, I wanna I know what this movie's about. - Yes, that's what I'm saying. - Okay. - And then I remember, um, I can't really exactly explain the movie, but I wasn't-- I didn't
pay attention to it. - Well, okay. You know
what we did yesterday? (laughs)
- What? We went and watched the movie. - Really? - Mm-hmm, so. - Okay. - What is the movie about? - [Narrator] They are now
contradicting his presence, or how long he was present. Here is where they will begin picking apart his alibi. - Geez. I, I don't exactly know. I remember being, I remember
being r-really bored. - So you go in the movie,
you paid that money to go in a move in and just, I mean, so your story is you never
really watched the movie. - Well, I was talking to the girls there. - Okay. But they're
two seats away, I mean, you couldn't do a lot
of talking in the movie. At least you're picking up something. You're going to pick up at least one image off the screen that you saw. Tell us about one person,
describe one person you saw in the movie. What'd they look like? - I'm seeing a man, and he looked at a TV screen and it
had white noise on it. It had the "ssshhh" thing. - And that's all you saw, the whole movie? - Yeah. - So how long do you think you were inside that movie theater? Total, grand total. - We were there for maybe two hours. - Two hours you were
inside that movie theater? And you don't remember
one detail to help us out. - Uh.. - We're trying to help you out. - Uh, yeah I know, that's why
I wanna tell you. Ah, geez. - Okay, so let's go back to this. You go back in the room, and Torey's still sitting there after Heather makes the phone call. When the movie credits were rolling, did you guys get up and leave? - Yeah. - [Narrator] After the movie, Brian says they went straight home to Torey's house and spent the night there. Brian's told his whole
story at this point, and is probably hoping that
this whole thing can be over. But now the interrogators shift their tone and get very real with
Brian, at the same time playing a, "we want to help you, not let something bad happen to you" card. However, this is after 45 minutes of letting him dig himself into a lie. - Um, Brian, we got some problems, okay? - Yeah, yeah, I understand. - We got some problems. - The movie. - And, and it's really important that this is the time, and the interview, where you really need to cowboy up and you really need to decide how you want this thing to fall on you. - Yeah. - [Narrator] The interrogator is now confronting Brian with
conflicting information. He never went to the movies. - Um, we've done our homework, okay? - Yeah. - We've talked to a lot of
people, we've viewed tape, okay? And I'm here to tell you,
you didn't go to the movie. - Okay. - You were not at that movie theater. - Mm-hmm. - Okay? Now that's neither here nor there, but the thing is, you're
going to have to get by that, because if you didn't go
to the movie, that's fine. But you're going to have
to tell us where you went, so that we can put you there, Because it's, I don't want
something to cave in on you, that's not working for you. - Brian. - Okay? We're here to help you, bro. I mean, really we are. - You know what happened, okay? - With what? - You didn't go to the movie. - We didn't go to movie.
Okay, okay, I'll tell you-- - Okay, listen--
- Before you do that, just listen carefully to Andy, okay? - Okay, now listen to me. Don't underestimate how much we know. - Okay. - Okay? I told you the first night that when I saw you that I don't think you're the type of person that can kill somebody cold-blooded. - And well, yeah,
especially my close friend. - Especially your close friend. - Of course. Okay. Okay.
Hold on a sec, okay? - Okay. - [Narrator] The interrogator is playing the "kindly dad" role here, the "come clean so we can
get through this" approach, by using a softer voice paired
with intense body language. He conveys the gravity of the situation, while also disarming Brian a bit. - I can tell you what we were doing, I was trying to hide this, but I guess I have to tell you now. - You're gonna have to,
man. It's the only way out. - Um, we went through cars. - [Narrator] The dynamic has
drastically shifted here. As Brian knows that the investigators know that he just lied to their faces, and likely won't fully trust anything he says going forward, still, he tries to "come
clean" with a red herring, completely avoiding the full truth. - And that's, I guess, all of it. So that's why I wouldn't say that. - So you went through
cars, what does that mean? - Uh, check for the
cars that they're well, well locked and-- - Where was that, where at? - It was Tourhead Drive, I don't know. And then, we called Matt
because he wanted to come too. - Okay. So you didn't go to the movie, but you went through cars. - We didn't go to the movie-- - Can you tell us where
you went through cars at, because if you went-- Did you
take anything out of cars? - We didn't find anything. Oh, god. - Okay, so can you take us to a car that you went through and we should find your fingerprints on that car? - We went to, I had gloves, and then we went, I remember we drove by Torey's house-- - Hold on. - At his neighborhood. - Hold on. - Let's just really, let's
re-zero ourselves, man. We, I can't stress to you enough that we are your best
friends right now, okay? And please don't underestimate, we know you're a bright kid. We know that you got a lot going for you, and we want to help you to
get a lot going for you. And we want to help you. And right now is the
perfect time that we can.. Man, we can really help you out. Now, we've got a lot of
bargaining chips right now. But it just so requires, like Andy said, we possess some knowledge,
firsthand knowledge. We know, and what we're really waiting for is you to come straight with us so that we can help get
you out of this crap so it's not gonna ruin
the rest of your life. - Okay. - We want to help you,
okay? We really do wanna, I just really want you to believe in us for a minute, and really-- - I understand what you're
saying, I understand-- - You need to tell us the truth. - [Narrator] The interrogator
uses a similar tactic as his partner, in emphasizing the truth. They've both gone good cop. (crosstalk) - Okay, so this is the truth. - Yes, this is, this is the truth. - You can, these things,
we should be able to go out and confirm. - Yes. - And corroborate. - This is, I was trying to hide this because I heard from her friend that that's 10 years in prison. - What exactly were you
doing? Tell me exactly what you were doing. - We parked outside her house, for-- - Whose house? - Uh.. well (stutters) - Let's try, okay. - Cassie's house. - Let's do something right now. - Yeah. - Just take, just take a minute. Let's all, we'll all
be quiet for a minute. You can take a few deep breaths, okay? - Yeah. - Really go deep and
do some soul searching, and get your, you know, get your wind back and then you can go
ahead and tell us, okay? - Okay. - Can you tell us when you're ready? Just take a few deep breaths. Like your dad said,
just need to calm down. If you're telling the truth,
this is going to be easy. If you're lying, it's
going to be a hard night. - Yeah, I gotcha. - Okay. - Now before you go any further, okay? We have some aces in our pocket. - [Narrator] The interrogator's tactic of vaguely saying they
have aces is commonly used when police actually don't
have enough evidence, otherwise a confession
would not be needed. Physical and circumstantial
evidence is enough to convict for murder
without a confession. - And what I mean by aces,
I mean, we have some things that we know beyond a shadow of a doubt. (phone ringing) That we've confirmed with
people and that we know, okay? We know about the car. We
know about some activities that you guys have done, okay? So needless to say, for you to jerk us, our chain, okay? Cassie's this
great friend of yours. Okay. - I mean, she's watching right now. She's hearing everything
that you're saying. - She has been brutally murdered and then you have wasted our
time by dicking around, okay? And trying to lie to us, and trust me, we understand why you're
trying to divert us, okay? We understand. You don't
want to get in trouble. I understand, okay? The
whole point of this is, is don't waste any more of her time, okay? Don't underestimate what we know. - Yeah. - Okay? Because it's gonna come down to one or two things, okay? We already have one
strike against you, okay? You've already lied to us, and we don't appreciate that, okay? - Yeah. - These are the types of
situations that you don't lie in. Everything else in this world is game. And I'm a firm believer in
that. I don't give a shit. If you lie in anything
else to a cop, whatever, when it comes to a murder
of a beloved friend, you do not lie, okay? The second part of that is I
want you to take a deep breath, and I want you to think
about what part of this that you're involved in. Okay, how much of this
are you involved in? - Involved in what? - [Narrator] Brian is
trying to play dumb here when he's well aware it's
a murder investigation. - In what we're talking
about, with Cassie, okay? - You think I'm involved-- - I want you to continue.
I want you to keep talking to us about that. - Because we know some things, Brian. Okay? And I'm saying, we're your lifeline. We can help you now, but
we can't help you later. We can, if you tell us, I mean, we're willing to let bygones be bygones. You told us the first lie, so what? We expect that. Just, let's clean it up and let's make it right. And let's be.. Let's look, man to man, in the eye, let's get all our cards on the table, and let's talk about,
we're here for one thing. We're here to solve what happened-- - Of course
- To Cassie. - Yes. - And we need to know. - [Narrator] Watch this
next moment carefully. - If you were involved in that. And if you are, that's
fine, we can deal with that. - It's not fine. - We can deal with that. (scoffs) (tape rewinds) - If you were involved in that. And if you are, that's
fine, we can deal with that. - It's not fine. - We can deal with that. (scoffs) - [Narrator] Brian
begins to smile and laugh in response to being
asked if he had anything to do with Cassie's murder. - What? That's ridiculous. Why would I want to kill my friend? Why would I wanna kill Cassie? - [Narrator] He even smiles when he says, "why would I want to kill my friend? Why would I kill Cassie,"
before catching himself and recognizing his expression
isn't matching his words. He corrects himself by
attempting to portray sadness. - No, I don't know who killed Cassie. Doesn't it seem weird
that all of a sudden now, you know, where you left
a place in the house, like, now you've already
told us the first light. Now, you know, I'm hoping
that you're going to, you're going to come clean
and you're going to tell us-- - I'm telling you exactly-- All right. We left her house, okay? We parked over here at the grass. - Okay. - We called Matt. I don't know exactly what the time was, it was probably 10:15. Probably t-- Not 10:15, that's too much. I don't know. N-- 9:40, I guess. He said he'd get back to us. - Get back to you about what? - About the, the cars. - So we should expect Matt-- - We were supposed to
come back and get him-- - I'm gonna stop you at one thing. Matt's taking a polygraph tomorrow, okay? - Okay. - A lie detector test. - Yeah of course, I know. - We're gonna ask-- - Okay. - Okay? Now you're saying
that he has knowledge of that, you're going to go through cars. - Yes.
- Okay. - [Narrator] Polygraph tests are usually not admissible in court except
under very few exceptions. The cops are either lying or trying to make more of the
test than is realistic. They are preying on
the suspect's ignorance of admissibility of evidence in court. - Yes.
- So that's true? - Yes.
- That's the straight up? - Yes.
- That's something we're gonna be able to bounce off, that's gonna be-- - Mm-hmm. So we should be able to
go ask Matt, "is it true these guys called and said they
wanted to go through cars?" - Yes. - Okay, okay. So you called him about 10:15, maybe less. - Yes.
- Maybe before? - Yes. - You said, "okay, do you
want to do it? And he says.." - He said he's not sure,
he's going to call his mom and see if he can stay out. And then yes. And so, we probably waited for about, probably waited about 20 minutes from about 10 o'clock, of course. And then we called Matt again. - So this would be about 10:20. - We called Matt about 10:20, 10:30. - Okay. Called him again. - We called him again. - Second time, yes. - And he said his mom
was coming to get him, so he couldn't go. So we did, we left, and went and did cars. - Where'd you go through cars at? - We went to a neighborhood
by Torey's house. And then I remember there-- - Okay, you gotta be-- (crosstalk) - Now listen to me. Listen
to me. You gotta make sure.. that you can verify what color cars, because we have to go verify all that. - I don't know what color cars, we just checked all the cars. - How did you do that?
You had gloves on, huh? - Yeah, we just checked all the cars. - What kind of gloves? - You got those gloves? - Uh, I should have them, yes. - Where are they at? - They should be in my room. - What kind of gloves? - Uh, I wore them for soccer,
they're the soccer gloves. - Okay. So you know what? I want to, more than anything in this world, be able to go around
Torey's place and find cars that have been broken into. - Okay. - Okay? That's what I want to do, more than anything in this world, okay? - Yeah. - Do you go back up to that
neighborhood, and park anywhere? - We parked on the side of a road. - You went back up in this neighborhood. - Yeah. - Which, okay, we're talking about Whispering Cliffs out there,
two and a half a miles. Did you go back out there? - No. - You don't go back there. - No. - Okay, so I'm here to tell you that if we have information that we see that car parked
there, where you said, at a different time. Later that night. - Okay. - How do you explain that? - We were parked there.
We were there, let's see, we were there at 10:00. - Let me ask you this. You didn't, you didn't go out to go through cars, you didn't park down the road to get out of that neighborhood
and go through cars? - No. Oh, well like, the one at her house? - Mm-hmm. - Where you left Cassie and Matt up in that neighborhood? - Yes, we parked, uh.. - Draw me your-- - There's a big tree. (rustling paper) - So you parked, and
you got out of your car. Did you go through some other cars there? - Yes. - Aside from coincidence
and all that kind of stuff, when you got out, you parked there. Did you go back to play
a prank on those guys? - Prank on-- - On Cassie and Matt?
- No. - Did you go there just to screw with them a little bit and throw a prank? - No. - Okay. You're solid about that. - Yeah, I'm solid about that. - Okay. But you did get
out in the neighborhood and check a few car doors. - Yes. - Okay. With the intent
to burglarize those cars? - Yeah. - You're going to take some
stuff out of them, right? - Yes. - [Narrator] The
interrogators keep going back to this "playing a prank" option. - You guys didn't go back
and things got out of hand, you played a prank.
- No. - And things went weird.
- No. - Okay. Because if it did, I mean, we can work through those things. I mean, that's fine. I
mean, it's not fine-- (crosstalk) - It's not good to kill, but it's like, don't dig your hole deeper
because, you know what I mean? - I know, yeah. - We didn't start off on
very good ground here. - I know. - [Narrator] The interrogators have likely already heard from Matt
about the flickering lights and loud noises that
night, and they were trying to offer Brian a less serious alternative that still gets an
admission that he and Torey did indeed return to the home that night. This way they would be
able to get their foot in the door and build off of that point. - I mean, I've got some
feelings and, you know, I've got some ideas of what went down, and it's just going to be up to you to come to a realization-- (crosstalk) - And they're not going to be happy. That's why I was trying to hide-- - Well, that's not the point. There's a little more
serious things going on here than, you know, that right now. - Yeah. - How many cars roughly did you open? - Uh, we opened maybe four or five. There, a lot of them were locked. - Okay. And so you got into four or five. - Yeah, four or five. - But you didn't take anything? No CDs? - No. - I mean, this is the
one time in your life that somebody needs to come
up with something missing. I mean, somebody needs to verify. - Yeah, but-- - Something you did,
just tell us something that, that we can go back-- - Didn't take anything.
- And we can say you did this. Aside from being charged with it, I mean, we don't care about that. We want to go back and be able to say, "Yeah, this story fits." Think, is there anything
that we can go back and make your story fit? - I didn't.. there wasn't
anything in the cars, so.. - Nobody saw anything?
You didn't see anybody? - There was a mother
that was yelling, and, at, like, her k-kid or something, then she walked outside and we, we kind of s-scurried off early, you know? 'Cause of the people there. - Okay. - Did you go from behind the house and come back up the hill? - [Narrator] Asking
about Brian's movements up a hill suggests there is evidence, such as tracks or footprints, in some area around Cassie's house that may link him to the scene. And sure enough, there were tracks left by Brian and Torey all around the home Cassie was housesitting. - Came back up the hill when? - Behind the house, behind the house Cassie was house sitting for. There's no reason why.. - We didn't go back there
after that, no. Well.. - You didn't go back to the house at all? - Well, at, like, what time? - No, no, no. At any time,
have you gone down that hill to the road down below? - Like.. - At any time in your life, have you ever gone from
the road down below, (crosstalk) near where the driveway
is, behind the house, gone down that hillside and down to the-- - I do remember, um, the layout. We were having a hard time, like, uh, you know, trying to find anything. - What do you mean? - Like, I'm, I do remember-- - Okay. No, listen, okay?
So listen to me, okay? I'm gonna show you. - You're walking. Did you walk out the back of the house and
walk up the side of the-- - No, no, no. - You didn't go back there on Saturday, out to Cassie's house, did you? - No. I called her, though. - Did you talk to her? - No, she didn't answer. - You're saying at no
time would your footprints ever be found behind this house. - No. - Going down the hill to a road? - Oh, I went to s-see her, her dog. That was on the left side. - Mm-hmm, did you go down the
hillside, down to the road, just to check it out? - No. - Okay. You didn't ever do that? - No. - Okay. What about towards? - No. - Okay, so you went out
to where the dog is at? - [Narrator] In Torey's interrogation, which you'll recall took
place the day after Brian's, he skipped right past
the movie theater excuse and also tried to rely on
the car burglary story, probably having already
heard that their plan A had utterly failed. - So what was the
purpose of parking there? - We were scoping the neighborhood. - Why? - 'Cause we were planning
to go through cars. - When you say go through
cars, what do you mean? - Oh, see the ones that are open. We don't go through any with
alarms or that are locked. We just walk by, push the
handle, and if it's open, we get in it, and steal
the gas money or change. - So have done that before? - Uh, once this year and in ninth grade. - Okay. So something that, I mean, you're familiar with? I mean, you.. - Yes. - [Narrator] However, like Brian, he's incredibly vague about
where they looked at cars, and even tries his best to breeze past the conversation altogether. - We got out of the car, we got out, and we looked around for about 15 minutes. - "Looked around," what
do you mean? Did you-- - We just like, "okay,
here's where we are. We'll go, we might go this way, this way, and then this way." - Okay. Which way did you end up going? - And then we got back in the car and we called Matt
because we were planning to invite him to go with us. - Okay. - But we didn't want Cas-- - You're confusing me just a little bit, because I'm not quite understanding what.. you guys get out of the car, okay? And you're out of the car, and you-- - We just look around, and-- - You stand in one place? - No, we walked out down
a little to the road, and then we'll turn around and we'll walk down this way, and walk down this way. We walked back to my car. - Okay, let's talk about these cars, 'cause now it's pretty
critical that we know, you know, where these cars are. And so you can walk us back to these cars. And so we know, you know, exactly where these cars are parked. - [Narrator] The interrogator
makes it seem like he is helping Torey to
establish vehicular burglary as an alibi, but he is
really letting the suspect lie in order to further
establish the propensity for not telling the truth. By continually discrediting
the suspect's story, the police in P.A. will rely
heavily on forensic evidence to tell the true story of what happened. - Do you remember.. a
description of the cars, the color of the cars,
what kind of door handles they had on them? - Uh.. I don't know what kind of cars, I don't usually pay attention to that. We passed a lot of cars-- - Where were these cars
parked, on the street? - On the street. - They were all parked on the street? - We don't go into cars that are, uh, on, in driveways, usually. - When you went into
these cars, so you don't, you can't give us, like,
a color of a car, or? - Uh, I got in a white one.
- First one that comes to-- Okay, a white one. - Yeah, I can't remember
what kind it was, though. - [Narrator] Something
interesting about deception is that a truthful person
will often fill a story with a lot of detail. On the other hand, most
people are not good liars, and filling in details
to support a false story is difficult. In Torey's story, the detail is heavy in some places, but very weak in others. So it would be hard for the interrogators to make a judgment call at this point. That is, if they had
nothing else to go on. - Are we going to be able to
verify your fingerprints there? - Probably not, I used
my sleeve to open it. - Did you have gloves on, though? - Um, no, I didn't. - You're sure you didn't have no gloves? - Yes. - Okay. - [Narrator] The interrogators
ask for one piece of evidence that would show Torey really
stole from cars that night, and he says he has a CD case. But then, his parents
actually voice their own doubt that this is true. - Okay, so you might've gone
through some other cars. - Yeah. - Did you get any other items that we can, that you have, that-- - We don't, I don't really steal.. - CD case?
- Yes, I have a CD case. - You just took one out of a car? - Yeah, I have a CD case. - [Narrator] As you may recall, Brian stated they didn't find anything as they were "going through cars." - So you got into four or five? - Yeah, four or five. - And, but you didn't
take anything? No CDs? - No. (fast forwarding) - Yes, I have a CD case. - [Narrator] And to make
matters for Torey even worse, his own mother is about
to catch him in the lie. - [Torey's Mother] Was
that from that night? - I can't remember. - That was from another night, that wasn't from that night. - Oh, okay. - [Torey's Father] Well
you better remember-- - [Torey's Mother] There's
a CD case that I said, "whose CD case is this?" - [Torey's Father] You
said it was David's. - And you said, "it's Brian's." - [Torey's Father] No, he said David - [Torey's Mother] Or David's. - When was that? - [Torey's Mother] So
that is a stolen CD case? - Yes. - Well, you better start
thinking about where you got it. - Uh.. - Do you remember it was that night? - [Torey's Mother] I don't think it was, because I think we've had it for, it's been sitting downstairs
in our family room. - Yeah. - [Torey's Mother] Waiting for
David to come and pick it up, or whoever's-- - Was that the same CD
case you were speaking of, that's she's speaking of?
- Yes. - 'Cause she probably
would've seen the one that you had that night. - No, she saw the one I stole. - On Friday night. - It was-- - [Torey's Mother] It could
have been this weekend or it could have been the week
before, I cannot remember. - [Torey's Father] No. - [Torey's Mother] I
remember there was a CD case, and I remember saying,
"when did this CD case, whose is this?" And you s-- And there was all these movies. - [Narrator] Torey
begins feigning confusion and scrunching his eyebrows. - DVDs, not CDs. - [Torey's Mother] Had a stack of them. - Yeah, they were CDs from a CD case. (crosstalk) - So they came from that CD case? - Yes. - But not that night, or yes that night? - I'm pretty sure it was that night. - Okay. - [Torey's Mother] I can't remember-- - You think it came from a van? - Yes. - Down on that street somewhere. - Yeah. - A white van?
- Yes. (crosstalk)
- Wait, just-- - [Torey's Father] No, it couldn't have been that night, Torey, because
they've been sitting there stacked up for two, three days. - Two, three days? - [Torey's Father] Yeah. It was-- - That was Friday night. - [Torey's Father] No,
I mean two or three days before the weekend. - [Torey's Mother] I can't remember. - All right, we'll take the white CD out in computation, okay? We'll go on to see if we can't
find something else there. - Okay. - [Narrator] Torey says,
once they were down looking through cars,
they made one last call to the Whispering Cliffs house at 10:48. This is important, because it
indicated to Torey and Brian that Matt would not be staying
with Cassie for the night. This goes to the issue of
opportunity to commit the murder. The victim would be alone,
and no witness in the house. - So I said, "Matt, do
you need a ride or not?" And he said no, his mom
should be there anytime now. So me and Brian just left,
and went back to my place. - Okay. So safe to say
it's about 10:48 PM. - Yeah.
- You make that final call, and he says, "no really,
man, I'm going home." - Yeah. - [Narrator] Now, Torey's
parents are about to verify the approximate time
he got home that night. And so Torey has to make up a reason why they didn't head home
immediately after that last call, asking if Matt needs a ride. The excuse is pretty weak. - Then what do you guys do? You and Brian. - We went through our findings. - Which one must, 'cause you already said there was some change. - Yeah. - Did Brian have something else? - Mm, he didn't have any merchandise. - Nothing? - He just had-- - So you had a couple bucks? - Yeah. (thumps)
What? - [Torey's Mother] Nothing. (Torey's mother laughs) - He just had a couple of bucks. - Okay. You just sat in the car. How long did you sit in the car? Is there some point in time where you-- (indistinct) - Um, maybe about 10:55. - Ten fifty-- - Between 10:50 and 11:05, between that. - So what were you doing
in this period of time? - That's the time that
we were looking through and just gathering up everything. - Okay. Help me, 'cause I'm still-- - Uh.. - Remember? So you came back to the car, and you make the call. So it's 10:48 according to the cell phone, it's a two minute call. You call Matt. And you confirmed that Matt's not, you don't have to take Matt for a ride. He's going to stay there.
- Yes. - Or whatever he's going to do. The long and the short
of it is you're not, you're not taking him with you. - Yeah. - So what do you do then? Do
you guys just sit in the car, you say you went through your stuff, but you said you didn't get much, like-- (crosstalk) - Yeah, I just, I put it in my pocket, looked through it and then
dropped it in my change. Then I went into my backseat,
just to look around, because all my books and stuff were thrown around out of it,
my backpack from my school. - Okay, so you just-- - And so I just basically
straighten that up. - What's Brian doing? - Brian's just sitting there, talking.. - So you're just spending
this time tidying up your car. - Yeah, talking. Pretty much. Yeah. - Okay. - Then we got, and then
we left between that time. - [Narrator] In reality,
Torey and Brian were murdering Cassie during this time period, around 11:00 PM or a little after. We know this because at 11:31 PM, they filmed this video of their reaction. - [Brian] I just killed
Cassie, we just left her house. This is not a joke. - [Torey] I'm shaking. - [Brian] I stabbed her in the throat and saw her lifeless body just disappear. Dude, I just killed Cassie.
- [Torey] Oh my god. - [Brian] Oh, oh. That felt
like it wasn't even real. I mean, it went by so fast. - [Torey] Shut up, we
gotta get our act straight. - [Narrator] Back in
Brian's interrogation, the investigators cleverly ask him if he and Torey did everything
together that night. - So you're going to say that whatever Torey did this
night, you did as well. - Uh, we went through cars, yeah. - And then I mean-- - Torey's going to tell us the same thing when we talk to him? - Yeah. I think he'll come clean
to you about the movie. - [Narrator] Brian
mentions he did come clean about the lie, the movie. He's trying to reassure himself that he's telling the truth, and, by extension,
assure the interrogators that he is being truthful at this point. - There's nobody that's gonna see you guys sneak back into the house? - No. - That didn't happen? - Well, no-- - And there's nobody
that's going to see you around the house on Saturday. - No. - We're not going to find those people. - No. We weren't at her house at all. - Did you have anything
to do with the murder? - Hmm? - Did you have anything to
do with the murder of Cassie? - No. No, I did not have anything to do with the murder of Cassie. - Did Torey? - No. - [Narrator] Watch this clip carefully. (rewinding) - No, I did not have anything to do with the murder of Cassie. - Did Torey? - No. (rewinding) - No, I did not have anything to do with the murder of Cassie. - Did Torey? - No. - [Narrator] While Brian is saying "no," he's shaking his head, "yes." And he actually does this twice. - No, I did not have anything to do with the murder of Cassie. - Did Torey? - No. - [Narrator] His body language
doesn't match his words. This is known as
incongruent body language, and may possibly be a sign of deception. - Okay, and you're being square on that? - Of course. - And if we offer you a polygraph
test, lie detector test-- - Yes. - We're going to ask you those questions. - I'll take it, yes. - You want to take that. - Of course I'll take it. - Okay. - And you're not going to fail it? I don't need you to fail this test. - Well, is there what,
it's 100% true, right? - No, they're about 96. - Okay. Well, then yes, it should say yes. - Okay. And they're pretty simple. I mean, there's not a lot of, there's not a lot of
Hocus Pocus on them, okay? They're pretty simple. - Okay. - Okay? - [Narrator] Polygraphs are
not actually 96% accurate. Otherwise, they would
be admissible in court. So this is merely an
attempt to intimidate Brian, and it seems to work. Next, the topic of
conversation now shifts back to the topic of horror media. - Tell me about the play
that Torey's been writing, or the movie. - Well, there's a film
festival in J-January. So we wanted to make a movie,
and then go there, and yeah. - Did you ask Cassie to
make a movie with you? - Yes. We wanted her to be, like, the main character and stuff. - Okay, what's the movie about? - Uh, we were making,
like, a slasher flick. - What is it? - Like a slasher flick. - Okay. - Like "Halloween," and stuff like that. - Okay. And what was
the, what's the theme? Tell me about the movie. - [Narrator] Sometimes,
criminals will fantasize about a crime and script
it out under the cover of a movie script, play, poem, et cetera, to appear innocuous. The interrogator asked
Brian to explain the idea for the movie in a bid to get him to admit the fantasy of the movie was
acted out with lethal results. It's an effort to reassociate
the suspect mentally with the crime if he is
disassociating himself from the crime, by using the device of the alleged movie script. - His idea was totally
different than mine. - Okay, let's hear yours first. - My story, th-there were four kids. You wouldn't know, but-- (crosstalk) - Four kids, but just kind of just give us a general idea of the movie. - Okay-- - Were do you got it, I mean,
did you written it out yet? - No.
- Okay. - Just an idea. - Just kind of an idea? - Yeah.
- Okay. - Th-there was four
kids, and they have, uh, their parents with them. - Okay. - Uh, they drove to cabin
in the mountains, you know? And I don't know, let's see,
I named the guy John McArthur. - Okay. - And he's the killer
guy, and, uh, let's see.. And yeah. And, uh, the mom
and dad get killed, you know, but then they escape, and-- - Who kills the mom and dad? - Uh, the, John. - McArthur? - Yeah. - Okay. - Okay. And then-- - Who's this John
McArthur guy? Is he just.. - He's the imaginary guy. - He's the manager, you said? - He said imaginary. - Oh, no, but in the story, how is he-- - He's the-- - He's the slasher guy? - Yeah, the slasher guy. - Where does he come from? - I haven't thought about that yet. - Is he just in the woods,
like "Friday the 13th," or.. - Uh, I haven't really
d-- I don't know yet. - So what, so the kids get killed too, or? - No, they escape. - Okay. - Then, 20 years later,
they go back to the cabin. - Okay. - And they stay there, of course, and they see him again,
and that's the whole.. That's about all I really.. - Okay. What about Torey's version? 'Cause you said it a little different one, what has he told you kind
of what his version is? - His version, it's similar to mine, but we had a dispute
about the name and stuff. Um, his is, well it's about the, you know, they get attacked. And I think his version, I think, like, half the kids get killed
in his version, but.. - How do they get killed - Well, by the guy, of course. - But how? How does he kill them? What is he killing them with? - Well, uh, butcher knife, you know. - Butcher knife? Okay. - Like at Halloween. - All right. - And then, um-- - Does he wear a mask? - No. - Does he, what does he wear? - Uh, I haven't thought about
that. Oh, he wears, maybe, I don't know, probably like
a jumpsuit or something. - Like Jason? - Yeah. Well actually, Jason
doesn't wear a jumpsuit, but.. - What? - Oh, Jason didn't wear a jumpsuit. - Who wore the jumpsuit? - I, that was Michael Myers. - Oh, it was Michael Myers.
See? He does know his shit. In "Halloween," right? - Yeah. - Okay. So who's more bad,
Michael Myers or Jason? - I like Jason more. - Okay. What about Torey? - Um, he's more of a "Halloween" fan. And then I'm a "Friday the 13th" fan. - So, does Torey have a knife collection? - Oh, no, he has his little, uh-- - Collects knives? - Throwing knives. They're
about, probably that big. - Okay. - And he has, like, a pocket knife, but that's all I ever saw in his house. - Okay. - Torey's friend would
later testify that he bought four knives for Brian and Torey. One serrated, and the others not. He's been asked to help make the purchase at a pawn shop since he was 18. Now the interrogators
will move on to touch on the boys' emotional
connections to the victim, which plays into the motive
of why they would want to harm her in the first place. - Did you love Cassie? - Like, love as a friend or love like-- - You kinda had a crush,
like, did you have a crush on her a little bit? - Uh, I did. And I was
about to ask her out. - Okay. - But then Matt did. - [Narrator] Brian would later explain that Cassie getting together with Matt struck him hard, because
in his mind it was just another affirmation that he was a loser. - I always thought they were
a bad, you know, couple. - Uh-huh. - You know, cause he..
oh, I shouldn't say this. But he likes to smoke weed. - Mm-hmm. - And I don't, and Cassie hates it too. - Mm-hmm. - And Cassie's against doing drugs, and I'm against doing drugs, and Cassie's against doing
the, you know, you know, like, drinking alcohol
and stuff, and I am too. - Right. - And I met her before Matt, and I was going to ask her out and stuff, and then he just moves on. - And he ends up with her. - Yeah. - So-- - I mean, that's cool, because
they're happy together. - I mean, did he tell you
about having sex with her? - [Narrator] Here, the
interrogator is attempting to establish Brian's
impulse reaction to Cassie being involved with another boy. - I remember-- - Would he would brag about that? - I remember, I went to the bathroom when I was at their house, and
there was a condom wrapper in the toilet. And then I asked him about it, he said that he had had sex
with her before we came. - Did he talk dirty about her, or? - No. - No?
- No. - So did it make you a
little bit uncomfortable when you were guys watching the movie and they're kissing and stuff like that, it was like, "do they have
to do that in front of me?" - Uh, I guess it was
kind of like that, yeah. - So what about Torey, did
Torey have a crush on her too? I mean, you guys kind of
both like her a little bit? - No, no, no. - Okay. - No, he was more friends with her then. - Okay. But Torey, well, I mean, Torey told us he liked her. - [Narrator] It's unclear
if the interrogators are lying to get a reaction,
or if Torey said this in his unrecorded initial interview, as Torey never stated this
during his taped interrogation. - They hung out, he went to
a movie with her and stuff. - Oh, yeah. I mean, we saw the hillside
(indistinct) previously. - Okay, but I mean, he said
that he felt pretty much the same way that you did. - I did not know that. - Well.. (Brian laughs) I won't be sharing that with him, okay? But I mean, that's what he's saying. - I didn't know, I didn't
know he liked Cassie. - [Narrator] Torey actually let it slip in his interrogation that
he hated Matt at one time. - Did you know that Matt, her boyfriend, was going to be there too? - Yes. - So, and you're also familiar with him? - Yes. - Friends with him? - Mm, I hated him last year. - Okay. - And then.. I didn't really hate him, I didn't really know him. I
just disliked him at school. - Well, disliked him 'cause..? - Uh, I don't know, it's a lot of things. - Just the way he acted, or? - He annoyed me, pretty much. - Okay, cool, fair enough. - [Narrator] He even makes a point to say that Matt wanted to spend the night, but Torey didn't want that. - Matt wanted to know if
he could come with us, uh, me and Brian. - At that time? - Yeah, and he said that
he wanted to stay the night at my house and I said, I
should ask my mom first. And I told him that I
should tell my, ask my mom.. (indistinct) I was never really wanting
him to stay the night. - [Narrator] The way
Brian and Torey talk about Cassie and her boyfriend
speaks for itself. Perhaps they had a sort of, "if I can't have you, no one can" mindset. - Then we happened to find out that, that you're in the area of her house. Not only you guys in
the area of her house, but you guys are wearing gloves and-- - Yeah, going through cars. - Okay. So, and then, oh yeah, by the way, I mean, just so happens, you know, Cassie ends up dead and
she's been stabbed, okay? - You know what usually
happens on things like this is, you know, guys, like you come
in straight up, you know, you tell the truth and maybe
you hold back a little bit more because you don't want to go all the way. And somebody else that
we interview comes in, i.e. Torey, comes in, gives it up, leaves a guy like you in the cold. And then you're like, "dang it. I should have been upfront first." - Upfront with what? - About killing Cassie. - I don't, I can't be-- - I'm concerned about
that, you know what I mean? I'm not sitting here accusing you, but I got to tell you that
I'm concerned about that. I'm concerned you had
something to do with it. - [Narrator] The
interrogators are now using soft and caring tones
to play the friend role and put the suspect at ease, while launching into the
prisoner game with Brian: "Who will rat out the other person first for a lesser punishment?" That's the question they're
trying to stick in his head. Police often employ this tactic when there are multiple suspects, and they're unclear about
who the guilty party is among the group of suspects. There is an enticement that,
"we will go easier on you, if you just tell us the whole truth before someone else does." The problem is that charging decisions are not up to the police. A district attorney makes that decision, and that decision is vetted by the court in pretrial hearings or
preliminary hearings. - Yeah. I'm not saying okay, because you, your story's not washing, bro. It's just not working
for us. It's not working. - It's the truth, this isn't
a story. This is the truth. - Okay, the last time you told
us that this was the truth, it wasn't a story.. you
even put it on paper, man. - But, but I didn't want.. - [Narrator] The
interrogator is indicating that Brian now has no
credibility because he lied about the events prior to the murder. This is where they try to
finally break them down into telling the actual truth. - --my parents to know I
was going through cars. - So you didn't want us to
solve Cassie's homicide, then, because you didn't
really care enough about that to tell us truth upfront. You know what I mean? You understand where
we're going with this? Remember I told you that night, I said, "if any time in your life,
this is the time you need to tell the truth." - Yes, I should have
told you about the cars. - But what if there's something else? - No. - Hey, you need to tell us.
You went back in the house and you played a prank-- (crosstalk) - You're not turning the lights off? - No. - You're not playing with the lights, you're not messing with them, you're not doing that kind of stuff? - No. - Didn't go back? - I mean, you're not getting into the.. Trying to scare them,
just screwing around, spooking with them and then
you guys get out of there. - Yeah. - Yeah, that happens, or no? - No, it did not happen. - All right. - And you're going to pass
a polygraph when we ask you. - Yeah. - And you have, or we
have, a promise from you that there is no more lies, right? - No, this is it. This is-- I did not k- I don't know why you even
think I would kill my friend. - Come on. - It could have happened, I mean-- (crosstalk) - You could get wrapped up movies, you get wrapped up in all this culture. - I knew you would say
something like that. - [Narrator] The interrogator
is tying the fantasy of horror movies into action in real life. He'll now switch to playing
bad cop to apply pressure. - Yeah. Honestly, I mean it
just, we've gotta wonder. I've got to get through those things. I mean, you guys are like
heavy into this stuff. It's not like you haven't seen
it before, like, in movies. - You're sitting there in disbelief, wondering how the hell
could they be thinking (crosstalk) - But then you watch
this stuff all the time. - I lied to them, I'm
wearing fucking gloves. Hmm, you know? Dude, you gotta see-- (crosstalk) - You gotta understand
where we're coming from. - You're a smart guy. - I understand what you're
saying, yes, I guess. - Do you know, I mean, you guys
are making this tough for us because when we catch the person, and we are gonna catch them. - Good. - The people, then you guys
have muddied the waters. - Mm-hmm. - Okay? No, it's not just
"uh-huh," I mean, that's not good. Okay? That's not a good thing at all. You need to get into a
car with us and you need to show us what houses you went to. - [Narrator] The
interrogator is telling Brian what he has to do to prove his innocence. This is a classic pressure technique. - That's what you-- - I can't exactly, like, exactly what-- - And dude, you're-- - Houses. - You're not putting yourself in a very favorable position in this investigation. - Uh-huh. Okay. - Okay? - All right. - [Narrator] A classic pressure
technique is shown here. In reality, Brian merely
needs to get a lawyer and stop talking at this point. When left alone, we can clearly see Brian beginning to break. - I want to go home. What have I done? - [Narrator] The first thing Brian asked the returning interrogators is
how his parents are reacting, just showing us how juvenile he really is despite his horrible crimes. - How are my parents.. - Well, I mean, you can talk to them, you're going to go back
out here in a second. - You wanna talk to them? (crosstalk) - They're supporting you,
and they want what we want. They want to get you out
from underneath something. If it is, they're totally a
hundred percent supportive. We're a team. You've
got great parents, man. (indistinct) I'm telling you, and
you already know that, but they're willing to stand
beside you and support you on this thing. - But like I said, this car
burglary things, not an issue. - [Narrator] Despite Brian's brief relief, the interrogators are
quick to let him know he's not out of the woods yet. They know he's not
telling the whole truth. At this point, the
interrogation has been going on for a good while, and
part of their strategy is to psychologically wear Brian down. They know he wants the process to end, and often a suspect will
think that a confession of some sort, even to a lesser crime, will bring the unenjoyable
experience to a close. - John and I have both been
doing this for 20 years. - Okay. - Okay ? We've both been
doing this a very long time. I've been sitting in
these rooms many times over and over and over. And I'm not very good at
a lot of things in my job, but the one good thing that I am good at is reading body language. Okay? So I see you the very first night and I told myself, you know something? Brian is not going to
be the type of person that if he's involved in
this, that can handle this. He may be able to put on
a show for a few people, but you know what? Down here
inside it's killing him. It's absolutely killing him. - [Narrator] Brian appears
to have a resigned look on his face and may be beginning to break. - So I just kind of filed that away. And I keep putting the big
scheme of things together. And I keep putting the big
scheme of things together, and we talk, I mean, God,
we've talked to so many kids, and you know what the kids are telling us? The kids are telling us,
Brian is pretty cool. Pretty cool dude. But Torey is pretty ruthless,
Torey's kind of different. - [Narrator] While it's
debatable whether or not the other students
described Brian as cool, the detective is telling the truth about what other students
thought about Torey. One student who was
interviewed by the detectives, and wished to remain
anonymous, stated that Torey was obsessed with
knives and horror films. Torey and Brian were so
obsessed with horror films, they were writing their
own horror movie script. Torey and Brian's movie script was about a boy, girl, and little boy being killed. They heard Cassie tell
Torey that she wanted to be in his movie. They heard Torey bragging about
committing the perfect crime and how he watched killing
movies and actually took notes during the movies on how not to get caught while committing a murder. Torey liked to mess around and pretend he was stabbing people and
cutting their throats at school. Torey had a crush on Cassie
for at least two years. - Not just one. I'm saying,
we go down the line, I mean, you've seen us at Pokey, probably,
when we've had detectives there every day, going
through talking to people, getting new information and
then we've been flooding everything that we can
and it's all coming back and we put it up on a great big
board. And what does it say? It says Torey, Torey, Torey, Torey, bad. Okay. Brian, Brian, Brian, Brian, good. - [Narrator] The interrogator is on Reid Technique, Step
Two: Moral Justification, such as placing the moral
blame on someone else, shifting the blame away
from Brian on to Torey. - Then we start theorizing things. We know that Brian is not
being truthful about the movie. We picked up on that in a second, okay? But we had to go prove it, okay? The second thing is
that we know that you're not being truthful about the
car burglaries. You know why? Because your body won't
let you tell a lie. Okay? I can read it in you. You
are not the kind of person that is just a coldblooded
person that doesn't care about things because you do care. Okay? The car burglary thing's
not happening. Okay? - That's what happened. - [Narrator] Brian continues
to lie, and the interrogator quickly minimizes the
denial by ignoring it, so they can redirect
focus onto acknowledgement of the crime. - Somebody has got you
mixed into something, regardless of what level you're mixed in, to something that you do
not want to be involved in. You don't want to be involved in this. - I don't, I.. - There's no way in hell that you want to be involved in this,
but Brian, you are. And, you know, the thing of
it is, none of us go away. - Yeah, I understand. You know, we can get hit
by a Mack truck tomorrow and there's going to be another fat guy sitting in the chair. Okay? Going over the same questions, saying the same things
that this isn't adding up, and this isn't adding up. Okay? Brian, we know some things that you don't know that we know. Okay? - Okay. - And we know that you
may be able to leave here and think that, okay, I've got them. I've got them fooled. Maybe
even called Torey up-- - I wouldn't do that. - "Dude, this is what's going on. Okay, this is what we need to say, this is what I told them, okay? I told them about the car
burglaries," but you know what? We're not buying the car burglaries. - That is the truth. - [Narrator] Brian continues
to lie by reinforcing that the car burglary story is true. The interrogators quickly
redirect Brian to their assertion that the story is a
diversion to prevent him from becoming entrenched in the lie and thinking they believe it. - Cassie is dead. She's not
supposed to die, but she does. And you know what? I think you see it. I don't know if you're there, I don't know if you're on top of it. I don't know if you
freak out and you do it. I don't know if Torey does
it, but you know something? You're there. I can see it.
I can see it in your eyes. I know by the evidence that we have that you're there. Okay? - I was there before. - I know that you guys come back. I know that you come
back. Either it's you.. - I didn't. - Or it's Torey. - Well, I don't know who it was, but I did not go back
to the house that night. I swear I did not go back to the house. - Okay, you're not being truthful with us about the car burglaries. Don't, like, don't even insult us. - I'm not trying to insult
you. We did go through cars, I mean, that's the truth.
It's exactly what we did. - Brian, she was not supposed to die. - I know. - You didn't mean for that to happen. - Tell us how you feel about Cassie dying. - I'm I'm s- extremely sad. She came to lunches
all the time, you know? - How'd she die? - So I'm really sad. - How'd she die? - I don't know. - Tell us how it happened. - They said it was like the Nori-- (stutters) Or the Nori Jones case. - [Narrator] Nori Jones
was a woman who was found stabbed to death in her home in Pocatello, the same town Brian,
Torey, and Cassie lived. It appears Brian slips
up here by revealing exactly how Cassie was murdered, and he tries to play it off. - But how do you know that? (Brian coughs) - The news said it was-- (indistinct) - No, I'm asking you how she died. - I, I mean, I guess that she was stabbed. - How do you know that? - Because.. (stutters) First of all, Matt told me. - All we want, you know, Brian, is like, we don't want to twist your words around. We're not going to do that. - [Narrator] The interrogator
offers the typical lifeline to the suspect, a classic police technique of posing as an ally,
Reid Step Five: Sincerity, when in reality, police are
not there to help the suspect. - I'm just going to ask you
a straight forward question. - Mm-hmm. - And we just want the truth. Your folks want the truth out of you. - I know. - And they're willing to do anything to get the truth out of you. - That is the truth. - We have presented them with everything that we know so far. - We've got another group
of detectives that have, are picking up Torey. I've got your car back
in the area, guaranteed. That's a given. We know exactly-- (crosstalk) - Tomorrow and stuff. - We know exactly when Cassie died, okay? I know exactly when. Okay? - Could you tell me? - She died when you guys left, right after you guys left and Matt left. - Okay. - Okay? So now you're
telling me you just happened to be back in the
neighborhood, burglarizing cars with gloves on, but you
don't go in and kill Cassie. - No. - [Narrator] The
interrogators start to turn Brian and Torey against one another. - What is Torey going to say? Is Torey gonna say that
it was Brian's idea to go in the house and play a prank on-- - We didn't go in the house, we didn't-- - What has he already said,
bro? You know what I mean? Second liar don't stand a chance. - I promise you, okay? Look at me. If you had something to do with
this, I'm going to find out. - Yes. Yeah, of course. - If you didn't do this, I'm going to be the best friend you ever had. Okay? I promise you that, because
I am not going to rest until I prove that you
did not do this, okay? I give you that guarantee. - Okay. - Okay. - So we're in it for you, bro. (indistinct) (door closes) - [Narrator] So the interrogators
had gotten both boys to resort to plan B, with
the car burglary story. But with Torey, they
want to dig a bit deeper into what the pair did later that night. But first, we get to see
a moment of Torey's dad offering him support. It is sad to watch,
knowing that he's still genuinely holding onto the
hope that his son is innocent. - [Torey's Father] I'm glad
you told the truth, Torey. I'm sorry I didn't tell you how important it was the first time. I should have spent a few
minutes talking to you. The police came in, they
said your friend's dead, and they asked you for a statement. That was just like, wham, bam. And I understand you're
worried about the cars. I should have taken you aside before you gave another statement. - I was worried about the cars, because.. (indistinct) that the cops told him
that it was 10 years per car you get-- - [Torey's Father] Right. - In prison. - Well, of course you
were worried about it. That's a serious thing. - [Torey's Mother] You should
have been worried about it as you were doing that, Torey. - [Torey's Father] Well, we'll
talk about that tomorrow. - [Torey's Mother] We'll
talk about that later. - [Torey's Father] Got
a problem at this point, it doesn't even matter. What matters is that you
told the straight story so they can look at everything. - [Narrator] As Torey's dad supports him with these reassuring words of trust, Torey slowly turns his
face away from both parents and looks at the wall. This is a common indication that someone has not been truthful,
but hiding their face and not looking at the people who have believed their ongoing lies. It's a reaction of
shame, and consciousness of guilt or culpability. And at this point, Torey's
situation is just going to continue spiraling downhill. The interrogators return,
but now they're going to confront Torey with
inconsistencies in his story. Not even his claim that
he and Brian stayed home watching movies until
they fell asleep is true. - Well, now we're at the point where you gotta tell the truth, okay? Because there's some people that saw you at Comment Cents later that night. (indistinct) - Comment Cents is, uh.. - Oh, wait. Yeah, me and Brian went down to the gas station, because
Brian wanted a drink. - [Narrator] Torey then
claims Brian then wanted to go to his house and
they went a different way than usual and got lost. He says they then went to a
gas station near Blackrock. The interrogator asks
about what they brought with them on this trip. - Did you take anything with
you when you left your house? - Mm, no. - Again, it's important that
you be honest with us here. - Yeah, uh.. - If somebody were to see you putting a blue bag in the back of your truck. - Uh-huh. - Were you taking some garbage out, were you putting the
garbage back in there? Did you do anything like that? - Um, no. - You don't remember doing that? - Mm-mm. - So somebody saw you open the truck and you had some type of blue bag. You or Brian putting it
in the back of your car, it was out in front of your house. - Do you guys have blue garbage bags? - I think.. - [Torey's Father] We have--
- They could possibly be.. - [Torey's Father] Tinted, minor tint. - Blue? - [Torey's Father] I believe they're blue. - Okay. - Probably.. - Did you take the garbage
out with you to dump it when you went out or did
you have the garbage? I mean, I'm just trying to figure out why somebody would see you
with a blue garbage sack, like coming out, like you're
bringing the garbage out, but-- - Was it a sack full of stuff or just..? - [Torey's Mother] Yeah. - It had-- - It was full of stuff? - Well, it had the sack.
And then, you know, there were some items
that you had, apparently. - Yeah. - Did you take a shovel with you? - Uh, I think it was Brian's
shovel that he borrowed, we were going to build jumps
in the back of his yard. - Okay. - In the backyard, yeah. - Who had the shovel then? - I think it's Brian shovel. - So where did you put
it? Was it in your car? - Yeah, it was in the trunk of my car. - Okay. So it was gone
by the time we looked in your car the other night? - Yeah. - Okay. So what did, you put that shovel in that car that night? - Yeah. - So were you just gonna just
take it back to his house? - Yeah, take it back to
his house the next day. - All right. - What'd you guys do with the shovel? - We took it back the next
day when I drove Brian home, he dropped the shovel off at his house. - So he was going to
build the jumps where? - Yes, in his yard. His house. - So why is the shovel in your car? - We took it back from our house. - I know, but why is it at your house? - He brought it over one day,
I guess. I don't remember why. Well, if you look in the
back of my house, it's all, he probably wanted to build jumps there. - [Narrator] Torey
struggles to hold together the flimsy pieces of his story against the clever interrogators. In moments like this, we
are reminded of just how far the boys truly were from their goal of the criminal masterminds
they tried to act as in their videotapes. In Torey's case, a
psychologist report found him to be rather immature for his age, with a professional finding indicators of frontal lobe immaturity specifically. Additional neuropsychological testing confirmed these deficits. Notably, He also showed
signs of possible depression, and obsessive anxiety. - Well, one of the things
I want to touch upon that night when you're out messing around, that's why I asked you earlier, did you take any masks with you? Because we have some
indications that you had some Halloween-type, you know,
scary masks or something. Were you guys playing around with those at any point in time? - We bought one earlier, but.. - Where'd you buy that at? - Adam saw that. It was only $7 at.. - Well, I'm talking that night-- - That night. - You guys had some Halloween-- - It was in my trunk of
my car for awhile though. - Was it in the car Friday night? - Uh, yeah, during.. yeah, probably was. - Okay. - [Torey's Father] Was that the mask that you guys were spray painting? - Yeah. - [Torey's Father] Was that
that one? That cardboard-- - Yeah. - When were they spray painting? - [Torey's Father] They
had, apparently they bought a plastic, or cardboard, mask, they spray painted white,
but that was sometime before this day. - Was it like the Friday mask? - No, it was hard white. - Oh. But it looks like a hockey mask? - No, it doesn't. It's a regular face. - Oh, okay. So you could
have had those with you and somebody saw you with those that night, messing around with them? - Probably. - Okay. - We weren't messing around with them. - Okay. You didn't put them on? - No. - So they wouldn't have saw two guys with those masks on? - No. - Was there two masks, or one? - One. - Very important thing to us that we got, (indistinct) Blackrock Canyon, too. - Okay. - We've got a car
matching your description, going up the Blackrock area. - Yeah, once we got up to
Blackrock, we were like, oh, this is definitely not-- - But that car's stopping.
You're not just driving, it's stopping up there. Did you stop for a period
of time up in there? - Uh, Brian stopped to smoke. I didn't want him to smoke in my car. - So did you guys get out? Did you walk, did you
get away from the car? Somebody saw that car unattended. - No, we did not. - But they'd report that as
an unattended car up there? - No. - Okay. So you guys didn't go up there and do a little campfire
or nothing like that. - No. - No reason why they
should have saw you guys playing with those matches
up in Blackrock Canyon? - No, we weren't doing that. - You sure? - Yeah. - 'Cause there's truckers
to park all along that gap right there.
And that's what we got. We got a trucker, asleep and
shut out of service at night, pulled over on the road and he's seeing a red car going up in
there, and it's parking. - Is that true? Did you
go up there and park? - Yeah, we parked there. We got out, walked around
the car, and went pee, and Brian smoked a little.
Had two cigarettes, I think. - Okay, you don't know what brand though? - Huh? - You don't know what brand
of cigarettes he smoked? - No, I don't. - Did you guys dig anything up there? - Uh, I don't know. - I mean, because you're
probably going to have dirt in the back of your car from a shovel, from dirt that's gonna
forensically match-- - There was dirt on the
shovel already, though. - But, I mean, we can match
the dirt, is the good thing. - [Narrator] Forensic analysis of soils is actually used in
criminal investigations. Mineral content is tested,
and even microscopic analysis could be used. They look for biological markers. Blood, saliva, et cetera, and test the soil for
mineral content and density. - Is the dirt gonna come from Blackrock? - I don't know. Brian
took the shovel, I think. - Did he? - Yeah, but he couldn't take it anywhere. - Okay. So is that dirt going to match up to the Blackrock area? - It might, it might not. I'm not sure. - Okay. Probably though? - Possibly. - Let's talk about knives, okay? - Uh-huh. - What do you know about knives? We've been told you like knives, okay? Do you collect knives?
- No, no. I have three knives. - Okay. Okay, did you
have a knife on Friday? - No, I didn't. - You sure? - Yes. - You're sure nobody would
have saw you with a knife? - Two guys in a mask,
messing around with a knife. - No. - Okay. All right. - [Torey's Father] Did
anybody buy you a knife? - No. - At Mad Mike's Post? - No. - If we had pawn slips, it's some guy by the name of John, bought
two knives at Mad Mike's? - No. - To give to you and Brian? (Torey laughs)
- No. - Okay. All right. We're just,
we're confirming some things. - Okay. - I'm going to tell you that
we need to, now's the time. Now's the time to really
start being honest with some things. - Mm-hmm. - Okay? We know some things to be true. We know exactly what happened.
We found some things. - Mm-hmm. - Okay? And I'm going to give you the first chance and
the first opportunity. - You owe it to your mom and dad. - Absolutely
- You've got great parents, you owe it to your mom
and dad to be straight. - We're all here for you, bro. - I'm telling you, I mean, we're not here to twist anything up. We're here to help you out of a jam. If you got drug into some
things, which apparently you did, we need to know and we need
to know the truth. Okay? - Mm-hmm. - I guess the best way I can explain it is the house of cards is falling. - [Narrator] The last several
minutes of the interrogation has been the Positive Confrontation step of the Reid Technique. However, this has been a soft
implementation of the step, which is not uncommon. Letting bits of the
confrontation out at a time, especially as a means of
controverting an alibi, or sequence of events, will slowly catch the suspect off guard. This makes fixes to the
story almost impossible, and also creates a slow realization that the suspect has nowhere
to go with the story. Options have run out,
and you see what Torey came into this interrogation unaware of was that earlier that day, the 27th, Brian had actually already
led law enforcement agents to Blackrock Canyon, which is where, as you can probably
guess, the two had buried the evidence from Cassie's murder. That's right. This entire time, they had been stringing Torey along and seeing what he would
reveal about their trip to that area the night of the murder. Who knows if any of the
witnesses they claim saw the boys that night even exist? It's possible they just
used those as an excuse to explain why they knew
where the boys went that night without revealing what
Brian had told them. At Blackrock Canyon,
they uncovered knives, a partially melted multi-colored
mask, a red and white mask, some clothing and gloves,
partially burned notebook paper, a melted bottle of hydrogen peroxide, a box of stick matches,
and, most importantly, a homemade Sony videotape
containing the footage of Brian and Torey
planning and later reacting to the murder of Cassie. But what led up to Brian showing
authorities the evidence? Unfortunately, we do not have
footage of this conversation, but legal documents indicate that he had had another interview that day, this time with his parents present. He eventually admitted that he
and Torey had unlocked a door at the Whispering Cliffs residence so that they could return to
scare Cassie and Matt. He confessed to wearing
masks, dark clothes, gloves, and carrying knives. He said that after Matt left,
he and Torey went upstairs and claimed that Torey stabbed Cassie. But Brian tried to downplay his role in the crime at this point,
saying that he thought it was a joke to scare him, and only later realized that Cassie was actually being stabbed. He denied that he had ever
touched or stabbed Cassie, and even claimed that Torey had threatened to kill him earlier that day if he told authorities the truth. After showing authorities the evidence, Brian was arrested and spent the night of September 27th in jail. So now, getting back to
Torey's interrogation, the investigators will soon let him in on the game-changing fact that Brian has already spilled the beans. But first, they'll make some final efforts to get him to confess on his own. - You know, it's kind of, the
stories are falling apart, and stuff like that. - 'Cause Torey, you know
where we're going with this. - Yeah. - You know what we have. - And you know, man, it's
just one of those things. You come to this juncture in your life and you just either gotta, you know, you either gotta give it up
or it's going to eat you up. And your folks want you to do that. I'm telling you, I mean,
the truth is going to set you free on this, you know? Literally, but the truth is
going to set your feelings free and you're going to get by this thing. But I'm here to tell you
that we've been doing this for several days. We've
talked to a lot of people. We've seen a lot of things. We've put the pieces
of the puzzle together. That's what we do. That's
all we've been doing-- (papers rustling) (indistinct) Okay? We know how it went down. - Tell us what happened. - With what? - Out at Cassie's place. - We went through cars, me and Brian. - [Narrator] This silence
following Torey's lie is intentional. It's a method to get the suspect to break the uncomfortable silence and an effort to get
him to tell the truth. - Okay. You know I'm not here
to insult you or anything, but we don't believe your story. And we don't believe your story,
and I don't think your dad believes your story about
going through the cars. It's a tough one. And I don't believe it, especially because I know it's not true. Because we got you going into that house. When you parked on the street, we got you going back into Cassie's house. - Mm-hmm. - If it was a prank, if you
guys were just messing around, we just need to know about
that prank, you know? What's going on in there and
I can see you're just there to scare them, and you guys left, and something happened else besides that. (Torey laughs) - [Narrator] Clasping hands
and arms in front of the body can indicate a psychological reaction to closing off the interrogators. - Let's get that thing out of
here, you know what I mean? But in everything that happens, there's always people that are watching. We went and we talked to all these people, and then finally put together this puzzle. You got the trucker out here, you got the Comment Cents clerk. You got the neighbor, you know? You've got all these people that see it. They see, you got people
seeing your car parked which you corroborated for us,
parking in your neighborhood. - Mm-hmm. - Shawn, do you guys go back
in just to pull a prank? Is that what happened? - Um.. - You're into that kind of stuff. I mean, for all intents and purposes, tell me if I'm screwed up
on this, what do you like? You like horror movies,
you like scary movies and stuff like that, that's
what I've been told about you. You dig those kind of movies, right? Thriller movies. - Yeah. - Whatever you want to call it, you dig those kinds of things. Did you go in there just to scare them, just to scare the crap
out of them, you know, and be done with it? Because, there's no
other reason, you know? - Mm-hmm. So tell us about that. Help us understand a little bit about.. - Um.. (Torey exhales) - Take a deep breath and do it, bud. You know the truth, the
truth is easy for you. But we can help you. If we don't get the truth,
we can't come together. We can't work this thing
out. We can't do it. You're going to be left out in the cold. - Can I talk to (indistinct) - You can do that. - [Torey's Father] Can you talk to me? - Probably, yeah. (indistinct) - Absolutely. - [Torey's Father] Is this room private? (indistinct) - We can kill it now. - [Torey's Father] And
you'll go in another room? - Yeah, let's do that. Let's go somewhere. - Let me make sure there's
nobody in the room real quick. I'm gonna just leave those there. (door closes) - We talked about this earlier. - [Narrator] At this point, since Torey has already requested counsel, the officers are limited
in what they can do. They can tell him what they know, what evidence they have,
and what the next steps are, but they can't overtly or covertly elicit more information from him. Since Torey has not chosen to
re-waive his right to counsel and to remain silent, both
interrogators are on thin ice if they keep pushing the issue. - I love you, son. You know I love you. Torey, do you know that I love you? - Yes. - Look at me. I do love you. (door opens) - [Narrator] Torey's father
giving him reassurance here is interesting. Parents' reactions are often mixed when their children get in trouble. Some react with anger,
others with support, and others just close up
and shut off their emotions as a coping mechanism. His father's reaction is not unusual, but often in juvenile cases, parents are either completely absent, or, as demonstrated here, they
become hyper-involved. - Dad, I think we owe
it to you at this point to find out what we know at this point. - [Torey's Father] Yeah. (person sighs) - There's just no easy
way to tell you this. We do know that Shawn, or excuse me, that Torey and.. - [Torey's Father] Brian. - Brian have gone back in the house. Okay? We do know that the two of them murder, we do know that they murder Cassie. - [Narrator] Interrogators
are launching into the story of what they know. It's back to positive confrontation. - Okay? We're got the evidence
at this point to prove that. - [Torey's Father] You found the evidence? - We also have some overwhelming
evidence, trace evidence, that type of stuff, that's going to prove that they did it as well.
It's not just hearsay. It's not just somebody saying it. - [Narrator] In a few
moments, the interrogators will reveal they've received
a confession from Brian. During this time, Torey
is looking at the ground. But as soon as he realizes
Brian has betrayed him, he quickly looks back up. - And then we do have a confession. (rewinding) And then we do have a confession. - [Narrator] From this point onward, Torey's demeanor shifts. Instead of looking anxious,
he looks more and more angry. - You know what you need to do. You know exactly what
happened, and you know what you need to do. So unfortunately, you're
not going anywhere tonight. You're going to be placed
into custody tonight, okay? And I'm sorry, that's the way it goes. - You're going to be charged
with first degree murder. Okay? - Okay? But like I said before,
before you say anything, I encourage you. If you wanna talk to your
attorney, you should do that. I'm not pulling punches here. Still, your full
cooperation can do nothing but help you at this point in time. - [Torey's Father] You
understand that, Torey? And I know you need a lawyer, or whatever, you want to talk to a lawyer. I understand that the
advice they gave me today, and then whatever you
and the lawyer work out, they want your cooperation. - We've got the details, we've
got the knife that you used. We've got the masks that you
used. We've got the video tape. We've got it. There's a tape
up in there that you buried. Okay? Tried to catch on fire. Oh, that's, you know
what I'm talking about, I don't need to tell you that. - [Torey's Father] This is right, Torey. And what they're saying is true. So it sounds like you need a lawyer. Yeah, what can I say? - Yeah, don't ask him anymore
because we don't want, we wouldn't want to talk to you. - I'm not a lawyer, I don't want-- - We don't want him
answering questions for you. - I just want you to
hear it from your dad, it's not the end of the world. Okay? Things can only go up from
here, but it's up to you. You can either make it really spiral down, or you can make them go up. - [Narrator] Torey is
showing signs of anxiety. Grabbing at the face and putting your head on a closed fist or open hand are common, but small, indicators of rising stress. - And by going up, you have to
come clean with your father. You have to come clean with your mother. And if you get an attorney, you gotta come clean with your attorney. And then you got to come to us. And we got to work together
to see what we can do to help you out and make this better. Okay? Okay? Fair enough. - If Brian already
confessed, why wasn't he placed in custody? (rewinding) - If Brian already confessed, If Brian already confessed. - [Narrator] Torey's voice
cracks, seeming to indicate that he's emotionally upset
and psychologically turbulent. - He is in custody. - He wasn't this afternoon. - He's in custody. Trust me. - I don't know how-- - Two people in custody
right now. You, and Brian. Matt's been cleared today. Cleared by polygraph, cleared by all that. But we know what happened. Okay? - [Narrator] Despite this
bombshell being dropped on him, Torey still doesn't seem
to grasp the gravity of the situation. - Well, this is a shock. Like I said, this is a horrible thing, but you control it. Okay? Don't try to play. - If you continue to lie.. (crosstalk) - And everybody at school
is going to know, right? - We're not going to
release it to anybody. I can tell you that, okay? What's going on here, ain't
going anywhere from us. We still got a lot of work to do. Okay? But that to me is the
least of your worries at this point in time. - [Narrator] This is a common thing to see in juvenile interrogations. They tend to do worse when their world, as they know it, is upended. The interrogators let Torey know they have a search warrant for his house and car. - We've got a search
warrant for your house. - Okay.
- Okay? - And for your car. - And for your car, and
then we'll also have a search warrant for Brian's house. Okay? And then we're going to try to make this as quick and as expedient as possible. - That's fine. - And we'll do everything that we can to accommodate you and your wife. I know this is one hell
of a blow to you guys. I can't even imagine. - [Torey's Father] I can't either. - And I know that if there's anything that we can do for you guys as well-- - I think it was worth
it for us to sit down and talk after this. - We definitely have to talk-- - Nothing to do with what
you say is amongst us and what the game plan is. And I want you to get all
your questions answered. - [Torey's Father] So
based on what you talk to the lawyer today,
Torey, you want a lawyer. You talked to him, you know what he said. I mean, if you want a
lawyer you got to say, it doesn't help to tell me. - He's already said he wants an attorney. So as far as we're concerned, where we've got to stop.
We're out of it, you know? - That doesn't mean he
can't change his mind down the road and come
visit us, come back and say, you know, with after he's
counseled with the attorney. If he really wants to come in, that's cooperation. - Yeah. - [Torey's Father] I'm sure he wants to. - I know, I know he does. I know you can do the right thing. I know you're a good kid, deep down. People make mistakes, things happen. This is one of those things where you don't want to make
it worse, my friend. It will eat you up.
It'll start right here. You know, eat its way all the
way up until it destroys you. And I can tell you, there's
one person watching right now. Okay? Cassie's here,
she's watching. She knows. And you know she knows. - [Narrator] Torey
immediately goes from looking at the interrogator to looking away at the mention of Cassie's name. This is commonly taken
as an admission of guilt, but other research has shown it's also an indicator of remorse or sadness. It's impossible to qualify which it is at this point, for sure. - Okay. - It's like, it all happened so fast. - I know. And those
are the kinds of things that you need to sit down and tell us once you get with an attorney, cause you really want an attorney, okay. I would love more than
anything to sit down and talk with you right
now and try to step through these things and
try to work it out with all of us in here. You know, but I'm kind of, I'm stepping in some pretty murky waters. When you say you want an
attorney and I don't want, I don't want to violate
his rights or your rights. So, but we're not mad, okay? This is a shock, but
we know what happened. All you need to do, it's easy for you, things happen fast, like you said. - [Narrator] Torey is left
alone briefly before two men come in to search him and take his shoes. - Right, I'm going to
have you sit there, okay? If you need something, we'll go get you-- - You want a drink or something? - No. - Well, we need you to stay here. Okay? (indistinct) (door opens) (people talking) - Torey, stand up and put
your hands on the wall. You don't have anything that's
going to stick or poke me in the eyes or anything? - Put your hands on the wall.
- My wallet. Okay.
- Okay. - [Narrator] Once in complete solitude, Torey's stress reactions
are interesting to observe. First, he's frustrated. He goes on to experience
a vast range of emotions as he plays over the crime in his mind, and also what went wrong in his life to lead him to this point. He's clearly reaching the
"yep, I'm screwed" point. There's literally no getting out of this, and the only recourse is
reflection and contemplation. Often, suspects at this
point will mentally go to another place. Torey's mother arrives in a bit, and both parents remain supportive. - Come on out, bud. - [Torey's Mother] And we love you, and we'll just go from there. No matter what happens, we're right here. - [Torey's Father] Your parents love you. Your brother loves you. Come
here, son, okay? Torey.. - [Narrator] Her maternal
nature is over-powering any sense of anger she
might express at this point. - We'll see you tomorrow, okay? - Okay. - [Torey's Mother] Just tell
them about what happened, okay? If we ask Torey questions,
it would be damaging. - [Narrator] Torey's mother says, "if we ask Torey questions,
it would be damaging at this point." She's correct. Note, the cameras are still rolling. (kissing) - I love you, Torey. Okay? I love you. (Torey's Mother sighs) And it's okay. (Torey sighs) - [Narrator] The only
remaining footage to look at is of Brian Draper on
September 28th and 29th. The jig is up, and he'll
now let investigators in on more details about the crime. If you're easily sick to your stomach, be warned that this is
where it gets graphic. The interrogators employ almost all Classic Reid Interrogation Techniques here to get admissions from Brian
that they need for their case. This begins with Step One:
Positive Confrontation. - First of all, we want
to kind of explain to you what the heck's going
on, you know, right now. You told us, you gave us
your statement yesterday. To be right honest with you,
what we're trying to do is fortify your statement, okay? Last night some things took place with regards to Torey, okay? He said some things I'm
pretty confident that they're bunk, it's not true. And so, alls we want to do is
ask you, is it true or not? He said that, you know, you
do certain things that you do. (crosstalk) Which I know he's just making it up. - Okay. - So, I mean, those are things that, and what we're also trying to do is kind of build your story. 'Cause like we told you,
you're the first guy through the door, and
we want to, you know, we're on your bandwagon, okay? Pretty much everything that
you talked to us about, Torey's confirmed it, and stuff like that. So things are looking good for you. - [Narrator] They start off by explaining how the interview with
Torey went the day before. - Okay. Okay, during that
interview last night, we kinda led Torey down
that path, the same path, you know, the vehicle
burglaries and stuff like that. Eventually, you know, he placed
you guys at Common Cents, like you said, okay?
After you left the house. He talked about putting
the shovel in the trunk, okay, is that true? - Yes. - Okay. Did you guys go
to that Common Cents? And you had told us that
you purchased some matches. Now were they, were they
box matches in a box? - Mm-hmm. - Okay. And so we're asking Torey, why did Matt purchase those matches? Well, we know why you purchased
them. You told us the truth. But he's telling us, well,
Matt purchased those matches because you smoke. - I'm Brian. - Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. - Guys, we're doing the same thing here. Our brains are gonna-- (laughing) - But he said, he says,
because Brian smokes. - I don't smoke. - Okay, so he said he
bought those stick matches because you're a smoker and you needed, you need matches light cigarette. - No. - So I'm asking him, what
brand does Brian smoke? And he says, "mm.. I don't know." So he, in a roundabout
way, he says, yeah, okay, We were out in Blackrock
Canyon. We were out there. Okay, we parked the car,
we got out of the car. And he said the reason why
you guys got out of the car is because you needed to smoke. (Brian scoffs) And you had to smoke two, and you smoked two cigarettes up there. So is that true? - No. - Okay, so you didn't
smoke two cigarettes. Okay. - So, we drove all the way up
there just to fucking smoke? - As you can see, he's struggling. Well, he's saying that you
got lost on the way home. - So we went through the highway? - Yeah, that didn't happen. You couldn't find the cutoff
to go back to your house, because you wanted to go to your house. And then he says, you
know, you guys basically, after that, you go home.
Is that correct, Andy? - Yeah. - [Narrator] It's intriguing
how much Brian's demeanor has changed in just a day. Although the quality of the
video makes it hard to tell, he seems to be laughing and
smiling much more freely here, particularly when the
interrogator clues him in on Torey's fake story. It's clear that Brian
is relieved to no longer have to watch every word he says, because now the truth is mostly out. They then ask him about the
evidence he led them to. - You led us to some
things that were found in Blackrock Canyon. Tell me about what they found up there. - Um, they found all of the
gloves that I told you about, um, those masks and then
the boots, and then I-- - Were you wearing those boots? - I was. - Whose boots were they,
were they your boots? - I found the boots at my
welding class back in December. - Okay, so you wore those boots at night when you were in the house? Okay. (indistinct) - Is that the first time
you've ever worn those boots? - Yeah. - Okay. What was the purpose
of wearing the boots? - They were black, you know, cooler. - Okay, then. - How did you end up in all of this? - Well, we, Friday, I filmed
me and Torey at school, you know, just walking around and stuff. And then we got Cassie on tape and stuff, I was talking to her. - When was that? On Friday? - Yeah. - Okay. Anything that night on tape, when you were at the house? - Um, it showed us like, driving this car when he decided to. - Okay, any audio on there? - Yeah, there should be audio. - Is there anything incriminating
on there that's gonna.. Why were you getting rid of it? - [Narrator] Not only was
there incriminating evidence on the video tapes, but
Brian and Torey's banter only makes it seem like they had no plans of stopping after Cassie. At one point, Brian even said, "so we're gonna kill her and her friends. And we're gonna keep moving on, scare them and kill them
one by one. Hell yeah." - Well, we-- (indistinct) - -in his trunk, and
yeah, they usually found-- (Brian mumbles) - But when you go in the house, are you sure you don't film what happens? - No. - Okay. Did you ever think
about filming what happened? See, like, people's expressions-- Yeah.
- Yeah. - What made you decide not to? - Well, you know, if
you're holding a camera, it's not like you're gonna
be able to, you know.. (crosstalk) - Okay. So really, the videotape has nothing to do with this incident? - No. - Okay. - [Narrator] Oddly,
Brian still seems to be trying to convince the investigators that there's nothing
incriminating on the video tape. Perhaps he thought they had destroyed it, and the footage would never be seen. But in reality, the clips
clearly show both boys being enthusiastic and deliberate about the planning of the murder. But at this point, Brian is still trying to downplay his involvement. - Did Torey ever talk about seriously doing this beforehand? - No. - Because I'm kind of getting
from talking to Torey, and he really pretty
much can't stand Matt. I mean, Matt's okay, but you know, he really doesn't like Matt. - Okay. - Did you ever get that impression? - No. - Okay, nothing like that to you? - They didn't really hang out, but.. - Okay. - [Narrator] Brian
seems to be feeling like he's in the authorities' good graces, and they're deliberately being sympathetic to gain his trust. But as they're about to reveal, he's far from off the hook and
they aren't easily accepting that he wasn't in on the attack. - You know, the problem
that we kind of have with this whole thing is, and again, you have been fantastic, okay? But sometimes the truth can
kind of be hard to tell, okay? It looks like two of the
knives have blood on them. - Okay. - Okay? So how can you explain that to me? - How come there's four knives, did we ever answer that? - Oh, those were just props for the movie. But we weren't going to use them. That we were gonna have.. - When were you guys
going to make that movie? - Well, we were starting
the script pretty soon, and then we start filming for,
you know, the production.. - Okay, so let's go back to the knives. There's two knives, two
distinct different knives. Two of them have blood on them. - Okay. - Okay? How does the blood
get on both of those knives? - Well, we put them in a shirt, we wrapped them up in a shirt. (indistinct) - The blood is layered on the knife. See, there's blood that's transfer blood, where I would like if I had a bloody nose and I'm holding it, and
then I take the towel and put it against you, and it's blotted? Okay, that's called transfer blood. This is layered blood, okay? And they say that once
you go into something and come back out, the blood
is layered on the knife. It's not transferred from it. So they know that both knives
have gone into the body. Brian, do you, does he make
you put the knife in her? Do you stab her too? - No, I don't stab her. - Are you sure you don't stab her? I know you don't want to stab her, I know that that is the
last thing in the world that Brian would ever do. But does, at any time, does
Torey make you stab her? - [Narrator] The interrogator
is entering Reid Step Seven, offering Brian a more socially or morally acceptable explanation for what happened by stating things like, "I know
you don't want to stab her." - Are you sure? Because I
want you to think about, I know that there's a lot going on. The mood you know, the screaming, the gurgling sounds that you're seeing, probably the smells that
you're smelling now, blood and that smell. Okay? And you've got a lot going on. You've got a burst of adrenaline. Okay? If he's yelling at you,
are you sure you don't see your hand coming out accidentally? Are you sure that you don't
stab her accidentally? - [Narrator] Again, the
interrogator is offering Brian a more socially or morally
acceptable explanation for what happened by stating he may have "accidentally" stabbed her. - Is that possible that that happens? - I dropped my knife. Dropped it. - Do you drop it after you stab her? Because we definitely have, I mean.. (crosstalk) She's going.. okay. The thing I want you to think back, okay? Some of the stabs are really deep. (hits table) You know, they're forceful. Those are not you. Okay? I know that. And then some are real light. (indistinct) They could tell. And then they said that some of them are just little pecks on there, and you know what I'm thinking? I mean, you're caught up in a situation, Is Torey, is the fact that he's
doing this and scaring you, are you scared that if you don't do this, that something might happen?
- He might turn back on you? - I mean, is that possible? - [Narrator] When Brian's shoulders slump, the interrogators are finally on the cusp of getting what they want. This is the body language
of resignation or surrender. Confidence has left the
suspect, and he is now torn between finding the energy to
keep minimizing his own role in the crime, and fully
admitting to what he did. - I don't think you're
stabbing her to kill her, I don't think you would
ever, in a million years, Brian, do that. Okay? But do you get caught up in the moment, and you're just doing it to show him so you don't get turned
on? Does that happen? Be honest with us, okay? Is that what happened? Did
you just barely hit it, just to try to get the hell out of there? Is that what happens? - Yes. - [Narrator] Reid Step
Seven has worked here, a minimized version of events, coupled with false sincerity
from the interrogators, which is Reid Step Five, breaks
Brian after all this time. - Okay. - How many times do you think?
I mean, was it just a couple? - I didn't want to. - What's that? You didn't want to? We know that, we know
you did it on accident. (Brian mumbles) - Okay. - [Narrator] Brian puts
his face in his hands. This is a classic indicator
of guilt and shame. Hiding the face, avoiding eye contact, trying to erect a barrier between himself and the circumstances, both
physical and psychological. - Was it just in the
stomach area, or the chest-- - On her leg. - Okay, on her leg. Okay. - Where else? - I think it was two times
in the chest and the leg. - And you said you threw the knife down? - Yeah, I dropped the knife. - Where did you drop the knife? - Probably fell down the stairs. - And then you pick it back up? - No one picks it up. - You know, are you being square about, Torey stabs her too? - Yes. - Okay, so that's,
you're solid about that? - Yes. - Okay. So, so he's not the one
standing and watching? Okay. (indistinct) - We're good on that, okay. This is all, I just want to know that. We can work through anything
that we've got going on. - Is there any way that you can remember the chain of events that takes place? Is he stabbing her maliciously,
trying to hurt her? What makes you finally have to stab her? - He comes over and says "we
have to make sure she's dead. You need to stab her,
you need to stab her." I didn't know what to think,
and I say "I can't do it." And he says, you need to
stab her, just do it quick. - And what did you do? - Stabbed her in the leg, and he says, "that's not gonna work, she has to die." - Okay. So why is he so focused-- (crosstalk) - I mean, you said before, she's probably already dead anyway. So what you're doing,
you're not killing her. He's the one who killed
her. You know what I mean? - Yeah, he just kept saying I had to. - [Narrator] And finally,
Brian was interviewed one last time. On September 29th, the pace and demeanor of this interview is far more relaxed. At this point, the police
have what they want. Now they're just trying
to gather more details. While previous interrogations
saw Brian sitting next to the door, next to freedom, per se, these final interviews show
him backed into a corner. This emotionally places him in a position where he knows he has nowhere to go. Even the truth, at this
point, will do him no good. Brian says he's been advised not to talk. - I'm not supposed to
talk to you guys, so.. - You're not supposed to? - No, that's what my attorney said. - Okay. So why did you, you
said you wanted to talk to us, though, right? - Yeah. Yeah, that was
before my attorney came. - Oh. - But I want to see what
you guys have to say, so.. - Well, you have the right to talk to us without your attorney, but you
have to make that decision. - But that's entirely up to you. And we can talk to you, I mean,
I guess we can counsel you, a little bit, you know.. - If you have something that we.. Maybe we could do this,
maybe we can just tell you, I mean, you don't have
to answer any questions, but we can tell you kind of
what we might need from you. And then you can evaluate
whether that's something that you want to tell
us. You know what I mean? - Yeah. - So, I mean, you're in control. - [Narrator] Saying
that Brian is in control is the furthest thing from
the truth at this point. They let him know that
they've seen the videos he and Torey taped. - You know, when we found some stuff up at the old dumpsite there that, you know, especially the video. - Yes. - A lot of things on the videos,
it's not looking real good. You know what I mean? - Yeah. - Makes you both look pretty bad. - Okay. - And like I said, you're going to have to just come to terms with it. You're doing the right thing, being straight up and tell us everything. - [Narrator] The interrogators now touch on another aspect of the video tape. - On the video tape, it shows you guys go into another girl's house. - Yeah. - Whose house was that? - Uh, on the tape? - Maybe on Thursday, the
21st, is when the tape says. And you're going to a house, and you're stalking around a house, looking at a house
somewhere, some other girl. And you're thinking about looking and seeing if your parents
was there, or not there? - I don't know. - [Narrator] The police
are trying to put together a psychological profile
of Torey at this point. - Have you ever gone out,
or have you heard Torey ever talking about, like,
choking out cats stuff like that? - Yes. - You ever done that, you
ever done that with him? - No, I didn't, uh, I, like animals a lot. - But he doesn't? - No. He said that, um, he buried a, uh, either it was a cat or it was a bird, in the ground, and he got a weed whacker and hit him in the head,
he got extremely mad.. He got mad, you know. - He buried it maybe up to its head, maybe hit it with a weed
whacker, is that what he said? - Yeah, that's what he
told me. Yeah, but.. - But did he say anything
specifically about choking them? - I remember him saying
that he had a kitten, like.. - Okay. - Popped its eye or something. Yeah, he made me mad
about that kind of stuff. 'Cause I have a couple cats of my own. (Brian mumbles) - What about anything
else, did he talk about killing anything else? Or mutilating it or anything? - He talked about killing
some animals, but.. - Has he stabbed any of them before? - I don't think he said
anything about that, no. - In the video he talks
about, he wanted you to stab him so he could feel
what it felt like or whatever. Before you guys, you know,
committed suicide or whatever. Had he ever talked to
you about that before? Did he want you to stab him? - Yes. At school, on the tape. - Mm-hmm. (knocking) - Come in. - Brian's attorney's here. - Okay. - [Narrator] Brian's attorney shows up, and the interrogation ends. In the end, Brian and
Torey were each charged with one count of murder
in the first degree, and one count of
conspiracy to commit murder in the first degree. They were tried as adults, and convicted during separate trials. Brian's conviction for
the conspiracy charge was later overturned, citing
errors in jury instructions, but his life sentence without parole on the murder conviction was upheld. Torey also received life in prison without the possibility
of parole for the murder, as well as 30 years to life for
conspiracy to commit murder. In court, Brian's counsel
argue that the videotapes of the boys were part of a
horror movie they were making. In the transcripts of these clips, it can be seen that Brian
and Torey said things like, "we're going for a high death count," "we're going to make history," "we're sick psychopaths
who get their pleasure off killing other people," and "we're going to be just like 'Scream,' except real life terms." They also compared
themselves to serial killers like Ted Bundy, the Hillside Strangler, and the Zodiac killer,
saying "those people were mere amateurs compared to
what we are going to be." Cassie's autopsy revealed
that she had been stabbed approximately 30 times,
and 12 of the wounds were considered potentially fatal. As authorities have finally
been able to piece together the puzzle of this crime,
it is believed that after Matt left, Brian and
Torey turned out the lights again and waited for
Cassie to come downstairs. But when she did not, they went upstairs where they were growled
at by the dog before Brian opened and slammed a closet
door at the top of the stairs to scare her, and then ambushed
her with the brutal attack.
N OMEGALUL he's probably just gonna skim through this
Before the whole JCS tremd I would watch, and still do, a YT channel called That Chapter. A tiny bit more YT style commentary from the host, but great vids and not too long.