When you hear a pilot grumpy
on the radio say something like this: Put this on the books. We're going around
because of them and we're going around. You might think, why is he so irritated? So let's see how he got there. Pipeline 12521 just let me know when you guys are getting
ready to cross the final for runway 22L. Traffic's 8 to the Northeast
descending out of 3000' 737. Okay, I'm continuing
and I'll look for that traffic. I'll let you know
when I get close. I'll probably have to
pass right beneath it and then southbound
at this altitude though. Roger just look
out for that traffic. They're at your 12 o'clock
five miles opposite direction. 3000' descending 737. 521 looking. First, we're gonna set the scene
of exactly what's going on here. This first plane that's talking
with air traffic control looks like this. This is Cessna 172 which is a plane that a
lot of new pilots learn on. When you're flying pipeline and it's
almost a job that I got in west Texas, but I didn't get it because I didn't
have enough flight time at that time. But what you're doing is
you're flying along a pipeline. For example, in Texas,
you're flying along oil pipelines and you're looking for leaks. In different parts of the US,
you might be doing things like flying along power
lines and looking for trees that are growing
on a power lines. You could be doing a
bunch of different stuff, but that pipeline flying is
you usually building your time because you don't have
enough flight time to get a job that you really want
or go to the airlines or fly for a corporate company. So what you'll do
is you'll fly pipeline. And you're able to
build a lot of flight time. That way, the quality of the
time though is not really great. What I mean by that is you're
building flight hours, which is good. And you need that experience
in order to be able to get hired. But you're flying usually in the daytime,
always in the daytime in clear skies. And you're not really doing anything
except just looking out your window to make sure that there's
nothing that's down. That doesn't really develop your skills
or grow your skills as a pilot generally. So I've seen sometimes where
people who build a lot of pipeline time and they might have
3000 hours of pipeline time, but they really struggle if you
put them in a different environment that requires your ability
to fly on instruments, meaning in bad weather, things like that because it's not something
that they have any experience in doing. So this is the
arrival into Midway, which is where this is
taking place in Chicago. And in this plane right here, we have a less experienced pilot that's probably trying
to build flight time. And something I want to say for all
the newer pilots that are watching this, as you watch this video,
realize that every airline pilot and every pilot
that's flying a big jet has, at one time, been a
newer pilot with less experience. They've all been there. Whether they act like
they've been there or not. They have been in this pilot shoes
before with this amount of flight time. The traffic that the air
traffic controller is referencing is flying in here in the Midway, which I've flown
into many times. I should probably say this because
I know people are gonna mention it. I did not fly in there on a
747, even though I would like to if we ever go apocalyptical
in this world, I will try it. But I used to fly in there all the
time when I was flying regional jets. But this is the
chart for Midway. And you can see there
are a lot of runways, but they're very short. All that means when you're
landing on a short runway is that you don't have a lot of time
to float down the runway. You've heard me talking
about a plane floating before, meaning they're not
managing their power correctly. And so when you're landing on a
really short runway, a lot of times, if you're a passenger, you'll notice it's
kind of a stiff landing and that's because it's very important that
you land exactly where you need to land and stop in time. So a pilot would rather take a
harder landing to get the plane stopped than have a nice soft landing
and go off the end of the runway. This plane that's coming in is
planning to land here on 22 left. And you'll notice this marking right
here indicates a displaced threshold. What that means is there's a
portion of that 6,445 foot runway that is not usable by
the pilots for landing. You can be used for
takeoff, but not for landing. So when air traffic
control says this. Pipeline 12521 just let me know when you guys are getting
ready to cross the final for runway 22L. Traffic's 8 to the Northeast
descending out of 3000' 737. He's talking to the Cessna, which we're
gonna show here with this white plane. And he's telling them that there's
some pilots that are coming in a 737, that they're gonna
be flying an approach. And so he wants to know when this
pilot in the white plane wants to cross this section right here. And the pipeline pilot understands
and responds and says this. Okay, I'm continuing
and I'll look for that traffic. I'll let you know
when I get close. I'll probably have to
pass right beneath it. And then southbound
at this altitude though. This is where the
controller should step in if they felt like there
could be a potential conflict because what the
pipeline pilot is saying is as we're gonna go down there, we'll maintain this altitude, which
I think they're around 1200 feet. They'll maintain this altitude
here and we'll cross down that way. But what the pipeline pilot will be
comfortable with and what an airline pilot will be comfortable with
may not be the same thing. And I sense there's some hesitation
from the controller, but he says this. Just look out for that traffic. They're at your 12 o'clock
5 miles opposite direction 3000' descending 737. The controller
is telling this pilot I need you to find this
other plane in the sky because once you
see them visually, I want you to maintain
visual separation. That is airline speak
or pilot speak for I want you to see that plane and then
not hit that plane in the air by being able to keep an eye on it. That's essentially what
he's telling the pilot. He's gonna put the
responsibility on that pilot. As soon as that pilot
can see the other plane, now he's responsible for staying
away from that other plane. But the one thing that this pilot
says that I really like is right here. 521 looking. The reason that I like that is because
when air traffic control tells a pilot, Hey, I need you to
find this other plane. Sometimes I'll hear pilots
on the radio, say things like, oh, I see them on my
screen or things like that. Unless you can physically see it in the
real world by looking outside of your plane, then it doesn't count. So by saying that you
can see it on your screen, on your plane, on your display, where it shows all the
other planes around you. That means nothing. So there's no reason
to even say that. Unless you can physically
see it, it doesn't count. So this pilot, I don't know if they have that
screen where it shows the other traffic, but they're saying, okay,
we're looking outside the plane. We're looking for
this other aircraft. So that is the right
response in that situation, which shows that the
pilot is looking outside and doing what they're
supposed to be doing. 521 traffic in sight. Southwest 391 MNDOE 22L. Pipeline 12521
maintain visual separation with that traffic and
caution wake turbulence. Thank you maintain
visual caution wake 521. Southwest 391 Midway Tower
traffic 12 o'clock 3 miles northeast bound 1200' it's a
Pipeline - correction - Cessna. They have you in sight. They
are maintaining visual from you. Runway 22L cleared to land. 22L cleared to land looking
for traffic Southwest 391. The pipeline pilot sees
a 737 which is easier. Usually when you're lower on the
ground, looking up against the sky, you only have really two colors. Generally you have blue for
the sky and gray for the cloud. So it's a little bit easier to see
a plane that's purple and orange versus when you're in
a plane, looking down, you have a lot of different
colors on the ground. White buildings and
red buildings and cars. So there's a lot
more that's moving. It's hard to find a much smaller
plane that's going along the ground than it is from being in a small
plane looking up at the sky. But the controller is saying, Hey, this small plane sees you. You look for that plane but
they're gonna stay away from you. That's kind of like saying you can keep doing exactly
what you are planning to do and their responsibility
is to stay away from you. That doesn't really mean anything
if they mess up and they hit you. Well, you've still had
a collision in flight, but that's essentially what
the controller's saying here. So based on the transmission, it sounds like the
Cessna is right here and directly facing the 737 which is right here. And they're three miles apart. And they're about to turn in this
final turn to go land on the runway. You can already see how
this is going to be a problem because the landing phase of flight
is a high workload time for the pilots. The pilots are having to get ready to
land and do all the normal checks that they're responsible for doing. While one pilot is flying, keeping their eye on
a very short runway, making sure that they maintain
their power management correctly. So they're able to land
specifically where they need to land so they can stop in time. While another pilot is
probably looking out the window, trying to find the other plane so that way they can maintain
their own visual separation from it. So they want to
both see each other so that way that
there's no conflict. But you can already see how
this is gonna turn into a problem. Listen what happens next. Pipeline 521 just remain
north of that traffic. Yeah I'm swinging
northeast bound now 521. Traffic in sight. Southwest 391 responding.
Getting back on glide. Southwest 391 roger. And if able runway
22L cleared to land. Alright if able 22L cleared
to land. We did have RA Roger. No we're not going to! Put this on the books. We're
going around because of them and we're going around. Southwest 391 roger. Maintain 3000' fly
runway heading for now. 3000' runway heading
Southwest 391. Happens way too often! Pipeline 521 heading
southbound now. Pipeline 521 roger. I like how the pipeline
pilot's like, okay, cool. I'm just gonna keep
doing my thing over here. Pipeline 521 heading
southbound now. So here's what happened. You have this 737 has a system. It's called TCAS. Traffic Collision
Avoidance System. And that system basically is looking for
all the other planes that are around you. Creating a bubble, if you will. And it looks at the trend of what
the aircraft you are in is doing and lets you judge
what's around you. So now this pilot could
be in the small plane, could be a thousand feet
below this other plane, the 737. And if that 737 was
flying in level flight, the traffic collision avoidance
system wouldn't care. But because that plane
is descending, it's sensing, okay, this is getting
too close for comfort. And now it's going to alert the pilot
and give them what's called a RA. A resolution advisory. That is what the pilot is saying
at this point without fully saying it. Southwest 391 responding. The full phrase that you would
say is responding to a RA which is basically
meaning you're following the instructions that
your plane is giving you to keep you away
from other traffic. So that resolution advisory
might tell the pilots climb or could tell them
something which basically is keeping their plane away
from this other aircraft. So when you hear this very
excited Southwest pilot say this: responding.
Getting back on glide. He is telling air traffic control, which
is absolutely the right thing to do, Hey, we were
responding to a RA. So now we're in a different situation
than what we were planned to be in. So it's basically like I'm not doing anything that
I'm not supposed to be doing. We're following the
instructions from our plane. And then he is letting
air traffic control know, Hey, we're not doing what we
were originally planning to do. And we're doing this other thing
because you put us too close to this other aircraft and we
have to follow the instructions of what our plane
is telling us to do. As this plane is descending, they're following this path
to get down to the runway. But if as they're going down, the
plane sees this other plane pop up here, which is the Cessna, it's going to tell the
pilots stop descending. Which is exactly what
the Southwest pilots did. They did exactly
the right thing. They stopped descending
and followed the instructions. And the controller
saw this coming as well. You heard him tell
the Cessna pilot, make sure you stay
north of the plane. He saw that this was
gonna be a problem. Listen here. Pipeline 521 just remain
north of that traffic. So the controller was hoping that Cessna
pilot was to stay far enough north and away from the plane so that way
the TCAS system wouldn't get triggered. And wouldn't tell the pilots to stay
away from that plane by climbing or whatever instruction that TCAS
system gave the pilots at that time. But you don't wanna have
the TCAS system from this 737. Look at this white Cessna
down here and think: Ah, yeah, you can
probably make it. That's not how it's designed. It's just analytically looks
at the information and says, that's too close for comfort. So maintain your speed or climb. Now then the controller says if able land on 22 left. Because now the controller can
see these pilots have descended or changed the descent rate. So they're not continuing the
descent at the normal glide path to get down to that runway. And because it's
such a short runway, it's gonna be a lot harder for
them to land and safely stop. Because when you are dealing
with a runway that's this short, you have to be very
precise in where you land. If you had to balloon up your
plane or maintain your altitude and now have to dive back down, you've messed up your
energy management. Could you catch up
and make it work? Yeah, you absolutely could. And probably if
you were in the sim, just messing around
with your friends, you could absolutely land.
It wouldn't be any problem. However, it's definitely
not ideal to do that. And if something goes wrong
and you were to mess up and come in too
fast or land too long, or have any type of an incident, what would happen is they would
look over everything that happened and then they'd look at
how you controlled the plane, the decisions that you made. And what they would say is why would you
make that decision? We'd rather you just go back
up and burn some extra gas and come back in and safely land, not do this. And that's why I'm guessing
this is the captain here. We're going around
because of them. So the Southwest
pilots did everything right. They complied with the RA. They let air traffic control know
that they were complying with a RA and that's why they weren't
continuing on the glide path down. Then they considered for a
second about continuing to land and getting back on the glide
path to come into the runway there. But then at the end, the captain, I'm
guessing, decided Hey, we're not gonna do that.
We're gonna do a go-around. So everything that
they did was correct. Now from the pipeline pilot, as the pipeline
pilot is flying around, they're looking up and seeing, okay, I have plenty of distance.
I'm nowhere near that plane. The problem is the Southwest pilots
don't have glass beneath their feet. So they can't see what the
other pilot is doing down there. And so if the plane tells them, Hey, you need to do something
different with the resolution advisory, they have no choice. But obviously this pilot
is very irritated by this. No we're not going to!
Put this on the books. When I was a new pilot, I would be happy to do a go-around because
I was just trying to build flight time. But when you're
an airline pilot, you no longer really care about
the number of hours that you have. You have enough flight time to
be at the job that you want to be at. So you're not really caring about
the hours. You just wanna land. Midway is a big
base for Southwest. So maybe this pilot is on
their final leg after a long trip, and they're just
ready to go home. And this extra 20 minutes
might put them in rush hour traffic. I don't know. Obviously they're
irritated about it, but if you are a pipeline pilot
and you are listening to this, you might feel bad. The reality is as long as you
learn from this experience, doesn't really matter. Every airline pilot has had to build
time and all of them have probably done something stupid
in their career. But now, you know, if this plane is coming in, you'd rather just stay
further to the north. That way you can let this plane go down
because we can't see what's beneath us. So instead of creating
for us do a go-around, you can take an extra 10 or 15
seconds and stay away from us and then come in right behind. It wouldn't be a big deal, but I don't think the pipeline
pilot did anything intentional to create a problem and I don't
think they really did anything wrong. They were following
instructions of air traffic control and maintaining
the visual separation. So they were doing everything
they were supposed to be doing. And they can't really
know if the TCAS system is going to alert
these other pilots, but it's always better just to
give an extra 10 or 15 seconds and then fly in
right behind them. N721FL can you
change runway 16L? I can change to 16L 721FL. Change 16L runway
16L cleared to land. Cleared to land 16L. N721FL, I need you down. I'll do the best I can you
gave me a long landing. N721FL sir I'll need you down
or you'll have to go-around. N721FL go around. I'm going around. Why didn't you
leave me on the right side then? So this pilot that was coming into
land was originally expecting 16 right. He was planning the land here, but the controller asked if you could
switch just a little bit over onto 16L. Now that's not too
uncommon of a request. I've had it happen
in my airline career. I think I've even had it happen
on the 747. It's not very common, but sometimes they might
have a plane that they think, oh, we can get
this other plane out. You can just slide this other plane
over one runway. They can land there. They can keep everything moving
more efficiently and they'll ask you, Hey, can you move
over to this runway? You have the right to not do it. You can say, no, I can't do it. Realize by saying that there's two
potential things that could happen. If you say no, I can't do it, air traffic control could tell you
to hold or go-around or whatever. If you agree to do it and you get to the
other runway and you mess something up, well, that's a 100%
on your responsibility. So you're kind of, you kind of have to judge based on
listening to everything that's going around. Do you need to do it or
do you not need to do it? And if you don't do it, is it gonna create a bunch
of extra time for you or not? And it's a little bit hard until
you get enough experience. But if you get asked, Hey, can you do this? And you're a newer pilot or
you don't feel really comfortable just realize you don't have to
take what they're asking you to do. You can say, no, I need to land
on this runway. And they could either say, well, go around and come back around and
we'll try it again, which is totally fine. Or like I said, if you feel good
enough to slide over there, then just go ahead
and slide over. But then you hear the
controller telling the pilot that he needs him
to get down and land. N721FL I need you down. It sounds like this pilot is
intentionally floating down the runway. And this is a very long runway. This runway is almost double the
length of the one at Midway earlier. And this pilot is probably parking
down on this area down here. So listen to when he
says he's going to land long. I'll do the best I can you
gave me a long landing. A long landing is when instead of landing in the
first third of the runway and the first couple
thousand feet of the runway, you say you're gonna land
towards the end of the runway. And so that's gonna really save
you maybe two or three minutes because you're getting
to fly a little bit longer instead of taxing on the
ground at a normal slower speed. So you're gonna save one to two
minutes in the grand scheme of everything. So instead of landing
on this part right here, they're planning to land
in this part right here. So we're talking about really
a very minimal time savings. And the problem is that if you land
at the very end of that runway and something were to go wrong, like you
hit some oil slick, or who knows what, and you slide off the end of
the runway, which happens, then you're gonna have to
explain to the FAA or whoever else, Hey, this is why I
decided to do this. I wanted to save the
extra minute on the ground. Now I've talked about landing too
short at the very start of the runway and landing on the numbers. That's dangerous because
if you come up short, you're hitting the grass
or whatever's over there. And it's the same. Landing at the very, very end is dangerous
in order to save one or two minutes, it really makes no sense. And you can hear the
pilot is not happy about it. Why didn't you leave
me on the right side then? And he doesn't get happier with
the controller as the flight continues. N721FL extend
your upwind 1 mile. Upwind 1 mile. Left or right? I'll call your turn out. N721FL make a
right closed traffic. Right closed. N721FL make a left 360. Left 360 721FL. Tower, what's the purpose
of the left 360 here? N721FL I have a heavy inbound. So I don't want to take you
too far out on your downwind so I’m trying to
keep you close, sir. You got two runways, right? Caution for wake turbulence. After that 360. What do
you want me to do now 1FL? Traffic is 2 mile
final Boeing 767. Report traffic in sight base your
discretion caution wake turbulence. Runway 16L number
2 cleared to land. 16L number 2 cleared to land. That made no
sense at all for 1FL. So this pilot is flying
in this smaller Cessna. Sounds like he knows what he's
doing. Sounds pretty competent, but just not happy
at all with the way the controller's deciding
to organize everything. But the controller,
he's seeing this plane, doesn't really know what
the skill level of this pilot is, what they are aware
of, what their abilities are. And he has a Boeing 767, which is a pretty large
aircraft that coming into land. So he's responsible for keeping
those planes separated out. He can't just trust that this pilot is
going to make all the right decisions, because if that pilot
were to do something, he's gonna be questioned of why did you let this
pilot in this Cessna fly behind a Boeing 767? And then he get caught up in the
dirty air of that 767 and end up crashing. So the controller
has a responsibility. And what he's doing is
making that plane do 360 so he's not near that 767. So the 767 is planning
the land here on 16L, which is the same runway that this pilot
in this Cessna is planning to land on. And the controller
has two options. He obviously can't put
him right behind that 767. So he can either extend
him down a long way so there's a couple of
minutes of separation there, or he can have him do a 360. So he doesn't have
to go that far away. So he's saying do this 360 here. So that way you can stay close to the
airport because there's a lot of airspace that could be congested
possibly in that area. So he's saying do this 360. So that way you
just do this 360, by the time you
come back around, this 767 will be closer to land. And then you can
just come back in. That's the controller's
prerogative. If he wants to do that,
then he can do that. And which is obviously
what happened. If this 767 lands
here on 16 left and the wind is blowing
this way or it's very calm, the pilot of this small
Cessna landing on 16 right could end up in a lot of the
disturbed air from the 767 and put him in a lot of danger. Now, I don't know if
the wind is blowing at all or what direction is blowing in, but the controller's
making a decision to do this. And sometimes as a pilot, you just have to do what they're telling
you to do unless it's really unsafe, which is not what... The controller's not giving
him something that's unsafe. He's just saying, Hey, this is what
I want you to do and the pilot
doesn't agree with it, but sometimes that's
just the way it works out. You know, sometimes
when I'm coming into land, they decide to put a
small plane ahead of me and that small plane is
gonna be going really slow. And I think like Really? Like couldn't have
I landed first but it's their choice, you don't
hear me get on the radio and go, no, not that guy.
I want to go first. I don't want that
guy to go first. No, that's not how it works. The controllers
made the decision that that plane's going to go first
and they have to organize things and do their job the way they
think is the safest for it to happen. And so I just let them do that. And now I have to take
my 747 and fly super slow so some guy can come in and land
in this plane and it's annoying to me, but I just suck it up. This pilot has a
different strategy though. And he says this. That made no sense at all. There's really no
reason to say that. There's times where I would like to
say something and sometimes I do, but I take my finger off the
button before I transmit it and I say it to the other pilot. There's no reason to
transmit something like that because it's not going to win
you any favors with the controller. And you can hear
another pilot chime in here. Come on man. But the controller
gets the last laugh. Listen what happens here. N721FL verify you have the
heavy Boeing 767 in sight? I've got the
traffic in sight 1FL. Maintain visual separation from
that traffic caution wake turbulence. Base your discretion. Base my discretion
for 16L 721FL. Be a long landing
for wake turbulence. Unable long landing.
Report visual separation. Visual separation. Then I'll have to land beyond
its touchdown point 721FL. N721FL turn left at
taxiway F contact ground. Left on F over to ground 1FL. Ground Stationair
721L off at F for ALC. N721FL contact ground. Alliance ground
721FL off at F for ALC. N721FL contact ground on 132.65. So the pilot is asking for a long landing
there and the controllers saying, no, I'm not gonna give
you the long landing. And so then he says, okay, I need to land past the
touchdown spot of the 767, which the controller
really can't say no to. The reason not is because
in a small plane like that, you have to land past where the wings
are generating lift of the 767 because of that disturbed air. So the pilot says, well, I'm gonna land past
the touchdown point, which the controller's
gonna let him do. But if he'd been nice to the
controller this whole time, the controller probably
would've been like, yeah, cool land long. If that's really
what you wanna do. But the controller says this. Unable long landing. Pilots have something
which is an active frequency, which you're currently talking
on and a standby frequency, which means when
you're done talking, you hit this button and you
go onto this new frequency. Every pilot has forgot to hit that
button to go on to the new frequency. However, in this case where the pilot
is saying to the controller, like you're not
competent in your job, but then forgets
to hit the button, I would imagine that his personality
type is irritated with himself, that he forgot to
do it two times. If you enjoyed this video, you really enjoy one
of these two here. I look forward to
hearing from you. Until then, keep the blue side up.
