RPC VS VFD

hey guys welcome to bar Z my name is Stan today I want to talk about VFDs versus our pcs that would be a variable frequency drive versus a rotary phase converter and we need to choose one and when you shouldn't choose one and you know I get a lot of emails I get a lot of messages over on Facebook and I get a lot of messages in my inbox on YouTube about how do I know when which to pick you know and for phase conversion well you have to ask yourself what you want to do with it let's start everyone knows that I've got a bunch of hippies scattered around the shop and if I didn't do this for a living first of all I get VFDs either cheap or free a lot of these PFDs I use or take out so they cost me absolutely nothing and I do industrial automation and controls for a living so this stuff is second nature to me if you don't have that kind of stuff at your disposal converting a machine to a BFD is extremely expensive if you're using a VFD solely for generating the third phase which they're all capable of doing that if that's the only reason you're buying a PFD you might as well go with a phase converter now there's two types of phase converters available what's a static and one's a rotary the static phase converters are pretty notorious for not making tag horsepower so if you plan on using all of your horsepower all of your tag horsepower you better stick with a rotary so you know we've kind of gone through that if you know if you have the time and the inclination to really dig into a machine strip all the electrical out of it and you know rewire it top to bottom whole new control group new fusing everything changes on a machine soon as you switch it over to a VFD it's not just sleppy up dianna and go there's a lot to it so if the only reason you're doing that is for three-phase you know I'm going to recommend an RPC for you and there's two ways you can do that too you can do it point-of-use you know one one RPC one machine that's it or you can feed an entire shop you can set up a distribution network where you have your main single-phase panel you feed a one large RPC and then that our RPC feeds a distribution panel a three-phase distribution panel and you send that out to the shop pull all your machines so when you come in in the morning you start the RPC and you're ready to go to work at all your machines you know and if you don't need speed control and all these other things that a VFD is capable of doing I've said it before PFDs are capable of so much we barely use 10% of what they're capable of so if you think if you think you're up to the task of doing the VFD more power to yet but as far if I had all this to do over again build my entire shop round up I would probably go with a very large RPC out of the main service and distribute three-phase throughout the shop another point I want to bring up is machines come and go and if you spend them if you bring a machine into your shop and you spend the time retrofitting it and getting it all fixed up with ABI up Dean give it just the way you like it and then maybe you don't really love the machine and you want something bigger or something different machines come and go and that's just a simple fact and you but you've already got all this time vested into something that maybe you're not completely happy with but now you you've got a lot of time and effort tied up into this machine and so you keep it but three-phase machines are all over the place and they're actually cheaper than the single-phase counterparts so having said that we've got a 5-horse PFD set up here we've got a Baldor and we've got a shipment from American rotary and we're gonna set up an ad xa5 horse unit and turn this thing into a plug-and-play I'm not doing a retrofit on this this surface grinders got a Fuji VFD it's running two motors I had to do a summer special in a control group for it just to get this surface grinder where I was happy with it and to run on the single-phase power it runs good but I've got a lot of time invested in it I've got about three days worth of labor and time and if I had to go out and buy all stuff for it I probably would have spent three $400 just getting the cabinet and all the pieces I needed to make this conversion so it was three-phase when it came in and now a single-phase but let's get this thing out of the box put together and let's see if this surface grinder I'll plug and play and no muss no fuss this machine can come and go and my myface converter would be here you know waiting for the next one all right let's let's get this box open and get this thing assembled okay so we pull the motor out of the box and install the rubber feet that's pretty basic pretty pretty straightforward we got four vibration Isolators type feet here and they provide a nice grip so I could sit on the floor or anywhere a convenient for you on a tabletop or even in a cabinet of a machine you could probably be okay now and this was a Baldor you got the tell-tale OpenType drip drip on the end it's been rebranded to to Jim tech which is American rotary but the first thing that strikes you is what's missing no shaft so they used rear-ended Mill twice and the only thing special about the motor is the the rotor inside is an 1800 rpm motor so it's a four pole I'm sure they've done all their tests vegan whether it's the higher rpm two poles or the four poles what makes the best generated third phase so the next thing up is there's some brackets that come with the kit and they give you a pretty nice instruction sheet on how to mount all this and we've got a control box that mounts on the top of this but the way these studs are arranged is this needs to be like this and like this but these studs need to be linked in and these are through boys yes we've got long studs over here so this is a through bolt this piece of all threaded rod needs to be moved this way and then according to the instructions that gets double knotted and those brackets get put on there so we get that taken care of and then we're gonna look at mounting the control box up on top okay we've extended our studs on this side this would be a little bit a little bit of studly sticking out there and according to our drawing they want us double not there so it's not sitting down in this recess you look there you can see they're down in a kind of recessed hole and what it would do is when we tighten the bracket it would just bend the bracket so we're going to run an extra set of nuts down there and say give us in this handy kit yeah I think we're gonna do that at both ends because we the same thing occurs at the other end as well regular nuts in here too we're supposed to use the nighloks on the on the outer and the standard nuts on the inner standard there's another plain-jane let me run these it down here I don't know that deep the deep okay so now our notes are sticking out beyond this in bill and our brach that's gonna go on yeah so we've got stud sticking out and our bracket is not touching our end belts are in pretty good shape so from here out we just do a different washers to this they're not talking about any washers okay so we're just going to use there are nine locks that they gave us all right rockets on next up we've got to get the control box and do some knockout work we've got knockouts to pull out of the bottom and we click there's some slots and they give us some nifty little vibration Isolators there's a there's a captive nut in here and that whole thing is flexi right there so these are gonna go between here and the box electronics sure don't like by vibration I need to do capacitors so this is a good call on their point they've got vibration isolation down here at the bottom and they've also got the control group segregated from the vibration with these little Isolators so that's pretty neat I'm gonna get the control box get it prepped and all bring you back okay now here at the bottom I get to see some slots here and here and these are just knockouts very similar to a regular electrical box you stick a screwdriver and and you know give them a tap and that will knock out in that slotted pattern and there's four of those there's two down there at the bottom and two there now this is uh this is our control box contains over running caps or starting cap and all the lugs and connections for both the idler motor my incoming power and my outgoing power but there was also some electronics there and I can definitely see where they want to isolate that from vibration so let me get these things knocked out and we'll get this guy down into that okay so these little fellas pop out pretty easy I've already got one out here and all I'm using is the side of a pair of lineman's and a big Cline and they've got three attachment points one at the little side groove and want to teach into the slot fairly easily you know they're they're down inside they're gonna rattle and everything else makes you sure you fish those things out of there they're just gonna slay down the bottom rattle that gets short against something so don't don't mess around you get your get your knockouts clear of the work okay well we've got the vibration Isolators assembled the way they're shown in the picture they're showing it right here on this one and what we've got sick a carriage bolt with a square base right here fender washer a lock nut with the serrations facing towards the flat washer and the vibration Isolators bottomed out in there and what these are supposed to do that's what this little second slot is for we're supposed to be able to take this and see how this does huh get in there oh yeah and then it lines up with that slot and then we can tighten from down here and that nut is captive we don't have to go inside the panel with a pair of pliers or anything during the silly so that's actually pretty cool okay well pretty painless there just drop right on those holes and you can see our slotted holes there after we tighten anything down everything's going to Snug up really good we're gonna use the supplied washers and locks to do our studs right here down into our bracket and finish mounting this thing out what we'd like to do after this is wire it at this is complete assembly so that's the hole that's the whole Marianne right there okay leave these nuts on and we'll start some wiring okay so we've got our mounts done these are of our vibration mount Center there so our whole upper box I mean you see it but it's you know we want independently plus we got a we got the bases uh doing the hippity-dippity so the whole thing's got a nice nice flex to it we're three about damaging new electronics or anything and now we need to get from the peckerhead of the motor up to the terminals and they even supply this with a cord so I've got a looks like a ten that's a number Kenny a GG that's so cord 4-conductor so there you go pretty nice you don't have a choice of colors but you know what the electricity has no idea what color the wire is so Rini is green for ground that's a natural standard red and black it's all good whites are only odd dog so we'll use the way I'm going to do it is phase a is gonna be black phase B is gonna be red and then phase C is gonna be our our white feller all right but they you've even given us fittings we've got a needle 1 fittings there one for the peckerhead and then I got a knockout in the back and that dudes just gonna go just like that nice enough to crimp plugs on the in for me all right so let's uh let's get the idler motor wire and then the rest of it's up to us we have to provide the wire for the input and the output and what he's done for me he went ahead and installed a receptacle here that actually fits my machine so I got all I have to do is go from the lugs to that reset and my machine just plugs right in there but the supply cord coming in to defeat the thing is by me so I'm not to supply my own F so cord and my own plug but no big deal I strangely enough I know a guy will find that cord all right now let's get the same wire okay so we got our cable installed we've got our nectar zin we've got our cables ready to go into these three lugs black red and blue and we're gonna be using black red and white now we're gonna use our old friend no clucks why are we doing it we got copper here we got aluminum there and we got steel CAD plated set screws so we got three different metals there dissimilar metals and then to add insult to injury we're going to some electricity through them so we are going to put no clips on these connections you should always put them on dissimilar metal connections and you can just wipe this into the wire and the stranded wire some guys say take a little wire brush and brush it in but I've gone back on jobs that have had no collects on them you know five six years later and maybe a beach city where we get salt air with no corrosion problems so we're gonna just get our guys in here and and tighten it firmly lost a couple there there we go okay idler motor connected downstairs and you lower you guys down they're going old-school on us they've already crypt terminals on our motor leads and they've already crimped terminals on these leads so this is the old-style nut bolt connection and this is how I was taught way back in the day so I'm going to show you a new way how to make peckerhead connections using lug deluged with nuts and bolts varnished cambric and rubber splicing tape let me go get my tape and stuff and I'll bring you back for that okay we're all set to make these screw connections we've got our better roll of varnished cambric which is almost like a cloth tape it's got a steep a very sticky back and see the sticky on it this provides abrasion resistance and toughness varnished cambric is a good first layer following that up with rubber splicing tape hmm we've got scissors I can't find my splicing scissors so there's gonna be hell to pay from some ones they're missing out of my bags and then we've got our bolts that American rotary chasse and usually what they're using they're actually using the nuts with the little serrations on so pretty cool our wiring diagrams right here and we're gonna be wiring lo bolts and according to this 4 5 & 6 go together and they've already kind of pre-taped some stuff together for us here so those three leads these should be what 4 5 & 6 that's 5 4 6 alright so these three guys go together I'm just going to put a dab in no flux in between so we got this is nickel wire and then we've got some CAD plating going on there too so we're just going to take a nut and bolt to go through all three of these lugs these going don't go to any of the connections no lines or anything they just connect together now that there are the taps for the that Delta so we're just gonna take three inches and double orange this thing down until tight and like I said this is the old-school way to do it I haven't done motors like this in a very very long time not a whole lot of places require it anymore but it's pretty cool that they do it this way I've seen very few failures making motor connections like this one of the Europeans still do this okay so that's the connection there it's three wires brought together with a nut and bolt you know get your serrated washer under there you got a nofa locks in between the on the heads of all those connectors now we're going to just take a length of runners Cambridge and literally this stuff cannot be torn it's like taking some some of that packing tape and saying here turn me off a piece of that the fiber strapping tape and what you're doing is you provided some abrasion resistance to this connection here just by giving it a layer of varnished cambric and it sticks to itself it's conformable but you never want to leave just this but this gives us some good puncture resistance now we're gonna follow it up with some rubber splicing tape and seal the connection we're going to start from the bottom bring all three of our wires together tight we're gonna wrap on the way up I can see why people hated these connections but a lot of them you were electricians these days never even saw saw this connection ever and you want to get a few wraps over the top this way to give that in some some good insulation so you've started from the bottom and you've worked your way towards the top and you've given it a few very nice wraps and now we're going to work our way back down to the bottom you can borrow all three wires together very tightly we're gonna cut and now we're gonna seal so I've been one continuous wrap I've gone all the way up to the top I made sure I've gone over that top several times to give me good insulation there and then I wrap doing the same continuous piece I wrapped it all the way back down on the bottom so a double pass tie wrap on the three wires and put you put your dikes on there ready to cut but use that that's leverage to pull pull your tie wrap tight cut that connection there no air can get in it's got no flux in there so I can't corrode and it's a nut and bolted connection we don't have any worries about that coming apart the only thing you could ever fail inside this connection is actually the crimp of the actual ring terminal but that's the old-school way of wire motors so I'm gonna finish up these other connections here and I get this buttoned up I just wanted to show you how to do nothing bolt connections in a peckerhead I've never demonstrated that on the channel so let me finish this up and I'll bring you back okay well we've got our connections made we're ready to drop all this into the peckerhead nothing left is the ground in we're just gonna put a fork terminal on that and hit that ground screws as a ground screw down inside the figurehead do you know if I took the cap off so no flux again just wipe it in best crimpers in the world or your Klein linesman's without stake on on the side what makes them so special and I can't even get the lens in there to look at it you could probably see the double hump in there I'm gonna see if I can get this on there and show you what it looks like after that's being cramped load your tool as so with the stake at the top or the brake is drop your wire in took on the other side make sure your wires flush as so and you got massive amounts of leverage with these things I'm gonna try to show you what kind of crimp that makes me zoom you guys in a little bit here hoping you can see that double crimp on there cameras kind of blowing out but it's all the connection that's no flux hand crimper ready to ground now what you'll pull that wire in half before that clinton comes loose all right so we're ready to hold all this up and put this back in the Packer head and cover this up then we're ready to do some of our field wiring for the for the rest of the RPC okay so we've got our internal wiring done it's red to red black to black and then over there blue is our generated phase of someone coming off the idler and then we're going up here to this receptacle that was already installed within the unit and this is just number 10 th h n stranded available at any home supply store all right so that's the internals of it I'm gonna leave it open until we make sure we got our phases right let's talk about the power supply the power supply I'm plugged into a 240 volt single-phase I've got number 10 wires running over to this receptacle but at the other end I've only got a 20 amp breaker and this is only a 20 amp rated reset so I'm due for an upgrade at both ends the wire that's in there is already adequate for the larger breaker and the larger receptacle but I need to change out this receptacle this cord end and then the breaker over it over at the piano and then I'll have a full 30 amp circuit feeding this thing but see we got here off run and start I guess it starts momentary and they give us a light I'm guessing that's gonna light up when our capacitor is charging and starting the motor this motor we don't care if it runs for her to backwards it's gonna make that third phase matter what which way you spin it so I don't really think we care which way that thing spins what we don't know is if we have our surface grinder phase correctly what have I got a 50-50 chance let's fire this off okay Sara light went out so our capacitor charge discharge started the motor and now we're up and running well we're gonna know which way by which way that spindles turning on I was just gonna manual first piece of paper bottom of our wheels should be going that way which it is you see of pushing it over that way I feel the wind blowing is over here okay we're speeding in the right direction and I know both motors were faced correctly that motor down there that's the hydraulic motor so let's turn on hydraulics and it's some juice flowing all right I heard that thing kick the hydraulics are running I'm just gonna crack this and let it bleed off if I did the flip the air out of the system I can hear it burping backyard and ago ah there you have it and now all I need to do is find a home for the for this phase converter I think this thing's gonna live I'm not gonna let it sit on this side is the dirty side of the grinder I'm probably gonna mount it down down low by that hydraulic unit all righty but Wow even got the phase go on the right way let's button this up okay guys well that's the end result of the rotary phase converter for a 20 use this is one phase converter one machine this is not feeding inside our shop so good little unit pretty impressed with the detail that went into you know everything they send the kit was very complete and everything fit together nicely and didn't give me any problems we saw the machine running what I was going to talk about real quick seen the amperes poles just a just a shade under a 1 amp I was sitting there idling just like that nothing running any machines or anything but when the machine starts it pulls you know another overall is about four amps or everything between the face converter and then the actual machine running so nothing out of the ordinary you know it's not pulling any monster power but if you have a machine that you don't require speed control on are you supposed to kind of control roofs or any special requirements it's absolutely nothing wrong with going with a rotary phase converter I hope this answers some of your questions I know I've taken a lot of questions over on Facebook and on emails should I go with the phase converter or should I go with VFDs and I always give different answers depending on people's needs maybe you have a mill but you got a variable speed head you don't need speed control the only need using a VFD force generate the third phase get one of those you just don't need to go with the VFD so every situation is different and always look at you know what what you want to do versus what you're going to spend on a rotary or what you're going to spend on pretty good control package and rewiring a machine for a VFD but if you are interested in our rotary phase converter contact the guys over american rotary tell marzi sent ya all right we'll talk we'll talk to you guys later thanks for watching you

Channel: Shadon HKW

Views: 44,572

Rating: 4.8686132 out of 5

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Id: jh7v71uehH4

Length: 31min 13sec (1873 seconds)

Published: Wed Jun 15 2016