Ricky Gervais & Russell Brand: God VS Atheism - Full Episode

hello I'm Russell Brand this episode of under the skin from luminary media is free and it's fantastic it's got Ricky Gervais Seng it Ricky Gervais one of the best comedy stars the world's ever known I think it's safe to say who's up there with you Chaplin's your Cleese is your Coogan's they're all British comedians whose name start with C that's what I'm interested in you cooks your Hancock's ricky device outspoken host of the globe's creator of extras the office after life season 2 of which is on Netflix now and is they because of him promoting that is even come on our podcast this is for you for nothing but if you want to sign up and get all of the episodes of under the skin which let me tell you a worth it as well as all the other fantastic content that's on that platform podcast from Carrillo mo from queer I know content from Lena Duncan get down then no one's making you stay you're not a hostage I'd say this is a fantastic episode of under the skin I'm very proud of it it's a brilliant conversation with Ricky Gervais it's a joy to talk to him he and me and him as we discussed see the world somewhat differently although we've got loads of things in common we talk about God I fee ISM animals love class fantastic stuff you'll really really enjoy it if you want to get luminarie if this episode indicates to you that these are the kind of conversations you might be into then you can get it for as little as $2.99 I've done with well other podcasters like on the platform like Lena Dunham and Kurama but also David Eagleman Neil deGrasse Tyson Brian Cox Yanni's fara Farkas I mean there's like brilliant intellectual conversation Naomi Klein I mean it's just like dr. Shefali last week's I mean I really think they're valuable conversations but this one for nothing with Ricky is it's especially good as you would imagine from Ricky Gervais and let me reiterate after life which I've watched is on Netflix now and is fantastic check out hello mate it's so lovely to see you look at you all grown up I've become an adult one believed you're not sat there in a sheet that was a deal breaker I said I wanted to conform to Western ways just for one hour I didn't even need to have that explicitly explained to me I saw intuitive it might not be wise to interview you in a sheet and why is it 1:00 p.m. I mean that is bang-on Supes news hour for me and then a little nap right so now that's what the super half from 12 gobbled that down it was very hot and my mouth is postponed until 2 p.m. so this is to some of the hardship that I've been going through during the gruelling tale even to sit and listen to Ricky that kind of suffering it's like they're Gulag Archipelago listening to some of that stuff yeah because I do like I've been doing a podcast for ages so we put one in the garage like a little podcast studio you're an outlier a pioneer and an extremist in fact just like Hancock's rebel there's no there's no question you're in that lineage no question should we do this little should we do this little if you start officially I'll start with like a compliment to put you at your ease it's really lovely to interview you can say that you're at too quickly Safa Coburn and anxiety have similar symptoms yes lovely to have a proper interview of you we've met a few times I've never been able to speak to you at depth but like anyone I've my year as a comedian very very much and I still like what like a lot of your stuff like you know maybe even just when you're doing Facebook lives but also like I still watch the office some watch after life checking out the new series which is what you're promoting at the moment doing these like podcasts and that and it's a real joy to talk to you Ricky thank you same-same pleasure thanks me and I suppose like yes you are a guest you are a guest and innocence is proportionate to our BAFTA backdrops endless masks I've got a drape and all that but this is this is my desk I'm at my desk the mic this is the smallest room in the house because I thought the echo would because the other words of this isn't this isn't like cribs where I hired them I was watching I was watching her oh I remember I remember a good many of them then for I don't know what that boy is like this a wild boy I guess that's some sort of writing guild or is it simply in a minute i that was auctioned for cherry and I gave so generously that reminds me what a great person I am it's good to have a memento of your own greatness those with less abstract accolades good live prey near where you're from me I like I saw a seeing sort of like and you're from reading and of course and then like yeah yeah he said obviously lovely around there do you live near here and we've got a little place quite near you but my main I mean I mean I'm mostly leafy Hampstead yeah where people like you you aren't allowed if I'm being honest I was there briefly for a while I lived on garden or Road at what I might call the high of my decadence yeah near flasks walk and well we used to visit this place you know before we lived we live in the center ever since or college and explaining to Americans were Hampstead is like I say it's it's sort of bohemian and eclectic and it's the sort of great-great-grandchildren of artists and poets and me new-money I I always feel that it was like The Beverly Hillbillies when I rolled into town and I think I think I think from similar sort of backgrounds where we moved where he moved up to be able to live next door took to wealthy people so I still I still feel when I walk into the ivy there's a certain amount of disappointment on people's faces yeah it's incredible actually and they're like it's sort of a very clear in your humor that you have that kind of background I remember watching Martin Freeman on something once saying that you were the first person to admit that had a sense of humor that made him laugh like people at school and I remember when he's when you used to do on stuff on 11 o'clock show and you talked about like I remember in particular one time when you talked about the apocryphal oft told tale of someone wanking and then opening their eyes and having a cup of tea there and I guess this was probably 20 years ago I remember watching that thinking ah that's funny man that's funny and I suppose and you've how how have you maintained and do you think you've maintained that kind of access to normality and that kind of brittle spiky working-class human now that you are in sconce t' on the hill well i think i think i have in in many ways and obviously all my family still live around reading Wokingham fat young men you know and they're what you call a working class they're all manual workers or carers and and then there's a there's 50 I've encountered them so great nieces and nephews that you know and so there's there's that we you're always connected to your family you always you always feel at home with your family you know so there's best that I do it I sort of do it quite consciously try and remember my roots because as the comedian and observationally I thought would do as well I think because we're court jesters we have to be court jester you have to have low status we're in the mud with all the other peasants teas in the King not too much because we don't want to get killed but we have to keep a low state as somehow I think I feel I want to and and I do that in two ways and you do this as well and one I am fighting behind the curtain I go what you think it's great being rich and famous well this is what I said in front of the Queen this is the first time I've got a private jet they thought I was the cook so I so I do that I give them the horror stories where I was the putz I was the wrong person I shouldn't have been there hmm I tell them that and I the other way I do is I talk about things where they're better off than me I talk about being fat and old and balding and gin I mean so I'm gonna die soon and so you do have to particularly when people know what top comedians earn now it's like and I sort of embraced that as well I tease them I like I did you know talking about with my house and wealth in an ironic way and they get that as well and I'm sort of saying listen this is luck I you know I mean listen I don't think I deserve this but I think people get it as long as you're honest it would it would well if I see a millionaire comedian going either way either side of that like talking down to an audience everything's or is a whole story that made one or you know they're all they're already on stage they're already inexpensive so or ever and and now they're telling the audience that they're wrong again I do that ironically but they get it like a mane I call them scum and they they know they get that I'm saying the opposite um but uh it would be pretty stupid when I see millionaire comedians going so I was flying on yesterday and I was on the tours on the bus no you weren't you know but I usually go the other way like them I typically oh I did in humanity was some press they always ask you know wealthy entertainers how much is a pint of milk um - that's meant to show you on you and I then I say I don't know I haven't checked but the next time someone asked me I said I don't know maybe is a grand so I sort of embrace my privilege um for comic effect I think the first thing that most of us know you for it couldn't be a clearer exemplification of authenticity the office whether it's the way it was shot the way that it was scripted - they're kind of a cute observation of normality and mundanity said like so from the outset there is an authenticity to your work with something that more recent like afterlife which I watched as I was instructed to or first couple is brilliant it's you know it's perfect someone told me you've got watching I watched a one-and-a-half J I mean and like I'm like okay it's I've loved the first series I think there's great people in it I love Roshan I love that woman Joe that's any I think it's a really brilliant cast I love her that's off of Charlie Brooker staff as well she's wicked obviously you're great and like what are you do you have the same level of authenticity and sort of I don't know candor when you're making something like that and if so where you getting this stuff about suicide and despair for it's it's it's thought the only thing I care about now more and more every day I wake up and I saw Bob is this is this honest man is this more true forever I like I'm peeling away these layers have been you know he's dead and you mad because I don't feel that I want to be more famous or rich or win more awards I feel that am I being am I using my platform to its greatest effect now I would be more honest am I getting everything off my chest before I die am I am I really do I really mean this I can only do things that I'm passionate about cuz you'll get caught out so the answer is yes and um the the office I suppose realism was sort of fortuitous or by accident or whatever and because I worked in an office of 10 years so it was harder for me to get it wrong you know I mean mr. direct I'll go with that would not but that didn't that but that would so that was easy I was also emulating something oh it was a it was a fake doc you saw and I watched a lot of those through the night is where an ordinary person got their 15 minutes of fame and you know was it interesting just being at work so that was the influences so it was easy it was easy to make it real and you know leahy you find out that we probably cheated less than real documentaries particularly by today's standards we wouldn't have a camera waiting for someone we wouldn't get them caught doing something and it was a really elaborate spy or they forgot their mic was on so um I've always been obsessed with with realism all of my favourite things were real even even to the point that and uh uh first time I saw a Mike Lee thing I'm sort of I don't know so important I just thought this is I've never seen this before people talking over each other and it wasn't even intimated was a you know a shoddy old play shop with a few cameras it wasn't even as good as he it became and even in the even another girl spy which I thought and I still think is genius there's one bit that made me feel guilty so when he says and it's a great jump it's a great joke um no sir Shakespeare complete works of Shakespeare never bound and they go he's showing off he goes of course you couldn't read that sort of thing and I thought oh well that's just not be joke because you know what most people don't and that's and it's not is that only is he taking the piss out of my try to trying to better themselves but not quite get it right and there was still a little flitter of okay okay so when I came to do it myself I wanted I did want to embrace that that that sort of honest working class they were know I'm more in a mix I like Billy Connolly I just thought I wanted to be like him but he spoke to his crowd like you do to a mate down the pub and um and I remember when I first had to meet with the channel 4 about the show before the office when they'd done the 11 o'clock show and and the big thing there was some crisp Morrison brass tie which I thought I still think is amazing but it's also very sort of it's very sort of gardening isn't it it's not like you do not I mean it's but the people who love it and I thought I wanna I want to mix that sort of comedy and that sort of I suppose pursuit of excellence and intellect but make it sort of accessible and so I remember I turned that I want to do I was talking to someone and I said I sort of want to bring that to the working classes which sounds very patronizing but early dazed but I felt that you know my family didn't watch brass I I felt that I was part of the media loving something did you not I mean yeah I do know what you mean understand the idea of sort of culturally ISM and esotericism and I feel like like you know you obviously have an incredibly refined sense of humor and at the risk of bolstering a compliment that I've already given you that was scarcely reciprocated I feel like you're a genius like in the like proper Hancock clays Coogan kind of lineage and even though your background is sort of marks by ordinariness and ordinariness and the sort of general beauty of the ordinary is obviously something that captivates you there is something I ena in first I think about that kind of insight that you have and I and I would offer also secondarily by becoming very successful and I wonder about how you like what how you've experienced alienation both prior to success and subsequent to it also bearing in mind like you know like prior to your comedy career you know there's stuff with the new romantic-looking 20 year old Ricky Gervais stuff and also remember I did mentions you about suicide and despair earlier so if you can just have an answer that covers all of that territory Jesus wow I don't know if I I don't know I don't know ever suffered from any of those more chronic conditions of I've never I've never really felt that I you know it or I've never suffered from terrible and so I your depression without cause you know I've had grief you know loved ones died and all that growing up I just I mean I did I didn't know I was poor and working-class till I was 14 15 nothing did I mean we're all in the same boat I went to a confidence in school and I was you know I was I was smart so I was in the top few there I always I always felt I go to university I just that jammy I never felt everything's out of my reach I never thought it won't happen to him which is odd I don't know why I had that confidence maybe I didn't maybe I'm remembering it well maybe it was bravado or maybe I just thought that's the only way to do it academia it's so funny because you know 500 years ago to move through a class you know you had to be a great warrior and you know might get an idea but that was very very dangerous then the industrialist start you know finding cold and old you know prospectors when I found gold and they moved up and they moved into neighborhoods like mine and you know they became wealthier than the wealthy but in our sort of lifetime I suppose the last group to do it were was pop pop culture you know it's footballers and pop stars where you know you certainly heard working-class from regional accents and they were in mansion houses and driving Rolls Royces into pools which I'm sure you've done but I never would I go that's a way to public let's get you and so we can fix this so I'm sort of aware of all those things but I never I never felt it I was never conscious of it you know I suppose the first time I went for an interview at university that's when I heard people who sounded a bit like the Queen and I hadn't heard that accent it might you know my teachers were working-class is like everything they were working tell us they were lads you know comprehensive scoring reading and so that's when I you started mixing with and people you know different in class and wealth and and I remember meeting someone he didn't know a supermarket was and I thought he was winding me up I thought he was winding me up and I guess dice played no because I'm my first dear I gave myself a skin it and I love the fact that I was ID'd going into the college and I could show my so I I definitely bet I know I remember I wore my dad's old Lang donkey jacket in oh yeah oh yeah yeah yeah oh hi guys I'm working class I'm one of the 6% well I guess I was talking about like you've sort of explained didn't feel alienated but like but you also don't seems like you you wore literally your class as a badge and didn't feel inferiority and like I suppose like you know character like David Brin like who's like under all this sort of excruciating social pressure and wants to better himself on camera right through to the protagonist in afterlife dealing with despair like it's like in your like and and of course your obsession with authenticity I wonder where in your own life is something that's very private to you feelings of what kind well because it does go into your art but sometimes you know I'm very keen for people to know that they they they shouldn't use that region oak as a window to the soul of the comedian because sometimes are I'll make a joke or a routine that is the opposite of what I feel because it makes the joke better and I'm militant about people going listen it's dumb puns it's jut it really is just a joke and sometimes it's the opposite what I believe I start with my my super nature so I I do a sort of a an off-color joke they all all they've grown and I go that was irony you see because that's when I say something I don't really mean and you as an audience laugh at the wrong thing because you know what the right thing is it's a waiter and I saw and they get it and they call back that sometimes I don't know don't let me down now what we said so I'm playing with those those those constraints and misunderstandings but um your first point is the David Ben and he was saw on I was fascinated that that please did a little bit with with Foley towers where you know it was he was he was so lower middle class and you know he wanted to his aspiration was Buckingham Palace whereas by the time I'm not going to do in the office the new aspiration was backing on Palace it was that sort of level you know I mean I want to be on telly or whatever cut I want to be on telly I want to be famous and it was just creeping in there and it was a very important part of the office without it being a fake documentary that is a very boring average sitcom there's some jokes there's some great reports but if you don't know why this man is acting like that you've lost 50% of what's funny and tragic about that in here you're right he's trying to move just like Basil Fawlty he's trying to move right but he's doing it for the same reasons right and you all this [ __ ] man I want this we need that we have to do that sir it all comes down to one thing right it's being happy it's being happy with yourself and having and there and then what's been happening with asbestos how many boxes to the tick and the one people forget is worth its thought it's absolutely massive it's worth and um so all those things were into David Brent but he basically needed a hug and I remember in the days when you were in every paper and doing every interview of clay you use someone said what's your favorite thing on and you said them the office and there was a picture David Ben and you talk about they've been and you said it's beautiful it felt and it is and by the and I'm when the first times I read that someone is that and because he needs a hug that's all that's all he's doing is he's saying am I good enough do you love me yet and it's [ __ ] tragic and when you know that I think you liked I think you liked him yeah yeah he always did then my favorite lines I like that I was thinking about it recently that that's not good news and bad news that's good news and irrelevant news that's not a phrase though is it ism is mediocre now they know we have leaders saying things like that the bad news is at the pandemic the good news is I'm up three in the polls really and it just got worse and worse I had to really up my game and for life on the road because it been 15 years and now David Brent wasn't even that old Abed do you not I mean people on the apprentice to who say I will destroy anyone who stands in my way that is like an unwritten law with the producers going let me on an arbitrary 400 fail Big Brother contestants get let me in there and our us powerful intent McLaws off okay promise me he'll again with this this this obsession with seeing normal people destroy themselves some of them some of I don't know how some of them passed the medical exam because some of them they shouldn't be in there and it's not good for them no this thing my people keep going back to fine going do you love me yet no they don't love you they want you to fail it's anyway here's a kind of like there's been a glorification of idiocy in culture and it seems like that's something that still annoys you that that's of a celebration of stupidity and it seems like a lot of what you're saying it like is that you're very a grounded person like you said like you know my role is a jester I don't want to get on my box so you know you can tease the King but don't start like you know trying to grab the crown or anything yeah but like I'm what about like how what is um see with the there's two areas I want to talk to about one your deep deep love of animals and to your obvious very public and articular atheism and I'll talk about us see those things as correlative you know as opposed as we as we go on about it but like him firstly have you always been like that with the animals yeah well that's yeah I mean I don't remember not loving animals I mean you know I was born into a family with them with pets and it was all I remember when I was when I was a kid my brother was 10 years older than me and he got in trouble right for punching a bloke in the park and when my oh my mom wanted of us really was to not just to go to jail or die in a barroom fight you know I mean that was wasn't international comedian just don't die before baby you know and um and so he must have been the it was he was mad though and she went why'd you punch him for and he went he kicked the dog and my mum went alright I remember five six seven years old I'm just out in the garden all the time just look I just I was fascinated with the world I want to know everything about the world what what where did this um animal evolved from what's worst he can I just might uh I wanted it all I mean I suppose learning was my first love but science and nature I've always been fascinated with it I still AM um it's always been a privilege it makes me feel good I don't know why an animal makes me I mean or an animal you know and even down to you know when a cat died recently but it was like if that cat was sat on me it's doctor by we gonna try as much as you can it was still a privilege that Kant wanted to sit on me I think what pretty and I can't stress enough that we're and I know you totally agree with this but we're just part of nature we're not about that we're with nothing special we're not as important as bees we're not as important as bees well it let's just let her think so yeah I absolutely love my being hey all everything about you know preservation and nature and this species and that species is still animal croaking I don't get it I don't know why I don't know the pleasure I'm worried about the psychology of people who you know and as it is a scale obviously there's a weird scale from sort of serial killer to people who just don't think they're they're worth worrying about that much you know um but yeah I've never I've known it keeps your waist the only thing that makes my blood boil and keeps me awake at night you know and now we've got Twitter and you do what you can yeah it's not a day go by when someone doesn't send me something I go off which wasn't in my head but it is so I've got to do someone now you know yeah yeah I suppose there must be like people that don't well and people that are capable of being cruel to animals it seems I would guess there's a kind of rupture between that person and this of knowledge of us all sort of feeling pain a kind of a sort of an impeded compassion or something again inability to feel there's something wrong with somebody who actually enjoys seeing an animal in pain I mean that is that's one end of the scale you know but then there's people in denial you know there's people there's lots of propaganda out there white so okay why I you know my all findings okay and because it's a it's an honorable way for them all to die shut up because it's tradition well so was slavery and child sacrifice is that it coaches the culture right it's like what I don't get it I don't I don't get it and the things that then you find out the things behind there like this [ __ ] secret with a sword right they've already jumped the [ __ ] ball they cut them contenders on the back of his neck they [ __ ] blunt that let's keep it safe a cinnamon honestly why he's done this to me why are you straight yeah I don't get it I reckon a lot of them the problems that were experienced in the world like right across the scope of our conversation so far whether it's people craving fame adulation celebrity approval or people being cruel to animals I reckon imagine it can be derived from a sense of being separate from nature whether that's inner nature or outer nature like that people see themselves as isolated alienated individuals that they're making their own luck in the world and live soft in a world extracted from meaning or the devoid of meaning and this is where I'm I suppose I'm interested in the way that you I know because I've listened to your staff like that your wife isn't began when you sort of saw your mum like don't say that to your brother when you've got a kid about like you know as if like and that Jesus was a kind of babies and additional babysitter and omnipresent sort of you know nanny of the estate but like but but like cause it like I spend a lot cuz see I spend a lot of time I suppose I'm solipsistic narcissistic person you know have been through the mill with addiction with Fame and sex and drugs and money and all that kind of stuff and it's placed me in a point where I've had to open myself up to different ideas I imagine if you and I talked about institutional or Orthodox religion and the way that it is structured and the way that power was deployed prejudice enacted violence and the written I reckon we'd probably agree but one of the things that I feel is that that my own love of animals and also my cat did died last week sadly it was also six days journey told and it like I was so affected by it as were more of surprised by the amount of grief and sadness I felt like it took me a part let it hit me full-on we bury earning the then I thought AHA what got into it there was only one self-indulgent bit everything was sincere except for one moment Ricky I did smear soil on my face as a sort of expression of deep grief that's why I needed to do that's that's just and I think well the way you're going is that I seem a spiritual person but not literally in that - Toby - I'm in as much or as seeing a tree or a mountain or a bird or a river as anyone who thinks God made it I I mean I I see the beauty of nature and I think most and I don't I don't know miss it but you're right there's a huge difference between spirituality there's something to the self that gets you through that you that you wanna you wanna know the reason you want to connect all those things I filled all those things with without the belief in a god or goddess religion something else religion religion basically says you want to get into heaven I know I know him you just got do this [ __ ] for me no we called you know in the week we know that the everything whatever started was was was written by usually a man with an agenda in there it's like it's no coincidence all those rules in the Old Testament sort of favor certain men in the it's not a coincidence you know and and the same with you know it's a it's no coincidence that if you're born in America you're probably Christian if you're born in India probably a Hindu etc except do we know that but if we talking about spirituality and I'm all for it it's never bothered me it's never someone belief in God it's never bothered me it's what do you do with it if you start saying to me I know um I love this prophet or that prophet and okay fine yeah and I do this and I believe I'm great yeah put it and I think we should throw homosexuals off buildings well now I now we've got to talk now we've got a job just you know so it's when there's suddenly an agenda that coincidentally favors the person you know it's when people have exactly luckily God agrees with them yeah yeah and them and I think it was started with good intentions in the acquaintance of lying when my character invents religion he does it because he can't stand his mum's fear of death and and I remember when my mom was dying if she asked me I was thinking I was gonna liars forget it probably is because it's a you know I'm probably with it so um I think people there's so many myths about atheism we can go into the the definitions and all that but I think it's worse people think that atheists run into churches and ruin people's days you know it's all bollocks nothing the truth it was asked me they've been the church I've got a chair yeah it's lovely buildings I love them but what do you mean you know it's this I don't know where it comes from and also technically atheism doesn't even mean you you don't believe in God it means that it's sorry you believe there's no God it means that you just haven't found God yeah you know there's no evidence it's true bids you know tour and I've explained this many times that technically I'm an agnostic atheist because what deals with knowledge and one deals with belief so no one knows if we agree that that no one knows we're all atheists so now what do you think and believers say I think there is a God and I just think I don't think there is a God because I haven't got any evidence yet so that is all is all I'm saying as you say religions something else to believe in spirituality and you know and people even second me and if someone proved there was a God would you believe Korso would and wouldn't even be belief it would be knowledge you know it would also be the greatest discovery ever forget this cancel the Nobel saw and from now on he's discovered God that's it's done and I think you know um and that would change everything I think but until we know I just don't I don't want to live my life by a belief in something but I have no evidence in that's all that's that's all I'm saying and I sometimes say to people that you know I'm a good Christian or a good real good to you or ever is someone who does all the good bits in their holy book and ignores the bad bits and I say if you already know right from mom you don't need the book and and and you know you have to cherry-pick and we know that the bad believe was the ones that do the bad bit too you know so for me it it's it is personal I just happen not to believe in God I used to but now I've thought about it and I I feel I don't need a God um but the thing that I really object to is people assuming that you can't be a good person if you don't believe in a God which which is proved over and over again and live tweeting things like um there are good ideas and bad atheists there are good Christians and bad Christians and the God has never changed that and all I'm saying is I get it it doesn't this is not mica it works both ways you shouldn't judge people by the beliefs you should judge them by their actual behavior you know right and wrong you know some people believe the right thing but don't do the right thing and vice versa and I just think I feel I don't need it I just don't need a structured guidebook outside uh you know my own morality and morality is relative and not absolute you'd have to keep dogma is the problem I think dogma is the real problem and it's not just in religion anymore it's creeping into everything it's creeping into politics and it's creeping no identity politics is creeping into just social structures and opinions it's it's you know if anyone says to me this is what shouldn't be questioned [ __ ] them no that's um no no less question best of best back to a poll know what don't wait oh I was not teaching someone said that I'll always even a board game I think what the rules can I yeah I've gone on a sort of like the opposite journey and I feel like I started off atheistic just the same way that I would reject any attempt to impose regulation or control on me for the purposes of domination and but I've you know gone through my own stuff with you know addiction and mental health or whatever it is and and like I know that you're very like you know that for example afterlife is about legitimate grief as opposed to some kind of abstract idea of mental illness brought about by a hormonal or neurological balance but myself my own sense of despair particularly looking at it from a perspective of mental health issues in addiction is that there is an unaddressed yearning for a kind of oneness together nurse and I've been like you noticed your point earlier about Brynn indeed for love and when like you talk about that sense of awe of like the appreciation of an animal the love of an animal when the sort of regard and gratitude for having an animal love you and care for you or the beauty of nature or the deep deep beauty of the cosmos what I feel like in my own appreciation understanding stroke belief in God is is that there is a kind of in the love of it in the awareness of rightness itself there was an indication that there is such a thing as rightness not that there any one particular group or ideology has unique but a particular and special access to it and and I really firmly deeply believe that spirituality is for me not for me to tell other people oh yeah I don't reckon you should be gay or are they reckon you should be allowed to they'll I feel like it's ID imaginable in the Bible it says you should pray secretly no one's oh yeah yeah like there is something so deeply private about it I also think Ricky that there is a social consequence - I don't necessarily want to say a few because I completely agree with your point that there's good and bad you know in like beyond those kind of limited taxonomy but like I do feel like when people think there's no purpose or meaning that and that needn't necessarily be just because of a belief in God that it creates cultures that are oddly materialistic nihilistic and I feel that in the last 20 years we're seeing more and more worship of self worship of individual of course there's a new narcissism of course and that in and I don't know why I think social media is this party's brain I think people being rewarded for bad behavior is partly to blame you know magazines or TV or whatever and I did a speech in the Big Brother house as Andy Millman in extras and again that was that was at the beginning of it and and now it's got worse but um a couple of points I do think there's a people crave of oneness and understanding about why are we here because again that's very human word quiz if we want to know why when the arts are why and something we don't accept but we don't know yet but we're on the way they don't they know well they understood the gaps we understand that what if I'd if you don't know it's funny God did it okay that's really so when if they even dance that I've put a joke in after like where cats bothering me and she says that how it all come from someone from nothing and I will wear it all compliment God made okay where did God come from she went he's always been around I don't see them bless that in it so you know it doesn't answer the question but I get it and I think I think a part of people want in there to be some sort of divine justice because you know that'd be great good people would be rewarding bad people will be punished brilliant okay it doesn't work like that you know he only has to look at um you know children Africa being born with cancer and you know we know that's not we know mysterious ways is an explanation okay that that to me is someone who doesn't know the answer and says mysterious ways but apart from that you're right we're seeking the answer why are we here and I think we think that hold on well it is too good it's too good to be chances everything's perfect well it seems that way you know it's like Douglas Adams puddle you know when it imagines this Islip this hot more perfectly and but I think you're right where we are scared Malone and we did the idea of datas is horrible what you'll never exist again what was the point and again I don't talk about this in an afterlife one where I am Cass saying that if you know there's no heaven won't you kill yourself and I say so if you're watching a really good film but you know it's gonna end you might as well just stop it should know because I'm not watching today again and I say I can ask the amazing thing about mine we can't watch it again you know one day your hug you know your your mum for the last time just smell your lost ground you'll eat your last meal you over know is your last but it will be relax and so you've got to make the most of everything and it is the terror about a fine prospect it is kinda sad that you will never exist again I think but it doesn't mean it's not true you know the bottom line is I can't believe something I don't believe and so how do I find meaning well we are here we are here the chances of us being us you being you and me being me existing now that's firm in that a is 400 trillion to one you know we're not special what we are lucky we do exist it's incredible and I think of it it's a holiday we don't exist the thirteen and a half billion years then we we we explode into this mass this electronic blob of for introspection love hate fear beauty horror for eighty ninety hundred years if we're lucky then we die and we never exist again we would turn our homes return and it carries on right and that's not scary because I think people are scared of death because they don't know what's beyond and someone said to me what do you what do you think it feels like when you die and I say like the thirteen and a half billion years before I was born and that was the right hmm so but we but the big thing is injecting mean and I think you're totally right I think that totally right when you start thinking about it why are you here well I'm not even the hell but why well to live your life to the fullest and not and not hurt anyone to leave the world in a better place than it was when you came into it to to experience everything all the reasons all the obvious reasons you know love why dogs learning and all these great things that you can do every minute of every day you're alive and then you then you check out you know I've done thanks and it's and it's done that it's beautiful it's [ __ ] beautiful it is beautiful but I struck when you sit that by a few things one is like this of like the injection of meaning as um you know like meaning would have to be imported externally fabricated somehow invented whereas I think on some level I feel that there is that meaning is in here and that the the meaning is in the kind of zeal that you have when you describe the things that give you love pleasure you know connections whether it's wine or dogs or whatever I I've had like some experiences like through meditation and when I took drugs to young and now so I'm now I'm not allowed to do ayahuasca or LSD or than things I definitely be doing if I wasn't in recovery but I had like those of these experiences that were a kind of I would say of an evaporation of self and yet a continued awareness I know that my consciousness is connected to my biology but I have a sense somewhat derived from the sort of the fact that you know you can't trace how the mechanical parts ever become conscious that consciousness may be elemental somehow now that like that doesn't point to a god in a traditional patriarchal or domineering sense but it so points to an an element is very difficult to quantify whether that's the deep intelligence of nature the deep mathematics of biochemistry and biology biology and the essential mystery of consciousness itself you know commonly referred to as the the hard problem and through these sort of individual experiences whilst I've not had anything that you would call typically religious Jesus emerging out of a Talon or Ganesh lashing around or any of that sort of stuff what I've had is like well it is highly bloody interpretive because there is this one breath thing I do breathe you breathe from the abdomen very aggressively and then you took take a sharp inhale and you normally you merely well a medical man would say what you're doing there is hyperventilating and merely passing out but from the inside what it feels like is bloody hell for this moment I am aware and I am not me what is this what is this is there a possibility that my awareness your awareness the awareness of all animals and and an awareness that's impossible to read is somehow present in all nature in all matter and if that's true then there's a kind of a real a genuine cohesion and togetherness between all of the beings of the earth and beyond and like most people that can't actually enjoy the lives that we are privileged to have of the red wine or the dogs or whatever like I'm not saying that's some sort of comfort to them but in fact those of us that are in privileged position might feel newly incentivized to work towards a different kind of society in system that is more reflective of those values now that doesn't necessarily require monotheism panthéon ism or any of those things but it is somewhat under written by a kind of a sameness and a oneness and how that might relate to justice and also there is a sort of a a personal experience of mystery in it I wonder what you feel about that and if you're curious about psychedelics and that and always thanks for that well you know I love a little bit mystery and you're right it is a mystery science all science it does is it's a discipline that follows the evidence and what science keeps saying and some people say this is the floor but it's been wrong before science never been wrong for interpretation scientists would not for you know it science is just a way to look and understand the physical universe and what science says it keeps saying okay this is the least wrong theory we've got so far and then the next day it goes okay we even less wrong today we were we were less wrong today you know they've mapped the beginning of the universe to to a fraction of a second which is pretty close but so I think citement keeps proving itself and over and over again and and the fact that we don't understand you know the mind-body problem completely yet and that is the beauty and the more we understand the more questions it throws up it's like um you know people say the missing link there's this fossil and is this fossil and we find that one and people but no there's two missing links so you can't win you know and all science we do is just keep filling the gaps and finding and finding new gaps um but yeah you're right you know I think that it's amazing what intelligence is what you know I'm a determinist which changes nothing I believe that free will is an illusion so Mir if it feels like it it might as well be but did they do analyze it and go well we're we're machines we are we are machine we machines and weird machines trying to understand ourselves and that's hard well well then one day be a computer the is suffering from anxiety I reckon so hmm I reckon so I reckon there be a genius computer that's worried about you I really do yeah that's weird loves to meet with with chimps with brains the size of a planning course we go mad and try and kill each other and worry about what's the point course we do is it's overwhelming and the more you think about it the more frightening it is so well it I just think that you know my new my new show super nature I start with saying it's called super nature for two reasons one I want to debunk the supernatural I don't believe in anything supernatural I think that anything that they exist is by definition part of nature and is explained or it's not now then eventually and also super nature because nature is super enough we don't need angels in unicorns we've got the [ __ ] octopus and they're not going to you know we don't we don't need to look I feel we don't need to look elsewhere that doesn't mean I'm not in awe of poetry intelligence and you know I just don't think that unweaving the rainbow spoils it I think it makes it more entertaining when let's see when I see a card trick and I don't know how it's done and then the magician tells me I can't wait for him to show someone else who doesn't know how it's done and how it's done this more exciting for me just did deny me yes yes I do and and I also saw don't believe in magic you know about that kind of stuff I but what one of the things I spoke to Neil deGrasse Tyson about was yeah that dude he's amazing is he like I spoke to him about this sort of physics all bets are off we can we can talk like - a blue in the face and then quantum physics comes along and there's that saying if you think you understand quantum physics you don't understand quantum physics it's magic in my quantum physics by all our definitions of science and nature right and we're intelligent people we've read of it we think right we've got a good brain we got good a brain is anyone but quantum physics it's mental yes yes it sort of seems that what I like that came up in our conversation and I sort of used it to illustrate my feeling that the limitations of our senses and the limitate and alq and the limitations of our capacity to handle knowledge mean that there will always be a realm beyond knowledge that all scientific disciplines are contingent upon application of existing senses microscopic telescopic even you calculating devices like AI and that the the the the the I reckon I don't see like quantum physics s rule type magic but I do see it as an application of [ __ ] hell there is an intelligence at work just we can't you know that some people say you can't understand it like God can understand its job got God's brain well that is quite a physics to me you know the fact that it's it happens means existing is true and it's scientific but then to ask us to understand it now with the week that's a big ask because it's it's incredible just the uncertainty principle the fact that I want it to be metaphor I want to go we don't literally mean this into place to one oh yeah we do it because the way the time folks right start again right right I've got two potatoes it's because yeah it's it's a bit and usually it's the scale of things that we can't fathom you know but it doesn't mean it's not true and it's true if it's true it's real or it as simple as that for me and and I know that that sounds like that sounds like a linguistic trick for me to get away without actually feeling that I understand it but it doesn't make it not true and that's all I think the fact that I don't understand something doesn't mean it's not understandable I would be so arrogant as to think that cuz I don't understand uhm consciousness and the fact that the university expanding it doesn't mean it's not true so I think I've always got that gown clause I don't have to believe for a being did a different being on a different playing and level made it I don't like that's all I don't it and I think that most people would be satisfied if you sat him down and said all those things do you think God did right he did he just doesn't have a will like you think he does he's just nature yes and I think some people would be happy with that I think yes because will is likes you know as much as I can understand it strongly related to my individual imperatives which are based on survival which are therefore material needs procreate need to fit have phone need to have shell and need to die so will however it might its refract through a culture that no longer requires of me that I seek shell or or find food you know like all are all culture that is coming from this place and I think when we're talking about the absolute whether we're talking about it in sort of materialistic scientific terms or spiritual even religious terms it's not gonna be a something that we can comprehend and understand and I've always used that as a kind of rebuttal to the idea of why do bad things happen because I feel like in this we are on such a narrow bandwidth of all potential realities of all potential understandable forms and and unformed that our notions of good and bad are inhibited we are whether we are beyond that yes well this is a another again I put it in I put in a fly first a bit of a joke where cat says to me and we if you don't believe in God and heaven all that why don't you just go out raping and murdering as much as you want and I say I did which is not at all and that's the scary prospect that some people because they think an absolute marabi they think that there's no point in being good without a God and that's the best of big that's quite a big school of thought that people take that to the nth degree but though you know and my worry is that if you're only not murdering because you think God's watching that's just scary yeah it's the purge you know if that's what stops you murdering then yeah okay yes that's a good way but where the gets you through so yeah I don't believe in absolute right because I think we invented morality so we could be as happy as possible um and you know if there are there are different laws for different times in different species you know the hit that the law of the spider is the same as the law as the human we know that if I'm starving I don't eat my own legs we make we don't bite the head of the afterwards it's a nonsense to try and equate a morality with with nature and and spirituality in religion it is because people got together and decided that the best way to live you know that that's that's a society more than anything and and and morality existed before I had me God in my opinion before any God you know and they they just took the gold raw which I love my love it's not religion that you know do as you would be done by and I think it's turn it's it's it's a really good rule of thumb and it would and if everyone did that the world would instantly be a better place and without without any God interference and the other one that I've come to love my probably my favourite piece from the Bible that everyone's forgotten I see it more and more and last 10-15 years and particularly on social media is let those months - it was without sin cast the first stone and I say yeah fast shut that would shut so many [ __ ] people up and you know despite what people think of me I'm not a very judgmental person in my proper but I go whatever you know what good good luck time you know I always try to see I even try and empathize with what he called bad people I think why do they do that oh I'm always ready to either I'd be a judge going promise you won't do it again you know I wouldn't okay like you're not Annie I really do you know one one bad bear a thousand guilty go free them one is the person you know but we do have to we do have to have these societal laws for the benefit one and and in the irony is that a secular society would defend all rights to religious belief more than any one religion does but it all is saying is let's not make it nor or let's not make super sister-in-law let's not and it's so funny I see it I see that I see the hypocrisy in a so-called Christian country free country who hate the idea of this this fundamentalist faith but they're doing the same it's just that there's a different God they're doing it waves well to be all the same you're the same you think God is on your side and you can you can you know your tribe can rule so yeah you know unlike all religions I treat all religions equally yes and what about secularism is some degree underwritten by economic ideologies and I also saw social systems they in a way behave precisely as religions do in that they inhibit in peace I don't agree with that talk--i salsa here's some sense that we wanna we want to separate church from state that you know you don't you don't base any laws on a particular belief in a particular God or religion you know that that's that's always really saying it's me and you know what in the freest most liberal sense we'll start is it is secular really but some people go to church and that's fine doesn't bother anyone but on on a on a an exam with biology physics and chemistry the answer isn't dot did it that's all that's always say cuter society insist do it this works biology works physics works it works over and over again and it's it's just it's just induction and I would be awesome if you could would you found religion I can I honestly wouldn't I honestly wouldn't bound religion in fact if someone should strike banning someone the right to believe in it whatever God I've marched Owen let them believe in their God its your right to believe in whatever honestly I find that anyone's right to believe in in God goblins which is you know just don't throw homosexuals up buildings and we're fine yes God and good become synonymous in any meaningful ideology that there is a kind of harmony and as best possible fairness and non innovation but it's all it's all I've got you know I've lost the working class thing now so all I've got it is atheism as my oppression there's thirteen countries where I'll be put to death an America we were voted least to trustworthy group along with rapists so I've always been 80 I'm oppressed Russell in that case I'm on your side yeah wicked Ricky we've done our there mate that's a yeah that's what you could go back into your carefully guarded rituals of open whatever else is that hold you together in your godless nihilistic expense well I'm just like to say I'll give you the compliment I'm so it's so lovely to see you well and all grown up not sitting there in a sheet but in real clothes and I couldn't be prouder oh-ho that's lovely thank you mate that's a I will carry that thanks man thank you very much if you enjoyed that conversation go over to luminary podcast calm now and sign up for a week's free trial and listen to the many many fantastic conversations that I've had on this platform Simon am still being but one of them who did we do recently that I was well into David Eagleman absolutely fantastic Oh Frankie Boyle there's just so many brilliant conversations all right lots of love I'm glad you enjoyed it thanks for tuning in

Channel: Russell Brand

Views: 1,882,801

Rating: 4.8886166 out of 5

Keywords: Russell Brand, Brand Russell, BrandThe, Russell Brand video, Russell Brand news, ricky gervais, ricky gervais russell brand, ricky gervais video, ricky gervais podcast, russell brand podcast, russell brand comedy, ricky gervais comedy, under the skin podcast, russel brand, ricky gervais interview, ricky gervais after life, afterlife, atheism, god, religion, comedy, comedy podcast, spirituality

Id: 5Szj5jJeUec

Length: 69min 55sec (4195 seconds)

Published: Sat Apr 25 2020

Reddit Comments

[u/BloodAngelA37]

Russel Brand speaking is a combination of word salad and nails on a chalk board. Hard pass.

[u/lafras-h]

Russell Brand is such a self enlightened condescending prick.