My AWFUL Ultra Orthodox Jewish Life: Julia Haart

I wanted to be good I wanted God to love me I turn it everywhere I look brilliant people intelligent people are following these rules why can't I just fit in why can't I be okay with being silent and subservient everyone else is what's wrong with me [Music] I'm reading a book I love it it's a what a brilliant book can I quote an early thing an early sentence back at you anything I'm literally an open book I have actually an open book so so this is from Brazen and it's very early on and you're right I walked into a world where no one knew me I had no past no shared history I was a zero now I pursue zeros of a very different kind for thousands of women what a great early line that is and with that in mind let's go back to the beginning tell me a little bit about your early days and how how they were a little bit different from from what most I suppose westerners might might have experienced talking in my old I think old Community let's start there okay so I think the easiest way to define the world I lived in is to watch Bridgerton or any of these you know movies or television shows about the 17 and 1800s subtract the ball gowns and the fabulous clothing and you have my life I lived an 18th century existence right women are there to be wives and mothers their intellect is considered inferior to a man's they are supposed to be covered head to toe and modest uh you know in the olden days if a woman slept around or you know was caught you know having an uh you know not being a virgin before she was married that was it she didn't get married her family was shamed and that's my world my world was a world where women and men had completely different roles and were treated very differently in my world when you wake up in the morning as a woman you say a set of prayers uh first one's very beautiful thank you God for giving me life and waking me up on this lovely day and then you say to God thank you for not making me a Slave and thank you for making me as you've chosen a man when he wakes up in the morning he says thank you for giving me life and waking me up and his third prayer is thank you for not making me a woman that's the world I lived in I wasn't a man but I wasn't asleep I was somewhere in between but I had no autonomy I didn't get to choose who I dated how I dated who I loved what I wore what I chose to put on my body where I chose to do with my body what profession I would have my entire life was curled tailed and this and it was you know a minuscule size because it is my responsibility to prevent men from sinning you know what surprised me about your story because I you know you have all these or one has all these ideas of what um either a Hasidic or a Yeshiva or Ultra Orthodox Community might be like but then the history of your parents uh seemed very different because your father was a concert pianist and and a communist in Russia and your mum is like a genius uh with phds in maths and philosophy so how does it go from that and I know because I've read the book but how does it go from that to to what you experienced growing up so it's something it's a question I have you know struggled with my whole life as I write in the book you know it's not a question I can ask my mother because well number one she doesn't speak to me and number two she doesn't like talking about pre-religious life right because that's something shameful that she tries to avoid at all costs our past was not something to ever be discussed in my family so if you can imagine a PhD being something of Shame wow yeah the only explanation I can give for it is that both my parents and especially my mother were brought up on this concept that you need to live for something greater than yourself that your own individual happiness is irrelevant to the greater good that's communism right communism is yes your individual happiness is irrelevant it's the greater good that matters and the more that you have to subsume and control your innate nature the more you uh satisfy your purpose in life of suffering for the greater good so my mother was educated on martyrdom uh you know when I first wanted a divorce from my first husband in my community and I told my parents I want out my and I just my mother asked me why and I said because I'm not happy and she said well who says you have to be happy where in the Torah does it say you need to be happy why do you think you deserve happiness that's the idea and so what did she choose think about communism communism is a religion communism tells you everything you have to do what's right what's wrong right and I I write in my book about the fact that when I was a little bit older and I met this elderly Russian man in New York and he was bemoaning how much he missed Mother Russia when I asked him what he missed he said being told what to do I hate having to make decisions right and so she left a religion communism where there was no self-autonomy and your own self-interest didn't matter and she chose a replacement that had the same set of rules fundamentalist Judaism is very similar to Communism the greater good your own happiness doesn't matter everything is decided for you no self-autonomy and martyrdom in the sake of the larger population she chose a religion that mimicked communism almost down to its core details that's fascinating to think about uh the metaphor of I guess the Communist Russia versus the individuality of of America and then they moved to America um and then it's it's so complex isn't it because I guess they also uh suffered a great deal of anti-Semitism there was this moment in Texas where you wanted to go to a particular school and you weren't able to because you were Jewish so they must have felt even more like we need this sense of community and being away from Russia and and then you move to monsie is it so what's what's Muncie like uh again literally the 1800s right women and baby with babies and baby carriages men who do the you know work look I worked I was a high school teacher but my money was not my own to control I had to ask permission to spend it because again just like in the 1800s a woman she got married the property immediately transferred to her husband I mean this it's it's honestly it's very simple I lived an 18th century existence and was yours uh and this is something I I won't go too far into it this time because I have done before and and I it's obvious it's a very difficult one I mean you've been criticized a bit by the Orthodox Community I've been criticized by some of the Orthodox Community or just some Jewish people who feel um attacked was your experience more extreme or do you think this is typical of of different ultra-orthodox sects well I'm gonna read you something and then I think you can answer the question for yourself [Music] um so when I when the show came out I got a lot of criticism from the Orthodox Community much less so when the book came out because when the book came out what I did because I got criticism on the show is an accompaniment to the book is brazenbook.com the website if you go on there there's a link that takes you to hundreds of footnotes where I prove every word that I said in my book so it's that's why there's almost zero criticism since the book came out you don't really see any the only articles that came out all the criticism came from the show because in the show the show wasn't about my past the show is about my present and it was mere little Snippets of my past so for example I got criticized for saying that I didn't watch movies when they're like oh but you did and then I say yes at the very end I did it took me eight years to plan my escape and in my mid-30s once I decided I wanted to leave that's when I started watching move you know so forth and so on so because the show was just little Snippets and I couldn't prove any of the things I was saying because that's not what the show was about I got criticized when the book came out because of that criticism I said you know what I'm going to fact check and bring proof of every word I say about that community and I did it's hundreds of footnotes hundreds of pages Reams and reams of proof for every law that I cite for everything that I say happened to me it's all there and I'm just going to read one go on um only because I think the biggest criticism I got was that the education I received was wonderful and commensurate with the 21st century and I could have gone to college and plenty of women from my school go to college which is complete nonsense I mean genuine actual nonsense I learned nothing in high school my education is not it was so subpar to the worst Public School in this country um for bio for biology I learned hilcus Russian heart which is laws of proper speech I mean we had a class called biology we had a class called chemistry I never went into a single camp we had an actual chemistry lab we never walked into it we never did anything there I never one stepped for appearances for in case it gets inspected appearances because not just appearances but for government funding right to get government funding you need to have chemistry you need to have biology so they have a chemistry lab that I've never once used I never touched a beaker I never used a droplet I know nothing about chemistry I was taught zero there's a story in your book is now of one of your classmates who wanted to go to college and asked for her records and they wouldn't give them to her and locked the schools that she couldn't go in and get them that's like my daughter couldn't get her transcript I had to go through crazy machinations just to force the school to give my daughter her transcript and the school that finally complied was not the school she went to we had to do this whole craziness where she I had to she had to retake certain tests in in a more modern Orthodox high school so that she could graduate high school and they would send her the transcripts I mean what I had to go through to just get her marks her grades that she earned was Madness so all of that I was called a liar and how wonderful and then they found like there's this one doctor and one lawyer congratulations yes there are two people in my community with degrees that doesn't mean the schools educate you so someone sent me a letter from base Yahoo right it's a system of schools I went to a base Yahoo there's isakovs and Muncie and Brooklyn and every Community religious community has this basic and I want to read you the letter because here's what it says dear parents in the last years it's becoming increasingly prevalent for high school girls to be preparing themselves and working towards a college degree while in high school now this is from 2020 okay so in the last few years so clearly not when I was in high school right in the last few years all of a sudden there's this terrifying Trend that women are trying to go to college now wait now you're going to see what kind of college they're talking about they're not talking about Princeton or Harvard they're talking about online schools or religious colleges where you still learn the same subjects with the same people okay listen to this this is not the reason Claudia Israel Claudia Israel is the Jewish people have established base yaakov schools for Benoist Israel for girls and it is not in line with a base yaakov it is not in line with the basico of Education college is not in line with our education black and white you can see it on the brazenbook.com website it's there this is not my word it is the school itself saying we do not prepare girls to go to college and it continues this is not the reason it's established School Torah education does not mean the subjects they are learning it means that they are connecting and drawing life from One Source only which is Torah can't go to college college is not taught okay base Jacob schooling was established to give arbenosis our young women a direct connection to Torah it was to become the sole source of their learning and connection to life to have them then connect it to college in any form which is an independent Source or should we say an outside source during those years that were set aside for them to draw life from Torah learning only is not to their benefit is detrimental and antithetical to basic of schooling now does that sound like a school that you can go to college from no it sounds completely crazy it sounds completely crazy the fact that college courses and now we're going to Define what kind of college they're talking about they're not talking about girls going to Stanford University going to Stanford right here's the colleges that they describe the fact that the college courses may be Etc these are Jewish courses Bible study Torah law or subjects they have already learned meaning these are not real colleges these are these I don't want to say uh BS colleges these are tangential colleges where religious studies are given credit accreditation okay yeah does not change the fact that they are in college for all purposes once your daughter has connected herself to college she has disconnected herself from Torah learning to that and only that which is her only source in life if your daughter is presently preparing for or taking any college courses or tests for college please make an appointment to discuss with us and then on the bottom you have to fill out if you can see these two little checks and the two little checks one check says my daughter is not taking any college courses or Preparatory tests the second check says my daughter is taking college courses or Preparatory tests I would like to set up an appointment so you're going to tell me that I exaggerated no I told the truth people don't like the truth you know why because it points fingers and says hey something is wrong well that's what I have to remind myself as well because I don't like being criticized um it doesn't feel good and I have this nature sometimes maybe naivety where I go oh God maybe I got this wrong and then I have to remind myself well these are people from within what I would consider a very insular uh Community or very defensive people at least but I guess another point that there some of them are making and perhaps wrongly that it's not that you exaggerate they're saying but but yours was a very extreme college for example so give me an idea is it is it is this widespread across uh let's say the American and British ultra-orthodox communities this is the main source of schooling for women in any black hat ultra-orthodox Community it's space yaku there are base yakub schools in London in Manchester in golders green they're all over the world it is the central core message and system of the ultra-orthodox schooling education for women that their only purpose in life is to be wives and mothers and the only education they received is should be from their Jewish High School period that's a fact it is a fact my story is not unique or extraordinary in any way shape or form and to say that it's something that I experience but other women don't is just actually inaccurate now what you can say is other women experience it and they don't mind they're happy being wives and mothers and here's what I always say to that this isn't a happiness contest this is an equality issue happy or not the question is is it Equitable or is it not are the laws fair or are they not and I always say this to people when suffragette movement came through in the UK in the U.S were is it only men attacking the suffragettes no no no plenty of women it was millions of women millions and what did they say we're happy we love being wives and mothers we don't need the right to vote and yet their daughters are very grateful that the women who marched did and that's what I say the women of my generation may say to themselves I'm used to not having these rights I'm okay I'm happy but I'm going to fight for their daughters and their daughters daughters whether they like it or not Judy I love how you talk you this where does this eloquence come from I suppose uh your Genius parents to an extent is that is that where it comes from well you know I uh I had to educate myself right I received really no education I received a 17th century education and so the only way to it's a very as you saw in the book it's not like I decided one morning I'm out and I just walk out the door it took me years eight years of educating myself of trying to familiarize myself with a world that was 300 years out of anything I understood I am a true time traveler I I knew nothing about the outside world and by the way that's why most people who leave my community do end up committing suicide do have substance abuse issues because we are not equipped to handle the 21st century we were not taught to handle the 21st century you cannot imagine how disconcerting and disorienting and confusing it is to walk into a world you don't recognize in my world women aren't allowed to live alone you go from your father's house to your husband's house to come into a world where women had any autonomy was really shocking to me the first time I slept in a room by myself I was 42 years old it's hard for people to conceive of such a thing and so it's either just to call me a liar or an exaggerator than to realize that it's true and it's happening in our century well the rest of us don't think you're a liar I just want to clarify that it's just it's just those I appreciate that no it's just personal because it's like it's it's the trauma of having to have lived through it and then having someone try to negate your experience and say no that never happened which is just ludicrous and um I think you know the way that I survived that transition is through Reading words are my lifeline so I think to answer your question in terms of my speaking and why I I write books well ebook uh and I have the show and I do everything that I do it's because knowledge is power knowledge is the key to everything and education to me if these women in my world are educated the day that they realize that they deserve more is the day that we change the world together that's beautifully pert Julia and you know what I'm writing a book about uh the psychology of Secrets and how secrets are used against people and there is a section I'm doing about religion and Cults and things I'm going to quote you in there uh if you don't mind absolutely there's I there's a there's a real um there's a real similarity between you know the creation story Adam and Eve and the tree of knowledge and they have to be careful not to get any knowledge that's the worst thing you can have and then there was this scene in your in your book about a classmate uh whose family had a television can you and then the teacher was sort of smelling it can you tell us about that that's amazing so okay TVs so you have to understand I fundamentalism can only exist in isolation right so the outside world has to be the enemy and dangerous you can't have a television television is too connected to the outside world I'm sitting in class one day and my principal comes in and she is I mean everyone was frightened of her she's a very brilliant very very charismatic and powerful woman she comes in and she says I smelt humor oh my God Tama means um impurity uh like rot and we're all looking around like oh my gosh I smelt Huma I'm just shaking in our seats and she points to a girl in my class and she says you have brought Tuma into this class you have brought Tomah into the school you have brought Tumo into your classmates and this poor girl is sitting there now and she's white as a ghost and she shaking hysterically why how did she bring impurity into the classroom there is a television in your home you must go home tonight you must take an ax and you must chop chop chop the television because it almost sounds funny to hear you do it as like the impersonation years later but how I'm terrified people didn't know how to packs at home is that a normal thing to keep at home I don't know that was literally what she said verbatim it's a TV of knowledge isn't it it's the tree of knowledge it's the same thing it's the same thing education is dangerous when I started dating I was warned Julia you're you know to because not only was I not allowed to read secular things right I wasn't allowed to read most of the religious uh you know books Forum that are in my community and I was constantly being told Julia you shouldn't have read this you shouldn't have known that you shouldn't have looked into that don't tell your husband or the person you're about to go out with that you know these things you're never going to get married does ignorance is celebrated ignorance is celebrated when I taught in high school my first high school and one of the teachers saw my lesson plan she said oh are you having problems at home and I said uh sorry what do you mean she's like well this is way too erudite you're going to make your husband feel insecure that's the world every like cult an extreme religion seems to turn into like a boys club eventually where these these guys all just sort of make it so it's as comfortable as possible for them and so you can suppress the women I mean it is sad and you know what's maybe surprising for people who have not experienced something like that but of you know reading your book it makes sense of course is that it seems like a lot of this stuff you you didn't just um you know go along with when you were young you you enjoyed and got uh the pleasure from you know the modesty and that kind of thing I wanted to be good I wanted God to love me I I wanted to please everyone around me and even more than that I I turn it everywhere I look brilliant people intelligent people are following these rules so I kept thinking to myself what's wrong with me why can't I just fit in why can't I be okay with being silent and subservient everyone else is it's what God wants for me what's wrong with me that it was I always assumed that something was inherently wrong with me that I couldn't be okay with these and I do want to point out one thing because I am saying a lot of negative things and I I want to stop for a second and say a few positive things as well so I've had two things happen recently that have given me tremendous hope what I always say to people is look I love being Jewish I'm proud to be a Jew and I don't think there are any there's no malicious intent I think I always say everyone in my story is a victim because they're taught these things they think it's right as well until we change the laws they're as much a prisoner as I am I I guess it's a good point to remind uh listeners who have no experience of Judaism and Jewish people and stuff that firstly this is a very small percentage of ministers in general tiny tiny percentage it's the most extremist version of religious Jews and most religious Jews are live very modern lives they're modern Orthodox they go to college they have televisions they live a perfectly normal existence and I have tremendous respect for them and all the things that I'm saying absolutely do not imply in those communities that's number one number two in my community I love the people in my community I just want them to have it all I want them to be able to be religious and not be downtrodden and and and and minimized and enslaved because they're women I don't want to attack I want to make their lives better and I think that it may be starting and I'm gonna tell you something that happened to me recently that I almost fainted I was so shocked so I'm in I don't want to name the place because it might give away who this person is I was in a location so this very famous Rabbi that every single person in the Hasidic or black hat world knows even if you're living in Austria if you're a black Hatter you know who this guy is It's a small world right we're all interconnected one of the most famous people in my world and he starts walking toward me and okay rabbi's like that rabbis that are that big they travel with an Entourage right so he's got his shamish and his people who are always around him and and I see them heading towards me I'm like oh no here is gonna go I'm gonna get yelled at that I'm a this and that and why can't I keep my mouth shut and blah blah blah I'm like oh my God and I'm literally stealing myself for an attack and he comes over with his whole policy and he looks down on me because I'm tiny and he says Ms Hart my wife and my daughters thank you no yeah and walked away you're saying I it took me probably 40 seconds to recover I every time I think about it I burst out crying because this is a man who could actually affect change this is someone who can actually do something about it and if he's coming to me and saying my wife and daughters thank you that means my message is getting across because I love Judaism I love the people in my community I want them to have it all and if I have awoken some people to say wait a minute maybe we aren't treating women properly maybe these are laws that need to change maybe women will be happier to be religious if we don't push them down every day my concern with that is is in some sense it seems incompatible because you talk of the prayers right from the moment you wake up the prayers already make an inequality between the the Sexes but there's a lot of things I have to have been changed in the last couple hundred years for example there used to be a law I know it's going to sound crazy but it's not in today's day and age there used to be a law that if a woman was raped her rapist would be forced to marry her can you imagine now what woman in her right mind would want to marry her rapist okay but go back three four thousand years and think about what a woman with a child alone unmarried would be forced to do yeah and it's right so my point is there are laws that existed back then that they have repealed now obviously in today's day and age there is no law in even the most extreme ultra-orthodox community that a woman should marry her rapist that law has been negated right so there are many laws that got thrown out because they don't apply to today's time it's not I'm not asking for something that has not happened before there's multiple laws that have changed for example um pre-babylonian times men could marry 10 women it could have as many wives as you want nowadays that's not the case so there are many laws that have changed as times have progressed I'm just asking for these laws to go for those prayers to be gone Prayer by the way prayer has been changed so many times I can't begin to tell you right it was first said orally and then it was put in writing and then it was put in writing twice and then when people were illiterate the khazan had to read in people just say I'm Maine because half of the religious you know World in Eastern Europe couldn't read so they couldn't read the prayers so things have changed and you know it has elasticity right it has some elasticity there so I'm just asking for that elasticity to being used to win it you know what I wanted to ask you so uh in your the community you grew up in what would they think of a a Jewish man secular atheist man like myself last Soul darling they you know look again going back to the 18th century example in go to like Regency England or or pre-revolution France right lineage is all that mattered and your lineage is if when your family came to the golden Medina to the United States they kept their religion there they have lineage they have royalty in their blood right in my community royalties how many rabbis you've got in your in your family tree okay if your family came like your family when they where is your family from originally uh Ukraine Russia those kinds of places when they came to the UK they left religion they became irreligious at some point correct yeah so people like you and me whose families whose ancestors left religion we're like lesser beings oh okay even worse than non-jewish people all about the same uh different because non-jewish people are just or non-jews we don't we don't we don't bother with those guys Jewish people you're considered a teenager nishba which means a captive child meaning you're a sinner against but you're a sinner against your own will because you just weren't educated properly so it's not really your fault so you know you're kind of like this nebulous sad Jew kind of thing because you are a sinner you're eating on kosher you're polluting your body you're angering God but it's not your fault you were kind of capped you're like a captive child you know you you didn't know any better so it's like a child raised in captivity who was not taught about Torah therefore it's not really his fault so they you're you're something to pity you're someone to pity that's basically the concept and um you know how like in the olden days women heiresses from the United States would marry British aristocracy to get so Mike can do the same thing if you're like me or you or you grew up you're religious and so you don't have that nobility of and royalty of all these rabbis in your background you need to have a lot of money to clean the shame of that and to marry into a royal rabbinic family that's how it works so for example my brother my brothers and my younger sister all married rabbinic royalty Because by the time my siblings were getting married my parents had so much money that they were able to buy into rabbinic families it works exactly like it did in the 1800s okay so then and when you left right that must have caused a bit of a scene you say you don't get on with your parents now so I mean how was that it's like I mean this must have been mad for everyone around you well first of all nobody saw it coming nobody I didn't tell a single human being I never spoke my doubts I never voiced my misery I was too afraid because well first of all people already thought I was crazy I was already a rebel because again you know it was a slow gradual transformation so before I left I was already watching movies openly and going to movie theaters and there was no more stocking since I was already really really skating on thin eyes um so if I would have told people I'm out or I'm planning to leave oh that would I mean who knows what have happened they would have taken away my kids I I don't know what have happened so I told no one so when I walked out the door I everyone was flummoxed completely they thought I'd lost my mind here was this woman she was a high school teacher for 20 years you know she taught all this Flemish toe or nothing is partial all this stuff and all of a sudden she turns around she's like bye I mean no one into everyone it seemed you know uh what's what's his name um who's that brilliant investor dude um who uh who says John musk no no no um who said that you know everyone always says I became a billionaire overnight they just don't realize overnight took 40 years um they didn't realize that I'd been planning this for nine years I'd been educating myself for nine years I'd been wow I mean this was a very long long process to them it was one minute she's religious the next minute she's not and no one understood what was going on um and at first people just thought I'd literally had like a mental breakdown and they're like she's just lost her mind and then people realized oh no she hasn't lost her mind she's out and how how was your mother well my parents haven't spoken to me since the day I walked out the door not one mark but the whole thing's a bit weird and I've always said this and I get again like there's another thing I get shouted at for and it's that I've said that although I shouldn't repeat it because I'll get shouted at more but uh I've said that you know there's this idea of maternal and paternal love um for the children and I do believe in it but it's amazing when you talk to people from extreme religions and Cults and things uh how easily it seems to be broken and for example your birthdays you would just be like you know it's my birthday today and they just didn't even remember and they left you at home when they went on holidays to look after like all the other children it was like this sort of Cinderella kind of thing I did not have a fun childhood but again who says you have to have a fun childhood who says you have to be happy right well yeah that's that's their basic that was their philosophy their philosophy is you are put on this Earth to serve period so if you're put on this Earth to serve go serve but you feel like they loved you that's a tough question you know um my mother my my yeah you know there's me and then there's 10 years Gap and then there's seven other children right so I was basically their mommy my sister Hannah who's the closest in age to me is 10 years younger than I and she was the originally the only person in my family who spoke to me when I left but now she doesn't speak to me either because her community gave her an ultimatum it's us or your sister and she chose her community oh I'm so sorry yeah I mean again it's hurtful but I understand it you know um so we did this thing for a year uh when she was living in Miami and I was living in Atlanta we did this thing where every time we spoke to my mother so this is when I'm still in the community right but my mother already didn't approve of me because I was too modern Orthodox I was as used you know as you saw I started reading secular literature I started arguing with people my skirts came a little bit higher my stockings came a little bit lower you know so as I became progressively more modern my mother became very you know disappointed in me and um for one full year we would end every conversation with my mother with an I love you to see if she would ever say it back and in the year of ending every conversation with her with I love you she never said it back not once so do I think she loves me I think she loves me as much as she's capable of loving a person I think she loves ideals and religion more is it does that how does that make you feel now have you sort of just gone ah forget it that's a different thing or do you do you dwell on it no I I mean hurt of course it hurts I miss my family I miss my siblings I raise them I change their diapers I did their homework I put them to sleep I they literally called me mommy these are people I raised and now they don't speak to me because I'm this terrible sinner um so of course it hurts I miss them but I have zero anger literally none because it's not their fault they're victims too they're indoctrinated and brainwashed they think they're doing the right thing they truly believe that to associate with me would be damaging for their souls they're doing which they're taught is right how can I fault them for that I can't and I gather that was partly why I mean there's a part in the book you have these struggles with with leaving and perhaps contemplating even taking your life and wondering what that would do to the people you left behind I mean deemed easier to kill myself than to walk into the 21st century it's it's so hard to explain to people it it's like saying to you you have to go to Mars now go to Mars go figure it out it's really terrifying and it's even more terrifying at 42 to go to Mars and learn a new language in a new culture and people that are so foreign to you that they really feel like another group of humanity I mean I didn't I didn't know anyone outside of my community you know I was afraid of non-jews if you can imagine such a thing I was really afraid of them but it's it's so mad though to think of you back then and then you didn't just like assimilate you sort of dominated that whole world you become like the CEO of a huge fashion industry you've got like this Kardashians uh TV series like you absolutely smashed it like how does there go home baby I mean I figured look if I can time travel I can do anything yeah nothing matters anymore it's like a difference like you say you're on Mars now you might as well just play the game that's it if I'm you know and also I think you know you know before my marriage went South my husband used to say you were in a pressure cooker and when that lid came off you just exploded because that's what it was for so many years everything I had inside of me all my skills and capabilities and talents and everything I thought and wanted to achieve I was told that all of that was evil and wrong to even think about so the minute I was given the autonomy to work I couldn't stop you know when people ask me what is my favorite thing to do in my new world it's work it's not party or go to clubs or date or any it's working it's achieving it's changing things it's creating it's inventing this is what gives me life and I'm Can't Stop it's I need it it gives me so much joy what were some of the bits that when you first came out were the most sort of alien and I I use I always use this example there was a woman called Emily Greene who got out of the Hasidic community in in London and she said she went to a job interview uh for quite a high brow job I think it was and she was wearing jeans and that's why she didn't get the job and she didn't understand that genes were different to suit trousers and stuff like that which I always use that example because it blows my mind like of course but that makes sense now but yeah what were some of the things like like that for you oh gosh I mean literally everything I think you know in my I didn't know about I'd never heard of a contract like in my world you just shake hands because your next-door neighbors related to their cousin's uncle's brother and if they mess with you then you're in synagogue to get you know what I mean it's all it's all done very it's there's no contract there's very little in many of these kind of deal structures it's all a handshake like my first Partners we wrote our thing on a napkin I just assumed when I paid someone something that was it they knew they would get paid I didn't realize you have to have a sign off and that the contract just the invoice has to be stamped and paid and sent back so that you have proof that you've paid it and so people would say oh no you didn't pay it and I'd be like yes I did and they're like show me proof and I'm like uh so people took tremendous advantage of my lack of understanding these kind of things and it's still kind of biting me in the ass now I still realize that I you know my my current husband made you know fooled me a lot when it comes to contracts because it's not something I was very cognizant of but familiar with um and then in the personal space everything like my first boyfriend I've had one boyfriend right I'm 51 years old I've had one boyfriend because left my marriage there's no boyfriends before I got married and then I just wanted to experience I had it like a sexual revolution of my own right and then I had a boyfriend and then I met my husband so I've had literally one boyfriend and um I remember when we first became Like official girlfriend I didn't know what that meant I literally sat him down and said okay are there rules like are we supposed to talk every day now am I supposed to text you again like I didn't know what to do like what is a girlfriend supposed to do what normal what's not normal what should I expect which I not expect what should he expect like I was literally telling you tell me what a girlfriend does I had no clue you know what though in in most respects you're right in that that you are in a disadvantage at a disadvantage in those things but there's also a slight Advantage because the rest of us also don't really know what anything means and what we're doing and oh are we exclusive are we together do I don't know about contracts and invoices and things but I can't ask because I'm a 33 near 34 year old man who should already know what I'm doing um so I can't really ask was you can now because you know you can sit down and say Hey you know explain this to me exactly how it is and then you can learn that's true that's true I am I'm a I'm an eternal student you know and it just you don't even realize like so many of these little things and also just pop culture knowledge as much as I started watching TV when I plan my Escape I watched for a few years right um I was inviting to this event by caring you know who owns like Gucci and uh caring group so there's like lvmh and then there's caring and they invited me to this screening of Thelma and Louise with Thelma and Louise with Susan Sarandon and Gina Davis and you know they were going to speak about it and it was the anniversary of when it came out and blah blah blah and we're in this theater in Manhattan the small theater and the movies playing and people are talking people are whispering and I'm seeing going shhh and the person sitting next to me is like my God you would think you'd never seen this movie and I'm like I've never seen this movie I thought you were going to say that you shushed Susan Sarandon not knowing who she was I have done things like that I'll tell you a massively well I probably should not say this on please do no it's just you know because again I there's just so many holes in my understanding of pop culture knowledge what's appropriate what's inappropriate I just don't know and I learn as I go and I make a lot of really embarrassingly silly mistakes um yeah that are pretty pretty bad I feel like you were going to tell me one I was I was going to tell you one but then I realized I'm just saying it publicly it's so embarrassing oh come on you really don't want to tell us me I'll you know what I'll I'll I'll uh kind of synopsize it a little bit so I don't talk overly stupid so um I was gosh um let's just say that people that I should have recognized and known uh in the UK and how to appropriately uh speak to them and you know what the proper words to call them by I really stuck both feet in my mouth and then swallowed them whole because I had no idea how to deal with any kind of royalty or non-royalty relationship kind of things so I just I made a complete and absolute fool of myself and I luckily was able to say not only am I an American so please forgive me I'm also come from a really you know isolated community so I'm just doubly stupid what did you do to the queen Julia no no I didn't do anything to the queen okay gosh I can't believe I'm telling you this story out loud well here we go um I am involved in the elephant family uh you know travels to my elephant I help I'm I'm really and I love this uh charity it's called elephant family it helps save the Asian elephant um and they're uh there are members you know uh King Charles and Camilla Queen Camilla and many members of the family are very involved in this because um they've really taken on this as one of their Charities and I raised some money and they they threw this cocktail event uh that I was you know that I came to and um they did this beautiful video for me and made this entire presentation and you know I didn't know you usually when when you're invited to a cocktail party and you're told the cocktail party starts at seven what would you think okay you don't do that if the people inviting you are part of the royal family oh I didn't know yeah neither did I and I made a complete ass of myself because I come 45 minutes late and I want it to sink through the floor I felt so embarrassed and they were so lovely and so kind and so I mean just so generous to me and you know they made me feel not as stupid as I felt um you know they were I they couldn't have been nicer um and uh they they smiled at my ignorance and were just so elegant about it and they're like Julia no don't worry we understand I'm like I'm so sorry I'm an American I don't know anything and I just felt so badly because they were so generous with their time and I I felt really stupid so yeah I get into situations like this all the time well most of us don't know what to do around I would never I wouldn't know what to do around them I'm English so bad had I known that and that they had and they had made a whole video for me and were giving me a presentation award and I missed my own video on my own presentation I could so embarrassing like so dumb anyway it's a cool story to have yeah wow isn't it that's a good way to look at it yeah we've got we've got a couple minutes left just tell me a little bit about I mean just to make it clear wasn't straws and Camilla that were giving me the award it was a different member of the royal family that was going to present it and and I just I don't want to embarrass this particular I mean not that it's embarrassing to the contrary she was Lovelier than any human being deserved after I messed it up I just I'm trying to leave names out because I don't want to get into any situations but um they the entire I mean the people that I've met have been beyond lovely to me and I'm so grateful to all of them they've been so kind to me and I'm really oh I'm so I'm pleased to hear that we've got a couple just in the last couple minutes I just want to hear about uh you know is there any more um my unorthodox Life coming up um and and how's you know how are the kids how's batsheva she's got a social media influencer career looks great kids are great you know I can't talk about Netflix until Netflix talks about Netflix um but uh kids aren't doing really well Miriam's back in Stanford even though she graduated already um she's taking some other classes there uh bacheva is killing it in uh you know her career is working with me on plus body my shapewear company that we're about to relaunch we had to put a pause on it because of my whole divorce thing but now we're coming back strong I'm really really excited about it so he works with me every day and um yeah I love my kids I'm really lucky oh they're fantastic and you're the show is fantastic the book is fantastic please everyone go out and go Brazen Brazen is out in the UK is it did it get released later in the UK I think it got released the same day I think now it's the paperback book carpet cover that paperback is coming to UK before it comes to us oh that's what it is okay well I just it's the most phenomenal book it's really insightful and unique and and I encourage everyone to go out and buy a copy and to watch my unorthodox life on Netflix because that's just fascinating to watch and fun as well uh Julia thank you for being on the edge thank you so much it was really a pleasure I really enjoyed it thank you Andrew join me on the edge for new episodes every week start watching right now

Channel: Andrew Gold

Views: 140,107

Keywords: andrew gold, on the edge with andrew gold, on the edge, podcast, interviews, julia haart, my unorthodox life, unorthodox, orthodox, orthodox judaism, jewish, extreme jewish, haredi, charedi, chasidic, hasidic, yeshive, ultra orthodox, kendall jenner, naomi campbell, ellen show, jewish woman, jewish wedding, hidden horrors, brazen, Batsheva, family feud, chavie weisberger, emily green

Id: 8ZgSX-4HMXM

Length: 52min 28sec (3148 seconds)

Published: Thu Mar 23 2023

Reddit Comments

[u/gypsycookie1015]

I know there aren't a ton of fans of hers on here, but I really am glad she's at least putting some weight back on. She was getting really scary looking there on the 2nd season of the show. I mean i get it, divorce, stress. It can have a huge impact on weight and other physical symptoms. Seems like she's at least getting a better handle on her health which is great.

I can actually really see the resemblance to Miriam in this interview. I could see the resemblance in Bat and Miriam but never thought they looked as much like her as each other. But with her face a bit fuller I can absolutely see it now. They are all very beautiful in any case.

[u/Savings-Cheesecake95]

Can someone summarize? I can't make it through another hour long interview of lies

[u/Ashfield83]

The interviewer CANNOT be a real journalist?! He’s so terrible at this!!

[u/Ambimom]

I left a comment on Andrew Gold's Youtube channel which he did not appreciate. I said that he obviously did not see Julia's second series, that Julia was a world-class fabulist, that most of her life was lived as a secular Jew and she probably believed her version of her life, but it was hardly shtetl on the Hudson. I was horrified by the way she parented her children as demonstrated in the 2nd series. Most of her drama is self-imposed. She needs therapy, not sympathy.

[u/supersonic-bionic]

a bit lazy to go through the whole video. question... what's up with her life now? what is she doing?

[u/bephana]

I quit at "communism is a religion"

[u/Only-Marionberry-273]

I usually love Andrew Gold's videos, but this one was a piece of doodoo. I watched one episode of My Unorthodox Life as a result, and absolutely loathed everything about this womanJulia. Good lord but she is obnoxious. And the idea that Miriam would go on a first date on camera? Ridiculous.