You may be seated. Hello, Your Honor. Hello. This is the case of<i>
Moore v Butler.</i> Thank you, Jerome.
Good day, everyone. AUDIENCE: Good day. Ms. Moore, you say there
is only one reason the
defendant, Mr. Butler, has doubts he fathered
your one-year-old daughter, and that's because of
his manipulating wife. Yes, Your Honor. AUDIENCE: Oh! Mr. Butler, you argue
you've been told on
multiple occasions by the plaintiff herself that you are not
her child's father. Yes, Your Honor. You state that Ms. Moore has
fabricated paternity claims
in an effort to win you back. AUDIENCE: Wow! Ms. Moore... What? Has Mr. Butler been involved
in your child's life
in any way? If you're talking about
diapers and wipes,
that's it. That's... That's not a father
to me, at all, period. Only diapers and wipes? That's it. All right, so, look.
Let's talk about why
we're here. Mr. Butler, you obviously
have doubts. Yes, Your Honor. What are those doubts? She told me I'm not
the baby daddy. JUDGE LAKE:
So she told you that? One time was because
he was harassing me. Him and his so-called,
quote-unquote, wife. AUDIENCE: What? So, you admit, Ms. Moore,
you told him, "You're not
the child's father." One time. What happened? How did
that conversation happen? It happened 'cause she
told me I'm not the dad. She told me
I'm not the father. Why would she tell you that? The baby don't even
look like me. (SCOFFS) Now, your wife is jumping
out of her chair. I guess she knows the story
better than you do. She always got
something to say. Which most wives do, huh? She always got something
to say. JUDGE LAKE: Come on in here.
Ms. Harrison, it is? Yes. You husband says he was
told by Ms. Moore
he was not the father. Of the child. Your Honor... Your Honor. On numerous times. MOORE: One time. Numerous times.
That's a lie. One time. Harassment. Harassment. Really, harassment? I ain't never harassed you... You and your
so-called husband. Whatever. That part, that part. Your Honor, I was getting
my hair done. That part. That part. I was getting my hair done at one particular time,
while she was on the phone,
he had her on speaker,
and she told him, "You're not the dad.
You don't have to do
nothing for this baby." Harassment! You're right.
You heard it yourself. I heard it myself. Not only that. She did hear it. These texts right here. She did hear it. Jerome, will you pass
me the evidence, please. She said her and her husband,
her husband does
a good job, of... MOORE: Fiance. And he do. No, that's... And he do. That's a text
that was sent to me. And he do. He has been a much better
father than Quincy. JUDGE LAKE: So... Trust that. This evidence that's
been presented says from Ms. Carter, "My husband
do a good job keeping me <i> "and his baby good."</i> HARRISON: His baby! MOORE: <i> Exactly, 'cause
he stepped up. He stepped up.</i> And my daughter is
gonna call him Dad. He stepped up.
Quincy's not around. Quincy never been around. Never been around. So, Ms. Harrison, you're saying, this evidence,
this text, proves you believe
it's her husband's child? I believe that personally,
Your Honor, it doesn't... To me? I believe that the conception dates
are all wrong. Because how can you tell
someone they pregnant
in December but you have the baby in July? Excuse me, correction. I was seven and a half weeks,
December 11th. Okay, but you would not have
had your baby... December 11th. You would
not have had your baby... December 11th. But did I have sex with you? No. Did I have sex with you?
You're not a man. You're not a man.
I had sex with you. I do have sex with him. That's the truth. But I've been
messing with him for almost two years. Tell me point blank. Ladies... If you believe it, you
married him. You tell me. Ms. Moore. AUDIENCE: Whoa! Ms. Harrison. It's classic, right, Jerome? JEROME: Mmm-hmm. It's always two women
going at it over some silent,
"nothing to say" man. Back and forth. But it wouldn't even be... JUDGE LAKE: Listen, listen,
listen, listen! What we're gonna do
here today is get down
to the bottom. We're gonna figure out
how we got here, we're
gonna get the truth and we're gonna figure out
where we go from here. But what we aren't gonna
do, as ladies, is degrade ourselves,
act a fool up in here. All she's gotta do
is leave me alone. And we're not gonna
be disrespectful and use disrespectful
language. All right? (AUDIENCE CLAPPING) I want to understand
this story. So, listen,
let's now talk about why we have the doubt, because
that's why we're here. Ms. Harrison, you say
the conception dates
don't add up. Mmm-mmm. Now, please, explain
to the court why you
believe that's true. Because if you told him
in December that you
were pregnant, your baby would have been
born in September, 'cause my daughter's
September 22nd. JUDGE LAKE: And so... She need to learn her math. Go back to school. Hold on, Ms. Moore,
Ms. Moore. That's what you need to do. Go back to school. Really? Explain to me,
why is she wrong? Because when I got pregnant I had left... Quincy was doing
so much cheating. I found... His last two
babies, and my baby and his last baby,
is two weeks apart. I found that out. (AUDIENCE GASP) I found that out
on his cell phone and I found it out because
he had his last girlfriend's
EBT card. The baby looked
just like Quincy. Now, if she can't do the math,
that's her problem.
She can sit down. December 11th, the doctor
told me I was
seven and a half weeks. So, that means November. November, then. And the baby was born... MOORE: July. BUTLER: July. MOORE: July 26th. I had two dates,
July 26th or August 5th. JUDGE LAKE: Okay, so... I had an emergency C-section
on July 26th. Was Quincy anywhere
to be around? No, you didn't tell me. No. When he came,
he came with bags.
When Quincy always come, Quincy always come with bags. That's just like
the beginning of this month. Quincy came with bags. You say he came with bags.
What does that mean? MOORE: Yes. When Quincy come with bags,
he thinks he's about to stay.
He's a leech. He is a leech, and his
so-called wife told
me that over the phone. It's never... It's always if
I call Quincy, it's always her.
Her, her, her. Because I'm his wife and his
one, one, one, one. I don't care. That doesn't make sense,
though. I'm his baby mother and I have to talk to him,
not you. I didn't make
no baby with you. It don't matter,
he's married to me. And the money comes
from me! (INDISTINCT YELLING) At the end of the day. So, can I get you for
child support, then? Since he on SSI.
Can I get you
for child support, then? Whatever you wanna do,
let's go for it. Exactly, and I'm gonna do it. Okay, go for it. I'm gonna do it,
and I mean that. When you first found out
you were pregnant,
Ms. Moore... Correct. ...did you tell Mr. Butler?
Did he accept the fact? BUTLER: No. No, no, no. No, I didn't tell him.
My mother told him. You didn't? Her mother told me. Not her. Okay, I wanna
talk to your mother.
Ma'am, please stand. Please state your name
for the court. Ketryna Gutter. Thank you so much
for joining us. So, you told Mr. Butler that your daughter
was pregnant. I called him and said,
you know, "My daughter
is pregnant." And he goes,
"What do you mean?" I said, "She's pregnant."
And he says, "Well, I'm gonna
be there for her. "I'm gonna take care
of her. I'm gonna
take care of the baby." All of a sudden... BUTLER: No, no, Your Honor. There is no Quincy
in sight no more. BUTLER: No, no. Mr. Butler, do you remember
having this conversation with Ms... No, I didn't. You never did? No. So, what facts, evidence,
knowledge, do you have that Ms. Moore was sleeping
with anybody else but you
at the time? Another dude.
That's all I can say. Wrong. Wrong. JUDGE LAKE: Who is
the other guy? Another dude... While me and Mr. Butler
were in the midst
of our relationship... I wish somebody would get
to the answer to my question. One of his friends called him
and told him that she had
another man. They have no evidence. So, all right. So once this
friend told you she was
sleeping with somebody else, you thought what? "This baby might not
be mine"? Yes, ma'am. Ms. Moore, let me
ask you something. You say the birth was
very difficult. Tell me what
happened that day. When I went into labor, I actually went into labor...
I started having labor
pains on the 25th. On the 26th, my blood
pressure went sky high. When my blood pressure
went sky high, the doctor came in and told me
that my baby's heart rate
was going down. So, as it was going down,
she was getting less oxygen. So, they had to get her out. And when they got her out,
I did not see my baby. I went to an emergency
C-section. When I got out of recovery
for 45 minutes, I touched my baby
and signed my baby off <i> to Pomona Valley Hospital,
which is the city that
he stays in.</i> He's right, I did not
tell him where
my baby was. I know how mental he is. And I felt like I don't want
that around my child. So, when you go see her,
I want to be there with you. When I got out of the
hospital, I called...
I called Mr. Butler. He do not answer his phone. I call him again.
He do not answer his phone. I'm not gonna keep on
calling you. I'm not gonna keep
calling you, that's
what I'm not about to do. That's a lie, Your Honor.
She ain't never call me. Yes, she did. She ain't never
called me and told me that
my daughter was at
Pomona Valley Hospital... GUTTER: It's
"my daughter," now. She never told me that,
Your Honor, so at
the end of the day, I don't know whose baby it is. The reason there's another
doubt is this picture. Jerome, would you pass
me that evidence, please. (AUDIENCE GROANING) Oh, that's me and my fiance. Like I told you,
he stepped up. HARRISON: This is the same
man that... MOORE: He stepped up. That, that... Went to every
doctor's appointment. HARRISON:<i>
That looks just like him.</i> <i> No, you a liar.</i> <i> My fiance is way finer than
him, so knock that off.</i> Not only that... Your Honor, the other
reason is the baby doesn't carry
his last name. Doesn't carry the last name.
She's never shown him
the birth certificate. So, your concern is that
there may be another man listed on the
birth certificate. Because you've never seen it? MOORE: I have evidence
right here. I've never seen that birth
certificate a day in my... Right here. Here you go. A day in my life... Jerome, hand me that. It's me and me only. I was the only one there
besides my mother. If she could have been listed,
I would have listed her
as the father. (AUDIENCE TITTERS) JUDGE LAKE:
Yes, no father listed. MOORE: My daughter has
my last name. Name of father, blank. After Za'Marah is here, at some point,
you do reconnect. Yes, after he made
a hospital visit, after my
baby had left. Then, yes, when she
turned two months, because there were so many
doctor's appointments, including when I was
pregnant. I was seeing three
doctors at the same time. And he knows that.
He knows that. So, after... I don't know nothing about
that, Your Honor. MOORE: You were there
at one or two of them. Nothing. Nothing. I never went to none of
them doctor's appointments. Wow. Wow. None of them. JUDGE LAKE: You've never been
to a doctor's appointment? I was at one of them,
that's about it. One of 'em, Your Honor.
One of 'em. All the rest, I never
went to none of 'em. GUTTER: You wasn't around,
you chose not to be around. That's your baby. I don't know
how you don't see it. She do not look like me. Okay. (SCOFFS) Okay, well, you don't have to
step up. I'm already here.
Don't even worry about that. So, at the point you do
reconnect him
with the child... I go to his auntie's house,
which he was living... Who he was living with
at the time, in Pomona. I go over there, I take
my baby to see him when my baby is two months. They taking pictures,
"This is my last time. <i> "This is my last baby.</i> <i> "I wanna be with you."</i> Taking her downstairs
to see his friends. His auntie say,
"Well, the baby look
just like you." This isn't the first auntie
that said my baby looked
just like him. Recently, he sent his
other auntie, which is
his momma's sister, to Victorville, as a DNA test. I dunno how, she didn't swab
or nothin'. I guess it's just
eye vision. (AUDIENCE SNICKERS) She come up there and say,
"I gotta tell you this." Taking pictures of my baby,
and all that. "I gotta tell you this.
Your daughter looks more
like Mr. Butler "than any of his other kids." Now, this other gentleman that I saw in the evidence
you submitted, this is the man you believe
is Za'Marah's father. Might be. Might be. I wish so, Your Honor.
I pray to God and I wish that I would have messed
with my fiance around the time
that I got pregnant. I wish. He has stepped up
in so many ways that Quincy has never been. That never been. 'Cause they keep me
away from her. As far as my daughter... They keep me away from
everything. Calling my fiance "Dad," I'm gonna grant it. How are we keeping you away?
You were just at the house
two weeks ago. He was supposed to be
there to live. The single point that I'm
trying to understand is,
is it true that you decided that maybe you'd
go and stay at Ms. Moore's
house with Za'Marah? Were you gonna go over there? To tell the truth,
he went over. Yeah. So, you did. And was it
because you felt like this
was your daughter? Yes, I did. You did, okay. So, it's almost like you've
got one foot in and
one foot out. Yes, I do. It's been... MOORE: That's because it's
being tugged on. I've been playing tug of war,
and I'm tired of playing
tug of war. If it come back to be my
daughter, I wanna see my
daughter, today. 'Cause, probably when
I leave her, I not gonna never
see her. And what is it, you feel that
Ms. Moore wanted to
be with you and since that didn't
work out, Za'Marah's her way of getting
back at you? Yes, ma'am. (GASPS) No. Yes, ma'am. I've been in a
tug of war because
I've felt like she's using my... Za'Marah, as a pawn to get back with me. 'Cause truthfully she's
unfit... And she's half...
Like, she's using me
as a bait tool. Like, she wants my money,
all type of stuff,
Your Honor. So, you feel like she's
trying to use you? Yes, ma'am. Now, look, we're in court.
I have to be honest. This conversation you're
having right now, is this something you truly
independently feel or are these things you
talk about with your wife? 'Cause you're in
a difficult position. You may have a baby with
one woman and you're married
to another woman. And they obviously
don't get along. They ain't never gonna get... So, are these things that
you feel... Is your wife
kind of egging these thoughts on
or are these your
independent thoughts? My own thoughts. So, now, my last
question is, if these thoughts are true,
when you get into an
altercation with your wife, why do you run to
Ms. Moore's house? I don't... Well, I did get
into an altercation
with my wife and I runs over here to see if this is
my baby or not. A year and a half,
it's been in a tug of war
with this baby. All right. Well, I think
there's only one way
to get to the results. HARRISON: Please. It's to have the envelope. Thank you, Jerome. There results were prepared
by DNA Diagnostics and they read as follows. In the case of <i> Moore v Butler,</i> when it comes to one-year-old
Za'Marah Moore, and as to whether her
biological father is Mr. Butler, it has been determined
by this court Mr. Butler... Yes, ma'am. You are her father. Now, look at her. I'm done. Thank you, you completed
everything today. You're very welcome, sir. HARRISON: You feel better? Yes, I do. Do you? Yeah. Now you can start
being a dad. When she was born
on down, this is yours. Thank you for coming
back in, Ms. Moore.
I know it's emotional. How do you feel? I'm just irritated.
I'm irritated. Because I know for a fact
that Quincy didn't want this
DNA test done. She did. JUDGE LAKE: Listen, I'm gonna
run it down. I'm gonna drop it like
a dime. You can pick it up
if you want to. I'm just being honest. Ms. Moore, this is
a life lesson for you. Mr. Butler, you have
a beautiful, beautiful
little girl. I want you to sit down with
Ms. Moore and start figuring out how
to let the past be the past. Thank goodness you've
got Ms. Gutter here. Loves the baby but can also
help you all, if you need it. If you need time to talk,
she can take Za'Marah so you all can talk
by yourselves and get this
together, okay? I wish you all the very best
of luck. Court is adjourned.
