Madara Would Stomp the Akatsuki

so today I'm gonna be revisiting a topic I covered in an older video of mine with Clyde the weeaboo where we looked into and discussed a hypothetical battle between Madara and the members of the Akatsuki now well the video has a lot more likes than dislikes is still fairly controversial and there were a lot of people who weren't super happy with the outcome of the fight since I kind of have a reputation for being biased towards the Uchiha and especially towards moderate I get why people were upset it may have seemed like Clyde and I weren't being entirely fair to the Akatsuki and like we were jerking moderate off a bit more than we should have I think the biggest issue with the video is that Clyde and I weren't taking it super seriously we were kind of goofing off the whole time making a whole lot of jokes at the expense of the Akatsuki members so our arguments may not have been as clear as they should have so hopefully I'll be able to avoid that issue in this video like I said earlier the video caused quite a stir so I've seen a lot of arguments presented in the Akatsuki favor and it's come from a whole bunch of different people I've seen reddit threads tweets double for anime even uploaded a video about it and a whole bunch of smaller channels did the same but none of the arguments I've seen have really done anything to change my mind I get where everybody's coming from but I think a lot of what everybody has to say is pretty flawed the most prevalent point that I came across was this idea that if the Akatsuki worked as a team the sheer power of that teamwork would be enough to make up for how much stronger moderate was than any of them I think that's a pretty flat and just generally not good argument now Dragon Ball and Naruto obviously have very different rules but I think everybody would agree with me if I were to say that even if they used the power of teamwork beginning force would not be able to defeat Frieza the ginyu force is very similar to the Akatsuki in this analogy and that its members have very specialized powers of course the ginyu force has less members than the Akatsuki does but even if you threw ins are bonded Ori acquis and Saiyan Saiga Vegeta to make up for the difference in numbers it wouldn't matter because freeze is so much more powerful than the members of the ginyu force and the rest of the members of his own army the same thing is true in the case of Madra and via kotsky let's take a look at the for example data to better illustrate the point that I'm trying to make light and I just kind of laughed him off in the original video and it probably didn't sound like we were being very fair to him I joked about how I felt he'd be more of a threat to the Akatsuki than an asset because his explosives tend to cover a pretty large area and to definitely have the potential to harm or even kill some of his teammates while I still stand by all of that a lot of people thought that was my only argument and that's not true now that's my own fault I'll admit I probably should have talked about data or more extensively and made it clear that I think even if you take this friendly-fire aspect out of the equation it doesn't matter because nothing he can do would be effective against Madara anyway a lot of people specifically mentioned C 4 and C 0 in their counter arguments and acted like they were some sort of smoking gun or something and while I'll agree that both jutsu are very impressive especially considering the point in the manga at which they were used when we're talking about somebody like moderate air completely irrelevant if Sasuke was able to avoid both jutsu there's no reason to believe that modern wooden be able to do the same thing and it's not like Sasuke only survived due to plot convenience well maybe you could argue that in the case of c0 but definitely not in the case of c4 he explains in great detail that he was able to see the many explosives created by the c-4 Karura as a sort of giant chakra cloud thanks to his Sharingan moderate prowess with the Sharingan is also pretty outstanding it's a lot better than Sasuke's would have been at the time of his fight with Daedra and is even implied to be among the greatest of the entire clans like moderate can tell the difference between a wood clone and a shadow clone just by looking at their chakra flow so it's possible that he'd be able to observe this cloud in even greater detail and that's without mentioning the fact that to use c-4 Daedra would have to either kill every member of the Akatsuki or tell them to evacuate which would make it very clear to moderate that he needs to do the same thing the same goes for c0 if they Tura uses it he has to come to terms with the fact that pretty much everyone else in the Akatsuki is going to die and I'm confident that like Sasuke moderate would be able to use the reverse summoning jutsu to get himself out of there even if he couldn't do that he could just protect himself with the perfect Susanoo which is more than capable of taking a c0 explosion moderate Susanoo took a hit from guys island level hero Dora and he was left without a scratch of course a perfect Susanoo offers a lot more protection than a base Susanoo does and I'm willing to argue that the difference is great enough to make up for whatever difference in destructive power there is present between c0 and hero Dora I'd also like to mention that moderate tanked the series of direct hits from the 9 Bijoux without using his Susanoo to protect himself so even if theta is suicide bomb did May to break through moderates perfect Susanoo somehow the remaining force from the explosion likely wouldn't be enough to kill him anyway now maybe you can argue that moderates first instinct upon seeing data is start to prepare see zero wouldn't be to bring out the perfect Susanoo like you know oh no made bottle wouldn't know what's about to happen he would it be prepared but since Sasuke was able to reverse summon himself in time to avoid dying I see no reason to believe why moderate wouldn't be able to whip out his Susanoo and time to protect himself the series has already made it very clear that the Susanoo takes no time at all to manifest for example Itachi activated his in the split second before Kirin hit him so even if moderate doesn't figure out what's going on until the very last second which is also pretty unlikely since his Sharingan should be able to let him know that a bunch of chakra is being gathered into a specific place in dataries body he should have plenty of time to protect himself and if we want to include in character arguments it's very possible that data I may announce what he's about to do he may be like time to take you to the other side art is an explosion hahaha or something like that so like Madara is fine c0 isn't an instant wind by any stretch of the imagination what it boils down to is since Sasuke was able to avoid both of data as trump cards even if you don't agree with anything that I've said up to this point you have to do some real mental gymnastics and even be a bit dishonest with yourself to convince yourself that there's absolutely nothing moderate could possibly do if either jutsu was used against him and this is the sort of thing that I was talking about with the ginyu force versus Frieza argument like yeah sure jutsu like this are a big deal for people fighting at the juninho incog a level but even people at that level of power and skill have jutsu that they can deploy to defend themselves from stuff like this so when you get to somebody like Madara who's so many tiers above people like that stuff that's deadly at the joaneen anti-gay level starts to seem laughable in comparison there's also plenty of other stuff going against data that I haven't even mentioned yet such as how he was overwhelmed by Sasuke's speed or how quickly he ran out of chakra but none of that really matters in the first place Madara could kill deidara in an instant if he wanted to valley of the and Madara can summon Kurama and have him fire a Bijoux bomb straight at deidara head o Madara can summon a meteor or two if he feels it's necessary and any version of moderate that has the agon can use the human path to rip date or his soul out of his body like I think you get the point and that's not all he can do to end the fight immediately either meanwhile both of data is trump cards would do nothing against Madara even if you give him every benefit of the doubt possible I saw plenty of people also bring up that saucer II could use his poison to kill Madara and that's actually a fairly strong argument because no matter how physically strong moderate may be there's not much he can do to train his internal organs and keep himself safe from the effects of toxins so if saucer he releases his poisonous gases into the air and moderate happens to inhale them then he'll probably die the problem with this is the same as with data as explosives Sasori can't safely release a cloud of poison without putting the rest of the Akatsuki members in danger the paths of pain may be an exception since they're just corpses but everybody else would drop dead around the same time as moderated and even then I'm not so sure the poison would work any way like if Sakura can detect it and hold her breath in time to save herself from dying then there's no reason to believe moderate couldn't now of course a Sri can just Nick moderate with a poison tip weapon but that's gonna be really hard to do against somebody who has a Susanoo and is also as fast as moderate even assuming Madara doesn't use his Susanoo to protect himself from the poisonous weapons he's still really nimble and do you think if killing him was as simple as poisoning him one of the sins you would have done it during the warring States Period in case anybody's forgotten matter was fast enough to react to a blitz attempt from KCM to Naruto who is faster than KCM one Naruto who is faster than the Reich a guy who is one of the fastest ninja of all time on that note I'm gonna move on to another point I saw pretty frequently I saw a handful of people claiming that if any of the Akatsuki members managed to draw even a drop of blood from moderates body that it's game over for him because all they have to do is pass the blood to hidan and he can kill moderate with his weird joshing ritual thing the issue with making this claim is that the Akatsuki would have to successfully injure moderate before he manages to deal with you Don and I don't think that's incredibly likely to happen yes sure the Akatsuki has its strength in numbers but to say they'd be overwhelmed fighting against Madara is a massive understatement we saw during his fight against the Allied shinobi forces 4th division that he's more than capable of handling does of people at the same time in a taijutsu confrontation so even if the entire Akatsuki rushes moderate all at once he'll be fine for at least a little while I think this is especially true because only a handful of the Akatsuki members are actually proficient with taijutsu Daedra and conan have shown almost zero skill with taijutsu and the rest of the Akatsuki x' members for the most part our masters of various forms of ninjutsu and genjutsu it's also important to keep in mind that he doesn't have to engage the Akatsuki in a taijutsu battle he can do what he did against the Allied shinobi forces and summon his Susanoo if anybody gets too close to injuring him and Madara is ninjutsu kind of speaks for itself like even one of his basic fire jutsu required at least a dozen members of the Allied shinobi forces to work together and perform a combined water jutsu to stop it they didn't even overpower mater as fired you to either they just cancelled it out final Valley Madara would have the ninetails on his side which is a pretty big deal since it's a lot more powerful than anybody in the Akatsuki Naruto's eight tailed transformation which is an incomplete version of one-half of the nine tails was too powerful for pain to handle and with the exceptions of Obito and arguably Itachi pains the most powerful member of the Akatsuki meaning that nobody else in the group would be able to do much against the nine tails either Edo Maduro would be completely immune to he Don's joshing ritual since he doesn't bleed in the first place and to the moderate that was revived with the ronee Tensei after the conclusion of the fight with jiu ito probably wouldn't get hit by any of the akatsuki x' attacks due to the extrasensory powers provided by Sage Mode like he was able to avoid hits from Naruto and Sasuke at the same time before blitzing both of them and to a Toby Rama tried to surprise him by teleporting behind him with the flying Raijin jutsu it didn't work either this moderate can also use limbo some in the ghetto Mazo and use all of the rena Gon's other abilities like Shinra Tensei my final argument against hidan being able to contribute in the fight at all is that he sucks he was too slow to avoid being caught by Shikamaru shadow possession jutsu and this wasn't a one-time thing only either this happened on two separate occasions in the same fight and then he got his head sliced off by one attack from Asuma since awesomest chakra blades are sharp enough to do this I imagine that moderate Susanoo swords could do the same thing meaning that he Don will probably be a non-factor in this fight like with data if you want use an in character argument for hidan here he likes to gloat a lot and it took him a really long time to actually get to performing the joshing ritual as in he spins like four or five entire pages just bragging to Asuma about how he's going to die he also needlessly stabs himself in the leg to make awesomo suffer instead of outright killing him and if he pulls any of this [ __ ] against Madara he's going to get himself killed immediately on the general subject of the Akatsuki trying to rush moderate down in a hand-to-hand confrontation some people may think that I'm being unfair towards the Akatsuki or bias towards moderate or a mixture of both I honestly don't think that there's much they could do against him in a scenario like this moderate has shadow clones and if we're talking about any form of moderate post edo tensei then he also has wood clones and to the wood clones have the confirmed ability of being able to use the Susanoo he can make at least twenty five of them and all of them can cloak themselves in a full-body Susanoo and even without throwing the Susanoo on the table 25 copies of moderate ichi ha is a lot to worry about anyway he also showed during his battle against both the fourth Division and the Reika gay that even in the heat of battle he's able to place people under sharingan genjutsu and since sasuke's genjutsu worked on deidara and obito's genjutsu affected Conan I think it's a safe bet that one of moderates genjutsu would work on plenty of the group's other members you can try and argue that they'd be able to avoid making eye contact with him but even the Reika gay who was able to dodge having in a matter a suit at him wasn't able to avoid moderates genjutsu forever now on the subject of genjutsu let's talk about mr. tsukuyomi himself I've seen a lot of people that seemed pretty convinced that moderate doesn't have any answers to Itachi's genjutsu the one I see brought up most frequently is a femoral the one where he thought you just point to this target and traps them in genjutsu that way and I don't think this is a serious problem for moderate because he should be able to see the genjutsu coming for example during the battle that took place when Itachi and Kisame first showed up in Konoha Kakashi could tell when Itachi was about to use tsukuyomi which allowed him to preemptively warn Kurenai and awesome ax to shut their eyes this is because his Sharingan let him see that an abnormal amount of chakra was being built up in Itachi's eye and now you could argue that Madara may not immediately expect genjutsu when he sees Itachi's chakra begin to gather in his finger but it's fairly likely that he just move out of the way of whatever direction thought she was pointing in any way just to avoid being hit by whatever jutsu he thinks is about to be cast on him also even if he does get caught by one of Utah cheese genjutsu if he's at a point in the fight where he's already created a clone then the clone can just use it sharingan genjutsu to break him out of Itachi's genjutsu the same way that Itachi and sasuke did during the fight against Kabuto and while I don't normally like to bring up the data books because they tend to make some pretty wacky claims if you do take them seriously then according to the third data book Sasuke was able to break free of Itachi tsukuyomi using his Sharingan mastery on its own and since Madara has an eternal mangekyo sharingan and sasuke broke for using a base Sharingan not to mention Madara skill with the base Sharingan should far exceed what Sasuke's was at this point he should be able to break out without any problems even if you don't agree with this it's not much of a stretch to say that moderate would just avoid looking into Itachi's eyes since he knows he's dealing with an Uchiha and they're known for casting visual genjutsu and if you want to stick with the finger genjutsu argument I mean there's still a lot of holes in it like for instance Madara could just end up moving around too quickly throughout the entire fight for Itachi to point at him for long enough to activate the genjutsu and even if that doesn't end up being the case it's also possible that ephemeral only works on its target as intended if the target makes eye contact with the caster's finger I say this because Naruto was only trapped in the genjutsu after looking directly at Itachi's finger and Itachi also didn't even think to use it against Kabuto in a situation where you'd think it it'd be perfect since Kabuto was acting like he was completely immune to any genjutsu sasuke or Itachi could throw at him and something like this that allegedly doesn't require the targets eyesight to work I mean surely that'd catch Kabuto off guard and would probably be pretty effective but both Itachi and Sasuke acted like Izanami was this busted revolutionary jutsu just because it worked on blind people so that makes me feel like a femoral isn't nearly as powerful as everybody seems to think it is now Izanami would probably work on Madara if Itachi successfully casted on him but I don't think he'd be able to Madara is shown through his recognition of plenty of jutsu that you wouldn't expect him to know about that his knowledge of the ninja arts is pretty extensive and he seems to know quite a bit about anything related to the youichi hawk lean in particular so I see no reason to believe that he doesn't know what Izanami is and since he likely is aware of what it does and the setup required to perform it he should be more than capable of taking the steps necessary to prevent Itachi from using it on him another thing about Izanami is for Itachi to use it he has to disperse his Susanoo and as strong as Itachi is I don't think he'd survive for very long in a fight against moderate without its added protection speaking of Itachi Susanoo let's go ahead and talk about it specifically the Totsuka blade and the yatta mere since they're the only reasons everybody hyped it up so much so there's this widespread idea that the Jaromir is an invincible shield that can change its size shape and properties and this is all pretty baseless the only things we've seen it protect Itachi from are a series of explosions created by a bunch of paper bombs thrown at it by Sasuke and Kiran and while these are both kind of impressive Kiran being the standout example here neither of them come close to generating the kind of force that a single swing from the sword wielded by moderates perfect Susanoo would and even if we take into account what the data book says about how the yada meera can change its properties in accordance with whatever attack it's colliding with nowhere on the page does it say the gotta mirror is infinitely durable even if it was invincible we know that it's not omnidirectional because we can clearly see the Susanoo move its arm to properly position the shield against oncoming attack this is something that wouldn't need to happen if the yada meera could just expand and wrap itself around the Itachi Susanoo to keep it from breaking so Madara could just avoid the shield and hit the Susanoo anywhere else and it would probably shatter to pieces in Itachi would get cut in half now on the subject of the Totsuka blade it wouldn't work on moderate either I know it's supposed to be able to seal anybody it Pierce's but how in the world is Itachi supposed to stab moderate with the Totsuka blade when he's all the way down here and moderates all the way up there you could argue that all Itachi has to do to seal Madara is stab any part of the Susanoo but that's probably not how it works during Orochimaru brief appearance in the middle of Itachi's fight with Sasuke Itachi chooses to stab Orochimaru body specifically even though it's further away from him than any other part of the eight-headed serpent this kind of implies that to seal somebody in the Susanoo gordy tachi can't just stab something that's connected to them he has to stab the person themselves moderate can counter Itachi Susanoo through other means - like he could summon a wooden dragon or a bunch of trees to immobilize it if we're talking about Edo Madara so we thought she doesn't pose any sort of serious threat to him moving out of pain I want to say that he's a big deal because I don't want it to seem like I'm downplaying him but even if all six paths worked as a team I can't see them being much of a factor here first of all Edo Madara and any version of moderate that comes after that can counter any of pains Rinnegan jutsu by using his own Rinnegan jutsu and even setting that aside the ped's of pain aren't very durable Konohamaru took out the Naraka path with a single Rasengan Naruto took out both the Asura path and the Preta path respectively with a single punch and he was able to knock the animal path out of commission just by hitting it whether a sing on barrage the animal path summons weren't super durable either two of them went down to a single Adama Rasengan each meanwhile Naruto had to hurl like a hundred of those things into the nine tails to do any sort of meaningful damage to it and he had to slam dozens of them until one of modder as oncoming would release jutsu just to stop it from killing everybody standing behind him so Madara probably wouldn't have a very hard time getting rid of any of the pads of pain with the only possible exception being the diva path even then the only things that the diva path could really do to him would be to use Chiba ku Tensei or a chaotic Shinra Tensei these are pretty large-scale attacks but again because we're talking about Madara Uchiha they don't matter too much we already know that the nine tails is easily capable of breaking free from atcha Baku Tensei so I'm pretty sure that mata is perfect Susanoo would be able to do the same thing it's not even like he'd get trapped inside of the chibok ooh ten Saiyan needs a breakout in the first place though like if he tachi Naruto and B could destroy a much stronger version of the gravity sphere that the diva path would be using against a madhuri here then a swing from moderate perfect Susanoo would certainly be able to get the job done we've also seen a perfect Susanoo cut multiple Chewbacca Tensei satellites in half before and yeah sure the person doing it was sasuke who's stronger than any of the versions of moderate that i'm talking about but the person dropping these chiba coot in say satellites was six paths Madara who is also way stronger than pain so I think it's sort of evens out then on the subject of chaotic Shinra Tensei if the perfect Susanoo can tank a c0 it should also be able to take one of these moderate should also be able to counter with a chaotic Shinra Tensei of his own and I'd argue that it would be a lot more powerful than one of pains would but that's a bit less concrete than the perfect Susanoo argument and it all doesn't apply to valley of the n moderate so it's not super important then finally of course there's the fact that pain can't use chaotic Shinra Tensei or qi baku Tensei without killing the rest of the Akatsuki members as was the case with data is c0 and sorceress poison I don't think I really need to address kakuzu rakonin I mean Conan's a complete non factor here like yes she did do that whole 600 billion paper bombs thing against Obito but that clearly required a lot of prep time and any of her paper jutsu aside from something that extreme would be completely ineffective against a Susanoo perfect or not I mean I guess kakuzu might be able to do something but I can't think of anything substantial as we know moderate fought hoshi rama to a near standstill meanwhile caca zoo's attempt to assassinate Hoshi Rama obviously didn't go too well Naruto also single-handedly took out two of his hearts and Kakashi did the same thing what makes that even worse is that we're not talking about 4th war Kakashi this is early shipping and Kakashi without all of his crazy right on and calmly nonsense so somebody like moderate would be way too much for him to handle he saw me is pretty powerful but he's not as strong as Itachi or pain and he doesn't have any attacks that are on the same level as c0 like Daedra so I can't see him making much of a dent in moderates defenses either he did nearly beat B which is pretty impressive and he also survived getting hit point-blank by a powered up here ooh Dora and while he wasn't in any condition to fight after being hit by the hero Dora it's still impressive that he survived it regardless but like what could he do against Madara I mean of course he confused with samehada and then just summon the giant lake but moderate could respond with the perfect Susanoo and also the giant lake would heavily restrict the movements of the other Akatsuki members their ability to do any sort of damage tomorrow would be inhibited as well since data is explosives probably wouldn't work nearly as well underwater and I can't think of too many other people who'd be able to effectively fight moderate underwater so I don't see that being super useful here either the last person I want to talk about is Obito and now if Obito's on the team then that means Sasori is dead but even if you want to include saucer ii like that doesn't make a gigantic difference but yeah a lot of people seem to think that Obito would be a real problem for Madara and they're right Obito's ability to face through attacks is pretty difficult to deal with but the thing is Obito doesn't have a lot of attacks that are high and destructive power he'll have to rely on using comely to suck Madara into his pocket dimension and for him to do that he has to leave his body open to taking damage we also know that Obito isn't incredibly durable he can't sustain a very extensive amount of damage for example when he fought in Minato he practically gave up after being hit by one Rasengan and Conan's explosive tags did a lot more damage to his body than I expected them to now maybe Conan's paper bombs are particularly powerful or something I'm not really sure but what I do know is they're not as powerful as a lot of the attacks that moderate can dish out and since we're talking about orange mass kobito mater is definitely fast enough to respond to any of Obito's attempts to suck him into the combo we dimension like as soon as he sees that Obito's vulnerable he's going to capitalize on it and like I said earlier Obito can't survive repeatedly taking the kinds of hits that moderate can dish out now some of you may think that I'm giving moderate too much credit and acting like he's faster than he actually is but here on this page we can see Obito failing to sneak up on KC m1 Naruto meanwhile as I mentioned earlier in the video moderate has casually reacted to a blitz attempt from KCM to Naruto now I know Obito can use ease and Nagi but all that should mean is moderate will have to kill him a second time and he should definitely be prepared for ease and oggi to be used against him since he acted his obito's mentor for a short period of time now I'm not saying taking Obito out will be the easiest thing he's ever done but it's something he's certainly capable of and I have no doubt that he'd be able to do it a second time in a row now one thing a handful of people criticized kalida knife for doing in the original video is talking more about how madre was stack up against each individual member of the Akatsuki then how he would handle fighting the group as a whole but I wasn't trying to convince anybody that Madara could beat each member of the Akatsuki on their own I don't think anybody needs to be convinced of that everybody knows moderate could be saucer II or data or pain or whatever in a one-on-one the point that I was trying to get across in this video is that none of them have even the slightest chance of beating moderate and so even if you were to team them up with eight or nine other people of similar skill and power it wouldn't matter because of who their opponent is and while I get why people think otherwise I'm not saying this because of some bias I have towards moderate I wouldn't claim that the Akatsuki could beat hoshi rama either and I'm even willing to argue that KCM to sage mode war Naruto would be too much for them to handle and it's not that I don't respect the Akatsuki I get that they're very strong especially when working as a group but when we're dealing with somebody who's c0 and Chiba ku Tensei are completely worthless against what on earth are the Akatsuki supposed to do to win against somebody like that I mean it's not for the perfect Susanoo I'd be much more inclined to say that they could at least beat Valley of the end Madara but then as you get to later forms of moderate with the Rinnegan and would release and limbo and all this other crazy nonsense it starts to get pretty easy to imagine how the Akatsuki would end up feeling a bit overwhelmed in a fight against this guy that's really all I have to say if you disagree feel free to leave any arguments or counter points in the comments below if you have any ideas for a future video topics make sure to leave them in the comments or shoot me a mention on Twitter but yeah that should be everything so thanks as always for watching the video all the way to the end and make sure you have a great rest of the day until my next video I'll talk to you later swag hug a out bye [Music]

Channel: Swagkage

Views: 2,208,153

Keywords: naruto, naruto shippuden, naruto explained, naruto shippuden explained, swagkage, swagkage naruto, swagkage naruto shippuden, top 5 naruto fights, rinnegan explained, eight gates explained, top 5 broken naruto abilities, top 5 naruto hax, transformation jutsu explained, obito vs itachi, shadow clones explained, sharingan explained, mangekyo sharingan explained, naruto uchiha clan, madara vs akatsuki, could madara beat the akatsuki, madara uchiha vs the akatsuki, madara uchiha

Id: 9b3cPVplFDI

Length: 25min 44sec (1544 seconds)

Published: Fri Nov 30 2018