Janette Blakemore, Rosemarie Morgan-Watson, Phil Dickinson - Enneagram Type 4 - The Romantic - IM

hello and welcome again to conscience TV I'm in McNay and today we have a program again on the Enneagram in our series and this is about type 4 and I have three people in the studio with me who are type fours we have is your net fill Rosemarie so welcome guys and so maybe let's start with you Jeanette if I can ask you how you first heard about the Enneagram mmm I first came across the anagram in the early part of 1998 when I was working in training and development area and actually went on a week-long course in Bristol and absolutely loved it straight away I knew it was there one of the models for me so what did you love about it oh what I loved about it was that for a long time I'd felt that our personal and spiritual journeys were one in the same thing that were kind of part of the same continuum but I hadn't found a model a tool that brought those two together in a very conscious way so when I came across the any room here at last was something that helped us both on our personal and spiritual journeys so I was just so excited that here was a model that really reflected something that I'd been thinking about for quite a while was needed and here it is and it really spoke to me deeply my first answer what is the elia ground in the nd ground is a geometric figure and if you think about if the word itself Enya is from the Greek word note for line and gram as in diagram so it literally means nine points on a figure okay and the ND ground can be used in many different ways the way that we're focusing on today for this program is looking at personality type but the any gram can be used as a model to understand many different things so for instance Gurdjieff who brought the model to the West in the early 1900s he looked at using the Enneagram to understand complex systems such as the universe and how all of that works but today we're working with the personality types and what that means is the Enneagram can really help us understand ourselves and others in quite a deep way so it helps us understand our deep motivations and also both our limitations and our potential and I will be talking about that a bit later and unlike a lot of tools in this personality area the Enneagram doesn't put us into a box in fact it shows us the box that we put ourselves in unconsciously most of the time and most importantly it shows us the way out of that so it's very powerful oh good yeah okay so let's just briefly have the story of how you guys also so that's heard of the le grand well for me it was through my husband he was on another training and those trainers were interested in the Enneagram and they held a weekend course and he said let's go and we went along and thoroughly enjoyed that but in fact my husband was also doing training and he got very deeply involved in it and I I was not so enamored at the beginning I think as as Jeanette has been describing but it was it there was a curiosity but it was only about mm okay that's that's interesting and then it kind of grew because I recognized how powerfully to that actually is and I like the dynamic quality of the Enneagram how quickly did you recognize your type uh fairly quickly I think I made a few other detours before I got to fall but probably one other particularly but when I did the questionnaire it came out quite strongly when I do it well it's quite remarkable how it kind of looks like it nails you down but it does give you a pretty good indication doesn't it when you really look yeah and it wasn't the one I went to immediately okay okay Phil what's what's your story basically with enam well came across it very similar time to Jeanette and sort of late 90s and having done a lot of work with other personality types so I'm like I've been teaching myers-briggs for quite a long time um and that is very valuable for what it is and I think the Enneagram brings something different and so I think to where to understand our complexity the more maps we have for understanding that complexity the better and yeah I don't believe anyone is particularly oh that's the one it's sad for me the Enneagram M brings something that young Jian type doesn't and more around the growth areas um yeah I think it was for me a a route into a more spiritual journey now whether it's turned out that way or not I don't know but at the time that was what I was looking for but how did you feel when you found out you were type 4 um reassured I think just for me were that what was very powerful is the it's the small little examples of behavior that I mean sometimes when you read the foot type for description I think well I'm not sure but actually when you look at the underlying motivations and you see where your own habits of behavior are coming from that's actually very powerful right it's always easy to do something about but it's you know to realize that actually when you're sitting there in every single moment not quite being satisfied with how that moment is then that's the type for motivation okay so for people who are watching this program that don't know much or anything about the Enneagram and they want to know whether they're a type for or not what would you say and the main characteristics are the personality type of theof the four starts there I'm sure you're going to input into this I mean if I just just go in there do this because it's following on from that it's yeah in every moment no matter how I deal you think that is it's always thinking and it could be better it's the inability to sit with exactly what is and just enjoy it so um you know for example I was oh I was on the Isle of Wight yesterday and yes okay it was drinking it down with rain but I was visiting an artist a potter who i am fascinated with her work and what was constantly going through my mind is and I wish I was doing that and I've missed that opportunity instead of actually just delighting in the engagement with that person and staying with it it's the sort of gosh isn't this fantastic and why am I not doing it this is something sad the habit does that exchange we all feel that they're all a different time I'm not a type 4 I still refuse yeah that's the that's the for me is the longing bit that you read in Haley so for year Liz Patil it was the longing you connected with yeah and that can be at a huge level or it can be just in that moment just not being satisfied with exactly what's happening yeah I recognized a much more in the past now how I would look an MV other people for oh they've got this or they've got that they seem to have got it together why haven't I got it together I recognise that part of it I don't know whether I'm you know it's quite difficult when you look into your past and I think that's and perhaps another thing as a four is that I tend to look back a lot at what has been and dug in to what has been but this sort of not not enjoying things in the moment I would say I do I do enjoy things in the moment but not all the not all the time yeah yeah because it's difficult to sort of you know put these things it's like Jeanette saying about boxes that often for me it's it's a moving goalpost all the time so talking about it now I know when I was younger I would have been much more fixed and sort of always looking for certain things and and feeling about a bit hard down by and you know I haven't got bad and that has changed and I'm able to take a different perspective nowadays so it's like the grass is always greener on the other side of the hell is that the type of feeling sometimes for you grass is always greener to some extent to some extent I think when you say sometimes that's important you know we're not always locked into that habit of behavior all the time I think one of the advantages if the Enneagram is being able to recognize oh that's that's the type you know stay with what is and so yes there are times when yeah be with the moment read to the times take ourselves away from it unnecessarily yeah okay see that what what sir hmm I think the sensitivity and introspection of the four are really key for me and how that plays out for me is I remember as a child and still now but but certainly as a child one of the things that used to puzzle me was was how affected I was by things I used to be very emotional at you know sort sad stories or hymns in school I would be crying when everybody else wasn't and I didn't understand what I was I so affected and you know and of course that immediately and this is another characteristic of before I think I turned in on myself and I was the one who was wrong there was something missing in me or different about me that didn't quite fit so I think this is another aspect of the fall that we look at the world and there's an instant comparison usually on the whole a more negative comparison might as rosemary was saying of kind of they've got it I haven't there's something missing in my own way of being it's not they've got it in the sense of they've got a nice car or a lovely suit it's something about their being in the world that as force we can often envy we can often compare and that then turns in on ourselves in quite a negative way so that's one of one of the patterns just one of the patterns and there are other things around feeling unique and special and different and and again that being a double-edged sword of course we all are every single human being every sentient being on the planet is unique and special and different but from a full perspective it's that's often that there's something set apart about me there's something that's kind of not quite fitting in with other people and as if I'm an average for then that becomes my identity that becomes I move away from other people I don't move towards other people and I start to and this is a very key element of for I create a whole internal world around that around my feelings so other types mice might say I think therefore I am with forces I feel therefore I am so no my feelings are my whole arbiter of kind of how I am in the world so my feelings start to if I'm not careful if I'm not present and awake take over and take me further and further away from reality from the reality of engaging with you with being here I'm often some usually quite negative fantasy about what's actually going on in relation to me in relation to my inadequacy yeah it's interesting because we made a program earlier today with type sevens and they're very feeling orientated but their feelings seem to come out it's in the difference with the fours is that the feelings you more bring them in and keep them into yourselves there is a deep introspection with force they are a chord and with two other types the withdrawn types and what that means is that we withdraw in order to make sense of the world so I'm affected by something someone says something I take it inside and I start to make sense and make meaning from that often way off them off I've learned over time but nevertheless it's in it as you say it's an internal process I don't feel I necessarily have to go out and act on it but I'm certainly doing activity inside with it and often a negative activity there's some there's some judgment about myself that's going on okay is there any other clues that people who are watching this try to guess whether or for their type for what might be might be useful for them I think Jeanette hit most of the key features they're learning the sensitivity they're taking things to heart as you know really an odd comment that somebody makes and it'll sort of that's it feels like a wounding first even you know this this gets engaged first before anything else and then this takes over and builds lots of stories and and creates that fantasy you know and taking things personally everything's a personal reflection on me yeah yes it's also must be difficult actually yeah yeah it's quite a challenge everything easy come to terms with that yeah so when you realize that and that was obviously valuable information how did that affect affect your lives well it was huge because again I think one of the beauties of the Andy Graham in general is that we often think we're the only one and and only one with our particular pattern all our particular suffering and first of all we can see that there are many other people who have a similar kind of pattern and that's both a relief and and an amazing kind of growth potential really without and an embarrassment there's a whole area of shame with with Falls it is very interesting area of kind of being being ashamed of how we are and being a fear of being shown to be inadequate in some way so I've lost your question was original question I was so so interested in the inadequacy I got a new class overall what I'm trying to do is for people that were watching this the better their type gonna feel for it so um you know I specifically asked you how you how you how you felt about it but let me just I made some notes from some of the books let me just read through this this is not necessarily for you guys to comment any kind if you like just just so it's good to give a broad spectrum of information for people here and you've touched on most and sensitive to critical remarks ideals are important always searching for my true self okay you're nodding there good it's three ticks forgot that one that's a big um awful long for what others have which you've already mentioned expert experience dark moods of emptiness and despair okay well coming to that sure thing abandoned don't like being told what to do I think that's true and many times yes yeah and feel like an outsider from the full perspective I would say on and that don't been taught to do is wanting to do things our own unique special way and that being very important and for some people that's a very creative way yeah when I say creative I don't just mean like in a traditional artistic sense although some fools are artists but not Oh artists off fours but it would be some kind of personal creativity that would be important for the for to engage in to express themselves in that way and so you know I want to do it my way and in what with my own unique expression would be how that would come out years I think many many people whatever time thing I want to do things their own way but if that's the particular flavor I think for for is with my own creative slant on it whatever that is and whatever many year on I'm working it would you I think it's interesting reading those words that you I tend to think if you sort of look at those and try and use those as a diagnosis that can be quite difficult and personally I found and and in discussion with other people the best way around is to sort of just start noticing well what is it that I do do and where is that motivation coming from and again in the sort of the smallest little bits of behavior through to the big patterns and the more you're aware of your habit of mind and where you automatically go then you can start analyzing well is that a for motivation or is that a five or it's sin you know some people you read the description bang is obvious other times you need to kind of get underneath it and the the out periods of dark depression is our after no way no I don't do that well but in its own little way I will have periods where the dissatisfaction is greater than it is in other months whatever so when I think everybody is unique in their behavioral expression of some of those patterns and for me you know becoming aware of what is it that I do do is a more important step than nailing down your type it's a very good point you're making actually yeah I'd really agree with that I think one of the teachers as I was reading earlier and I was on the train coming here I talked about how our attention gets magnetized in certain directions and I really like that it that is that drawl that we kind of have so the whole way of working with the any grammars Filson I think this is really important it isn't just about what's my label what's my new badge but actually it's a tool for self-awareness and for observing ourselves more and more honestly as I think we've just we haven't really touched on the spiritual journey but I think the any gram is a spiritual tool as well as a psychological tool and from a spiritual perspective it's really knowing deeply the real truth of who we are and the way through is to know deeply the way in which we deceive ourselves or the way in which we think our usual patterns our reality so we need to really be willing to look at those and our tenth our attention does get magnetized in certain areas and does get drawn off and in that process from a spiritual perspective we get drawn away from ourselves we lose ourselves in our usual habitual response which is where the angiogram is so beautiful in very specifically offering us a map to look at where vie which cul-de-sacs have I gone into now you know that kind of thing really and so so down at that ability and willingness to self observe is is really critical unfortunately for us as far as I think one of our on our gifts which will probably come on to a bit later but but is that worthy instruct introspection is to really be very honest with what's going on in ourselves I think we're able to really land in that in a way that perhaps is more difficult for some types to really to be honest about this is actually what's going on here now and if we feel safe to be able to share that in quite an articulate way usually having is one of the gifts of our introspective type you know and our we're usually pretty self awareness as well as another area for for slit yeah you know okay I want to also try and keep the program basic in one way and so when you say self observe yes it just just talk very briefly about what that is for you how you self observe yes it's a great question because we yeah we do use these phrase that's just kind of glibly otherwise for me um well at a practical level I might notice that I've got some envious feelings about someone I'm thinking you know I wish I'd worn something that Rosemarie might have worn it was warming today and I can notice that happening and over time I noticed that quicker and quicker in the past I might be having some I might be withdrawing from her in some way I might be sort of pretending I don't want to talk to her or or just be too busy doing other things when actually what I'm what I'm doing is actually being envious of something about her so I can start to notice that happening and sometimes I might notice physical tensions around my shoulder around my neck a headache so I can start to kind of ask myself what's really going on here it's the mental patterns that we all have that we don't necessarily realize they're driving us a lot of the time yes so that's a question of really of trying to pull back and almost did not it almost disassociate to say well this is a pattern that I'm carrying somehow is that right I start to be able to look at it more objectively and not believe it so much okay no I don't necessarily believe my own story oh I see ah there I go again you know here it comes up again because these will be repeated patterns it won't be the first time so so I start to kind of say are okay and catch myself in the act again as they talked about in the end world and I think that's really really key to be able to ideally see it as it's happening and and for the the gap and sense of mind the gap though the gap being being closer between my am I doing it am i noticing it okay sorry the intention of doing that I mean to begin with I found certainly that you sort of you observe it after the fact you suddenly think ah yeah okay that's just what's happened and then that kind of goes backward in a way in in the process in that the more you have an intention of you know okay I'm going to be aware of really what's going on here and at some point you suddenly realize it's happening while it's happening it takes practice it does take progress it's not easy yeah I think we're picking a point you say them yeah a mental habit I think for me one of the very powerful things is it's a mental emotional and physical habit so that pattern is embodied in the whole system um and so being aware of you know how am i physically when I mentally wishing something was happening you know than the melancholy sit it fitting in is that sort of you know you saying then notice it well actually if I then decide well there I go again actually I don't want to go down that route then one of the ways of breaking that is physically and emotionally it's a sort of I don't think you can just think yourself out of it I think it's the whole system nothing that for me is one of the areas where and there's a lot of development work to do an understanding to do with the Enneagram a lot very valuable work I think to be done standing this whole the whole approach am i making sense then yeah framework to show you things and there's a lot of work that goes on bit has gone behind the scenes in the observation and understanding and the feeling yeah you know this this some reality or awareness that my habit of personality is Trump is removing or hiding me from and then that personality I've got into a habit of doing it here here and here and just trying to think myself out of it in my experience won't do it yeah yes need to work attitude all the levels okay so um I think you mentioned about the potential of the other in terms of once you understand your attack for and you and you've got familiar with your your my word patents and the way you're operating there's there's there's a potential for each person obviously in their lives and the type for has a particular potential I understand Alan if any want to talk about that I guess it's also a personal thing and so far is it's your particular potential I mean for me I I guess the potential is is there for everyone you know it's just recognizing the Faunus and the the holding back that that creates if I can recognize all those different things within me then that releases me from following the same path and allows me to be more creative to to enjoy things even more I mean for me personally music art all those sorts of things are really important but to actually get really involved in that and not just use it in the way that I use it now but to embody it as well as feel it as well as think it you know it's kind of embracing all all the things that that for me is what potential is about it's about recognizing the wholeness of it all and that it's all there for me if I let if I'm prepared to let go of what's the most familiar things to me so okay so when you say let go what does that mean for you me letting go of this is wounding you know letting go of that that was that was meant just for me it's it's not it's very body it's letting go of fear when I have my melancholy moods it's recognizing that I'm doing that I'm I'm feeding it I'm creating it I'm digging a hole for myself that I can get out I can go for a walk I can do something different that I have choices I have possibilities I don't have to do what I've done in the past and I don't have to make the past part of my present and my future that you know the future is there to be had it's to be created it's to be developed and to be inspired it sounds like it sounds like you know you were all saying about how you tend to bring your feelings inward it seems like it's a question it's almost the opposite process about your feelings coming out I think it's for me as well it's to trust I don't know about you tell me trusting people that it will be okay to go out there and to be whoever whatever and and to trust that people are going to be there and accept it and how's that process been for you um it's a work in process how's it being for me I suppose it's sort of going out a little bit testing out there are certain scenarios where it's very comfortable where you go certainly in in the spiritual work you know there's a sense of yeah everybody's there to support so this is okay this is safe but other environments you know and I think it is a testing it is a just testing the water and seeing whether that's okay for me but it's an ongoing process you know I see it as a journey that is just part of what life is for me so what some of the challenges for you fill in your journey of this from Discovery to to moving towards the potato sort of em just following on the potential bit that there's the potential of you know what are the strengths of my type what does it give and actually that sort of and the longing for hey wouldn't it be great if can be a very powerful motivation and that can be great you know so it can drive you places and as well as well what's the potential if I stop inhibiting myself so if I can sort of you know drop the negative patterns that that would be that a sitting there thinking about it stead of actually getting on and what's the right action and do it and so there's those two sides the the biggest challenge I think is that in deciding or in thinking hey you know my route is to become that then you create something really really special and of course it's the same old habit again you know that it will be wonderful if and so at some you know our habits kick in again and again and I think for is a very good at they sort of M you know I will be a a wonderfully calm spiritual being when I've done such and such but that's the full pattern you're not getting more spiritual though you're just falling in the same trap again yeah you have to be super aware to catch catch another and hit in the greater way and yeah I think we'll okay you know am i moving forwards what yeah right that's good yeah yeah I think for me the potential is the adventure of being in touch with reality whatever that is so for me to really meet reality and be with that and be with my emotional responses to that my mental responses my physical responses and and and let whatever I experience be okay and their potential in that is therefore whoever I'm Way from whatever I'm doing I hope that I might enable other people to feel safe to do that for themselves because we I think we all want to feel safe in the world and be acknowledged and understood and if I'm able to really allow myself to be as I am with all of my self here it connected with watch see what's happening not what's happening in my fantasy or what my dream world would be or my ideal partner or my ideal life but actually I'm landed here now physically mentally and emotionally um that's a huge adventure of me and I'm realizing that that is much much more attractive and interesting that anything that I have going on in my head anything that I've created in my own emotional fantasy about things including my ideal self no it's um I'm not not there at all in terms of that's my ongoing reality all the time it will get me wrong but it but it's certainly something I'm glimpsing more off as a possibility and I do think that is also not only facilitative and more joyful for me but but potentially is for people that I'm working with or living with or you know whatever you know any people that I that I come across in relationship and for life in general yes of course for all of us really it is a kind of a journey to discover our true selves whatever that means for us at the time and for you guys that the type for no you're a type 4 has helped help with progression towards that so what what's been the biggest stumbling block I know we may be covered this in a minor way but just interested because again people watching this that don't know much about the Enneagram who wonder if a type 4 they might identify with a particular stumbling block that you've had on a personal level well if I just ask was carrying off what I said just before that the danger that was so the biggest stumbling block for me is em doing things because I'm trying to be more special and different so it's an artistic thing you make some the many artists list earlier the cello at the moment yeah because I had a thing about I wish I played a musical instrument as a child you know I had an opportunity to do em drama which through childhood circumstances I didn't I'm now taking acting classes um and and I have pottery studio home but how much time I actually spend doing it so it's that sort of if I'm not careful I can set up all these special things and it's just the habit yeah mmm rather than just a like I was only I nearly said deeply engaging in them but of course that's making it too special again actually just gather and enjoy you yeah you know how many times to actually just sit down and just enjoy the cello practice because I want to reward myself or just sit and play with some play because I love doing it now that's the rabbit I don't often do that hmm it's all about an image if I'm not careful I don't know if that ya know that does resonate with me I know for instance painting I mean I'm not a brilliant painter but I have enjoyed but sometimes it's like oh if it's not that good or not that special by the time I finished it is it worth my time doing it so I may actually and I have I've given it up you know but actually I do enjoy doing it and I enjoy doing lots of different things but that there is that pitfall of it if it doesn't actually get some kind of that's tastic attention or something you know then I there's there's a danger that I decide well I won't do that because I'm not quite good enough that is this is this need for recognition as this part of it external recognition yeah I think there is so it's so certainly that's that's something that resonates with me and for me I'm afraid I I do have times when I can spiral into being very melancholy I I hope I don't show it to people a lot no doubt I I do in different ways that I haven't recognized so so why do you say you hope you don't show it to people um there's a long story attached to that um because other people don't really want to go there that's that's in my crude okay that it's it's not a pleasant place to be and it's of my making so why would I want to suck people into that but I do know that if I get certain things will trigger and that's those sorts of moods and if I allow them to really take me in to move then then I'm I'm not very productive luckily I've always described myself as someone who bounces back that I recognize I go down there but in a way I go down there to really battle it out so that I can then let it go - it's a strategy for me isn't this is a question I'm not saying that this is the case isn't it maybe the challenge and maybe the doorway to actually be in this medically state and just allow yourself to be there not knowing what's gonna happen whether is allow it is not wallowing is a challenge yes it is a challenge and there's a choice that is a choice hmm but it's on the whole it's I have found it I well I would assess it now is quite unproductive I mean I know there are times when I've done it in my I can you know remember episodes when I've really enjoyed it you know I can't get away from the fact that it's you know I have allowed it to be real I've been yet indulged is a good word I think but it's really not very productive he doesn't really take me any productive for me it's a sort of M so therefore what's the right action I can't remember whereabouts in the in the model that phrase right action comes from but it's this sort of M so what am I going to do about it mmm what's the link in the next five minutes that I will actually take physical action about I think it can be quite informative yeah you know I think coming back to you is that that I'm not saying it's about I'm not putting a label on that it's bad in terms of you know I can be with it and I think that's one of the things about force I think they can be with those very deep and dark areas but at some stage you have to reckon well I have to recognize that there's a world out there and it comes back to to Genet you know saying about this fantasy and reality and if I want to engage in the world and and discover more about myself and more about others and how to be in the world I've got to get out of there you know I'm hiding away in this little place and how is that for you this manically side of things um I'm just going back to the kind of ongoing challenge that I notice for me another one the biggest challenges is um assuming I don't have anything to offer and so what I tend to do is often look at other people idealize them put them on a pedestal look at all of their gifts and compare myself negatively so if I can't be like that person and do it their way and of course in the process I'm denying and not even really turning towards my own gifts that I have to offer there so I noticed that happening a lot and it still can be a tendency which can be a combination of withdrawal melancholy and I more and more again try and spot it try and catch myself in the act and what I've also found is reality testing things actually going out and sometimes if I can speaking to that person finding out hey they're a human being too they have limitations they have gaps it's not all rosy for them that actually really helps me have a reality check and actually take take my own sense of myself back and say this is actually what I have to offer here I think there is a I can often want it to be so unique and special and different but I'm not really with the reality of what I'm actually offering you know so so I I have an idealized sense of what that means and that takes me away from actually what I'm offering now so so it's that goes on in me why don't I still notice okay so what's it like for someone to be the relationship with a type 4 person what what is you should be asking if I'm asking it for a purpose I'm just I'm also always aware of people watching the program not knowing about the Enneagram I'm thinking well they might be funding a fair partner it's a type 4 so so we've heard it we've heard it from your point of view but what what you know what feedback do you get from your partners on how it is for them to be with you guys and yeah the because you're searching for an ideal in lots of different parts of your life then em I've had yes friends and partners say there's a sense of never being good enough and that's quite quite shocking that actually you at some level and then it's been more than once and you know that is being put out of not quite accepting the person just for who they are and yeah it's it's quite critical other people and I would I would say no I'm very uncritical person I don't Chris hospital but that gets felt gets further so it's not so much I get its this I should not put out its kind of bit you're feeling here put out a truce awful level yeah and yes we can we can all be pretty critical and I can be quite a perfectionist in some areas because this needs a bit of type one in me somewhere but yeah that and you have the ability to pull people in and then when you and kept them very close than the ability to push them away and I my experience as well is that that's a it's a it's a world of view of somebody that you can vertically morph them in front of you that when you I'm fully into the for pattern I can spot all the blemishes that's hard to be around yeah equally when I'm in the wow then a all I see is the good bit these are real polarities here are they and does that is that swing happen quite quickly sometimes from one to the other it can do I mean I've noticed that for me one of the experiences of we talked earlier about how the habit needs a physical embodiment that actually if I'm sitting much more in a grounded position actually I see the person for who they are who is hunting my for stuff then are lacking it's as if I've experienced somebody nearly physically exchanged so that's really good so you were sitting in a certain way and that's that's he went back to your for your you're caught in your for type yeah and that's that's where I could start spotting that you're you've got and then I have and stuff only marginal I could pick it up oh yeah and actually III fractionally noticed that just then really yeah so that's the habit of no that's really helpful to know this gun is details you know yeah sorry but much more here then that's there's a very different connection it's just me connecting to you for your and you and you can you guys do you do you ladies feel feel the same that it's you can switch like that yes definitely hypercritical of people people not feeling understood ironically I want to be understood and I don't give that time and energy to another and I know I can do that and yes of that sort of sense of dismissing people that don't come up to some sort of sometimes arbitrary standard about how they should be what they should be doing how they should be responding to me a lot of the time I have to say on the plus side I do think that that the Falls when they're more at their best really are able to hold a space for the other to really sense deeply into what's going on for them because we're able to be as yes phil was saying if we're more grounded in ourselves and are really able to be just just as I am then I know that the other is more able to access how they are so what's your different body positions we saw Phil's can you switch from one to the other oh um yeah there's sort of well it would be a kind of disdain actually beautiful way from you don't forget the camera mayonnaise it's kinda Miss Piggy you know so it's that kind of thing really versus um just just being here really just being here sensing my body being you know it's fully open to you as I can be a course beam up to myself and just allowing space for me to be which in turn allows space for you to be so I'm not turning away and not twisting myself I'm not having a sort of paddy about you know how superficial you are or how you know lack of understanding or like a sophistication all of that kind of stuff I'm getting so how you are it's also affecting how someone you're in contact with deafness to definitely yeah yeah both positively and negatively yeah yeah I think we forget that but that's very true yeah yeah and I think it's it's amazing how quickly we send those messages across you know without saying anything as well you know this is sort of body positioning yeah and they can be very much very subtle you know a facial changer I do things with my jaw on my lips that I've had comments on before now it's like you know that that's your jaw going rosemarie because you know there's a setna s-- which is just like I'm not listening really hmm you going to tell you when using well actually people have create something really special and yes so you know and they're not conscious they're just they just happen but I think it is when when there's a kind of become conscious yes yes again this catching yourself in the act but also it's a pattern of behaviors and it's not always just sitting in one but it's actually the softness that you move with rather than the angular you know they can be movements going on but some movements are encompassing there's a warmth there there's an openness there there's an inclusion rather than a barrier or I'm over here and you're over there when going to okay turn and I think in terms of you know the bigger picture on this that the M each person's physical emotional habit will be subtly different to go down the route say all fours do that yes yeah we're not sleeping I think all types have yeah but so each individual will have a physical emotional mental way of expressing their type and you could put sometimes notice it in other people and help them see it hold up a mirror but I'd be very much against diagnosing and saying are that person's a seven look at what they're doing but but useful when you you know you just notice a shift in somebody then help as you say often we're not aware of that shift happening in ourselves hmm so it does seem like you're all other ongoing journey with Elia Graham is one of your guides so to speak yeah yeah and just one other thing I'm at that and it's noticing well when is that habit not helping me because a lot of the time well that's me it's um it's the positivity I bring to the world so and you we can we can be a bit down on our types sometime or are on our mental emotional physical habits and they're gray a what US had they are what helped us operate in the world and occasionally might want to change them yes but isn't isn't there a distinction there between the habit and something that is truly expression of us that have it been something that's more acquired if you like rather than something that is fundamentally more tangible yeah I think I would still say and that habit um it's still very useful to me at times and I wouldn't want to get rid of it completely okay and I think yeah I well I'd be very uncomfortable with working with anybody especially myself to say well actually get rid of that no just recognize when is it putting me in a box or when it's trapping me and not enabling me to experience things differently okay we have about three or four minutes left so I don't know whether any of you wanted to say anything that you feel would be helpful to somebody watching this about that we haven't talked about on a type for in the Enneagram you start we usually got any quick points I suppose the main one is and some of the literature does make it into got amazingly dramatic and you know artistic depressives and I just think dashi over does it I think you can and you can have the four habit of mind done in a in slightly different ways than some of the behavioral descriptions but that's just a were a four of saying well actually I'm a unique form which is habit is really buddy famous that typifies the four in terms of the more dramatic side I usually actually research system that the suggested famous people I didn't let them do that on this occasion well I reckon Michael Jackson was a four okay long drama okay yes I am and yeah people like Alanis Morisette who else Martha Graham the dancer right know each other own unique expression but there's something can be quite dramatic and I think just building on what what Phil said really I think there can be a danger of just stir there's a huge range with all of these types and you know as we as we deepen into our spiritual journey we do see all these different traits and styles but I think it's very important to still be with the mystery of what's underneath all of that to not know really who we are and that's like I think I think a particular irony with the fall because one of the things you could say is kind of a traitor for over for is is having a constant question of Who am I and what's my true identity and and in a sense as we go deeper into our journey with the anagram and other spiritual tools other practices we might be doing perhaps we're more open to not knowing who we are ironically we're less and less sure about that I know that I am with after-work in the continued work that I'm doing being more with the mystery and again that could be a sense of excitement rather than a sense of emptiness or a sense of lack in the case of the floor that there is a potential there in the mystery that that when we're trying to label Arsenal's are trying to say am i life or not or where am I on this spectrum that that whether we can move away from that's a great place to finish about the potential of the mystery so thank you okay thank you all of you for coming along and talking really about thank you about yourselves in your lives and I just want to just show some of the books if you've watched this program and other ones on the Enneagram you want to maybe know more about the anagram and about maybe what type you are then we have here we have someone just hanging it's the wisdom of the Enneagram by Don Rousseau and Russ had so much I haven't read but I hear it's very good it's my personal favorite I love okay great it's what I always mentioned that any Graham made easy which is kind of a beginners book but I still find very interesting useful at times there's two more which when we started you net mentioned the two the spiritual side of the Enneagram that's very much take that on board by Sandra Mae tree all these these two up both very good reads and then by ahms faceted unity which is quite an advanced and again that's really on the spiritual side but that he does take it into quite a fascinating realm so thank you thank you again to I guess and thank you for watching countries TV and watch out for more programs on the any ground series hope to see you again soon goodbye you

Channel: conscioustv

Views: 46,249

Rating: 4.8769231 out of 5

Keywords: Enneagram, Type4, 'The Romantic', Janette Blakemore, Phil Dickinson, Rosemarie, Morgan-Watson

Id: rA27yA2AYx0

Length: 52min 41sec (3161 seconds)

Published: Tue Feb 22 2011