Fixing multimeters that the factory can't find the fault in - for OBData capture packages

um afternoon everybody this isn't really going to be that exciting a stream this is just a case of i have to get these done and i figured i would sit here and annoy you all or rather you could entertain me while i got them done uh broken from factory is subjective i suppose i finally got a response back from final element 14 take your pick on the name and they said the factory cannot find any problem with the units um they don't believe it's a batch fault blah blah blah and i'm like whatever i said i'm just fixing them myself anyway because quite frankly i don't have any more time for this you try to do nice things like you try to let them know that there might be an issue and oh that's right they said we've had no other people return the units or complain about it and i explained to them that's probably for two factors and one is that under windows it's an intermittent issue the second is that most of the people who are buying these meters probably are not actually connecting them up to pcs in the first place so yes uh the device itself the meter part of it works fine it's only when you try to do communications and then under windows you will get a intermittent like every now and then it'll probably stop transmitting a value or something like that for a second or two and then carry on so it's not something that people are going to actually notice unless of course you happen to be doing what i was trying to do and you go hey my data keeps disappearing and the connection keeps failing what's going on so corner case fault i guess for me and the factory is like not our problem hey lexi and i can kind of half respect that that they don't care as it is i got the peak meter brand from aliexpress and they're fine so is only this batch of uh digital ones that are faulty i can't even you know the ch340 chipped is fine normally so i don't know what happened to these ones hey any triple five yeah i've got to get them replaced because i can't send these out like they are because they will fail for people when they're using them for openboard data i probably shouldn't be using 460 on this but whatever kind of makes things a bit smoky and yeah the user base is just incredibly small but it's not going to come up i was and i was just like that's i'm not going to bother wasting my time anymore i tried to help anyone who does have an issue with the meter and they happen to buy it from whanau well they can get a refund but i said if you it might just be this one particular batch and nothing else but certainly the ones i got from aliexpress are fine i mean obviously they're branded differently but they are the same meter ah but what's more amusing is that i've got like over 200 ch 340 chips now to do something i don't know what i'm gonna do with all these chips i mean they're very handy chips but i really have a lot of use for 200 of them i'm sure i'll find something maybe i'll do a chip art or something and glue them together maybe i'll sculpt someone's face using the chips i don't even know what i'm doing here i'm sort of half deciding whether i'm going to hot air it back down or solder it back down i'll probably solve it yes no good d goes unpunished precisely unfortunately at least you know it didn't actually it wasn't a penalty to me or anything like that it was just a disappointment ah for sake and this is when my brain starts telling me see you should have had to add it down [Music] it's like yeah whatever i probably will now [Music] this should really be a five second chip swap but for some reason it's taking me quite a bit longer okay one issue i've had different multimedia brands and typical failures to continue continuity mode which fails a lot over time i'm not really sure why that would be and let's put a great big divot into the outer casing of this [Music] that actually is soldered down but i'm going to add more solder for reinforcement yeah greg i am glad i found the fault at least it you know stopped me going insane hey hyperman yeah keeping busy here i had a couple of um nightstand attack jobs i was like really nightstand attack the screens completely shattered i don't think it was the nightstand [Music] oh look pedro's here pedro scam you i swear pedro you are the one that did that um ebay sale thing that's exactly your type of response to someone saying can you go a lower price and you come back and say sure and you give them a higher price that's exactly the sort of thing you would do i mean you're proud of it you post it all the time that you do that crap hey 10w uh you got them as well what sort of success rate do you have with making them realize it was their own dumb fault for dropping it it's always this far onto carpet that's like three inches plush and it's like no it's not so don't don't lie to me like that all right so that one should be good load it back in its frame put it back into the machine well dretchen you got to decide you know this is this is adult life food for you isn't it you have two conflicting needs or a want and a need and we've got to decide whether you wish to have the want override the need all right clearly i can't align my ports very well that's right hey jim yeah i'm certainly feeling better they said um as i messaged you the other night you know i was getting real close to that genuine panic phase there were a couple of times at 3 4 in the morning where i had to put myself through the calming mantra sort of things to stop the anxiety running wild over me and descending into the madness of panic it's kind of scary that after you spend a good number of years enduring panic attacks and trying to manage your anxiety and mental health you do seem to be able to have the capacity to separate yourself from the precursor well from the start of it you know you feel it coming on and you find a way to be able to convince yourself that it is just a panic attack and i shouldn't say just a panic attack rather say you know it's coming you know it's because you're panicking and you seem to be able to diffuse it before it gets out of hand or at least you're trying to sometimes it hangs on a bit too long but [Music] yeah should we just plug this in yep straight away no problems with the connection unplug it plug it back in yeah no dramas see with the chips before it would sometimes connect will then disconnect then it would lose it uh it would just be all over the place but this with the replacements now works reliably so we only got a few more of those to do let's see hyphen on fairly high success rate saved an 11 that went oh wow 11 washing machine yeah i guess that happens next one how was bunnings i forgot a few things of course but yeah we've got door stops oh that's right that does remind me i've got another project i don't know if i'm going to have any luck with this project but i bought a driveway alert device you know passive infrared thing pir i'll just show it here before i get on the meter okay this is just a cheap swan unit anything swan is basically cheap and on the packaging it's sort of mentioned doorbell and if you look on the back here you've like got melody change and the doorbell functionality whatever but i didn't see the little asterisks which said requires additional equipment i.e the doorbell tunes and activity only works for a doorbell unit it doesn't actually work for the pir system now the reason why that's a problem for me maybe i'll dem no i'll just tell you why with the pir unit when you activate it this thing goes off like a siren it's like yeah and it's it's loud it's great it's fantastic i love that it's loud you know it's got a you know genuine speaker in there and everything but that's not what i want i wanted to just do the doorbell noise or something a little less traumatic the cats hate it when they hear the siren sound they go hell to skelter but there's no way to get it so that when this gets triggered that this does a doorbell or some other alternate sound it is locked on being the siren only and i've tried all different programming techniques and what up and anyway you can't do it so what i'm going to try and do is either find a way if this thing does accept doorbells like it as an optional extra they must have a slightly different code that they transmit some prefix code or something like that that allows this to differentiate between the pir versus the doorbell but i have a horrible feeling it's all hard baked in and i'm not going to be able to change it there's no alternate triggering system that lets me you know it doesn't send one line up high for doorbell and one line up high for um for the pir the only difference might be that i might have a chance on is that these diodes are for the pir and this one here might be just for the doorbell and i might be able to find a way of rerouting out of that back into something else but i doubt it yeah so it could be 20 down the drain it's great as a alarm system but i don't want it as a driveway since i mean you don't want to freaking someone's invading your home on the driveway you know a normal driveway alert system yeah so it's i'm a bit annoyed with that my bad i should have read the fine print can get a little tricky to read the fine print when you're in the middle of bunnings and you don't have your glasses with you and i need a bigger screwdriver it's a nuisance trying to screw these out now unfortunately i took half of my toolbox down with me the townsville yesterday because i had to do a 1932 battery swap oh i'm gonna need that one out there i was doing a battery swap and so i just took the whole toolbox basically threw it in there no i do have a better screwdriver for this you know the next size up but oh looks like we're gonna have to keep on with this one ah yeah miles i don't know if we want the horror welcome uh what's geek asking i need to replace some surface mount components on a macbook i have the schematics but flexible review yeah just use openboardview that's what it's there for that's why i say on the flexboardview site if you are just doing this for a one-off job or you're not commercial just use openboardview it's there it works support it use it thank you pedro uh jim it's actually bo i just want activity in the driveway and i've had them before and they work great the only hiccup with this one this one it really works great it picks up you know the motion whether i'm walking or a car is moving in there the problem is just the alarm anyway if i can't bodge that one to do what i want i'll just go get another one it's fine they're so cheap and i just get them locally i'm just more frustrated that i got caught out of not reading the fine print i did at least get some nice doorbell ones yeah there's no shortage of driveway alarms and all that it was more a case of i'm just sitting here annoyed by the fact that i got caught out by thinking that had the option to be on alarm or on more of a doorbell noise i said i might be able to hack it or i might not it'll make for an interesting project if nothing else the really crude way i could go about it is just simply to remove the speaker and then just detect the led activity and when i see the led activity i then drive the speaker with my own little arduino i didn't say that my own little avr board i should do it using a tiny oh you know actually i can do that now that i think about it i can do that i've got my remote alarms my low voltage alarms so all i have to do is simply trigger that pin and now that that's going to be a piece of i'm not going to say what the word we normally say is but um yeah that's going to be a piece of cake that's a better word to use paul good job save yourself there yeah we'll do that we'll make it so that we just read the led status and then we will drive the speaker ourselves piece of cake a pop fix that's a good idea yeah we'll call it that edward rigo oh six girls here yeah miles i don't believe in the arduino i think it's a solution that was never needed hey dr electra pc you know if i manage to bodge fix this um driveway alarm i might even get some respect from dave jones not likely he doesn't believe in us queenslanders he thinks we're all a bunch of um weirdos we don't even speak proper english up here okay schematics do the plugin perfect i'll see if i'm not going to say that tony actually where i usually get in trouble is when i just freely start calling out your mother is a in afrikaans and [Music] i'm not going to say what the last word is but it's just a little bit too natural for me to yell it out and because basically nobody around here is afrikaans no one knows what i'm saying it's a little bit naughty but it's one of those bad swearing habits you get into that you shouldn't have see dave jones has a fast leak on one of his ev tyres and no spare tire it was probably the nightstand that stabbed his tire yes your mother's a saint that's the one here okay another one fixed up i do like the way that they actually this is why i like these mirrors well amongst other things first thing is it's got four double a batteries so you've got a lot of power there that's great second is the usb module is just so easy to replace third is that physically they stand up very they've got a good back stand so um yeah they don't fall over when you change modes fourth is that the usb plug is a mini usb and the cable can just be very light cable so it doesn't push your meter around i hate it when you plug in things cables and they start dictating where your equipment goes it's like hdmi cables can be bad for that hey bill baby monitors yeah okay oh yeah i think i saw that yeah all right so that's another one fixed we've only got four more to go and if we can get through this then i will um see what we can do about that alarm system i think we can make that work assuming i can remember how to program my old boards i'm sure i will even if i have to write the code again from scratch hey john finn joshua bell no this is not um a response to an l if an l can't work out how to do that then well that's an l's problem the only reason why i give support to lewis rossman when he has issues is because yeah he's got exposure leverage on me but for anyone else it's like yeah they can suffer on their own i find it's better to let people wallow in their [Music] sort of um yeah when they can't solve something i like to let people simmer in it for a while because more often than not once people realize that help's not coming straight away they will often try and sort it out themselves and lay behold they do work out how to solve it themselves which means that forever more i'll not have to solve that problem for them you gotta learn how to be a little bit cruel so that people can learn how to do things themselves yes adversity builds some character also some knowledge because it is very easy to fall into that trap of just simply asking people to answer your questions i mean i do it myself it's like the intelligent part of my brain just switches off and i go into please bro mode if someone gives me an answer a little too easily and i'm like oh cool that was easy the brain says let's do that again with something else and then before you know it you've got no idea how to pull a macbook apart [Music] yeah tough love results in remembering things but as i said when it comes to lewis sometimes i've got a i've got to respond to the baby screams otherwise he may just throw himself out of the cop please send an email for me on the second item the package is sent okay which one is that the esr or the containers the um plastic jar of things container right okay hey this one's faulty did i put the right chip back on or did i put the old one back on i might have just been [Music] no definitely having issues with this one yeah it's having trouble enumerating that makes me wonder whether i put the right chip back on am i certain i did looks legit but it's definitely given me the enumeration issues that i was experiencing with the so this one doesn't oh man i cannot talk today this one does not have the green stripe on it which is a pencil mark from the originals is that that's just a piece of hair this is what i go through and check everyone that i do is that i want to be sending out a meter that's not going to work particularly because a lot of these open board data packages are going overseas so i don't want to have to be paying double freight well the old ones have a green stripe on them see this green crayon mark so that's how i was knowing that it probably wasn't well it's not enumerating at all weird let's try another one i mean another one that we know that works that's fine something's wrong with this one something different i'll just spray the contacts on the inside get a circuit board cleaner uh sonia i'll just send you one actually it doesn't really matter as long as it's a meter that well it's one of the meters that i've written software for okay what am i missing here what the hell is going on there's not a lot that can really go iffy with this circuit you've got your crystal and you've got your chip not much else i'll get a um one of the cables we've got a whole large box of these cables they're actually for the keyboard capture unit not for the multimeter the multimeter comes with the same cable but um we also need one for the keyboard capture unit you seem to have a spare usb up there it says likely no this one's got me a little bit confused i did notice that yeah all right i'll try from a different selection of chips that i got floating here i'll actually take one out of the tube [Music] because really there's very little that could go wrong on these boards [Music] yeah miles i basically all my projects if i have to have a compact usb interface it will be usb mini it's actually a robust one rather than the damn micro one and you don't really save that much room going to the micro i mean you save a little bit and i suppose in the world of tenths of a millimeter it matters but uh overall i didn't really find it was worth the weakness and issues i mean sure the the micro usb is certainly more prevalent more people got the cables and all that stuff but mini really should have been a bit more popular on devices that um needed a bit of robustness i suppose what didn't help is when they moved to the usb 3 standard for data transfer they stuck the additional additional connector on the side to make that wide micro usb connection and that probably sealed the fate of the mini [Music] yeah both legs the crystal is soldered they're on the other side they're soldered yeah and the other problem of course is when you get the micro a one which is really weird because it's almost bi-directional when you put a mini uh a micro b in it but it's not it just breaks the tongue let's try this now that works fine okay it seems to be that particular variant of the chip is a problem uh if you have a look at the chip design physically because that works fine now it seems to be the ones that look like where is it these ones these ones here with the broad dimple on it yeah those broad dimple ones seem to be the real culprits i'm kind of curious now with the little dimple ones are okay mind you that doesn't make sense because i've got a lot of little dimple ones and i know they were definitely faulty yeah so those two broad dimple ones definitely aren't working all right we'll just replace another one and see how that goes so i can be so very frustrating when you're trying to replicate someone else's circuit and they may have just by freak chance pick the right variation of that particular chip that works for their project but all the other variations of it will not work that happens a little too often in life broad dimple bad match possibly bad or fake i mean mind you yo who would create fake ch340 series i mean they're already so cheap miles i did a micro to c conversion on my logitech k830 okay and i presume it worked i'm still not the greatest fan of the usbc connector i would have preferred it to be physically [Music] more like the lightning connector just in terms of durability but yeah it's what we've got now so can't always win everything inspector 12 okay dingle dodger yeah i don't know it could be either i didn't bother to check to see what it reported as so okay so the one that we just installed that we're happy with that has a firmware of 263 whereas the dodgy ones the 26254 no that's a good one actually two five four no no that's too far [Music] all from we've got three to go hopefully we can find some consistency in our form before we get to the end the obd2 connector i don't know that one obd2 is that um onboard diagnostics for cars yeah i would really don't want to see iphones switch to usbc i don't even know if they can i don't know what the accessory support would be like but yeah the usbc uh plug tongue oh sorry inner port tongue and the fact that you got twice as many connectors little pins in the plug now i suppose you can counter counterpoint that and say well yeah the plug's dead easy to replace which is true i think the bigger problem might be coming from funnily enough the likes of apple macbooks and such where the physical holding the shroud holding of the usbc is very lackluster at best and so it feels just sloppy [Music] and i hate that sloppy connector feel i mean hdmi is so bad for that too there probably are better standards for the hdmi you know standards physical standards that have a a superior tolerance for the shell and things like that you don't find it too often and implemented and it's one thing to have stains another actually have them implemented all right so we've got a um small dimple one here i'm kind of curious i'm gonna plug this in and see how it behaves yeah hey derek chun now this doesn't work this does not even come up so yeah it's like i'll show you the okay so like disconnect oh it just started to consider connecting then see plugging it in nothing not another not another not another if we get say one that we i think we just did see immediately connects so i love the fact that the factory is trying to tell me that these work just fine does this i can see error error error error it's not just fine that doesn't work so we're now going to change that chip and see what happens so it might have been those broad dimple ones came from my stock so maybe and they were loose ones in the packet they were not part of the tube sets so maybe there was some dodges anyway you can see this one's green striped so that is genuinely factory come on come on miles would be interesting to see how apple deals with the european regulations then because if the european regulation decides not everything's going to be usbc i'm kind of yeah i'm curious to see how apple counters that i guess it would be in their financial interest to bribe so to speak the council a few tens of million will be worth it okay so this is one of mine personally i don't think apples should be forced to have to do that crap i mean i understand that they're trying to reduce waste and things like that and apple themselves are pretty god awful when it comes to environmental good behavior stewardship but i still don't think that they should be forced to have to rescind the lightning connector [Music] that would just go with the wireless charger you see i mean and then that leaves us an even bigger hell then so that's the problem so you get these groups that try to do the nice thing and all it does is just makes companies skew around a different way and we end up with inferior result overall okay plug it in you're gonna tell me that you're not working you son of a all right i'm genuinely going to lose my knot soon oh that works if lightning wasn't proprietary i wonder if see what happened it probably still would have would have rather mostly because a lot of companies will create alternate standards simply because it's or two things we don't want to be apple we don't want to follow apple and not invented here syndrome which i suppose is the same thing i just noticed my face cam's a little overblown yeah i need to get a better front light on my face the failed query thing here that's me manipulating the camera okay so yeah this is a 263 so so these chips actually do have a different build variant to what i originally thought they were going to be because the first couple of samples that the guy sent me who oh shoot now from all of these they were all the 254 the initial samples but it looks like it's a legitimate mixed bag yeah we'll see how we got miles are you saying your money's on firmware issues with the actual chip cause yeah i mean i'll be going for that myself 264 seems to be the one that really does not work yeah probably a good number good thing i've got 200 of them now this straight up no problems i got to also be careful that i'm not misinterpreting linux being slack about assigning the uh usb device versus particularly if it's had a bunch of errors on that port you know maybe sort of like saying i'm going to wait around a little bit before i try enumerate this one again oh sorry i just realized i wasn't even connected it's another one done two to go [Music] certainly everyone that has failed seems to be a 264. let's see what's on there we'll do ah this is i gotta get a screwdriver that can do the job hmm [Music] see if it does any better funnily enough this is almost equally as awkward but at least i can get a little more pressure you know downward pressure on it [Music] it's like it's halfway between ph1 and ph2 on the philips so what is this yeah this is ph1 but if i go ph2 then the holes are generally a little bit too big for this the shaft is usually too big for the holes so we just have to use ph1 and then a bunch of force [Music] uh rodrigo that's probably because i've eliminated most of the frustrating people [Music] and we still do get the occasional coming in stirring up strife [Music] so we have one more of these to do after this one and then we'll have a shot at reworking that driveway system [Music] personally i would consider it a massive overkill what i'm going to do to it but and i mean for the price it's a bit of a waste so that'll be fun i hope and someone didn't put enough flux down so this is gonna never got lucky [Music] normally without enough flux there those making those pads would tend to sort of hershey kiss them a bit [Music] yeah nell is in here yeah mel i hear you're having troubles with multimeter [Music] display in your stream some people suggested i should have helped and i suggested that you should just you know mean up and use your brain a bit more oh good mark it's not a macbook oh well here comes the spammers [Music] oops someone's messaging me yep 263 and that works perfect so another one improved let's give that a wash okay i was about to put flux on there for washing it yeah that really would work spectacularly well if i'm very slimy circuit board hey gd tech good morning is gd tech supposed to be god damn i'm assuming exclamation tech driving the screws back in if this is okay in fact it's kind of better because it stops you from over driving the screw and because these just go into plastic standoffs then it's best not to overdrive you split the stand off and it's that's the end of the road you can repair them but it's no fun that's weird now this one's giving me grief what the hell's going on here and that's a two sec this is driving me up the wall okay i'll just check maybe it's my usb it's frustrating i do not have enough usb ports i have got several hubs and yet somehow i still manage to run out of ports just disconnecting the barcode scanner plug in the three-way usb port just even seeing if it stays stable and staying stable this time all right okay last one to go [Music] [Music] it's got a different wrap on it this one they can't even remain consistent within the the batch of devices [Music] that's a durator same as the others what's your usb device number count i'm at 265 at the moment funnily enough this one's actually this one's behaving okay and it's a 264. [Music] i'm going to leave it there for a little bit uh now that is the case with all of them i believe all of them from the factory [Music] i'm pretty sure the power tech ones i've got also come with the batteries [Music] now this one's actually stable very unusual yeah this is the basics the same meter peak meter and duratec they changed the brand on it that's about all now the batteries encrypted hahaha funnily enough it is a bit of an interesting thing that this whole batteries encrypted thing ended up being a bit of a hysteria response it turns out it is just the same as with the existing iphone batteries where if you don't have a genuine one it will complain but aside from that yeah it's not a major issue and i think when we get these hysteria events it actually is very damaging for our industry so i do wish that people producing those videos would take a little bit of extra time to eliminate you know to make sure they know what they're saying is actually correct hey gd tech uh programmer multimedia software it's been a while since i programmed something but see what i can do which meter have you got yeah yeah but the thing is what the complaint was is that it wouldn't even boot like if it that was the original thing if you don't have the genuine battery it's not going to boot but it turned out that's not the case and the trouble is the damage is done because now you're playing forever catch up with that far front because there's always going to be someone who hears that information first and you know pushes it ahead spreads it around before they themselves are updated to find out that is not the case but most of the time it's always lately now well not lately but it just seems to be a case of everybody's vying to be the first to do the teardown or the first to find the problem and things like that and i i think it's great that there is that intensity and you know competitiveness but at the same time there needs to be responsibility but feeling like kidding no one ever does that okay maybe there's no batteries in this one [Music] yeah it must be it must mean just the duratec ones have the batteries and these ones don't yeah now well not that i would trust those batteries to last more very long and i'm throwing away these i will put them in the package but we're not you're not going to have to use those horrible horrible leads yeah i'm going to replace these leads with these these are good quality hirschmann they're the same ones that i use and i think the best part about these is actually the alligator clips they're fantastic alligator clips and you got these pro points that are quite spiky just tell my fingers ask my fingers i should say they know say i will throw them in but or maybe i can't decide it's probably 150 grams of extra weight and it might push the packages over a certain weight limit we'll see yeah interesting no batteries in that one all right [Music] [Music] well i'm going to replace this one anyway just add an abundance of caution i probably don't have to but i'm going to do it yeah no i don't know why manufacturers bother i guess i gotta include something [Applause] i will say at least with these duratec meters i am happy that i got them at a discounted price because i basically bought all their stock what was remaining in the existing shipment [Music] well then i ended up finding him cheaper in china anyway through aliexpress [Music] for future for future open board data project capture kits i'll just be getting the ones from aliexpress the power tech meters and yeah people can supply their own batteries for batteries i like to use the eneloop pro double a's anyway you get a much longer life particularly if you are doing mostly things like diode and continuity mode it does drain the battery is pretty upset a bit do is the um that needs to be re-done that crystal that leg those legs are not going through that's interesting they um they're just floating there fantastic greg how much do they cost their for the inner loops i mean they're not the cheapest here either but it's wait there's existing legs in there what the hell there's old legs in there they're old legs they do not belong to that crystal or maybe they did that's crazy i have to dig those out [Music] [Music] now that just look like a pair of android memories [Music] okay the legs are out [Music] 45 for a set of what four or eight can you even still get the non-pro ones the white ones because they would last perfectly well too [Music] that's a little distressing seeing the crystal having been second soldered onto the [Music] forty five dollars panasonic analog fourth gen okay so it's an eight pack that's fine yeah no i think for an eight pack that's pretty good price actually i mean i would buy it at that price all right so we've got a bit of a problem here that this crystal the legs are just a little bit short so i kind of have to bend it but with these can crystals you don't want to bend them too much they do not like the junction between the case and the legs to be used as a fulcrum point as it were so you've kind of got to i'm probably overthinking this but it's easy to mess up crystals because you relied on that um piece of bakelite under the bottom of the can as the point where you bend the legs from uh now just look like a drunk walker that is a serious drunk walker we'll get that one this leg in and see what we can do about the other [Music] oh there's that spam again folks if you missed out on the first time now is your opportunity i'll just make a plan and work my way through it okay erica cleaning up cat people how delightful somebody's gonna do it you can expect the cats won't i'm kind of overdoing this there we go [Music] um i'm looking at these aren't being sold these packages these packages are already pre-funded through the right to repair initiative through rosman i'm just simply putting in the work to put them together and distribute them out but yeah they're already funded and i'm fairly sure i've allocated all of them now but there may be another batch put out depending on how much data we can get if we can show that it was a success and we pick up uh pick up some good data for the systems then yeah they may give us another round of funding if on the other hand it turns out to be a bit of a dud then yeah we won't get more funding hey thomas bulba [Music] i know it's an overkill but i'm just over filleting those oops looks like that's struck by an earthquake then uh derek chan the reason why they don't pour copper in that is because it costs more money remember these have been built down to the absolute minimum price possible so therefore copper poor costs money yeah that's all good 263 and working fine because if there's one thing that a lot of the chinese manufacturers and designers are exceptionally good at and that is being able to shave the cost of these things right down they can find truly mysteriously marvelous ways of cutting costs and you just you look at it and you kind of go okay well it works that's amazing and i don't even know how you came up with that idea but it does work although usually by work it's typically in a far narrow or smaller operating envelope but that doesn't matter as long as it works at standard temperature and pressure that's all good okay that's it all the meat is it done i just need to clean up the train wreck that i've created on the floor here i will go through and individually test them though i'm just organizing the boxes so i don't trip over them too much this is all supposed to be done about two weeks ago and it as usual didn't happen depends on what uh process they're using for the etching like i think most of them just use heated um well actually i don't really know for sure but i know often they can use cupric chloride or something like that and they just simply revitalize the etchant so the etchant really is more of a carrier rather than being consumed by the process i mean i'm sure they've done the number that's the thing they've probably done the numbers and they know what's the most economical option for them hey young zimmy yeah if they say a tenth of a cent they will save a tenth of a cent it's all a saving what is it penny save is a penny earned or something like that i don't know sounds like a uh george washington or one of those old people type sayings hey ben wilson but yeah most of us are unfortunately used to dealing with things like ferric chloride and such and yeah we see the copper being consumed and the etchant get used up and things like that but when you change over to things like cupric chloride etchant i think i'm pretty sure it's cute chloride then it's more of a circular process and your main consumption then is just energy all right okay well we'll guess we'll go to the next project which is can we hack job this kind of looks like i'm gonna need some batteries let's see three double a's and three triple a's okay i'm probably going to end up damaging the pir sensor at this rate maybe i can screw this back in before i do that i don't think i know what i'm doing ah right does that line up okay that lines up cool i guess the question is where do i put the batteries out not where i'll put the screws in there over here the screws seem a little large okay that's an acceptable fit honestly i really should berate myself more often while i'm disassembling these things because i tend to take a bit of a cavalier approach and just like yeah i remember where the screws go and naturally of course you never do or you wonder where you put the screws yeah it's interesting they've got a code button here but i suspect what this code button does is it just simply randomizes the suffix digits or whatever it randomizes the idea of this and nothing more i don't think it does anything more intelligent than that and then what happens is you re bind it with this one so there is some level of intelligence in terms of understanding the ids that are transmitted by these devices but it's not overly sophisticated and this is just 433 megahertz transmitter stuff it's a very useful thing these 433 units and you can get about yeah 10k a second out of them for data ah pedro i hate ferric chloride yeah sodium perchlorate and things like that i much prefer prettier too and you can actually see what's happening with your etch okay so the red eye of the pir senses you now these things don't usually take up a lot of power so i can just screw this back together and it should be fine for the purpose of what we're going to be doing i think the worst thing about pirs is trying to get the damn things to activate when you want them to they almost never do it's always when you don't want them to all right so transmit is good get some two more double a's which i have uh oops charged up two others these are eneloops but they're the standard inner loop okay scared now okay that should be mute i think no that's not mute all right [Music] that's the really frustrating i can't it won't let me switch over to a um what do you call it anything but that tune that tune is all i've got interesting is still blinking actually takes a while to stop blinking interesting it's almost like that's decaying away yeah it's just some fancy hack job that decays away anyway so we can't stop that we can't um i mean okay then okay so that now should be silent i hope what why did that change on me stupid son of a something is a little wonky here see how slow it's running yeah pir rage for sure okay maybe the batteries are a bit weak i should have been charged well at least two of them are charged get back here 1.27 139 this one damn it that one there's the non-charged i think yeah 1.39 1.39 and minus one point two seven okay unfortunately my battery charger doesn't do single cells so what we'll do is we'll steal candy from the baby and these are analog pros but we only need one see if we've got anything better on this cell 1.28 well you're not much better in fact you're worse also 1.28 right mouse batteries are on the verge of collapse like my sanity okay i'm just putting them in the charger and i'm gonna go grab some other batteries hmm yeah that's better 1.36 really not a fan of devices that need three batteries in some ways i wish they would just go all out and say look you know what we need four and we're going to regulate it down because three batteries are such an awkward number when you're trying to charge or buy enough you sort of end up needing at least 12 batteries okay i can't remember it's supposed to be two or one damn it [Music] maybe one maybe i'm supposed to press this one [Music] yeah it's definitely not that one there's not behaving how it should something's gone wonky probably because of me see that i must be misaligned somewhere it does have a manual but the manual is about as useful as me so ah joseph's being the pun king today how appropriate for halloween the punking well here's the easiest way we'll just disconnect the speaker but we kind of need it and the antennas with the chip numbers and see if i can find anything useful out of them most of these chips you can't do squat with greg it's a company called swan but they're really just a re-badger they don't really do anything useful sxda43b this is the 433 module these chips are pretty common the pt4 303s um all you have here basically is um this is the data pin and this is the enable pin so you just get whatever data is coming off the transmitter comes out through here say delta i don't know what they're getting q4 some sort of buffering configuration and it's coming into this chip here which will probably be some sort of right once programmable chip nt 620 em can't find anything on that oh wait what have we got most of it now that's just a random okay 204 tubes yeah no idea of what most these chips are going to do does that nat mill atm there would no way they'd put atm cl 902 that is a flash chip that contains data on it what if we can read what's on that i don't know see 2402 that's not a very big one it probably doesn't need a lot that could be holding the codes for whatever you program the device for now for when you resynchronize i would say that's probably what that's for and it is talking back to this chip yeah bugger lm4 what is that for 890 that'll be the speaker amp i'm guessing yeah movies this year i bet you that there goes yeah it'll be the speaker so that's the speaker amp sxd a43b oh that's a yeah okay apparently someone read it about it okay sxda43 seems to be something to do for audio not quite sure maybe it's the tune chip like for the doorbell tunes and i've noticed in another controller they've got an nt200m so that basically this also been an nt type chip that's probably right once program would chip see the nt-200m pulls the pt4 303 c high briefly every second we had the data sampled from the 4303 yeah so the sxd is like the tune chip yeah greg that um that first line you posted up there the indoor alarm received provides a choice of 16 different chimes you can't use them though because we don't have a doorbell unit yeah any triple five you want to tell me how we're going to do that because you're right that is one option it would be the default tune as well decide to use a playback line blah blah blah yeah the question is which one how do you get it to do it the other problem is going to be is if the alarm is not actually part of the tuned ship if the alarm is in fact driven by that um nt chip let's see red green blue trigger this is audio yeah it'd be nice if you could just simply force this chip as greg saying to only output for the um doorbell team but i am worried that this chip will be creating the alarm noise as part of its code i suppose one way we can test that theory is to actually remove this chip and see if it will still do the alarming let's see the other way is i should look at the pin out for this audio amp and these are only single-sided boards so yeah maybe greg's idea might actually work lm four eight ninety well it's a one watt power amplifier that's pretty cool that's quite amazing that they can cram one whatever output into that tiny chip damn it press the wrong button story of my life okay schematics okay so i see it's gonna do a quad view here i don't know if it's gonna work yeah that's good enough that'll work okay so we've got this is the shut down okay interesting shut down pin and these are the inputs that's kind of weird we've got unless that's coming through there all right i guess single channel relative to ground so that there is input capacitor decoupled so what's this pin here then yellow is audio out okay so that is audio out capacitor decoupled 20k resistor i'm guessing that's a 3k to [Music] okay weird 3k oh must be feet that'll be feedback right yeah yeah in minus and yeah vo so output okay we do have vo2 okay so right all right so output an output blend there audio amps and not my speciality all right so it's a push pull driver configuration so b class and essentially they've actually pretty much copied this so if we look at we've got the 20k input and they've got the 20k resistor there so that's that so that's probably going to be what they've got there 390 nano farad i'm not sure why they've got the 1k resistor here to ground but i guess that's just part of the biasing i am curious with this 303 [Music] okay they've done a slightly different on the feedback the feedback on the schematic is 20k this one's 3k no it's not this is 30k all right so it's less feedback they don't want to amp it as high i guess okay so that's pretty much as per schematic this is why half the time when apple says they've invented something most of times just copied from the schematic so it's only got the one source okay well that's a good sign so that means how does it trigger so we need a data sheet for this sx da43 sxd843 datasheet and find a way for us to request only that one doorbell thing there's only that one [Music] you're kidding me how does it know which code to play hmm all right well if anyone can find me a better data sheet for this this sxda43b i'd be very interested i might almost might have to bring the scope out to have a look so apparently this pin here is the let me call it trigger so let's trace this back trigger that's on the back here okay that's the tune select button you think is it i know this the um this button here is being used to select the volume that's between that and that those two there hey richard t yeah it's getting desperate if i gotta bring the scope out i agree okay this would just be vcc yeah it is orange is orange playing i don't know what okay all right so orange and yellow are the audio out i'm not sure why they've got this person's listed one is playing red ground that's obvious i'm going to take this chip off and so actually i don't have to i can just trace it with continuity trying to see what the other pins are going from it's like you [Music] this one here oh no you're just going straight under the all right nothing to do with that chip okay so these are all ncnc and cnc yeah i'm going to bring the scope out and see what happens it's a sad day in my workshop that i got to bring a scope out crap i've only got two hands no i'm good thanks i'm just being a this is my poor little probes have gotten a bit saggy yeah someone's going to make an inappropriate joke about that i'm going to leave i don't need to speak just plug the speaker back in just to make it truly annoying jonathan i would agree with you well swann wouldn't have done much at all with this they just would have said we need something that does this and someone said here you go and we put your uh put your branding on it i love the fact that the battery compartment is about half a mil too too narrow so you basically have to deform the plastic to get these batteries to fit in okay no do it this way still going to wiggle around a bit though these are actually the wrong sort of probes to be using for this particular task i would have been better off with multimeter type probes but yeah i'm having here is that uh certainly the bit slinky like at the moment rather than holding themselves up like i would normally want and of course we're going to get a hold of ground but unfortunately i can only get a hold of positive here so oh wait no there's a chance i can get ground elsewhere i'll probably set up the scope first rather than because i'm going to fiddle around i'll knock things best i'll get the scope ready what's the time bill 220 240 okay so much dust on this thing now now unfortunately i don't really have an ability to show you what's on scope too easily it's a good game thing just falls over needs some support soldering a bit much i need one of those right angle power leads the iec leads with the right angle connector on them we mean to buy a few of those but i never get around to it sxda43b is a temp pin 10 is the trigger right yes yeah we've um let's see one just reverses yeah that one i've already identified i guess the question is how is it toggling on that trigger to make it pick the particular tune that we want let's see blue for blue even though it doesn't really matter not sure i'm going to be using two channels on this but we'll see i don't even know if this works anymore seems to light up that doesn't mean squat no it actually did work now the microscope's gonna be keep it in the way you can tell this is not my normal normal thing and i'm stuck in that situation where this is one of the few scenarios where i would am better off using something like a 5 diopter desktop magnifying bench glass thingy i've got one but not in this room okay so i need to actually raise the whole damn microscope up this is such a literal pain there we go we haven't locked that all right that's gonna give us the range we need okay pin 10. i want to see what the audio outs like on this yep that one might have to sit it out we're just going to watch pin 10. and grab ourselves a ground what have we got we've got red it's channel one i can't even see the damn screen properly now okay we're on the run [Laughter] ouch okay well you guys can actually see what's on screen better than i can so just tell me if you see it capture anything oh yeah there we go [Laughter] but it's running too fast i need to actually capture data god damn it i don't know what i'm doing horizontal no that's offset volts division seconds division okay let's drop this back a bit what am i set on at the moment dammit reflections are all messing me up there we go okay we'll try 200 milliseconds of division called dave jones yeah i wish i could [Laughter] [Music] that just looks more like it's running a square wave and nothing more i'm just going to try something i'm going to try and short that pin 4 trigger to now if it goes could blame you you get a good view of it no or is it pulling it to ground [Music] all right that's weird i only i pulled it to ground and it the blue is running the trigger like i pull i pull blue to ground but then when i did that that trigger line does the square wave i don't get it i'm missing something here about how this is working missing something considerable well here's a question no okay where's the other ding dong thing i'm very much out of my depth here okay let's use the plastic probe pull that's the safe thing to probe with let me say u5 that um move the damn thing oh well no biggie this here where does this go wow this is so painful oh boy it goes to an unknown okay so what does this pin actually this is what i'm wondering what does u5 actually do i'll find out they're not u5 i mean this pin here now let's do it again let's trigger it i don't even have to use the transmitter now for this i can just do it manually oh wow that um just getting close to it makes it okay that's weird so why did that change greg i think what's happening is that the doorbell unit the actual wireless doorbell unit that they supply as an optional extra will have a different transmit id in it like if we yeah let's i'll show you what i mean i really need to spend a couple of days and learn how to use this dso probably anyway um i'm just going to make sure this doesn't fall over i think we might put on that we need it here okay we're on the data output pin okay cool this is more what's it doing it's just picking up random trash at this point all that is just random stuff that the 433 megahertz thingy is just decoding but i think if we shove my face in front of this it will suddenly become [Laughter] [Music] that is a long data string that one's a shorter one there's a youtube video showing different screens been playing anyway so well basically what i'm sort of trying to say is that the doorbell will have some sort of code prefix or suffix in it some sort of bits in the data that it sends for the id which indicate that it's a doorbell now i'd love to know what those bits are but then i would have to change the transmitter my bit of confusion here is why is it it just gives me the alarm then but when i do the trigger this way it was giving me the doorbell not that which makes me think that that there is more of an output than it isn't i just don't know this is where you need data sheets folks and what does u5 do what's u5's current voltage status ah keep saying u5 but i mean the pin down here and continuity mode is not a good mode to be measuring voltages in paul there we go i wonder how many of my meters have died from that all right so we've got four volts steady on this line here or at least i think it might be steady it does appear to be yeah two volts division what was this other pin it's ground where does that go oh jeez get these out of the way fine tip marker time wondering if the note selection button on that box sends it selection code to the chip it's um let's see which is the top of the bottom button on this it's top button isn't it yeah it's the top button on it okay the top button here so that's that there it's supposed to be part of the binding system so it's like it's got a multi-function purpose a multi-purpose function i should say i think it depends on how long it's been held down for time-based functionality is a convenient tool but by god it's a pain in the ass tool all right so that goes to this button here my pin we should be able to get it to play different tunes by pulling that to ground it will cycle through the tunes i think i'm trying to find a real ground around here yeah i've got the musical notebook and unfortunately it's also marked as the um a programming binding button which just simply confuses the issue a lot give me a second to see if there's a ground yep and what are you okay so now i'm gonna see if it will replicate what i'm doing when i press that button yeah that it's going to cycle through all the tunes now [Music] there are so many tunes on this chip yeah the volume button that's right that's this one over here that one there interestingly that one doesn't just go to ground that seems to go across these two here and it's actually kind of quirky and that's also isolated [Music] yeah cuckoo is appropriate i think okay four volts on that oops no volts on that four volts on that all right so basically these two get insured together and they should cause the volume change it's causing the volume just the bouncing of the lack of de bouncing is giving me grief there all right so shorting these two here together does the volume change so this must be okay so that gets pulled up if i short that whereas the other one pulls it down so it's a multi-mode type input so which one's zero on that but we should have four on this yeah if we do okay and zero on that yep okay so okay maybe it's not multi-mode maybe it's this sees four volts it's volume change and if that gets pulled to ground data sheets data sheets but again we do have the question how is it driving the siren because according to this little snippet of the code the working that this person has done according to that it's um it's not really making a lot of sense in our scenario the pin could be both input and the output i suppose yes i mean there's no harm in that i'm kind of curious what this line is oh it's probably just four volts who's the devil which one so what triggers this iron how does the siren get generated because it's got a it's got to come out through this uh audio chip yeah somehow this audio chip is generating that siren output as far as i can tell unless it's driving one side no this doesn't make a lot of sense i was going to say maybe it's driving one side for the siren and one side for the um yeah you know what i might try bend up one pin and see what happens so we've got pin one and four are the ones of interest so one is shut down now it's just weird shut down when low three is the one i would have thought they would have uh they connected it's also a little bit hard when you can't just because the circuit's got power and i don't want to do continuity tests okay you you get a feeling that these two pins well the the coppers there they're connected together they're bound together and that is bypass and in plus yeah probably makes sense actually yeah it does actually i'm the i'm the idiot there uh jim the tune chip is sxd043b and there's basically nothing on the internet about it that i can see that's it there there they could be yeah that could be doing so many things but the chip itself i would imagine is more simple than that but i'm starting to think that the pins have sort of multi-mode capability like suggested you know maybe at certain voltage levels that do different things i'm just trying to better understand the output network here so this here appears to be the main audio drive then we have we're going to pin four which is in negative and in positive just goes yeah back to bias this is the trouble is because they're so good at minimizing the cost of building these things this is where they create these amazing quirks or they exploit some maybe not necessarily documented behavior of certain chips to make them do interesting things it'd just be nice to know how they're getting it to even make that siren noise because as far as i can tell there's no siren noise really on that chip i think or maybe there is maybe we just haven't cycled through enough of them okay let's do this again i don't know what we're up to yeah listen out to see if there's a siren on it [Music] so many freaking leprechauns on this chip now back to the start try lifting pin six yeah that's ah changed only pin six one two three this one here yeah that's what i was wondering about that one there why is it doing what it's doing because that's the um yeah it's a shut down pin so that's why i'm kind of wondering what they what they're doing with that how to do it it seems to go into the bias section not bios by ass and so i don't know how yeah maybe they're sending through a shifted version of the tune that they're putting out in order to get it to go to siren yeah i think i'm going to go with that suggestion lifting up pin six right i was wondering why i was taken down then i realized i actually need to out get the battery out messing with the doorbell because it doesn't have a feature that i actually want it doesn't let me change the it's got a siren for the proximity sense rather than just the doorbell that i want and the problem is that we can't well at least i haven't found the actual siren tune on the chip but everything seems to come from this chip so they're doing something with that whatever tune it's generating in order to get it to do a siren so yeah some kind of phase shifted xor but i don't know i'm talking gibberish here i should start writing movie plots or criminal csi investigators stuff they always come up with this bollocks that they talk about that is too awkward i might have to use a spatula to get that out just want a little more lift and then i will wick away that solder okay now i can wick it and try to reverse the polarity then if i replace reverse the polarity it will probably make me start making siren noises now i don't know how that bass is going to go because that is a free floating line now so that's going to be really weird it may have to be tied to ground not sure anyway let's see how it goes look we can get rid of the scope sorry scope you you're nothing more than just a visual feast but you didn't actually do anything useful uh i suppose it did do something useful it showed us that that trigger pin was in fact more complicated than a simple on off so for that i guess we're thankful yeah visual prop may look a lot more legitimate although for that you really need the old tube cro type ones um yeah tube scopes all right so we're back to life trying to see if we get the alarm now we get nothing so it's it knows there's something happening but we're not getting any output so i don't know whether we should tie that to ground or something let's do that and then try it to vcc and do that let's see crow damn you yes i used to have a crow oh this is still on whoops try triggering pin 10 with that's pin 10 again 6 7 8 9 10 oh right yeah it's very sensitive now yeah nothing i think the problem is because it's floating it doesn't know whether to enable or not floating pins are not good things with my wagon if i'm i can't zoom out a bit it's as far as i can go yeah we're going to focus on this task first this attempt before we get distracted chasing other rabbits down the hall someone's taking my flux and my flux good yeah then the tri-state inputs all right so all right let's set the ground mind you in this case the audio amp chip does not have that option anyway all right well that's um interesting it's not producing anything again hmm all right what if what if that bias pin is actually modulating a fixed square wave or something mind you if it was modulated fixed square wave it should oh well i suppose we should actually still try put this bias pin to input high yeah def i'm not gonna yet show that up sorry buddy i'm working on this current process so something we all learn is that you have to wait your turn to get your chance and i can't zoom out anything this is that's as far as it goes that's as far as it goes okay i'm gonna put this too high just pin six on this hopefully don't cause any shorts or jeans do i do that with the battery for oh shite let's do that the battery connected god damn it [Laughter] but i betcha the doorbell still runs oh that hurt actually [Music] all right so it appears that that pin six doesn't seem to really do anything other than the fact that it just enables or disables the chip probably just stop it maybe picking up noise bugger all right well at least we eliminated one option and put that pin back down oh yeah death pump i'll just give you an over overview okay now this unit generates 16 tons of double belt out of those 16 tones none of them appear to be the siren but the audio chip going off to the speaker with a piece of junk in it that is the only path and its audio inputs are coming from the chip there i'm kind of curious what happens if i lift pin five i don't imagine much but it's um and we're kind of curious so anyway so the siren would appear to have to be generated out of this somehow but i said we can't find that in a tune and also we can select you know by toggling pulling this to ground we can change which tune it's going to hold which i believe has probably just been held in here at least in theory but then somehow it generates a siren on demand which means i'm thinking it must take the tune that is playing and somehow mix it in with itself to produce a siren what does that unpopulated r24 do let's see r24 capacitor so that'll be a v-plus rail of some sort which is it comes up here and goes into another it's some sort of rail and funnily enough it doesn't really matter because it's coming off here anyway the copper is connected straight there r27 so they are actually already connected so you get power input supposedly audio output based on what we're seeing for the data sheet for this and this line here is the input bias select which appears to just be pulled high when it wants to generate out what the tricky bit is is this we can trigger the siren by pulling this low and we can change the volume by setting this high i think it was that's b plus so something in here tells it how to do it i wonder what if it's a polarity shift maybe if i pull that to now i can't pull that to ground because i'll pull that to ground that's a low impedance line it'll probably fry i think is it oh no this is just the on off buttons right wait so how the hell does this even get told to make the alarm yeah how does this get even told i'm just gonna pull that chip and see if there's i can't see any traces i'm missing unless this one taps out somewhere probably going to melt the living daylights out of everything here but it's going to be interesting especially those whole things in a plastic chassis and the batteries are still in it yay oh no i did disconnect that okay it wasn't complete and utterly moronic um so far as i can tell this chip is the one that holds the 16 tunes as far as i could be wrong thing is stuck like nobody's business no nothing fancy going on there so someone forgot to put the fume extractor on yeah unless this chip actually doesn't do anything at all with the tunes well i thought it did maybe since it's common in most doorbells that's the thing it's more the commonality as opposed to explicitly knowing oh god that hurt ah this way you should have been here earlier i'll let someone else in the channel describe what the problem is no we don't want the siren for the passive infrared detection we just want the doorbell tuned we just wanted to go ding dong when someone comes into the driveway not so we're trying to find out how it differentiates or how it drives differently to give the doorbell versus the siren now i know it's differentiating by the different id that comes out on the data line here so this data line here when it goes to this chip it will then compare to whatever is being flashed into here for the bound devices that it's on or has and if it detects a doorbell type one which probably has one or two bits set a certain way or a bit patent a certain way compared to the pir units so like maybe it's got a 10-bit signature first two bits indicate the type of device that sort of thing and then it will then tell this to pick uh the siren or the doorbell but that's the trick we're trying to work out why how can this tell the difference between it meant to be doing siren or doorbell and as you say yeah maybe there's a doesn't seem to be an i2c line into it this is why i was complaining that a data sheet would be awfully helpful right now hey james ewing jonathan where did the board may be repurposing some sort of hardcoded error output that bypasses the tunes and creates it is possible that is possible it certainly does happen yeah authentic alarm sound yeah i wonder what an inauthentic alarm sound sounds like so yeah if i could do anything i wanted all i would really need to do is change the coding coming out of here or the detection [Music] of those which bits in here and make everything be treated as a doorbell but i suspect this nt 620m 2042 whatever chip i strongly suspect that that's a flash once type controller other doorbells seem to have like an nt 200 and whatever is there a drop down is there a drop down cap on the line um which line sorry i don't mean to be difficult i'm just sort of yeah kind of curious about all this up here this here is a little more sophisticated okay the this here these are the r2c lines let's see you've got a 10k 10k there you pull ups so that they're this here is the chime selector there's also time-based sensitivity on this so if you hold something down for 10 seconds it's going to have a different functionality to just pressing it um okay this is data input section so that's basically just filtering the data bringing it up level shifting yeah so that'll be data in unfortunately we can't do anything with that so selected data in i2c to the eeprom or flash rather not really sure what we're doing here see 100k [Music] 10k 100k i wonder if it's a multiplexed level based um let's see one two three no no they're all individual selectors okay yeah it's a little bit maddening there's it's probably going to be something very obvious at the end of it all but for now it's a bit money so this here is all just data section this here is audio generation this here is probably id storing and probably it's hard to say it may be holding what tune to play or maybe there's enough room in this that it or flash storage eprom storage in this that it um holds its um the tune id but then the question is how does it tell this one which id to play how does that how do they even communicate that's the other thing oh that's right i was wondering about this line here right okay this line i don't know where it goes so if we can find out where that goes we might be on to something i'll take the battery out and i'll just do a bit of brush continuity testing yeah you got the same site that i did deaf palms you got the same style i did that one with a little green yellow orange and red and blue dots on the chip yeah that we found it didn't quite equate to what we're detecting here i suspect because this is a more complicated device okay continuity mode yeah okay so i'm just gonna find out which pin along here okay so pin one does something i suspect that's how it's talking to it'd be interesting i wonder if that's a um what if it's a tri-state input if it is we may actually have found a way to do it maybe so we're going to see what voltage we're sitting on okay 4.14 i might short it to ground with like 100k resistor or something like that and then well it can't be tri-state if it's at four point whatever volts if it was tri-state even with the input impedance of the multimeter it probably should drop a little bit uh just trying to find my axial resistors which i find that's about 100k now i don't want to blow the output pin zero one and stopped all right fair enough jim wins that one i probably got 10k in here somewhere i think how damn it why all my resistors like 2.2 ohms 1 ohm 1.5 ohms 10k hello it looks like i would a thousand of them you goes explosions it's probably not even going to contact properly because i've got junk on the end of my resistor's legs another hmm all right it could be a one-way data line so it could be being pulled up internally and it just clocks out whatever it is that it's looking for but it still doesn't explain how the hell they get the siren out of this chip that's confusing as hell at least i'm 90 sure there's no siren on so go through [Music] remember [Music] do no uh john stanley that's the um problem is that it seems to be coming from the same line so we're trying to work out how it's making things different when it's alarm versus this and unfortunately my scope skills suck so i can't actually check all pins at once yo ben um i mean you're quite right so that's why someone was someone made a mention about being an error output so that's always possible and also maybe i'll just do a bit of quick googling these doorbell chips um maybe because they have a real good habit of copying each other we can find something that has a pin out that matches okay except these are 16 this is only a 14 pin one yeah so you're damn it's only 14. so we've got a 16 pin one and yeah this this empty oh well that was crazy they got ding dong module chips just in three pinners that's crazy do it's crazy you get better data sheets on alibaba than you do on google but i mean this here is this chip talks through spi so i have a feeling if we probe this pin here it probably has the um data that like picks which what and i also noticed on here that they do mention [Music] like you have programmable section uh where was it something else yeah there may be just a mode that's in a different section like it's not just doorbell tunes in this it could be other things and they're selecting that ah boy here we go ask the same questions again the transmitter can't pick the tune because the um the doorbell ones it all it seems is just an id they don't send anything like that because you can re-flash the id and there's the um yeah it's it's happening internally i just can't believe how impossibly hard it is to find any data on these things honestly yeah okay nt i can't even find this nt620 m i can find an nt200 but so far as i can tell the main purpose of this chip is to allow you to manage the devices that it recognizes and such because you can program up to 32 devices into this chip that it will identify and so this here is just the micro controller that decides you know what's going on but yeah clearly something in this chip has yeah you can select what tune you want and i would say although it's not a doorbell tune it probably is in there as a selectable device now if i was really good which i'm not and maybe i'll have to spend some time tonight doing this i will be able to capture the signal being sent into this pin as in the data the bit stream and i'm fairly certain that it will be different between when the pir activates versus when the doorbell activates it'll send through a different address or something to play which ultimately [Music] however brings us to the issue that if that is the case then we can't really do anything the only thing we can do is to say pick off the led output or something like that and use that to drive the speaker with our own audio amplifier or you know drop in our own little modifier so what we can do is we can just simply like pick up this here um the driving of the led and we glue on our own little micro controller board which then feeds into this amplifier and we just put whatever beat that we can generate what about detecting the signal input that triggers the microcontroller the they all come from the same place they all the signal comes from here okay the data stream goes in the data stream goes into um what was it what did we say it comes into this second pin here and that will be like i said a 10 bit sequence or maybe 30 bit sequence from the doorbell or the pir and a couple of those bits will be set according to what type of device they are certainly a bus power would be more useful than a dso in this it's certainly easier you know it's easy for me to plug a bus part into this capture the data for five seconds or so and then analyze that after the fact dsos are useful but this is definitely not where i would like to be using the dso all the time i would prefer to use a bus pirate anyway so if we were to modify this we would really have two choices one is to just drop this entirely get rid of this and put an avr or something like that on this pin and read what it's sending and then base as soon as we see some data from there we go okay and you know put whatever tune out we want it seems like an extremely complicated since when is modifying not being complicated it's modifying stuff is always over the top waste of time it's a case of more satisfying your insanity rather than trying to be economical if you could read the chip or if it's encrypted i doubt this chip is encrypted this chip here won't be encrypted almost any of these doorbell systems are not really encrypted you can very easily just capture the 433 megahertz data on the open air and um replay it if you want there's there's nothing really encrypted or secret about it it's very easy to be able to capture and replay particularly in these sort of scenarios for garage alarms and things like that sometimes they have a rolling code system which makes it a little bit harder so you won't be able to just capture and replay because it will say okay you just sent me that code i'm not gonna um i'm not going to open up because you just replayed the same thing let's have a look at that arnold gene 22 and 23 00 links um the analogy we've been we've been looking at that one too yeah this is yeah so this is where that comes up that's what we've all been looking at uh these are our own links that's just probably for ground plane because this is a single side board so we're just simply connecting up the ground planes yes i think at this point my options are probably the easiest option would be to take this chip off get rid of it entirely watch for this pin with an avr i'm going to use an avr because i know avr very well and i've got a ton of them um watch for activity on this pin on avr and then generate my own audio out of that that's the simplest way i can do it you could modify the pr to output a different code yes um yeah you definitely could do that you could take a doorbell unit for the id there's not much to the pir units i suspect though the problem is going to be that they have probably got the top the bits that make the idea of whether it's a doorbell or a pir unit i suspect they are probably actually fused we'll have a look at the chip maybe it's got one or two lines that are actually set by resistors externally and if that is the case we might have a chance yeah so we'll have a look at that and see if maybe we've got some external selectors you can say avr you can't say arduino without me kicking you in the backside now the arduino haters because i always felt arduino was a bit of a needless needless overlay on c it just kind of it was a whole new thing to learn when really you could have just learnt c in the first place and the specifics of the micro controller like what you know the pins are and you'll be done but instead they bring in this arduino and it's like it's easier and it's it really actually wasn't it was probably easier more for the fact that someone said it was easier as opposed to actually being easier i mean some things were perhaps a little less daunting like setting bits or unsetting bits or there are a lot of pre-baked solutions particularly for setting things up the pwming modes i can understand that was a little bit frustrating i thought a bit ambiguous in the documentation or felt ambiguous when you read it the first time but other than that no i thought it was a bit of a waste of time have you tried scm32 no i haven't no all right so this chip here will hold the code and that code will get replayed when you press when it detects nt 619b yeah it's actually quite a marvel you've got to appreciate the impressive how they've done this so cheap like this here is all the pcb antenna it's really quite good i mean all you've got is a saw oscillator there and a couple of transistors here used for amplifying the rf that's about it 3.3 volt regulator and it will this chip here will probably probably go into the base of some transistor somewhere and modulate the rf output i'm not sure if this is just ok output or done differently it's probably i think ask i think the nt619 now let's see so it's i doubt there will be any selector in there um external pin selectors on this so it'll be flashed with something this here the switch this randomizes the code so when you press that the code gets shuffled to a new one so let's have a look where that goes so let's see 100k it goes into here say a program that gets triggered it goes comes up for new code but those lower bits are probably fixed yeah the stm32s are very big in the drone community it was um mostly because at the time i think atmel really dropped the ball on this because at the time people were just managing to make drones and my brushless controllers work with things like 18 mega 88 or 168 even 32 eights but it didn't really have the spare cycles on hand to make it easy it was always a real struggle and at the time atmel was just bringing out the x-mega and on in the initial announcement of the x-mega it looked like it was going to be a great chip you know and solve a lot of our bottleneck and complication issues but in the end the x mega was a in my opinion not that it counts for much uh in the end i felt the x mega was a a dud in the sense that a lot of things that were hoped for didn't end up happening and they changed the interface to program it in such a way that it sort of took away from what made the 8-bit 80 mega up the 8-bit avr's so popular no more was it a case of simply programming or anything like that it became a completely different platform and it didn't really deliver and it was expensive and around that time that's when things up the st 32s were coming out strong and yeah they swept up the market poor little msp 430s were still going what about us what about us i mean yeah the msp 430 it's a really nice very low power chip but again it did suffer the problem that didn't have quite enough grunt it sort of lost its audience a lot to the avr8s even though it was substantially more efficient in many ways it wasn't enough of a winning feature for most people to go for it rather than the avr's it's a shame yeah it was a very nice chip well it is a very nice chip the msp430 but yeah it just didn't have the market share and like i said the ease of the avr8 series just washed away everything else and then yeah atmel made their own up as it were when they they really just it may be considered a second syndra second system syndrome with the x mega and then after that they lost that momentum so the market was gone went to the stm32s and so i guess once they lost that momentum they were happy then to be bought out by microchip and that's pretty much the end of the story ah batteries yeah i'm leaving him out for the moment for the moment i've got other things to get done it's four o'clock i've got to get a machine built i may as well do that while i'm sitting here and you can all just watch with great boredom now let's see final data shoot let's have a look at this one oh this is really encoded one yeah switch one two three four yeah it'd be something like that and like so i'm fairly sure they'll have certain bits pre-encoded in their bit of firmware they've probably got in there whoops wrong they'd pull ground both input triggers and jumps at the same time might save a new chime uh casey that's because that was much earlier on in the stream much earlier on uh we're going to get this machine and reassemble it oh dear god no what did you just do okay get this reassembled well it hasn't been through yet and it's been here for a couple of years now it'll get replaced soon enough ah that's way too much full now well apple standards yeah john i'll try to do that no promises but i will try i probably should have done this assembly before i even started with the doorbell madness this is what i should have picked up after i finished with the multimeters not the doorbell i'm keeping pressure on the board because what i've done is with that thermal paste and i've sort of squished it back and forth so it's created a fairly minimal layer between the heatsink and the chips and it should have if it's been done properly a slight sort of reluctance to let go because they've exhumed all the air from it but it's not going to be enough to fight against these initial springs as i've pulled them down okay now it should be good now i can let go and it won't separate between the cpu and the heatsink because you want the layer to be as thin as possible so that because thermal transfer compounds transfers heat but it's still not as good as metal on metal assuming that the metal is perfectly flat which of course doesn't happen in our real world when you zoom into the metal it looks more like a craggly ridge with very few contact points and we use the thermal compound to fill up those gaps but like i said it's still not as efficient as metal and metal unless you're in space if you're in space then metal will tend to self-world when you bring it together which is kind of handy but also probably kind of not what they want in space this machine came in yesterday and its problem was that it has or it did have but not have any more it did have um it would tend to intermittently dive when it was idle while you were running it it was fine but as soon as you started idling it would drop out and die so it turned out that there was corrosion all down the side here and part of that was in fact the uh there's a mosfet that handles power switching to the sleep sections so it was nice to find that smoking gun and then throughout the course last night i backed it up time machine and washed it this morning and now time to put it back together give it back to its owner return it back to the wild as it were this is a 281 board by the way for anyone wondering but they're all pretty similar in this series city collier they don't use the silicon thermal pads because they have an even higher thermal resistance compared to the paste properly applied paste so certainly the thermal pads are very convenient because you can cut them apply them very simply um you can reuse you well you shouldn't according to the manufacturers because i want you to put a new pad down every time but you can reseal it back up every time for a few more shots with slightly degrading qualities each time but yeah the amount of the thermal resistance is higher with transfer pads no no it wasn't the sleep sensor i mean the sleep sensor had issues no it wasn't actually a super sensor there was a temperature sensor that got created as well but this ended up being the mosfet or at least certainly the gate drive for the mosfet was problematic it wasn't what i was expecting to be honest i when i first got the job request on this i was like i don't know if i want to do with anything with this one because it kind of sounds like one of those i'm never going to be able to solve it i can't find the fault type boards but i was lucky when i opened it up it had corrosion in the right spots interestingly there was about three or four different faults that were about to start happening on a more regular basis all along down that side or this side wherever it was but it was the sleep one that decided to wake up first this intel started seeing down the dials and 10th generation as well so silicon pads probably run the risk uneven pressure oh great i have had to use silicone pads in some of the newer machines where they use that crumbly not crumbly but the paste is not paste it's more of a combination of paste and little glass spheres or something like under things that the 1534 cpu and stuff like that damn it paul you got to stop sliding that screwdriver down that slot oh good what was the prognosis for the situation with fluff i'm thankful at least this is not an 820 1700 i think the a201700 is becoming one of the most disliked boards out there so people see it go now dead not touching it goodbye osteoarthritis and infection but good kidney and liver thing well that's always good especially with cats kidney kidneys especially they're so quick to give up on their kidneys i think what doesn't help is that the number of items that we have in our houses can that can cause severe damage to feline kidneys is a little bit scary we don't even realize that like a lot of people have lilies around the house as in true lilies as opposed to just the water pond things and if the cat gets lily pollen if they ingest that then it's actually very deadly for their kidneys and of course cats are naturally inquisitive creatures they'll go up and they'll sniff the flowers and that's how it happens um well i know kind of take the trash book in one way because now at least the trash book is universally accepted as a trash book and you can deal with it but the o1700 is still a case of but it's a good machine and i need it fixed and you're like i really don't want to touch this thing come on getting there getting i'm actually feeling a little bit impatient but because i've been sitting in this chair a bit too long thanks to that doorbell didn't really ring my bell for me i i think i'm going to chase the avr solution for the doorbell i think it'll be something entertaining probably just a oh trying to think now at13 might even be okay or maybe an 80 25 since i've got a few spares of those i've got a heap of 45s but i don't want to waste them if i was a mad genius i would do it with an 80 2010 oh thank you hugo oh very much i do need the coffee after this so yeah much appreciated into the uh no pedro i'm actually going to i will need one going off from the led but yeah i'm going to try decode the data coming in from that controller chip i'm not going to be trying smart about it i'm just going to say okay we've had a 10 bit sequence here so i'm going to assume that it wants me to ring the doorbell so i'm going to do that if i was doing it with an 80 tiny 10 that would be even more interesting it's a fun chip the 10 because it's usually you have to program it in assembly so it's nice to get back to assembly particularly on a small chip like that but you're not going to end up writing some humongous chunk of code it can't be any more than 1k in size overall definitely one of those let's do it for fun sort of things come on what have i got left the bits that are removed and the battery stuff where's the bottom case for this oh yeah it's a little bit dusty just wash it down if someone could tell me where my paper towels are there they are in that box i took to townsville yesterday hey okay ah jungle over my pants yuck so yes complain to the universe the universe will provide i have generally found that to be surprisingly true surprisingly true i suppose i should check that it boots did i muck up something 20 volts one here oh yeah okay i've got apple logo just took a little while all right that's booted and fine i hope i'm not obviously not showing you anything miles i think the reason why they probably try to avoid the matte black or matte colors is they tend to the blemishes tend to be a little bit painful to i guess it's a matter of perspective some people say gloss is painful to look at and thankfully this thing has booted right back up to where i left it before i shut it down whereas before what would happen is it would come up straight away and say there was a problem in the previous machine okay i'm just making sure it runs off the yeah so this is all good the person's going to be happy certainly i'm going to be happy because it means i'm going to get paid i'm going to get some muller uh i only need about 10 000 in a month i've got a new project that i need to get done and somehow mr daniels has to come up with ten thousand dollars in a month i'll probably be able to do it if i put my mind to it i find if i if i can get flex boardview on a stable release and then i can con important people like louis rossman to make an announcement and actually show it being used properly mind you the hard thing of lewis is getting him to use the latest version i hate doing that fortunately i didn't scratch that there's an old scratch there but it's not mine um yeah and if i can get enough even if i get like 100 sales i'd be great or even 50 50 sales would be all i need to do and yeah i think with the proper promotion i can get that so turned out for us no think at this point although you're right yeah pushing up the price is always handy i think at this point 179 us we've sort of gotten up to where i think the market is happy with it i've yeah so i don't think i have any compelling reason to push it up any higher it's uh i've got to get the open board data stuff all sorted out need some more data there what i am happy about is that we now have modern macbook board views again so i like the m1 series and i've um thanks to some people i don't know if they want to be named but i've got you know more iphone boards that i'm working on so you know the tools function it's me remaining relevant that's what i mean so lewis seems to be outsourcing repairs to anil and paul s well that's because he's smart yeah pld merch merch is good for um some things but in terms of making profit it's generally not now it's more a case if i need to just you know generate more sales not too much sales from people trying to open p oh jeez yeah people trying to open or pdfs open up pdf there i do need to create some videos for flexbird view i mean how many years i've been selling it now three four years it's about time i made a video on how to use it as opposed to just hoping that people will work out how to use it however that said i think it's nice if you can open up a piece of software have no documentation and find your way around it in fairly quick sequence and really other than maybe quirky button selections there's not that much in flexboardview that is specifically difficult to find out so anyway i am out here i've got to go take this to the person who's waiting for it and i appreciate it that you're here and put up with me going all ding dong and i'll see if i can catch up with you maybe late tonight maybe we can have a bit of a running stream with the atmel modification of that doorbell so all right i'm out of here you take care i'll see you next time

Channel: Paul Daniels

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Length: 205min 19sec (12319 seconds)

Published: Fri Sep 24 2021