Designing gods from scratch || D&D Lifehack

I love thinking about this stuff hello humans my name is Dale Kingsmill bringing you a D&D video today I'm gonna give you a game hack on how to build a Pantheon from scratch for your D&D game not necessarily a Pantheon even doesn't have to be pantheistic that's what we're gonna get to first I want to lay out a foundation give you the groundwork so that you can sort of understand where I'm coming from with this once I build my thoughts those of you who have been subscribed to my channel for a while probably know that I'm I'm coming at this from a background of mythology I have a great interest in mythology I've been making videos about mythology for many years now I've given a couple of lectures on the topic at university so I'm coming at you from a perspective of like how you know God's structured within mythological contexts with that being said let's talk about what we worship we tend to come at these topics from a very modern perspective and I think it's skews things a little bit for example I think we tend to overestimate the role of like the elemental you know you'll have gods of fire guns of the sea things like this but it isn't really how it works so if we take the Olympians the Greek Olympians as an example we'll keep coming back to them as an example because they are both one of the ancient Pantheon's that we have the most information on and they are the pantheon I have the most information on as someone who's been focusing on Greek mythology for a long time we come from a modern perspective and we look at the Olympians and we say Zeus was a god of thunder and we say Poseidon was god of the sea and these things aren't incorrect but we do have a habit of over emphasizing these roles as part of that character these domains weren't necessarily elemental the way that we described them Zeus is a God of justice he's a god of retribution after the technology when they were dividing up the major spheres of existence the sea the earth and the sky between the three elder male gods Hades Poseidon Zeus they they drew lots soos became God of the skies Poseidon became god of the Seas Hades was God of all things under the earth and as part of this war the titanum Archaea and the division of these domains zeus wound up being associated with the thunderbolt as his weapon it's part of a wider character and it's important to acknowledge while constructing your own deities for fiction these are all just parts these are all just pieces of a bigger picture now having said that i would like to talk about the concept of the numinous now this is a concept that was brought to the fore by rudolf otto who was a german theologian and he was talking about human experience of the spiritual and the divine kinda so the numinous according to otto is the mysterium tremendum it's a wonder that is at once terrifying and fascinating it's anything that causes a moment of inspired or which makes stark the vastness of the experienced and unexperienced universe in contrast to the individual Aldous Huxley describes it as the incompatibility between man's egotism and the divine purity between man's self aggravated separateness and the infinity of God CS Lewis who we all know I adore drawing on for philosophical discussions like this he insists that it is not physically defined it's not caused by fear of one's own fragility or mortality as we might assume it is rather an awareness he describes it by saying if you knew there was a tiger in the next room you might know that you're in danger and therefore feel fear of the tiger but if someone told you that there was a ghost in the next room and you believed them that there was a ghost then you would feel afraid but a different kind of fear you're not afraid of what a ghost might do to you you're afraid that the ghost is a ghost and so that fear becomes dread it slips into a space of the uncanny and the uncanny sits at the fringes of what he refers to as or which begins to describe perhaps the new Louis separates it from the physical by saying just as no enumeration of the physical qualities of a beautiful object could ever include its beauty or give the faintest hint of what we mean by beauty to a creature without aesthetic experience so - we can never fully describe to someone our experience of the numinous if I were to describe it in my own poor words I would say that the numinous are the things that humanity experience as incomprehensible or infinite the horizon the ocean the sky birth maybe the way a new human and new consciousness is knitted together from basically nothing the vastness of space the countless nosov stars the unending nosov time basically witness to a raw storm how could we not conjure a deity of thunder these are things that when you get caught up in them make you experience a Lois calls it a sense of how small you are compared to this great powerful massive thing so perhaps this is where we start to think about the development of particularly very ancient objects of worship worth thinking about but don't start drafting you guns yeah we've got a lot to get through it may be a trivial way to sum this up but I think triviality is very useful to a Dungeons & Dragons game the short hand after all has power in brief I would say that there are gods of action and there are gods of virtue gods who will reward you for things that you do love fight deceive and there are gods who will reward you for things that you are beautiful strong clever now with this in mind it's important to recognize that people tended to worship aspects of the gods more than the gods themselves in Sparta they didn't worship Artemis the virgin Artemis pothinus they worshiped Artemis Ida Nia will Durov the spear and artemis or thea the vengeful the bloodthirsty think about the way the greeks had two different Olympian gods of war right we had Athena who was the goddess of tactical warfare she was imprudent warfare she was heck and popular people loved Athena meanwhile Aries Aries was the whole huffing stuck of ancient Greece he shows up in what like three different stories in a major role in one of them he gets stuck face this is sex net then runs home crying and the other one he gets stabbed in the leg by Heracles made the laughing stuck again the ancient Greeks pride of the theatre of Ares they hated Ares he was the worst but then the Romans carry that mythology over to their own stuff and the Romans really like war there are militaristic nation they're bent on conquest they love Mars because from where they're standing tactical warfare is great but if you won the battle you won the battle it might also be worth mentioning the idea of the cycle of admiration right so the idea is that our culture worships guts that embody the ideals that the culture values and the gods in turn are rewarding people who embody those ideals it's basically the same thing in both directions it's one big circle so now getting more into actual d-md and how this stuff applies to you let's think about the clerics divine domains one of the best things that v ii does is to structure things so that a cleric is attached to a domain more than they are to a specific deity who then has domains this is clever this is worshiping an aspect of the gut right so stop thinking about these domains as aspects of multiple gods I will say and I'll try to keep it short but why why is there a domain of light what even is that what does that mean that's that's so vague that's nothing the whole description of it is all like oh yeah prophecy and stuff and ah but that all the spells and all the goodies you get for it a literally light get it out of here get it out ah also you've already there are seven define damnit you don't need seven the cleric section of the book is so long just cut it out and while we're at it let's just change the name of nature to wilderness or the wilds that's what you mean just say it don't call it nature nature is so vague the god of nature what's that encompass plants who's the god of plants owns the god of plants that the god of like wild places apparently I have opinions on the topic all right so that's the groundwork you've got the basis for how I'm thinking about this now for the hack as the French call it yeah all I'm so worldly okay so divine domains become aspects of multiple gods right it's spread out a little bit more so how are we actually going build a pantheon or mana fee and that's not does alright team here it is this is the big secret if you just start listing off gods attached to a domain it's gonna feel like a spreadsheet if you want this to feel like a religion if you want this to feel like it has depth like it's lived in like it's grown over time what you need is one good story but all the extra guards all the little myths and bits and pieces they all grow out from one solid gravitational Center and the story it wears different faces it looks different in different contexts but what you need are four major characters Authority Harbor purpose and treachery these four archetypes show up time and time again in different combinations in different outlooks across so many mythologies all around the world all at different times let's look at some examples Greek mythology a core story in which we transition from Titan rule to the rule of the Olympian gods it has been prophesied that Cronus current ruler evil will be overthrown by one of his offspring and so every time his wife Rhea gives birth he swallows the child whole Rhea can no longer stand seeing her children devoured and so in order to protect her youngest child Zeus she gives Chronos swaddled bundle of rocks in place of the baby god Zeus grows up fulfills his destiny and overthrows Cronus a great big wall the Titan of machia happens at the end of which humanity is created by Prometheus one of the Titans who sided with Zeus Zeus proclaims that humanity shall not have any fire and so prometheus goes behind Zeus is back and steals fire from the Sun on Olympus and he gives it to humanity and is punished for eternity well yes there's a thing that happens with Heracles don't even worry about it authority Cronus haba Rhea purpose Zeus treachery Prometheus Egyptian mythology Osiris king of all the gods he's hosting a big old party when his brother Seth decides that he would like to claim rulership for himself and tricks Osiris into getting into a coffin and he throws him up into left a little bit and scatters all the bits across the world Isis Osiris his wife goes out of her way to find all the pieces put them all back together and have Osiris resurrected and the son of Osiris and Isis Horus grows up to triumph against Seth and take back the position of Pharaoh of all authority Osiris haba Isis purpose Horus treachery sent dice a Seto said I usually say said Christianity authority God haba the Virgin Mary purpose Jesus treachery Judas Odin authority Frigg haba Valda purpose Loki treachery it's the one good story it's not even just limited to religion the old king hamlet authority Baba Horatio purpose Hamlet Junior Hamlet the Hamlet Prince of Denmark treachery Claudius it doesn't matter so much the connections that these archetypes have just that the archetypes are present in your core story I've deliberately chosen the words Authority Harbor purpose and treachery because they're a little bit more free of connotations and cultural implications that we tend to put on this stuff which is important because the role within these archetypes sometimes shifts and the attitude that we bring towards them sometimes shifts Authority can be a guiding hand or a hot rebuke kava can be comfort can be love can be defense and protection is the figure of purpose a rising hero with a destiny to fulfill is it a tragic and inescapable fate or is it triumphant is it vengeful treachery is an interesting one because that does carry negative connotations but it's difficult to get around that with this subject because this is someone who's close to the other figures there a sibling or a child or a spouse or a close friend of one of these other archetypes and they do turn on them but if you think about these examples you've got set who betrays the Good King Osiris this chaotic villainous figure compared to Prometheus someone who humanity thinks of positively because Prometheus is betrayal of Zeus was looking out for Humanity play around with these archetypes play around with Genda play around with who's the good guy and who's the bad guy play around with the connections between them think of your version of the one good story give names to those gods apply the domain where they fit those are the only people that your players are going to need to know about this one story is the only story your players will need to know about the religion of your setting and if you're having fun with it feel free to fill in the gaps give those characters husband's or siblings or filling the gaps with later additions to the Pantheon for that I say start with culture Matt Colville has a brilliant video series from when he was building up capital and the culture and the deities of capital I'll put a link to it he goes into some really brilliant stuff there I definitely recommend it but this here is my zippy life hack for coming up with a pantheon that feels legit all right humans hope you enjoyed the video if you did it's a YouTube video all the things apart from that I do believe that's it I'm done email this to your grandma and I will see you some other time it is there's really no where to walk my room is a terrible mess [Music] like you should see it I won't show it to you because then I would have to live in shame but it is truly spectacular

Channel: MonarchsFactory

Views: 96,107

Rating: 4.9701276 out of 5

Keywords: MonarchsFactory, Dael Kingsmill, Geek & Sundry, Geek & Sundry Vlogs, Geek and Sundry, Geek and Sundry Vlogs, Geek, nerd, australian, australia, vlogger, Greek mythology, myths, mythology, Dael, Kingsmill, Dale, Dale Kingsmill, story, storyteller, story teller, story time, funny, dungeons and dragons, d&d, dnd, homebrew, worldbuilding, pantheon, religion, gods, god, numinous

Id: eMgPgbRb_fA

Length: 14min 25sec (865 seconds)

Published: Wed Jul 24 2019

Reddit Comments

[u/brubzer]

The existence of a light domain feels like a weird thing to take offense to given the number of important sun gods in many world mythologies.

[u/Nephisimian]

Dael Kingsmill is such a D&D name.

As much as I dislike this kind of information being delivered in video form, this is a good video. However, I think it could have been more, and the title is incorrect - it's more "Designing religion from scratch", rather than "designing gods from scratch".

This is coming from a modern academic approach to religion, where it assumes the religion is, y'know, mythological, rather than real. Where religion is built by people, rather than the result of extraplanar phenomena. If you're going for a world where gods either don't exist or are created by faith, then this is a pretty applicable video because this is talking about how religions work in the real world. But if you're going for a world where gods are real entities that exist independently of mortal races - which is the default for D&D - this video isn't going to help you very much. In these kinds of worlds, a god just wakes up one morning (or rather, before time was invented) and decides "Y'know what I think I'm going to be the god of Nature". In which case, no one can tell them they're wrong. They're a god, they just get to choose this shit. They could be the God of Purple if they really wanted. The thing about deities in D&D is that typically, they're a "What if mythology was real?" thing. That means that there's a lot more flexibility in what a pantheon can actually be. You don't necessarily have to stick to this 'one good story' because when your gods literally exist you can have any story you want. Could even make your pantheon only full of good actors who all get along with each other nicely and never experience treachery.

Really, there are two approaches to deities when you're designing a D&D world - Society first or Deity first. This is a great guide for people wanting to do a society first approach, where humanoids existed and then created deities for themselves. It's not relevant to a deity first approach.

Also, on the topic of domains, Light domain is a pretty good one to have, because there are a lot of "Sun gods" and "Cleric who fires rays of sunlight at bitches" is a really popular and common fantasy archetype. The problem with Light domain is that its fluff is that of like, a poetry domain or something, rather than the fluff of someone who worships a god's ability to purge the unholy will magical space fire. There are also a lot of concessions that need to be made. If Domains were designed to emulate specific reasons a creature might worship a deity we'd need dozens of domains. We'd be splitting Nature alone into three or four domains to represent every possible aspect of "I worship this god because I like that they represent some aspect of the natural world". Life and Death would both be split into multiple facets too, no doubt, as might Trickery and Forge. Domains are generic things, that are supposed to be something you can use to emulate quite a lot of more specific faiths.

[u/VanishXZone]

Just popped by to say that I liked the video, so last night on my stream I tried to apply it to my world that I’m working on. At first I thought “this is a good organizing principle, sure. Let’s do this” but you can see on my face at one point the whole thing just clicked, and I had a religious organization that I could work from and use for my world.

It was weird, just looking at the video I thought “this is good” but actually doing it felt so much better and easy and effortless. Thank you Dael!

[u/Shirt_Ninja]

I got through 3/4 of the video before I realized she wasn’t going to be showing me how to build a Parthenon.

[u/TheL0stK1ng]

Simple, effective, and evocative ideas for.making something my players may actually remember. Great video and content, thanks for sharing

[u/ZiggyB]

Are you Australian? There was something confusing me about your voice when I first started the video and that's what my brain settled on. I've watched too many DnD videos by Americans, so hearing a local accent doing it broke my brain's audio processing I think

[u/atorin3]

I used to watch your mythology vlogs religiously years ago, but then life got crazy and i stopped having time. Seeing this reminded me how much i love your content. Im looking forward to catching up on the vids i missed.

[u/lingua42]

Dael, this is fantastic. As a sometimes-DM/GM with experience practicing in several religions and a social scientist with a degree in religious studies, I think the central-story method absolutely hits the nail on the head for making a believable religion that's easy to create and quick for players to understand.

It also allows for as much elaboration as you'd like with other deities and other stories, for conflict among people who have different interpretations of the story, etc. And while it may or may not be how academics would say religion "really" works, it gets across how it feels as a practitioner on the ground.

There's a D&D group in my area composed entirely of Episcopal priests--I'm sending this to them right now!

[u/EndlessOcean]

Do all of you have pantheons in your worlds? I have something akin to Hinduism. There's one God, with different aspects, but safe to say that every cleric, paladin, priest, whatever is above it all worshipping the same thing.

There's a creator, there's a destroyer. That's fundamental. How people worship either (or none) of them is what makes the followers good or evil but there's no such thing as an evil God or a good God, only acts done in their name.