Could this be the BEST fight scene ever? TROY, Achilles vs Hector, Fight Scene Autopsy

hector hector yes not you go go all right heck door heck door okay heck door [Music] thank you to everyone who's come to watch this video it really means the world but unfortunately there are a lot of people who are not getting notified of my content youtube is currently de-ranking and suppressing content like mine in preference to other content and a lot of my viewers and subscribers are not actually getting notified one of the ways in which is actually a truly a tremendous help in trying to break through this type of suppression is by subscribing if you enjoy the content please do subscribe and join us in the future liking and commenting helps boost the interactions on the video which makes the algorithm realize that more people are engaged and of course sharing is absolutely really crucial ringing the bell only does so much to try and get notifications youtube has actually not been notifying people who have even the bell rung and so if you really want to ensure that you get notified 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and shield like they make it look well we'll see how how good they make it look but there is a question to ask about how viable would a big spear like this be because when you get up close short sword and shield is a great combo and look they do end up using swords but one is the backup after the spear goes if you really go into combat and you had a shield this shield helps you nullify a lot of the reach adventure the spear you're getting close and then you have like the romans did a great effect short swords and shield is a deadly combo so maybe i should have led with that but let's take a look we're going to break it down go in deep and have a look to see how good this fight scene really is you don't want to do that to any sharpened weapon like sand is very coarse actually like it's a good way to just shoving your spear into the ground like that it's almost like grinding it against rocks it gets everywhere it gets everywhere so don't throw okay at least they tried to justify it in the narrative if you haven't seen this film before minor spoilers someone close to achilles uh was killed and hector thought it was achilles because he was wearing achilles armor and so achilles took off the helmet and said so you know who you're fighting right but then you should have put the helmet back on helmets are really useful the first protective item you would wear above any other armor you have like you could survive hits to many parts of the body as long as it doesn't hit vital organs but a good solid hit to the head even if it doesn't fully kill you instantly if it doesn't pierce the skull blood pouring down over the eyes if there's a cut above the eyes um it's just protect the face and the head so this is that was pretty ridiculous but also something else i noticed if we go back so have a look at that nasal guard right there this is supposed to be metal but we see it bend so watch this carefully like it just like bends out showing that ah this is like a foam plastic helmet why couldn't he have just given him something solid metal helmet right uh yeah anyway then he but they both don't bad move don't get rid of the helmets so unfortunately we're not up to off to a good start i i like the narrative thing at least they tried to justify it seriously it's like now you know you're fighting back on and it goes back into that drawn out trope where you think you need to see the person's face hollywood is so obsessed with that that they've even done like ridiculous half helmets in the last jewel have a look at the half helmet alright so now we're getting into the action achilles is approaching look i like that what achilles does here okay is it necessary maybe this is a thing misdirecting like this you actually see it done in sports where uh if you played rugby or red iron depending on what your terminology is right so one of the things i played casually in australia this thing called touch rugby where tackling is like you just have to touch him and uh and that's considered a tackle so trying to avoid even touching doing those things ends up being the key to misdirect and get someone to lunge that way where you you they think you're zigging but you zag this could actually be effective in combat um hector doesn't really fall for it and that's one of the things that i will praise about this fight scene achilles has a very distinct style as to how effective it is well they they sell it in my opinion and hector is more just um i guess practical utilitarian and achilles is more agile you could almost say a bit more flamboyant but i have actually sparred with people that have very flamboyant styles and sometimes it only serves as a bit of a misdirected like what am i going to do kind of thing it works it works here so lunge lunge forward thrust is he withdrawing his shield here in this thrust so we go back uh achilles it's like you're not even using your shield so shield kind of there but then we withdraw it for that thrust that's one of the uh sort of like you see it in video games a lot and everything you can absolutely thrust even with like a lunge thrust and keep the shield in front and can i it's not that hard even throwing your shoulder into it look at how much protection a big round shield still offers when you do a big thrust like this okay but holds like do you see a difference here this is here you know and what i find interesting hector he does this big thing it's like but what are you doing you have a shield all right and a spear and like it you know this fight scene is praised a lot but as you break it down slowly i'm already seeing a large amount of air resist from a practical combative standpoint if you're unaware what i do here on fight scene autopsy i'm mainly looking at how realistic the fighting is from a practical standpoint not necessarily from an entertaining standpoint because this fighting is very entertaining it's got a lot of motion movement there is like um that there are peaks and waves in this fight scene where one gets someone gets an upper hand someone gets and then they have to change weapons and so it's a dynamic evolving fight scene which makes for really entertaining stuff what i encourage and believe is that you can achieve such great you know enjoyable fight scenes with more practical realistic combative maneuvers and still and when you do that it actually enhances it even more because you know you might not be a trained pianist but you can still tell a bad rendition on the piano even if you don't know perfectly it's actually the same with fight scenes fire scenes that have far more martial validity just look more authentic even to the untrained eye when you combine it with you know a great fight scene that has almost a narrative to itself where there are ways it gets you know more dynamic and then they change weapons and there's a bit of a story happening to it makes it even better and there's examples of people doing this just on youtube we see the example from corridor digital with their more realistic lifesaver fight scene and we see an example from abueria with a really more authentically realistic a long sword fighting that has those waves and flows with more practical realistic maneuvers and so hector when he does this big lot like this you're holding your shield mate you should have just blocked with the shield block and then you you're still holding your spear so instead of wasting all this movement on that block counter thrust get achilles to block and so they should like this fight scene should be shield blocking in a really cool dynamic where it's a block and then they do switch and you know maybe thrust here then that gets hit and have to spin around and they're doing these big dynamic things with the shields because the shield is it can be a very dynamic element to a fight scene just have a look at how uh roland warzeka does he studies a lot of viking kind of period combat and he uses and has seen the shield in like this incredibly dynamic way but here they're basically ignoring you like the shield doesn't even is there so far we'll see how much they utilize this shield but the shield honestly should be one of the primary elements of this fight scene over just the spear the spear is you know you want to thrust with it but in terms of dynamic movements and stuff and blocking and things the shield should just be going crazy so big lunge all right this was interesting um he lunges let me go back and achilles comes with a swipe of the shield that's that's interesting but the question is why do you choose to swipe with the shield when he has a more deadly weapon in his other hand and it really wasn't about position he lunged okay maybe if his spear was forward and he has to withdraw it to attack again then his lunging with the shield ah yes points i think this is a good move so he smacks then hector raises the shield to block good then they separate and kill these kind of jogs around almost like this was a test engagement i really like that i swear it's a quick exchange of a couple of strikes and they separate and they're just kind of getting a feel for you know each opponent where they're at and it sets an interesting pace and and it does draw you in so in terms of i think just the pacing of this fight scene so far yeah really good and maybe my criticism with the shield okay hi high achilles um maybe my criticism for the shield uh only applied to that first exchange we'll see how much they use the shields as the fight continues so this is like an interesting one it's like achilles one of his signature moves a jumping attack there are possible criticisms here but those criticisms might not completely apply one of the problems or dangers when you do like a jumping attack you can't dodge in the air someone could really take advantage of that and just thrust but there is one thing that could help mitigate the danger and that's the shield and uh what do we see achilles right here right there and so he's actually kind of holding it in place to protect himself the other question is does a jump like this make a better attack maybe it's basically run up and it's going through this big attack and throwing all the momentum he has into the strike so i would think there might be some benefit the other thing that helps sell it is the distance see where achilles is and see where hector is okay is not like jumping so close that hector can easily exploit a weakness and the other thing that helps sell the jump he has a weapon of very long reach and so if you tried to do a jumping attack with a smaller weapon that would be a lot more dangerous with a shorter weapon now we do see achilles do a jumping attack with a shorter weapon at the beginning of the film uh so not sure but i think with a spear it helps mitigate a lot of the risks far more yeah and i would say a strike that does land you know right where his does look like he's aiming there would almost be an instant kill especially with how deep he got that short sword in the beginning seems to be kind of trying to do that here and there are more things that help mitigate the risks and then because of the style because look i do acknowledge that this is a fight so you want to be entertaining so sometimes you want to throw something in that's just going to look really cool and if you can sell it absolutely go for it and i think right right here i do think they sell this really well it makes it the fighting look even more dynamic yeah this is good i like it so big strike hecked up blocking with a shield good stuff mate now something they do something really here a couple of things okay um depending on the type of shield of the period so these aren't necessarily like spartan shields where they're thick wood and then they have like a layer of copper over top and what you'll notice with spartan shields they have a very distinct kind of lip and rim and that's actually to help it rest on the shoulder because they're so darn heavy these ones don't look to be anything like that they're not that level type of a hoplite shield they're far thinner and by the look of it a spear with this amount of power would actually have a high chance of puncturing the shield okay so if we pay attention to the sound here already that is a distinct metal clang so they're trying to say that this was a metal on metal strike that these shields either have a metal lining over top or just pure metal to begin with that would make them really heavy okay uh and so much so that the maneuvering that they're kind of doing would be more difficult and that honestly have to use them more like the hot plaster where there's a lip that rests on the shoulder and it's kind of fixed there you can still maneuver around it and get it but doing dynamic like things like that with a shield that heavy if it's metal it's actually not going to happen look these are basically superhumans kinda they're mythological characters in the actual like um iliad hector is said to have like this insanely long spear and they in the production of the film i remember them saying you know they tried to see if that were and it's just way too impractical they could not have they couldn't have given um hector a spear that long and so they kind of go into the mythological levels and we could we give a bit of an allowance that they're just so so strong they can handle a heavy shield like that uh maybe maybe could you stab through a shield that actually depends on what the shield is made out of these were wooden shields this strike right here that achilles is doing right down that would actually penetrate the shield with the amount of forces putting behind it and if not you will have blunted or dulled that spearhead especially if it is bronze okay this should be bronze age stuff when we shouldn't be steel so the battle of troy is estimated to happen around 1100ish bc and in most cases that is well before even iron weapons are around there are rare cases of iron weapons and even steel weapons as early as like 700 bc and some cases of steel before then but for the general trend now this most likely should be bronze and bronze under a huge impact like especially a point and they have massive problems in retaining their points uh it would just ruin the spear the weapons and just the weapons right now the armor is a different topic the weapons have unreasonable durability in this film and fight scene whereas the armor has unreasonable like uselessness in it um so yes this would definitely damage the sphere like look at that i do like hector's reaction like that knocked him back he's like oh that was a that was a big hit interesting the attack here right achilles going for what are you doing with your shield achilles no and hector why is your spear lowered like that keep your spear up even catch it if you need to ready to just the fact that it's just holding it down like that it's not good and yeah what achilles is doing here with his shield again he's just lowering it but then he goes for a low attack this might but i'm a little bit more critical of this low attack because unless you hit an artery on the leg um you're not going to incapac look you could immobilize them with a good solid hit at the legs if they actually pretend armor does something okay achilles wouldn't want to aim for the chest because it's armored and so maybe that would make the legs a more viable target if they were if they treated our armor properly and that you wouldn't be out unless it's a really powerful thrust because it depends on the type of armor the greeks even had a type of linen armor called the liner thorax um there's a couple videos done on it which is like layered linen with organic glues tied together and it was surprisingly effective all right it could stop arrow shots of the period and would have a good chance of defending spear but i think you could even get through a line of thorax with a really big thrust with a very sharp spear so okay maybe is aiming for the limbs because the armor but that would only make sense if they're consistent with that and actually show armor doing something now hector's response is interesting he blocks low with his shield but because his spear is low and it's going to be harder for him to do a counter attack and block slow kind of throws it aside he sees like throws it aside the spear goes with it it's like if his spear was up he could have blocked and thrust over top unfortunate now achilles he pulls back and is ready for another thrust again and now he's overarm hey i like to see that could show some you know variancy either overarm grip or underarm hector is not in a good position he's holding the shield behind him because he threw the you know the spear aside this is interesting achilles kind of goes a thrust with the back end switches to the front and then it is kind of doing this it mixes it up i like it so there and thro like almost a backhanded thrust picked up blocking with a shield good to see achilles so this would not have a lot of force or power behind it i think they sell it he actually gets a slap against hector's face with this by the look of it slap right there hector gets thrown back and then he does a bit of a slash with his spear can you slash with spears depends on the type of spearhead doesn't mean you'd never tried it like and he's in a really bad position here so he needs to bring that shield back and look if that helps ward off your opponent and you're not in a position to be able to like switch it maybe you could have done that would it have been just as fast to go like that into a thrust versus a wide slash like that which would have far more lethal capacity because the spearheads that we see like that achilles and hector doing they're small they're not hewing spears so a hewing spear kind of similar to this lap one that i have here but sometimes they're even longer where they have a big blade easily as long as certain short source at times and you can do slashing attacks with hewing spears pretty well because hector's spearhead it doesn't have a huge blade it's not going to do much with a wide slash like this and say he goes like achilles ducks an inch is like it's it's like a big it's stylized it looks good i think that works you would want to raise your shield though uh but there you go brings a spear back again low thrust is he trying to go for the heel achilles is this foreshadowing about a certain heel thing that might incapacitate someone who knows but keep your shield raised mate like okay look at how lower the shield is at this point for someone who is like supposed to be a master trained combatant of this period of warfare one of the most consistent things should always be keeping the shield up as often as possible so low attack uh hector's just trying to get distance there's obviously a thrust good but again he has to raise the shield to block it he does it in time but the shield should have been to begin with and then look at that over swing he's like i know it's kind of going with the momentum to get a thrust but you didn't need to throw the shield all the way over to get the thrust you just raise thrust and look at look at look at the man shields can defend so much so all the way back hector you know you have a shield so i find it interesting that in a lot of times in this fight scene these combatants are opting to dodge the weapon rather than dot i block with the shield and people might say it's more dynamic should be just say no you could like do dynamic blocking with the shield even keeping in front like bang block hit you know and all the ways that you could do it because they're showing these shields they're essentially very light or much lighter than what steel shields would be uh for these combatants and so they're already flailing the shield around they could use the shields in really dynamic interesting ways and choose to block with them rather than opting to dodge it's like they're forgetting that they even have shields so the question is would this strike if hit hectare maybe let's see it's it's going forward it doesn't really move it much forward than that but seeing this coming to your face yeah i could see why you would kind of dodge back like that knocks it aside with this spear okay i don't like this move um it's unneeded achilles has fully extended the spear already like this and so at this point the spear isn't really a threat to hector and so hector who's standing here all right you don't need to knock aside the sphere because it's not a threat and was achilles even blocking himself in this thrust let's go back and see knight this is the part where he throws the shield behind him in in that thrust and now it's fully extended and so when we get to this point yeah the shield is still completely behind him at least there's not a lot of these moments in this fight scene but this is probably so far the worst part of the fight scene from a technical standpoint because hector achilles is massively vulnerable his withdrawn is shield overextended with a thrust and instead of knocking aside with your spear it's right there just thrust forward it's a bang and achilles would either have to dodge because she wasn't ready to defend or he could have potentially killed him right there because he's left himself wide open what's interesting just from again a technical standpoint achilles is uh displayed in his fight scene as the more uh aggressive and talented skillful fighter yet from a technical standpoint he is a first one from the you know maneuvers and choreography so far to make the most severe blunder and leave himself open look there's been people have left them so hoping to this point but he can't defend with the well with the spear because he's extended it so far and the shield is out of the way and so kill this is the first one to make the worst technical mistake there were 10 more stakes before but to me this is a big one and so achilles so hector look hector makes it a big technical stake here he could have just like i said thrusted forward he hops to slap aside the spear okay so it's an alright move from the position he's in but the position he's in he shouldn't have been in because it's really bad position where he had the shield like way back his spear gets knocked aside and then is going in for a a a kind of shield strike one thing that i will give our props for in this position is that achilles is striking with the edge of the shield that's one of the big errors when people think shield bashing they bash forward when that would just disperse all the force over a really large surface area when you want to actually strike with the shield you do it with the edge concentrating the force smaller surface area right there smacking like that and good to see that that's how you'd want to bash with the shield so swings over uh hector dodges you know yeah like he had to do this big wide thing he lowered his shield to do it so i would have to dodge from that position again keep your shield up hector though dodges under and they're gonna have to both recover uh he goes for a slot and then he's basically swiping back with the shield instead of recovering his spear and thrusting uh and you know it knocks a hecta's going for a stab good to see and it's actually okay it's not really attack it's a slap a sight he's defending with a shield swings it really wide i think they seem to like to do this right they like kind of doing a a exchange of momentum where if they're gonna and this is wrong you shouldn't do this but if you're gonna thrust with a spear they like throwing it back and then if they come back with a shield they retract their spear and they're doing a lot of kind of this motion when you don't need to do that is it to convey movement to make it more dynamic you could like you definitely could do it with the shield by striking bringing the spear keeping the shield there and doing movements like this right and making sure the shield is always forward you would still get that wide kind of movement and especially instead of doing like this where you're leaving yourself open you could move with it all right depending where the enemy is and stuff and absolutely there's a lot of movement that you can do to convey dynamic motion unfortunately here they're going with the more technically flawed approach so achilles is going for a thrust which like again hector you done the same thing he went for a thrust withdrew his shield leaving him wide open and uh look how close this comes he has to dodge and it misses him by like a hair and look i think it's cool to have that you know it intense kind of suspenseful where like look how close the strike came you could still have this type of you know exchange where a strike came really close without the you know opponent hector in this case making a very big new mistake by always withdrawing his shield and throwing it out of the way it would be really cool if maybe achilles did like a feint where he went down for a strike making hector lower the shield try and block and then he comes and then hits really quickly and then it's that moment where hector is like oh atmosphere come so close all right so that he knocks the spear up with his shield this is interesting i don't mind it so achilles just got the um spear knocked aside and he's gonna is bringing it around back above the shield and is gonna be doing a hahaha from this would be a like over-the-top movie in a real fight but because this guy's supposed to be almost superhuman in his skill you could try and sell it and for me it works so it goes right there and he goes for the okay probably holds it too long because from that position there's not many ways that achilles can strike it actually become puts him in a very very vulnerable position if he was taking advantage of a weak like an opening to just try and go with a momentum where the spear got knocked aside and it gets brought around to here and he quickly does like a stab maybe you could sell it but because he holds it so long and then he's like that actually puts him in a pretty vulnerable position just because there's not a lot of options from that stance and so hector like he could do a lot in taking advantage of this but he just backs up heaps and heaps not taking advantage of the opening really so they see that thrust at least he blocks with the shield kindly he just quickly slaps it aside because the shield is open knocks achilles spear all the way around like big wide okay this is interesting he's like a haha thing i don't mind that there are some what look to be almost exaggerated stances in in combat that if you get invented it works really well i'm not sure it works well for you know a big wide slapping kind of strike with a spear it's not a hewing spear warding it off but the stance does convey huge style and for that i think it works there's a maneuver in certain rapid treatises where you do this wide kind of side step to bring the sword kind of around and then you thrust and you end up being in this really kind of interesting sideways stepping attack like that it looks a bit flamboyant but to kind of curve around so oh yeah you want to kind of curve around and then thrust down behind someone's guard and then you put yourself off center to avoid the counter attack here is an image from one of the hemitritis's it's actually a very martially viable maneuver even though it looks a bit more flamboyant so i'm not against flamboyant moves if they're more justified so i think i'm on the fence i like that they're showing style i don't like what he's trying to do with it because yeah the slap like it just comes in he blocks with the shield comes back returns with a thrust hector what are you doing with your shield mate it's like the shield wasn't even there you're just holding it to the side and then all right this is where hector actually does pull out something interesting because this seems to be intentional he's purposely letting the spear thrust come in and watch what he does here okay so he then jams it between his spear and shield so what's interesting all right i don't like achilles wax uh at hector's spear this would not break a spear shaft just a shield edge like that in actual fact even if this shield had a really sharpened edge to try and cut through it like a a proper you know solid spear shaft that's not going to be made out of bolsa wood or anything like that it would be difficult to chop through this in one strike with an axe let alone a shield so this right here to me is huge bull crap it's not going to break this spear but hector's still in that position because his trapped achilles spear and so what he does no he just lets it go i thought he was going to try and break it here he'll okay achilles just withdraws it i thought this was the part where he broke and killed his spear but no it happens a bit later all right i don't like that that hector spear should not have been broken from that angle and before i cause again the shield is blunt and so with hector he's got the shield there he's got a spear here with achilles shield coming in knocking it so much it would just knock the spear sideways like pulling like that it wouldn't break it come off it this is interesting it's like a battle of strength and leverage achilles is lower and so he has a lower center of gravity and so i actually like his position for what he does here because by having a lower center of gravity he would be able to get underneath and actually retain his position more easily push hector off his balance that's good i like it so push achilles is lower then pushes back hector gets knocked off his balance and his spear is broken so he just throws it aside i i know he has got a sword but why doesn't he draw he's got plenty of time to draw the sword at this point okay it's very odd that he's not drawing your sword because instead of bracing yourself you've got time to draw the sword and then of course he's waiting for her achilles strike spear thrust comes in slap just you don't need a slipper side you got a shield you can just block with it and then again more slapping aside with the shield all right this is where it happens so he kind of knocks achilles spear down okay from this position it's far more reasonable that you might be able to snap a wooden shaft like that but the shaft will generally be stronger even than someone's grip and so with hecta jamming his uh his knee down on on it like that rather than snapping it would either knock achilles hand down um yeah that's really it or make it knock it out of his grip because the spear should be stronger than achilles grip it's like these made out of really flimsy shafts and they just snap like that um and now he draws the sword it must have been in the shield but it looks like he's drawing it a bit higher and then he slashes that achilles achilles like where is your shield again let's go back to this point here again your shield just holding off to the side like it's not important and that leaves him really open to this slash that hector does um and then he blocks with the shield he draws his there's a spin hmm first real spin in this fight scene so far they've been kind of sparingly with their spins is this one justified there are ways to justify spins as we have addressed in fight scene autopsy they're not always bad is this one bad so we'll watch hector's slap sword has been kind of uh let's have a look he's slashed with the sword he alright so achilles kind of knocks the sword aside which uh he's going with the momentum i think this one mostly works he's trying to draw the sword but he wants to draw it in such a way where he goes with the momentum and strikes back like that uh it doesn't leave him terribly open he's got armor and so there's that depending on how well the armor is supposed to work i think this one it's not terrible it's not terrible it's not great you know i'll be good hector could have actually done a spin here with achilles strike he could have actually stepped forward and then knocked achilles aside that would actually be a really good attack just from the position he's in there's a spin that could be justified that comes in hector blocks interesting that they hold it a bit too long here those are definitely broadened swords well they should be and so they would be gouging into each other right here so achilles withdraws the sword but hector's arm would be in the same position and so i don't think that's good by withdrawing the sword and hector's sword would be so close he could easily slash down and to kill his legs he's definitely close enough and so this is a bad move by achilles but he withdraws the sword while hector's sword is so close he goes in for a thrust hector dodged underneath by the look see where his hand is see where his hand is like through that entire thing it already showed him ducking which means he wasn't defending with his shield or his sword and their legs are completely vulnerable a big slash along the leg oh again achilles left himself really open this is the second big technical flaw in terms of leaving yourself open and it's done by kelly so far hector has actually made less mistakes than achilles here and achilles seems to be blessed by the gods because it's been out of break hector's spear when it shouldn't have um and even though hector shouldn't be now to break achilles spear he was in a much better position to be able to achieve it than what achilles did so i would actually say hector is actually the more talented combatant in this fight so far again hector what are you doing with your sword mate you dodge underneath this and you're withdrawing your sword when look see right here heck that right here don't don't just slash slay like oh you could probably cut really deep into an artery there you see he's wide open hector what are you doing alright so this is a big flaw that hector does achilles has two big dum-dums and hector now has a very a very big dum-dum moment oh [Music] yeah yeah bad he just withdraws it oh wait now he slashes instead of slashing or he could have slashed right there plenty of time he decides to withdraw and then he slashes and achilles blocks with his green right there and yet like what are you aiming for hector like there's a lot of leg and you should know that achilles has armor on his feet don't aim so low aim for his exposed thigh there's almost like two big flaws very close together ah you're doing so well hector so he dropped that achilles withdraws his leg after being hit seems to why you don't lie with your shield now achilles is really open on this shoulder right here and is lowering his shield even further not good okay now he raises it a little uh hector what are you doing with your shield mate he's just holding it to the side achilles is going to go up for a thrust hector has to dodge because his shield isn't there look it shows good motion i like that stairs like like that that's right slash up sideways cut did that what did that actually hit there's a bit of there's a clang looks it's like it's hitting the shield here or it's cleaned off the armor is this one like it's so subtle it's hard to see but it was this a slash at the armor because the real question is are curly's why are you slashing at the chest slash at the throat mate right there um so for being such a you know incredibly like talented you know warrior why are you just aiming for the chest here because right there maybe maybe he's kind of aiming for that i don't know that is so close that definitely had to have made contact so hector goes down for a really strong cut achilles blocks i like the position of the shield there bringing the shield close in to kind of like absorb the impact works great i i like that stance but hector look what he does with his shield here for this again this shield is behind it you could do a big cut and still keep the shield here you don't need to go like ah come on that's a big hit achilles comes in now he just brings in the shield to block and then achilles kind of he he follows through so achilles is he went in for like an attack was that a slash or a cut let's settle it it's kind of like a forward yeah he's leading with the blade so it's going there and then he's going to bring it down and come with a thrust like that and let's take a look all right okay why are you holding the shield there i know it's maybe to try and not block his body so and he he was bracing himself in that block before and then he went for an attack and his held it's held the shield in position so it's not like he's necessarily with the druid he has repositioned his body and has held the shield in the same spot you could almost justify it to get the momentum ready for this thrust that is about to do and the pose looks great this is one of those few times in a fight scene where i'll almost accept this as the rule of cool where it's such a dynamic motion he's got this great kind of position where it's like this and it's going to go in for a big thrust and it's going to end in such a cool hero pose i think i would even go for the rule of call with having the shield position there just to get this dynamic ending pose which happens right here like that that looks awesome okay actually i don't know it looks pretty silly just holding the shield like that but i think you could sell i think it's and i think this is mostly being sold because it's been a forward is there on a big forward thrust where it's actually kind of ended like that really and he decided to hold the shield there to focus on the momentum of the thrust i think this one is sold oh yeah it looks awesome one of the big flaws of course is that this is a bronze blade that just went massive thrust into a shield and received absolutely no damages at all okay did we get a closer so hector just got knocked back almost you know i was going to say a mile but hyperbole but you know you get what i say and no damage on that bronze sword in the slightest for a bronze sword like the blade will have just gone curved like uh right up from a thrust like that this is the reason why bronze blades actually see this ridgeline they see this is accurate okay so see this ridge line right along there a lot of bronze blades even had more pronounced ridges than that because they were so prone to bending at dynamic pose look at those steely eyes okay uh hector comes back in yeah he just slaps it aside because achilles is just maybe he's trying to intimidate him hold the blade out so he lets it this is very stylized he's been holding a shield behind him he lets the strike knock his sword aside and then he moves behind to block with the shield unlock from a tankless standpoint is very dumb unless he's trying to taunt hector in this position because he's just like it's very odd they're overly stylized hector goes for a spin i don't know i'm not sure this one's justified because he goes in wide slash he's off balance look you could say he's trying to go with the momentum because he's like oh it is gonna just go and try and swing it around not sure it was needed but he again blocks with the shield goes with the momentum goes in with a wide strike and achilles is still holding the shield line and this has to be because he's taunting him at this point like i don't even need my shield i'll hold the shield behind my head and take you on just like this uh because that's the only way you could try and justify a warrior talent as an achilles doing this there's no technical validity or benefit to what it's doing like from a standpoint it's ridiculous therefore i'll let it pass as taunting thing as though with a like a hector's wide strike coming in if he had a way to block that strike maybe no because i was going to say if you attack the arm instead of blocking the blade the attack still might land but he just hit hard enough on hector's arm that's coming around so hector's right here is coming for a big strike and if achilles hit the arm and prevented the strike from going all the way potentially chop off hector's arm here because the arm is actually exposed look at that see that um so anyway achilles blocks knocks it up tries to stab down protect the blocks again then hector isn't really holding his shield in position properly still achilles still taunting with the shield behind goes for a thrust hector had his shield low raises it more thrusts hector going for a leg strike achilles seems to have pushed aside with his grieve i don't mind that but hector what are you doing with the shield mate yeah just letting it hang down that's the biggest flaw with this fight so big wide slash hector needs to dodge duck under because you know he's forgotten his shield exists i like this achilles well don't i don't like the stance but from the stance the follow position achilles does a big over swing and hector's head is right there you might not have enough time to get the sword there but this his shoulder is right there so he just smacks the shot usually i have a big pet peeve of people doing or landing attacks with unarmed parts of the thing i like punching when like they're in a fight they have a sword in this end but they decide to throw a punch the punch lands which means if they attacked the sword it could have killed their opponent this one isn't exactly like that because is it though i'm trying because the floor would be if it wouldn't have taken that much extra time for the sword strike to land rather than the elbow okay he's wide open he's wired up instead of hitting i you know i think i need to withdraw that like the fact that i thought this was okay because it's not that much difference between landing that and just going slash just like letting the elbow not extend and bringing it around and then just doing a draw cut would have sliced hector's neck or head wide open another poor choice from achilles so hectic i almost has three big technical mistakes the bit i know there's lots little ones but in terms of the big ones hector had two it seems to be almost the third or fourth for achilles i'm losing count knock he could have ended that yeah he could have killed hector then hector goes for a big wide slash achilles doesn't know bothering him out of shield hector withdrawing his shield now is just almost flailing about wildly achilles still has his control he goes up for one of his signature jumping moves trying to get there yeah he's trying to get it right into hector's neck like we saw at the beginning of the film hmm this is where i don't think it works as well because he's using a sword he's closer and he's withdrawing his shield to be able to get the big like that and so all hector needs to do on this side is raise his shield and stab and achilles can't really dodge okay doesn't work as well don't like this one hector blocks with his shield instead of trying to attack back then he runs back forward he's wildly flat like vivian wilde attracting the shield behind him in the in the exchanges and it gets into an interesting bind here achilles seems to get leverage over it throws it aside it does prettier just raise your shield man my goodness slash like very close it could have sliced hector's neck white right open because again just they're forgetting they have shields so as fun as this fight scene is and it is a lot of fun there's actually a lot of technical flaws with it but the fact that they're just not using the shields properly that's one big issue there's other issues as well hector goes underneath this is interesting i think it goes underneath not using his shield though slashes again achilles seems to trap the sword knock it down goes up for a slash just the whole time hector's just look at all this right this we're gonna go from here but even before then hector's basically forgotten about his shield the whole time ready shield is just no not using his shield she's still like there finally he does the shield for something achilles knocks it but all that whole exchange he's just was letting it hang down and look achilles isn't that much better here he at least the shield is a little bit forward at this point but he is letting it withdraw he throws it all the way back at this point going down okay so this is like the closest anyone has ever come to harming achilles he actually nicked the armor achilles is a bit surprised but achilles why are you so surprised you literally withdrew the shield and that's what would happen because you're wide open we'll go back right look at what he's doing with his shield he put it there see where it is see there from this point he is swinging the shield back so if i get on hillary's side he's swinging it back just like that okay and he doesn't bring it back forward and so it's not like smack smack slash and that whole time it's just like i will hold my shield open and let you slash at it all right so hector goes in for a big ah this is interesting achilles seemingly is he either didn't get the shield close enough to block or he knowingly let it pass in inside the shield and traps hector's sword this is interesting then he i actually really like this okay by letting the sword come in he he like lets it in and then he moves aside he pulls it down and traps it and the sword is now angled down on the flaps and so we go to where achilles is shield is here pulling it and the flat is pressing up against his breastplate that would be perfectly fine it wouldn't really cut and hector's arm is in a really difficult position this is easily my favorite maneuver of the entire fight it's technically complex it's martially viable and hector genuinely is in a really awkward position to be able to get leverage or strength here love it so achilles okay so achilles was gone for a kill shot look at how close that is hector's in a really awkward position and he just barely manages to bring his shield in to defend against it i love it i think that's really good and hector still is not in a great position to try and find an opening so achilles does a kick kicks him back and then he he trips over a rock oh all right so because like that last maneuver was the most technically complex and sophisticated maneuver of the fight scene i was almost going to say hector was still the more talented combatant because he made less mistakes but because achilles pulled off that maneuver which honestly just like gorgeous okay that brings achilles back as being a you know in terms of the technical competency on display his backup probably better than achilles maybe then yeah a kick but then uh hector trips on a stoner and it's mostly over he lost his shield dude dude you wouldn't be caring about crawling away you've lost your shield that's like the most important bit of kit you have probably even more important than your weapon honestly instead of crawling away you'll be like lunging to grab your shield again uh bad choice here this is really this is a big dumb moment for hector choosing not to get the shield back just crawling away gets right there man this is why you're crawling the opposite direction pick up your freaking shield don't take my glory ah now achilles throws his shield i like what achilles should really do is like hector your shield's there why are you cr no and i kind i do think it's in line with achilles character today like all right you not for some reason you're not getting shield fine i'll throw away my shield he wants an even fight um yeah but dumb for hector i could see why achilles then decides to throw away the shield and now hector's just kind of flailing about he picked up is that what he decided to get the spearhead and do wield like do you willing spewer head and sword not better than sword and shield okay shield is vastly more protective so he goes in for a wide slash yeah look i will give it this one seems like it would have hit if achilles didn't dodge i think the blade is angled see right there you can kind of see the blade angled a bit too far away from achilles but it's so fast um and the motion of the arm makes it look like it would have hit if achilles didn't dodge so that's good big wide over swing is it achilles what are you doing with this sword though like this big white attack achilles is dodging what are you doing like ah this is a big bad moment for achilles again he's just do he forgot his sword existed hector is wide open here yeah it's unfortunate achilles you could have done something with your sword and then he just he's holding it like not doing anything just dodging this is interesting where he goes down oh oh okay he i it's it's like a spin but dodge at the same time so achilles is here and he's dodging under and he's gonna bring the his attack around in the spin and hit by the look of it and slash yes all right i think that that is pretty cool goes right through so that's not armor then because it actually cuts right through the cloth that was just i don't know a loincloth basically uh you'd think i could they try to make it look like i'm with these you know metal things but that just cloth doesn't do a thing gets slashed on his leg and as to the complexity of this move from achilles he's not doing anything good with his sword here but going with it that does make achilles look like you know more like a more competent fighter pulling off something far more complex and difficult hector here tries to knock it aside he's trying to slash an achilles but look it this part i think they're selling quite well in terms of that hector is at the end of his rope and is just kind of flailing about he's trying hard but he's losing it and achilles is in complete control just as precise as he was at the beginning of the fight where hector has lost that kind of precision that is great narrative kind of storytelling in the fight scene to kind of show where the fight's going and so slashing what is he aiming for there that's a bit dumb that's a bad hector what are you aiming for really nothing there that's aim for a kill he's achilles is forced to block what is he trying to do there when he grabs it is he just trying to push it aside this is a bit strange he raises his arm seems to push aside okay goes in for a slash hector dodgers hector b ah this is good hector going for the leg achilles raises the leg this shows like great kind of area awareness from achilles like he probably saw the telegraph the attack coming low he didn't even need to look and he just raises his leg uh letting it flow underneath kelly's in vast more control of this fight now hector almost losing it so i think this is the part where the fight scene really does raise its quality in terms of what they are trying to tell so like i said the narrative that they're showing in the fight scene is top tier some of the technical com you know combat elements were pretty poor honestly in a lot of areas and if they got those more technical aspects correct it would have added the emerging authenticity of the fight scene all right so hangar running in again wide flail achilles is dodges but you know he's dodging under he just thrust up as he dodged hector would be in a pretty poor position he kind of does he tries to thrust there but misses don't know what he's aiming at hector why flare with the spear now he's got a spearhead hedge has been slashing at it using this that spearhead like it's a sword no it's still a spear he should be thrusting and he could cut or thrust with his sword but he's just flailing the spearhead around like like it's a sword he goes in with his sword block he's just holding the spear down he's not he's not really dual wielding to the full advantage here because he's just using one his sword to strike now not really exchanging it with the spearhead achilles slashes hector dodgers he tries to use the spear then there's a little thrust here see this part here right right there where he goes in thrust with the spear not sure what it's aimed at he always pushes him back in full control they face off at each other all right this is interesting so disarm love this see that so hector's going in for a thrust achilles moves aside grabs smacks up with his arm right at the point of contact which so you see that right here he's gonna smack forward see this is great this is a great disarm like i've seen disarms in a lot of fight scenes where people just let go of their weapon uh it happened in obi-wan actually so it was when darth vader was fighting riva in my ob1 fights in autopsy darth vader just kicks uh riva and she decides to drop her weapon because what so there are some really crap disarms so people just let go no this is a fight the combatants are going to be trying to hold on to the weapon a lot and as a result you need to push against the resistance of them holding on to the weapon to get a proper disarm they do that here brilliant look like achilles has to really push in here to get hector to lose his grip pushing pushing pushing and only there does the grip get broken brilliant love that hector went in for a wide slash in return now achilles has both and look at this ah okay so he goes through for a slash misses this is a really interesting exchange what's about to happen here we see multiple spins yet each one is carrying the momentum around and so in this instance because is like slash slash slash slash right it might have actually taken more time after like this slash this slash to stop that momentum and then return and so by spinning with the momentum it might actually be faster by spinning than not spinning and that's what could sell it this was this is what makes this type of spin far more believable because it's so quick let's have a look bang bang like look at that look at this so we're gonna watch it again slash slash bang it's almost like each one was a misdirect throwing hector off balance he doesn't really know the attack is coming really really fast he goes bang bang bang slash right in that looks freaking badass that's that's good spinning yes that was awesome spinning was a good trick in this move okay okay let's watch it again and then ends with a spear right into his collarbone that was awesome that was legitimately cool this is a great example of where you can sell some more flamboyant even spinning over-the-top moves in a more realistic way yeah and then it feels more authentic more immersive and it just lands with a bang it's great so that went through his armor so i would agree a spear thrust strong downward thing has a chance to get through armor it's almost like it's in between some of these plates as well one interesting thing instead of like this kind of ring of blood around it should actually be like almost a line see in the angle of my hand here like because the spearhead was you know flat and so there should be like a line cut on either end on this end and on that end going down a little bit and then up a little bit like that just to convey that hey this is actually a broader wider spearhead that went through but as i mentioned i could believe downwards you know stab like that could puncture uh classical period armor yes you know this should be bronze armor as well by the way hector falls down all right so this this i'm not so sure about so hector's basically done it's like the bronze sword don't i i don't know it's hard for me to decide let me know what you think in the comments this is a bronze kind of odd looking armor it's not it's not a actual curas there are different like square bits of bronze thing on top of some type of leather curase so honestly a sword would have higher chances of puncturing through you that type of vomit and especially in between the plates i could allow it but armor is meant to do something okay achilles has all the time to try and build up momentum he's even got his fist behind it pushing it forward that soles it a bit better i i i'm on the edge but a little bit on the side just a little bit of accepting it i think this one is sold for the technology level for the type of armor the armor that he's wearing just doesn't look great if you like like i said odd it's not a good armor design so if he gets in between the plates a heavy enough thrust even a bronze sword might be out of puncture the armor in this specific instance i think i'll allow it barely but i'll allow it and then the fight is over hector is defeated and that is hector versus achilles from the movie troy uh my overall impressions at the end still one of the better fightings out there for the tempo the motion and the dynamic kind of exchanges in terms of it the technical side it's honestly about 50 50. actually probably even more there was more worse things in terms of the technical uh maneuvers they were the shields of the big issue they were forgetting the shield so much okay but there were some really cool moments that had a good technical validity in it so by far it's not a dumpster fire there's actually some good moments in it so maybe 40 good 60 bad or close as i it's hard could be 50 50 but it's around there in terms of good competent you know combative maneuvers versus dumb stupid things that is unrealistic and they're not doing the right thing but that is it achilles versus hexdraw feisty autopsy hope you have enjoyed hope to see you on the next video here on shadowversity and until that time [Music] you

Channel: Shadiversity

Views: 523,940

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Id: sjEt94Kkl6s

Length: 65min 14sec (3914 seconds)

Published: Sat Jul 30 2022