Chad Nicholls Fires Back - UNCENSORED

after the 98 Arnold I get a phone call would you be interested in working with Sean ray why would he say well I'm gonna tell you why he said that my athletes literally change sport they looked different everybody has access to certain things Kuwait yeah the anabolic chicken everything it's probably right now the most abuse drug in the sport this suppose Dallas McCarver anabolic non-canonical right I don't know if people even believe this you know he's speaking everybody outside of Haney and Yates you're saying there's no way even if you work with him that he could win the whole thing look I think he's a piece of [ __ ] person I'm not gonna deny that he was a good body go Kevin LeBron was like angered and he was like this mad man dripping in sweat and rips his shirt off and he's ready to fight me that's a complete lie that's media that's conversation that's talk so then Steve Weinberger he's like dude you gotta chill out like this is not the place so the part about Kevin wanted to rip you a new one well there's a marshal truth to that yeah the more angry Sean got the more driven I became I would have probably worked with every one of his competitors for free just to bury him did you ever think you would you phone we got that tape now you came in give it values today this world of entrepreneurs we can't no value to hate this run homie look what I become I'm the unborn [Music] so I got to tell you I remember when I interviewed Sammy the bull Gravano and when I interviewed Sammy Sammy called that Teddy Atlas a month later Teddy Atlas sat right here and he said listen I got a respond to what Sammy said I remember when we had Dorian Yates here and he called that Brandon curry a month later Brandon curry showed up and responded to Dorian however Shawn Ray calls out chat Nichols Chad showed up in the front doorstep here within 24 hours so would that be in such an thanks for coming out I appreciate you having me so I'm assuming that video with our buddy Shawn really fired you up a little it did a little bit it wasn't anything that I wasn't used to but it is you know when you wake up in the morning and you have 25 DMS with a clip of Shawn's at it again you get a little irritated was it anything different than what he had said in the past before it really wasn't there was mostly the same stuff but there was a couple things within it that was like JustFab completely fabricated which was kind of shocking like I'm not even sure why he went down the road but because it didn't pertain to like him bashing me but like it was again completely fabricated so how about I played I got a part of it I'm not gonna play the whole thing they'll give you six minutes I got the fifty second part of it and then we can go from there and obviously I got a lot of other topics I want to go into with you but let's start off with our buddy here by the way the UN Chad nickels ever do anything together absolutely not he's dr. Kevorkian to me bro in 1996 I went to guest pose for him took me to dinner and he asked me if I needed any help I just got second place to Dorian Yates no I don't need your help I don't even know you and I think that's where we started to butt heads Ronnie Coleman will defend him to the ninth degree but he was in that bathtub near death in 2001 at the direction of Chad Nichols who's not a doctor by the way there's at least five deaths Don Youngblood NASA relson body Dallas McCarver and few other people as a bodybuilding coach that are dead and in the ground and he hadn't gone to one funeral so I have a reason to be pissed so that's a shorter abbreviated version of you know of what he said exactly what are your thoughts somebody said there so there's a couple things I it depends where you want me to start we can start from the beginning the most I don't know if I want to say funny because I don't think any of its funny but the most interesting part of it and it basically outlines basically his direction of the whole thing is right from the get-go because he says you asked him if we ever worked together and his response was absolutely not but he went in guest post for me in 96 and I asked him if he wanted to work with me or basically that's we had that's a complete lie like that's an absolute lie and when I explained it to you you'll understand he did absolutely guest post for me that year he came he guest posed we went out to eat we that was literally the first time that I'd probably talking to him I didn't even know if he was in town until I got to the venue and there was a Lamborghini parked out in front of the venue that some guy from Arkansas had brought down for him to drive around town all day he guest posed I didn't have any issues there we go out to eat and we literally talked about three things we talked about his like which was weird because I was actually under the impression he was from a very wealthy family but he kind of portrayed the fact that his brother was a drug addict and his mother was in prison for drugs and which means my wife were kind of like what we thought he was from very like wealthy family so we're kind of shocked by that no big deal and then he kind of portrayed this MA of him like really working out of the gutters and coming you know becoming to think which I like again like we don't know it like by at all I don't know him at all at that time the bodybuilding world doesn't know him yet oh no they know him but we do don't know we don't know I don't know him from man he say we zoom in Kim okay we don't know anything about him we was just under the impression pression that he was from a very wealthy family just based off of how he day he was maybe portrayed in the magazines which is really the only way we know it he talked a little bit about the cars how this guy would sell him the cars he would buy the car driver for two months resell it which I thought was kind of a cool idea and then he basically talked about finances that was the only thing we talked about now here's the interesting thing we didn't talk about nutrition we didn't talk about athletes I was working with we didn't talk about anything about that the reason we didn't talk about that is because I wasn't working with athletes yet I hadn't trained anyone the only person I had trained up until that point is Kim from 92 to 96 I don't first get involved in nutrition until the 97 Olympia at no point would there ever be a conversation of a kid I was 27 years old whatever I don't know 28 9 years old I would never be even talking in that realm because I wasn't there yet like nobody's talking about hey Chad Nicholas is working with athletes he's you know doing this he's doing that that part hasn't even started it's a year down the road so that is completely fabricated 100% completely fabricated in no way shape or form did that never happen why would he say well I'm gonna tell you why he said that because I never asked him but now we fast forward so in 97 I do start working with athletes okay and I trained NASA relson body mm-hmm I trained Paul to let both of them gone most people think the NASA could have won the Olympia that year Dorian ends up winning but no matter what it was the best that NASA had ever looked that year 98 we come to the Arnold Classic and flex wheeler wins now a lot of people will say that to his best ever I think his two best is his first 193 where he was a little smaller but conditioning was phenomenal and 98 which he was bigger and again conditioning phenomenal directly after the 98 Arnold now this is where everybody's gonna this is gonna be interesting after the 98 Arnold I get a phone call from Boyer Co now if you're familiar with Boyer Co Sean ray and Boyer Co they had a workout program called flex workout together so they were friends he also dated a girl named Debbie mug Lee who was a professional bodybuilder my wife and Debbie mug Lee were friends so when we would go out to California we go out to eat with Boyer and Debbie and we became friends Boyer CO calls me and says listen Chet would you be interested in working with Shawn ray because the Olympia is open this year and we believe that with your guidance he could win the Olympia and so at this point I'm kind of like okay because I'd already started hearing like little tidbits of stuff that was starting to come like after the flex wheeler when at the Arnold right that was all kind of being directed at Shawn but the rumors right because at this point we have no social media everything is just hearsay Jeff and stuff and again this can all be literally confirmed through Boyer Co so so Boyer calls me to ask me this and I'm like listen honestly there has to be three things that has to factor in for me to work with an athlete one I have to believe they're a hard worker to I have to believe that they'll pay attention and do exactly what I say there that I'm not wasting my time with the athlete and three I have to believe that we are going to click and that the person is not a like that he's a decent human being Shawn doesn't match any of the three criteria I have zero interest in working with him zero told us to to Boyer Co now on that prior to this how many interactions have you had with Shawn none except for that dinner yes oh I take that back I take that back actually so we're at the dinner so now at the dinner supposedly this is when I supposedly asked him right and he's like Oh Chad's the devil right like we don't want anything to do with him but in 97 when my wife wins the Olympia we are in California for photo shoots and we're doing photo shoots and miraculously Shawn shows up at the photo shoot like out of the blue for no reason shows up at the show at the photo shoot and there's literally like somehow even gets into the photo shoot so there's literally a picture of him like encouraging Kim to like you know like how they're doing photos and they're like go for the weight and like Kim's curling and he's like motivating her stuff so he literally shows up there now again I don't talk with him we don't talk about anything were like at no point are we talking about working nothing like literally he just shows up which I thought was weird no the reason why or never no idea okay literally got no idea why showed up but it would be it seems odd that he would show up there based on the fact that he just told you in 96 that like I'm the devil and he wouldn't have anything to do with me when in reality I can tell you that never happened the whole thing was completely fabricated by Shawn completely fabricated by Shawn and after that point if you realize that was after the 98 Arnold from that point I became the devil for sure so from that point everything literally escalated so once I had talked to Boyer that seems to be the point because before that there's no interaction there's no Chad this Chad that blablablabla after that point that's when everything Escalus after you taught Boyer no chance no no chance Angeline Boyer could confirm that he's 100% now I've had people like talk to Boyer and Boyer will kind of beat around the bush a little bit about it he will confirm that he made the phone call he will confirm and he will kind of act like you know well so I didn't really come out and say like to do it but I was just reaching out on his behalf I don't buy that for a second they were buddies like not for a second do I buy that because at this point now we're already like by the time this is already be an ass Shawn's already like bashing the hell out of me so I think he realizes it's happened he can't go back on that it happened obviously but he has to kind of save face for Shawn a little now at this point who's working with you flex is working with you [ __ ] names that are working I was working with you yeah so this is 98 now I have Nasir I have flex I have Ronnie I have pulled to let those are probably the mean those are they and those are names but those are not like years they're working with the main guys pretty much at 98 I mean the 90 - yeah the 98 Olympia that was the top three it was Ronnie flex and Nasir and in the 99 Olympia it was Ronnie flex Cormier and I had Cormier in 99 Cormier as well yes okay 99 it was the first year in the other part of what he says is how would led to you know or what happened with Nasir how he led to what happened with the rest of the name but it's absolutely okay what's your response to what he says about so there's a cut there's a bunch of response like we can we can talk about it but I think the biggest one is flex I think that basically sets the tone for just how big of a liar Shawn is like he is a pathological liar and anybody that's listening to this right now can go to Google and they can type in what disease was flex wheeler born with and it will pull up FSGS which is focal segmental whatever okay it's a kidney disease that he was born okay he didn't find out about that until 99 now Shawn is a hundred percent aware of this he's a hundred percent aware of it I don't recall ever in my 20 years that he's been talking [ __ ] about me ever hearing him mention it but he's a hundred percent aware of what the diseases that flex has a hundred percent but he looked at you dead in the eye and basically blamed me for a disease that Flex has now here's the bad part of it flex went through a kidney transplant he has this disease but it's a disease that he got at birth he still has it so the kidney transplant didn't cure flex this is something that flex will have to go through ever so 15 years from now now I'm granted no flex is aware of it now so he was very proactive he is watching everything they monitor everything but that's not to say that in 15 years because the disease is there destroying the kidney right now it's there it's destroying the kidney and in 15 years flex may end up needing another kidney like that's possible because of that now could've bodybuilding escalated that a hundred percent okay there's no doubt it's you're not discounting it I absolutely not like listen if he would have chose to be a golfer he probably would have needed a kidney transplant ten years later but he didn't he didn't choose that he chose to be a bodybuilder and it doesn't matter what you know what I did what he did it did it doesn't matter because based off of the chosen sport it was going to escalate the problem and I'm sure that flex is a hundred percent aware of that it isn't because he did extreme things it isn't because he done more than the other person or less than the other person it's because of the sport in general but at the end of the day the reason he is missing a kidney or had a kidney transplant is because he was born unfortunately with FSGS and that's and like I said I can promise you you can google that what was he you know and it will literally be the first thing that pops up and again it's not like Shawn didn't know that he's a hundred percent aware of it but if he says you know he was born with a kidney transplant and this and that did it up that doesn't really create drama but if he uses my name and slams me then people like [ __ ] like that's a whole different story but if he's been doing this all year long there's got to be a sincere because he also said some will come back to the names here in a minute and we'll go through some of the pictures that we got here but he also mentioned dawn long - yeah he mentioned how long he mentioned all these names so but but the part the part that I want to go to is is before we get into that he also said Kevin LeBron was heated and yet wanted to be sure not because he was setting exactly tear you a new one right so because there's two camps again before we get into this I want to play something on what Ronnie said about yoga flex it about you because the overall story at least is has got some partial truth to it so there is some part there's a partial truth to that didn't unfortunately play out let me play this let's watch what Ronnie and flake say about you we heard Charlotte say what they say she was your nutritionist plate and winning it's you know how had he not had a night hand I wouldn't want that big of a role that bigger role was that the same one those eight years when you went back to bed on same woman how much trust did you have in his feedback 1,000% trust I did every single thing he told me did you got it what's here nutritionist for multiple people or only you multiple people okay flex flex one told me to go to his this Chad you're talking about yet Nichols okay said Nichols Wow not sure where I'd be without him yeah taught me a lot in an age of gurus he taught me that flex you know more about you than me the only reason I can help you is if you understand your body well enough to explain it to me that I can give you advice so polar opposites okay one camp is anti checker sure one camp swears by user that it's not he didn't even say 100% he said 1,000% right one camp swears by you one camp doesn't he says the camp with him lover because obviously when this interview went live with Sean and what he said you know the comments he made about are you sure you know my my phone from bodybuilders from all the way you can't believe this he's right you go let me say what so I'm kind of like from the other I'm not even in the bottom now this is not my game I'm gonna complete it from game but I watched a practice thing and I noticed automatics like Democrat some Republican and there's those in the middle right I'm just kind of stay one out of there's a partially right partially not so let's first address the live wrong thing then we can come back what some of these guys it so the part about Kevin wanted to rip you knew one was I was that partially right no okay but there was a confrontation so here's what happens so we this is the first this is 98 so the show is in New York so me and Kim fly and we get in late so we are literally coming in at the end of the press conference so we're literally getting ready to or it's actually kind of the athletes meeting it's kind of before they have like literally a press conference it's more of a like an athlete's meeting so they're discussing everything kind of amongst themselves and it's not really an open thing there's media in there there's people in there but it's not like it is today and so we're walking in there and everybody's like bro you do not want to go in there like this whole thing was about you and I'm like what do you what do you mean it was about me and I'm like like dude they're literally ripping you a new [ __ ] and I'm like so I'm like oh yeah who's they so that's all they said so we don't know we don't know who it is yet right so we walk in that were originally thinking like okay we we got we know it's Sean we know Sean's involved but we don't know all the players yet so we get in and I'm met by Paul delet and flex wheeler just to get the baits right this is this most your call would Boyer this is post yes this is after okay yes okay yes all right so so we're met we're walking in so we just literally walk in to the press conference and it's over so everybody's kind of made it into groups they're talking to press their stuff we walk in and pull delet and flex beeline over to me and they're like bro like i don't know what's going on but man this was crazy and like they wanted you like your room searched and like all the stuff and I'm like yeah I'm cool with that lease whatever they want and they're like they're talking about a black bag well the black bag was actually a little fanny pack that I wore this all the time like back in the day I like I literally no matter where I have there's a picture of me there's like a fanny pack on and I'm like listen they can search it right now like I don't have a problem with that and they're like but yes so this is what all went down and Kevin laronne said that you called him and literally told him he ain't got a chance in hell of placing in the Olympia without me okay now I lose my [ __ ] now like um like piss because up until this point Kevin Love roan is not even on the radar like literally not on the radar so now I'm pissed and so I happened to just catch out of the corner of my eye Kevin Love roan walking kind of the outskirts of the ballroom so I just literally meet him like immediately and I'm like dude what what the [ __ ] is this like what is this like I'm hearing that like I called you and he's like bro bro no it was misunderstood like it was Wayne it was Wayne and I'm like so now I think he's lying to me now I literally flip out like literally flip out and I'm like like literally throwing f-bombs and I'm like dude I'll beat your ass right here okay so I'm like at this point like I'm gonna tighten this one Kevin Kevin LeBron i'ma beat his ass right there so he's got a training partner behind him so I'm probably 300 pounds right here who's this training partner behind who is also probably 300 pounds right so he steps up but he's like what did you say and so now I'm like screaming back and forth like and we're literally three seconds from going like we're getting ready to go who's on your side right now Paul they let it fly back there like Kim is trying to stay between us like I'm screaming like LeBron is right there but through the whole time LeBron is like bro this is a misunderstanding like this is not you know like I didn't say that like it was waned Emilia did it edited up but then you know like the training part of steps in so then Steve Weinberger like literally grabs me and it's like dude you gotta chill out like and I'm like man I'm tired of the [ __ ] I'm fed up with these you know guys running their mouth like I'm gonna beat their [ __ ] ass right here shut the door and he's like dude you got to chill out like this is not the place and I'm like all right you're right this is not right so now if you have a relationship with them outside like are you guys good you and Eve yes yes I grab me how about Wayne just to put it all together Wayne's a different story okay doesn't like when they don't but at the time they were kind of coke you know 98 right okay and so big Steve grabs me he's like dude you know how this is people talk like you know he calms me down you got to stop the [ __ ] blah blah it's not the time I realize it so literally like we were three seconds from just you know 600 pounds of stupidity like you know bouncing around in the ballroom of the you know wouldn't be a press conference like just an idiot really basically that's what you know and so at the whole weekend though like they literally assigned a security guard to live round so the security guard with him and I'm thinking like and so I tell Steve like dude like really like they're like that just for precautions they know you're pissed and all this and I'm like like I was pissed like 30 minutes ago I'm not pissed now what reputation deal at this time do you have attempt a reputation of somebody that loses it the are you mean really are you a chill guy are you like an underground chill guy but like everybody knew who my friends were like everybody knew who I like they like they knew like who I ran with as an bodybuilder fronts of friends like God some scary friends yeah and so but I don't think that was really I think it was just you were connected in a way that they knew yes yes not cross and not yeah I don't know about that I just think that everybody was at that time like hey listen you know this is what we do and this is what's gonna happen if this is what you know if this goes down okay now as the weekend goes on it becomes very apparent that Kevin LeBron didn't have [ __ ] to do with anything okay so now so literally it didn't have anything to do it kept like it was literally Wayne d'emilia in Sean ray like back and forth just stirring the pot and it became very apparent of that right off the bat and I literally I didn't do it that weekend because obviously I stayed completely away from Kevin Love roam because obviously it was competing the last thing I wanted to do was create a more of a you know [ __ ] drama for him but later on I absolutely apologized to him told him like look man I'd totally lost my [ __ ] but that was because of Sean like I literally should have never done that it was a wrong time wrong place like it was idiotic you know type of thing me and Kevin shook hands we never ever had a problem ever again from that ever no I get along which with human communication we Kevin I don't communicate with him but I'm not you know if Megan got a message saying hey did you see the interview happened that we don't communicate back and forth like that but like when he was making a comeback you know I you know I reached out to him like dude you know I love this you know I can't wait to see on stage type of thing we were friendly with you know in no way shape or form where I say were friends but like you know we're friendly with each other and I have a lot of respect for him and I and I would to this day say like that you know me jumping the gun that was 100% my fault like I just lost my [ __ ] because of all the stuff that had you know went on and that's what happened but at no point did Kevin LeBron like rip his shirt off like again like that is so like far-fetched and and literally there was 20 people around like there was 20 people standing around watching the whole thing which for Shawn to say is literally delusional like that's the part that like is crazy and the part that is weird and and I was a cop for five years and people that lie all the time literally when they lie to their spouses or to their employers that they do it all the time they end up blurring reality and the lie and so they just don't understand him because the lie is usually what rotates in their head most of the time they don't know the truth they don't understand the truth they don't know where the truth is so for him to literally come up with that you know Kevin LeBron was like angered and he was like this madman dripping in sweat he rips his shirt off and he's ready to fight me was literally idiotic like idiotic and and really like yeah I lost my cool and but it was actually probably closer to me and the trading partner getting into it because the training partner ended up stepping forward and that was literally more of it and Steve Weinberger broke the entire thing up you know like pulled me off calmed me down sent me on my way we and everything was fine like it was over with that me and again me and Kevin never had another problem after that ever when's the last time you knew Sean spoke spoke spoke spoke so me and Dan Salomon done a radio podcast called pro bodybuilding Chi weekly and I believe he was on there this is how long ago this has been eight years ago eight years ago Wow it's been Shawn haven't talked anytime soon outside of that eight years have you had any kind of interaction any dinner or lunch with nothing zero no nothing nothing that's public people know you and Shawn are on different absolutely okay 100% so let me ask you a question who else would agree because yesterday I was reading some of the posts and people were tagging me and I saw what a couple people posted Sameer posted would announce it and all these guys and I was kind of being the Samara one - yeah so I'm getting I'm getting all this stuff and I'm you again I'm Reid I'm like okay good okay this person saying this then there was a lot of people involved the time we got involved jQuery on Samus I forgot all so their camp if they're saying that was there anybody that was worried about you getting close to the other guys like there was a story about they were trying to get everybody to be tested I do because it was the open is there truth behind that part would they would I mean they were absolutely trying to get it tested yes they're trying to get the guys in your camp tested they they wanted the whole show tested I believe because they were under the impression that my guys had an unfair advantage so that's where like the plasma expanders stuff stories you know we became and so they wanted they basically wanted a blood test for plasma expanders because they thought that would even the playing field and the funny story of that is so waned Amelia calls me like before the Olympia and it's talking to me and he says listen we're gonna test we're gonna blood test at the at the Olympia and I'm like it's all right and they're like we're gonna blood test for plasma expanders and I'm like okay and he's like you know so I just wanted to let you know and I'm like listen do you you realize that none of my guys are using plasma expanders I go I said if you knew anything about plasma expanders you would realize that to use them you actually need a diuretic so a plasma expander will pull water into the blood but you still have to be able to get rid of the water so I said what you need to do is there's five diuretics that you realize aren't on the diuretic list right I said if you're going to test for the plasma expanders and you literally want to make this a hundred percent add the five diuretics and he's like well we're comfortable with the diuretic test we're just concerned about the plasma expanders now the five diuretics that were very common off the diuretic test was clearly what everybody was going to use nobody needed plasma expanders because there was already diuretics that was available to him that wasn't going to be tested so the whole thing the whole staged like check his bag and all of this kind of stuff was idiotic because in reality Wayne 2-million knew that there was tests that there was a diuretics off the test to begin with not only did he know he literally told certain athletes like hey listen most of the athletes are using this diuretic because it's not on the list like it was very well known very well know very well don't worry so why is he calling you though what is so yeah it was it is is that the world where everyone knows who the you know the the Chad nickels is because there's names of a mountain that people use are there's you know the names that are okay are they very close in communication with folks like when Wayne words okay here's what we're looking at this you're know that was a one-off thing that happened it was well I mean it was when that you know the whole diuretic thing took place but I think that what ended up happening was my athletes literally changed sport like they looked different like they were in better shape they were drier they were more conditioned and literally the people were like obviously if that's the way they look there has to be something he has to have something that is clearly not available to everybody else like and that's I believe what you know and so I don't necessarily know they ever had planned on diary you know I mean blood testing because there would be just and monumental you know undertaking I think the whole thing was they were trying to be like well maybe he does have something so we're gonna scare the [ __ ] out of him and I am NOT a me okay yeah and so well you know is he am I gonna be this am I gonna be that but in reality there never was anything there whatever whatever happened to you we're not gonna do anything to you or no nothing can you go to do you go to miss roll up here every year every year you're there absolutely and how are you treated when you go there but just like normal normal guy this absolutely no one's given you a hard time any of that snow okay so are there any other people that have bad relationships with you at the level of Shawn or Nell I don't think so nothing not that people know the marketplace I mean don't know I mean there's there's no doubt I think that even you know when you come out with this like listen I could I could give you every possible scenario of why Shawn lied but at the end of the day there's gonna be people that like me and they will believe me and there's gonna be people that like Shawn they will believe him but at the end of it all Shawn is literally the one that had the biggest heart on for me and it was very obvious why he did because like he said he just like you said in 96 you know I didn't I didn't need anybody's help because I play second to Dorian Yates actually placed third but Nasir flunked the redick test which then moved him into second place and like you know he was like you know this is this is you know who I am type of thing but unfortunately he never placed in the top three ever again ever and my guys beat him from that point on like without a doubt and the more angry he got the more driven I became and the more like like I mean there was a point where potentially I would have probably worked with every one of his competitors for free just to bury him let me ask you a different question here's a question for you say he did work with you let's just say yes let's just say you've got your story his story everybody's gonna hear but let's just say you know somebody came in says listen let's just try to make this work let's just say you did would he have had a chance to win it all no no that's it that's a strong statement because he's been second he's been top five thirty competitions you know he's speaking everybody outside of Haney and Yates you're saying there's in no way even if you work with him that it could win the whole thing no chance why is that here's the thing so during the time frame that I would have came in from 97 on ya flex wheeler is also in the mix and Ronnie Coleman is in the mix and I can tell you that Shawn Ray at a hundred percent doesn't beat either one of those guys at ninety percent no chance and is he is he a good bodybuilder look I think he's a piece of [ __ ] person I'm not gonna deny that he was a good bodybuilder like ever like of course she was a good bodybuilder but was he a flex wheeler bodybuilder no he wasn't a flex wheeler body bull he didn't have the genetics of flex wheeler he didn't have anything close to that was he close to Ronnie : look nobody's close to Ronnie Coleman at hundred percent nobody I don't care what anybody says they can idolize whoever they want Ronnie if you look at Ronnie in 2003 we may never see that again ever like I mean if we do it will be amazing sight but he was that far ahead of everybody that far ahead so if you work with you again let me take this back I know you weren't in 1996 but the two years where he got he was right behind yay Yates if you did could he have won at all with Yates maybe not Ronnie maybe not flex how about against Yates it's close you're still saying it's close its close not 100% 100% okay yeah so even with a injured Yates he would have still an injured weight and injured Yates yes he would want he possibly win for now so yeah the only reason I'm asking this question is because you you know sometimes when somebody obviously you said you know how you feel about him as an individual and as a body but it is what it is it's so credit to you to be able to say that if you had it I couldn't think he saw somebody that at the end of the day like Yates was injured I thought I thought Nasser beating I thought Nasser beating there's numerous guys that you know like flex wheeler at a hundred percent on that given day beat seemed like he you know Dorian was very vulnerable that year like he wasn't you know the Dorian of you know that the years that he was so dominant like he was a very vulnerable athlete was a 98 97 okay so 97 he was a vulnerable he had had the injury he wasn't in good shape he had trouble controlling his midsection like it was a train wreck for him but he luckily pulled it off you know and and it's probably still to this day it's probably one of the most controversial you know wins he's you know he's got dominant body parts but when you put you know you go pose for pose it's a tough it's tough to get to the point where you can justify him winning and don't get me wrong I'm a Dorian Yates fan like I love everything about him everything his work ethic his like I love all of that you know but just on that given year he just wasn't his best so okay so now let's talk about the other part so what what made you so different than everybody else's camp everybody has access to certain things but was so different with you but I think the difference is so you're exactly right everybody has access to the same thing everybody does every okay so there isn't like a mad Juke potion out here that all of a sudden this camp has like you know I mean it doesn't matter like you've heard all the stories about Kuwait like okay you know yeah like oh [ __ ] like you know that they had the anabolic chick and everything but at the end of the day they have access to exactly the same things that everybody else has that what a lot of people say though a lot I don't say that our stuff is better than you know Europe or Australia or you guys actually I disagree like I think our knowledge may be a little ahead I think as far as like the science behind everything but what they have access to like as far as supplementation got it so it's all the same so it's all the same okay so what is the differentiator how you piece it together how you put it on the other so I think the difference is a couple things one you have to be able to motivate these guys and you have to be able to click with them so that's why like listen I didn't take on every athlete that wanted to work with me because there was a athletes that I knew that we were just not going to click not that I disliked them not that I thought there was anything bad about him I just knew like we weren't going to be a good working relationship I think that the key is that the other key is I think most nutritionists have one way of thinking they have one way of doing everything so keto diet is very you know very popular right now there's a lot of trainers that swear by a keto diet but it is virtually impossible to think that every bodybuilder that gets ready for a show is going to be a hundred percent on a keto diet it's impossible but most trainers think that way they're they only have one process that's it you know if it's high carb or if it's whatever it is that's the process that's what they try to apply to everyone and they try to force that bodybuilder to with you know come within that guideline I never thought that way ever I didn't think that way on nutrition I didn't think that way on training I felt like everything had to be individualized I felt like it had to be something one that they could do so flex perfect example I knew that he wasn't going to be a guy that was going to be just you know regimented and like this like nitpicky guy that's going to be able to eat X amount of this based on personality personality like and and a lot of that was how I literally was able to get from point A to point B so successfully because with each person you have to manage that and you know eventually you end up with a guy like Ronnie Coleman who is just a machine and you know I remember the first time like we did stuff together and he won the Olympia and it's funny like the whole time I was I was telling guys like man Ronnie Coleman looks crazy and they're like that third place best you know they're they literally didn't think you know until they saw him and then after the thing and I've told the story before I said no Ronnie just from my personal you know and because I've dealt with all these guys just for my personal use as far as like what happened how many times do you think you cheated on your diet this was at the banquet and he looked like me like I was nuts and he's like it never even crossed my mind and I was like and I knew at that point like oh this is gonna be nuts like this guy is a different human being but you had you couldn't take that way of thinking was wheeler like Chris Cormier like listen like Chris Cormier was like I always called it like the chaos factor because if everything was going good for Chris we were in big trouble like that was not gonna work for Chris Chris had to be kind of around this process of people and things and stuff but there had to be a controlled like point that we had to get done like I knew that if he wasn't busy like doing stuff he was gonna literally be sitting at home playing PlayStation eatin Captain Crunch like I knew that's what he was going to do okay so there had to be a process with that that's not a bad thing on Chris it is yeah okay most people could not figure that out they couldn't micromanage all of those things or what however you want to put that together they just couldn't do it they forced them to go Kito because this is my process and this is how it works and this is how I do everybody and this is how you have to do it that's how I think I was so successful like and I did the same thing with training some people like look I wasn't going to be able to have you know flex wheeler trained the way Ronnie Coleman did how these guys you trained as well okay a lot of them trained most like did a lot of their stuff on their own but I would like your likes like you know push them in certain directions so if they were doing a certain thing now a lot of things like were flex had Charles glass but again we would communicate because I would want to know what Charles glass was doing because what Charles glass was doing it depended on what his diet was doing so it you know like listen if they all of a sudden are going high volume I can't do certain things with his diet because they're going heavy weight and high volatile often were you talking to trolls I didn't talk to Charles a lot but I communicated more with flecks like okay this is the direction we're going this week and this is the things that we're doing now me me and Charles you know would communicate a little bit yeah but it was mostly through through the athlete stuff but the same with Chris like I knew Chris you know when he built the physique that he built he built it off a hard work so even though like Chris may not have been the best dieter like you know as far as things and and he would you know sometimes you know be out late at night and partying and doing the things that Chris did he still was a hard worker in the gym he pushed a lot of heavy weight that's how he built that physique and so you know I had to make sure that like look that's what we got to do you know when it comes you know contest I'm like we've got to you know go those directions and stuff and I mean that was part of the success like I didn't ever I never tried to adapt them to me I always tried to adapt to them and apply and you don't think most people do that I don't think anybody does it okay so let me ask you this other question how much of it is genetics how much of it is training how much of it is diet how much of it is drugs so it's the biggest issue is food so I'm telling everyone that's number one so food is without a doubt number one and when you say food what do you mean by I mean being consistent and that doesn't mean that doesn't mean offseason or contest that's across the board so if you are in the offseason and you're not consistent with food if you're not continuously pushing food and it's probably every it's probably the majority of athletes downfall because they get to offseason and they're like it's offseason like I don't I don't have to eat six meals a day I don't have to quite just if I don't feel like I'll just skip a meal and I'll go grab some fast food and these things it's probably the biggest downfall it's hard to eat six seven eight meals a day with high calories so that your body is literally in a calorie surplus all the time every single day it's hard to do it's probably how I end up weaning out more athletes and not because they'll be like I can heat all day I'll never have a problem and five days later like there's no way I can eat all this food it's just tough most people don't realize it that's first though not a doubt hard work and training is second so second without a doubt is training so you have to be able to push yourself you have to be able to put in work and again consistency you have to be able to figure out what works for you you have to be able to go in every single day and push beyond really what the body is capable of push push push mentally third is probably drugs is it it would be ludicrous to say that it's not part of it because at the highest level it is part of it but it's definitely after food and training and then after that is probably genetics is going to fall in between probably training and drugs actually so you don't think genetics is more important in food no you really know I don't can I ask you a question on that challenge yeah so here's a question before you competed Yeah right okay when you competed you you know this stuff so you could have applied it for yourself to go to the top right absolutely and I'm and the only reason I'm asking this is because some guys you know like I'm six four and a half right the chances of me going out there the tallest guy that ever wanted you know what it's Arnold so right don't you think like there's a sweet spot of genetics too cuz you know do you look at some of them without a doubt you without a doubt like with me like talking to win about to compete yes yeah to win for sure now that axis first with it's definitely at the top of the of the game because when you because when you're talking tiny tiny percentages like you're talking like because when you look at that you know you can look at the top group right now list so the top three at the Olympia was and you you had bow and AK and you had a hottie okay so all three of those guys are phenomenal phenomenal bodybuilders but in reality none of them have the genetics of Phil Heath none of them which is why if Phil Heath is in that group he is a superior athlete without a doubt but when you look at all three of those they all three have phenomenal genetics so there's no way you can say like Brandon Currie has bad genetics William Bowen AK has bad genetics they all have at the top top of the genetic field but there is always going to be that outlying guy that is a Phil Heath and a flex wheeler that is just god-given that there's no hard work that there's no that there is or that there isn't well there's nothing that can match that okay I got so listen there's like flex wheeler Kia I don't care how hard you work I don't care how many things you take I don't care who you have working we're not gonna look like because you're never gonna look like flex wheeler yeah ever yeah ever now flex wheeler was beat by hard work there was guys that out worked him you know but that wasn't because of you know they were better than flex that was just because flex let him let them getting you know you mind educating our audience on anabolic steroids is that okay if we do that let's talk about that okay so we've had people that have been on and they've talked about you know Dorian will talk openly he doesn't really I mean Dorian literally could care less what do you talk about he'll talk about psychedelics he'll talk about just a whole different guy when he talks about it but for me you know when it comes up to this topic I think most people are uneducated on it most people don't know first thing they hear about it they're automatically there's a red flag and and there's a misunderstanding on it so when it comes onto steroids when it comes onto steroids how do you view anabolic steroids yourself and then we'll go out topics of what each one is and why some people use right I think the steroids is one of the things that get well especially now okay now it gets a bad rap because of all the social media so the stuff that's out there on social media is crazy and I think that there is so much bad information there's so much like negative put toward it because of all the craziness that goes with it right but if you look at every sport I mean you you know the Olympics is coming up and we're going to see athlete after athlete after athlete failed drug test there's no doubt and it's beneficial across the board obviously where people wouldn't use it now you know we're not talking about swimmers dying we're not talking about this because I think they use it in a term just to benefit just to enhance just to do those things and it's been around for a year so if you even if you look at the backstory you know Russia created testosterone literally and basically for the Olympics I mean it was literally created for the Olympics that's what it was then our scientist was like hey listen Russia has testosterone what we need something now but we need something easier and faster so they created Dianabol so now our people had Dianabol and the original Dianabol was very fast it was an oral pill and you know the athletes obviously used it and then all of a sudden it was banned obviously but it was a writ that's I mean the whole basis if you look back that far it was literally created from the Olympics like that's literally what it was research for and created so I think that when you look at it bodybuilding is going to get a bad rap because look we're you know you look at a swimmer a swimmer is in 300 pounds right there is some baseball players and football players but they don't look like bodybuilders but when you're talking about a muscle enhancing drug and the sport is muscle bodybuilding is for sure going to get the biggest rap on it because they're gonna be like these guys are abusing it they're not just taking it to enhance their they're abusing it and in reality they're probably just some people that are doing that but I believe that the majority of people that take it don't be I think that the majority of the people that are on the pro level that are literally at you know at the highest level of this sport are all pretty damn close I don't think they're doing anything more or less I think they're all pretty damn close aware of where they're at and really damn close a word there right yeah and I mean and that doesn't mean and that's not pointing the finger at whoever they're working with they could be in Kuwait they could be training with somebody over here they could be wherever I believe that nobody is that far outside the thing I may be wrong on that but that's the way I feel I mean I hear I hear different things but again I I'm just trying to kind of get educated on this with you here and by the way for full disclosure you are not a doctor I am absolutely something you've been around and you brethren we've experienced it so okay so why would somebody use these two drugs obviously you got clenbuterol up here and you know what the top one is lasix Oakland puter all is basically a drug use for conditioning so most people use that to get in shape so it's used it has actually a relatively long half-life so most people don't use it for extended periods of time they will use it for a little bit of time I believe the half-life is 36 hours or something which is in you know that type of thing that's actually relatively long so they'll use it a couple days and usually go off on for a couple days but it's basically to burn fat now lasix is a different one that's a loop diuretic and it's not used obviously for contest prep it's used at the end for basically finishing the look on stage it's probably in my opinion one of the least used drugs in the sport because most people don't realize that how dangerous the product is because the drug was actually named lay six because it's actually a six hour diuretic but if you look at it and you read it the half-life is very short on it so most people who have gotten in trouble back in when you seen guys actually got in trouble with it was from this drug they got in trouble with it because they would take it and two hours later like they still holding water so they would take a little more of it and two hours later they were still holding a little water so they would take a little more of it now they have literally 12 hours basically or more of lasix pulling pulling them down pulling them down pulling them down and so because of that I believe most people have went away from lasix just for the simple fact that it's it's relatively dangerous and it's relatively hard to predict on what it's going to do it's not fast enough to use and so because of that which is a good thing I don't think people are using it that much people are now using I don't think so now Columbia law the question that I got for you is a lot of these things are not necessarily for bodybuilding bodybuilders use a Columbia doll is an asthma patient so absolutely yeah they use it daddy I mean and they also use it there's a product called ventolin which is also a clenbuterol which is a gel pump that they actually literally pump into cattle feed to to like create bigger leaner cows so this is used for what bodybuilders use or know what's they used it I mean lasix has been around for years like I said it's a loop diuretic I don't think it's being used very much anymore because I think the guys that that literally got in trouble with diuretics I think they got in trouble with it from using lasix because they didn't understand the diuretic itself what's the side effect of clam you know any realistically no side effects I mean there is obviously some side effects but very very safe at low dose is that is that similar to would you put the side effects of Anna fed rein compared to like computer all in the old like ephedrine like the e back in the days all that stuff yes very very similar very similar that's the same drug obviously I know something absolutely ok so let's go through these now these are actually some of the famous ones that you see and hear about all the time what are they used for and what are the side effects and benefits of each okay so testosterone obviously everybody knows that's you sipping a chiffonade they're sipping eight and Nant eight these are slow-acting esters so basically when you're talking testosteron you're talking about building up a baseline now bodybuilder what they're looking at doing obviously is creating a stable base so again most people take testosterone because they don't understand it so they just keep taking take and take and take and take it you have to realize how it comes in and out of the system so realistically the key is basically just hitting a baseline and keeping it there because it's going to be based off of the level of testosterone within your body this is out in about 72 hours so from the time you take it to the time it's out it's going to start decreasing in about 72 hours so it literally it could be taken realistically only twice a week and maintain a stable testosterone level which is why most people that are on like their you know like prohormone like the you know yes yes and and stuff like that when they reach 50 and those types of things will go to a slow-acting testosterone like sipping aid and Anantha and at a very low dose you know is very very safe and actually probably not only safe but better for you because as the natural males testosterone drops the body tight actually tries to counter that and literally then everything else starts to go out of balance but as long as your natural testosterone level stays in line where it normally is especially on a male that you just function better at that point so it's probably safer to have a normal testosterone level normal level perfect thousand and most athletes that have been an athlete all their life functions somewhere like at that thousand range now a non-athlete just somebody that's going in there you know whose level probably test it out at 200 will probably feel amazing at 700 at 700 yeah when you say amazing what do you mean by me like just revitalize like you know just feel like you know normal again normal normal okay how about the rest trim alone acetate so that's a fast-acting drug most people take that I say it's actually kind of made of surgeons because most people took that pre-contest it was something that added hardness to the muscle but it is something that it's probably right now the most abuse drug in the sport this is that right there yes because of what it does so it makes you strong it makes you aggressive it it's the one drug that's probably the single most abused drug in the sport it crossed the board like I don't care what sport it is it could be powerlifting it's probably across the board across the so you're saying professional athletes are using this across the wheel without a doubt and it's fast acting so it's in and out of the system relatively quick so you can use it use a water-based or oil but it's oil base okay yeah and that's that is very fast in and out of the system so but it's also now there's other ones though but this is acetate so that's a faster acting one but it's like I said like it was originally there was a drug called FINA ject which is back in the day which is very similar to it but this product is was you know used you know back in the day when people were doing things like normal it was used you know last eight weeks and now it's probably used almost all year I guarantee of those guys that use it all year guarantee what what are the side effects of this that would be anything like blood pressure is gonna be a major issue with trend that's gonna be you're gonna run and deliver in kidney issues with that like that's gonna be a harsh drug could actually it could do it I mean most steroids aren't going to like kill you like like an opiate would kill you but there's no doubt that long-term effect of that could be a way of your kidney liver stomach it could eat away everything like it could destroy your body I had a high dose and that's the problem with that like that drug is probably more abuse than any other drug on this in in the sport and it's it's abused at high levels because high what do you mean by high like I mean well for instance I would say that people probably so 75 milligrams is what that is I would say they took that three times a week back in the day so back in the 80s or 90s back in the 90s that would be you know what 225 I would say they're doing that every day now 225 a day a day possible you mean the guys on stage I would say and actually there's the thing that's probably more amateurs than pros so the amateurs are probably abusing all of this stuff way beyond what the pro because again the pros have phenomenal genetics they have people helping them like I can tell you like I don't care how many people like you can throw every nutritionist under you know under the bus there isn't anybody gonna like prescribe this like recommend this for you know high dosages year-round like nobody but there are some like gym guys out there that will be because when you take that you feel phenomenal so the more of that [ __ ] you take the more you feel phenomenal you start getting strong next thing you know you're benching 500 pounds you you know you've gained 30 pounds your muscle looks hard and you're like holy [ __ ] if 200 as good as this just think what a thousand is on this and that's the problem with a lot of time people think how about how about the master own yeah it's like master on phenol propionate is something that's taken in last five weeks of their show so it's a hardening drug mainly to add basically hardness to the skin it's literally taken for no more than five weeks no more than five we know how different is that them Primo ball it's a similar drug than Prima bone there's two different kinds of premium ball to so it would be the effect of it would be very similar to like the old parabola or prima ball and acetate prima ball and depo is a slower acting drug which some people do take in pre-contest but most people use that I don't even know if they it's even made anymore but it's it's a little bit different how about Dec I mean you everybody for somebody that doesn't know about stores they're for today it's like like the original right it's like what Arnold and the boys used it's probably it's it's something that I'd actually don't like I'm not big on a lot of people like it because they think it helps their joints things that makes her joints fill I think the side effects of that is it's not like harsh side effects but it's a very slow acting it literally just shuts the body down like your sex drive literally drops to nothing once you're off yeah what you're on it now you're honest yes you got to take so many different things just to keep your body balance back out like deck it to me is like one of the worst things it's a safe drug as far as like side effects to the body but the way you feel on it like most people that's ever taken it will tell you instantly like I hate the way I feel on it I hate the way I feel absolutely yeah and I and I think because of that and that and here we come back to this so back in the day that's what they would use they would take a little bit of testosterone a little bit of Dec and if you talk to the old guys they'll tell ya right they'll tell you even back in Arnold today that's what we took great now like they don't go to that like they're like listen I feel like [ __ ] on that but I can take trend and feel crazy I'll stick with the trend but it's it's a much harsher harsher on your body and we're being pretty open here Anke poised is actually very similar to like decade so it's almost there different drugs but the makeup the the way they respond in the body almost identical I like that one though because it doesn't have a lot of the like you know sex side effects and type of thing like decreased you know that how would stories decrease sex you know it will you be surprised so it just literally lowers your libido it there's so many effects that it has like on it but the acupoints doesn't so people will have a tendency to stay away from decking building EQ but it's also a slower acting drug so deck is really slower acting and most people don't use deca because it can be detected for so long so that's why they stay away from here we go so this the next topic aghgh an insulin insulin yep so this is where the sport changed obviously from like a certain point nineteen nineties or and stuff yeah and so the girl one one had always been around and I think people were using it but what they didn't realize is how the effect of the two worked together simultaneously and basically the the insulin and and the insulin kind of had like when it first came out I think they that people overdid it you know honestly I do and I think like you know me and even a couple other you know people were kind of the first ones that was like listen if you take the insulin every single day it stops working like literally and you know there was people I was like listen you know how long have you taken that and they'd be like now I've you know I've been doing it now for three months and I'm like how much are you taking they're like 15 units a day I'm like I'll tell you what take the 15 units and don't eat don't eat any carbs when I call I'll crash and I'm like I'm telling you you won't you won't crash and they were calling back in their black hole [ __ ] like I took the 15 units I didn't crash I'm like exactly because your body now is used to it like your body is literally limiting what the natural production is and so I think a lot of people the nutritionists like that knew what they were doing literally kind of curtailed that a little bit and took a lot of the people away now I say that I've seen like some like really crazy like resurgence of insulin over the last like six months so but up until this point it has been very very limited it was used very like once or twice a week it was used maybe a couple times after training you know a week or something like that just to make sure that everything was completely loaded completely you know like the body was functioning at a hundred percent but they weren't like abusing it trying to force glycogen non-stop basically trying to upload everything they weren't but now there has been a little bit of an like like the protocols that are out there that seem to be floating around are bad right now they're like really bad what's the biggest difference between the side effects of HGH and insulin versus steroids anabolic the totally to separate you know things I mean obviously steroids are all based really based off of testosterone and those types of things where growth hormone is is basically your based off your growth hormone levels and and insulin is obviously you know based off of insulin levels so they all have a different functioning purpose within the body now obviously all three together are a very powerful combination combination and and realistically maybe one of the most powerful ones is insulin as when you're looking at you know the hormone mega it could be the most powerful hormone within the body but it doesn't do legitimately what you think it's going to do and I think a lot of people when they first were was introduced to it they thought like holy [ __ ] I'm gonna do all these things and I'm gonna look like ASSA relson body or I'm gonna look like and just know it's not gonna happen like they can take insulin all day most most of the people that I see that take high doses of insulin just get fat just get fast please get fat yeah you hear about these your thoughts on this so I hate this stuff like all of the synthol and this stuff there are some people I think most people hate it like I can tell you it's the one thing that I hate within the sport I can honestly say like I've never ever like you know like encouraged an athlete of mine to take it I've had two athletes of mine use it and it was literally kind of against my you know that I don't like it I think that it is one of those things that we literally have no idea what it is and everybody is like you know it's you know you put it in the muscle it stays from the muscle there's no chance it could stay in the muscle I don't care how much of it you pump into the muscle there's no chance it has to end up somewhere and those places have to be brain lung heart so a percentage of that has to come out of the muscle it the way it basically like hardens if it doesn't clear out of the system it's going to end up there it's going to end up almost like cholesterol like so if you've seen an artery that is filled with cholesterol my thinking is how is this not binding to it how is this not binding to cholesterol and a lot of people think I'm nuts you know I know Dave Palumbo is a big very you know like he's very proactive on this and and but he sells it also too and it's it's not illegal in any way shape or form but I'm just one of these guys that thinks that it is not a positive first we'll just kill you I think a hundred percent can kill you is there is there stories of that happening or no you know I mean the world of body they're they're not necessarily there's a lot of stories where people have had trouble with it I know of a guy that literally had open-heart surgery from Chicago that took it and when they opened him up he they literally had that [ __ ] everywhere like it was everywhere so they're you know I see so pop are people like is it is it two together without doing the work I mean even some of your guys that did it they're well-known bodybuilders there's so much sure there's a lot of yeah and that's the thing I mean I think a lot of people have done it I think a lot of well-known people have done it mr. Olympius says they frown upon it but they know some people are using it on disqualifier do anything with this thing I think that the key is there has been you know like there has been some guys that have done it that you either couldn't tell or at least it looked really well they did it really really well I think those are far a few between okay I think that there's very few guys they can do and last but not least this is simple this is obviously know what this is so those are all like estrogen blockers those are probably two of the most common ones there's another one that probably everybody uses which is aromasin which is another one but it's very expensive these are obviously used because as you take more and more testosterone your estrogen level will then start to crank up obviously you need a certain balance of estrogen we do need a certain you do so you don't want to limit all of your estrogen within the body but you want to keep it at under control so what ends up happening is the higher estrogen levels you end up with everybody sort of like the gyno and those types of things those are the same family right Nova Dex is the same in the same family and Nova Dex is tricky because Nova Dex you if you take that for an extended period of time that will actually decrease your estrogen but it will also decrease your growth on one level so you have to kind of counter some of those things and to most people that take estrogen blockers will take those for short periods of time and Nova Dex literally nobody takes it at least to my knowledge for any longer than five weeks nobody takes it for longer than five we know okay and is that off coming off a cycle like you're you're getting off of it it depends like they can use it coming off a cycle but I think a lot of people will use it like mid cycle or you know whatever even in the offseason just to control estrogen levels because obviously you know you don't want higher estrogen levels could create a lot of serious issues with them within the body the gyno is like the extreme but just even like having a high level of estrogen like you can tell like the way the skin looks like yellow or yeah well and just even like how much water you hole I see what your stuff - so so let me ask you that so you a somebody who has no desire to compete they're not going to be a bodybuilder they're just a 29 year old guys watching this saying you know what I want to go use stuff there's different conversations here about the usage of steroids right and then there is when you said the guy about 45 55 you know he goes to the Donatello 180 or 121 I do doctor says you may consider trt right you know something like that what is your counsel you give to somebody that has zero plans of being a professional athlete using under 50 versus the person about 50 so my here's my thinking so I tell everybody like obviously the choice is yours like you're gonna have to make the Detroit you know this is sure but if you have zero interest zero interest in competing I would think long and hard before using anything so go to touch it now because my thinking is why are you gonna take it like like now when you get into that forty range and your level is literally coming down without a doubt like I think that you're crazy not to take it because I think that the benefit literally outweighs the risk like with a hundred percent like a hundred percent but the guy that's wanting to just literally walk around and look like a freakin a t-shirt for no other reason than looking like a freak there's a lot of stuff that's over-the-counter that can literally benefit you such as I mean there's a lot of pro hormones and we don't even have like great Pro hormones anymore because most of them are illegal but there's still like a lot of you know I mean like there's some stuff that pushes the envelope a little bit that would that would benefit you legally legally so yeah are you talking like back in the days one now back in the day the preneurcast and all the tests and all of that stuff like would be great you know and and now there's still a few I know high tech has a few I know Blackstone has a few and they're legitimate like products that literally work and like to me like if you're not planning on competing if you don't have a goal at the end like if there's not a reason like why are you doing it like it makes my number one that's my number one if you're not trying to compete if you're not trying to you know go out there and do something with it there's no reason to do there's plenty of supplements to be able to train with it but I like what Brandon curry says first get the training get the diet and then consider that we're talking about this because of the the reason why you are here after the response we got was John and would get her a bit deeper in this topic so now let's go to the last part of what he said uh in the video where he says you know this person's life you know that person is this person right so obviously these are some names sure we'll go through them together you obviously know who these are monster you know else embodies or in mathura so and then we have some other guys you will get to hear in a minute so you know when you look at this what was the cause of death with what was this control by it or we don't know so with monterossa like one of my best friends was best friends with him so one of my best friends Mel Chauncey was very very good friends with it I've heard nothing but good things about it moderato yeah one of the greatest guys on this whatever like phenomenal personality like on just a phenomenal guy phenomenal guy realistically I believe that he was like hereditary like I think that his father died at a relatively young age of heart issues like Ken can you say like did did the things that he did escalated possibly like possibly but I mean I don't think that there was anything like he wasn't like terminal because of bodybuilding I think that there's no doubt like some of the choices he made without a doubt could have you know changed the the process but I think that I think he died of cardiac arrest if I'm not mistaken and I think it was a hereditary issue else somebody because Shawn put that on put that one on there right so here's the thing with with Naser so naasson was probably one of my best friends within the industry so he me and him were together a lot I talked to him probably more than any other bodybuilder ever that I'd worked with so me and NASA were very very close my relationship was not with NASA was very unique because most of my guys I was a hundred percent in control of a hundred percent in control but Nasser was a little bit different so if anybody the new Nasser he was a very very intelligent man spoke seven different languages like he was a very smart human being and so my role with him was literally more advisory maybe I guess you'd say or friend like you know whatever and so you know literally the shows that I would work with him I worked with him for yet 9700 Olympia 98 Olympia 99 Arnold okay so those were the main shows that I worked with him and and I didn't literally take over all of his stuff until the last week so I would control definitely alright his like final prep stuff but the rest of the stuff was you know at this point you know by the time he got there like he was big like he was like I didn't need to be like hey listen this is the way you need to train or this is what you need to do he would you know send me pictures and be like how close am i and I'm like dude you're behind like we need to we need to drop the hammer like we need to crank things up like that was where the things were he would ask me like hey I'm getting I'm thinking about adding this in I'd be like yeah that's probably a good idea or no that's that you don't need that yet or those types of things but there was never like this is what you do right here this is what you followed that it ended up now the thing with Nasser is like this is the thing that's interesting about Nasser so again like he literally puts that one on me right so but literally I didn't train him after 99 and he died 14 years later like I'm not really sure how like okay I'm not even sure how you even go down that road like it's so idiotic like I mean like he could have lived 20 more years and then you're like yeah that was still there like yeah monster obviously you hadn't you never did it monster but it's interesting I talked to months or the year he died and so he he was a very unique individual he was a super nice guy I didn't speak really good English so it was like tough - it was tough to communicate with him and we were you know we were talking about some stuff and then we were talking about a certain thing that he was using and then he mentioned another it was a cortisol blocker that he was talking about and and then he mentioned another cortisol blocker it was it was a weird was a weirdest conversation I'll never forget it like I said you realize those are the same thing and he's like now they're different and I'm like no I said this is the American version this is a European version and now he was double-dip yeah and so he was double dipping on those now those are notorious for eating up like your stuff they're really hard on the stomach like even at a moderate to low dose and and he was doing a humungous dose of now I'm not saying that's what had anything to do with it but the conversation that I had was very like so weird because I remember going up to Kim and being like these guys don't even know what they're doing like they were talking about Disney like the same thing like what the hell is going on and then literally we get home from the Arnold that year and there and then he had died on the plane early at least coming you know over there and he was like an anatomy chart laughter your call well no I just literally talked to him and it was a very brief letter like it was at the show we were talking about stuff and he has no sense dumb and he was actually commenting on Kim's physiques like he was like he was like being like I've never seen a you know a female's quads that lean that are done we're like you got to accumulate look at your quad okay let's let's just go - lets go to Dallas Dallas ky here so obviously that's the controversial one that about whatever sure so for sure there's a there's a dialogue between Dallas and Sean when they go backstage you know that whole thing I've been thrown aside and what's your relationship with Dallas because that's the biggest one he puts on the biggest one right so here's the thing with Dallas so I worked with Dallas for three months that was it I only worked with him for one show I met with him and November at Nationals and I prepped him for the Arnold I became very close with Dallas during that time and you know Dallas was one of these guys that was just a likable like there's no way you couldn't like Dallas like he was probably one of the most genuine nicest people I had ever met in my life he was super honest about everything like there were so many things that would like so I never literally second-guessed him about anything because the things he told me like I would have like never dreamed that he would have told me honestly like you know he told me you know things just from way back way back and there was you know the thing that I probably one of the toughest things for me it was like when I when I think back through all this stuff like there were signs right from the get-go like when we first literally very first week of the diet so we started we literally kind of started like the beginning of December and so we had talked at Nationals which is the middle of November and then we started in December so I only literally worked with him for three months he worked with another guy for two years before that and another guy before that and then the guy two years before me he ended up working with when he died but the very first week like he calls me is like listen I'm throwing up and I'm like like oh that's not I said are you feel okay he's like yeah he goes you know I do that a lot because I've done it all my life I got like a weird stomach but he's like I didn't know whether I should like replaced a meal or not and so I'm thinking like wait a minute like what do you mean he did that your whole life and he's like well I thrown up my whole life I got a weird stomach like I literally throw up like I threw up before every football game I've thrown up like before every contact like every contest diet I've ever had I threw up so I'm like I said listen like don't be let's just see how this plays out because you may be sick you may have the stomach flu or something so the week goes on and he seems fine and then Thursday throws up again so I'm like okay listen this thing normally you don't just throw up you're like literally 25 years old or something I'm like go to the like urgent care like I want you to go to Urgent Care like you're throwing up now this is a week two weeks into your relationship ninety days this is a week into the relationship right and so he comes back and he's like yeah they think that I may have bronchitis and the drainages like coming you know drown and Smits make me throw up and I'm like well how do you feel any goes I feel great but he goes listen I get bronchitis all the time because I've had pneumonia ten times in my life and I'm like well what I go you've had pneumonia ten times in your life he's like yeah he goes like oh I literally like always get it and he kind of blamed it like like and he was very hoping about this so I have no problem talking but he's like yeah smoke weeds from the time I was 12 years old he goes I probably smoke more weed than anybody you know that kind of coughing I have drainage and that's kind of what it kind of leads to and I'm like okay I mean it sounded pneumonia from weed no but if he was saying he gets pneumonia and I was trying to the coffee so the coughing the drainage Ani is like you know he's like I stricted breathing and then he ends up was like bronchitis and pneumonia and so I'm kind of thinking like yeah you know I get the coughing like the pneumonia thing sounds a little weird like I don't know let's see how you feel I said you why don't you rest for a couple days let's see how you feel weekend goes by feels fine a couple weeks ago buys back throwing up again and I'm like dude this is not normal like you shouldn't be throwing up and he's like Chad I'm telling you I throw up all the time like I literally that I've done it my entire life and that's the one thing thinking back like I'm like you know like where was that hit like how in the hell like where was that head you know and so we go through the process like through the whole process I can tell like something's off like his body is not really responding like I thought it would it didn't you know and then and like I don't know if people even believe this but like based off of what he had been doing we literally did half of that what he had been doing so a lot of this stuff so he's saying you're doing half of what he was doing half of what he was doing so my thinking was like holy [ __ ] like maybe like his body's not responding well like maybe he it's not because we pulled back so far right but then all of a sudden his body kind of started to come around and everything started to look halfway decent so we just you know and then he actually kind of started feeling better everything kind of seems like right on target we go and we're literally planning on going into Pittsburgh to meet with Mannion let him look am take look am posing just critique posing all these little things we're sitting there and he starts throwing up again like with the stuff and so I'm like okay it's like dude like how like this is not normal you shouldn't be vomiting all the time and he's like Jedi listen like this is just my life like this is what I do like I vomit I have a weak stomach like I this goes all the way back to football like he goes all the way back to football and so I'm like okay so we go through the process through this whole process I can tell like somes clearly off his body didn't respond well like nothing's really responded well so and so we start talking we start talking about like just personal things like you know and so he had moved away from his hometown he went to Boca to be part of the company that he was with and everything and so we literally and this was after the Arnold so he ends up second you know he goes to New Zealand which I literally didn't even want him to go to because I thought he was sick in at the Arnold like he was like Hocking up [ __ ] like I literally said listen don't go but he had already like signed contracts like he was already committed he's like I have to go I have already signed a contract and I'm like listen just go to the doctor and you know get it he's like no I'm gonna go so we so we go there and then and then of course he's super sick in Australia almost passes out on stage like we literally like literally two hours before that we were literally talking on the phone and I'm like don't do the show like I don't want you to do the show and he's like I'm gonna take a nap and we'll see how I feel two hours later he calls back man I feel phenomenal I feel great you know and I'm like are you sure anything I feel phenomenal like I just needed a nap I think it was a flight wore me out then of course it goes onstage the damn theater passes out so then he you know it comes back home and so through this whole process I'm like listen something's off like I think that you're unhappy like listen I don't think that I think you left your home I think you moved to Boca you don't know people there you're in a stay in an apartment by yourself like like you're doing all this stuff that's like not making you happy like it's not making you happy I'm like you need to get out of there get completely out of there go back home and at the time he didn't have a good relationship with his family but he was trying to mend that and I go go back home like you know create this bond with your family that you're trying to do do do all of these types of things and I said I said I said we don't even need to work together I said go back home and his coach was in his hometown I go go back with him I said because I think that friendship stabilized you like I think it stabilized you I think you were happier within that environment I think a lot of your friends and gym people were there and he was like you know like that's I think that's what I'm gonna do and so that's where we kind of left things like we kind of left things many looking back on that now I'm like was that the right decision like was like was me just kind of saying go back home like go into that thing because it was literally right after that that they started posting up pictures and I could tell instantly something was wrong like instantly and then I became like in this like tug of war with myself like okay do I call up him and say dude what the hell are you guys doing like something looks off here and then like a my budding in on this because I'm not working him anymore I'm not the coach and they're like it's kind of an under you know like written rule like you don't interfere with other people's stuff but I felt like man something's off like I knew it and then the last picture he posted I'll never forget this Dan Salomon called me and he's like have you seen the picture of Dallas and I'm like I'm like I have I said he doesn't look good and he literally looks like he's getting ready to drop dead I said and and Dan Solomon says I dude I just saw him and he looks like he's walking death and I said that's what he looks like in the picture I said he's gray I said his skin looks funky like he's in a hospital he said no no no he just they're just posting up progress pictures online and and I'm like I said he doesn't look good like he just looked unhealthy and two days later he died like and that's the story like you know I didn't you know like I wasn't training him during the time I trained him for three months I didn't train him for the next four months or whatever from the time he died I have no idea what they did I have no idea what he was doing so not fortunate story because he uh you know you again and stories like this you get a lot of different versions of it on what happens but he was a guy that was alike guy he was coming at the most like together that's what's then Ike I'm telling you like he was if not the most liked guy like I mean I'm telling you like you were never gonna find anybody that had anything negative to say it let me ask you two about there's a there's an article online that says the supposed Alice McCarver anabolics on technical right right and all of this stuff here that it's got you know I mean the list is it's not I'll tell you first of all that's not I can tell you I've already seen it I it was sent to me I can tell you exactly what it is if you want me to tell you yeah yeah absolutely this is not his cycle this is a drug list that him and his coach ordered that's the list they ordered that's it that's a drug list that's a rug order list but that's not you this has nothing to do okay so I can tell you that was this is pre you or both this is after me I believe this is either pre me or after me but this has nothing to do with me and Dallas at all like oh that's sometimes that's a lot ridiculous now but this supposedly what I was told is a shopping list for him and one other person that's what I was told and I was told that from the literally the person they ordered it problem how it's a legitimate like like it's a legitimate guy that told me that so it's a legitimate guy guy told you but this has got this part has nothing to do with you ordering with them that's saying anything to do okay like this literally I like I can tell you by like there's so much stuff on this because I believe this is the one because I've seen too this is the one with EPO on it yeah and it's it's weird because that drug right there I can promise you like he didn't use with me but he asked me about that drug and it's weird because I didn't even think anything about it but we were at the Harned and he said listen we're just bullshitting and he goes listen he goes I've heard people use EPO and I'm like yeah I go listen I know of maybe three people that could have benefited or it has benefited from EPO I said very few people because it's a drug that literally like endurance people use right it doesn't really play a factor with bodybuilders there are some very rare rare instances that possibly and he's like and then he asked me this question I'll never forget this and and this was before I ever this list he asked me how long do they stay on that and I'm like five weeks max and he's like really he goes have you ever heard of anybody staying on longer than that and I'm like yes cyclists like cyclists he goes bodybuilders and I'm like no and he goes so nobody like six months a year and I'm like that would be I go do that he's asking he's asking me that question and I said no I said that would be friggin idiotic like I said get a sense that he asked you because he had done for six months or you don't have any idea I didn't have any idea what he was asking me but then when I saw this then I saw the EPO on it and that's when I was like holy [ __ ] like what was he asking about like and then it was and then I had already seen this list and it wasn't until after the list that somebody told me like well you know what that list is that's a that's an order list you know and if you know anybody involved with this list there's a couple things on the list at points right - the list is who it came from yes okay and your world would know who that is my world would a hundred percent no that is a 100 percent no that has nothing to do with me okay so so let me let me ask you this the reason why I'm going to in this direction is the following is I'm a fan of the sport at this point of the game you know I'm a fan fan support I showed you a picture earlier what I look like when I was 20 years old I wanted was amazing I mean I was crazy yeah I wanted to go in the world in the direction of being a body but then a one minute I'm like no I'm leaving it so with the current state of where mr. Olympia is with no Joe Weider there's not a wieder right there's not somebody that's selling it pitching it's you know from the time and with the current social media conditions where someone like this wouldn't be around 1994 so I'm not gonna write an article like this and say hey look what you someone's not gonna be online saying hey Chad hey great ok that's not the world we're in today not today 25 years ago right so today where everybody is quick to jump and say I can't believe what happened there what do you foresee taking place with the future of mr. Olympia today and bodybuilding and what do you think needs to happen for it to become mainstream rather than a niche small communities fort of don't bring too much attention a little bit is good we can make money but let's not bring a lot of attention to it I think the direction that we're headed right now is positive like literally positive and there's a couple things like the the direction that the Olympia went last year now people are gonna rip the [ __ ] out of the Olympia last year because there wasn't a like a defending champ there wasn't big names in it and so you know I honestly feel sorry for Brandon curry a little bit because you know he was in a no-win situation like him Bowen AK Hadi like listen any three of those guys could have won and they all three are gonna go through what kind of Brandon is going through a little bit right now and they're all gonna be like well of course he won because he didn't beat anyone there was nobody in it bow neck wins he goes through the same thing like they all do it but at the end of the day Brandon Currie earned the right to be mr. Limpy he showed up he battled like I personally don't think he should have won like I I thought Hadi should have won I like because I was so you don't fix it I loved hotties physique because I'm a guy that's big on conditioning I liked conditioning I liked I thought to me like when you look at structure muscularity and conditioning in comparison to all three I thought how do you how do you had more of of that but I also could see how Bowen that could have won and I can a hundred percent see how curry did win so I thought it was that close I thought it was literally there just wasn't that one guy that just was like oh [ __ ] this guy its mover type of thing so that being said but the direction that the Olympia has gone turning over to Dan Solomon who everybody knows a good friend of mine but I know the direction he wants to take things and if you look at all the stuff that he's doing right now he's brought Shaq on board and they're doing a lot of promotional stuff and they're doing a lot of things you're gonna see big names in the show this year so they're it's gonna have heavy hitters in this you come on flex Luis or were you doing you got flex Luis in it right we know that big rama's probably going to be there we knows the Phils gonna be there but like it's gonna there's gonna be some major major guys in this lineup so whoever wins this it's gonna be a legitimate win so that's that's a foregone conclusion but the part that can take us into the next level is athletic on it can benefit across the board now everybody's trying to act like Oh F Letta Khan is going to hurt the Olympia I completely disagree I think athletic Khan is going to benefit the Olympia because anything that has the rock involved in it and he has embraced this industry he is a bodybuilding fan he is a treaty trains he lives this type of sport and he is bringing a different level of you know like everything that he can do nobody's been able to do like listen the what he could do for this sport there literally hasn't been like Joey Durand and the things that they've done like you nobody will do what they did again because it was just a different time like that for me was like the golden era because like he knew all the athletes and and he was it was like a family like it was a little bit different but it was a little bit of a cult type you know think it wasn't mainstream even though they wanted it in the Olympics it probably was just never going to get there the rock can make it in mainstream he can put it out there and say look at what these guys do look at the hard work they do Kenny they can it take attention away from the store Olympia or no I mean I don't think so I mean I think that the mr. Olympia is the mr. Olympia and I think that what I think Athletica athletic on could be huge I think it could be monster as a point where they come by 51% of Astral MP or Danelle well I mean possibly but I think that I think the key really isn't so much overshadowing the Olympia I think what the key is how much attention and how big athletic con could be draws that much more you know to the Olympia in my opinion I well I mean listen what's going to be interesting to see what happens because for me again it goes back to the conversation with what Dana White it to UFC okay and Dana White build that Joe Weider cult caught like top of an environment would you have seen where people like me who were you know all boxing and you know following boxers to all of us and so you know what I don't even trust any of the judging movie I'm gonna go watch I got you so I hope I hope you're right and I hope that does take place but I also hope I also hope that somehow someway the relationship with somebody like a Danny or a rock it gets deeper in to develop and promote the next bodybuilders and take them to the next sub without exit the head that's what I go with it Dan seems like a really nice guy when you even forgot yeah since you're a guy that wants to do the right thing you know sometimes we're gonna say some companies are missing one or two pieces but the other question I was gonna ask you what this part was we just talked about the Dallas we just talked about some of these stories right what what do you think needs to be do you think the bodybuilding world has a black eye because kidney kidney kidney you know young you know down low okay do you think bodybuilding has a black eye of a the amount of people that have died or have had issues there and if yes what do you think needs to happen for it I mean a different direction the thing is when you look at the number of people that have had issues you know it's pretty small like when you when you look at it and like I said you know even with the Flex thing like the Flex thing was that even the dawn long so I mean that was one of the guys that that Shawn ray brought up again he's a hundred percent aware of what what the deal is with Don long like if you if you google Don long you will find out that Don long was born with one kidney one functioning kidney he didn't find out about it until 1999 so you know and again like did bodybuilding like escalate the problem a hundred percent it escalated the problem if he would have picked to be a golfer would he have needed a you know a kidney transplant so those things are all out there I think that the biggest issue is that just like this list like this is what is being pushed out there because this is shock value like and I think you know it's not so much like look there was the death Momoa died from diuretics and we know that he died from diuretics and like you know there's there are those cases that happened at shows like there are like but they're far and few between and in reality most of those are like all related to something like the the Momo stories are very limited and but I think this stuff because you have a lot of young people right now that are on the internet and they're like like trolling the sport you know realistically yeah and because what I got to be honest like when I first seen this list I'm like it's a fake list like no there's no chance that's a real list like it's a fake list you like you know and then you know when when like I was talking to somebody and they're like it's actually not a list it's a shopping list and I'm like okay like I get it now and it's not for one person it was for two people and you know so I'm like okay I got that now and so those are the things that are out there but this list being pushed around by 16 year olds and 18 year olds and 19 year olds and all of these kids and then these kids talking about this and these kids just like the sight enhancement so you see all of these like crazy guys that have just injected like ridiculous amounts of [ __ ] in their arms and they look like a sideshow freak show but where are they they're on generation iron they're on all the platforms they're being talked about on all the podcasts like most people are making fun of them it's you up this thing yeah it's the dumbest looking thing ever since but they're literally they're like they're there and when those are the things that are out there and people pull up bodybuilding and bam they're that is the general public looks at that is like what in the hell they don't see the story of Brandon Currie flying literally home with the Sandow and going directly to a school and talking to kids like you don't see that very often you see this freak who has pumped a ton of [ __ ] in his arm for no reason whatsoever and that's the stuff because that's what gets shock value I business mr. Olympia develop better content with their YouTube channel and start pumping stuff out there and start really putting stuff in our faces so right these types of stories exactly again that also goes back to the marketing aspect exactly you tell the story and I think it was a part of conversation that we had by the Amish by the way I am a sue mink you have spoken to Dan about about their being on value attainment I'm assuming I actually haven't so he doesn't know you're gonna be here absolutely not he's gonna enjoy yeah no idea when Sean was here Sean was fully a you know he sounded like he was all team you know the run came right prepared to do you know shots fired and all right I seem really prepared for the whole thing but you know again my interest I'm interested in the sport I mean you see who's in my ear right that's the reason why that's their I'm interested in the sport I think there's a and in me but if you look at what Dan has done like Dan has you know he had Mark Wahlberg at the you know Olympia this year and he's immediately you know teamed with Shaq who I think is you know one of the most visible personalities you know out there nope and so those things you know are are huge steps in the right direction credit to that but I also agree that you can only do so much there and the only person that really has the ability to pull the strings to that next level is Danny and the rock and they have the ability to I think take athletes to put them in front of people that you could never get in front and that's what it's going to take it's going to take somebody whoever if it's Phil Heath or whoever it is to win potentially athletic con and to be put out there in front of people that would never see him and when he's sitting next to Danny Garcia and the rock and they're talking about athletic on and all of the fit you know physical fitness and stuff all of the nonsense then is eliminated all these freaks that are doing the idiotic stuff is eliminated and it's more of a positive and that's where everybody has to go I mean I hope it happens I don't know it happens I think a benefits the entire sport if it does happen I I get asked if Pat do you want to buy him a stroller up here I don't have the time but I want a financial firm I don't have an interest in wanting to buy the company today I'm in a different state my life but I wouldn't mind seeing somebody like them taking me but let me ask you this 2020 was stolen what does it look like whitfill he was it look like without fitfully it comes back what happens what would the excitement with the people in your opinion now you're more team salomon you're not really team Phil he'd so for full disclaimer but right no come by like Phil those are gonna be wrong late it's funny like I didn't used to really like him that much I was actually like when he first came on I was like hi he's narrow and he's this and that and he proved me wrong like you know like he I felt like he had weaknesses and then he progressed as a bodybuilder and you know I like the fact that he did that you know and I mean he'll be the first to tell you like listen like Chad would call me out like listen and when I look good Chad told me I look good when I look bad Chad till now look bad and so I'm very Pro Phil when Phil is a hundred percent like absolutely if Phil is in the show it is a better show like it is a better without a doubt like a hundred percent okay you know I just you know I think that's the key like do we see Phil at the Olympia I think we're gonna see Phil this year 100 percent you think you're gonna see 100 percent I think we are gonna see him I just don't know if we're gonna see him at the Olympic I agree with you I let it count I told yes I totally agree and and there's been some you you know there's gonna be some very interesting announcements being made here pretty soon but you know I just hope it's not gonna be one of those things because you know how sometimes like imagine if I am right now you know how you said if I had it my way I would have done whatever I could to help the other candidates to help beat Shawn Ray because I wanted to clean it up exactly so now so so maybe if mr. Rowland yes a little bit pissed off would feel before the way he is kind of in with Chandra maybe Phil is kind of like dude if I come back they're pumping up Flex Lewis to kind of subtly give him the mist rondell give me number two why would I put my body through this those are some other things he's got to be concerned about because there's a lot of politics there is a lot of politics and I mean those are things here's the thing like and I know that's a big topic right now because Flex Lewis gets an invite and like their pump and flex Lewis right it is big time and and here's the thing that's tough about that like I get the aspect of he's a to 12 champion and I believe 100% he deserves an invite because the Olympia champions literally carry over full-time so he literally deserves what no but nobody and he's got a beautiful but here's the problem here's the problem you have you have guys literally getting ready for the Arnold right now you have Brandon Currie who's the reigning mr. Olympia and the last thing they want to do is prep for a show with even an inkling of doubt like and I know exactly what that's like because my wife prepped for the Olympia who's without who you're talking about so like Brandon right yeah Brandon courage like you know listen you so here's flex being pumped Pumped now I have a feeling when we get closer to the Olympia that's I have a feeling they're pumping flex right now because I just invited him and so I think everybody a little bit I think I think a little bit everybody's jumping the gun and I think when it comes right down to it I think so I think we're gonna have a dominant winner at the Arnold and I think that guy is gonna be a major force and I think that we're going to have Brandon Curry coming back as like really trying to prove himself because let's get real I mean he took a lot of [ __ ] this year because he didn't beat anybody so he's now trying to prove himself you know flex Lewis you know going in who who has all this I bet he's trying to prove himself and I think that you have a situation and who knows what's gonna happen with rodent-like if Rodin's court case is over and he's you know basically you know basically cleared of all charges I believe that he will be I think he will be in and so we could potentially see four or five really good bodybuilders battle it out on stage I still don't think it's gonna include Phil Heath but the ultimate goal you don't think Phil's gonna hit the stage this year I think he's gonna hit athletic on okay without a doubt but at the end of the day I still think we could benefit because the ultimate goal potentially would be whoever wins the Olympia goes to athletic on now I think obviously if mr. Olympia then beat you really scary that's what you just said it's scary because nothing that means that let it come becomes do not necessarily just Thank You Phil he's my passion people just think if just think if let's say that Phil Heath bypasses the I'm just gonna throw this out here so let's say Phil bypasses the Olympia and ghost Athletica yeah and let's say that big RAM he comes in and wins the Olympia guy and decides he's going to go to athletic on and then he beats Phil atletico he just proved that the mr. Olympia is still by far the top thing now the flip side of that is if if he wins the Olympia and goes and gets beat by Phil then it becomes a different story is scarier part here's a scarier part say Phil goes and competes athletic on he wins he gets a contract with Under Armour he gets a contract in the movies he makes nine million dollars Rahmi then goes and wins the next year he gets a four and a half million dollar contract then there's a massive exodus and and you have to understand capitalism war no I get that I understand I don't mind I'm sitting down he's talking to me he says to me Pat I'm telling you I got the safest business there's no one that's gonna put me out of business I said Andy Grove the legendary CEO of Intel in the 80s wrote a book called only the paranoid survive and it wouldn't be the smartest little mr. Olympia can I be parent it was my absolutely I could be wrong but I got to tell you like if that scenario played out it would be the absolute greatest thing for the athlete and I agree it'll be humble don't agree you know Phil Heath making X amount of million whoever the next person is it would be the greatest thing because in my opinion what it would do is it would light a fire hopefully under some of these guys and go holy [ __ ] look what Phil just did because right now that fire is not there like you can see it like when you're looking at guy is Wayne Johnson and banner Garcia are way more sex so into that world that's a search and it's a different scenario because like these guys like right now I think you know I mean when you go to these shows and when everybody's talking about like these guys aren't suffering and these guys aren't putting in the work and these guys are out of shape and this and that does it uh I can tell you that a eight million dollar Under Armor contract or whatever you know like all that kind of money that will literally light a fire under somebody's ass you know and that's that's yeah and so and then I'm gonna give you a bipolar complete opposite side of it I'd love to see Phil get nine I just don't know if the political power people want to see Phil night because I don't know if they want the face yeah of nine to be ahead of Lee Haney or Ronnie because it's almost a lid I just hope I'm left I'm glad I hope I'm wrong we're talking nine Olympians I'm talking nine Olympia yeah yeah that stuff that's dumb if I'm a guy that's right now in Olympia I want to see him come get nine because that's that's media that's conversation that's talk but again but but when you think about it like when you know and then I just had this conversation when we're looking at that talk like that guy okay the guy that's gonna do that and I'm not saying it's ever gonna be done but even if it's Phil first he's got to win one more to eight yeah to get to eight right that just heisting and then he would need another one to break nine to break that like to break that that athlete literally has to be 100 percent like that athlete doesn't come in and just win you know what I mean because even when ronnie was going for nine and we and he was already dealing with his back issues Phil can be a hundred percent I don't know if he can be a hundred percent but in two years I'm not sure if he can be before what he's 40 no yeah possibly possibly you know but I even when ronnie was coming in and he was having the back issues and stuff and you know I remember having this conversation with Kimmy it's like you know this is like nine and and where does he gonna have to be and I go this will be the hardest Olympia ever to win I said no matter even if this one even if he's a little bit better he's not winning this one because that separates somebody that's a monstrosity of an achievement if anybody could do it maybe Phil maybe Phil but it would be it'll be crazy well a chat I think we have to thank Sean ray for making this happen if it wasn't her best friend Sean ray you and I are not sitting at lunch and that a conversation exactly but also at the same time I I like the fact that you have the courage to sit here and take all the questions you know it's not it's probably the most open I'm like I'm not the most open guy just because bodybuilding is typically not open you know what I'm saying of course but I think that there's so many negative things out there now and like look it's not like we're hiding something like we all know what's going on and I think the problem is like there's so much misdirection and so much miss you know information out there as far as like what's actually involved and stuff and that's why you know like even Kim was like like how far are you gonna go with this you know and I go you know what like I've never like literally spoke like openly and I'm gonna speak as open as I possibly can and that's exactly what you did I think that's exactly what the audience is gonna appreciate about this I think the commentary while you're watching this obviously you're gonna share your thoughts below so we can see what you took away from this I am assuming there's gonna be a genre camp that's gonna be here as well and we want to hear from you as well but chat appreciate really I know well 24 hours were coming out I appreciate it thank you so a different type of a topic for body but then a lot of you guys have been asking about it we decided to go a little bit deeper and obviously he responded to Sean ray which I'd love to hear your thoughts please comment below I got two other interviews I want you to watch one is with Ronnie Coleman if you haven't watched it yet and you came here through suggested videos it's a phenomenal interview with him or click over here to watch the interview that cause Chad Nichols to be a guest on value taemin which is by genre and again if you haven't subscribed to the channel please click here to subscribe thanks for watching everybody take care bye bye [Music]

Channel: Valuetainment

Views: 390,157

Rating: 4.6145358 out of 5

Keywords: Entrepreneur, Entrepreneurs, Entrepreneurship, Entrepreneur Motivation, valuetainment, patrick bet david, chad nicholls, shawn ray, mr olympia, diet doc, ifbb, flex wheeler, steroids

Id: 3ETGfQM6NRI

Length: 114min 26sec (6866 seconds)

Published: Fri Feb 14 2020