1 New AI vs 7 Old AIs

hey guys spirit of the law here in this video I want to test a claim that was made about the new AI before a definitive edition was released I thought that was a video of it from e3 but I haven't been able to track that down but I did find it in an article the exact claim is if you put one AI non-cheating of the definitive edition version against seven of the original that do cheat it just wipes the floor with them no problem every time now there's no question the new AI is a step up from HD which itself is a huge step up from the old conquerors AI in a free for all it does win in the way described there but I'm wondering if they actually mean having won against seven all on the same team well let's try it out so here we have a game setup where I have seven of the old conquer version AI is all on the same team and with what the new AI is team two I am going to pick its civilization as Chinese just because I think it's a civilization the AI is quite good at playing and I want to give it the best shot possible to do this for the age of conquers AI though I'm just gonna let it go random even though it might get some of the new civilizations and not know quite as well how to play them on the right you can see I've got pretty standard game settings going for Arabia extreme difficulty and regular resources and all that stuff so let's check it out you can see here in the blue we have the new definitive edition AI of course playing as the Chinese they have three extra villagers and no food at all so first thing you do always is you grab loom and could see that it knows to do that little worried here you can just thinking about how many to sift phonus is the rep against at once yeah it's it's gonna be an uphill fight but don't be intimidated man we're all cheering for you well let's check out what they're up against to the left here we have the cumin which are a really good civilization not sure the AI is gonna fully make use of the multiple town centers and knows how good the steppe lancers are and stuff like that but we'll say definitely strong civilization moving on and oh there's this plan it's gonna flush with ranged units so futile rush with ranged units that's actually probably what I would be doing as well here and here we but the Koreans of course they've got their noob would discount and I've always been a really strong late-game civilization so this is where you want them not right beside the person they're matched up against so good SIF and moving on we've got the Hunts who've just found their starting goats it almost two minutes yikes what'd they hit chopping wood for two minutes hmm anyway so yeah the Hans strong civilization and yeah just off to a rough start there and scouting man it's important and next in the bottom here we have the Turks now this is a really strong civilization you want to just boom up a lot and this actually worked out pretty well for them they happen to be the farthest away on the map because really if they just go straight for Imperial age and get out some gunpowder units that's gonna be really strong and much of the AI is gonna know to do that but I'm curious to see if it does and moving on way over here we have the Malians not quite as bad as the Goths but I can't imagine Chinese player would be super happy to be up against them in the late game because of course they have their champion line with extra pierce armor and Chinese are going to be going probably for mostly archers in the late game not sure the AI is gonna know to exploit that but we'll see and of course already on their berries and grab them from multiple cheap at the same time not ideal and now of course they run out and they can I've send everything to berries like scouting is so important to grab adds have a consistent early game here and Dai really shows that so next over here in the gray we have the Khmer again another really strong late-game civilization kind of like the Turks or the Koreans and chimera of course have scorpions and ballista elephants and just elephants in general just a lot of really really tanky units that are gonna be pretty good and last one here is the vulgarians in the red which is the closest to our hero the definitive edition AI could very well be the first target Bulgarians are quite good I'm not sure the new AI or the sort of the old AI is necessarily gonna know how to make great posts and get the most out of them and that's part of what I'm interested in seeing here is how they actually handle all this and this is a good example here of why the new AI is better as you can see here it's already luring board the old AI they don't do that they take all their sheep and then they just send everything over to berries it's pretty inefficient in terms of collection rate and also makes them pretty reliant on farms early on you'll see they tend to get a pretty good farm eco like voda got farms coming up at five and a half minutes that's very early you can see generally players will take both of their boar first and then maybe put a couple of farms but sometimes you can also try to delay them in order to get horse-collar first which is a little more efficient but you just have fewer food sources happening so a couple ways to do it so I'm gonna speed up here just pretty typical stuff happening the Dark Age I don't know I'm really interested to see from the old AI what their strategy is because it can be pretty passive sometimes and I think that's what the new AI is gonna have to rely on is not so much trying to out boom all of them but to at least rush and quickly take out a couple of them because if we can take out even two of them it might be able to out boom five I just don't think I can help them seven go to think in terms of population limit you've got 200 they've got 1,400 population space to work with and that's really tough to play against generally when you're against multiple weaker opponents like this you try to rush at least one or two of them and take them out before they can really actually reach their potential and you can see here we're going up with 23 villagers so this does that's pretty quick and definitely gonna plan to spend a little bit of time the fuel age here and we've already seen its strategy on the left there that it's gonna be going for feudal units now flush can mean a couple of different things here but it does say ranged units so you would think that means archers and so we're getting the barracks down so that we can pull the archery range as soon as it hits the next stage and kind of sparked here that's picking up some deer as well sometimes it'll push them but in this case don't really have to and this the archery range coming down right away just nice to see ideally you want to have your wood set up so that you can have two archery ranges you can see grabbing those boar mean they have some berries left over that they can use now whereas the older AI it has to use a lot of extra farms at this point that just makes it harder for them to make military buildings and gives the new AI a bit of a window it might be able to explain right now and would you have a second archery range coming down working on archers that makes a lot of sense we will defend some spearmen there in case you get Scout rushed I don't think that's gonna happen though the old AI is usually not super aggressive early on and cool that's an exposed wood line I don't know if it's quite scouted it yet though so let's see can we also it has okay so that's really weird scouting hang on what did just send it scout off to die in the corner well that's that might be a problem but at least it does know that Purple's here so I think Purple's gonna be the first threat it's pretty unfortunate it's already down a scout actually because it's not gonna know very much about the map now even where the extra golds and stuff are that doesn't make any sense to me okay and yeah I don't actually see the Scout running around anywhere now he's scouting with the Spearman now hmm it's kind of weird not sure what happened to the Scout cavalry maybe got a little fight in the corner or something and we are coming up on 15 minutes this is when you would like to be hitting somebody if you're going for archers I mean you'd probably hit them bite 14 minutes is kind of what I aim for personally and to at least be getting your archers out and heading toward the opponent but it just seems to be masking them up and almost exploring here without attacking I think this might be a look a little bit of a mistake I think it should be sending these forward immediately because the old AI is not gonna have anything yeah it's just no military you can see all of them only have their Scout and the new AI has eight military go use it man go take these go yeah so just kind of hanging out I don't think that's the the best move here but we'll see hard to say so let's check in on where everybody else is at everybody seems to be going blacksmith and market so trying to a fast castle and we can see Reds even in the castle age I didn't even see that okay well that's pretty good that in fact a bunch of them are in the castle age and let's see almost all them are in the castle age now and this could be a problem if all the other AIS are reaching castle eight have gone straight there okay at least we are going out with these archers now but you don't want them to get multiple town centers up like we see Red's already getting a second Town Center up which means now instead of being up against seven other town centers were up now against 10 or 14 but I do like this we're getting a little bit of a raid on one of them still though this is five minutes too late I think but that's a pretty good army and we've even got a little bit of upgrades on there this could be a tough game I think here for for purple although I get a little hung up here on just lumber camp I can want to go raid this gold and then I mean if I were controlling this right now could probably kill purple in two minutes so you just put a couple of archers around the area put him on stand ground and that would be that but just seems to want to attack this lumber camp for some reason there we go it's a ran out and seems to be successfully luring blue into the town center no don't do that oh okay well I was just gonna throw the whole army away it hurts extra cuz the upgrades are all coming in right now - that wasn't the brightest move ever okay so we delayed castle age here trying to get this plan straight delayed castle age to get feudal units out sat around the feudal units and then sent them all off to die into a town center and we're still the score leader so kind of shows you the competition it's up against right now so at our second town centre coming out everyone's castle age I think it was actually the last when we get to castle age and gotta feel like that was the window and you can see how exposed these are you can see how a real player would be able to exploit this by just coming in the few archers and just hit all of these AIS and I do wish the new AI was just a little bit more aggressive and sort of understanding that the fact I'd say it's more important to be extra aggressive and getting your units out when you're outnumbered and don't just play defensive and what's it doing right now so it's decided Purple's too tough and so it's going to instead go knocking on red store here and hopefully it's to avoid getting taken out by this town center and this is another major difference between the old AI and the new one the new AI does not wall where's the old a eyes do and I think it gives them quite a big advantage okay yeah that seems like a really useful wall just in case I mean you never know maybe there could be another player joins the game late and they just come in from the side of the map and you know who's laughing now if they're held out by that wall I can see how it would be easier to program it to just build a wall 20 tiles away or whatever from a town center then it would be to try to teach it that this side of the map can also be a wall but I don't know I don't even know how you would program any of this so I assume that's hard to avoid all right so we've got a little bit of a note of three Town Center boom not bad my man can help coming in can sometimes get the AI some trouble now it's got that cleaned up uneasy looking at the score it's definitely the best player here by quite a bit just not sure it's gonna be able to beat all seven I don't know guys I want to believe but it's tough at this point I think there was a chance to at least knock out purple and maybe even green there if they just kind of rolled through and took out villagers but at this point you're really trying to out boom in two of them or even an imperial h right now didn't even notice that which is a pretty good time to be Imperial before 30 minutes I mean for an AI that's pretty good but again a little bit of indecision here we're just sort of sending our units around luckily haven't really been rated yet by anything got some Ford very aggressive barracks here every AI seems you want to drop the barracks and definitive edition yeah is gonna have none of that still walling up and these lone megan else from red this one's gonna go through AI confuse though not quite sure what to do you hear there we go i like that it will actually use the battering ram to target them sometimes i know got scared like all right now i'll do it no no okay now i'm gonna do it for real Oh hey what was that the old AI repairing with the villager that's weird the old AI doesn't do that hang on what's up this is playing better than the old AI does that was a little suspicious I think the whole day I actually know some stuff that it definitely didn't before because that's new which just means that's even harder for the new AI if the old one knows some tricks as well and although this is old AI stuff is putting a watchtower in the Miller know where and it will have to put these town centers in places where it's clear all around it instead of right up against resources that's such an old AI thing to do obviously the new one will actually squeeze them right up against resources which i think is the better way to go and like on the stone and stuff and I put down a castle I think that's good it does love I know from the past the AI loves to make the elite Chico news which is a great unit I think that's actually a good call so we get some rates here from yellow it's the mole Ian sitting in a couple of these nights here looks like we've got some new players getting in on the action here you've got some cavalry archers coming in now normally by 36 minutes if you just had 12 cavalry archers or 15 or whatever this is that wouldn't really be a threat but the problem is when there's so many AI just dealing with one more of these when you already have your hands full becomes really overwhelming really quickly we'll see but this is why you gotta take out a few of them early on the score still looks pretty good though in fact I think it's like extending the lead oh man this is a villager have killed that dismounted chronic they're not strong unit nice to see that the new AI is actually the point now it can get rid of these barracks and seem to have some decent military numbers in a bit of sijo you can see a light in there hopefully it just decides to push out after this and I do kind of wish the new AI would wall up here because I feel like it's taking the brunt of this on its economy and its town centers and it's losing a bunch of villages here probably in half to if it would just wall this a little bit I think so we've got a pretty good army here let's let's check this out so they definitely the biggest military that we certainly don't have a number all of the enemy military anymore just town centre or Inc that was a castle that'd be a very aggressive castle I'd approve of that looking back home at their economies lets them have a lot of farms and stuff definitely some military that isn't even being used I'm not sure these kids are going okay what's going on just go out this way whatever just AI thinks and we do actually have a pretty forward castle and petard sand what are the pitar it's gonna break down there's no balls to break down here it's gonna go after units I guess petard well I got somebody to think and seen a lot of cavalry archers out of the AI right now which kind of works for the elite skirmisher spam that the new AI is going for it so I was looking around at the economy's here while they're just skirmishing at the front all the guys doing pretty good about multiple town centers pretty good farming economy is placed into a little further behind yeah just don't seem quite as developed and trade is actually gonna be a pretty big pretty big factor here because just think about Chinese once they run out of gold they don't have chicken use anymore and I'll just trash it's gonna be really tough to fight against seven AI that have gold when you're just using trash units but look at that score it's almost double each of the other ones normally that'd be a really good sign but uh yeah hard to say I feel like we haven't really done any damage to anybody but I don't know we're making a move here so we've got the elite Chico new like I said it loves to make those we've also got some lead skirmisher mixed in nothing wrong with that and a pretty successful boom we got one hundred and thirty three villagers everybody else is on 71 ish so I can see it definitely out booms the other one and while also having more military so it's using its population a lot more all the rest are about half population looks like kind of a hundred just over just under where's our boy here is fully boomed at a hundred and ninety-six population and so make a pretty serious play here on red while holding really well here and the weird spot for a castle but other than that this area does seem quite defended and I like the idea of a castle I just wish it was up on the hill to get the hill bonus instead of having the hill bonus against it and a few these kipchak completely unafraid it though so there won't be that scary you can see they fire a bunch of different arrows so you can be deceptive actually these two units remind me a little bit of each other yeah he's a good hail of arrows there and this is a pretty successful really I think the siege Rams are doing the work here they just blast through everything and everything here seems to be arranged unit so doing Pierce damage these Rams which is 195 pierce armor yeah yeah that scores pretty good okay I take it back maybe we've got a bit of a chance here we're using these seat ramps in front with the elite Chico News it's a good combo and I think that's part of why they're so good with the Chinese is they know how to play them in the early game and they also know how to make use them in the late game yeah like this is very new behavior the old AI did not know how to do this where they would actually repair the on atures this Andre was just wrecking guys come on just charge it mmm this sides going really well though is that actually taking out red I wouldn't be surprised Fred designs here in a couple minutes hard to say the old AI can be maybe a little bit too reluctant to design yeah just the score you can tell it's I'll say this even if it doesn't when it's clearly be best player here community thrive under this much pressure you can just see that villagers the military it makes even seems to transition from booming into a lot of villagers into losing villagers and replacing that with more military oh no take up this trebuchet I lost a whole castle he has Chinese you really need your castles a tricky one for this it's all elite cheap and new spam you got to keep all your castles alive and Brett's pretty much dead here what economy do we have from red red has 35 villagers so one down now we're not really seeing a huge threat over here war wagons starting to come in I do fight with some colors we haven't seen a lot of like yeah we have the Turks this is the most a I army ever met this miscellaneous siege some regular skirmishers at 50 minutes some hand cannons and some hose ours with a couple Cavaliers mixed in with no upgrades just in one long train here as such an AI army this is a pretty serious raid though and we don't have a castle at front name why it's white I guess a little further back or up on this hill would have been better thanks you know calling me hit pretty hard here while at the same time losing a bit of steam here I lost the elite skirmishers chicken news just a few left and a couple of siege rams trying to push forward but the pressure on blue is getting real here it's disrupting the economy I think word yeah we're only down to 17 farmers right now I think that was up to 40 at one point so 72 Lumberjacks is a lot of Lumberjacks but the farm economy is getting really disrupted glad to see we're putting up more cast as here a train the lychee canoes I mean the scores still looking great but I'm sensing the tide is turning here a little bit especially with the as low number farmers like we gotta have at least 40 farmers here so you keep churning out units we're not able to stay at 200 population they keep saying we as if I'm playing as a definitive edition I feel like I come across a little biased here but obviously I'm cheering for it come on you have to cheer for an underdog like this things aren't looking great though because this push is stopping red is basically eliminated I think it's got a little bit of an economy but we're now we're just getting these waves of miscellaneous units coming in and I'd really want to see another big push here and get the population back up to 200 because there's no way you can do this if you aren't maxing out your population even with 132 villagers we're not banking a lot of extra resources here but that being said it's not doing that bad and it's pushing over here on this side these kipchak 70 still not really any upgrades as it's got chemistry and elite yeah these auditors can be dangerous though yeah I can see they take out a lot of them and how we doing over here this area it's not too bad I like we're putting another castle I don't know if that's an accident that is made some of the best location for a castle it'd be nicer a little bit more up on the hill or something but just having something here if not a wall because I'd get the new AI doesn't wall you gotta have some kind of defense there because there's definitely focusing on that area this is looking like we're gonna get overwhelmed here I think even the push on this side it's kind of installed out even though we're more than double the score of anybody else still looking a little dangerous to me it's hanging on don't get me wrong it's hard to find ways to move forward when you're under this much pressure it's not just the AI is making bad decisions here it's been doing really well actually I like that it's spamming chickeny and the seed ram combination was really good the problem is eventually you're gonna run out of gold doing that and the other AIS they've got trade so they're not gonna run out because they're not really trading a little bit yeah this isn't one of those games you can just wait out seven opponents though the seven opponents can just wait you out I do like to see that we've got back up to 40 farms though and back up to 200 population so kind of lost a little bit of a battle there probably a battle event but has definitely come back from that and kill a death ratio you can see as it's going ham it's 600 kills less than 400 deaths it's pretty good and I don't think we got time to UM to take out buildings like this I think we gotta move forward you got to put these units to use and when one fights and skirmishes all over and it's just got to be a little bit more focus here and what we're trying to do which I would say either you got to keep pushing through here it's gonna be tough with castles and stuff here I still think they should be going for purple that's the direction I'd be heading I'm in shore up this front side and then go for purple but this is getting dangerous now we've got trebuchet zout here and these units are just going to start getting fully upgraded over time like the old ai's slow but it will eventually you can see like the cavalry archers it does get all the upgrades eventually and so then a great killer death ratio almost seven hundred to four hundred almost [Music] and so I'm gonna get tricky shades on this side - yeah this this castle goes down again just gonna be opening big raids up here and it's pretty good spam I'm gonna lie that's a lot of chicken especially yeah it's maintaining 200 population which is tough for the unit with that much turnover and that you need castles in order to train and playing a little bit disadvantage here with the hill still a good matchup though I think for the elites you can use here and definitely have the numbers to take that one and where are we going we're going way out here to grab gold yeah so this is what happens is you run out of gold oh they still got some back here yeah so this is now open to raiding and once you're out of gold you're in big trouble and a situation like this you can't just ban elite skirmishers and win so I'd like to see it going out there to grab the gold I think it's got a establish that though with a bit more of an army you know that being said it cleaned up this side this is what I like to see it's pushing against purple we need to keep going and keep destroying the next AI you got to keep the line moving so I really like to see this because Reds basically out of it right so that's one less player that you've got using their 200 population space so I got two military and Purple's down to nine military this is pretty good I think you just keep rolling through with these seat rams the seed rounds this is the purple seed ramps but these seed ramps do the work you don't need trebuchet as you can just use seed ramps and yeah this is great they just keep pumping them out I love that a little bit of harassment over here from the mullions you see but that +5 pure summer and it being pretty good especially against skirmishers stuff like that and make another play for this gold here almost be nice to see it defend that with a castle or I guess can't afford a castle but a tower for sure and to get when it Purple's castles here which is good seems like we're making progress here are those Kip checks they can put out the better I'm pretty easy to see it you know if we took away three of these a is I think of what if steamrolled purple and red long ago and I've been able to move on but it's just seven it's just so hard still maintaining a good population though I like to see that and these waves of Units again before we've seen waves of Units that weren't upgraded now we are seeing wave the units that are upgraded and it just end up being so much stronger and meanwhile we start running out of gold and stuff like that yellows making a big push over here it looks like yeah even bringing some ramps it's a little scary ramps and trebuchets don't like to see and green supporting purple here at purple seems to be safe at the moment trying to rebuild Town Center and a castle and that's what snowing is when you make a push to get rid of their castle and then get pushed back by an ally and they rebuild the castle and meanwhile you just spend a bunch of gold so I can see Oh transitioning into halberdiers now transitioning in skirmishers NC we only got seven twenty gold lots of gold miners but I don't think it says thirty-eight gold miners I don't think they're all working on gold though I think they're tasked over here so as they're walking over it's calling them gold miners yeah so all these these are counting as gold miners right now so oh yeah it looks like you've got thirty of them but look at that income it's just relics only for right now and this is the position you don't want to be in is where you got a spam trash against AI that doesn't have to spam trash and pretty big raid in coming here taking out a lot of these villagers which you know if there's no more gold that you can access really don't need these guys I mean fair enough you can may make a few more farms and Lumberjacks but if you are gonna go for trash and really need spam a lot of it so I don't think they necessarily need 130 villagers here if they're just gonna spam trash and it's gonna be really annoying castle once this goes up and again we're not really seeing any of those see tramps like those Rams that were making such a huge difference there or go on now and even these leech eco news it would be really hard to replace here at this point and finally lost that town center yeah but trebuchet is in the outside it doesn't really know what a prioritize taking down trebuchet z' and this is starting to get a little steam Rolly it's trying to get a snowball effect here where there's just so many units you can't take good fights really hard to maintain that 200 population and you can see so I've been making military right now we've got three TCS queuing up villagers I mean but a little bit in terms of military trying to be snuck out but all these farms no longer working I think this is the beginning of a pretty quick downward spiral here just not quite able to use its early advantages enough to knock out these players before their economies were fully built up and they had all of their upgrades and at this point how do you get traction against this only a few farms are working we've got 30 idols and put down to 120 unpopulated here our military's down to 16 I don't think there's coming back from this could be wrong I mean the score looks fantastic three times the score this is what I would expect if you were steamrolling all of these but I think just didn't quite get purple out early enough and even reddit is still being annoying and still sending in a few units to them showing up every once in a while and is too many trebuchet is too many cold intensive units too many different types of units you can't even properly counteract all of these and even certain get some seeds on it just coming in and commands have everything it's ridiculous units see Jonah derp yeah we're getting all that he's probably elite no not only war grand but you can see they got all the upgrades there's so many upgrades for all these units coming in now like these are strong units and they're just getting spammed in here and just your whole economies idle all the time even though it looks like you've got you know so many units all these are counting as farmers and Lumberjacks I'm sure as they just run around being killed yeah I think this is over we can just hit on us to be any second now I'm sure it's gonna be spiteful but everything's on fire nothing's really working a little bit performance there everything's on fire nothing's working properly we're not making make to skirmishers right now I don't know where you'd send those as soon as they've got this many tribal shades and you can't fight that off yeah it's kind of over right there we've been getting pushed here on this side more trippy shades on this side I don't know why it's not calling it right now GG man it's okay put up a great fight and even it made it competitive for a long time there but I'm not sure what the condition is it's waiting for maybe when the town center is destroyed or something it'll call it yeah I didn't even wait that long well you know it had a really good start kind of slipped away sometime after killing red and either before during the failed attack on purple I'd say you can see that completely unheard economies like how do you out produce all of these economies I like the little towers everywhere for the Koreans that's cute you can see the Huns not really prioritizing farms here they seem to have fewer farms and everybody else I think is going for a lot of cavalry archers maybe so doing a lot of gold and wood instead is they have about the same number of villagers as everybody else and even a bunch of more units in the back here they weren't even using I didn't look at this one yeah and even red managed to hang on like we had never actually resigned so let's take a look at these stats here so by far the biggest score by that doesn't always translate into map control especial when you're up against so many other players and biggest army was actually the Turks which were the civilization furthest away from the blue player didn't go for any Janissaries or bombard cannons or any of that characteristic stuff but yeah still contributed a lot and I seen it kills though I like that and a ton of Units lost not quite as good of a ratio but by the end there I think they just lost a lot of units basically for free magic elect a lot of resources though pretty good economy and yeah so like we saw in the game had about double the villagers so I really think you'd be able to take four consistently every time I think but I think sevens just too much unless it is able to know to rush them and take them out right away which to be fair maybe sometimes it does but I would say does that every time and sort of looking for the main goal here was to see if we think it could be 7ai every time and not so much I mean you can see there was a period here where hit futile came out with the army everybody else fast castle with blade it being with slowest cuz he couldn't find his sheep but yeah they had no army like that was when you hit and then even when it went to castle a bunch of these didn't have anything they were just going to Imperial aged so he targeted any of those still probably could have taken them out but once you hit Imperial when you try to boom they're all booming as well and you can see the the dark shades is there military and it just kept expanding their military well the purple never really got going there and red was pretty close but managed to come back a little bit and even contribute a bit in military so overall I gotta say no I don't think it can take on seven of the old a eyes every time and that being said the old AI does actually seem to be better so a couple of tricks that it was doing that the old AI had never done before now I have confirmed that if it's in a free-for-all against seven of the old AIS then yes it will win and it does steamroll it in a way very similar to what was described in the article either way it was an impressive performance and definitely kept it competitive for a lot longer than I thought it was going to be able to really shows how far the AI has come but that's all for this one thanks for watching guys I'll see you next time [Music]

Channel: Spirit Of The Law

Views: 2,015,025

Keywords: aoe2, age of empires 2, definitive edition, aoe2de, spirit of the law, sotl

Id: Lt-3F47FD2w

Length: 35min 32sec (2132 seconds)

Published: Sun Dec 08 2019

Reddit Comments

[u/Nabbered]

New AI just so much better.