Zastava NPAP - Is Yours a Ticking Time Bomb?

hi this is Nisha and this video is on why I still believe the serbians estaba in PAP is a good gun for the money and a good gun for a range juice for a shooter cuz there's been a lot of talk about this I have my impact DF under folder out sorry I don't own a standard impact M 70 with the 1.0 mil receiver and I've just checked inventory on we don't have any in the store right now I could've sworn we did but I guess they already sold and because we had this out doing a different video here's my sis table Oh Pappy I'm 70 now this video is not about this gun we have multiple videos on it I just wanted to bring it out for comparison and to have something else on the table honestly now the impact was the second generation of the PAP M 70 series to come out of Serbia it appeared in 2013 and replaced the original so-called just PAP emissivity and the PAP em 70 was the first squareback gun to come in that could take standard Zastava you go pattern furniture it was imported by centuries and the impact still is today for that matter before it the only PAP is available in the USA were a slant back and they were single stack they were and they were pretty difficult to convert these were imported by EAA for a number of years and while very well made guns were not very successful it took century to bring me in and excuse me the the PAP m7 TN that could take standard mags they put in 922 our parts so on and so forth well the original PAP had a couple of issues that's in we have a video comparing the three generations from about a year ago but it had a couple of issues and so they replaced it with the in PAP but you're still imported today the original had a 1.5 mil receiver same as ISO PAP here the impact for whatever reason they went to a 1.0 mil receiver these are still built entirely in Serbia by Korea s table the former communist Factory it was rebuilt after the Yugoslavian civil war and continues to manufacture select fire weapons for the Serbian military as well as for many many export customers these impacts are sold by century with removable muzzle devices usually a slant type they come in with a nuzzle nut welded on they do not have a bayonet lug and sentry doesn't bother to add one back and the furniture can vary now this being the under folder we have the original Yugoslavian the pattern handguards made at original wood and we have an original you go under folding buttstock the fix talked version will usually come with American made hand guards and a fixed american-made buttstock the first ones would have a thick stock with a rubber recoil pad and no sling swivel later more recent ones for the last couple years have come in with a sling swivel on the stock but no rubber recoil pad other features of the impact series that are common to both variants we have a 16 inch medium heavy profile cold hammer-forged barrel it is not chrome blind because the stoppage just doesn't Chrome their 7.62 by 39 guns for military use or for civilian SKS or aka doesn't it doesn't matter they just don't we have a nice military-grade blued finish which is very similar to the finish on the military guns I'm sure they use the same treatment if a bolt carrier left in the white polish carrier that's nice we have the heavier duty air smooth top cover taken from the original ake a little thicker than most AKMs we have spring-loaded button in the back for the takedown this was originally introduced for grenade launching to lock the KITT dust cover on so it wouldn't come flying off carrying grenades we have an original receiver made over in Serbia we have on the under folder we have three rivets in the front we also have three rivets did you do it in the back here the original impact thick stock had a - rivet very similar to this Oh pap here okay heavy gun yes I loop it up had two rivets stack vertically more recent impacts will have three rivets in the back holding the return unit and unlike the wasser the in pap has a dimpled mag well it also on the impact one point zero male receiver version has the X&Y stampings which many prefer duty now interestingly the Pope app does not have the XY stamps again this is a 1.5 mil receiver as well I found those features of the receivers interesting kind of gives a little more of a military look to the impact so that's the gun in a nutshell up until about 2014 2015 the impact was very well-regarded but then a.k operators union did a torture test 5000 round torture tests and they had some trouble with some cracked ribbits and I believe some minor cracking on the rear of the receiver and a couple of other issues also battlefield Las Vegas published a thing saying that they were pulling the impacts off their firing line because they were prematurely failing so the impact has had very mixed to negative press the last two to three years and this has caused many to shy away from buying it I think this is it's pretty silly I think the impact is still a really good gun in this videos why I think so first off we do have a completely imported gun this just 922 our dand converted over here by century all your key parts are made by Zastava the same folks who made all those Yugo parts kits that everyone loves the barrel is top notch and the price tag really can't be beat these things or anywhere they've been as low as 450 500 nowadays they're hovering around 6 for the fixed dock or 650 for the under folder so some things that are true detractions we do not have a chrome-lined barrel this is people that some people don't like this I personally I can't see I like that it's not chromed but since surplus ammo corrosive ammo and 76039 hasn't been available for a long time everyone shooting commercial out of these and so I don't think it's a big deal it's a hammer-forged barrel that's nice it does take the extended Yugo pattern handguards which means that not all handguard types and you have to bisque a specific type for this but I like the longer handguards it gives you more room and keeps just that much more the barrel is concealed and more and more American manufacturers are making aftermarket Yugo pattern hand guards those are really things you can talk about hand and on the fixed stock version it takes a Yugo pattern fixed stock much like what the hand guards it's specific and you might argue but again more and more American manufacturers make these so what's going on with these there dude just seemed to be some legitimate issues but there seem to be some concerns people saying that the receiver is not made is not heat treated as hard as it should be I've also heard people say that the barrel isn't as heat treated and as hard as it should be so let's start there because this is an easy one to dismiss I've been reading about it as much as I could for the last year there have been a few people that have claimed that Yugo barrels aren't as hard as some other barrels but here's the thing they're talking about all you go serve me in barrels be they from select fire guns or semi autos the thing is though just because they might be a little softer a nice dress might doesn't mean they're so soft that there's a problem not all metals going to be the same hardness and actually being too hard has its own issues as well so even if the barrels are made of slightly softer steel it's not soft enough that it's ever caused an issue after all wars have been fought with these rifles actually Zastava has exported more rifles that have actually been used in conflict zones and most of other manufacturers outside of say China in perhaps East Germany and Russia of course so the barrels are top-notch I I don't see any reason to doubt them no one's ever shown evidence of a barrel bursting cracking or having premature rifling or crown wear plus you get a slightly heavier profile than almost a km's because it has leather profounder so I would the barrels to me seemed good to go if you actually read any evidence it's very circumstantial and even then guys aren't saying they're bad barrels they're just you know saying things so a lot of its been taken out of context as to the receivers let's start with the battlefield Las Vegas they weren't using semi autos they were converting these to full automatic so most of the impacts that were on their firing line were being fired in full auto okay I'm sure they did a perfectly good job of converting them but I'm also sure it's a rental in Las Vegas and that people were running the hell out of them you know how people treat rented cars and so on and so forth these guns had a hard life and battlefield was the first to say that every gun they had failed it just it was a matter of when Sega's washers they would all fail at some point now they said that the impacts were failing prematurely but they did not say at what round count they said that some washers made it to 80,000 and up did the impact only make it to sixty forty twenty ten we don't know how many rounds it made it to they never let that information be known they also didn't mention how many guns that this encompassed and we don't know if the guns were from multiple batches or one single import badge it's possible that they were all from one batch and maybe one batch was not as you know there could have been a quality control issue with one batch that happens to any manufacturer or they could have had guns from multiple batches over a couple of years times men we don't know the information there is so vague so I don't really know how to take that into consideration without full info now the a.k operators union test he's done to the second test the impact past it had a few wear spots at 5,000 rounds and I think there was a small crack near a rivet in the back on the fixed stock gun again and he didn't test the under folder but it wasn't so bad that he did he felt like it couldn't be sent to a viewer so he was sent out that was one gun it was fired quite extensively we did have problems with the stock getting loose this is not Zastava or the in paps fault this is because of Century Arms the wood is crap on these guns its balsa wood at the best and it's not just an issue with the impacts it's the same type of wood they put on their washers and they're as 47s and c39 v2s it's just not good wood any of those guns at 5,000 rounds the stock is going to get loose and probably fall off same goes for the hand guards getting hot if they're the us hand guards they just don't seem to be as good of a heat heat sink is the original because the woods not near as dense it's much more porous he also had problems with this spring-loaded latch back here the little nut fell out and the latch came out now he fixed it with a rock I believe but even if this was out it doesn't change anything most of your class the cops don't have this part so I agree it's annoying that it fell out but it does it definitely not only didn't keep the gun from functioning it's not even important to functioning it's really just a leftover from military guns that it's in here a lot of your guns that are sold the semis don't even have a latch for example the Polish archer did not have one and the Saiga SGS didn't have one even though the military counterparts did foreign aid launching it wasn't this style attached it was on them pretty cool bad but you get the idea anyway passed the test and you would think since it did pass the 5000 round test even with not an A+ may be considered an a-minus or a b-plus it still passed that that would have made people feel better about it but for some reason people seem to read what they want to read into these things and also remember that it was just a test of one and there's several variables MMO type mags he cold how fast how slow the faster you fire a gun the more where it's going to put on it the more stress it's going to put on it so I don't feel that there's exceedingly a lot of evidence to show these guns especially newer ones brought in the last couple of years are bad some people have performed Rockwell hardness tests on these receivers here's the problem results have varied across the board some guys say they're too soft some guys say they're too hard and some guys say they're too exactly right so it's like Goldilocks testing here the problem there is and I'm sure everyone who did it and published the results did it with complete honesty I'm not calling anyone out but without knowing the methodology of how they tested them did they use a control what was the setting you know you don't know with the tests there's more there's lots of variables that go into it so it's hard to just take the results and again they're not testing 20 or 30 guns they might be testing two three or even one so it's really hard to say with one or two examples being tested if we wanted to do this really we should get a couple hundred guns spending the entire production facility in the same method in a climate-controlled and very controlled setting laboratory clean typesetting to get a good accurate result and of course someone checking over the results making sure there wasn't one of those silly errors that humans make and of course the results should be repeatable so while I think these tests were done in good faith I just again the kind like the battlefield Las Vegas don't know the details enough to do it what I do know is you don't see videos on YouTube of these exploding I've never heard of an impact letting go like say you see on some of the last 47s or iOS or some of the homebrew guns I've literally seen homebrew guns come apart appear in the rivets were right receiver cracking or not you just don't see these failing on camera and the thing is century has sold tens of thousands of these on the other hand you can say well how many of those have actually had a high round count we don't know some guys buy these and never shoot them some guys might put 500 rounds a year rob ski is unique and why his testing is actually valid is he's putting 5,000 5,000 rounds through them quite quickly in a short time period this is something most people can't afford or don't have time to do so I'm not you know not discrediting that I think Rob does an excellent job for someone who was escaping from the mental ward and got over to the USA he hiding in the magwell of a 747 excuse me real well of a 747 now really Rob I really really all appreciate your work no get me wrong it looks like hard work though you know that the videos make it look so hard but I think you would be the first Rob would be the first to admit that he is a sample set of one he's just a trigger trigger puller and obviously if he had the money in time he'd love to test 5 or 50 guns but it costs so much money just to test one so I'm just saying keep tests like that in perspective of what they are as to the issues really what you hear of are maybe a cracked rivet now and again after a certain number of rounds or small receiver cracks you don't hear of trunnions letting go exploding you really don't hear much in the way of unreliability these seem to cycle just fine you do hear the furniture being crap but since it's the u.s. stuff no no argument there it is it is crap it's gone reason I like the under folder what I suspect and here's my theory one issue that's bandied about that I actually do agree with is the recoil spring for whatever reason the springs that come in these seem to be subpar they're either not properly tempered or they're too short because I noticed after shooting mine it was noticeably shorter and this gun here was shot at a year ago so I replaced it with a with a wolf spring and have had no troubles since so I would say that if you do get one of these spend five dollars and replace the recoil spring because something seems to be wrong at least with some of these Springs I suspect that the metal is just not quite treated right I don't know why maybe they're using leftovers or so on and so forth I don't know now if the spring is too light what's going to happen this carrier is going to come back very hard and hit that rear trunnion on an aka the bolt carrier impacts the rear trunnion it's just a matter of degree how hard and how fast but the proper spring it's cushioned but if that spring is not doing this job its slamming it to the back here very aggressively this could very much lead to cracking in the rear or the rivet and it's going to be putting extra tension extra stress on the spring back here because the guide rods held in but that's my theory as to why this went away on Rob so early on I think on his gun and a lot of new guns this carrier when you're being fired is coming back too hard too fast and related to that this seems to be a little over guest which means the gas port might be drilled a little little large for a lot of the ammo we're shooting now this all a kazar over gasped that's just how they work that's why we have holes to let off excess pressure in the gas block and or gas tube so between being over gassed and maybe having a weak spring I think this carrier is coming back and hitting the rear trying to aggressively and that's causing the cracks and problems it's also you know we're shooting our ammo we shoot here be it golden tiger brown bear - wolf it's possible to whatever ammo they manufacture in Serbia today is a little bit different spec and that's the ammo that Zastava is is tuning these guns for over there I don't know so yeah stress in the back I think it's that there's also been talk and this has pretty much been put to bed by now but about the tail of the bolt carrier mushrooming obviously impacting the rear trunnion aggressively isn't good but I am one of the proponents that I think it was caused by the early Tapco triggers that were in these for a couple of years it's known that the Tapco hammers were a overly hardened and B the angle the face was not done right so it impacted the bolt carrier is it came back at the wrong angle and this led the mushrooming and I really feel it was the top coat trigger because you can see the same mushrooming and washers with the tap Co our AES 10 B's mine is 10 B has some even other guns like Arsenal's that have had tab pose put in have started to show it and my own Archer my polish Archer which came from IO with one started to show it so I think that's more a fault of the hammer and that's why it's not just a thing that appears in the open I do feel that these receivers are made its estaba to spec at least as much as you know it was reasonable I point to the fact that these have X&Y stampings why would they go ahead and put the Y stamping in on this one but not say the O PAP if it wasn't a military stamping also it would just cost more for them to make a separate batch of receivers and barrels and trunnions and everything for their salado's then just use the same ones off their production line so I think these are coming in the parts themselves are coming off the same machines and they're being made by the same workers and out of the same metal as their military guns now are they using rejected parts this is a favorite theory that's been bandied about since the days of the Worcester I'll just say this there's no evidence either that ever came to light with the wasser or the impact that rejected parts were ever used in it so I would say the two things you can do if you have a Tapco hammer or swap it out for like a rack one or one of the new Arsenal's I kind of like to do fine Arsenal trigger group it's kind of patterned after the mow lot and definitely put a different recoil spring in at the very least the standard spring from a different gun or even better a wolf extra power I feel that those two small changes which will cost you I mean that the springs five bucks trigger groups anywhere from twenty to fifty depending on what you want to buy unless you go way out for a target trigger but it's a small thing and if you have the fixed stock I would also replace the the century buttstock with something better because it will get bad on you but it won't hurt the gun per se so first off I would do the recoil spring now what's funny to me is the fixed stock impact was tested by rob and it has this staggered me flip around a other sense you can see it better Ribit pattern in the back which isn't the best for controlling recall everyone still loves the yo PAP but you know this hasn't been through one of Rob's tests and as far as I know the battlefield Las Vegas didn't use any Oh paps it's entirely possible that one of these would experience the same type of failures in a rob test that the impacted everyone says what has a 1.5 mil receiver it's stronger it wouldn't do that I agree that seems logical but until you actually put a gun through this then the test you don't know because everything else is the same on the open this barrel assembly same barrel same bolt group same top cover the only real difference between the in PAP and the O PAP is the heavier receiver and some in the earlier Oh paps had some m7 tb1 parts like the sights and furniture I've been told that later ones have more commercial parts I don't know this firsthand so I gotta say that but the major difference between the impact and the old PAP is just the receiver everything else is the same and these are built in the same factory again on the same machines by the same people and these don't even have the XY stamped receivers which is interesting to me I don't know why but if you're gonna say the impact isn't good isn't trustworthy because of the ako you test the eight or the bad off had Las Vegas results you really can't just assume the O PAP is good because it hasn't been put into the same test I said I'm saying if one of them is questionable really both should be likewise in the similar vein the impact DF is a different model from the impact thick stock and again the impact DF has not been put through the aka operators Union torture tests nor did battlefield Las Vegas to the best of my knowledge ever converted it east of full-auto for use as rental guns it's not only just different in that it has an under folding stock and comes with the original hand guards the rivet pattern is totally different then on the fixed stock we have three rivets to here and went back here these are going to absorb recoil differently I've also read online that the military guns have a reinforced we were trained for grenade launching so that's just hearsay take it as you will I will say though people say oh the impacts only made for the civilian market it excuse me the the 1.0 mil receivers only made for the civilian market this is bump cos the 1.0 mil receiver has been used on a lot of select fire guns by the stava dating back to the early 70s they have a version of this called the m7 ta b1 it has the grenade sights it was meant for launching grenades and he this identicals receiver also they had a version of the m7 tb1 confusingly just call them 70 be one with the fixed stock that was the same and the m92 crank the aks you the shorty which came out much later uses this one point mill receiver so they did use this receiver that's that's that's provable so it wasn't just made for the American market but back to my point this would absorb recoil differently in the rear and the rear seems to be where the tests were showing some stress on the impact so really this gun would need to be tested separately I haven't read a mini impact DF owners having problems but then again there were far fewer of them out in the wild say ten to one compared to the fixed stock so who knows how many have been put at a high round count we certainly haven't put many rounds through this one under a thousand for sure so it's hard for me to say - but if you're you know the impact fixed stock isn't really representative of the Oh Pat fixed or the impact DF under fold in because they have radically different receivers and in this case trunnions so to really know how either of these would reform we have to have a separate test because they really are different guns but if you're gonna say the impact DF is questionable because of the aka operators Union test then you must also admit that the PAP is also questionable it's just one of those things because they're equally the same and different from the impact pic stock personally though just to conclude I wouldn't worry about it every guns gonna fail the only way to keep your gun from having wear is to never shoot it and that's not fun we we all know that washers can make it way up there ten twenty thirty fifty thousand rounds on the other hand I've seen guns washers that because they were lemons they had hidden flaws fail but five hundred rounds the truth is you don't really know how far done will make it until you actually shoot it that point you can extrapolate and guess but you really don't know to shoot your gun an ami gun any gun made could have a hidden flaw or it could be a hidden gem that'll run forever you just don't know but why worry about it these are not high-dollar guns they're five six hundred dollars if you shoot five thousand rounds through them you've already spent more in ammo than you did on the gun if it fails at ten or twenty thousand buy another one again they're not high-dollar they're not arsenal or you know definitive arms prices and it may not it probably won't honestly they're good guns but why worry all the over what might possibly happen if you have a five hundred dollar gun break I know that sucks but think about this every time the car breaks it probably cost you nearly that much and how often does that happen in your life or your hot water tank burst we have had that happen to ourselves twice and it definitely cost more than five hundred dollars each time to fix it and replace it mechanical things break I think the in PAP fixed or folder is a really good investment really good shooter really good gun for the money and the ones I've owned and the ones that I've asked my customers that have bought themselves all have good things to say I have no real bad first-hand experience aside from the recoil spring that was obviously too weak other than that good luck I just don't think worrying about what might possibly potentially maybe slightly might happen is really worth it certainly not worth avoiding a good gun while they're coming in now are these better than a Wasser I'm not saying that they're a different feature set and that's not what this video is about but these are my thoughts on the impact and this is why I still trust it I just haven't seen conclusive evidence that these things are subpar they might have an issue or two but let's be honest most economy guns do Wasser has had issues for years some of the Arsenal's have had known issues everyone can put out a lemon to keep that in mind well I just wanted to share this with you today it was at least interesting I'm not really telling you what to think I'm just saying maybe think about it analyze for yourself research for yourself what's going on with these don't just take you know two second Malheur is conclusive evidence really dig into these that's what I did and after doing it extensively I feel confident and I trust the Serbians estaba in pep and these are still coming in and I would still recommend them to a customer in fact I just ordered some more under folders last week if you have any questions or have your own impact stories please share them below if you liked the video please click if you haven't already subscribed couldn't do so that'd be great too appreciate your time and please tune in again for more hopefully unique and thought-provoking videos this is Misha we'll catch you then

Channel: Mishaco

Views: 89,297

Rating: 4.8559999 out of 5

Keywords: Educational, Historical, Documentary, Historic, History, Preservation, Documentation, Zastava, Zastava Arms, Yugo, Yugoslavia, Yugoslavian, Serbia, Serbian, AK, AK47, AK-47, M70, M70B1, M70AB1, M70AB2, PAP, PAP M70, NPAP, N-PAP, NPAP M70, NPAP-DF, N-PAP-DF, NPAP-DF M70, CAI, Century, import, review, good, bad, problem, problems, AKOU, AK Operators Union, test, thoughts, thinking, analysis, Battlefield Las Vegas, reliability, durability, avoid, buy, OPAP, O-PAP, OPAP M70, compare, comparison, WASR, WASR-10, WASR10, 7.62x39, underfolder

Id: aH-vdDDucdw

Length: 32min 54sec (1974 seconds)

Published: Tue Dec 05 2017