Worst Trucks to Buy Part 1

what is going on diesel Nation we're excited to have you guys with us today on the diesel podcast if you're watching this on YouTube and aren't subscribed make sure and click the Subscribe button turn on notifications like the video comment let us know what you think about it let us know if there's a question you'd like us to ask the guests maybe after the episode or get them back on or if you want to hear about a completely different topic we're always checking YouTube comments we love seeing your guys's opinions on topics things you guys are working on and what your direct experiences with products whether it's fuel additives turbos injectors Transmissions let us know we love hearing from you guys one of the most common questions that we get on the podcast from the very first one we released until now is what is the worst truck to buy and what's the best it's a very difficult topic to tackle because there's so many different sides of it whether we're focused on performance or what is you know has the best price value what has the most aftermarket support so today Vinnie from Leadfoot Diesel Performance is going to join me he's been in the industry for 15 plus years seen every every different angle of the industry from sales service maintenance repair everything and I wanted to ask him factually what does he see at the shop so this isn't about brand loyalty or which one can make the most power our focus is really a truck that you would keep stock or near stock just you know minor upgrades on something you daily Drive tow with and the criteria that we're going to use are one are there any inherent issues with the truck itself whether it's with the engine transmission turbos Electronics just something you would have to address if you purchased it second is going to be what's the aftermarket support like so if you do have issues or you do want upgrades or there is a failure and you want to go back in with better Parts how well is it supported in the aftermarket and then third is does the truck have the capability to make the horsepower and the torque numbers that you would need to tow um you know what a trailer weighs today if you have an active lifestyle you're always Towing hot shotting can the truck make enough power provide enough Creature Comforts that you would want to put tons of miles on it every year so I'm going to sit back ask him for his factual opinion I'll interject a little bit with my probably less factual but just my opinions on what I think is the best and have a great conversation so it's going to be a three-part podcast there's just too much information to put on one so we're gonna have three parts and really look forward to it before we get to it though I want to remind you guys our friends at Kershaw Knives have a 20 off-site wide code for you you just use code diesel 20 at Kershaw dot Kia usa.com you get 20 off site-wide they've got a ton of different knives for EDC Hunting Fishing and no matter what budget you have they've got some really cool stuff so if you're in the market check them out all right let's get to part one of chatting with Vinnie from Leadfoot Diesel Performance about what his opinion and factual experiences with the worst diesel truck to buy and the best Vinnie welcome back to the diesel podcast man how you doing this morning I'm doing good brother what you got going on out there I'm a little jealous of your background that uh that you got on this Saturday morning with the beautiful trees a little fire going behind you looks way better than what I'm looking at roosters are growing man I've been I've wanted to do this for a really long time and that is to like about four years ago we did an episode about the worst diesel trucks to buy and we went through each make and model and the gentleman that was on um owned a car or truck dealership and he was telling us just things that they saw I know a lot has changed over four years and your perspective is also a bit different because you've been in the industry for 15 plus years been working on them leaving longer than that they've seen all different sides of diesel from you know Parts owning them yourself service maintenance everything so I thought we would do like a three-part kind of podcast and go through what is the worst and the best Within each model and I'll just throw questions at you you know and ask and I thought what we would do you know it's kind of the you know the way we would approach it is you know which trucks have just inherent issues that no matter whether they were brand new or they're 10 or 15 or 20 years old somebody buys one they're gonna have to fix these things two would be what's the aftermarket support like so if you do have one of these trucks or maybe you have one of the best ones that we we name how easily can you get stuff and then third I thought to make it fair for new versus old is how much power can it make because I don't think you know truck owners wanted a 94 or 89 or 97 is the same as what we're accustomed to now in 2022 with what the new Power Stroke the high output is going to make 500 horse and 1200 foot pounds so I thought that would be kind of a loose you know sort of Judge of our opinions of what's the worst and best oh absolutely no I mean there's a there's a lot of good valid points in there too um I personally I kind of have the broad spectrum of those what you just mentioned I have a 97 Power Stroke I love it uh absolutely the best body style ever made I don't care what anybody says in the comments you're wrong um there's just nothing sexier than an OBS Ford and and at 11 years old working on a cattle ranch in Montana that's what I drove it was the first vehicle that I actually took out on the highway with a cattle trailer and took cows to auction in and so I've always wanted one uh for me it's not even it's more of a romantic relationship with my 97 I hate that piece of um you know if I pull up to a stop sign and I look left and I look right and there's somebody a mile down the road we sit there we wait you know I'm not going to ruin their day because I drive a piece of seven three so you know I love that truck and it's got a a romantic place in my heart but at the end of the day it's I don't know I've never had it on we did Dyno at one time with a bad lift pump it made 67 horsepower so I mean being fair with a tune and a SMB cold air intake that's that's one upgrade I do on every single truck I own is put an SMB intake on it and uh it might make 200 horsepower at the tires and I love it it's a great truck it's left me stranded like 12 times but I also have an o5 power stroke with a 6 liter in it and I never wanted a six liter I hated six liters I talked crap about six liters for 10 years of my life at least but at the end of the day it's affordable in a weird way like when you buy a six liter you don't go into it like I'm gonna buy the biggest piece of ever made and make it reliable for me it was the truck literally came in the shop and the customer brought it to us uh proactively he bought it at auction and uh brought it to us to do head gaskets on it and they weren't blown they didn't have any problems but he'd read about it online and I get this you know for a shop that does 70 trucks a week I deal in volume you know all my opinions are not opinions I don't even have opinions opinions are stupid ideal in facts so if I see seven threes coming in constantly with bad injectors and bad lift bumps and clogged up socks and the in-tank sending it those are problems those are issues that we fix every single day all the time that's just the 7-3 plague is the in-tank filter socks get clogged up it puts a lot of strain on the lift pump the lift pump starts to fail Stars the injectors for fuel now you got to do injectors those are facts those aren't opinions so if you own a 7-3 that's something you're going to run into at some point if you want to be proactive drop the tank every two years and clean the sending unit and you can avoid expensive injector repairs uh if you don't do that and you're lazy you're going to put injectors in your truck every 190 000 miles or what have you if you have a six liter someday the head gasket is going to blow and so people know this this is we're in a we're in an age of information you know the Internet is just brimming with information so I'm good and some bad and so a lot of people are already halfway educated when they bring their truck into the shop so my o5 power stroke came in to get head gaskets first thing we do when we start to do head gaskets is we run the truck through a full diagnostic procedure and we check injectors we check the turbo we check everything we can possibly check with IDs and then we go through and do a visual inspection we check brakes ball joints U joints everything you got a massive labor blanket when you're doing head gaskets so what we try to do as a shop is we try to give the customer everything and I'm up front with them and I'm honest with them I'm like hey ninety percent of what's on this estimate you don't need these are just observations we're just trying to be polite and helpful and fair with you if you want to repair these things while it's here repair them so we did that we ran through the truck and it was in good shape it ran great and uh the next step's draining fluids so we drained the oil and we drained the coolant well we drained the coolant we attempted to drain the oil and when we pulled the drain plug out of the oil pan nothing came out and the oil had literally solidified because the previous owner had never changed the oil apparently we don't really know the history of the truck so call the customer you know we're like hey the oil's solidified do you want us to keep going yes keep going so we start tearing down and we ended up pulling the engine out of the truck pulled the oil pan and there was a two inch thick rubber form of the oil pan that was at one time dinosaur bones and it it had started to eat the lifters it had started to eat and pitting into the cam so the truck ended up needing a motor for no other reason than neglect and you know the customer was kind of threw his hands up was like I'm done you know Uncle and so I got the truck for a really good deal because he didn't want to fix it and I put the money into it and fixed it so all in I got a 05 super duty fully loaded sunroof every Factory option you could get for 15 000 bucks with head studs so I drive a six liter now I never thought I would never planned on it made fun of those guys forever but to have a four-door long bed F350 pickup truck for 15 grand with leather and sunroof and every amenity I can want that's hard to beat I mean I can't go out and buy a brand new you know I I can't go out and buy a 2011 Lariat for 15 grand they're 50 still it's insane how well the six sevens are holding their values so you know me you've known me for well we meet on comp D probably in a new 0508 era I was a die-hard Cummins guy you couldn't tell me anything else now I got a seven three and a 6-0 power stroke set in my driveway so life in the Diesel Industry will do that you know it's it's not that I wanted them but I grew up poor and uh I live a pretty humble lifestyle still today and at the end of the day I gotta drive what's going to get me from point A to point B for the least amount of dollars possible and I put that money into that 6.07 years ago and it hasn't been in the shop since um that's hard to beat I mean it's been a very reliable platform trucks got 353 000 really trouble-free miles on it and uh I can't say that about my 7-3 I think a lot of a lot of enthusiasts you know when they're looking for something and like you mentioned it's easy to find information but who is giving the information it can be tough when you Google you know what's the best truck to buy or diesel truck to buy who's writing and how much experience I definitely don't have the most um you know I know I know what I had and my experience with it but I've never had my hands into an lb7 or a 7-3 power stroke or six liter or six four so I thought it'd be great to have you on and I thought for this first you know kind of part one is we would start with Ford power strokes and in well like you said you don't operate in opinions you operate in facts so what is what is the best one to to own and and I probably should clarify this in the start we're not talking about building a race truck or a street truck we're just talking about something point A to point B yeah man so the fun thing about doing these podcasts with you is I never know what you're going to throw on me so I inevitably started with power stroke without you even introducing this episode so you're welcome um so the hard you just hit a lot of points there in a very short time the internet's full of and happens when money's involved um I don't own Leadfoot diesel I'm just the idiot that answers the phones there so it does not behoove me to have a favorite it does not behoove me to take up for one brand versus the other that doesn't change my lifestyle at the end of the day it doesn't put food on my table all I have to do is answer the phone I'm not paid on commission so I don't care if you drive a Ford a Chevy or a Dodge you buy whatever your butt feels most comfortable in bring it to us and I'll tell you what's wrong with it or what could go wrong with it at the end of the day the simple fact is they're all garbage and that's why I have a job and that's why this podcast exists so right off the showroom floor being just perfectly blatantly honest I would have to say the six seven Power Stroke is probably the most reliable platform out there right now um 6r 140 Transmissions an amazing transmission we've pumped 800 plus horsepower through them can't kill them uh we did finally kill one with 1290 horsepower on a stock trans we broke the intermediate shaft um doing a four wheel drive boosted launch and so we had a I want to say Billet but I don't think it was Billet Suncoast made us a shaft we broke it a couple times found out that the Machining tolerances were too tight so that was kind of a manufacturing defect not a transmission defect but for that to be the weak Link at 1290 horsepower is insanity um I've been in this industry a long time you know you're not going to do that with a 48 re or a 47 or a year or a 68 rfe or an Allison you're just not going to do that it's not possible um so that's a really really badass transmission um I have seen bone stock trucks with transmission issues but every single time it's tuning and I hit I know the tuning guys are going to roll over out there and it's not tuning it's not tuning but take the tune off flash it back to stock with IDs put a stock transmission back in it at the same horsepower level I'll never see that customer again so it's tuning you're wrong um so that's been really frustrating to explain to customers because we are in a digital age where everybody's a superhero tuning guy on Facebook and then when their Tunes suck and it blows up the customer's motor or it destroys a customer's transmission the tuning guys the last guy to admit that it was his issue but at the end of the day if we can Flash it back to stock and get the tune out of the equation and the truck lives it's tuning and I I've seen these tuning guys just fall on their swords defending themselves but the facts are the facts if we take your shitty crappy tune that you did in your grandma's basement wearing your shitty dirty wife beater off the customer's truck and the truck lives your tuning is the problem and that's becoming the case more and more unfortunately because as we all know with the EPA getting involved in the Diesel Industry a lot of the really good tuning guys are going out the window and uh they're either no longer tuning trucks that have been tampered with or they're only doing emissions present tuning which is hard to make big Power with so we're left with a bunch of really really bad tuning coming into the shop and really weird issues that we've never experienced in the past 10 years uh with six seven power strokes so take the aftermarket out of the equation the six seven Power Stroke off the factory floor is a great platform it's very reliable it tows unlike anything I've ever towed with coming from many years of experience hot Shouting Out West with Cummins trucks and I thought they were bad and I daily to 800 horsepower five nine for seven years and it was pretty bad and the first time I towed a trailer over mon Eagle here in Tennessee with a six seven Power Stroke bone stock I was embarrassed I was really embarrassed that I'd spent the money I spent building a five nine to do the same thing that Ford accomplished out of the box with the six seven power stroke they're amazing how would you say the emission systems in the well I know what the 11 to 14 turbos on the six sevens those are kind of a known issue and I know the aftermarket stepped up with it but if someone's listening and they're looking for a Ford and a six seven probably one of the first things they're going to ask is wow you know has he seen any high mileage ones you know what kind of mileage are people getting out of it what do you see there with them so we have a lot of uh apparently Atlanta's the breeding ground for Hot Shot Truckers I've I've worked in five different diesel shops and three different states I've never seen the number of Hot Shot truckers that we have here at Leadfoot diesel in Georgia I mean it's ridiculous it's three a day and I'm not exaggerating three Hot Shot trucks a day coming to our parking lot whether they need repairs whether they've got questions it's three Hot Shot trucks a day that I talk to and um a lot of them are using the six seven power strokes Cummins I would say is the most popular and the and the repetitive fact that I hear from those guys is they're cheap and they are it's the cheapest truck you can buy you cannot walk out on the lot and buy a brand new Duramax or a brand new power stroke for what you can pay for a brand new Dodge they're cheap trucks uh the Cummins engine has a really good reputation over the span of 35 years um personally I'm not a huge fan of the six seven Cummins it's got a lot of problems we work on them constantly they come back they come back they come back uh as a guy in a shop comebacks suck comebacks mean somebody expects something for free and The Comebacks are not because we're not doing our due diligence that's what we're known for that's what we pride ourselves in is is studying the aftermarket studying the the factory platform what is the problem how do we fix it and on the six sevens there really aren't any even on the emissions side you take a bone stock six seven Cummins and you throw a triple Axel gooseneck trailer behind it and you hit the highways in the United States of America you're probably not going to be in a shop very much that truck you're using it for what it was meant for it's gonna the the emission system thrives on pressure and heat so if you're towing you've got both of those uh it can it can complete successfully the regen cycles that it needs to complete so guys that are out there working those trucks we don't work on them that's the God's honest truth the the six seven power strokes that we're working on is the guy that's commuting back and forth to the the office 10 miles one way 10 miles home again that's me um and so those trucks just can't live in that environment they don't ever get the pressure they don't ever get the heat they don't ever get the miles per hour to complete a regen cycle and they're going to have issues and that's not a Ford Chevy Dodge thing that's just the emission system thing um I don't care what you drive if you're babying your truck and you're taking it easy you're gonna have problems uh get out there and beat that thing if you're not Towing if you're not working it go out there and beat on it you know drive it like you stole it a couple times a week and do it for a period of 15 minutes or longer you're going to have issues with the emission system um I will say the one absolutely thing that Ford did to us and Dodge followed suit shortly behind them foreign fluid right next to the diesel fuel what the frick like why is that a good idea like why is that even a thing I cannot tell you how many thousands of trucks have come through our shop because the customer in a rush talking on the phone whatever the case may be they mixed them up and they put def in the tank that's going to destroy the injection system that's going to destroy potentially the engine um I've seen it all and uh I don't know why we're you know do the same thing and expect a different result that's the definition of insanity and here we are in 2022 and we still got the death nozzle sitting right next to the diesel nozzle somebody needs to get their dick cut off because they should not be breeding um that's a major issue and I think GM got it right and and screwed it up the most they put it under the hood but then they put this tank that hangs down below the frame rail and I've got construction workers ripping these things off left and right I mean I can't even you can't even keep them in stock because they're ripping these death Tanks off so often driving through ditches and stuff uh but that's a whole nother tangent for a whole nother episode but but I would say as far as the Florida missions go they're very reliable um I I think they sucked in 2003 to 2007 they really screwed it up in 08 to 10. but I think in 2011 they got it right I I hate deaf fluid as much as the next guy but these trucks that are running deaf get way better fuel economies than the trucks prior they were not running def um it's definitely eased up the Regeneration cycle on these trucks and uh for the most part it's pretty reliable at some point def doesn't have a very good shelf life unfortunately um I don't know what the timeline is because I'm not the the customer buying the stuff and putting it in their truck so I don't know if these people are buying the stuff and letting it sit on their garage shelf for six months and then putting in a truck at some point a six seven Power Stroke is going to come in needing a death sending unit uh it's the reductant heater assembly is as we've quoted out of the shop and uh 99 of the time is when those things have codes or issues you tear it down you pull it apart and it's got crystallized exhaust fluid in it and it's just it can't flow so I'd say that's your worst issue as a uh owner operator and to answer your question as far as mileage uh the highest mileage six seven that I've seen so far was a 2011 truck the guy deleted it right off the Bay right off the bat I mean he literally bought the truck deleted it the first time I saw it it had 75 000 miles on it we were just doing a service oil change fuel filters what have you and uh the next time I saw it was two so first time I saw it was 2012 13ish and it was an 11 model the next time I saw it was 2015 I had 575 000 miles on it wow I was pretty impressed I asked him what what have you had to do at this point he said oil changes and fuel filters the last time I saw it was 2017 and it had 880 000 miles on it same story uh we put a radiator in at that visit and it was just trickling out the end tank we put a radiator in it we put a factory intercooler in it the core had failed and and Old Change of fuel filters and I asked them again I said hey what have you had to do to this thing at this point he's like oil changes and fuel filters that's all and that customer hauls uh boats so his route he goes down to Florida and he hauls boats up to Illinois Minnesota Wisconsin up in that area and then he does a hot shot out to Oregon hauling campers out there from Illinois to Oregon and then back and then down so that's kind of his route Florida to the Midwest out west and then back down to Florida and I haven't seen that guy since 2017. I keep in touch with him I email them every now and then check up on them everything's going good I don't know what the current mileage is on the truck I'd have to assume it's probably over a million now um and he's bought another one you know he's got a 2017 2018 350 now that we've serviced a couple of times so that's been pretty impressive to see that truck work um that's not everybody that's not every day not everybody's gonna have that experience obviously um we got another high mileage truck that we do a lot of service for uh high-end hauls on Instagram if you guys want to check them out uh Rashad and uh his truck is named Brutus and that thing's been a beast um kind of the joke around the shop is every time his truck comes in needing a repair it's a p0911 code operator error um it's it's never been the truck's fault it's somebody driving you know with a blown intercooler boot for a thousand miles I mean you're gonna tear something up and then that's gonna happen whenever you put an employee in a truck they're not paying the payment they're not paying the repair bills they don't care that's just abuse so you know I think he's had a cracked cylinder head I think we've put a motor in it at this point but every time it's just been abuse it's just been negligence so you know things do happen um and I'm not defending the truck in any way I don't care at the end of the day I don't drive a six seven my wife does I drive a six so so but I I do I do think out of the big three Ford Chevy Dodge I think Ford has got the emission system figured out the best um they're only downfalls they don't get very good mileage so you know a six seven Power Stroke you're not gonna have a whole lot of problems with the emissions if you do it's because you're not driving the truck properly and and putting the pressure to it when you do have problems they are the cheapest to fix uh the Ford parts are way cheaper than the Dodge parts uh we covered that on the last episode that I did with you where I did some side-by-side comparison as far as like the cost of the DPF and the cost of the EGR valves and coolers and sensors Chrysler is insane like they're nuts their pricing is ridiculous um I had a Eco diesel in the shop this week and there's a mid-pipe between the catalytic converter and the diesel particulate filter and that little mid-pipe's like 18 inches long it's 770 dollars why it's just Chrysler's smoking crack when it comes to parts and prices Ford is massively affordable on their prices compared to Chrysler GM falls in the middle they're not they're nowhere near as expensive as Chrysler is but they're not as cheap as Ford when it comes to parts and and your viewers anybody watching this can go do a little research call a Ford dealership a Dodge dealership and a Chevy dealership and just ask for the price of a diesel particulate filter you'll have your answer in five minutes you know you'll know what I'm saying is true and Parts availability right now is the biggest nightmare for us because products don't exist yeah it's just insane yeah I think when I was thinking about that and this is from the outside looking in I don't drive one but I I do talk about it a lot with people and I thought what would be the best and this is just my opinion which is less factual than what you're saying but if I was gonna get if I was gonna get one it would be a six seven power stroke and it might one of the deciding factors for me would be the power level that it comes with stock and some of the amenities that you have on all newer trucks but specifically we're talking about Ford what's going to come on a 2017 or 2020 or 2015 versus a 99 a 97 a 94 you know an o5 and yes I you know I know that the aftermarket you can put in backup cameras and other things but just the quality of materials inside the The Styling at a certain at a point I know that appeals to people I definitely did with me the older I got before I was just like how much power can I make with this thing I don't care what brand it is but then I started to think how does it ride do I like how it looks how do I like the interior um what does it come with what uh you know what creature coverage does it have so I agree with you from a you know a little bit different perspective of just somebody observing it is I love the styling of them and from everything I've heard with doing podcasts is they're pretty reliable yeah you can have and this is necessarily Ford's fault it's not GM's or Rams either but the fuel quality and it affecting the cp4 can definitely be an issue there there are you know solutions that are out there for that but that would be the one that that I would pick and this kind of leads into why I didn't pick another one and I think we probably might maybe agree on this one but what is the worst power stroke or the one you would tell somebody do not buy this unless and it could be for a number of different reasons I don't think there's necessarily just one any of these trucks are going to have but in your opinion what's the worst one to get that's not even a there's zero contest there I mean a six four power stroke I love them I want one I want a standard cab two-wheel drive six four power strokes so bad I can't stand it they're nasty you throw a tune in take an exhaust on it you got a 590 horsepower truck um biggest piece of ever made hands down um what we see and and the series of events that takes place is the k-16 pump it just lives a horrible stressful life under extreme pressure I'm going to be perfectly honest and say I've never seen a CP3 fail on a five nine Cummins I've never seen a CP3 fail on a six seven Cummins uh CP3 has about 185 000 mile lifespan on a Duramax if we're being honest with ourselves um because it's starving for fuel it's trying to pull its own Supply and pressurize it and feed eight injectors instead of six and it's just a bad lifestyle for a CP3 easily fixed throw a fast on it if you own a Duramax and you don't have a fast you're an idiot um but a k16 on a 6-4 Power Stroke when it when a CP3 fails the the metal debris that comes out of that pump as it's eating itself alive goes back to the fuel tank and then it gets sucked up into the fuel filter and it stops there so worst case you're going to starve the injectors for fuel and you're going to throw a pump and injectors in an lb7 or an LBZ or an LLY or an lmm or whatever it's the same fuel system on a Duramax from 2001 to 2010. so that's just the facts so throw a fast on it you'll fix your issue on a 6-4 Power Stroke we cannot fix the issue because when the k16 fails that metal debris goes forward it goes through the injectors and so you've contaminated the rails you've contaminated the fuel injectors you've contaminated the sensors pressure regulator everything's full of metal when the k16 fails and when it fails you know you got a fuel system operating at 27 000 plus PSI you hang an injector open with a little bit of metal debris in it and you just cut the Pistons in half so how do you fix that well if we're looking at it from the aftermarket world you go find somebody that's redesigned the fuel injection pump and come out with a better solution and beings that it's only a a two-year run really a one-year run manufacturing wise for the six fours there's no aftermarket support for that problem so the best we can do is throw a fast on it cross our fingers and say our prayers every day and when it blows up it's twenty thousand dollars so I've got one at the shop right now we put an engine in it in 2013 a long block from Ford so that's off the top of my head I think 15-6 back then was the price tag uh 2017 we put an engine in it again and it's a specialized truck and that's the only reason the customer can justify doing this three times it's a Paving Company and so the truck's got a specialized bed with a hopper on the back that I don't know exactly what it does I guess I haven't paid that much attention to it I just know it's a greasy mess and it stinks when we have it in the shop but I have to assume that it's spraying tar or something on the asphalt as they go down the road so it's probably 125 000 rig brand new and it's probably 125 000 rig to replace it so to put a 20 000 engine in it every three to five years I guess makes sense for them not for me I'd swap the bed over to six seven and be done with the thing but uh it's at the shop now for its third engine and uh this last engine only has 10 000 miles on it it's unfortunately out of warranty time wise we always use OEM Ford engines in that application because they got a really great two-year unlimited mileage warranty on them and they pay for labor as well so we tried to do what's best for the customer in that situation but at the end of the day six four is the biggest piece of ever made and that I'll say that confidently with Ford Chevy and Dodge uh that is one diesel that I don't care to ever own one unless it's just a stupid good deal like if I could pick one up for twenty five hundred dollars and beat the balls out of it for five to ten years great when the engine blows up it's going to scrap like I'm not gonna put money in it it's really interesting is when you think back to different time periods and this is by doing this episode is so I guess to be helpful for a lot of people is you remember when the six fours came out and it's like every Power Stroke Enthusiast was excited because the six liter was going away here's this brand new truck The Styling was on point the Interiors were really cool it made all this power it had this you know cool turbo setup and there was like you mentioned it's just like a tune and some other you know parts here's 590 600 horsepower stock transmission 6-0 sucks six seven Power Stroke sucks lmm suck and we look back what 10 years 12 years later and it's reversed itself yeah but you know I know they have a lot of aftermarket support with engines and other things that that are done but it's one of the hardest questions I I ever get is somebody say hey I listen to the podcast I want to get a diesel truck I found a great deal on the 6-4 what do you think and I'm like Ron I'm like go listen to the police episodes because it can be okay it cannot be okay but I know it costs a lot of money to fix it and I I agreed with you and I was thinking about this and it it pained me a little bit because that there's two trucks that when I look at them it just like hits me in my soul that's one of them as far as just the appearance catching my eye but I don't know if I'd want to spend the money on a long block of short block as often as they may go out and and it's just it's tough but it had so many cool things you know it had that sequential turbo set up it had the great power it had ability to make Power really easy with just a tune and it's just it's tough it is and it's it's frustrating because I know the potentials out there I know there's people smart enough I I one guy that comes to mind Zane Kosh from H S Motorsports I know for a fact that man could fix the k-16 issue but talking to him doesn't make any sense to put the r d out there to build a pump or do a CP3 conversion or whatever the solution may be it just doesn't make sense you're going to have a couple hundred thousand dollars in r d maybe more to to figure all that out and you got a truck that was manufactured for 12 months it just doesn't at the end of the day it's never going to happen nobody's going to make that investment there's not enough passion on the planet for somebody to lose a quarter of a million bucks and never get it back and that's the facts you know if we're dealing in facts and not opinions here that's the facts there's no reason to put the money in to make a 6-4 reliable when the patterns are clear it's 150 000 mile motor there's some unicorns out there that go farther I've seen them I got a customer that holds Kentucky Derby race horses first time I saw his 6'4 come in the shop it had 385 000 on it complete freaking unicorn I mean the guys out there Towing every single day with it it never gets unhooked from a trailer it's a four-door long bed single rear wheel beautiful truck like you said you see you see a 6'4 going on the road you're like damn that's a good looking truck I could drive that oh yeah you know especially getting to like the Harley Davidson editions with the interior I would love to have that truck I remember seeing Mike corsilli 6'4 that navy blue truck that did PPC and I saw it in person they were all lined up and getting detailed and I walk out there and I'm like I've seen a ton of third gen to seen a ton it oh my God look at this thing like it was just oh it caught my attention but my pants are getting tight yeah I know he sold it and you know kind of moved on but I told him when he was on the podcast years ago man that thing when this series is done people will know the two trucks that that do that to me that's definitely one of them um now I know there's going to be guys out there that are listening they're like well he didn't say the 7-3 what do they think about 7-3 or the IDI or the OBS and yeah I think there's two reasons I didn't pick it as the best or I don't think they're the worst but I think about the power levels and the aftermarket support to reach it and you know right now or here in the future you're going to be able to get 500 horsepower 1200 foot-pounds a torque six seven Power Stroke with every Bill and whistle out there and the the towing ratings are insane on them and I think it does that for an active lifestyle would that work I think as a commuter truck something to drive every day it would be great probably last forever but they're older and I think finding a clean one and having to go through it all is is kind of tough but you know you own them you have owned them what do you think about the uh the seven threes I mean that was my first new truck was a 99-7-3 and I loved it and uh I bought it through at the time I was working for a Timber framing log home company out in Montana so I bought it through our Fleet account with the company so I got a great deal on it you know stripped down base model roll up Windows manual transmission it was a great truck through a Super Chips tuner on it through a cold air intake on it and a mbrp exhaust and it was a I mean at 16 17 years old you couldn't tell me that there was anything faster on the planet I thought it was the greatest thing ever made um traded it in the next December and bought a 2000 and traded it in the next December and bought a 01 and I did that every year because we were putting 100 000 miles a year on these trucks you know we were building houses in Montana and then we're hauling those houses to Vail Colorado Aspen Colorado Jackson Hole Wyoming Lake Tahoe Nevada I mean all of our jobs were on ski resort towns basically and so they were great drugs I I loved them yeah I didn't I didn't keep them long enough to have any problems with them you know as soon as the factory warranty was up I was trading it in so my early years of the 7-3 were fantastic and uh it wasn't until years later when I kind of my father-in-law passed away and left me a 12 valve Cummins and I kind of got bit pretty hard by the Cummins bug it was simple it was a very uh easy to work on engine for the most part you know doing injectors in a seven three is a five hour job doing injectors in a 12 hours 12 valves like 45 minutes so I got a little spoiled with the Cummins and I kind of went down that come and rabbit hole for 10 years and uh that's when I met you and that's when I met Clint from ATS and uh Brady from industrial and some really just super amazing people in the industry and it was just an easy platform to make Power with and seven three is not uh I had a good friend in Washington state that was trying to make 550 and we didn't I'm not going to say we knew what we were doing back then we were a couple young guys you know around in the driveway bolting on Parts trying different things uh we were sucked into the forums and everybody's forums are absolutely terrible places for information because you're all you're getting is opinions and opinions we all know what those are like and so we were just shotgunning Parts into this guy's 7-3 to try and make power and we eventually made 550 horsepower but sitting around the bonfires on Friday night you know he didn't have a leg to stand on because he spent forty thousand dollars to achieve that and I got a five nine Cummins sitting in the driveway that I maybe had 10 grand in making eight and a quarter so the the money and horsepower spectrum is so vast on seven three it just doesn't make sense it's it's it's not a if you want to make Power with your seven three do it have fun with it love it enjoy it um we do it every day I mean we got great customers that are making five six hundred horsepower to their seven threes and they love them and we love doing it for them but being an honest man at the end of the day you feel a little guilty you feel a little sorry for him it's like good Lord you just spent like all right that's a down payment on a house and 100 acres like God like and you're only making 550 like that's embarrassing and you feel bad for them I have a seven three it's got an SMB intake on it and a Hydra tuner from Power hungry performance done I'm not spending any more money on that truck it's slow as balls it's got a South Bend dual disc clutch in it it's never going to be fast and I'm fine with that yeah I love that truck I'll drive it till the day I die I hope uh my kids are driving it learning to drive a manual now they're 13 15 years old it's a great truck I love that truck I'm never going to try to make Power with it it's a giant piece of when it comes to horsepower um if I'm gonna put money into something to make horsepower I'll put money into my 6-0 um I'm not really interested in that anymore if I was really going to make power right now I'd go buy me a five nine Cummins uh 12 out of 24 valve early 030405 if I'm gonna make Power that's what I'm going to fall back on uh you know I just I I love the five nine Cummins it's an easy engine to work on it's easy to make Power with it's affordable to own um and they don't have a lot of problems so a 7-3 to me is a point A to point B vehicle it's a utilitarian vehicle it's you own a farm you own a ranch you own a construction company buy them they're great trucks they live forever they don't have a lot of problems keep a cam sensor under the seat enjoy the hell out of it but it's not going to be a Powerhouse and if you do want to make Power with it you're going to spend stupid money to do so there's guys out there pee pumping them and doing ported and Polished heads and that good for them innovators doing something nobody else has ever done you guys are awesome not my cup of tea I think there's going to be a couple different types of people that listen to this episode there's going to be you know what my my real goal with it was was to be able to have a source that someone who doesn't own one of these trucks can come in and listen to it and say okay I think I think I've narrowed it down to a couple year ranges or I'm I'm set on a 6-0 it meets my budget I know what I have to do with it and then there's going to be the Enthusiast and I mean I love hearing from these guys that have a 7-3 OBS and they're trying to crank 7 800 900 horsepower out of or you know a six liter or the six fours and so yeah I think our discussion I probably should have said this at the start we're not necessarily saying if you're doing this with your truck your way you know don't do it it's it's not worth it but it's really for somebody who doesn't know and I find that maybe not so much in diesel trucks but other things that I'm interested in where do I find the information like I'll go into Google and type in you know what's the best XYZ and I get a whole bunch of articles that I know are written by people who are paid by the company to write the article and I'm like I just want somebody's opinion who you know this isn't sponsored content you know if Ford's not paying you to be on here or paying me to do the episode what do we see what should we look for so I think you really highlighted all of that for somebody who you know is is a Ford guy or gal wants to get into a diesel truck what should they look for um what should they be prepared for if they maybe just got it maybe they already are in that 6'4 or that six liter or that seven three or that six seven Power Stroke to know hey I might need to do this or you know what are some things I should do so I appreciate you sharing you know the knowledge on that and uh well that's that's one thing I want to highlight you know I read the comments on all these episodes and I get emails every time somebody comments back and it's it's fun I enjoy the hell out of it I love your viewers they're great commentators and and you've got The Good the Bad and the Ugly and they're all wonderful people but you know at the end of the day my paycheck does not change no matter what somebody spends at our shop um 99 of the people commenting on your videos and these episodes that we do don't buy anything from me and I'm fine with that I'm happy about that um again I don't get paid on commission so if you know I have been inundated with emails and Facebook messages since our last episode about water methanol injection I've answered all of them hundreds maybe thousands of emails and Facebook messages and I have not sold any water methanol kits so that that's a point that I want to make is I want people to reach out I want the messages I want to answer questions I want to help we all work our asses off and and we spend our hard-earned money 99 of the time just to make these trucks reliable and uh I appreciate those messages and I want you guys to to message myself and Patrick or whoever but uh I will always tell you the truth and it's never going to be monetized I don't get paid to tell you why this or buy that I'm not a commission based salesperson I'm not a Salesman at all I'm just an idiot answering the phone um so you know that's it takes the out of the conversation when you don't get paid commission and and that's huge I will never accept a position where I can benefit personally from selling somebody something I think that's when you turn a a good honest person into a liar yeah and and I grew up way too poor to be a Ford Chevy Dodge guy I don't care at the end of the day you know we grew up you drive whatever gets you to work and work your ass off and hope it doesn't break down so you know I I drove Fords in the beginning because it was convenient for me to purchase a brand new vehicle through our company's Fleet account I ended up driving Dodges because one was left to me and somebody's will uh it wasn't something I wanted it wasn't something I purchased it was something I was gifted and I had to make the best of it so you know all my diesel experience is based off of of convenience and what's affordable and that's how I look at every customer that walks through the door how can I take the best care of this guy get them into the correct Parts whether it be stock or aftermarket you know if we're doing wheel bearings I'm going to stick with the OEM it's got the best warranty if I'm if I'm dealing with tie rod ends and and steering Knuckles I'm gonna go with move lifetime warranty um if it's a 6-0 power stroke having issues of any kind I'm going to go with bulletproof diesel because they make great Innovative products that solve Factory issues so there's a myriad of answers to questions out there I try to base mine off of facts and and who's put the money into the r d you know what company has found a factory problem and come up with an aftermarket solution and uh you know as we cover other makes and models through this series there's a lot of really great Parts out there that I'm going to discuss and uh try to help your viewers with and and hopefully save a whole bunch of people a whole bunch of money that's at the end of the day that's the focus of this podcast is educate people and take the factor out of it you know there's so many salesmen out there that are just blowing smoke up your ass to try and take as many dollars out of your pocket as they possibly can I don't think you are iron that guy because we don't stand to make a dime off this stuff we're just putting good information out there I hope exactly yeah I mentioned that on a on a podcast once is um you know somebody had asked you know why do we do the podcast or you know something like that and it's really being able to you know kind of help people and guide them and I don't have a website I don't sell parts so if you want to name drop people and I don't I don't sell it's not like I say oh don't say that because I don't make the margins on it say this place like I it doesn't matter to me but what does matter is you know when someone listens this and says any of these episodes and says hey I actually learned a lot help me with a purchase or I change careers or I started my own shop or um hey I just made this power number you know I loved hearing what this person had to say or they inspired me so that's what uh you know I sing with this this series is you were the first one that popped into my mind to do it and we got part two and part three to still do so um yeah we we got a lot to cover but I appreciate the Ford insights I learned a lot I've never owned a Ford power stroke they're always on my radar and so I know what to expect if I'm looking for one and and I'm sure our listeners you know will as well so I appreciate your time chatting about uh this and we'll continue on with a part two here shortly sounds good man don't forget diesel fans stay tuned for part two this is going to be a three-part Series where we go through different trucks and I ask Vinnie what his professional experience has been from a factual standpoint what he sees as far as patterns with the trucks that are most problematic and the ones that are and just seem to really serve the owners well so if you liked part one definitely turn in to episode two I want to remind you guys we have a code from our friends over at Kershaw Knives it's diesel 20. you get 20 off at kershaw.kia usa.com they got a lot of cool knives really to meet any budget so if you need something for hunting fishing or EDC and are in the market definitely check them out I want to give a shout out to a couple of our patreon supporters Tyler Lowe in a 23 diesel Caleb all of our patreon supporters all of you on YouTube Discord subscribe to us on podcast apps we love hearing from you guys we love seeing what you guys are working on so if you have an idea for a podcast a guest a topic you want covered make sure and drop us a message on Instagram Facebook you can email me lasted info to dspodcast.com or comment on YouTube we're always checking messages there until next time keep the shiny side up [Music] [Music] [Music]

Channel: The Diesel Podcast

Views: 47,552

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Id: uqsEwoVo9GQ

Length: 54min 34sec (3274 seconds)

Published: Mon Oct 31 2022