Trevor Noah Talks Race and Identity In America | Get With The Times

good evening everyone I'm Megan Kay safer with the New York Times and I'm so pleased to welcome you to get with the times our new live event series for college students tonight we're live from Northwestern where Jarnell ago and Trevor Noah will join us for a conversation around race and identity in America today Jarnell ago is a new york times national correspondent who covers america's issues with race among other important topics he also happens to be a northwestern alum Trevor Noah someone who needs no introduction is an author a comedian and host of the award-winning The Daily Show on Comedy Central his first book born a crime stories from a South African childhood was an instant New York Times bestseller we're delighted to share that tonight the New York Times is streaming this event to students who are hosting watch parties on college campuses across the country you'll hear from some of them later this evening please join me in giving a warm welcome to John el ago and Trevor Noah [Applause] good evening everyone good evening thank you all so much for joining us and we're really excited to have Trevor here we got talking race and identity which is like we can talk probably about four hours for it but I don't think you have time for that's a really simple subject but before we start I want to thank you all joining us at Northwestern University here the finest institution in the country perhaps the world and I'd like to thank everyone watching live on facebook on nytimes.com we thank you for joining us well we have a very riveting conversation here but before we get started I want to let everyone know all the college students watching we do want to hear back from you we want this to be interactive so we want to hear from you stories of how you have experienced race and ethnicity on your college campuses we want you to send an email to on campus at nytimes.com and we might publish some of those on our website so please you can find that email address on the Facebook page but it's on campus at nytimes.com and please you know we do want to hear your stories and hear how this topic relates to your lives but before we start I think Trevor wrote a very excellent autobiography here born a crime but New York Times bestseller and I believe we're gonna start with you reading a short passage from it you'd like me to read a passage yes please oh Lord there's a school all over the game all right this will be from the chapter entitled chameleon as apartheid was coming to an end South Africa's elite private schools started accepting children of all colors my mother's company offered bursaries scholarships for underprivileged families and she managed to get me into a school called Maryville College an expensive private Catholic school classes were taught by nuns Mass on Fridays the whole bits I started preschool there when I was three years old primary school when I was five in my class we had all kinds of kids black kids white kids Indian kids colored kids most of the white kids were pretty well-off every child of color pretty much wasn't but because of scholarships we all sat at the same table we wore the same maroon blazers the same gray slacks and skirts we all had the same books we had the same teachers there was no racial operation every click was racially mixed kids still got teased and bullied but it was over usual kid stuff you know being fat so being skinny being told of being short being smart or being dumb I don't remember anyone being teased about their race I didn't learn to put limits on what I was supposed to like or not like I had a wide berth to explore myself I had crushes on white girls I had crushes on black girls nobody asked me what I was I was Trevor it was a wonderful experience to have but the downside was that it sheltered me from reality you see Maryville wasn't oasis that kept me from the truth a comfortable place where I could avoid making a tough decision but the real world doesn't go away racism exists people are getting hurt and just because it's not happening to you doesn't mean it's not happening and at some point you have to choose black or white pick a side you can try to hide from it you can say oh I don't pick sides but at some point life will force you to pick a side at the end of grade six I left Maryville to go to H a jack primary a government school I had to take an aptitude test before I starts it and based on the results of the test the school counselor told me you're going to be in the smart classes the eight classes I showed up for the first day of school went to my classroom and of the 30 or so kids in my class almost all of them were white there was one Indian kid maybe one or two black kids and me then recess came we went out onto the playground and black kids were everywhere it was an ocean of black like someone had opened the tap and all the black had come pouring out I was like where were they all hiding the white kids I'd met that morning they went in one direction the black kids went in another direction and I was never standing in the middle totally confused were we going to meet up later on I did not understand what was happening I was 11 years old and it was like I was seeing my country for the first time in the townships you don't see segregation because everyone is black in the white world any time my mother took me to a white church we were the only black people there and my mom didn't separate herself from anyone she didn't care she'd go right up and sit with the white people and at Maryville the kids were mixed up and hanging out together before that day I had never seen people being together and yet not together occupying the same space you're choosing not to associate with each other in any way in an instance I could see I could feel how the boundaries were drawn groups moved in color patterns across the yard up the stairs down the hall it was insane I looked over at the white kids I'd met that morning ten minutes earlier I thought I was a school I was at a school where they were the majority now I realized how few of them they were compared to everyone else I stood there awkwardly by myself in no-man's land in the middle of the playground luckily I was rescued by the Indian kid from my class a guy named CSUN pillai CSUN was one of the few indian kids in school so he noticed me another obvious outsider right away he ran over to introduce himself hello fellow anomaly you're in my class who are you what's your story we started talking and we hits it off he took me under his wing The Artful Dodger to my bewildered Oliver throughout conversation he came up that I spoke several African languages and Thiessen thought a colored kid speaking black languages was the most amazing party trick he brought me over to a group of black kids say something he told him and he'll show you he understands you one kid said something in Zulu and I replied to him in Zulu everyone cheered another kid said something in pasa and I replied in Casa everyone cheered for the rest of recess Thiessen took me around to different black kids on the playground show them your trick do your language thing the black kids were fascinated in South Africa back then it wasn't common to find a white person or a colored person who spoke African languages during apartheid white people were always taught that those languages were beneath them so the fact that I didn't speak though the fact that I did speak African languages immediately endeared me to the black kids how come you speak our languages they asked because I'm black I said like you you're not black yes I am no you're not have you seen yourself they were confused at first because of my color they they thought I was a colored person but speaking the same languages meant that I belonged to their tribe it just took them a moment to figure it out it took me a moment to at some point I turned to one of them and said hey how come I don't see you guys in any of my classes it turned out they were in the B classes which also happened to be the black classes that same afternoon I went back to the eight classes and by the end of the day I realized that they weren't for me suddenly I knew who my people were and I wanted to be with them I went to see the school counselor I'd like to switch over I told her I'd like to go to the B classes she was confused oh no she said I don't think you want to do that why not because those kids are you know should know I don't know what do you what do you mean look she said you're a smart kid you don't want to be in that class I said but on the class is the same English is English math is math yeah but that plus is you know those kids are gonna hold you back you want to be in the smart class I said but surely there must be some kids and the B class who are smart no they aren't I said but all my friends are there you don't want to be friends with those kids yes I do we went back and forth finally she gave me a stern warning you do realize the effect this will have on your future you do understand what you're giving up this will impact the opportunities you'll have open to you for the rest of your life I'll take that chance I moved to the B classes with the black kids I decided I'd rather be held back with people I liked then move ahead with people I didn't know being at a change AK made me realize I was black before that recess I'd never had to choose but when I was forced to choose I chose black the world saw me as colored but I didn't spend my life looking at myself I spent my life looking at other people around me I saw myself as the people around me and the people around me were black my cousins are black my mom is black my gran is black I grew up black because I had a white father because I've been in white son school I got along with the white kids but I didn't belong with the white kids I wasn't part of their tribe but the black kids embraced me come along they said you're rolling with us with the black kids I wasn't constantly trying to be with the black kids I just was thank you for that so much I want to talk about the phrase pick a team because as I as I read through your autobiography I think that was a theme that I got to sense throughout your entire life the choices you make and how they lead to your identity whether it be hanging out in the township and Alex whether it be when you had to go to the jail holding cell and you had the group saw the Indians in one corner covered people in another corner you come to America now what team have you picked here coming to America was an easy choice for me because I always identified and aspired to black American you know I remember growing up in the townships and we were poor and you knew that you didn't have but one of the first experiences I had of seeing somebody glorify the nothingness of the world they had was black Americans that was the first time when the hood was something that was cool it was the first time when people actually seemed like they had an ownership of this identity as opposed to it being thrust upon them you know and I understand the complexities of difference you know when you get here but from the time I was a young young man I I thought to myself was like oh I I want to be a part of that culture that's that's something that I I can identify with that's something I wish to join and so coming to America I didn't get to choose before people told me they were just like oh you're black and I was like oh I was gonna choose black anyway but yeah whatever yeah is it almost easier here cuz I mean you talk about you know growing up it seemed like you were in some ways like a mutt I mean you you had to kind of figure out where you fell you had you know a Swiss father right African mother how were you able to navigate is it easier here - almost identify with what you are I think it's easier and it's more difficult at the same time so for those who don't know in apartheid South Africa the system was set up to specific separate people by race and when I say specifically I mean it was very precise so unlike America where you have a one drop rule you know in South Africa apart sides separated people by the finest detail in their skin by your hair so it wasn't just black and whites it was black and white and Indian and colored and and so those things separated you so you had some families where if a dad was just slightly darker than his kids then that dad would have to live in the different areas of the children the children could go to a better school then maybe their dad could go to and then the mom might be very lights and she would be considered white and and this was a completely strange world for many people so it wasn't just black or white you know coming to America though it's very much black or whites but then you deal with the complexities of colorism and class and and a whole different identity that comes about especially when when you come from Africa there's there's a whole different story that you have as an immigrant so the race side of it is simple and then you get into the complexities of how you interpret what is happening to you because of your race when I was over in South Africa I did a story on Lindy beam as a bucco she used to be the head of the opposition party there and she was a sumo woman but she was a bit fair-skinned and kind of a narrative around her because she was not with the with the ruling party with the ANSI was is she black enough and I'm like it's for my American audience I'm like she's a woman named Wendy Lee who speaks Zulu I mean this is like as black as you can get so I'm just kind of curious you know being a fair skinned person over here how is your credibility as being like a man from Africa do people here see you as an African man and then does that bring with it a certain type of credibility about blackness that maybe you would otherwise wouldn't have I I don't know it always varies you know I can only answer that question you know with regards to the people I've met you know some people have an idea of me before they meet me as a person and you know when engaging in competent in conversation then you start to realize what you do or don't have in common what you you know like for instance I've found a lot of the cultural experiences I have coming from Africa are very similar to what many black Americans and the South experienced you know in the way you're brought up culturally in the ideas that you have in the ways that you address an older in the way you're raised within a black family and changes everywhere you go the one thing I always found was black Americans were really quick and warm you know in terms of welcoming welcoming me as a person who once they found out I was from Africa like when I when I first lived in LA that was my nickname in all the comedy clubs no one bothered to learn my name the guys at the door would just be like ayo it's Africa come on in Africa and I was like yeah I mean this countries as well but whatever like you know cuz I was like what if another guy comes like then are you gonna go Africa whenever it gets you just give us the countries you know but i but i but i took it as a it was it's it's affection it's it's it's a it's people in many ways seeking to connect with something that they know I guess takes them back to to a story that was stolen from them you know I've had many people coming up to me going like hey man which which part of Africa do you think I'm from and and tell me about Africa and what's it like in this place and I go like well I haven't traveled all of it but these are the stories I know these are the places I've been these are the people I've seen but but for the most part I would say I have felt welcome I have felt like you know being African adds something to the experience that I have with African Americans you mention of colorism a little bit and how would you in America we talk sometimes about you know light-skinned privilege a little bit and and I assume you experienced that as well in South African you talk about that experience in South Africa versus you know how does it compare to here oh I think it's very similar actually you know that's you know that's one of the vestages of racism is your your color although you may still be in the same boat of being oppressed your colour would move you up a few rungs on the ladder of oppression and that's something you can't deny you know I know that having my skintone may get me a few a few sentences further in a conversation than maybe someone who is darker than me would get and that that was common in South Africa because in South Africa I wouldn't be labeled as black people who say I'm coloured you know what was strange for me is growing up I didn't grow up colored at all colored in South Africa is not just your skin tone it's a culture it's a culture of people who have an identity have their own dialect within a language have you know a food a tradition a way of living and it's beautiful and they've created something from a very dark past but that's not how I grew up you know and then so I never shunned it I was like if you want to call me colored call me colored I understand why but I always say I'm colored by by by color but not by culture because the only reality I knew was growing up in a tosser household from my grandmother - my mom - my aunt it was a matriarchal house that that you know defined how I lived so I did experience that at times where people would go oh you're not you're not black like the rest of them that's what they would say sometimes in South Africa they'd be like oh you're not like the rest of them auu one of the good ones that's what they would say and and so you you you came you know you you come to realize in life you go like oh I I see this I see how people feel like they can team up with you against people who you actually see as your team because they think that you're willing to step away from it it's really interesting do they do that based off skin tone because I feel like that happens here a lot like people know you know I'm a New York Times reporter from a black person who's a bank or they go yeah you're you're not like the rest right no you're not one of them is it based strictly on like do they look at skin tone there's that how they figure it out or I don't know I'm sure there's multiple factors you know I found in my life it's it's it could be it could be multiple things sometimes it's my skin tone sometimes it's my accent you know I'll have people speech me and all of a sudden it's like oh wow you speak really well yeah and I'm like yeah I studied English in school right you don't mean we were colonized by the British I but but I I I understand it you know fundamentally because you you know it goes it goes back to language in many ways and that is people have been programmed to to identify language and the way people use language with who they are or what people believe they are and so depending on how I speak depending on where people see me and how they seem it could even be how I wear my hair that could determine how people you know conversate with me or how they treat me all the time I believed you had cornrows is that I did yeah I did that is a very unfortunate time I don't think it was involved in that is necessary to bring that up I think I've gone through enough pain in my life that's not yeah no I did I had to add cornrows for a very long time jagged edge inspired my hair I think you should go back to that well I want to go back something you said you mentioned um you'd always aspire to American black culture I think you know when when you first renamed to host of The Daily Show you know everyone calls and looks up your entire history and some black Americans were critical of um kind of your comedy as a goal raised where black Americans they they said you either played on negative stereotypes or you questioned their on test authenticity as people of African descent um you know I want to get back to you I will get eventually get to the root of that comedy but I want to ask you as as as someone who was living in South Africa what and your what was your perception of black Americans and how has it changed over time living here now wow that's interesting growing up in South Africa my perception of black Americans was always it was a perception that was created by movies and TV and music and music played a big role in that you know I I always saw these people who were they were just the coolest cool that you could imagine it was everything from watching boys in the hood to to to you know the sitcom Martin to you know whether it was Tupac and Biggie and you know and puff you were watching these these these people these black people who existed in a way that I had never seen before they they seemed to command respect in their world beyond just who they were but also like how they made people around them feel and seem like it was there was a coolness attached to what they were doing that that that was really powerful and I mean there's the that's one of the reasons that it permeated South Africa I know I wasn't the only young black person growing up in South Africa who identified with this you like that's that's that's a piece of me I can be that you know I can be that guy driving the Benz I can be that guy you know living in a mansion I can be that guy living a great life wearing gold chains like that was it was aspirational you know it was aspirational beyond the circumstances that the people found themselves in and so that was my identity it was one that was limited and it was stereotypical of 1x perience and that's all I knew and that was all I needed to know in a way and what was the perception of black Americans in terms of like I guess their connection to to Africa cuz I remember my first time I went to Africa was in South Africa a couple years ago and when I arrived I guess I'd literally want expect kiss the ground like everyone from the Diaspora it's like you go to Africa and it's like oh I'm home you know it feels like but you know quickly as I walked her out as people saw me I could quickly tell that I you know they could tell right away that I was not you know from the continents from I'm curiously as far as the authenticity of black people to the to Africa I mean what did you make of that I guess well I think the mistake I made early on and it's one that I was always bound to make because I had no direct information was I didn't understand why black Americans would aspire to to to Africa I didn't understand why black Americans were like yo the motherland I gots to get out there you know I didn't understand that I was like what but why so you guys are living an amazing life you were in timberlands and you driving G wagons why would you want to come here like I honestly didn't understand it so in many ways I I know I wasn't the only African way I found it hilarious I was like this is it's it's funny because you don't realize how many black Americans have been robbed of a place they believe is their home and the culture and the story you take that for granted you know I come from a place where I can rattle off the history of my family without flinching I I can tell you about my ancestors I can tell you about my culture I can tell you why I do certain things because of the blood that is within me you know and that's something that you don't ever think of I never thought of that and so whenever we would hear that you know as myself and my friends we'd hear black Americans saying that'll they've come and they'd be like oh man I'm gonna kiss the ground I'm home baby I'm home and you'd be like this is the funniest thing I've ever seen in my life and then you understand beneath that funny the pain that's attached to it and then you understand why people want to connect with the story because they've been robbed of that story you know and and as you learn and as you read through the history of slavery and America and and the slave trade as a whole you come to realize how much you took for granted something that you never even thought of as privilege and that is knowing your story I want to talk a little bit about you know that approach to comedy and talk about you know it's a very divisive time to say the least especially with I'm sort of issues of race talk about humor and how do you use that to maybe balance it out balance the playing field a little bit well it's it's trial and error you know comedy is is is one of those formats where it's all about context you know I always say to people I go a joke is always limited to the relationship you have with your audience it doesn't matter if you're a comedian or just somebody telling a joke to your friend the connection and the context you have the relationship is what provides all of the context you can say something to a friend of yours that if overheard people would would you know would reel in horror but your friend maybe shares the context with you and that that grows with an audience as well you know if you have an audience that grows with you in comedy clubs and starts doing shows with you you know as I had in South Africa you you start to grow a relationship you know going back to your previous question it's what happened to me in America when I first came to the United States the the rooms where I was given the most time and the rooms where I was most welcomed were the urban rooms right and and that's where you know I'd be doing shows like chocolate sundaes in LA you know I would be going out and I'll be performing you know in Baltimore I'll be doing shows that were predominantly black and so I found my relationship to the audience was one that was contextualized by my perception of african-americans and their perception of Africa and I played within that world and I played with those stereotypes breaking them down turning them on the head you know you know twisting it around the mistake I made and the one thing I regrets it over time was I took for granted how that comedy could be used against black people in America you know cuz I wrote all my comedy in black rules but do you think if it's different if you say it versus if Chris Rock says it being that he is from America is it kind of like if like if a white guy would make a black joke can they not do that you know do you think it's different what I think it's it's definitely different if Chris Rock makes a joke if I make a joke and for white comedian makes a joke it is different in varying degrees what I do know though is regardless and this is from speaking to too many comedians who are my mentors and friends people like Dave Chappelle there's there's there's nothing more hurtful than seeing somebody else taking your joke and using it in a way that you didn't intend it you know so like I I lived in a world where I genuinely only had the references that I did and I would enjoy sharing that and so you you craft this the set in black rooms all across America and then you start getting opportunities to perform in mainstream rooms that are predominantly whites and you're doing that material and you don't realize that the laughs is changing the laugh is changing from recognition to ridicule you don't realize that you've almost given people a key to laughing at as opposed to laughing with and that was that was a shift that I then had to make in my comedy where I was like oh okay I'm trying to course-correct and figure out what's happening here because it was something I I didn't understand until it was almost too late and I was like okay that's that's something IIIi I promised myself that I would work harder on making sure that never happened again you also talked about understanding that history where it comes from that yet black people from America would really want to go back to Africa or wanna you know go back to the motherland and that type of thing you know obviously in South Africa very recently you all have had a very horrible issue with apartheid is there anything that you've learned about the horrific experience of not just black people who are there minority groups whether it be you know Native Americans Latinos and what not anything that you've learned about their story or their history in America that's even surprised you at the level of the horror and the scrutiny and then the things that marginalize people have to go through here Wow is there anything that surprised me do you mean is there anything that hasn't surprised me um it's tough especially when you when you read through it all you know lots of American history is is delivered to you on the outside and in tidbits and snippets you have ideas of it but I won't lie I didn't fully know I didn't understand the complexities and then you read through it you know I remember one of the things that I guess surprised me and and shocked me the most was when you come from the African continent when you are an immigrant you're prone to believing that all you have to do is behave and then the world will treat you appropriately and I remember the first time I discovered that that's exactly what black people in America had tried over and over again it's why there was a movement of freedom fights as wearing suits you know it's it's why black men in America dressed so DAPA the way they did because they said this is I want to show you that I'm acting accordingly I'm being respectful and then seeing how even that wasn't enough you know going through the stories you know whether it was MLK or you know whether it was reading stories of you know in Oklahoma you know reading all of these stories where you realize that it wasn't it wasn't about what you were doing it was more about who you are which was a scary thought to come upon you know because you always like to believe that there is something you can do to prevent you from being killed by a policeman to prevent you from suffering the ills that your parents or your grandparents went through you like to believe that it is all in your control and I think one of the most surprising discoveries for me was realizing how far that was from the truth speaking of you know the horrible racial turmoil let you kind of you know reference their let's talk a little bit about Donald Trump's America you've talked about I don't like to call it Donald Trump's America I think it's not president it's yeah it's America dealing with Donald Trump well stop he's America and my next line was from something you said I think in an interview with the LA Times you talked about our Trump is really just an antagonist in America's story the way you dress and in America oftentimes the excuses oh that was way in the past I was very long right South Africa that excuse may not bear out so well cuz I mean it's more recent past I mean when I was over there people sayo we're only twenty years into this Democrats always line do you think it's some ways that the Trump presidency can be seen as a good thing for race and American that it exposes kind of rifts that people thought were just gone in the past and then didn't exist anymore well I don't know if it's a good thing I think good can come from it you know that's how I've always lived my life that's how my mother has taught me to live it she goes we can't control what's happening to us but we can't control how we react to it and so in many ways you go okay Trump is president this is the reality we are dealing with this is the reality the world is dealing with because it's not just an American issue now Donald Trump is president and he has in many ways emboldened people who are racist all over America and and so what has happened and what good can come from it in my opinion is the fact that conversations can no longer be masked Donald Trump is forcing people to choose Donald Trump is in many ways it's it's funny because you know the phrase was always used during the campaign people would say what would it take for people to not vote for Donald Trump what would it take and I'm like well Donald Trump's gonna show you what it'll take you know he step-by-step action by action he slowly tests the resolve of people and you see people slowly saying actually is it wait is that what I look like is that that's not me that's not who I am and as frustrating as it may be for some you know they go like well why wouldn't why weren't you against him from the beginning I I'm the eternal optimist which is always gonna be my downfall and my gift and that is I I go well Donald Trump is the person who will push people to the point where they do have to make a choice and it is sad because many people will still fall on the side of bigotry and and and xenophobia and racism but there will be many who seeing Donald Trump for what he is will then choose to try and not be that and not everyone may succeed but I do believe that some people would then go oh I I don't I don't wish to associate with what that is I didn't see myself as being that given that you say you're the eternal optimist and obviously where you came from you came from a background and upbringing where you had dabble in all different races cultures and kind of bridge that divide any tips or any words of encouragement you can give us an hour or for how this society how here in America we can move forward in bridging a lot of these racial divides wow that's a tough one the biggest thing is is is to talk about it it's not easy but I do know that's that's one of one of the most powerful tools you have and when I say talk about it I'm speaking to white people predominantly in America it's a frightening conversation to have but it's a conversation that needs to be had and that conversation is race that conversation is understanding you know the very fiber of the country you are living in those conversations need to be had with your friends and family and it seems it seems like it's it's it's impossible it seems like it's a it's a mountain that can never be you know climbed but but I do believe we can make inroads I do believe that as people we can move a conversation forward but the key is to have that conversation and I think in many ways social media has done that you know I feel like younger people are more in touch with each other than ever before we are seeing each other in ways that we never saw each other as human beings you know whether it's black people being shot by police in America or whether it's you know a bomb going off in Mogadishu and seeing the victims whether it's people in Syria going through chemical attacks you know I saw it launching attacks on them whether it's us seeing what's happening in Myanmar with the raw anger people I don't think that many of those images would have filtered through to generations that came before us in the same way they may have been one expose on the New York Times a big piece but for the most part you find that would have that would have blown over and now we're in a space where we can see each other like never before in many ways I was say it feels like we're living through the best time ever because we now have the ability to see how bad things really are which I know sounds like a paradox but I feel like that's a hopeful place to be in yeah I think the lens is there but I always kind of made coming for my cynical thing are people looking in the lens are people looking and accepting and trying to understand well I think people are looking the acceptance is is is one that I can't necessarily speak to you know I I do think though there is a shift slowly you know people there will always be people who ignore there'll always be people who turn the blame around you know you see it happening in all instances it doesn't just happen to black people in America where something happens and you know they go like well why was he running why why was he driving that car why was he wearing a hoodie oh the same thing happens to victims of sexual harassment or assaults we're seeing it now with Harvey Weinstein people saying oh why was she in that hotel room why was she wearing those clothes well did she really want it and that's that's a thing that we have to root out in society is victim blaming but what we can't deny is access to those stories does drill into people's minds there will always be the holdouts you know I don't ever think we will get everyone I don't think society needs everyone to move forward oftentimes you will have the people who are left behind and they're forced to come with there is going to be dragging the the rear end of society and then there will be those people who are at the forefront most people I argue are in the middle but they but they're also moving forward and we have moved forward in society you know we've made progress but that doesn't mean that more progress doesn't need to be made and that's that's that's how we live and so and so I think having access to that is better than not having access to it because that these people have to they have to in some ways grapple with what's happening whether they agree with it or disagree they're not grappling with it which is a space I would rather be in one of the things you mentioned is we have to talk we have to have conversations um and when we posted about this events on on Facebook I was looking at where in the comments and there's a commenter who was saying oh Trevor Noah's coming I must bet there must be lots of protest and burning now they said oh no wait I guess not and there's a sense among conservatives that there's definitely double standard especially here on college campuses when you've seen with conservative speakers coming in right there being a lot of people and uproar and whatnot do you think that college campuses are a little bit too close-minded in terms of bringing a diverse array of views when it comes to conservative liberal and whatnot Mattson that's an interesting question because I haven't had personal experience with every single college campus I I do know that it's a tough balance to maintain you know because on the one hand we cannot deny that many conservative people have dabbled in the world of extreme views when it has suited them you know you will find establishment conservatives who in some way shape or form have condoned or allied themselves with people who have extreme views you know whether it's Nazism or you know whether it's genocide like you you hear these ideas and you're like how could you even be on the same page of this as this person and so I think what invariably happens is there are many people who are afraid and go we don't know we don't know who the Nazi is or isn't right now and so we're going to protest all of these voices I do believe though and maybe it's because I was a big fan of watching debates not just in South Africa but in America as well you know I would love watching Malcolm X on a stage debating somebody who wished he didn't exist as a human being you know I used to love watching those debates where James Baldwin would dismantle an idea and take it apart piece by piece and and something I always enjoyed about those debates was having the confidence in your ideas to put them up against ideas that you completely were against and and more importantly you know these ideas may have been against you even existing but I but I I always enjoyed the power of a good debate you know I also think people have to be careful because on some of these college campuses the people are specifically there to troll and it's a tough it's a tough decision to make as a person in a school you go do I let them speak or do I and I golike but yet oftentimes they don't have they don't have the numbers you think they have they're relying on you to amplify their voice are you blocking them makes them a thing the story becomes about the blocking now people want to see what was blocked you know it's the same way when I was a kid I always wanted to see in porno magazines what was hidden behind the stars that's that's like you want to know what's hidden what's the what's behind the blur now you've creates a suspense you know and and it is it is it is tough I'm not gonna say it isn't you know because many people go like how can I let you speak when what you're speaking about is me nots existing at the same time that is the gift and curse of having a country where free speeches is as applauded as it is I think we have to get some questions soon to some viewer questions soon but um that's just one more quick thing about college campuses um the idea of safe spaces that's really being a big thing that people have been talking about lately being um spaces where people of marginalized group can have kind of a safe environments on campus and whatnot right um some schools like Northwestern University of come out and said you know this is a thing we endorse so the schools make maybe the University of Chicago have been less enthusiastic about something like that where do you fall on that and ask you this just throw shade like we're like just like do that it's like a turf war [Music] somebody gave me the mic so I gotta use it um but but you can I ask you in the context of apartheid cuz I mean one thing you wrote about in the book is that um what a part I did is it did not allow white people to not see the ramifications of what's happening in Alex what's happening in some of the townships and I sometimes wonder whether it could we have that same impact if we rely too much on safe spaces where were people who might come from a small you know town where they've never met a an Asian person right no person will never interact with one what I I'm always you know branding in America fascinates me because like the term safe spaces is used many many times true to reference spaces where ethnic minorities are hanging out and I I don't know I feel like everyone has safe spaces you know your safe space is just way you define it like conservatives have safe spaces as well they have conservative conferences you know gun owners at the NRA that that's a gun owners conference they would they're the go that's our safe space they like you you know Fox viewers those that's their safe space this is I I don't know I I feel like I'm being tricked I feel like there's something I'm missing here but I go you also do that it's it's choosing we do that as people we say oh this is our group Chess Club is a safe space in a way like all of these things are our safe spaces it's just a group of people who say we have a shared identity we have a shared idea we want to speak about this like those tiki torch that's a safe space that's what they're doing that's what that's that's essentially the same thing so I don't know if I agree with people going like oh you and your safe space over there I golike know many people everyone has a safe space it's just that term has now come to be used in a way where it's like oh it means you're soft and you know everybody does that everybody finds a group of people that they relate to and these are essentially clubs that's what they are so if you had a university and you find there's a group of African students they're gonna want to find a club of Africans where they can have conversations where they don't need to be constantly translating you know it'll be the same thing for a Jewish school where they'll go like oh this is this is our space where we get to just talk freely amongst ourselves and no one we don't have to explain anything we don't have to worry about people getting anything out of context and I I think that's what it is I think though the branding has been successfully used in such a way to make it seem like people are soft for wanting to engage in conversations where they don't need to translate to an outsider who may be listening to them and I don't know I don't think I buy into that's very well said I think we gotta get in so we had um different college students submit videos video questions and we got a bunch of them we've whittled it down to about five of them so we're gonna play them up here and hopefully you have some good answers for them so can we roll the first one if the technology works hi Trevor my name is Katie and I'm a senior at Bucknell University comedy is obviously a big part of what you do and who you are and I know these days a lot of mediums are hesitant to do shows on college campuses because they believe that they're becoming too politically correct and intolerant and I was just wondering what your thoughts are on this in an effort to become more tolerant our college campuses actually becoming intolerant of some forms of comedy Thanks that's an interesting question um you know when it comes to college campuses I sometimes think that the younger generation is always going to be one that or should always be one that that forces progress or forces progressiveness and people don't even realize it's happening but it's is happening you know I would argue that people in the South even in America who may consider themselves staunch conservatives if they go back 60 or 80 years they would find that you know what I mean they were like the Liberals of you know what I mean they would be considered liberals according to to those standards when I think of comedy many times when people go PC culture or those ideas I think what people are just saying is we've gotten to a place where we've come to realize the power of words we've gotten to a place where we've come to realize that people don't have to accept being marginalized anymore and we have to take more responsibility for what we say now is there an overcorrection sometimes yes but for the most part I know even as myself as a comedian I've had to learn these ideas I wasn't I didn't always know how to do it or what to do with it you know I've lived in a world where there was a time when I thought that fat jokes were very funny do you know because I came from a country where being overweight wasn't an epidemic it wasn't a disease in many ways like it is in America so I information differently all of these all of these ideas I find evolve over time and so I still perform at college campuses I still share my point of view some of my ideas may be edgy but I I don't think that it's a it's a thing that we should shun I think that Corrections always need to be made you know there are some comedians who are really old now where you go like well you can't you can't say that you know they'll say things that are crazy racist and you'd be like hey man you can't be saying that and then you'll find like a younger generation of comedian will say something else you know about maybe transgender people we go like hey man you you can't say that and I feel like every generation recalibrates what society does or doesn't accept and that's a good thing and so we're just in a period where that's happening again III don't think it's a negative thing in fact I I enjoy it you know I watch comedians who have successfully navigated that from generation to generation and I believe that's why they've remained as successful as they have you know people like Chris Rock we mentioned earlier he's done it from the time I was a young child and he's still one of the best in the world doing it so so clearly there are some comedians who know how to you know progress with the times as opposed to saying no this is how I've always thought and this is how I will always think can we go to second question please and my question is in this political climate classroom discussions can often be divisive what do you think is the best way to have an impactful and effective conversation about your peers what is the best way to have an impactful conversation amongst your peers I think punching works really well I really think no don't don't do that please I Trevor says punch jokes I think we can always start from a place of empathy one of the hardest things to do is people in the discussion or in the debates is operating from the from the point of view that the person you are speaking with is a human being we often forget that it's hard because sometimes the person you're speaking to doesn't think that you're a human being and so I find in a debate what really helps is thinking to yourself what if I'm wrong just for a moment just think to yourself what if I'm wrong there are many times were we've been wrong there's times when you're wrong you you have the wrong information you've been brought up in the wrong way you have the wrong idea of what the world is or how it works and when I engage in a debate or when I'm trying to convince someone of something I and include that as my first port of call I go what if I'm wrong because this person thinks they're right I think that I'm right this person things I mean yet the same way I think that they're in idiots so something has to come from somewhere so I go okay if I'm wrong then that person is right this is their point of view and then I go let me take that point of view and see if I can dissect it from that that side as opposed to just spitting out my Dogma consistently you go constantly I don't go this is this is the only truth I say well let me take your truth then and poke holes in it and and you'll come to find that when you do that not only will you understand the person you speaking to a little bit more but you may be able to converse with them in a way that they may understand a little bit more and you won't always win and sometimes I find the debates is not to change the person you're debating with the debate is often for the people who are watching the audience are the ones who are choosing between the ideas that are being presented to them so in that classroom you may not be convincing the person you're speaking to but somebody listening may be swayed because they see that your point of view or the ideas that you are sharing are ones that are superior or preferable to them do you find that happening on the daily so much I think the one that people most point through the tommy'll area and having her on the show and all this she's very different point of view do you find yourself engaging in that level and and putting your place in yourself in their mindset and what their thing yeah I always like to I always like to because otherwise how do you how do you know your ideas are good if you don't test them you know I don't want to live in a world where I believe everything I believe because I've been told it and I and I just reinforced that idea myself I like to challenge my ideas I like to know why I believe what I believe you know because every idea we have didn't come from our minds it has come from the world in some way shape or form you know very few ideas are completely sparked from the genius within our own minds and so what I like to do is have someone who can test my points of view to force me to galvanize my ideas and in doing that I can then question them I can I can bring an idea back to them you know like I remember when when Tommy came on the show that was one of the key questions that came up because of the conversation we're having and it was you know a common common conservative talking point which was black people shouldn't be protesting I didn't boo and then I just honestly in the moment I just lost the question I said okay when when is the right time to protest and I still haven't gotten that answer from anyone like I genuinely haven't I haven't heard any conservative person saying this is when this is when it's acceptable for black people to protest and so I think in those moments you wouldn't have gotten to that because you wouldn't have had anyone challenging your points of view let's go to question three please despite all the chaos in our country regarding fake news and the widespread distress of media what a vice you have for college students trying to enter the field Oh what advice drive for students trying to enter the field well I think now we're living through an age where more than ever there is a power that you have you know if you're trying to enter journalism that that you never had before you know there there are journalists everywhere in this room everyone who has a phone has become a journalist everyone who has a Twitter account has become a journalist in many ways you you have the power to not only gaana information but also share it with the world around you and so I would say to all those people who are entering the field I go this is a time that we're living through and hopefully this will not become the norm you know you you see countries all over Africa countries like Russia for instance where the government has found the apparatus they need to keep perpetuating the idea that there is no such thing as real but there is real there are facts you know facts still exist and so if you're getting into the field of journalism just believe in that keep hammering home those facts because at the end of the day they are real they they will come to your aid in sharing a story and sometimes it's frustrating because they may not bear fruit when you would like them to but a fact is a fact is a fact and at the end of the day that fact cannot change and so for anyone getting into journalism and I told him I go like it this is if anything this is just the beginning you know maybe the era of fake news you know coined by the president who invented that word but I do think this is this is the best time to be involved in it because people are listening are you a journalist do you consider yourself one no no I rely on the work of journalists yeah that's what I do you know I give my opinions on what is happening in the news but without journalists I couldn't do what I do I need to be informed as well and so you know if it wasn't for journalists to go out there and find the stories on earth everything from you know what's happening in North Korea to Niger to California to Harvey Weinstein scandal I wouldn't know what I know and that's the joy of living in a country where you have a free press is you have access to information and knowledge can we go to the next question please my question for you is how has being born in another country affected your credibility in the United States how is my being born in another country affected my credibility I think that's a double-edged sword I found like most things in life it's a gift and a curse you know on one hand people will say to me you're not from here why would you comment why do you have an opinion why do you have an idea I'm often say to people I go I'm still a human being you know I still live in the world a lot of these ideas we are dealing with are not specifically American they are their ideas and issues that society has to deal with it's also painful for me to realize how many issues Americans deal with that South Africans deal with and had to deal with during apartheid you know so so when I look at that I go I understand some people would think oh we shouldn't listen to you because you're not from here usually we shouldn't care about your opinion and I I understand that point of view at the same time I argue some of the greatest you know help that came in the world like for South Africa came from the world we had Americans who were speaking up for us in South Africa and we didn't say why do you care you're not from here you know the same thing happened in the UK there were there were people there's always people who care about something that does not involve them and I've always thought that's what the world should be more like one of the things that I'd I hope to use to my advantage is is not being from here because then I don't I don't take anything at face value I ask the questions you know I've come to realise that I'm an idiot and I enjoy yeah I enjoy that mantle because when you're in idiots and when you accept it by the way it's a very scary thing to accept but when you accepted you you you start to enjoy life because you you questions you're not afraid to be an idiot because you know you're one so then you just ask why why why and then you'll be shocked at how many people don't actually know the answer you know and so that's that's all I aim to do because I I don't understand I don't understand the electoral college and so I would ask that question someone who goes like well that's just how it works I go like put why and the why why why why why and then get your own way like well okay slavery and no you know just asking the why over and over and over again gets you to a place where oftentimes it's not just me that's discovering this information but it may be my friends or my colleagues in America who also go I actually don't know why and no one has ever asked me why and so now we can dig into that why and that is something that I I choose to use to my advantage so some people may think that impacts my credibility some people may think that it doesn't I'd like to go I I don't I don't need to be credible or not and I'm giving you an opinion you know I'm giving you an opinion and I'm sharing facts with you you know I I work on a show where I have a team of fact checkers you know and some of the best in the world and they rein me and they go like you can't say that this is the fact and I'll fight against it but it's a fact and so I I have to say it and the best comedy is based in truth and I'm trying to make the best comedy possible so I will always be bound by the truth and that's the only credibility that I that I feel I need thank you um I get would think we got one more question to go [Music] deal with a lot of comments and it was thoughts on your appearance or things you say so I guess my question is how do you do what are your self-help tools and how do you deal with the constant negativity that you get on a media platform wait I get constant negativity what time is she read it she's reading the conservative um you know what I've come to learn is as crazy as this sounds most of it is not real I know that's not a popular stand or stand points here but I I've just come to learn most of it is not real you can choose most of what you accept into your world you know I have a good friend and a very wise man by the name of Joseph Opio who he always says to me he goes like why why do you care about this world so some random person will tweet you from anyway and now you you care why why do you care because the person tweeted me and he's like yeah but if that person didn't tweet you then what would change in your life you know it's it's it's it's an idea you know and there are not many ideas that you can escape in the world there are some things that are happening to you physically we cannot deny that but there are many things that are also an idea of what is happening to you and you know as much as we cannot control what is happening to us we can't control how we react to it and maybe we've been brought up to believe that we cannot but we can you can choose many times how to react you can choose to not read three dimensions online you can choose to not interact with trolls you can choose to not get baited into a conversation that you know is just going to wind up in in trolling you know you you can choose a lot of these things even though you believe you cannot some people say I don't have the luxury of choosing yeah I get that but you're still making a choice and so I've come to learn that I can focus my energy on moving an idea forward I've come to learn that I will focus my energy on learning and trying to be a part of something that is positive I've come to learn that obviously people are not going to like you and that's what you should accept in life is people who don't like you won't like you because you stand for something if everybody likes you then you you're doing nothing so for me it comes with the territory love me or hate me but don't be indifferent and that's the way I live my life and they say and what do you say about you know how you respond to where I think s people forget that there was a time when there was no Twitter so right it's it and I know it's hard especially when you're young like this thing it's it's it's it's now our world you know it's we we feel like we can't get rid of it it's become this vise but we can we can there are moments when you can completely disengage just imagine your battery died whenever you want to escape just be like it's dead and then that's it and then you're just like oh look look look at how much nicer just take a break for a weekend just quits it all you know read the news that you need to read keep up with what you need to keep up with stay away from the conversations when you want to stay away from them and you'll be surprised to find you can focus on the positivity in your world and that'll give you the energy to deal with the negativity when you choose to good and I think we're wrapping up here soon but I got one more question for you from my end you're a comedian you're very funny guy is there a joke about race that you can tell us that might get you on trouble in trouble on Twitter tomorrow huh is there a joke I could tell you a white guy black guy walk into a bar type type thing and I never know which one will get you into trouble that's the weird thing about the world I wish I could tell you one that would and I I don't like I don't have like those I don't have those kinds of jokes I tell stories if anything I share anecdotes I share ideas yeah I don't have any I'm ashamed to say I don't have any that would get me into trouble on on Twitter if I have one I'll tweet it later and then you let me know how it goes they go to eat tweet yeah yeah you retweet it and then we see what happens we let the outrage build overnight and we deal with it tomorrow Trevor thank you so much for your time and thank you very much thank you for having me [Applause] and I want to thank you all for coming out this has been a great conversation again please keep the conversation going on like all of our college students go to email on campus at nytimes.com tells your stories about race how you've identified and college campuses and we thank everyone here for being here we thank everyone for watching online and you know please keep the conversation going and for those of us here in the room all we'll be doing a small Q&A just with myself afterwards so if you want to stick around please feel free and once again let's give it up for Trevor Noah thank you so much Trevor thank you everybody [Applause]

Channel: New York Times Events

Views: 1,221,512

Rating: 4.7247133 out of 5

Keywords: trevor noah, daily show, trevor noah daily show, comedy central, trevor noah comedy central, race, race in america, racism, trevor noah africa, Northwestern University

Id: 31k4Lg794Pk

Length: 61min 34sec (3694 seconds)

Published: Mon Oct 16 2017