Top 10 Advanced Two-Player Games

[Music] hello everybody good afternoon i'm tom vassell i'm z garcia hi i'm mike delecio welcome to another top 10. so let's start off here with some explanations so last week we did our top 10 what do we call them we call them casual casual two-player games we're now doing our top 10 advanced two-player games we talked about what to name this list that's what we're calling it we made the wrong choice here's the i'm just gonna say right now that there's for me there was when i made this list there was never an option of i don't know if it goes on this list or the list or last week for me there's a third invisible list we're not doing called top 10 medium weight games okay for two players and so that's what this list is then for me almost oh no you did the invisible list i did this to ignore the invisibleness i knew i did something no i'm not saying i'm just saying that i did so it's not of uh if it hadn't made this list it would have made the list from last week and so on and so forth so none of the games on your first list were from that invisible medium list huh no what i'm saying well i'm saying that you could argue that they could move in either direction but there's no way a game from that list would make this week's list and vice versa because they would hit that middle list first i know you're mocking this but i know people know what i'm talking about that's better i get it i get it so i chose that arbitrary weight scale the bgg weight scale of 2.0 right i chose that on for the for the list that we did last in the casual list really this list is anything that is above 2.0 oh you're skipping the middle i will tell you this has a voice it's a 2.01 that's advanced uh there may or may not be a game here that is a 2.10 let me ask a small question since ron is waiting how many rankings does the game have to have for this to be valid apparently you know this apparently one because the highest games in his list last week had one rating right of a two but i won't forget right but i uh i honestly thought that weight of a two was too high so i didn't worry do you know if that rating is two right now it's not because somebody went in there and put a five i'm sorry let's make a bus route the dice game is not a five just to mess with you just to mess with me yeah and that's fine it wasn't me no yeah i'm sure it wasn't no i'm trying to actually i'm sure it wasn't all i'm saying i don't know this list has a much wider range of complexity than that first list i have a game that's from i said 2.1 all the way up to a 4.23 but these skew lighter because as i said last time i don't play a lot of two-player games and when i do they tend to be the more casual games right so that's all there is to it i actually this is my list of games so i i used my wife as kind of a or or someone who hasn't played many games one of those two this would be someone comes in we both played a ton of games we want to play a two player game these are the ones i'm pulling out okay top ten two player games with a gamer okay yeah i none of these games are games that i would necessarily love to play with somebody who's new to gaming i'll put it to that well sure i mean that's the very epitome of it being called advanced there you go i'll play these with anybody okay no no some of these uh no some of these are much more brothers i brought some pretzels i was told we are sometimes too mean to each other oh so i'm gonna when they say something really stupid i'm just gonna eat a pretzel passive aggressively you're gonna need some more pretzels yeah you're right i don't think i brought another no you did not because i'm getting ready to get real stupid where's my list that's a good question get the pretzels i'm going to eat your pretzels too you take one that's legit but it has to be the same thing okay all right there's my list you're the wrong list no i have anybody from the sweet thing i thought you were looking for the hidden i a a uh brainstorming list i got it we're good all right eat the pretzels no that was a good statement to say are we ready to start with number 10. all right so my number 10 is actually classified i believe as a war game and i don't play a lot of war games this is a game that i actually played with you relatively recently okay this game no um blitzkrieg is an interesting example is it my middle list boom done yeah that's that's really what it is okay i this is the shores of tripoli oh okay okay i applaud your choice i will not even touch the paper thank you yeah so it's not a heavy game but i certainly wouldn't want to introduce people that were not familiar with like you know this card driven action system that you see here it's an asymmetric two-player game where one person is playing as the american forces and the other players playing as the tripolitan forces and it's based around the first barbary first barbary war uh barbary coast war right uh really clever it feels like um the uh twilight struggle light in a way you know you're playing cards that are you have to know your deck to you know what i mean so like daytime struggle it's daytime struggling no no no no it's the middle struggle i mean it's a war game that uses cars i wouldn't say it's like twilight struggle okay that's probably not a great comparison only only in the sense that change your mind to be to be no to to feel confident you have to know your deck and you have to play through it a few times that's what i'm getting it's also not intuitive no it is not yeah there are some there are some cards that you you have to be aware that the other side has certain things and that's another thing that's similar to twilight struggle so anyway i think this is a very clever relatively streamlined war game uh very out of my comfort zone when i when i came into it but i i really enjoyed it and uh that's what it made me really fun it is good so number 10 on the shores of tripoli from the halls of montana [Music] to the shores of tripoli i'm gonna need a whole bag you're going to get rice cakes and you're going to like it my number 10 is a game called lewis and clark hmm right roy yes good um do you like it you like this one too losing clark the expedition i consider to pretty much almost exclusively be a game for two you might talk with three but it's unlikely and then i will definitely not play with more than that okay the game outstays it it's welcome by quite a bit i i think honestly right after two because it's not a short game it takes about i'll say 40 minutes per player or so right 45 minutes per player so you play two players it's about an hour and a half and that's good you've got some card purchasing and then you can use those characters to help you on your journey you can it's it's kind of like a work replacement game smashed up against this card driven uh action game right and both parts when you take a turn you do one game or the other game and both parts work really well together and you're racing in like the slowest race in history but you're doing that two i find it compelling i find it engaging very well made and more than that it's so slow and long it's so long um i wonder i don't like the game at all i do like it but i've never played it with two oh it's so much better it's definitely better with two i agree and like you said the fact that it is a race i think also makes it feel better as a two-player game it's you and that other person i mean it's a very clean uh you like this better than the dice version as well oh yeah okay oh dice version is good that nice version is fine that's a better one multiplayer exactly but this is a good uh a big box sort of two-player game that feels great at two and too long for what it is and more than that so this has some of the earliest vincent drew trade art i noticed too that i really like this the game was like oh who is this artist you know that's true that was one of it wasn't the first game one of the earliest definitely one of the ones that brought him to my attention sure yeah good choice that's my number 10. my number 10 is majors got to say really fast before it gets on the screen um your number 10 was spoiled before you said it oh i didn't see it oh it was or mage wars academy one or the other i mean i i can put back and forth definitely the majority of my list are fairly involved games mage wars is no exception there you have a book a little binder full of spells you can play any of those spells i mean though half the game is building that book before you play sure and then you can play any of those as long as you have the magic to play them and then you fight back and forth rolling dice it's some similarities to magic to gathering and that you're summoning creatures and that's about it really yeah it's really involved and i tend to like mage wars academy a little better because it takes the board out i was going to ask you about that yeah because the original game has that kind of tactical element there with the board the new one does not have as much of a tactical element although you sacrifice that for a faster more streamlined game take that every time you yes but i i could play both right this is just a fun game i really like how different every mage is you got one mage that's growing plants up and another one raising zombies from the grave and your plants vs zombies so do you like the actual building of your character as much as the playing of the cards it seems to me like that's half the game right it's not half the game 40 40 yes half a pretzel yes yes it is about 40 but once i build it i don't toy with it as much okay because you don't play all the cards in it right so i'll be like ah this time i'm going to summon this first sure i feel like i'm messing with it more but that almost any deck building game or anything like that half the game for me is messing with building the deck right i sorted cards last night for two hours straight and was very content and i felt like i was playing a game so i don't know cars for what you know i'm not getting sucked back it's a little bit unnerving sorting things out it's like that's like a trap yeah what were you doing what was that for yeah let's move on to number nine [Music] all right so my number nine is a game that i think is kind of a flown under the radar game it it is a game that terror under the radar subterra no that's under the earth it's also under the radar stealth stealth is under the radar or something like that yeah no i get that but there's no game called stealth i bet there is you're telling me that subterra also means under the radar no no what i said in the earth okay it also is below the radar he doesn't you don't even when you say something when someone else has something well i would eat them but i have to talk about this game so this is dulasaur island this is the two player only version of dinosaur island i really really like this game it's got an i split you choose mechanic which is one that uh i think it's not utilized as much as maybe it should i really like that as a mechanic i do wish it wasn't morgan yeah it's a really neat and basically it takes many of the elements of dinosaur island where you're drafting the dna dna dice easy for me to say to build uh dinosaurs and you are kind of drafting character powers but it's a more streamlined experience than a dinosaur island certainly a smaller table presence but there's still some really nice thinking decisions um a game really different especially if you can play dinosaur with two players right but i wouldn't i would always choose it's okay but i would always choose this i think they're different games that's what i'm saying they are they are yeah and dinosaur island is okay as a two-player game but i just think if i want kind of that that vibe that that theme in a two-player game i'm going with this dual sword island i think more people should try this game it's good excellent i wish it was a different title but such a difference really ah come on i mean i hate it so much but that should not keep you from playing a game z no i know of course right but i just it doesn't it's not a jokey game the same reason why i say that but i'm like that's kept me from playing auto mania is i don't like the cover which is stupid i'm eating a pretzel i should play he's just a little snacky you know what i mean any excuse you're like i'm hungry also tell me something dumb very very very very stale i'm not gonna be able to talk for the next hour and a half uh you don't have a drink do you i do actually okay good my number nine is mr jack in new york and the reason i picked mr jack in new york even though it is not my favorite it is the thinkiest and most strategic of all of the mr jack games there's mr jack the original in new york and then there's a spin-off about the phantom of the phantom of the opera which is the lightest of those three by the way that one's the the one i would recommend first to someone who hasn't played any of them if you don't care about which theme then that's the easiest one but if you want the most open-ended then mr jack in new york is the most open-ended one because the board starts largely empty this is an abstract game of positional positional awareness and trying to figure out which of these characters is jack the ripper and capture them in the original game you have alleys and houses that block the way and exits and things like that and this one you begin with a board that's empty and you build where the parks go you build where the lanterns go so the decisions are much farther reaching um i don't like it because it's a little slower and a little sort of more brain burning than the other ones i like my in-between you know thinking but moving along and um so i kept it just to mr jack eventually but i think it is extremely well put together very well balanced one side versus the other and if you are looking for again the really advanced one then this is the advanced one mr jack in new york and tom hates it i wasn't even going to say it i was going to go through i'm still not going to say it all right i saw someone the comment says that i'm saying mechanism wrong i'm not mechanism is actually the correct word when mike says mechanic i'm talking about the guy who fixes your cut i am incorrect yeah it is mechanism actually mechanic the dictionaries aren't changing it to mean that so both are legit i just i say both scott scott nicholson got in my case about it and i've always said mechanism because yeah mechanism is the one that's probably the most correct i just sometimes i say mechanic sometimes i say mechanism snootier too let's call the whole thing off you say mechanic my number nine is no there you go so complicated most people don't play it at least that's my reasoning most people don't play it uh i just sorted this out a few days ago i was going through my games and sorting them out one by one and i thought i don't know when i'm going to play this game even though i love the game and that's a dual of ages 2. here we go there we go but i love this game now this game originally when i first got duel of ages i was attracted to it because it says i think it even says on here it says two to eight the original one said two to sixteen and i was like oh man that's amazing i would not say that now it's been 20 years since i bought two of h's that is a stunning looking yeah and i mean literally stunning i don't know what to think look there's no question you say this is an ugly board i say please shoot me it's an ugly board the cards artwork not fantastic no the game's a little more complex and yet i love it and you'll meet people like me we like it and we're having a good time it's that anachronism that you like really that's what you love about it i like anachronistic themes bill and ted's excellent adventure things like that yeah that's what this is you have people from time and space you have a group of them i i like to play eight verse eights pick someone else you pick eight characters i pick eight characters out of a deck of two hundred whatever yeah all kinds of weapons i mean every game is different and not like cosmic encounter i love that sort of thing they have special powers sure one guy's an amazing fighter this person sucks at fighting but they can run run around really fast this person switches everyone else's stats when they're near him but it's it's easily i don't play as much because i don't feel like teaching it to people it is a beast i played this once a long long time ago so i am aware of what it is and how it plays i don't like it at all but i can i see the attraction of uh open-endedness and sort of just it's really sad you know what i mean sure i really love it and i would like one of my dreams would be for somebody to come and take this game and streamline it that's not going to happen i know because i really tried hard to make it happen it's just not going to happen you say maybe maybe tom vassell could be the one tom vassell tried wow no so all right well uh somebody good at that kind of stuff could try though it's true you could do that that's mine number nine there you go we need to yeah throw those out they're rough man those are rough i'm still i'm still dealing with the repercussions of that my number eight is a here you go try one z you can give yourself time for it to uh that's that is sawdust to work its way through your system yeah it's pretty rough all right my number eight is a a game that you can play with more than two but this to me is very much a two-player game this is shaolia warring states this is another game that you are loving on this game i really yeah this is saddam this is kind of turning into my pet project game i think it's just it's one that i really really like it's basically where each player has their own kind of home territory there you go and you're playing car you're buying cards out of a market that you're playing on your territory that are either going to be usually offensive or defensive cards and you're just simply in the main mode of the game trying to either knock out the other players kind of defenses or get a culture victory there are other cards you can play that move you up a culture track so you're either trying to kind of win militarily or culturally but it's all based off of these cards that you play and it's nice because there are so many different cards and you're only going to have a market of i can't remember maybe eight or so at the beginning of each game so you can it could be very different depending on which cards you have in the game a very clean rule set but a thinky game in that you're trying to kind of see what your opponent's going to be doing and and it's more tactical than a strategic i think but i tend to like tactical games especially two-player yes um and so uh this is a game that i'm very excited to see it's getting an expansion that uh i'm looking forward to uh and i hope more people get a chance to play this one too i like it you can play with more than two but would not i would not either it's best as a two player because because there's two ways to win once by culture once by attacking in a three-player game the attacking goes down a little bit and right that's because there's two people you're attacking you're attacking both with every attack yeah so it's just it feels a little i don't know it doesn't feel as smooth it feels like a two-player game that's being shoehorned into a different player count is honestly what it feels like so yeah that's cool yeah it's a good game i haven't heard of this at all it's in the library man oh jake yell me coke i'm not going to get a pretzel i'll tell you that pretzel give him a pretzel okay my number eight is a game called summoner wars oh really first edition and the reason it's first edition is because i haven't played the new edition also in the library oh yeah it's right outside i don't want to hear any more about this library okay you walk through it every day why i don't know how to read it's a decimal system you could you could easily substitute this for second edition if you've played it i just haven't i like the idea of playing this miniatures game with no miniatures or just on the cards with the nice information right there in the uh right there on the cards and the simplicity of movement the grid being so straightforward is a big part of it as well you know it's it's exactly the opposite of a free-form miniatures game you get to move three it's like one two three there okay am i close enough to attack you two spaces away in a really obvious you know grid great i roll some dice and do it everything is this feels like the kind of game that i don't know again the design process how that went but it feels like a rock that they polished and polished and polished and eventually the only things left were the absolute necessities to make the game work and to make the factions distinct from one another mechanically this is very straightforward the advanced part comes from exploring the different factions the tactics and it is very tactical also sort of responding and figuring out where you want to be at any given moment what seems like you're trying to flank me over here hold on let me summon this and throw it in your way or wait till you cross this threshold and throw this lying at you or something i'm lying baby um so it's very enjoyable and it does kind of give me that miniatures sort of feel without there being a bunch of things on the board so yeah i'm excited to try the new one i just haven't gotten around to it this game is so worse i put the second edition in our library and i kept the first edition of the library did you it's not my favorite game but i'm really i've always been impressed by how balanced the factions feel and that's pretty impressive there's a lot of factions available now ah for sure well not in the new one though no because the new one is is trash right no the new one just is brand new so they've only got the six in there six that's correct that's actually another reason i haven't yeah right that's why i won't play it until there were at least as many as the first one had and then when i started just broken roy so that's when summoner wars three comes right he's like all right fine i'll play two there you go that's how he still hasn't watched empire strikes back oh man all right that joke did not correlate i know yeah don't do it don't do it don't do it don't do it you gotta be able to talk i gotta do i gotta talk first all right my number eight is another one of these two player back and forth games this one involves superheroes although you wouldn't know it as much because it's it's it's abstracted but i love it anyway that's dice masters oh wow okay i still talk about dice masters so i like magic to gathering a lot and it goes up and down there are years where i'm high on magic and years run low on magic where i'm at right now is fairly high actually um because i really like dungeons and dragons but forgotten realms anyway so like i said hours last night sorting cards but i like this a little better than magic because it gives me the feeling of magic collecting these cards you know and making your own deck although here your deck is eight cards right sure and 20 dice but then using those dice it feels really tactical you at each game again it's kind of back to mage wars i have these eight cards there's some randomness in which dice come out of the bag but the randomness i'm choosing the dice that go in there right and i feel like the combat back and forth is really good um this is another game that i think could benefit from a new second edition of it probably yeah um but as it is it's fun i like the different themes although weirdly enough even i just like dual pages i like anachronistic stuff if it i don't know what the word for it is if it kind of meshes so like for example dual of ages it's a bunch of different people from history and humans and androids but then it doesn't have pokemon in it too right so this one is weird for me because i like marvel i play against dc even teenage mutant ninja turtles works wwe but then wwe i have to play by itself right or warhammer they don't do you miss the other ones i miss marvel in dc oh yeah no problem no but those are all both superhero things right and even teenage mutant ninja turtles they're here they're kind of like that yeah okay yeah so you just don't like mixing ips that i don't fit this fit the same sort of yeah but i didn't even like putting in yugioh what about d and d i didn't no i didn't like mix d d is good right but you want it on its own yeah i'm a real stickler for that i don't like getting those things mixed up um it's the same thing yeah yeah for the most part sir have you seen batman versus superman yeah with spider-man and you have seen it that would be amazing i would watch that movie you should and it's terrible all right punishment time [Music] [Laughter] [Music] you know the first bite it's not so bad right but it's progressive bite right because you you get once you get past that outer shell the outer shell is fine when you get to the sawdust in the middle that's when it becomes and it takes all of the moisture out of your body and it all coalesces into your uh your mouth the idea was this this was yours do you like that i like it i don't even think it's used correctly there but i'll tell you that comes together yeah all right i'll take it all right my number seven is another what's classified as a war game delicious i don't even know who you are anymore are you is he talking to himself i believe have you coalesced are you complimenting yourself at this point i know i'm saying i don't even know who i am anymore that's what happens when you turn 50. and you start liking war games apparently because i'm my number seven he is dirty like that right i'm gonna be sitting in my in my your age now my barca lounger i'm gonna be watching the history channel yeah it's coming for you um i'm gonna somehow get uh the the tv guide and do the crossword in the back of the tv guide i didn't say you're going back a time mike my number seven is uh you can choose the the version undaunted uh either normandy or north africa they're both fantastic they're basically both the same game okay um they're both very available to get right now and i recommend them both north africa is cool because it has the the vehicles but they're both really good i like this one a little bit maybe a little better right but such a great clean system again another tactical game really good where you're you're you know you're playing kind of tiles as your map and there are different scenarios throughout the game you can kind of play through it as a campaign but you can also just play them as one-off scenarios just a really streamlined rule set but that don't take that to mean that there's no decisions to be made because there are plenty of decisions to be made there is some randomness with dice rolling but you can also mitigate that just a really clever game design system i feel like that this system could be really expanded to a lot of other different uh people they are coming out with an expansion for it from donald marvel no no no but i'm saying if you're in a war game how much of a war game is this not much only in theme it's a war game in the sense that the grizzled is a war game no you don't think so you are literally shooting at other people that's true but yeah but but it doesn't feel like a traditional yes you actually you play with angry folks um no you're i'm probably hamming it on too much this is a this this is a war themed game i don't think it feels like most war games i think any war gamer out there would flip out over there i don't care this is a war game okay it's one person a war game i don't care what some arbitrary person is arbitrary it has fog fog of war cards it has military units you know military units military weapons you are taking part in military style activities so yeah it's a war game you literally move troops around you do shoot at other troops yeah i don't know how that's not a war okay i guess just in this it's not a hex encounter game right it's not it's not a war game right what you think that's a joke there are some people that would make that argument i would joke four gamers don't joke about that they would some people would make that argument that basically that's true it would never be a joke so anyway it's a great game whether you want to call it a war game or not check it out undaunted either i don't this is one that you know i usually will tell you i think you'll like this or not i have no idea i don't know how you feel about this usually do you just think you have an idea yeah whenever you give that opinion that is true you're usually wrong [Laughter] give me a process you should try this though you should try this there you go my number seven it's a war game of jason game called target mm-hmm i thought this might show up on your list this is a good game i do agree on that oh snapple snapple you sure because it was on your because it was in your casual list you think this game is casual i do i i know two things this game is heavier than you think it is and these pretzels are of the devil indeed oh my gosh right it's like gnawing in a 2x4 there's not enough liquid in the world to replenish what you've lost i spent a lot of time around sawdust carpentry equipment and i'm right back in the show that's right yeah i feel like i'm right back in the shop yeah these are like twisted mdf things yeah they're they're awesome military pretzels target is a two player only game in which you are deploying some workers around an action sort of square with all the cards around this large square giving you an ability but also where the two where your three workers intercept in the center of this card grid you'll be earning that card as well you either there's two kinds you get something one of the various goods in the game or you can spend goods and and buy that card build it in front of you knowing i mean there's too many gears within gears for this to be casual i think it's not just what do i want from the middle but how do i get it because to to hit this card there are four cards that go on to it right you'll need two of those to intercept so which ones in what order and then when you trigger all the things you get you get three actions and possibly two cards from the center the order in which you trigger them will also matter how you build those cards in front of you will matter there's too many moving parts that affect each other too much for this to be casual i think people will kind of just i was arguing that point right now i'm arguing that point slow down so you're saying that against my cards yeah i'm out it has cards this is too much it's a hard war game like game i think it has all that you're i don't disagree with you i just don't think you have to put that kind of effort in when you're playing you can say i want that resource i'll put my thing here i'd be very happy here i guess i'll go there you're talking about oh look at all these things i don't think you have to do that to play the game i just would be hesitant to teach this to somebody who didn't play a lot of games you know i think this is going to be out of the comfort zone for a lot of people that don't play a lot of times i would though would you yeah i mean it has multiple resources it has guests these principles that is awesome i would not in fact remind me we're done here to get rid of those pencils they're going okay i thought that thing kept everything from getting stale no no it's just a trash bag out on the counter why'd you think no not wait when you said no not that i was making a joke especially weren't these pretzels from essen three years ago or that actually we've had them for a while i mean they were next to gummy bears from the late 1800s anyway target is my number seven i like this one it's one of my favorite two-player only games fantastic talking about setting things up for complexity my next game i was talking about magic this is another spin-off of magic it's like mixing magic mage wars and a deck builder together because it has all three of those mechanisms and that's codex oh my gosh what a throwback i have not played this i really like codex codex you have these you and before the game starts you pick a color magic that you have and i think there are six colors yeah there's six different colors of magic but each of those is broken up into three sections like so purple magic is time magic you can decide to do past present future oh i see because you have this notebook you see all these cards and again you're kind of buying these cards but then you put them in a deck and you build this deck and then you use this deck to play people in front of you and attack the other person like sounds like wars too like you said so it's like mage wars in that you have the book right but then you're not put the cards out in front of you you put them in a deck i see and then you shuffle that deck right and the stuff comes out of the deck and you cast spells and do different things you have heroes that go up in levels and it sounds fairly complex because well it it is a little bigger but once you understand it i think it goes fairly smoothly but i wouldn't even suggest this to most people right right if you said i really like magic but i'm looking for something else i'd be like oh here's a cool game and also you get every card when you fork out the huge amount of cash that it costs to buy this sirloin games aren't cheap uh-huh and now this one's out of print yeah it's probably more expensive easier to find yeah but it's one of my favorites so that's why it's on the list is it in the library yes there you go uh what library that would be funny if you were like what library what do you what do you think those things that was just that was just uh kenny's game called you not looked at the card catalog next to your desk z no what are you doing you were supposed to build that [Music] [Music] oh all right well my number six is not a war game but it is a historical game a historical themed game i i'm feeling like a lot of my games on this list have that kind of either historical i would never guess he was a history teacher there is that but it's funny i don't always get gravitated towards those types of games i don't know why but this is what your list says otherwise it does for this list it absolutely does this is a newest newer game called unforgiven this to me uh you had i was hoping you put this on your list yeah you um who had seven uh seven wonders duel you did on on the last list yes yeah this is the one for me this is uh it has a very similar feel to seven wonders duel mechanically um mechanismally is that their youth anyway yeah you think it's really similar it's very similar but uh i i just i like that what this does a little bit more i like kind of the the push and pull the tug of war element that you've got there i like the card play this this i feel like is a really really cool game that is a nice theme that you wouldn't necessarily expect leads to a compelling gameplay experience but it really does if you have some background information on it it maybe makes it a little bit better but you don't need to i mean everybody knows i think even if you're not an american that abraham lincoln was assassinated and that might be all you might be all you know that might be all you need to know i'm sorry yeah you know here's the thing though i can't divorce that from my playing of the game sure i love that theme a lot if it wasn't there would i still like the game oh yeah yeah yeah it's a good game but that theme really helps the theme is great but mechanically i really like the the way this game works too i like the kind of the card market the the very familiar you know kind of uh pyramid of cards that you're drafting from i think it just works great as a two-player drafting method and sure that that came from seven wonders duel and i think even was acknowledged in the rule book as such but um i feel like this does a little bit on top of that without kind of having the parts of seven wonders duel that aren't my favorite which is really kind of the science and military uh that's just not my favorite technically that's in this game it kind of is but it feels different to me i don't know it just feels different to me than that fitting seven wanders duel it's in this oh whatever i like the game i would teach seven wonders duel to a casual game which was why it was on my catchy list first because i think that theme is more accessible this i'd be like do you like assassin's creed and theater yes assassinations in your theater i would not be using that it's about a trial it's about a trial it's a good game i don't know six is my number six it's several one or two no yes it is oh did you not even know that this whole time i've never made this list before no i made the list i forgot i wasn't looking um seven wonders duel is if you've ever played unforgiven right right is that what it's called yes good uh if you've never played on forgiven uh or if you have played unforgiven this is very similar to that except that it came first and is better it did come first and everything mike just said just think of that but with an interesting theme no screen caps and weird awful grainy pictures oh no the pictures are cool in there you like that i absolutely do 100 i think it looks great you like the sort of dusty looking vibe for the whole thing oh my word like they are already doing that in 800 of our games they're just medieval paintings whatever i think drew i think the art looks fantastic and i'm forgiving i like the art in this too don't get me wrong but i wouldn't complain about the art in either of the game this is frozen oh everything's wrong coconuts you like the pretzels stale stale thing frozen your hat it's not that's nice i tried it where are we so good you would have made more fun seven wonders duel is a great tug-of-war style game i think that doesn't physically need to show the tug of war though it is there with the you know with the combat i guess the military military i like the three different ways in which the game can end but at the end of the day you might convince me that it's a little lighter than perhaps the rest of the list warns and if so add the expansion either one and they both then it it very much takes that outside of that realm of something i would teach to someone sure sure so both of the expansions are very good and they both add enough moving parts that now it is just too much this is two crossovers so far it is with the previous list yes [Laughter] is awesome and belongs on this list yeah all right my next game is one of the lightest on this list um but i think it's it's it's complicated enough because there's multiple things going on there's bag building plus chess maneuvering and this is war chest oh okay i thought you can see some different guys now war just could be played with four but it's it's best with two it's a it's it's again a game where you're kind of splitting stuff up in war chess you have different units each game you get different units whatever they might be and then you each unit is represented by these big amazing poker chips that you throw into a bag and then you pull them from the bag and you can use them to activate your chips you can make your chips stronger or put more out on the board but the more you put out in the board the fewer in your bag to activate them and then they each move differently and you're trying to capture different points in the board there's a lot going on in this game it's not an easy game to teach because you're teaching this whole concept of whatever i have in my bag is also corresponds with my movement points corresponds with how strong stuff is on the board it's a really tricky line okay i really like this game and then the components don't hurt it sure abstract it's it's a it's as abstract as chess i mean yes the the canon can shoot things and this the horse can move farther but yeah that would change about it sure sure well yes but chess is slow the queen is very fast that horse is missing a leg so when it goes twice forward it goes in thirds and that's what it means right that's exactly right yeah well how does the castle work that explain that theming to me it gets pushed over and only falls in a straight line really far really as far as you want it to but only in a straight line and never over something because it's a poem these bedtime stories for kids about chess and i'm like trying to come up with a story i'm like so this bishop you see he liked to slide across rooms unseen so he'd go from one corner to the other does the electric slide anyway war chest a really good game [Music] all right my number five is by far the heaviest game on my list and i'd venture to say any list the heaviest game on any of these lists is it a war game fast right no it's not a war game how can it be that heavy and not be a war game explain that to me hey this is a different kind of pretzel that one's not stale it might not be let's try it let's see what happens obviously if you say something dumb first i won't it's this is uh this is a this is cloud spire my number five is cloud spot that is pretty heavy this is very very heavy um and what's heavier this is another game pick something that's heavy both ways the game itself what's it got to be something heavier than that oh sure advanced you know i'm thinking about the games in my life yeah so i mean that's something that's so heavier sure i'm sure there are many games that are heavier but this is a this is a very heavy game number two it's stale but it's uh edibly stale the distribution of that shape it makes it work no i think just not been in there as long as how many more of those do i got in here keep going mike this is awful all right anyway classifier is another game that you can play with more than two but to me this is very much a two-player game it's kind of like a moba style tower defense game where you are drafting different units that are represented by these poker chips and every one of these units have multiple keywords that affect the way that they either can move or the way they attack or special powers they have it is a bit overwhelming quite honestly it's not easy to teach it is not easy to learn but it's one of those games it's a lifestyle game i think it's one of those games where if you take the time to learn it and internalize the rule set and play it often enough that you don't need to relearn it every time you play it it is an incredibly satisfying experience a very very um i don't know it's deep it's a very if i want to get into spoilers here but i would have thought you would put a different game from this company on your list um it won't be spoiling mine i did not put too many bones on here okay only because i think that too many bones works with with a different player counts better than cloud spire does cloudspire i've played with four i will never do that again if i can help you what about three there was a pr when we i only played it once we played three yeah and i felt there was some problems about that i think two seems like it's the way it would make two is this or solo it's a fantastic solo game but two is the sweet spot for for multiplayer um you can play it with three you could play with four i wouldn't um mike's not kidding enough we played this game to be like mike from the beginning yeah from the beginning again and that's why roy and i keep talking about playing it again because we don't want to forget i played it enough i feel good that i can teach you anyway he put up two thumbs up i don't think so i think roy's into it so anyway you should be into it too if it appeals to you because it is a pretty thinking game and a lot of investment both monetarily and learning the rules but i think it's worth it cloud spires it's also the biggest player you'll ever get yes you're like oh this week oh there's more a lot of keywords man i'll tell you mike roy might be somewhat into cloud spire but you know what he's really into what is marvel champions the card game really marvel champions the card game really decided to buy you lunch wait munch is over tacos um tostada not that no never again pretzels never forget too soon never forget like six months terrible experience um marvel champions the card game the reason i went with this and this is the only lcg of the you know living card game of these the reason i went with this is because i think it is a the closest from being a one player to a two player and staying really strong and interesting than some of the other ones i've played okay the two-player game gains quite a bit from the ability because you are switching as your hero and its alter ego you're switching back and forth between those two personas and uh you know either fighting or perhaps trying to deal with uh more intangible threats the two players have to sort of coordinate what they want what they want to do i'm gonna go on the offensive okay i'll hang back and try to clear this threat or we need to mount an attack so let's both sort of go forward you know put on the outfit attack you can intercept if your opponent is about to be attacked you can sort of jump in the way and deal with that the dynamic story telling that you can sort of suck out of the marrow of the game i like that about it which i which is why i think it's a great single player game but it is an equally good two player game and for most of the other ones i sort of prefer them a little bit at one and they're also really good at two this one roy is like giving me this sort of weird like roy royce roy's yeah what is going on this is super creepy you really think this has an emergent narrative uh this game i guess i hadn't thought about it that way i suppose no i think it has it's not a narrative by any means i think it has highs and lows okay different sort of pressure yeah i can see that yeah you know what i mean yeah yeah like i'm getting beat i'm going to go hide in on may's basement or whatever right right and while doing that i'm not being attacked like the game will not attack you right because if you are just peter parker instead whatever character it is rhino or whatever they're out there spreading chaos and when you're ready you've healed you've drawn some cards you feel like you know you've built yourself up you can sort of put on the costume again and go back out okay if two players are doing that it's more interesting you know yeah um so yeah i really like it marvel champions the card game and two is a great game very lot's going on also which is what makes this list all right i'm going to up the complexity here although i think mike might have beat me but mine's a better game so my number two i played it once twilight struggle if i had a mic i would drop it yeah anyway twilight struggle the entirety of the cold war from 1945 to 1989 in a box there are other games of this ilk there's 1989 they just came out with imperial struggle last year there's smaller versions like watergate blitzkrieg have feelings of this which i like those any game that does this which is essentially a giant tug of war that's what this game is but man the theme in this game and every game i don't know what to do every time i play this i'm like oh do i want to mess around in southeast asia this time or i'm going to try to take cuba or i'm going to nor no north korea this time or cuba so anywho i really liked all the options here and then there's a space race going on in the background this is this is just a great two-player game but let me ask you this question i i actually considered putting this on my list but i've only played it as an app and that's what kept me from you playing against against the computer yeah well then you don't know of the two player that's that's a solo i guess that's the thing that kept it off the list i mean i understand the the appeal of it i mean it's a very very clever system um i feel like you you won't know what you're doing until you know both decks very well because you kind of have to know what could happen you're going to unless you're playing a kind-hearted teacher right you're going to get wrecked you're going to get wrecked your first game because again we were mentioned another game where you need to know the decks there's a lot going on here but once you do it is it is beautiful ballet was this not like the number one ranked on board game geek for a time yeah it really was it's it's a it's a superb game and it's i mean i figured it would make this list i've never played it yeah i thought you have both played try the app no i'm good try the app do it so anyway twilight struggle fantastic game [Music] oh we're back so your number five was a game of wouldn't you say a political intrigue would you would you not say that twilight struggle is a game of political intrigue that was my number five yeah would you say that would you say that it's a game he's asking political interests i'm i would say that tom's number five is a game that has a hefty amount of political intrigue my number four also is a game of political intrigue at least it's themed that way what it really is is a fantastic two-player game asymmetric game called watergate uh watergate you mentioned watergate i'm aware that's what i'm saying i was trying tom i was trying to be sympathetic in my mid list it would be that's what i'm saying this i'm not going to say that this is the heaviest game on the war in the planet but it's also not one that i can use that thing every time it's not the heaviest game in the planet no kidding it's it to me there's some game that is the heaviest game on the planet well true i did not feel comfortable putting this on the casual list so i did feel comfortable putting it on this list okay that's why i had the middle list this is that's not fair if no one tells you about the middleweight how are you supposed to do i don't get the memo maybe it's in the card catalog and i just didn't get to it but it's by the pretzels on the counter fair enough watergate is a fantastic uh two-player game where you have kind of an asymmetric feel where one person is playing as nixon the other person is playing as the press trying to kind of uh infiltrate what's happening behind the scenes the whole watergate controversy again this is a game where if you are familiar with the theme then likely it's going to even ramp it up even more but even if you don't know anything about watergate it's a very compelling game it just is a really good two player game it feels like it is so well attuned that i've heard people argue that one side is harder than the other i don't know if that's true it feels very balanced to me it's almost symmetrical yeah it's the brief it's no no i think yeah i feel like it's pretty well balanced i mean um and and honestly the way i prefer to play the game is to play it back to back and change roles that to me is my favorite way to play this game 45 minutes maybe at most most yeah really so you can knock out two of these in an hour and it's good then you play for like 15 minutes right right um and it's just a really really compelling experience a very very good two-player how many of your games have been historical so far that's a really yeah i didn't realize that so far if you count shaliah which technically could probably not i'll keep that one out it doesn't it's just an event how many of these are like kind of based on almost specific events if not specifically so far four of mine i have been historical based yeah yeah yeah yeah but you're fine that's fine just you keep it like wow okay i'm putting a historical game on my list a lot of mine are based on historical events too if you use my definition of historical mm-hmm as some of you know from various lists i've done in the past historical basically just means true okay here we go my number four is also a multiplayer game but i've played a lot of it at only two and i think it is a great game for two this is everdell this was not a game i expected to be on this list right it's a terrible pick it's an awful pick no i don't know that i've played every day or not i don't know if i've played this at two i've played it at two have you it's fine at two okay yeah you played it i played it two with roy it was a memorable experience let me tell you next week when we do our top 10 gaming experiences of all time i don't want to give any spoilers number one evernote before people get too expensive we're not doing that right we're not doing that sorry that was just a joke now people are you're gonna get at least three emails about that two of them please do it and one of them please make mike shut up there we go um okay everdell he sent me that email i want to go right right as soon as i'm done here throw out the pretzels then right there everdel add two players is very tight you're still fighting over the same worker placement spots there are fewer of them of the ones you sort of put along the fourth a change that you don't deploy all four i think you put up two or three or whatever you put out fewer so there are fewer places there's a lot of again tactical gaming in general is something that i really like having a long-term plan is nice and especially one that you come up with you sort of formulate and then sits in the back of your head and you check on it every now and then like am i still trying to do this yeah great okay whatever go away how do i react to what's happening and this is a game that gives you lots of moments for that there's a a pool of cards that basically players are sharing they can build from it you better be on top of what's out there if you intend to be opportunistic in what you're building um worker placement spots when your opponent recalls their workers at the end of one of their seasons how long do you wait and sort of do other things until they finally go and you're like ah finally i can do what i've been waiting to do combos you make you know what what you go for in that case what we should have combos let me can i ask you a a devil's advocate question z say yes because i'm gonna do it anyway yes all right pretty big deck of cards yes many of the cards require another card to interact with do you feel like with two players that that becomes a problem like do you feel like you're kind of looking for cards that don't ever show up in the market that's my concern how many more cards do you think you see in a three-player game yeah it's a fair question but they're being cycled a bit more so let's say like i don't remember it was like the husband and wife or the mayor and and i'm like i remember playing i was like well where's this card going to be is it going to ever show up so that's going to happen less in a two-player game maybe but there's also a lot of and you'll probably remember this there's a lot of locations where you draw cards in the game that you probably don't use a lot that is true and also you've played this a lot you will use them more in a two-player game and that's why i know you've played this a lot too that's why this is a legitimate question i was asking have you you haven't found that probably it felt uh you know uh inflammatory this was a horrible picture i want you to definitely actually felt like a lawyer like yes yes yes your honor i'm leading the witness is what i'm doing here right objections your ultimate demise overruled yes i overruled your objection oh have you not watched an accurate unforgiven ones it feels like this is uh i ever tell i really enjoy so there you go my number four i i don't know if you would expect me to put this on my list but this is a game that came out last year and i love it and it can play with more than mike up to five i'm not sure i will only play it at two maybe solo but two for sure because it's so big even at two that more than that is just too much but i love the game and that's monumental i almost put this on the list really it was on my short list i almost put it on there i agree with you 100 monumental is a deck building game yeah where when you play the cards you play them in this they put out in this grid and then you pick a row or a column to do and then all those cards activate you get resources and you use them to buy more cards or wonders of worlds and then move around on the map it's fantastic it's such a good game it's i really like this game it's one of my favorite games the analysis paralysis is huge with more than two players two it's just exactly where you want to be i'm looking at your board going oh it's interesting and then right when my interest starts waning it's my turn again yeah you know with three people you're like oh now it's your turn and also the cards change more yes and from the cards you can buy when there's when you're playing with four players you might as well not even look at it for sure until but with two players he might buy one or two so i'm looking for my second choice too like if you like stuff like don't buy my car don't buy the one i want yeah and yeah and having more players doesn't change the warring aspect of it with two players it's not really a fighting game anyway it's more i mean there's a little bit of fighting but it's not certain certain civilizations will be more suited to fighting you might you know if you have a more war like but you're not like conquering the other person you're more like pushing them out of areas right okay i really like this game it takes a lot of table space so i think it also works well with two yes um in that regard because it takes up less space but just a fantastic game i keep thinking about this i haven't played it for a while and i'm i'm kind of raring to try it again well the expansion hopefully is relatively soon and that will definitely be something i want to get back out and play doesn't this have like a billion expansions though no i have one so far i'm thinking of a different game though what's it called monumental i'm thinking of dominations yeah dominations came out at the beginning with a bunch of games never mind in my whole dance this whole time i've been thinking of like this is a little triangle game yeah no no no no no is it deck building and this is from a designer you like matthew dunstan yeah yeah i haven't played this yeah good game there's a bunch of games on these lists i haven't played catch up on all three of them in fact the problem with the problem with catching you up on this one is it's nobody caught that huh yeah i said there were games i hadn't played on all three lists hey if you had to spell the joke i know it was too subtle mario mantle hey we gotta [Music] we have a couple super chats that are all fawning on mike first one says mike is spot on with everything he said today give this man some fresh pretzels you say i appreciate the thought but i don't want pretzels as my reward not if they're these there's another super said fresh pretzels oh okay there was that one way up there i thought it was that flesh pretzel whoa no there it is great list mike do you like spirit island up too i do like spirit islander too uh i considered that that was the only question asked you don't need to expand i considered it for the list but um i also think that it works well at higher player counts too i saw a comment that said that you and me were just way too mean to mike so we're doubled down double down it said that i'm equally mean someone said someone said i don't know how mike puts up with lizzie and tom they're so awful or something no we we we all have fun here help me no all right [Laughter] my number three is a uh two player only asymmetrical game called skulk hollow um this is i like this isn't this a good game yeah this is a really good game this is one where you are either playing as these forest dwelling creatures and you there are a number of them like the robin hood yeah yeah and or you're playing as this big kind of behemoth monster and uh the way it plays is diff is different for each side but you're doing you're playing cards essentially to kind of drive your actions and one of the things that i like about the game so much that i think is very cool is that when you are attacking the monster when you're the kind of forest creatures there's a board that represents that monster and you are literally climbing on to him and the different spots on the monster represent different actions that they can take it might be stomp or smash and if you can disable that part now the monster doesn't have that action anymore until they can heal up it's like i really want to be able to do the smash attack but i can't because they've disabled my arm or my claw or whatever it might be okay um it's not the heaviest game and so this would probably be better on that middle list that we don't have i i debated on this one for a long time i really like it but i don't think it's a casual game either no i don't think that is so uh it fits on this list really well it has a great production as you can see there on the screen uh i think it's just pencil first is best game i uh yeah well i probably so and i like a lot of their games but this is just the right level of asymmetric you know how sometimes asymmetric games are almost too much and you feel like you're playing two different games sure this doesn't have that but you also do feel like you're doing something unique to the other players from the other okay just at the right level so i think skull call is a really really solid game good production just a good game check it out another one i haven't played i don't know if you'd like it or not i think you might you might my number three is a classic game magic the gathering i saw some folks in the comments talking about magic the gathering a little bit earlier sort of thinking like oh maybe somebody will put it on their list i did and maybe somebody else did it's not on my list but it could have been i'm not again if i had made the list this week it might have been on my list yeah really i've been messing so much with that new it's sort of in your head now i haven't played it enough to put it on my list we're gonna actually fix that but yeah i'm sure i mean magic the gathering is certainly there's no question as to which of the two lists it belongs on yeah because there's a ton going on it's a very deep game with an evolving card pool if you wanted to have an evolving card pool and an evolving meta game if you wanted to but i don't worry about either one of those things really i don't i used to buy the dual decks which they no longer produce but this would be you know two whatever themed decks balanced against each other i would get that and play those two against each other so didn't even worry about the deck building the deck construction or modification just play the game and even that as as basically as low a level of entry as you can get is still a thinking game with a lot of steps to your turn a lot of things to consider when you attack and don't what you play out the timing of what you do there's just a ton going on yes there are things about magic gathering that other ccgs have collectible card games have for decades now attempted to fix and change because there are obvious things that didn't age so well like mana and getting too much mana or not enough to be able to do what you want to do but the game is a classic for a reason also it's a fantastic card game that has a lot going on in it so magic the gathering even casually which is definitely where i live with it is an enjoyable experience my number three you know if there's one thing that's not makes it casual and i was just complaining to roy about this i bought these new decks and they they literally don't have the rules of them you know you know they they list a few things and i'm like okay great there's a new set out i'm like oh cool how does this new stuff work you got to go hunt it down online and it's not even that easy to find i like i like type how does this work and i'll find an article written by somebody talking about it or an overview on a news website that explains it and it's almost like magic is being taught through osmosis to people like the best way for you to learn magic is someone to teach you someone to teach you magic which is probably i would guess the way 99 of people who know magic have learned today yes i do remember a couple of years ago they were trying really hard they being wizards to to kind of make an effort to teach new players to introduce new players to magic but it seems like that's kind of gone by the wayside now you're right it's like it just feels that way like i'm opening these cards i'm like i don't know what this does go to look in the rules it's not there it's online somewhere right okay fine i can figure it out sure or i ask roy um but you also have a lot of background and context for the game yeah but but that's that would keep it off the casual list straight up on that yard for sure all right we're on number three i love this game with two players as long as one of those players knows how to hit a wall oh come on you mean a rock anything not movable hashtag too soon it's been a year gloom even john johnson's the lion actually you know what i didn't even think about this is a great pick i didn't even think about it i love this game with two players yeah it's fine with one sure it's a good solo game and i played it solo but being with one person you're like yeah let's do it together and you're going because with with one player you have to play two characters anyway yeah so with two you might as well each have your own character right and i think let's get into it i zoned out of being able to play it um because i was playing solids here right and i started with the two characters as they say and i went through i don't know a few missions yeah and eventually just it was too much to keep track it is so i sort of like you know uh the the weight of it sort of like eventually just pushed me out and i put it down and figured i'll come back to this when i can split the load yes with another player and i can run one character with two you're right this is a good pick but we took this one a lot actually it was really fun it was i had more fun with mike than by myself wow that's a high company they said something nice see um but where was i during all this you both suck i'm not playing this with three actually i had played it i played regular gloom haven with with z back in the day and it was better solo um you saw it no that was actually i was playing with three people and i found that i liked solo better than three yeah but i like two better than one i just like this best one too yeah and it works really well you nice back talk and fourth i don't know i know some people love gloomhaven to get together with four people have like a almost a role-playing night they're going through and i get that that's fine but the two things just the zooplayer thing worked really well for me most of these scenarios are designed in such a way that it's really close one way or the other and with one other person there those kind of stand-up moments on the on on the they just feel so much better that way again it does help if you have a modicum of swinging now and now he took away everything i was feeling good for a moment and now you can go where we want to jump in this way through if you want to see the worst luck ever like i thought i think i'm breaking the realm of mathematics somehow all right someone wouldn't know gloom i know [Music] we're at the top almost yeah we're getting close all right my number two is a tactical skirmish game that technically plays with more than two but again this is one i think is very very clearly best at two this is wildlands by martin wallace really oh yeah absolutely this is a great two-player he loves this game yeah this is a great one i love it too but i'm happy with that more i think it's better too especially on the um i would say with the base box this is probably glad you mentioned that it it's okay with the base box because those maps are a little bit larger but there have been some two-player maps that have come out that it's so good on those two player maps man they're great okay um you know basically this idea is that you've got uh some units and it's kind of asymmetrical too but it's all card driven and at the beginning of the game you are drafting cards to decide where your units are going to pop up on the map and you're also deciding where some gems are going to be placed out on the board that your opponent is trying to get us you're actually your opponent's gems and so it creates some really clever tactical play where you can either try to spread the gems out so they have to run all over the map or maybe you're going to put the gem somewhere that you can pop up and hit them if they try to come out and get it yeah this is a a really i like to pop out an idiot yeah that's right it's like that is not overwhelming in the rules but it's definitely i don't think a casual game either because there's enough card play and interactions between the cards and line of sight and different terrain and the different maps can also make things a little bit more complex they might involve different types of movement or things along those lines so i really i i talk about wildlands a lot maybe too much but it's a really good game with two that's my number two wow too much my number two is again one of those games that more strongly than probably any other game i've said i prefer with two this is this is a game i will stick to the count of two players only and after that not only does it get sort of messier tactically but the resolution of things is going to be a total pain i know what it is you do know what it is go ahead never shoot my hex you know it because because i thought about that when you play before you're like what's going on here yeah i'm sorry at that point i need a computer to figure this out niroshima x absolutely a great two-player game this is a a light war game yeah i'm gonna use it who is z i don't even recognize z anymore this is an abstract this is an abstract game uh in this one you are taking two groups two factions in this post-apocalyptic world and having them clash on the battlefield in a very organized manner in fact because you're going to be taking turns deploying units and traps sometimes and whatever and then at some point a battle is triggered and you go through the resolution order of these things as they wipe each other off the board so it's the the cadence is very interesting it is not a game in which this sort of a constant battle it's mostly chess and then you give all the chess pieces automatic weapons right i was going to ask if you could refuse as an abstract it is yeah the funny thing is i actually enjoy the theme and i allow it to sort of inform my fun of the game a lot in this game i think the theme actually it's very abstract it's weird but the theming comes out also in the different armies sure this army throws nets right this army has one attacker i really think that yes while this feels mechanically it feels abstract and abstracted to a high degree right it's very thematic i think you know there's like an army that's zombies right and they keep coming back when they one of them gets killed off you don't discard the unit you put it on top of your spawn pile stuff like that is all over the game yeah and it makes it feel like i'm playing these people so i started like using and identifying the different groups this game is an amazing mash and mix-up between a cool theme it is the mash yeah i was going to say mashup and or match one of the two so i went with mash it's a great meeting place between a really cool theme that i like a lot post-apocalyptic gobbledygook and lots of thinky tactical moments and i um i've played this a ton i mean i've played this is one of my most played games so yoshima hacks had two players lots to think about i would not want to play this with more than two i think you're yeah all right let's reel back now i've been i've been very america trashy on my list let's jump over to the word of mary out of it am i not supposed to be the one eating it i'm confused i don't know what's going on anytime you say something dumb oh no that was classy that was a good that was a good burn i was glad that's why i ate the last remaining non-sale all right all right um this one i'll play with three three's fine i refuse to play a four or five but i love it with two and if there's two people and you wanna play a euro game let's play my favorite game ahav oh have is gray at two now i know there is as an aside there is a two-player game called lahav inland port right which is a very different game there's also a two-player game called fields of aural also a very different game it is none of his games really feel like lehigh to me like i'll say oh agriculture they feel the same and howlertown feels like fields of oral right that's a little bit of that in there i mean he definitely wants you to feed your people mm-hmm but in this game and those are nice containers i thought you might say something about those are pretty good errors but i love this game just collecting resources in with two it's great because you go four times around or three times around you know when you're like i'm only gonna go three times that's still pretty awesome yeah okay and you just get to do stuff like i'll take that pile of fish i'll buy this i'll turn this into i don't know i'm just enjoying myself the whole time i love this game it's been so long since i've played this i need to play it again uh you really love this game man i really do i think about it all the time people come over and make they'll be like let's play a game i'm like oh there's four people all right we'll play something else just assume that if you meet tom at a con somewhere and he's maybe looking past you just imagine he's thinking about lahav is what it is don't take it personally i want that policy he's distracted by the fish i'll buy that malvera are you saying no [Music] apparently roy had we we reached max awkwardness and he was like i have to move on and he's like you guys are making this awkward we're like yeah we know roy hit the crib wasn't an accident all right so number one two players no um is it a two player only game it is a two player only game i have a sneaking suspicion that may cross over with z for his number one we both are very fond of this game he just says he likes the game no he i never heard he was fond of any game z has a tremendous amount of personal fondness for this game from the doctor reiner kenichi this is blue moon or blue moon legends unfortunately unfortunately both of them are out of print which i don't think will be the case this is your number one yes this game is fantastic are you kidding me four pretzels i love this game um to me when uh when we mentioned you know that we were doing these lists i almost thought okay can this go on the casual game list and i thought no this is not a casual game uh because again why good it's a fantastic game like a lot of canisius designs the rules are relatively simple but the depth is in the decks and i've heard a lot of people say oh this is just like glorified war you you if you win you you win by luck no play against somebody that knows how to play this game bring it tom they will destroy you consistently it's not a game based on luck it's not about the draw of course there's luck anytime you're drawing cards luck is going to be involved but this is a game of push and pull tug of war there's a little bit of getting into the mind of your opponent there's a lot of different type of card powers and the different factions play differently all of that i think makes it less than uh not a not a casual game and more you're seeing a lot of dumb things i guess apparently this is a great i i think this is a fantastic game i'm going to keep talking though so he'll keep eating these horrible presents talk about how amazing it is yes no deal with his pretzel thing eat more um yeah no i i really really think this is a fantastic two-player game it's not the heaviest on any of these lists but i don't think it's a casual game uh that's why it's my number one blue moon or blue moon legends and i feel like z is going to let me down he looks like he's disappointed in my pick no it's a good pick he's this point he didn't pick it i got two words for you middle list i know but it's this is not a casualty just outside of casual yeah and just below advanced okay this list is called advanced i know but it's not casual but it just doesn't feel that advanced do you know what i mean yeah yeah yeah when i made the other list i'm like nah blue moon is not casual right you know what i mean yeah that's what was it it's almost exactly like some jerk some added demon had some sort of unspoken middleweight forgot to tell anybody about the middle miss we couldn't do a top ten middle of the rough two player games i didn't know what to do for that regard yeah it was basically we we did this either or thing and this field fit on this list more than on casual it would have been the lightest game on my list i think yeah all right what's your number one you think you think blue moon is lighter than 7 wonders duel i too really i don't know i don't know about that i do i think so um anywho my number one is a two-player only game okay kind of thing sport game with jason cool is evil it's full of evil in this game claustrophobia cluster huh whatever that game is that you like so much the claustrophobia game 14 27. wrong year so that's not it gotcha claustrophobia 1643 ah you're so dumb that's right eat a bunch of pretzels no yeah claustrophobia 1643 or claustrophobia the original one was just called that whatever either one i don't care pick one ah is a fantastic two-player game a ton of the things we've talked about here as being good two-player things are in this game asymmetric exploration um tactical and strategic like you have an overreaching mission you have so because you have a scenario but then you need to react to what the other player is doing one player has a group of humans who are trying to achieve something go into these tunnels under the earth and then bomb and exit for the demons or just escape or whatever the other player the aforementioned demons with an endless supply of troglodytes hunting you down impeding your progress messing you up along the way combat system smooth clever straightforward mechanically a great mix of a euro game in many ways to high thematic concepts everything about this game sings for me i think it's a fantastic game the new one took some getting used to because it was pretty different actually especially visually and then they reworked some of the rules to the previous uh edition of this but either one i find very captivating it's also a game that manages to be a dungeon crawler in like 45 minutes which is just a rarity yeah you know what i mean it's also isn't it rare to have a two-player only dungeon crawl i'm trying to think of another one it's two player only very different sides yeah quick many of the scenarios not all of them but many of them involve actually finding out what's in front of you in these caverns i love that i mean this game is superb it's a giant box you know so it's a lot for one for for a two player only game is quite a bit but yeah it's so good all right tom you're going to have to uh redeem us because according to the chat chris's non-existent list and some list that apparently roy put up are better than all three of ours so you've got to save us here okay well first of all wow no um secondly we'll talk about that when i'm done with my number one but thirdly it's a crossover of sorts it should be a full crossover but one of us doesn't bother playing new games and that would be summoner wars but to be clear second edition the garbage edition no i love them it's it's a slight variation of a better and better i love summon awards i really do it is streamlined it is fun every faction feels completely different than the other ones the concept of your deck oh yeah this is the picture from seminars anyway um summoner wars the concept of your deck also being your units and making the choice to put out the unit or yeah right that's not really in many games if any and that also the fact that it's a really small deck runs out pretty quickly the game is forced to end right i just love it i really do it's not easy to you know it's a good game that's to be taught to you it's not that difficult to play after a while to get good at it it is though this is again one of the lower ones my list of complexity wise but it's my favorite so of to play two players if someone's here they're a gamer they want to play two-player game i'm like have you ever played summoner awards that's where we're at did you put this on your list too i did not it's not my favorite game i think it's fine but i don't love it and he's just not my favorite game he means no i i don't know i like it original but nothing new i have not played the new i played the original i i no i legitimately mean i think it's fine i think it's like you know for me it would print like a seven maybe all right let's uh go to you folks well we didn't make a uh we didn't do a poll this time but we'll let you shout out some in the comments we'll answer them but if you shout them out you also gotta thumb up the list too i'd like to hit 200 thumbs if we can i've seen star wars rebellion i have not played what will do roy said what was your number two roy was uh war of the ring yeah and his number three was star wars rebellion sure so that will make everybody else happy yes i just haven't played it i like both those games they just did make my top ten that's all right uh arkham horror was brought up okay oh race for the galaxy is not that i don't think it's too casual for this list race for galaxy is an excellent two-player game and it's very possible that i didn't think of it but let's pretend that i did think of it i like it at all player counts i used to say it was best as a two-player game but i've come around in that i really like with three too a couple people mentioned starship catan that was on my short list i had that written down along with monumental starship consent yeah it's a good one yeah it is a good one there they go huh dice thrown that's not a bad choice i just i think that's more casual i actually did consider looks more complicated right it's it's really yeah imperial sellers on fire same games we actually put on our list right right yeah yeah terrifying mars i like that one more i think yeah i did consider fields of oral someone put fields of oral there and i mentioned it during the game face-to-face now it's casual journeys of middle earth no i'd pick war to bring over that anyway battle lore i thought about it second edition anyway oh that's true that's a good one shogi showed up on the casual list for me rams and crusoe i don't know what were the ones that you had that we didn't put um i had uh i don't even know shouldn't you not even know when you just got in like 20 seconds you made up there we go here we go marvel champions in ukraine with you worth of rings star wars rebellion summoner wars it's both of us leave that mystery battle or unmatch that goes with you magic with you hero clicks with nobody um dice masters with you inspector ops you know what i mean i don't know it's obviously a very intangible thing how heavy or complex a game is gut feeling yeah other games people are saying net runner grand austrian hotel is a good choice because that's not very good with more than two a lot of people are saying res arcana i i rezarcana is on my middle arcana works fine with more though i like that at three i like it best with two actually i like it best with seven cthulhu wars duel i didn't play that i considered it um i considered it five tribes says joey come on man it's great at two but it's equally good with more yeah i agree netrunner is you're crazy a tough game to get into a lot of people saying spirit island but again spirit island is better at i think or not better but it's good at other players what of an english man is pretty pretty light american sign language [Laughter] um star realms no star arms will be in the middle list scythe no not a two that's not that's not his best player i would not play side with two yeah no that's not his best player account castle burton is a great one too it's also pretty casual though i would consider to be casual very much casual yeah brass baby uh hive hive i just don't like hive that much but i can see it being on this list you like hive right that's your middle list kinda kinda dominion is good but dominion fits in this diminished in the middle is for me for sure because yes dominion can be complex but it can also be pretty simple and it goes up to like any kind of the player count as well it doesn't really change nothing about two players like makes you go dominion at two right we also realize that there are people out there who their entire top ten would be heavy war games yes and other people whose entire top ten would be ffg games or well that's kind of what we were but a little bit but um abstract strategy games and some people would pick from like the cosmos two player line or newer games on that line like what's the pipeline the two-player game uh yeah curious cargo but i wouldn't carry a huge fan of curious cargo myself that's because it was too advanced it made my head melt we did not get the 200 thumbs so we're just going to keep talking there we go it doesn't work yeah it will work batman all these people who are putting up suggestions are not thumbing this up so that's correct start no don't don't do that all right anyway lots of good answers here folks thanks so much for watching if you're watching this later on obviously put your favorite in the comments two-player game but see if someone else put it first and if they did then thumb up their response it's kind of like a way to vote for your favorite two-player yeah i like it the ones that get the most thumbs we do appreciate y'all watching we got more videos going up all week uh tomorrow you guys have a video going up where you reviewed anno 1800 goes up tomorrow anna 1800s super chat it says z no arkham horror i'm thinking is what they mean uh no i'm guessing you mean the the lcg and like i said when i talked about marvel champions i think this one is better going from one to two than arkham at one from one to two players so yeah i just picked one of the two we hit 200 thumbs did it brian says love you thank you thank you brian and then on uh we got other reviews going up all throughout the weekend and sunday i'll be reviewing the scent the new version of the scent coming out i keep forgetting the tagline to that one oh yeah i can't remember there's sense there's a new i want to say it's not another one what was it legends legends in the dark descent legends back that review is going up sunday so anyway we'll see you all next time until then i'm tom vassell i'm z garcia i'm mike alicio thanks to roy and chris for helping put this together see you next time [Music] my [Music] you

Channel: The Dice Tower

Views: 53,848

Rating: 4.9616766 out of 5

Keywords: board game, board, game, dice, card game, cards, catan, monopoly, tower, dice tower, vasel, review, tom vasel, vassel, settlers, gaming, GeekUsername: TomVasel, board game review, boardgame, uno, ticket to ride, apples to apples, educational games, educational, top 10, juegosdemesa, Brettspiele, ボードゲーム, brädspel, jeuxdesociété, משחקילוח, 보드게임, deskováhra, graplanszowa, bordspel, 棋盘游戏, gioco da tavolo, desková hra, gra planszowa, настольная игра, trò chơi trên bàn cờ, jogo de tabuleiro, لعبة اللوحة

Id: Hd_wgYRc5xI

Length: 92min 15sec (5535 seconds)

Published: Thu Jul 29 2021