The XboxEra Podcast | LIVE | Episode 166 - "Planet of Lana & ABK Drama" with Klas Eriksson

[Music] thank you foreign [Music] foreign [Music] foreign [Music] thank you [Music] foreign [Music] foreign [Music] [Music] foreign [Music] foreign [Music] [Music] foreign [Music] foreign [Music] [Music] [Music] thank you thank you [Music] [Music] [Music] you know [Music] [Music] foreign [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] foreign [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] foreign [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] foreign [Music] [Music] foreign [Music] [Music] [Music] if this is your first time or your usual time with us then welcome to Xbox era we provide a platform for the Xbox Community from our forums and Discord our main site with the latest news and reviews and our podcasts like the Xbox hero podcast and you have me at Halo We Exist our focus on the Xbox platform front and center because so many media Publications out there don't we love this community and believe Xbox really can be the very best place to play if you love what we do help us you can join as a YouTube member or even better subscribe to us on patreon you help us grow and get plenty of perks to enjoy as a token of our appreciation just head to patreon.com forward slash Xbox zero and as always thanks for sticking around this podcast is brought to you by patreon executive producer Tom Raptor [Music] Hello friends and welcome to episode 166 of the Xbox zero podcast I'm sick of mechanico back from another weekend off for holiday things but we're here and there's lots to talk about we've got a unique show I think for you today very packed but as your Xbox Centric publication that's funded by the community we welcome you we're looking forward to talking to everything today we've got a a good lineup I think joining me as per usual is special Nick what's going on uh we have Jesse in the in the Pulpit he'll make an appearance later but replacing Jesse is the third panel member is class Erickson from the wishfully team who'd recently developed planet of Lana which was fantastic welcome thank you so much for having me I'm excited thanks for making the time that's a hell of a title there third panel member and like I'm yeah like this is an official when you're on the crew you're on the cruise not an interview mate you're just part of the panel you know it's all it's all it's all go now from here welcome to the team uh we don't pay anything thank you that's all right that's okay I'm in it for the love no that's good that's good we're wrapped to have you so it's uh it's a pleasure to have you along um as always chat we welcome you um we know that everybody this weekend is going to be chit chatting about FTC and Xbox and all of the hilarious Shenanigans that's been going on Stateside we'll be getting that to the later in the show because we want to talk a little bit about planet of Lana and what what that game has done uh to Game Pass and how many people have loved it but before we do all of that as a personal reminder because you know I was off last week and I don't know if Nick does this as well as I do I'd like to remind you that uh we only support because of you guys and if you do love what we do head over to patreon.com where you can pledge your support or become a YouTube member right here and keep your eyes peeled on Xbox zero.com for the latest and greatest in Xbox news anyway now I've done that boring bit um class welcome welcome welcome to the crew um thank you you've just shipped planet of Lana which I you know notwithstanding Xbox era's review was glowing right we actually loved it we were featured in your accolades trailer which is always a nice thing to see because it's like a little reward for our work had to be there we were so grateful thanks guys but mine's blown a little bit it was wishfully's first game [Music] um uh how how how did you you pull off a first game in fact let's let's do two things how did wishfully start and how did you make a a pretty damned in fantastic Indie Masterpiece as your first ever release oh well thank you that's a that's a a big question yeah um well to the first question how we were funded founded so I will get to the funded no but it's really it's the brainchild of um of Adam like you told the story a few times but like um me and him are old friends like we've known each other since we were like 12 years old and we've been collaborating on on projects since then we went to high school together like sort of like a really media Communications focused High School um and then we we actually had uh before we actually we had a production video production company together but Adam's always been really into uh video games it's that's always sort of been his dream that he wanted to do and then one day he drew this um the key art that you've probably all seen for planet of Lana with when she's just standing with mui in the field and like looking up at the at the robot sort of the one we use for like nice thing so um and he just sort of sent that to me and a bunch of other collaborators and friends and said like I think you know this there's something here I think there's a video game and it just seemed like everyone who saw that art like just sort of agree that like yeah okay you know it evokes questions and like it just like you know it the the art the art style was so pretty and um and then I guess like you know once he realized that that was gaining traction he he started wishfully um or like you know decided to to have a go with it in Urban 2018 I think we started wow um the sister studio uh fully came on board as well it's partners and then like uh me myself Dan designer on on the game and technically technical animator who is also part of a production company he came on board and um and then our lead animator Ole angstrom he was sort of like the actual OG he jumped on board like um first with Adam I think um and then uh you know we started the company um and a little bit later thunderfuel came on board with the funding like but we pitched we pitched the game um for like a long time I think Adam says you know he did over like 100 100 Pages or something like that before we actually have found the funding yeah yeah that's surprising like yeah looks like you mentioned you mentioned the concept art and you look at the game just visually from a visual perspective and it's so arresting so it's like I might be surprised that it I was shocked that it took that many pitches like yeah wow yeah I mean you know it costs a lot of money to make a video game I don't blame people for not for not um you know taking a chance on improving unproven people like even though we've all sort of been in the creative Industries uh for I have long careers like you know in animation and film um like I said it's uh as far as the founders that was our first it was our first video game and none of us are like developers or anything like that so um you know I guess it makes sense in a while in a sense but um yeah but everyone just sort of like it really was that lead um the the key art that sell it to everybody yeah and it was the same with Takashi like our our composer Takeshi forecast like you know we only had like a couple of concept sketches um and the boys were at um I think it was Sweden games or something like that yeah and um uh it was a British journalist came and he just sort of saw these like sketches that we had and and wrote a piece and said like this looks really interesting and this is before thunderfool before any funny anything and um Takeshi just emailed Adam out of nowhere and said like just based on a few images saying like I really want to I really want to like to work on this yeah um and uh Adam thought it like he he thought someone was trolling him at first because it was like literally like The Way We Were The Way We Were pitching the game early on was like uh inside what was it oh yeah inside meets uh The Last Guardian in The Studio Ghibli Universe yeah yeah that's a good that's a good amalgamation yeah right yeah I can I can agree with that I'm on board with it that pretty much stayed the core core concept um but then so when obviously The Last Guardian composer got in touch Adam thought like it was a joke because you know but it wasn't soundtrack yeah and and you know on the soundtrack I mean it plays I mean a it's incredible that you know my my partner's classically trained and she was like oh let's get hints of Beethoven and stuff like that as inspirational pieces but I've got a an amusing anecdote for you like so the soundtrack is is incredible and big thanks to the team who sent it across for me to use in the in the video review because I think it just brought it all up a notch I've actually listened to it a bunch but one of my favorite moments so my nine-year-old son he saw me playing planet of Honor with the review can I play it yeah I was like no you're not on my PC Sunny gym you can wait till it comes out going past it dropped he spent two days two or three evenings in his room and he only called me like two or three times to help right but I walked past his bed the second night and it's like 8 30 p.m nine o'clock here he was meant to be asleep but I could just hear throwing behind the door [Music] he was just humming to change himself and I was like and it's incredible like I think one of my favorite pieces is the chase I don't want to ruin it for Nick because he's not fully finished it yet yeah for Chase like that build up I was like this is this is great and that came out of nowhere there's so many bits in the thing that are elevated by that soundtrack so that must have been quite a quite a get to to have him work on board and oh for sure for sure and like I think like coming from like like Swedish people are we're pretty minimalist like you know as of as a foundation like and I think um what we had like because obviously it's not a very we were super good uh uh Ghibli inspired um and the the music there is like usually a lot more like sort of expressionists like minimalist like you know some piano that sort of doesn't really go anywhere it asks more questions and provide answers sort of thing um and I think we like initially both me and Adam were like quite that would be cool to like actually go full on and like do do something similar like I keep it quite quite small but I think uh when Takeshi came in um he he sort of disagreed with that and and said like no no we should go like full yeah yeah uh you know Orchestra and everything and and obviously I was literally orchestral like um they recorded it uh with the full with the full Orchestra and Budapest and yeah it was a Hungarian wild yeah that was one of the wildest moments actually for me like just because obviously I I'm in Australia the rest of the team are in Sweden um and like just just getting those videos from Adam when he was down in Budapest like recording recording this stuff and you see like all these musicians yeah just playing the playing the music from new games just it was wild so you're the only one not in Sweden uh well our sound design well obviously Takeshi is in in Los Angeles but I'd like to find this on the core team yeah and then our sound designers are actually based in Turin in Italy so there is a very much a remote aspect to the studio then yeah yeah it's turned out that way yeah yeah yeah because I was I was one because I know we've had like Thomas malaron from moon and he told the story about how that entire studio is just all over the planet and I had I had assumed that most of your studio was in a similar boat but um I guess it's like I mean most most of the core team are in are in Gothenburg but even like in Sweden we have a couple of we have a couple of people working remotes and like you know obviously it's it's possible these days to do it so um I don't know that like you know if it wasn't for the fact that because I'm for people who don't know I'm I'm co-directing and um and I wrote and I wrote planner planner uh but I don't know that if me and Adam didn't know each other so well and had been collaborating that long I don't know that you know Australia and Sweden specifically would have worked out that well before I know how you feel I know how you feel yeah you work with an Australian it's a nightmare mate so you're not gonna get any coffee anywhere else like you get down here exactly flat white flat whites make mate you just the fact why you think Europe you think Europe would be the place but not and and class Europe in Sydney mate come down to Melbourne for a bit and then Next Level coffee down here beautiful unbelievable I haven't been down for years actually I gotta I gotta go I'm really Keen you do we'll catch up catch up have a coffee sounds good 100 I'll be there so so how did you how did you wind up in Australia was it for your partner yeah that's it yeah um so we were running our production company me adamant and Dan from the studio um and at a certain point I think everyone just sort of went like like we were doing mostly animation and stuff like that so at a certain point everyone sort of went like we could live anywhere and do this really like we don't have many face to faces yeah let's and everyone just sort of went their separate ways a little bit so that's that's where that started uh we moved to Spain um I met my partner and she turned out to be Aussie and I really like this so yeah yeah we moved we moved over here in 2017. in fact first email I have from Adam about the game like saying like I'm gonna really do this do you want to tag along with pretty much like the day after I arrived in Australia so oh up until like Gamescom there's some like less European summer that I hadn't seen Adam In the Flesh or anyone else from the team at all for the whole production period so wow yeah and you obviously had to develop a lot of this game you know you mentioned it you know production really started 2018 uh we all remember 2020 to 21 was pretty rough time for the entire planet um you know did that impact development to any large degree you know the team all having to suddenly go fully remote and do everything in that way what was the because you know you guys been working on this 2018 to now that's a good solid five years the Polish shows but you know and I think that's what surprised so many people in an industry where we have seen so many games delayed released buggy um you know oh and you know covid is often used as an excuse and yet you guys somehow rode that storm produced a beautiful product that you know from certainly from my perspective I played it on PC I have played it again on Xbox and 100 there apart from the Flawless achievement we'll get to that um but you know what was what was that process like and and was polish you know was there a certain point where you yeah we're done and now we can just Polish Polish Polish to a fine Sheen this is so interesting because obviously yeah again first game and um I think big kudos to to the dev team because like polish like probably when went on for a lot longer we talked to our sound designer who's just like uh you know like usually like Reaper lock it's like you know a month before yeah but um you know we had a really we had a we had a really stable stable product like so I guess we we could sort of afford to to polish like um right up and until the end and like a lot for me was like you know like just little like little story polishes like just little um little timing things of like you know you get really nitty-gritty of like I can imagine having those little interactions with mui when she like sort of like gets on the log and like giggles and like a lot of that stuff like came in quite late um and I think that was that was really down to like just the dev team being so on top of it you know that that we could get that nitty-gritty with it so yeah no it really comes across very very proud of very proud of you should be you should be when can I get a movie plushie [Laughter] he's like yeah I gotta get the merch going mate or one of those those um like a squish mellow yeah partnership squish mellow or just a little stressful oh my God okay I can relate to that every couple of years there's some company that comes out with like some new soft toy so for a while there it was the Beanie Boos now the kids are all obsessed with squishmallows they're just like how do you describe them John Legend animal faces that are roastly uh cushion shaped but they have a kind of like Round Top and they're different animals but they're full of the softest squishiest yeah yeah squishy mallow hence the name yeah squish mellow but funny enough they're so big McDonald's are partnering with them here in the UK as happy meals with 24. yeah they're huge here too Australia I've completely missed this this is like movies like you've been working too hard that's what I'm saying that's why I said to you squish I'm looking on things you know what's going to happen now class is going to go guys I gotta go I gotta get in touch with Adam right now I gotta go I gotta go oh man I mean you mentioned you mentioned the nitty-gritty of sound design and mui mui and Lana and the you know there's no spoken language at least one that we can understand so everything from a player interaction point of view you know this is a game with no uh HUD this is a game with just pure audio and visual cues to guide the player to where they need to go next and the amount of I and I think this is where I really appreciate the polish from a game design point of view you know a lot of games tried this whole Co-op AI partner thing and fail right but within five minutes I'm a cat owner I'm not a dog person right but you know he's kind of half dog half cat anyway right yeah but mui has this unique playful personality Lana you can immediately get the bonds between her sister you know when they walk past at the beginning of the game you've obviously got the graves and they hug each other and yet without no spoken language nothing like that the player immediately develops this bond to you know a pixelated character and the the mournful little cries that Murray gives when when you die or something like that in the game the amount of care and attention that must have been poured into that I mean what was the inspiration for Nui as a creature like to arrive at that final you know chirpy cat-like but also quite obedient and clever I mean the AI programming alone must have been quite tricky yeah for sure I mean that's if you want the nitty-gritty of that I'll have to I'll have to get someone above my sort of developing payer grade but yeah it's uh that a lot of a lot of time and resources went into that aspect of it obviously I like to to give her like a bit of Independence and a better attitude and like I guess just figuring out where you know she wear a lot because so much of the core gameplay is like what like Lana and movies limitations and abilities and like how they come together to sort of complete each other so there's a gameplay aspect of of building mui and building the relationship and like that does a lot of story work as well just like with the work that you know the the game design did on that uh but then like you said um uh story wise we wanted to really it's again that minimalism like you know we didn't want because video games are often I feel uh and not always and it's definitely getting better but the guilty of that all adage of sort of um tell dong show instead of show don't tell which is Yeah you sort of want to be from a storytelling perspective um and look it took it took a lot of uh trying and because I think in in early stages we went way too far uh the other way like it was uh like we probably went a little bit too minimalist so it took a lot of tweaking to sort of find that sweet spot like that scene where the ELO that you mentioned where like um um the hug for instance yeah that hug actually came in quite late like before that it was like the emotions would like sort of even a little bit more subtle uh but then you know you just sort of review it and you go like and do a lot of play testing and see like what works and what doesn't what people pick up on and yeah yeah for sure yeah sorry did that answer the question it was awesome yeah is a long-winded answer I was just like you know there's so much stuff in your head don't worry and later today you're gonna think about stuff you probably should have mentioned and forgot to mention all right it happens all the time we've got it we've actually got a Super Chat someone someone uh watching the show wanted to ask you a question sepho um question how did the team feel when planet of Lana was revealed and was met with such an overwhelmingly positive response from The Gaming Community oh man that was it was so unreal that that day of like assuming that they mean the reveal at summer game Fest and not um not the release right yeah the reveal yeah yeah um yeah that was that was Unreal like obviously in Aussie like getting up really early in the morning yeah you know just seeing that like it was so real and like it was building up because we were I think we were somewhere around the middle of the show so you're watching the show and then it's like just like building up and like you're wondering because you don't really know how Jeff is gonna present it or like if is it just gonna be like is it just gonna play the trailer but then like he actually like introded himself and like um it was uh it was an insane insane feeling and my girlfriend actually like a bit of a personal story but my that morning my girlfriend handed me a a positive pregnancy test as well [Laughter] that's gross 16 months and she's actually in the game um as well like in right in the beginning in in Tyler Village like you run past baby you can hear oh wow awesome yeah oh wow that's so good story no yeah no service it was it was incredible like it we it was beyond our wildest imagination like the reception and and like how excited people were and yeah yeah we were so lucky so lucky yeah now earlier you mentioned Adam's Peach which I was surprised there was a certain game omitted from that pitch now I don't know how old that emits how old is Adam um so we're all born 85 so 30 38. oh wow yeah 38 yeah wow yeah okay so now then then that that makes sense then so because I just started the game very recently because I finally got a chance to sit down and start it and as soon as I did I mean aside from the fact that oh my God the game was just like destroying my eyeballs with how unbelievable it looked yeah I started playing it and I'm like man this this feels a lot like another world like which was a game I loved as a kid yeah and it felt so not I shouldn't say felt it reminded me so much of another world and how that game played and its themes and the whole the feeling that that game was trying to evoke because you had that alien partner in it yeah and so much of planet of Lana was reminding me of another world yeah it was down to the moon like the you know yeah all of it all of it right yeah it's a bit of a homage yeah no for sure Adam is a huge fan of another world yeah so I don't know that I know that that it wouldn't have been part of the pitch maybe but it's definitely yeah that's what I said I was surprised it wasn't part of the pitch yeah it amazes me really when you talk about you know you had to do a large number of pictures before you know I think thunderfall uh who partnered with you to publish this right um you know that you know from a from a publication point of view they're really great Partners to work with in terms of working getting review code and stuff like that and they were very supportive in getting us code which we always appreciate as a small independent Outlet you know it's not always easy to play but what really surprised me about this is you see that reaction you know when it was revealed at the game awards and you know I've always thought that these kinds of games there's usually always a game of this nature you know an Insider limbo they are universally loved I think for the majority they're not for everyone no game is for everyone but yeah you know when you have a unique art style like this it really I mean it really surprised me that it took that many pitches because you know if it was me I'd be like I love these games yes please um well you know it's one of those things it's one of the things but either way we got the game so we're really happy that it's it's yeah and obviously there's a lot of there's a lot of stuff that's got to make sense for for Publishers timing and like you know I get it but yeah yeah but obviously Microsoft liked the look of it yeah for sure yeah Phil Spencer's been out tweeting a bit that's that's yeah very nice yeah we're so yeah very pleased that Phil liked it yeah I think Nick's gonna ask anyway yeah yeah yeah so did you guys partner with them was it for ID and Xbox as well as getting into Game Pass uh console exclusivity or um I'm trying to because I know Thunder Falls the publisher yeah but was it it wasn't part of the idea at Xbox program was it planet of London oh God I'm not sure I'm so sorry oh it is okay that's what I want because I know Thunder fool is like a fairly major publisher so I'm like I know you're being published with Thunderball but there was still an idea at Xbox game wasn't it yeah apparently so okay because that's right I'm so bad at all the I'm so bad at all that all that stuff like if you'd had Adam here the room he would have been able to answer okay it's fine we much prefer the kid yeah exactly I definitely I'm like a little little I'm Robin in the relationship guys all right okay well I think it's a bit I think my basement and and write up weird stories yeah yeah I think it's a bit late for Adam though for Adam it'd be like one or two a.m right now wouldn't it yeah sure but hopefully we can get it together sometime yeah yeah yeah okay number two yes yes what was it like working with with Microsoft and their support you know obviously it launched on Steam it launched on yeah Xbox but it launched into Game Pass and you know we've heard from we've heard a variety of stories like I think one one developer who who runs a small Indie publishing outfit which is um help me out Jesse with your brain of knowledge Mike Mike Rose Mike Rose um yeah no more robots he's very positive about game part you know when they released one of their games descenders which is the BMX Downhill Racing game he says we released it the Game Pass we've got tons more sales tons more players and he really helped with discoverability do you feel like you've got the best of both worlds in launching on Steam and in into Xbox and onto Game Pass like your player numbers have been boosted by all that sort of free publicity of The Game Pass launch does that help in your system with we're super happy I think like as a as an indie developer like first and foremost you just want as many people as possible to like to play the game you know and Xbox like game passes really obviously enable that um and like as far as Microsoft goes like have nothing but good things to say about like you know the whole collaboration like the team over there like it's been it's been awesome like so much support um yeah I have nothing nothing good things to say yeah it's always good to hear it's always good to hear I mean it's yeah it I guess it must be extremely um daunting I guess in a world where the old days you'd release a game and you'd have to hope that people wishlisted it you'd have to hope that people like to look of it enough to put down money but whereas now you're okay I'm releasing it and immediately like I don't know let's pick a number 25 million people on Console can just click download and play and that's yeah that's uh kind of like oh God like do you guys I don't know if you haven't I don't want to step on any toes do you guys have a player number that you've announced like oh it's been completed by over X number of million people or anything like that that you uh have boasted about yet if you haven't I'm not trying to put you on the spot feel free to be like nah don't know that no no no no no comment on that one sorry fair enough we're very happy let me tell you this we're very happy okay that's that's a good enough for me that's good enough I've got a question and feel feel completely free to avoid this question if it's something you can't answer because it's just it's just a question a sweaty part of the interview no no no no it's just a question out of curiosity because I find that with a lot of Indie Studios that have breakout hits especially with their first game I find that see their path seems to go one of two ways yeah they stick to their wheelhouse so you know there was Limbo and then inside was very similar to limbo and then yeah but they seem to stick to their wheelhouse then we had you know Moon made Ori which was a fantastic and now they're working on like this third person action RPG shooter thing so they're going completely in another Direction now it may be way too early but is wishfully do you guys plan for wishfully to sort of have a uh like a signature in terms of their games and have a very familiar feel and look and style to everything or are you guys more of a studio that's like okay we've done this beautiful 2D Living Art platformer thing now we're gonna do this other completely different thing in another Direction and I'm not asking you to reveal your new game it's more about you does yeah I mean look day by day because like when you're making a game like you're just so busy making that game and I think a lot of you know a lot of those questions are sort of like starting to definitely pop up now in the studio like you know because yeah it's like you're just so focused on what you're doing and then you emerge from it and then you realize that like oh well we're we have a studio now and like you know what kind of Studio are we going to be and like you know um but were so like planet of Lana really like is the result of every single person like in the studio you know what I mean so yeah yeah yeah I think like the one thing I can say for sure is that we want to be the kind of Studio that keeps like you know our game should be a reflection of our people um yes and our our people are truly like artists um so I we want to definitely keep making like you know these kind of artistic um artistic games with like a heavy focus on like story and narrative yeah and and solid gameplay as well so that I think that's about the best I can answer that question yeah no no I get it seriously serious yeah that's the sort of cachet that having an indie hit can buy you like wishfully could obviously off the back of planet of Lana could develop a signature where now for your next game your trailer is in the next Xbox showcase and people instantly know that this must be a wishfully game because yeah I remember planet of Lana and this has very similar not not necessarily the same art style but there's but some studios develop a signature Like A vibe yes yeah and you can tell instantly that oh yes that's a wishfully game for sure no it's I I definitely think that'll be the case and that but then you know like we've been reading a lot like in the studio and I like uh creativity Inc from what's his name Ed catmore like the the Pixar guy uh it's all about um it's all about Pixar and like sort of the creative culture at um uh at uh that that they have over there um and I can't remember where I was going with that uh boys boys awkward especially in your life you've got to just bounce it off just laugh it off don't worry about it yeah I'm not going to get you a coffee no okay no no no no yeah no so but no but it's like they're always talking about biggest Pixar like it's a def is a great example what you're talking about like this there's a definite Vibe and like uh style to what they're doing but they're always they're always like sort of bringing something fresh to each project you know yeah yeah I think like that's that's as a creative that's that's a really good place to be that you can that you can have that instant recognition but you can always have a curveball as well and keep it fresh and keep people keep people guessing and coming back for more so that's definitely the ambition yeah I would love I would love to play a planet of Lana too but she's kind of already saved so I'm kind of like ah you know where can that go but I'd love you know more time with mui is always time well spent I think uh do a mui spin-off game oh oh I'm not even noting both these things here this is good stuff how did mui come to be and how did how did mui end up with London oh well you know we're treading into spoiler territory here but there is a story that could be explored as to as to the relationship and why they came at all oh anyway there's a lot of loose ends let's put it that way it is a lot of loose ends but look guys I'm very grateful for all the like I feel like we've got a director of merch here now Nicki you might have to come on squish bloody oath I'll get in touch with squish mellow yeah Mike says oh my god I've got so many squishmallows in my house the time and I do want to make sure so as play Xbox Sierra our patrons they get a very unique perk where they have a secret lounge that they can come in and every episode they get to ask us Community questions it can often be irritating as heck if it's already a four hour show and then they decide to have 20 questions um but we obviously let them know of the guests in advance and we do have a couple of questions there's not a lot there's not a lot but you know just conscious of time so that one of them from Good Old Collingwood Nick and I'll let you tackle it it's kind of already been asked a little bit um with regards to summer game Fest but there's one last bit at the end the last two questions there yeah yeah again there's not there's not a ton there's only like a handful so if you don't are you cool to go through them oh for sure yeah of course okay um all right I'll go with good old colleague good old Hollywood uh welcome class and hello to John Nick and Jesse so as I recall the first time anyone had seen planet of Lana was on Jeff Keely Summer Games first last year it was not seen on the Xbox showcase the next time we saw the game was again on Achilles stage either games Com or the game awards arguably a Keeley presentation draws a great deal of viewership how did it feel at the time to know that your game was being seen by many thousands of Gamers for the first time did it add pressure to make sure the finished game live up to the promise of the preview no but yeah for sure for sure it added pressure but I think it was any pressure like that is is good pressure you know for for a creative person like you know you wanna I mean especially because the Gaming Community as well that they are so passionate and it's like um yeah especially it's a good word to use passionate yeah I'm one of them so you know um I gotta I gotta I gotta address it no but um yeah for sure like you don't it it had it added that bit of extra pressure that I think that I think we really needed to elevate it to what the product that is you know um and yeah it was it was nothing but positive nothing yeah this is an extra little there's an extra little question at the bottom of this one and it's something we usually like to ask our guests when we remember anyway there's a classic 90s sitcom that John and I are both massive fans of and so we like to ask our guests Jesse's already shaking his head we'd like to ask our guests 1985 you're you're in you're definitely in the right group yeah were you were you a friend uh a fan of friends class Jesse playing the music has basically muted his audio ah Jesse I now we can hear you now we can hear you have any friends I'm a I'm a big fan of the of the theme song uh definitely no but what I said was I was I was more of a Seinfeld guy sorry we hear that a lot it's one or the other like the biggest reason for that though is really like um Swedish uh television like I didn't have cable growing okay like I only had like uh the the sort of uh free to Air stuff uh and they had Seinfeld and friends was on yeah it was on cable so yeah that's a fair we're a product of our cultural and Society this next one's not so much a question but I I'm I'm curious about this one because again I just started the game and usually when I start games I have a quick look at the achievement list before I do and I noticed I noticed there was an achievement and skedaddle here has done nothing but post this achievement and said challenge accepted so one of the achievements and I need to have a chat with whoever designed these achievements yeah one of these achievements is complete the game without dying position to make before you answer class I I have 100 of the game aside from this achievement and one thing I would request in a patch update so you know feel free to let whoever the powers that be know so yeah I'm typing I'm typing don't panic you don't have to play the game from start to finish you have to complete each chapter without dying the other side is you don't know which chapters so just a little green tick of like no deaths green tick no each chapter then I know right okay which ones I need to do and which ones I don't and I'm a very happy man maybe you guys needed an achievement consultant [Music] hey I'll I'll take as many roles as I could get did you did you notice my tweet John where my name was in the Benedict Fox credits as an achievement consultant wow yeah that was quite funny because they put an achievement in there just to screw with me which is that I have to watch all the cutscenes Nick skips cutscenes like I don't I don't like watching cutscenes I skipped cut scenes and so oh Bart was like well we're going to put an achievement in there where you have to watch all the cutscesses I Love It Well mate yeah um you're gonna have to watch some cutscenes and plan on Atlanta too yes I know I found out I could not skip those yeah I found out you don't want to upset because you know class that's obviously I'll wear a lot of your storytelling is going to be happening right so yeah you know like don't you dare choice I have to watch them I will say one thing I definitely appreciate because not a lot of devs do it anymore is that your achievements have like proper artwork I think they're actually just screenshots I mean the game is a like basically a moving work I've had anyway so the the achievement art is just screenshots from within the game which is good yeah yeah yeah it's really really nice I like that uh okay not Jack class I like this question too what games have you enjoyed the most this year aside from Planet of Lander how much inspiration do you get from other games Okay so this um this is a good question because like as I've learned one of the biggest downsides and this is to all the gamers out there aspiring for a career in game development is there's a there's a massive downside and they say you don't have time to actually play games um especially when you have a baby as well but um I played but now since I've emerged um I played uh Uncharted 4 I just finished Uncharted 4. oh wow um yeah just partially for like entertainment but partially also like for for inspiration but my my favorite game of all time if I can insert that as part of the question would be Final Fantasy VII so I'm super excited now to play because I haven't played the Remake yet so I've just started just started the Remake last night um and obviously it's good timing now with the with the sequel being announced as well so I'm just gonna hopefully drag the first one out until the next one comes nice did you beat Uncharted 4 have you beat it yet I did yeah yeah I can't remember how many hours it took but it was it would have taken a few because that game is very long it was long man I kept thinking it was gonna end but it's thank you so that wasn't just me what no I I didn't want it to end let me let me say I didn't want it to end but yeah I thought it constantly thought it would yeah I I was I was just curious to get your thoughts because my thing with Uncharted I've got a weird relationship with the Uncharted series my favorite is the first one I I've always called Uncharted one a flawed masterpiece like I right like I like a lot about the game while being acutely aware of its flaws and its shortcomings Uncharted 4 to me felt like naughty dog got everything right gameplay was great combat's the best that's ever been visually gorgeous everything all of it all great yeah but it all came undone for me with the pacing of the game right okay it just it just it dragged on to me it outstayed its welcome for me right fair enough and it just like you said you noticed moments where you felt like it was about to end and then it didn't it just then it kept going and then the Lord of the Rings Return of the King and it keeps going yeah but I was going to say though isn't that like in in True Hollywood sorry to interrupt your neighbor isn't that like no no old school Hollywood uh Hollywood uh style of like doing that remember all those like movies in the 90s and let you know the adventure like yeah I know but maybe it's because I also like short games yeah fair enough that I also like by short sharp Punchy like I'd rather have that short roller coaster that's like unbelievable for a few short hours rather than this thing that just fills up with content for the sake of content that's just yeah you know exorbitantly long because they feel they need to justify the price tag or whatever the case may be yeah look I've there's a really good book called Blood Sweat and pixels um yeah yeah that's right yeah uh I think I've probably read that cover to cover six times during the last five years oh wow like yeah and they obviously they have a whole chapter on Uncharted 4 in that um and what it sounds like was that they knew that it was going to be the last one so I think they just want they wanted to go out with a bang like you know they probably just wanted to make sure that players really got bang for their back because it's not going to be another one yeah yeah okay fair enough that's nice that's good yeah yeah um so I guess we answered that question even though we had the tangent about Uncharted 4. I have also but just to add too I have also been dabbling in a little bit more Red Dead Redemption 2 as well yeah oh wow okay that's it that's a tangent you risk setting Nick off on again here Red Dead Redemption why I didn't play Red Dead Redemption well your general feeling towards uh oh yeah rockstars yeah yeah yeah insistent on in enormously lengthy slowest molasses animations yeah yeah where you're like let me do the thing and yeah I play did you play Super Mario or a C-Class oh God no I haven't no no oh mate you wanna that's a that's a 10 out of 10 just perfection experience a sense of Rift here we're an Xbox podcast Nick Nick is uh we co-hosted by Nintendo Fanboy like there's nothing we can do about it we just have to grin and smile and I'm just sitting here talking about PlayStation exclusives we're in the Twilight video games it's all video games and that's what we love so it's all good with us Super Mario Odyssey don't don't get started class has got like nine minutes so we've got I think we've got like two more uh yeah we've got a couple more yes uh Commander Buck hello all and welcome class am I pronouncing it right by the way yeah that's per that's really good that's some of the best I've had in Australia actually yeah oh really okay that's it might be because the Greek it's the Greek descent that's just oh that's all right we can pronounce just about anything it's fine yeah first I want to give Jesse a huge shout out for his amazing work this week on coffee with cabosa uh to class planet of Lana is an awesome game how has the positive reception of this game affected the studio wow what a good question I mean everyone's very happy obviously um a lot of people because people always ask like you know there's so many emotions some so many emotions when you when you've been working on something for this long and this hard and like you know it's like a little baby and it's uh yeah yeah it's a really really scary thing to like just release it and like you know luckily people on the internet are notoriously friendly ah yes we're completely unfounded no but like you know it's it's always going to be completely nerve-wracking to like just release something like this um but it's uh yeah the reception has been hugely positive and I think everyone's just been really really stoked about it in the studio and how it affects us long term I guess we'll see maybe everyone turns into like a diva now you know oh I'm not releasing that so you're confident yeah exactly I can see the class in Sydney just ordering a goat's milk chai latte mochachino don't worry Don't You Know Who I Am that's the attitude you should be having I love it we're staying humble we're staying humble we're taking the love but we're also taking the the the non-love and and taking that into account and like just you know making sure that we're that we grow from both the price and the the non-price sort of thing and taking that with us into the next one it sounds like you're wanted so I think that was the last Community question that was that was the last question yes it was and we're back on time thank you so much it was absolutely brilliant if class wants to hang around and be the host of Name again he can I'm sorry I have some family commitments we appreciate you making the time thank you so much for having me honestly had a blast um yeah it was great thank you yes it's unfortunate we couldn't get Adam on but I noticed that Adam was on the Xbox expansion pass all right yeah oh man it's still what's going on I have to listen to that one see what he said yeah yes Adam yes Luke over there managed to get Adam on and I know and I saw him tweet it out and I'm like are they doing like a press tour maybe a guy Adam on the Divas expansion pass class has jumped on I'm like yeah okay here we go they're finally getting some time now because I said to I set the class off air like I've been in a DM with the Twitter account for like a year and a half I reached out as soon as I saw that game I'm like oh we've got a doggo normally I only have cats on podcasts look what breed is that this is an Aussie Cattle Dog what we call them Farm dog surprise like there's a bit of it's a bit of mop like yeah that almost looks like some stuffy in there yes definitely I think so too he's got the stuffy eyes sometimes and yeah yeah Perfect final question for you then Nick and I as as parents ourselves big fans of Australian cartoon Bluey blue uh do you have you yeah okay it's so good right I think it's more for the parents than the kids stuff like it's it's I watch season three without my kids like four and a half arrived on Disney plus and I was like it's 11 p.m at night I'm watching Bluey I'm not ashamed to see the cricket episode did you watch the cricket one oh the cricket episode is brilliant it is we're on season two because we we like just yeah because freya's my daughter already loves it like you know yeah he's like 15 months old she hears it like okay there'll be Bluey squishmallows before you know it uh right now but class appreciate you coming on um it was an absolute pleasure to chat you and the insight into the team at wishfully we wish you guys all the best with whatever you make next we'll be keeping an eye out for it obviously as big fans already um for a first game it blew rightfully so the community away so congratulations on the launch and all the success and and I'll be in Sydney in November I'm coming up we're having a coffee in Sydney for sure you're not going to bring something from Melbourne Nick you're not gonna like me it's good enough it's good enough in Sydney it's good and it's just fine I'll take you to the I'll take you to the right places promise done thanks so much guys appreciate it class you take care have a great weekend thank you and thanks to the listeners as well actually yeah yes thank you thanks for the questions all right bye ciao adios that was class uh Erickson from wishfully and he's replaced by this guy wearing a Starfield headset just got to move over a little bit he's just gonna he's got a half a Starfield headset that was cool that was great what a lovely chat what an incredible game Nick if you've only just started man it is such a journey there's some bits in it that will make you feel like whoa where did this come from yeah so yeah yeah oh you can tell class has been here for a while because you can you could hear us with the Aussie accent just infusing and becoming because there's an American there's an American footballer who plays for Collingwood he's from Texas and he's now being in Australia for quite a while and it's hilarious to hear how the Aussie accent is taking over his Texan accent just slowly slowly bit by bit it's actually quite hilarious um but yes so planet of Lana that was good it's lovely chatting with actual developers because you can you know to see The Human Side of these products that entertain us for hours on end and provided us with all this fun uh well they're made by real people who have dreams and stuff it's always good to have a chat and thank you chat for for hanging out um and giving us all the love don't forget to hit that like button and as always if you want to support us so that we can get more developers on and do more cool stuff you know patreon.com forward slash XBox Sarah or become a YouTube member all of these things are available but Jesse's back and he's been um quietly lauded in the chat as the real MVP because you've been keeping everybody up to date after an eight and a half hour stream particularly yesterday of the FTC versus Xbox uh court case which is primarily the big thing to talk about this week right I mean that's insane it is insane so I just yeah Where Do We Begin yep it's not Jesse you're muted Bros you're going to want to say yes you know audio it's saying [Laughter] can we hear him now yeah I can I can hear you but we can hear Jesse chat but he's fixing it now so that's the OBS thing where you are I'm they can hear me now the OBS thing with um default mics just changing in the middle in the middle of the stream I checked it 30 minutes ago and it said they still can't hear Jesse they still can't no they can't it takes 10 seconds they can hear me oh okay okay so we're in fortnite before we go to that are we going to talk about what we've been playing at all oh yeah I mean we can already because that's the new game I started I've been like planet of Lana um and aside from that my obvious usuals so I guess you guys talk about what you've been playing yeah yeah uh very quickly and I guess yeah I can just show it off so uh this week uh season four dropped for Halo uh bringing infection I've been beavering away um on a very ambitious map for everyone to play on which is Kingdom so the big big feature for forgers out there is uh Forge now has water um what was interesting is they brought out a water plane which is just a flat static block uh it's very flat and you can put it down and it gives a water-like effect it's kind of cool but I wanted to go a little bit above Beyond so I was desperately hoping for waterfall effects now I knew there wouldn't be waterfalls but I did find some very cool Four Runner energy streams so I tweaked it a little bit um and I got what I think is probably one of the best looking Forge Maps yet that isn't a forerunner map because the Forerunner textures and metals are really easy to work with for for lighting and stuff yeah um and yeah there's a brand new uh set in a kind of ministerity fairy tale type Castle map to go play on uh you can go grab it now from forge.xboxer.com it's very cool very nerdy um yeah that has been there's been a lot of hours sunk into that um to make it as detailed as possible and that's a hundred percent of the forge budget you cannot spawn anything else at all ever which makes it really difficult because like for for game types to work you have to have certain objects so you have to be like oh okay I'm losing these flowers because I need a spawn point for this game type and stuff like that but yeah that's pretty much been the last week or so um I've been dabbling in Golem still oh really I I encountered another but it's it's just yeah it's um it's offensively bad to play and it's just it constantly breaks like it is yeah it's just breaking on me whenever I drive it's it's not fun so yeah that's pretty much it for me that if you call them is the QA that everyone thinks Bethesda has but it's just atrocious but um so I have mostly been playing on stream while co-streaming the um so I bought the new GPU I bought it five days before they started up a game bundle giveaway so I complained to AMD they sent me a code and I got Resident Evil 4 remake which I've actually already completely played and beaten on series X on stream but now playing that full balls out every setting enabled and still getting like 200 FPS on PC nice is a real night oh my God is it good looking and uh so I've been playing that a lot while Coast not co-streaming not rebroadcasting but giving a live running transcript of the FTC Microsoft case which we'll hit in a bit which was a huge pain in the ass to set up because 99 of you can show what you're saying on OBS things are just will only work with your mic so I had to find one that would work with a different source audio being an edge browser and then display capturing the preview that gives you and so I've got that up on screen so it doesn't look great but it's really accurate so I was playing that a lot and residential 4 remake is really dumb but it knows it's dumb so it's it's very fun and on PC they've fixed the aiming by the way on series X so it actually has good aiming it's bedtime it's better second if you haven't done it since the second patch it's a hell of a lot better oh yeah oh okay maybe I need to go back again yeah first patch got it down second patch gutted feeling pretty damn good I've hit the um fight with the short so yeah I want to pause for a moment and just uh and give a shout out to the chat particularly to expuds who were streaming it uh shh we don't want to get him arrested or sued or something but uh he already provided a valuable service to me myself I was also there I was on his stream at the time I asked in the Discord I'm like oh has anyone got a link to the stream and someone linked expud streams I was just listening to that I've been lucky I've gotten into the I've gotten into the call the zoom call both times no problem so as long as I can keep doing that oh it'd be very easy to capture the um the text for the stream we had over 3 000 people watching it well I don't know I had only been doing it for those others right I was that's the thing we were going I was already I already hit a grand and it was going up by 50 people every minute just kept going I was up and up but then it was like oh by the way if you're and I'm American if you're not American I don't think anyone gives a if they're like oh I'm in Canada I don't care what the FTC says but as I am in America even though the site's UK I'm like it's probably not worth it yeah that's what's because I was seeing people coming on Twitter after Jess was like Hey Xbox here or tweeting I'm like yes I mean we appreciate the shout out but Xbox uh is the hero we deserve uh right now I think one of the um real huge Sony fans was doing it too but he couldn't stop talking during it so no one like listening to his stream like he had over 3 000 we've got 200 that's it that's all we got we got 200. rookie numbers we need to up those numbers and only 91 likes oh my God what come on less than half of the people watching clicks the thumbs up button I know well that's disappointing like I know we're not streaming the FTC case but come on yeah come on like we go but to that point so Jesse you are planning getting into the zoom call pending to to yeah so they're going Tuesday Wednesday Thursday planning to do it the whole time they're doing it Tuesday Wednesday Thursday so we'll see Xbox says thanks fellas I Didn't Do It on day two to they they got to you didn't they the fear got them we will find you many many thousands of dollars warnings gets to you it doesn't say you're breaking a law it just says it's prohibited yeah but and the penalties for it will be you know fines and different stuff like that and you know how the FBC is we'll get into it but they're they're kind of like we'll just make up the rules as we go along yeah well we will get into it um before we do before we do we need to get serious for a second for a long time on this show we've made jokes we've had a lot of fun poking at Nick's inaccuracies the lies the made-up things the made up things the Cloudy things and lucky things on this man and yet one of the big headlines out of day one of this old news it's old news I don't even know why everyone's look at him he's just laughing I'll just let you laugh it's fine why are we even discussing the fact that Indiana Jones is exclusive to Xbox it's two-year-old news it's not even a new story it's not even a new story it's old hat now it's all it's odd news like anyone who watches the Xbox era podcast they're two years ahead of everyone else there's all these other podcasts all these all this oh have you heard guys Indiana Jones it's exclusive to Xbox September 2021 cold days news guys Xbox era podcast viewers already knew they already knew that's true just just disagreed with you though right so the first time Jazz chose to publicly challenge me and try and quash me was on Starfield when I said Starfield was a next-gener only game and jazz is like I don't think so buddy cross gen I'm like no Jess it's not it's next gen only jizz we've since seen how that's gone and then jizz wheeled out the old ah but you know may maybe it changed it was definitely but things duckling duck and then you know I gave everyone back when we used to do pre-recorded podcasts I put out a preview of the rumor mill and I literally I got the the approval from my source to actually show the redacted DM saying the DM I just woke up to it I think the time was like something A.M you know hashtag Indiana Jones only on Xbox and so it was a September episode that we had and I said that I've been told as you saw from that DM that Indiana Jones is exclusive to Xbox and then Jazz replied to that tweet going I reckon this is another prediction you're going to be wrong on and I'm like no I'm not I'm not mate and here I am cash in that check two years later cash in that check that's zero dollar check yeah by the wages three and O's coming mate in the form of the gears collection trick I'm gonna hat trick him just like in rocket League I'm just gonna hat trick jizz don't worry mate it's coming I love the confidence it's it's beautiful it's beautiful um but yeah so that was that was pretty cool I wanted to call that out specifically but look you know the chats all here it's been a crazy two days did you see the timing of it though like if you think about it um Bethesda went through Jan or Feb 2021 yep I got that DM in August that's probably around the time that deal had been renegotiated like at the time we were discussing it on the podcast we said you know that's an interesting one because that deal with Disney probably would have been like I maybe I should have got Jesse to prepare the clip that's my fault but at the time we said Aaron you once as a deal had that deal had probably been set prior to the acquisition so you have to assume that maybe that deal changed an IP was an ip21 will be about where it's going to be on yeah so August 2021 it's roughly six months after the deal closed fair chance that's probably around the time it was negotiated and I got that DM and there we are I'm sure we said it as part of our predictions we're like why not reveal India at the Showcase and say hey XBox exclusive they may as well have now because it came out anyway the FTC showcase they could have had it they could have had it on the Xbox showcase and instead it's like part of the FTC hearing it's like it's it's hilarious to me that the F the FTC hearing is more more entertaining than the Sony showcase but there you go but by the way I may have got some more info about indie [Music] no I can say it right now oh since we're talking about Indie well it's just there's there's been a lot of Indy no it's not it's not I don't uh we'll just talk about it as part of the Indie discussion don't worry about the remember button we're just also timestamp it but we'll um we'll just talk about it as part of these discussion so there's been a lot of talk about is Indy going to be third person is indeed going to be first person it's got to be first it's got to be third person India like Uncharted blah blah I may have got a little bit of info about that it's second person about the camera angle of Indiana Jones interesting now I don't know if this is finalized or not I don't know if this is like because the game I think is still quite a bit away from what I've been told from what I've heard it's the rumor from what I've heard it's going to be both not like Starfield where you get to pick but there'll be specific as far as I'm aware there'll be specific sections some will be third some will be first so it is second Passage so Jesse was at the moment I don't know if that's finalized I don't know if that's set in stone I I just at the moment as far as I'm aware it's actually a combination of both there will be first person segments and third person segments I don't know which is interesting more detail than that Halo does that you're getting a vehicle it's third you're picking up a big ass gun it's third it's normally first I don't so it could be normally third but sometimes first as well you don't you know I don't know see the the DM doesn't go into that much detail so I'm not sure on what I made a guess so people are now going to say that's 100 what it's about yeah well anyway I I don't know the context around is it an entire stage that's first is it just a section that's first or third I don't know the context around how that's going to play out maybe you play as Marion Ravenwood and you've got to hide around or to get away from Nazis because everyone loved the MJ section in Spider-Man oh yeah they were like the favorites um interesting yes um it's just all the DM says is it is third person in some parts and first person in others not switchable so again that that's that's as much context as I have here so I don't know and curious that is that is how it all works where you can't be first person in a vehicle you can't be first person no I know but that's what I'm saying I I know what you're saying but to me I mean I just literally read out word for word what I was told so to me that sounds more like specific sections as opposed to oh you're getting in a vehicle now camera goes back to me it kind of like where you'd go from a third person Adventure game and then you do an on-rail section from a chopper and you'd be shooting a gun that would be yeah to me it sounds more like that that's how it sounds again that's how I'm interpreting the DM so hey this section where you need to find this treasure is all in third person because you're in whatever but this section where you just walk into a bar and take out all these Nazis it's first person and you just beat the crap out of them and to me that's what it sounds like I mean I I'm not I'm whatever creative Choice machine games want to make I'm very curious to see how it all plays out I'm surprised both parties won't it maybe I'm surprised it's still far out though because obviously we've had the recent film release I haven't seen it yet um but you would have thought they would try and get within a ballpark of that film release but maybe covered and stuff oh I don't know I didn't get told it's far out I assumed yeah fair enough fair enough who knows then who knows I'm trying to see if he's telling me that no I don't think so um anyway in the in the interim um so there's a little sliver of info about Indiana Jones it's nice it's nice so yeah the big stuff this week then the FTC versus Xbox trial so what I thought we would do and chat keep the super chats coming if you wanna if you have your opinion you want us to read it out make sure we can see it in the chat hit that like button we're going to go through each of the days and we're going to pick out the big key moments um from from both days trial so day one um wait I'm stopping you please saw in the chat Gary Barwick welcome to Xbox era supporter Gary barricks and Xbox zero supporter now we love having members which reminds me I I you I bet you noticed me having my breakfast during um I hadn't eaten yet I hadn't eaten yet so make sure www.drink control.com use our code 10 off mate be like Gary Barwick best Shake you'll have best meal best tasting meal replacement you'll ever have oh well Gary's also a patreon member as well so he's like double whammying up yeah we're only we're only 220 or something new members away from last podcast so I don't know if we want to try and catch it or two podcasts ago so they want to break that record you know feel free yeah yeah that's crazy um okay well thank you Nick for that important Interruption so Xbox versus the FTC we all knew that this would be um an interesting case um FTC went in it's a fast it is a fast it's a hilarious circus it is it is oh my God I don't even know like I was I was so baffled and befuddled by the I was hearing that I was literally driving to get a coffee last night and talking to myself about it because I couldn't believe how stupid the whole thing was like I just man like for the longest time so many people have talked about how I'm a bit of a tinfoil hat guy or like ah you know so the FTC have clearly demonstrated how clueless they are they've got no idea about anything right yep they're they're pleading their case to a judge who probably doesn't know much about the video game industry so she opened it opened the case with the disclaimer saying her son works for Microsoft so obviously all of the crazy out there Sony Fanboys have been like and you know what that's fair enough honestly that is fair enough that there is room for conflict of interest there if the judge's son just got a job at Microsoft then yeah there could unconsciously or subconsciously be some sort of buyers there having said that while I do you do agree that there is a conflict of interest there the FTC have done such an incredibly job that that her her subconscious bias doesn't come into play like yeah so this is where and this is where I keep telling people the CMAs corrupt the if this is corrupt because what happens is so the reason I was telling everyone to see a maze dodgy and just protecting their buddy Jim is because you look for telltale signs right try try and take your favorite box bias out of it there's little telltale signs so when the CMA spends a year talking about protecting Sony talking about console SLC and then at the last second they pivot to Cloud and put all their focus on cloud you know there's something dodgy if the FTC was making really strong logical well thought out arguments and blah blah blah blah and then the judge turns around and goes well I'm siding with Microsoft then you could turn around and say well hold on a second her son just got a job with Microsoft that's a little bit they're funny yeah I I don't disagree I think she's she's got a she's a she's a lifetime appointee she's been doing it for years and years and years and I think her uh her approach and her credentials and her demeanor are in question really and fair play she did make that disclaimer I think she also when she was saying that I also I'm sure I have a copy of the Call of Duty somewhere in my house is what she said no that no and that's fine that's fine that she openly admitted that but my point is even if she didn't admit it this never got to a point with with that factor could come into it like because the FTC was doing such a terrible job it's not like it's not like she had to look look like she had egg on her face because the FTC made these genius arguments and she had to go against them and look dodgy the FTC that lawyer like that's why on Twitter I asked for his resetterer account because he just sounded like a resetterer poster or a Neo guest poster trying to look out for Sony like I was I was embarrassed for him I'm like very painful dude you're a lawyer listen to yourself like people forget this we've said this from day one the job of a regulator is first and foremost to protect consumers yes yet I don't know if I heard the word consumer during any of his questioning I don't think I think I saw a Tweet someone counting I lost the two days I just saw a tweet and all I heard the main words I heard were Sony and PlayStation and pinky promise because I heard him go do you pinky swear you're gonna put Call of Duty on PlayStation and what about Diablo do you pinky swear you're gonna put Diablo on Playstation I'm like dude he didn't say things up but yeah he did he did say sorry he said promise he said promise he said do you promise he goes can you promise that you're gonna put Call of Duty on Playstation can you promise you're gonna put that and now think about it right the FTC have no clue and you've got a judge who probably doesn't know a great deal about the video game industry but even that judge heard this FTC lawyer talk and was like oh my God you could hear her getting frustrated but that's day two that's day two we'll get into it I want to go through both days and we'll go through some of the key highlights from each day and we can just talk around some of these points and chat if you've got comments you want to say I will say up front let's step away from you know and chat you're mostly well behaved so I'm not going to worry too much but let's just keep things civil step away from name calling and any kind of slurs and things like that of other people it's not necessary the most you know you can call them silly idiots whatever you can do it about next and no one else that's also fine I do have to let my out though because she's just yelping she jumped in through the window here and now she's just out the door going well I'm like go back out the window there's a cat flap and she's just like staring at me obstinately give me one second hate my cat so Nick how much do you hate John I hate you so much did you hate him yeah who's this that stupid hair that little beauty hey sorry about that anyway we didn't say anything yeah sure sure so day one day one FTC versus Microsoft and it kicked off um in in pretty bombastic style uh I think within the first hour we had this bombshell email so rewind your brains Activision gets announced Jim Ryan and Sony are out there oh a nice detrimental to PlayStation what about us all our Revenue all our Revenue all of this and then they have an email from Jim Ryan the exchange between um the former CEO of concerning computer and saying revealing that Jim Ryan doesn't actually think Call of Duty he would ever go exclusive to Xbox and this is this is what the email said I'll quote it out it's not an exclusivity play at all they're thinking bigger than that and they have the cash to make moves like this right and he followed it up with we've got some good stuff cooking bear in mind they announced like a few days or a week later the acquisition of Bungie we have some good stuff yeah we were right about we were out by two years but we were right about I'm not complacent but I'd rather we said Microsoft no we said someone was gonna yeah we said that Bungie was looking to be acquired yeah yeah because I thought we said Microsoft I don't think we said Microsoft we just said I'm going to look at that please don't it's uh it's a black mark on my record um yeah yeah um but it set the it set the stage for the rest of the day that followed right um so Microsoft were immediately out saying look despite all of the showboating and the you know flying to Brussels and everything else Sony have known from day dot that that we'd do what we'd say we would do which is to keep shipping Call of Duty on Playstation um I mean I think that is pretty damning to the FTC and the CMA for taking and adopting all of the positions of Sony the provisional Finance was something even more damaging during their own witness we'll get to indeed I know we'll get to that day too I still can't get over that it was the stadia guy yeah well we'll we'll hit that we'll get to it we'll get to it um so yeah so PlayStation's obviously out there just protecting their leadership position right um which we've said from day one which yeah that's that's exactly what that's what I mean there's nothing to talk about it's already stuff we've already known we've already discussed for the better part of a year and a half it's all when you watch this podcast you get stuff ahead of time we don't we don't jump on bandwagons we start the bandwagons you start them we're the trendsetters so I understand like everyone's like oh man did you just did you see how the FTC is just trying to protect its own it's like we were telling you that a year and a half ago that they're all just out to protect Zone yeah that's that's all good news it's absolutely crazy um but what's mind buying about this is is the FTC have had all of this time to prepare this time and yet they're still primarily focusing on the console SLC and not the cloud like they've said oh yeah we're concerned about Cloud too but they're still focusing on the console yeah they're still worried about PlayStation and there's some absolutely the most Bonkers stuff is when Phil was on the stand right um but before we get to it um as the day progressed um they had Matt booty on the on the uh I wasn't awake for that I did yeah I I didn't hear a lot of this bit um but I did sort of catch up and read sort of the notes and they were asking all sorts of questions about how Call of Duty could run on the switch and you know oh my god seriously their main focus has been to disprove that the switch is in the same Market they're going for two angles the angles are we don't believe you on Call of Duty you're gonna make it exclusive and angle two is the switch doesn't count because the games don't run as well on it so it's not a true competitor even though it's in the stores now in so do people believe me yet after four years of doing this podcast do people finally believe me yet that console Warriors exist in any industry and at any level so the way this finally believe me what I've taken from this Nick is they're not they have no idea how any of this works but they're very happy to do is take everything Sony will tell them at face value and try and use that as their only argument because there's no legal reason why they can stop this so they know they don't have a legal argument but Lena Khan is like we're doing it anyways I don't care if we're losing Court even though it's a terrible precedence and it makes everyone mad at me and all of our good lawyers have quit so you fresh in from college you come over here you give one of the worst crosses to fill I've ever heard and I've heard like three of them um but their entire argument they only have two things and they're gonna pivot the cloud just the same way the CMA did because they've been working in luck they could have possibly been working in lockstep together and it's an alligator legibly they were colluding but yeah so they're they're even though all evidence points to them colluding but potentially allegedly polluting but so they're the only things they have that they have been going back and forth on and it was so boring is switches and switch isn't the same as a series x s or PS5 so you're obviously not competing um and the thing you better talk about the thing yesterday where I will talk about the thing I've got it I've got it all listed sword versus sort but yeah it's great they've just been hitting those same two and you'll hear don't worry it's coming um it's coming that's all they've been hitting that's all they've had until the very end yesterday when they brought the stadia guy in and that you know we would make graphical adjustments and assets to make it run you know in a similar way to the how do you find a way doom doom runs and it runs great on switch um but the point of this is you know FTC are focusing on this invented high performance console Market versus the console market right um and it matters to the ftc's case because if they get to exclude Nintendo Xbox has a I think something like a 46 market share compared to PlayStation so the way it would go is they said the shift between would be roughly five percent which would still have Microsoft the little like one percent or so below so whatever that math ends up working out too five down five up and they're only one so again what's the big deal what's the biggest Microsoft so that's the market leader that's the annoying thing there's been nothing here on why this is bad for gaming this is bad for custom consumers why it's bad for the industry at all it's only this will hurt something bad for Sony that's all because they because they just took PlayStation's arguments which are of course about themselves not even their customers just the actual corporate money that they will lose I've said this from day one because this is all stuff we've said from day one like try your best try your best I know it's hard for some people but try your best to take your love of your favorite console out of it for a second like you remember you're talking to someone who would prefer the deal doesn't go through but in the end I can't come up with a genuinely decent reason for it not to go through outside my personal bias that I'd rather that money gets spent elsewhere like yeah you can feel free to check my Xbox profile the only Bethesda games you're gonna find on their Doom I don't play but there's this games I didn't care about the Bethesda acquisition the only games you're going to find on my profile from ABK is like cod the odd Cod here and there back in the 360 days was different Marvel Ultimate Alliance X-Men Origins Wolverine Call of Duty every single year um I was more of an ABK guy back in the 360 era now outside the odd Cod here and there I don't care about ABK either I want to see guys seago's all I want so I'd rather this money goes into better stuff for me but in the end I can't come up with a decent reason look really no one can come up with a decent reason for this not to go through and the the Ace in the whole Microsoft has is the fact that they're losers and they're coming in third place and so they have been coming that up a fair bit Yeah like did you see the tweet from um Derek from tweetown he's like wow I don't know that they're ever going to really do more big AAA games you've Derek you've grown so much and I really do like your your Twitter account now but you're buying into the they're shoveling they're showing you all the bad stuff they're ignoring the fact that they actually make the second most money from The Big Three Publishers both both sides every side of this they're gonna Spin and paint the picture that's worse or better this week that's that's how business works like that's the whole point Matt booty was put under some pressure so the FTC had had some emails that talked about Matt boodie's description around first party games on Rival Cloud streaming services like GeForce now um apparently booty uh described them as as creating a moat that nobody else can attack and there was an email from 2019 where he was venting about Nvidia putting Xbox PC games on GeForce now yeah this is the the full quote is we're not putting our first party IP on competing streaming or subscription Services no effing way that's how it was written out it may have been no life you know what that means don't you when we get try and get Matt booty on the show we can swear yeah bill they all swear non-stop it's just in private yeah I bet you but now that it's public with math yeah if we I'm gonna try and get Matt on now and we'll say Matt a Matt this is a swearing podcast because he's a public place it's already out there it's already out yeah you're swearing now we know the um text on why he was mad at Nvidia is because they just put everyone's games on there without permission well this is your computer in the cloud so you can play whatever you want off your Steam account and every all the Publishers like what the no that's against their terms of service works that's not our licensing agreement yeah the end user license Agreements are very clear about that that's why you can't play your purchase games in xcloud yeah I don't negotiate that and indeed you know they pulled all of the Xbox game titles and he actually said look uh we'd recommend in the absence of any other plans that we do the same for Bethesda now times have changed obviously Nvidia is one of their companies and they are going to be called I think on on Wednesday or Thursday of next week uh as part of witnesses um um so that's going to be super interesting but uh yeah um Booty's response to these questions from the FTC was look you know my perspective has changed in four years since 2019. yeah um and he was quoted as saying I think since then we've seen that whilst content is absolutely important to our strategy it really isn't a durable advantage that others can enter a field and build a Content Library relatively quickly um following that booty being on stand we had Pete Hines from Bethesda I thought Pete did really well this is kind of where I jumped onto the audio feed so they were going a lot harder at him then they did yeah they're very like I didn't hear this yeah so for those that that perhaps are reading the Recaps online or seeing transcript I think the tone of this is is important to know like all the way through the FTC lawyer when he thinks he's going after a gotcha and this is this happened over and over again you get this impression he was building towards some incredible gotcha and I'm telling you folks from listening to the audio it never happened he'll pull out the gotcha and be like uh and that was and his here's what you said five years ago or here's what you said in your deposition was it truth and accurate when you gave it and they're like yeah but the question you asked is different to this one and they always came clapping back with a better answer I think only once in day two Phil actually said I was wrong that that is inaccurate sorry here's let me correct the record um but we'll get into that so all the way through this um Heinz was particularly called out for his apology and you guys might remember this he did an interview in 2021 following the acquisition and all of the up you know coming up on stage and talking about Bethesda with Xbox he did an interview with Gamespot where he kind of turned around and said I'm sorry you know it bothered me that you're upset I don't like it when our players are upset it's something we do and you know I personally apologize and they they were like hounding on Pete Hines for that apology and he's like I I empathize with our player base because the world's changed we're now owned by Microsoft um so it didn't really get to where the FTC wanted it to go um uh and it's um yeah when he was questioned on Steinfeld he actually said um it wouldn't be coming out in September if it was also a PlayStation game the quote is we would not be putting this game out in nine weeks if we were supporting an entire additional platform in my opinion and that was a prevailing thing was about the focus of these teams now they only have a set number of platforms they have to go and build for um you can be guaranteed if if Sony had got their way and had bought Starfield exclusivity that game would have been released like a year one year ago why was that a bombshell didn't Imran Khan reveal that Sony had been trying to lock down Starfield it was a rumor and it was confirmed in the court case that that's one of the reasons Bethesda rumor just like my Indiana Jones rumor like I'm I'd be surprised if Imran didn't have decent sources on that and if you guys get screwed over because so many bad rumors are out there too that people just end up being very cautious on what they do and don't believe yeah but like think about it logically is is it that hard to believe that Sony were going after Starfield Sony always go for money hats they had already got death Loop it already got ghost white Tokyo is it such a stretch to believe that they took a look at Starfield and went we'll go for that yeah and Kotor like there was a clear strategy from Sony like there was a clear strategy they did it with Street Fighter as well how do we take away the fighting game Community from Xbox like all the tournaments are on 360s the fighting game Community is on 360. how do we take that away money hat Street Fighter like Sony's been doing that for years and I've loved the candidness with which the Xbox team uh Phil in particular uh uh cut through the noise and just called it what it is is a hostile competitor that is constantly trying to nudge us out despite the resources that Microsoft has and it we'll get into day two in a sec I want to talk a little bit about Sarah Bond and chat if you're if you're listening if you've got a question comments of Sarah I caught the tail in the yeah yeah we'll get into some of the stuff she was she was very cool and collected he was very cordial with her and it was not with Pete or Phil yeah it was almost she was joking around with the judge I think there was one anecdote where she was talking about Diablo um and was asked to explain what Diablo is uh you know you fight the devil and she actually was like oh you know my dad's it's my dad's favorite game and the judge kind of laughed and it was including your 76 year old dad and all this sort of thing so there was a there was a lot more uh uh Candor and and Rapport between the judge and and Sarah Bond but she she went over a lot of things um explaining how license agreements worked explaining how um you know have a subscription service Works how it can generate interest in in other other things um but what the bombshell that came from Sarah Bond was that she talked about the revenue sharing deal so the story is I understand it goes um series X Series S is about to launch they want to launch Call of Duty on it the first time around and Sony had apparently agreed to a better Revenue share for for sales of Activision's game and Activision were like well you know we're not going to prepare a series version if you don't if you don't come to the table on this so effectively through Sony's ability to control the market forced the third place player to to also give this publisher more of a cut in order to have a parity version for their consoles and you know and obviously the FTC seized on this right oh so you're willing to pay more for Call of Duty because it's an essential input because it's important blah blah They seized on this a little bit um but it's you know they were dodging around it a lot because obviously this financial information is clear the rumors said I think 8812 the FTC lawyer did accidentally say 80 20 split well they said they said 80. so that could have been the beginning of 88 88 yeah yeah and the card that said never mind 80 20 like in the chat I saw grub set yesterday but the actual rumor is 88 12 12 per Cod yeah yeah um but that was quite uh like other guy you know Savvy Savvy move from Activision right like to get more money but that is the kind of Market power I don't blame Activision capitalism is what it is that's the kind of Market power that Sony can affect you know because they can be like yeah we want more money we want more Revenue spit because Call of Duty is by far an incredible selling game on PlayStation PlayStation themselves obviously come out and said how essential it is to their input but the fact that they then managed to squeeze the third place competitor for sales but that's why it makes me laugh when I shoot a stupid Fanboys having a cry on Twitter and stuff about it like just be consistent don't sit there and go on Microsoft's just using their money to like do this and that and the other and then be okay with the Zone he's been doing for decades like yeah I I want Microsoft to have their turn as the heel Nintendo had their turn in the 80s Sony had their turn in the late 90s early 2000s Microsoft hasn't had their turn yet like I see Fanboys on Twitter being like ah what about a Microsoft's money hats you think my money hats are bad you people have no idea the stuffed Nintendo and Sony have done in the past if you knew like what's come out in this FTC case tip of the iceberg the reasons yes stories I could tell me and yeah why do you think Jim Ryan's testimony is so under lock and key Microsoft Sony and Nintendo have done in the past in I'm talking about in the video game industry I'm aware that Microsoft has been horrific elsewhere but in the video game industry specifically Microsoft's nothing Microsoft is like I don't even know how to describe it like you're talking about a company that had two money hat a game just appearing on their platform in Final Fantasy 13. Grand Theft Auto 4 like who do you reckon's paying for those Persona ports you don't think Microsoft has to pay for all of that like yeah this is yeah Nintendo used to do this to Sega Nintendo used to have these agreements where third parties couldn't make the games and cartridges for Mega Drive so cigar ported a lot of those third-party games themselves because Nintendo wouldn't allow them to do it like there's Bonkers isn't it on that level they're notorious for going after reviewers in stores and yeah you know like and chat you know if you guys again if you guys have got specific questions you want to call out just don't don't forget to slap that Super Chat button and we'll get right on them and and while you're there 300 plus people watching you know hit that like button we really appreciate it the algorithm has been meaningless lately strong tactics it does help us um but yes the other thing that they they grilled uh Sarah bondon was around xcloud um where she was very very careful to Define this as a feature are we talking about the the windows license [Laughter] and Sarah's like no I I think I think I understand how they got that misconstrued which I'll explain later yeah and it's it's funny right because Sarah did get into a lot of details about it Cloud including how much it costs around the service and I uh the full quote is we get revenue from it but when we look at all the numbers the revenue we get per minute per hour from that is lower than the cost we get per minute per hour of that so essentially the nutshell Microsoft doesn't make money out of xcloud because it's costly to take all of the series X Series S hardware and put them in blades plonk them in data centers and run a feature that is mostly used according to Microsoft's own data for its price layers to try stuff before they download it um that's how I use and the exchange that you're referring to Nick is um hilarious because FTC were like oh so you need a Windows license to stream PC that's correct correct no you can stream PC games without a Windows license disagree it involves a license for Windows correct uh that is their agreement with third-party um like ubitus and GeForce now those companies are running Windows versions of games so each computer they're running those off of need a Windows license which is a part which is like a way that they're trying to say oh well you make money off all these third parties anyways it's like well yeah but we're also they I think they offered like you get our games for no license the license is literally free for the APK yeah Xbox first party stuff so like they're already paying for this first part they're already paying for Windows Keys it's not part of the New Deal the New Deal is you get our game licenses just ask as long as you're a legitimate Cloud company you get them that's it and we've spoken about this in the past it's a win-win for Microsoft because you still have to buy the game off them so they don't care go stream it on GeForce now you've already bought it you gave us our money for it and that was sort of that argument as well like lots of oh so Microsoft get all the money from the game purchases yeah these clown providers are not it's their game store they're not selling a product they're selling access to streaming that product that you already own this is completely different thing you rent their Hardware like I don't look I get it people who don't even corporations they don't know how it works I understand everyone hates their big evil corporations but okay that's fine but that they should still be allowed to operate the normal way like most aren't but not I just don't like this idea that that everything has to be framed in such a bad way but then Microsoft makes all the money it's like well of course it's their video game and you're buying it from them why shouldn't they not call them and this whole case this whole case has been you're not why do you get exclusives you you shouldn't have this exclusive all of their you know things just keep coming back to well you shouldn't have this not why just you don't get this We're not gonna say it helps customers if you don't get this we don't give a about customers but why does that information consumers because they don't have beneficial legal argument for why this is bad for consumers but their whole mandate the whole the CMA and the FTC their primary mandate is protecting consumers they just spent hours and never mention the consumers once under Lena Khan their primary mandate is to go after big business no matter the cost to the country no matter the chances of winning no matter the terrible precedence it sets when you know you're going to lose in court all they want to do is get to court and tie people up as much as possible because the smaller companies just can't afford it now I I saw like you know I I had friends who are PlayStation fans I have friends who are Nintendo fans have a lot of Nintendo fans right if you if you want to spot a Sony Fanboy on Twitter there's a very very easy way and this case has brought it to light if you see anyone on Twitter say man the FTC put forward a really amazing case like they were just drilling all those Xbox execs unbelievable like roasted them grilled them if you see anything like that on Twitter just mute that person because you're doing it with an idiot like think about it logically right so the FTC has no clue about anything this judge I was I was starting this before and then we had to go to other stuff this judge probably doesn't know a great deal about the video she's got a sensible head on her shoulders I like her already yeah she's come into it saying yeah she doesn't really think about hell think about what a piss-poor job the FTC lawyer is doing right just just put this in your head for a second how bad of a job is the FTC lawyer doing when a judge doesn't really know much about the gaming industry is listening to this guy question Phil Spencer and then eventually was just like dude shut the up just shut up you've heard it in her voice I could hear it in her voice and this is what I mean hearing the tone of these people yeah if this was just something happening privately in her home Phil Spencer was at the table the FTC lawyer was at the table and she was there she would have literally uttered the words dude shut the up like I mean you heard the exasperation in her voice she's like oh my God I'm stopping this right now it wasn't the first time she had directed him to just move on she's like we get the point um day two was was Phil Spencer primarily but we'll go through it in order um so where to begin um the courtroom I think at the start of day two was sealed so there was some Financial testimony that was uh privileged information um which I think was via a Microsoft uh guy called Jamie Oliver um who's the senior Finance director at Microsoft or Xbox specifically I should say so we don't know what was spoken about there um but then Spencer was next on the stand and kudos to Phil a remained very calm and collected throughout and he got a he did get drilled right ineffectively and he held he held some frustration in his voice yeah you could hear he was annoyed at the stupidity of the question I could hear there were moments where you could tell Phil just wanted to go dude you're pushing it it wasn't me off he was full on going for he was just going for gotchas he had nothing else it was just how can I look at what you gave us in deposition and then try and trap you into saying something different but the you know and the big focus of day two was was funnily enough all about uh the Nintendo's little little no Nintendo's Nintendo's handheld console was the primary they had other kind of conversation they did have them all up there yeah they had a PS5 and a series X and you're like different it looks look how tiny it is they talked about the form factor right and the point of this is right I heard that the FTC want to say um Microsoft doesn't talk about the switch internally they only talk about how they're comparatively to PlayStation um and to try and back up this whole premise of a high performance console Market that doesn't really exist right and Microsoft are like uh the switch is in the shops you can go buy it it's all the same shelves it has games it has games it's a games console it's in the market and you know as Jesse said they did bring in all of the consoles I think the quote used was the PS5 and the Xbox series consoles shipped at the same time from a form factor these two functionally look more equivalent um but Spencer you know I'm picking out some quotes here uh thanks to the wonderful work of Tom Warren at The Verge he's got some great Recaps on both of the days by the way so definitely go check out uh it's incorrect to say Nintendo isn't a competitor um but he did admit that yeah of course there's some clear Hardware differences the switch was designed for people to take on the go whereas the Gen 8 Xbox One consoles require that they're plugged into a wall and don't have a screen Nintendo built a different platform um but the FTC wouldn't let this bone go all right so Spencer was questioned how many frames per second the series and this is where it gets hilarious right because any of us no well the switch could do 120 FPS the game wouldn't look very good but it could do it right so this is always a balancing act of artistic intent and I got it from the nerdy science side I don't think it has anything in my 2.1 oh so it makes it interesting it might be able to Output at 120 but at like a real low resolution you never know yeah yeah but you get my point right is that the the creation of games and the performance of games is is is what are we making and what do we want it to perform like there's plenty of 60 FPS games on switch [Music] um and yeah they just they they were going into all sorts of crazy crazy detail um and just wouldn't let that go um oh well and then where do we go um but so I did disagree with Phil on one thing what's that so the lawyer kept saying talking about the generations and he ultimately came to the end and was like so do you think the switch is a gen 9 console and Phil was like no either vehemently disagree on that it's gender Services what's about as powerful as a 360. but that's not what Jen means I know when did Generations were never about power Generations were about when your next Mainline console comes out yeah the switch is their gen 9 console the fact that it came out three years before the other the other relevant it's their gen 9 console the Wii U was their gen 8 came out in 2012 one year before Xbox One and PS4 and because of how horribly it bombed they were forced to go early on gen 9. that is their gen 9 console Jen's not about power it's about their next console anyone who says the switch is not a gen 9 console is objectively incorrect I I get I get why Phil said it because he was kind of tired of bored and angry well I think he was he was just yeah I think that was one where they were just I honestly think it hurt his argument I actually think and I don't know if he realized that it actually hurt his argument more he should have said no it is a gen 9 console it's their ninth generation console it is it depends on what their internal discussion about it is so if they've never called you gen 9 internally you can't say that simply because it's going to go against and then it's a gacha yeah he's trying to he's you know he's going to think about all the things he said four or five years ago legally logical legalese is what you can prove against the law in court in laws quite often are not about being logical they're written by who just want to get companies more money so they can get paid this this cat is back again what do you want what are you doing they're the worst that's why I don't let mine in here during the show because she'd get well it's only because I've got the window because it's crazy hot in here you guys should have here you don't have to rub your in my face man I get it okay it's summer there okay yeah it's lovely it's hard it's like 19 degrees it's so hot so on the subject of of grilling Phil about things so one of the things that that Microsoft argued was you know I believe this was a either a statement or a press release they they talked about Xbox lost the console Wars its Rivals are positioned to continue to dominate and then yes we've got this wonderful console or is the social construct and and it's so funny I saw Greg Jeff Grubb tweaked this out and I pinged I added pre-drag I was like dude you know what to do and he missed the boat and someone else made the t-shirt and got all the love yeah can make a nicer one yeah pre-drug will make a nicer t-shirt at the moment though the fill face we should have on ours is the smiley face it would look so much better with the Phil smiley face on it that the console war is a social contract was on break I keep asking him for a thumbnail the the full the full quote is as the air consoles Wars are a social contract with the community I would never want to count our community out they're big fans so he was being he took like when he was asked this he was like he thought for like a good 10 seconds I was like was the audio cut off but then he just said this right um if you look at our market share in the console space over 20 years we're in third place we are behind Sony Nintendo in console share globally so he never said we lost he very carefully said we're in third do you know what I mean which is fine um but then he was questioned about an email exchange with the CFO uh Tim Stewart um where Phil actually described PlayStation as hostile to Xbox's survival they are that's not again that's not news like and this he knows I loved the truth from Phil here and he said every time we ship a game on PlayStation Sony captures 30 of the revenue that we do on their platform and then they use that money amongst other Revenue that they have to try and do things to reduce Xbox that's a clever way of spinning that that's a very clever very clever way we try to compete but as I said over the last 20 years we failed to do that effectively okay now this brought up an interesting point of discussion because I saw a lot of people on Twitter with their own attempted gotchas but Microsoft's a trillion dollar company they can't outbid Sony on this like I know I know they but they again not news we've spoken about this stuff forever so for all the idiot Fanboys that don't understand how this works Microsoft is a ginormous company yeah huge company video games are a very small and relatively unimportant part of that company right Sony on the other hand would effectively live or die by PlayStation PlayStation is a massive massive massive part of Sony yeah and both in image in financial importance in everything Nintendo even more so that's why Nintendo is so uh so OCD about their games being so incredibly good and like like Nintendo may have games that aren't for you but Nintendo doesn't have many genuinely bad games and there's a reason for that it's because they can't afford to have bad games right because Nintendo's entire business regardless of just his opinion wrong opinions on Super Mario Odyssey whatever and then say it's a bad Nintendo Nintendo doesn't have many genuinely bad games because they simply can't afford to have bad games right because their whole business is video games Sony to a lesser extent Sony also can't afford to have too many that's why that's why Sony is so all in up until recently was so all in on the third person over the shoulder narrative driven because that's where they found success so they're like well guys video games are very important to us do what's working keep doing what's working keep doing what's working right Microsoft if XBox went away tomorrow Microsoft would just keep on trucking yeah the way they've been Trucking like it so you can't turn around and say well Microsoft's a 2.8 trillion dollar company and why can't they outbid Sony on these deals here's why because Microsoft's not just going to give blank checks to Xbox to do whatever the hell they want very true because Xbox is in the position they're in their costs deals aren't going to cost the same as it costs Sony so there has to be a Tipping Point where Microsoft's like well no screw that why does Sony only have to pay 5 million for that deal but we've got to pay 10. go get stuffed dumped get stuffed there's a point where they have to say no more yeah I agree with the mindset that that's my point it's the same reason why again Xbox era ahead of the curve it's the same reason why I've been trying to tell you all Sony's not going day one PS plus yet this is where their Market leadership has the opposite effect Microsoft gets all these great third-party Game Pass deals why aren't we seeing Sony do the same with PlayStation plus they do Indies but they're not doing big third party deals on PlayStation Plus why do you think that is Geniuses why do you think that is because when you're the market leader it's gonna cost more for a third party to forego all those potential PlayStation sales to launch their game into PlayStation Plus idiots where with Microsoft it's not going to cost it no I'm saying idiots because these people don't think before they talk take away your bias for your stupid box this is where your your Market leadership hurts you that's why Sony's gonna take a while to do day one on PlayStation Plus because they need to get their first party Studios cranking to get more games out per year to be able to do it so the future of PlayStation Plus will be day one launches and some mintis sprinkled with some Indies and some old third-party games that's what places are in Thailand yeah yeah yeah so they'll get day one Indies like stray like rocket League like whatever whatever they'll do some of those or their first party and they'll sprinkle in some old third-party stuff and they'll put their first party back in because even now once their first party goes in it comes out eventually it doesn't stay forever yeah it doesn't stick around but Microsoft who's who's third and doesn't have a lot of console sales even though I was hoping the console sales would come out because I still think it's higher than people think but anyway because their install base is lower those third-party Gamecast deals don't cost as much so they get an outriders they get it back for blood they get all these third-party logic path of the goddess exoprimal they can get these because there's not as many lost sales yeah that's the nutshell soft Taz that's the nutshell and I have to pause for a minute big shout out to biggity 08 who's been a member for two months uh as an Xbox series supporter he says what's up fellas one of the few podcasts that speak facts keep it up thumbs up um uh equally if you want to support Xbox here you can go to patreon.com forward slash XBox era and you get all sorts of cool perks and all the fun stuff I had to get to Annoy Us every week with Community questions but we'll get to them at the end of the show so uh furthermore FTC was like oh so your business isn't necessarily meeting its internal targets today right and Phil said nope it's not today with the majority of our business residing as the third place console business we're not a robust business interesting phrasing um because and you know I think this is a bit dissident you'll say they're losing money he said we are not a robust business but like wasn't it two days ago or something that we had a big uh oh we're making more money than ever on Xbox we did a you know exploding they said they were making it so the wording is they're not hitting their internal targets that's the key yeah we don't know what their targets are their targets could be astronaut they could be like Square Enix they could be like Square Enix the Square Enix One's Tomb Raider to sell 47 million copies and only 20 million didn't hit out isn't that the same thing so Square Enix always says that their Western games were failing because they had they were not paying yeah ridiculous targets for them but then we find out that Tomb Raider sold like 13 million copies it's like man that's that's that's actually pretty damn good oh but man that was below our expectations what the hell were your expectations yeah that's why Phil we again we always say this Phil's always very clever with wording he knows what he's doing he's definitely been coached very very well for the cross oh look I'm sure there's a little bit of coaching but let's be honest Phil's been around long enough to probably not need that coaching so yeah he scores this FTC lawyer a number of times right um but he was he was quizzed further okay well you know why are you spending 70 billion dollars on Activision then and he explains it's all about the mobile opportunity so yeah the field quote here is the deal as we've talked about expands our business to the mobile platform the existing business that we run today is the third place console business is a very difficult business to drive profit and margin so the opportunity for us to expand in a meaningful way into Mobile the world's largest gaming platform was really both a strategic and business opportunity behind the deal um and then to back that up Spencer was then uh quizzed from the FTC about how this Activision deal could help Xbox consoles so I'll read the quotes here because these are great FTC if Microsoft's going to grow particularly in a business like console it can grow by taking share from its competitors yeah that's competition there is no console growth in our Activision deal model so chat what he means here is when Microsoft internally looked at Activision and modeled out what it's going to look like what it's worth to them what the Ambitions will be if that acquisition closes they did not calculate console growth as a part of that deal it's not even a consideration they're not concerned about growing Xbox as part of this deal I'm sure off paper they probably are a bit on paper yeah on paper they did not mark it down as a consideration for growth so when they're saying yeah we're actually in this for the mobile so lot of things and maybe the PC side of things that this is this is an important one so the FTC followed this up with do you have any intention of this deal helping you to climb out of the number three spot and Spencer said in console no and this is this is hilarious FTC also that's just a write-off and you can hear Phil's annoyance he's like uh I don't understand how that's a write-off so the question bills start to get annoyed like you could hear it yeah rather than answer that the FTC lawyer just moved on he just ignored Phil be like how is that a write-off like we're not what in his his tone the FTC lawyers tone pretty much of the entire time with Phil was like just combative like just yeah just on the edge of sounding like I don't like you and I'm gonna constantly come at you because I'm I'm gonna get you like I got gotchas so many of them yeah yeah um comparison it did get followed up right so the FTC guy was like if you could make a decision that would benefit Microsoft and harm Microsoft's competitors in any of the markets that they've discussed that would be good for Microsoft gaming numbers right I hate the way the FTC law is like right right correct yeah for every yeah I was like oh this is grinding my gears um so what he's trying to do here is kind of say you know look you're going to harm the competition and boost your own Revenue here and Phil answered again very succinctly uh we're trying to compete in the market by growing our business some of our business growth is obviously growth that our competitors would like to have so in the end our growth is probably from some of our competitors not realizing that growth themselves which is a very diplomatic way of saying if they're not going to invest we will and we'll realize that growth that's not taking it away from them that's our competitors not doing the same thing and Ergo not earning that growth I think that's a fair answer that's mine but why are they not allowed to grow that's what's hilarious why are they not allowed to grow what's harming the consumer the ftc's the FTC is coming at it from two angles that even if they get it right even if they convince the judge I still don't see how it helps them get a preliminary injunction I don't see how proven the Nintendo doesn't count in that Xbox could potentially take away Cod to boost their business and knock Sony's business Down Still how does that hurt the market and how is that worth essentially killing the deal by giving the pi like even if you win on those points which you're not because they're really dumb how does that win your case it does get it in my book paying citizen I find it really goddamn annoying that so much money is going into something so stupid I wish it was being said better Brazil is still the gold state to this day the Brazil regulators and how they tackled it is still the gold standard which is which is ironic given Brazil is the market that arguably gets screwed over the most by Sony by Nintendo by Microsoft by all of them like it's crazy to me the Brazil Regulators were the only ones that really they get screwed over by their own rules so the Brazil customers get screwed over the most but Brazil's own tax rules are what make those prices yeah I know I'm just saying like Brazil in general in terms of buying a video game in Brazil they get screwed over the most yet they're the regulator that did this by far the best super quick absolute not just quick they were thorough and efficient like yeah they they covered so many things that I never thought of that no other regulator has thought of like here you've got the FTC being oh but so new to to promise so it will get to it it's really painful I've got the full exchange here and then Brazil is like well hold on if you guys have ABK that's going to make you arguably quite powerful to the point where maybe other third parties get squeezed down and you don't need them anymore I'm like wow I did not think of that that's that's a nothing I never thought of that's like a real possibility unlikely which obviously Brazil decided it was unlikely but that was quite a clever thing to think of I never thought about that yeah yeah where the FTC and the CMA are just like but what about PlayStation who's going to think about them yeah it's very very strange oh my God it's embarrassing but I mean it gets stranger right so um they bring up Bethesda a lot so obviously uh exclusivity this became then the Hot Topic so we'd already heard on day one oh you know Indiana Jones we redid the deal with Disney um and it was going to ship on multiple consoles it was going to do XYZ and now uh and Phil's answer to this was look well it wasn't on Game Pass and then we became a Game Pass house so we went and redid that deal and yeah now it's going to be an Xbox game pass day one game and PC only that's they've obviously saw it that's that's up to Disney that's these aren't New Deals we said those exact words we said those exact words when we spoke about Indie being exclusive two years ago we said Disney aren't aversed doing exclusivity deals with consoles are they they did it with Spider-Man and now they're going to do Marvel Ultimate Alliance three only on switch and and they uh they turned around and then started talking to Phil about Elder Scrolls six and Phil refused to confirm it he said I think that clear on what platforms it's launching on given how far out that game that was that was our next game right now there was something that booty brought up to about out of Worlds he was like well we haven't decided yet we all know but they're they're not going to commit to anything they don't have to so it's a stupid question to ask they're not going to maybe even but again this is why I love the clever wording right and and the reason I Love Phil saying this is because Phil is basically confirming what I've been saying for the longest time so I I still personally believe that eventually Call of Duty will be exclusive to Xbox that's my opinion random Jazz that's not Insider info that's my opinion hey Nick sorry to interrupt you but you know at this point we'll get into it a little bit because some of the questions are about it but you know are you can you promise can you promise all of that if Sony don't play ball and sign an agreement that's what I was about to just get to now so Phil said yes I can promise that we will continue to Pro to publish Call of Duty on Playstation as long as Sony lets us why do you think Phil kept he said it two or three times why do you think Phil kept saying if Sony lets us Minecraft why do you think distinction to make you know I we have hit our friend Chris uh a lot about Minecraft not being a series X version that runs a 4K in this case I think has shown why because they weren't able to do that on PS5 at the time and they know if they gave Xbox a better version then like that would come back and bite them in the ass which is not just that it's but it's also so they didn't get the dev kits in time they don't want to and if the PlayStation can't do all the ray tracing stuff the series X can do because it has lesser Hardware it would be an inferior version and they know that they're being watched so tightly on this stuff he's the reason why Phil keeps saying if Sony lets us Sony has to sign a licensing agreement every game all games have to have a licensing agreement right and if people bothered to actually read these licensing agreements they'd realize that they don't own any of the games they think they own nope but anyway let's put that aside even the cartridges that you think you own you don't actually own there's a gonna have to be a licensing agreement signed now for COD once Microsoft or if and when Microsoft the general publisher agreement that they have yeah my this is just my personal feeling and this is why Mike Phil kept saying if Sony lets us so right now we know we now know through this case and Microsoft's probably already known for ages that Sony has a has given Activision a very favorable Revenue share agreement my guess and I've said this before is that they will try and close this deal if so if the FCC doesn't get their Pi they'll close the deal straight away and then they'll close it on the CMA as well and they'll quickly redo that licensing agreement for Sony to make the terms as shitty as possible maybe like a 90 10. they've already got 8812 if they've already got 8812 allegedly they may go to a 90-10 what what they talk they did talk about um that they were actually offering better terms in their agreement but the thing right in the current one yeah and but what Sony wants is they still want all their exclusivity they want the exact same terms with the better split so they still want their exclusive content for a year they still want their exclusive perks on all this they don't want parody they want the better version still there's loads of stupid stuff and we'll talk more about about cod in a sec before we do that we've got a couple of super chats that we need to to tackle there we go yeah uh Hitman with the one I know Super Chat big brain I think that was about Phil when we were talking about Phil being smart uh and Timber 21. uh Phil said under oath I will not be the one to break this exclusivity deal we make here today wait until Sarah Bond takes over baptism of fire yeah I feel like Sarah is like super aggressive as well we've said that for ages like Sarah has to be the one that takes over yeah she's been prime it feels a little bit like she's being primed for it but um I'm sorry he's letting her take front stage on a lot of stuff like the um the showcases and yeah even after at The Fan Fest like you it was the main one talking like uh she's but there's so many there's so many reasons both front of house and back of house reasons that Sarah should be the one that takes over so many reasons um yeah uh so there was all sorts of stuff the FTC kept throwing at Microsoft have you had conversations about skipping PlayStation with Activision titles and he was repeatedly asked about this and feels like ah I don't remember a specific conversation but it would probably be a normal conversation for us to have over the course of a year and he kept he kept getting like you don't remember a conversation in Fall of 2021 it's like bro I can't remember a conversation I had last week man imagine if you're talking about this stuff day in day out it was like this constant game of gotcha with this guy and sometimes like two or three years old do you remember this very specific meeting that there's an email about it it's like I he Phil has how many meetings a day does he have like yeah five ten a day it was like you know you you said this thing in your you know in this ages ago you said this thing right you know do you remember that and he's like I mean if I did say it it's like factually incorrect we're still publishing games on PlayStation we're still public it was about zenimax yeah and he's like you know you remember you said this and he's like oh yeah even if I said it it's clearly factually incorrect because we're still publishing but there's the games on PlayStation yeah well one of the ones that they they hammered on was emails about Minecraft dungeons um and how Phil was having a chat with uh the Xbox CMO Mike Nichols um and they were both like yeah yeah it should be exclusive to Xbox regardless of that conversation it still arrived on Playstation Xbox PC and switch right um but the biggest Revelation that that came out of of a lot of the conversation that everyone was really surprised about and I know Nick we kind of talked about it already was that and I liked that Phil was so direct about this look Sony regularly and he didn't say he didn't say Sony makes deals to support the games or buyers first part you know exclusivity he said he's they're paying competitors to skip Xbox they're playing Publishers to skip we've talked about and the quote was from Phil when we acquired xenomax one of the impetus for that is that Sony had done a deal for death Loop and ghost wire Tokyo to pay Bethesda to not ship those games on Xbox so the discussion about Starfield when we heard firing renkar maybe that Starfield was potentially also going to end up skipping Xbox we can't be in a position as a third place console where we fall further behind on our content ownership so we've had to secure content to remain viable in the business fair enough and I loved it I actually saw a tweet and it's not often I see a tweet from Ryan McCaffrey that that I like sorry Ryan um but he was like the Sony was uh around to around and find out securing exclusivity for ghost wire and death Loop and then they found out with stuff yeah we're just gonna buy the whole company that was stuff we had said back then like that's that's what this is and that's probably a part of what ABK is and that's why I that's why I've pivoted from Capcom to square now I'm like I wouldn't be surprised if they're having a look at square and it came out that there had been discussions about acquiring Square again another around and find out moment because Sony just keeps money heading all the square stuff and Microsoft has the payovers to get stuff on there their style of their style of money hat isn't we're going to get better things for our customers it's we're paying not to help our customers they're gonna have this anyways we are paying so your customers don't get anything and that's I think always the difference is like they're just paying they're not paying to make something exist they're not paying to make something better for their fans generally they are mostly paying when they can outside of cod to just you don't get this that's it yeah but Sony's been doing that for decades they did it to Sega they always but but remember there's two sides to this story right so yes I understand there's the X there's the Xbox or the anti-sony side which is well this Sony's dirty tactics they're always trying to muscle out the competition they muscled out Sega they're trying to muscle that Xbox those things are 100 True Sony has been doing Shady tactics the muscle after competition from day one right and that was born from the way Sony came into the industry when Nintendo screwed them over right so Nintendo screwed over Sony and created their worst enemy and that's how Sony was born in the industry so all they know is Shady tactics and it's worked for them look at Nintendo Nintendo became what they became because of shady tactics Sony became what they became because of shady tactics Microsoft hasn't had their turn yet don't think that a few money heads here and there is anything compared to what Sony and Nintendo have done in the past now while it's easy to say Sony's the bad guy because of these Shady tactics and muscling out Sony is the guy that comes in and finishes the job that's the other side of the coin Sega got to the point where they were forced out of the industry of their own stupidity yes as a Sega Fanboy back then I I put a lot of the blame on Sony but really see no Sony didn't make Sega release a 32x Sony didn't make Sega release a Sega CD or a Saturn and screw up the Saturn that was all Sega so the Sega was already a Dead Man Walking Sony came along I went Bang and put the final bullet in their head this with Xbox is the same so Sony didn't make Microsoft have the disastrous Xbox One launch Sony didn't put them in that position Microsoft put themselves in that position the difference is when Sony came along and tried to put the bullet in the head they didn't realize who they were actually dealing with yeah that Sony never thought that Microsoft the parent company would actually start to get involved that was the difference Sega didn't have a Microsoft behind them I know a Microsoft behind them to help them so now Sony is this bully that's been picking on the kid in high school for years but not realizing this kid had billionaire parents that's what this is Sega didn't have the DNA parents Microsoft I kind of agree with you with your stance there because yeah you know the fact that Microsoft said hang on a second are we are we serious about that we all know the story right Sachin nadello and Phil if we're gonna go do this do we could we actually go and do it rather than think about doing it and how heartily do it can we make it a pillar now they have but all of this Square Enix um you know xenomax one of the other Acquisitions that came to light was Microsoft did explore acquiring Zynga as we all know take two got that in the end yeah Phil actually called out in the end the opportunity that we needed to have we need something bigger than Zynga and it was too small to start us and give give us a Kickstart into Mobile but look we get to the meat and potatoes of it which is the the Call of Duty oath the promise the pinky promises oh God the pinky swear right you have to do it twice um and it's funny I so in the middle we you get the first one you'll go into in a second but then after the break when he came back and he had always sleeping on Twitter and he's like okay I know what the I know people are gonna try and say that was very yeah yeah so he he got called out and he said to the judge I would raise my hand I'd do whatever it takes my commitment is and my testimony is that we will to continue to ship future versions of Call of Duty on Sony's Playstation 5. so that was the first time this came up right now the key word there obviously is he only said five which left wiggle rooms all the conspiracy nuts out there that oh what about PlayStation 6 and PlayStation 7 and so on and the FTC chomped on that and they they asked the question right can you swear under oath without without looking at any future terms that you need to hash out that your ship all the versions of Call of Duty that may exist on all the versions of PlayStation that may exist in the next 10 years and Phil said that's my goal yes and then there was more more back and forth and again he said yeah that's my goal if what you're trying to propose is that something might change the terms of how we ship games on our platform that would prohibit us from shipping on their platforms um that's my goal that's why they don't want to go above 10 years you can't lock yourself into something you don't know that's that's our intention that's our desire very smart wording we've said that before yeah that's kind of talking about that type of uh thinking that Nick was just doing Hitman again big frontal lobe thinking Nick yeah and the FTC wouldn't let this go they then started asking about other Activision games um and I listened to this and I was sending the judge God shut up it was it was really this is where the judge interrupted so the FTC were like would you make the same promise with respect of all of Activision's games and feel quite right it was like I was asked specifically about Call of Duty my answer's yeah that's right Activision ships games on mobile and all sorts of different platforms they have some PC only games like Warcraft I don't think there's a blanket statement you can make and then he had a full Fanboy moment what about Diablo what about Diablo can you promise they had blow I'm like I love cools answers he got Phil got shirt if it was like can I promise I am able and a question like that is they don't own Activision yet he doesn't he has an idea that what Diablo just came out and Diablo 4 is a big platform they're going to be supporting a long time I have no idea legally I don't have to have any idea what that future of Diablo is Diablo Games come out like seven to twelve years it's like we don't I don't know I don't know if I can promise that to you it's just and the judge was just like I am stopping this right well I'm stopping this right now the first time the FTC were like you're able to bind Microsoft today are you able to bind the corporation here today Phil didn't answer and the FTC also I remember listening to this and thinking what a douche he was like I think the point has been made I'm happy to move along and the judge was like yeah why don't we move along you could hear the exasperation voice and it didn't improve right so they were talking about the acquisition and this was brilliant from Phil right he he sat down and schooled this FTC guy so we've all heard this argument right oh they're spending 70 billion dollars they've got to make that back right so FTC you have a 70 billion dollar upfront payment that you're making for Activision right and feels like no when you acquire something it's not a payment it's like when you buy a house you're buying an asset that has value so it's really a transfer of cash into that asset which is called Activision and that you believe retains the value that you acquired it for so to try and characterize 70 billion are somehow spent like a payment is incorrect financially it's really moving that 70 billion into the asset which is a game publisher that to us is actually worth more than 70 billion so it's not spent money beautiful like the FTC the Federal Trade Commission should really understand already what an acquisition is and how it works I'll admit I I I'll admit I don't know about that stuff I would have seen it probably in a similar way to have the FTC lawyer sorry you spit you're paying 70 what spending money is you trading I'm just admitting that I'm a dummy man I'm just saying he shouldn't be because trade I know he shouldn't be spending money is literally trading your money for something like the Federal Trade Commission this is what they oversee so getting that fundamental thing wrong hurt it hurt me as an idiot inside that somebody in this position could say something so seemingly to me idiotic it's like you are a you are a government lawyer for the Federal Trade Commission and your thing is overseeing Acquisitions into so flatly and incorrectly State what an acquisition is fundamentally hurt my heart was aching with like how am I paying this guy to do this right now yeah it's painful and and Nick this was the point where the FTC then started going on back onto the Call of Duty commitments and they just threw it in there it was like a lost he said he was having Mary yeah he said he wasn't done and then said oh can I ask about this and yeah and then yeah so the lawyer was like yeah I'm done oh wait uh can you make a commitment to bringing it to Sony's Playstation cloud service station I know you all don't want to believe in it but there's every chance that that FTC lawyer is just they're locked up in what PlayStation's lawyers are telling them they are locked stepping it it is their only focus I keep saying that but but why people don't want to accept the fact that like fans of video games exist everywhere he doesn't understand video games he doesn't at all that doesn't mean he can't be a fan of PlayStation I've got mates who love Xbox and Playstation have no idea about the industry but they're still fans of that platform isn't that hard to is it really that hard to believe like like Sarah Bond said her 76 year old dad loves Diablo these gaming fans everywhere the way I look at to believe for them being a government entity with a directive from their lead Lena Khan that we just we're going to do everything we can to stop this when they don't have any decent legal recourse and the only thing they can they can grasp on to to try and figure something out are the arguments of the main competitor because it literally goes against every tenant of the FTC to to back Sony in this they are back in the market leader but they're doing it because they don't have any other case they're obvious the first the the female lawyer in the first day seemed fine she seemed to get it and was doing okay she I mean that's why it was so cordial because she kind of came off like yeah I know I don't really have a ton here but the guy in day two with his smarmy voice and Jesus Christ did he just sound right right correct he was like the teacher in high school you hated because he thought you knew everything but he was a idiot um but they're like they just they've had more people quit than ever under Lena Khan because they just don't like working for her because they don't agree with her and the way she's on the right side of the issue going about it in the completely wrong way when it comes to Big Tech and Acquisitions and stuff like she's very lenacon is resettera where she is on the right side most of the time but she goes about it in the exact wrong way and so the lawyers they have now are being told you must win this case no matter what and when they look at the law and they're like well this is a vertical merger and there's no reason why we should be against it what can they grasp on to if they're new and they can I ask something like something I'm I've been seeing in the chat a lot and I don't know where it's coming from because I don't follow Bethesda enough because he apologized yeah he apologized that their games aren't on Playstation it seems like it's more than that though I'm seeing it a lot in the chat the only email about how come we don't get to choose stay third party because he emailed okay so after the APK thing it feels like their games the place Cod will stay on PlayStation and Pete's like well why don't we get to do that look I know about the apology but that apology didn't come across to me like he's a PlayStation fan yeah he took a lot of just came with people online that he actually kind of quit Twitter because people wouldn't stop leaving him alone about it so so and look I I would say it's in the chat look if you're just curious why I was like what did I miss nothing major just people reading into stuff if you're a Creator you probably want your stuff to be played by as many people as possible and look the reality is they've been bought by Microsoft but now they're seeing you know they're seeing Bungie no no we're still going to release everything third party they're seeing Activision no no we still have to release another party and he's like oh man we've let down so many fans that may exist on other platforms that's how I interpret it I interpret it it's just a human being well we've always been on PlayStation and all of a sudden we're not sorry sorry to the PlayStation fans that like our content that's the reality I didn't I didn't interpret his apology as oh he's spewing because he prefers PlayStation that's why chat looks at things like a versus B and Publishers and developers don't they just like her being everywhere and they like being on everything now in certain cases it's obviously better to just be on one it's a hell of a lot less work um for QA and all that but still in the end they're creatives who like their stuff being everywhere and Bethesda had a long history on Playstation not as long as on Xbox but still a long history on PlayStation and now that you're just gone there and all those devs you worked with who you're friends with all those fans that you know because they interact online like that's all just gone this is the reality man it is quiet that's just the reality it was but then Bungie gets to stay third party Call of Duty gets to say third party you're like oh what the but that's the agreement though so Mo Yang is as well Mo Yang's third party too so that's the agreement so bethesda's agreement wasn't that so Minecraft is so but it doesn't sound like other things are that like Dungeons didn't have to be everywhere Legends did not have to be everywhere did you hear that that was a whole conversation that talks about it just now so gone Phil and um you know who it was John the guy who had the email with and they're like we probably shouldn't put it other places they said literally in an email we should keep dungeons um I was just talking about Minecraft in general no no talking about the spin-off game yeah but the spin-offs did not have to be exclusive or the spinos did not have to be third party they could have been exclusive but like Jeff Grubb has talked about a very data-driven company they ran the numbers and they're like no Minecraft's so big everywhere we should put dungeons everywhere if we put it everywhere except for Sony this it will bite Us in the ass so all the things you always talk about Nick with tariff contracts and all the things logically we some people would love to see they know they can't because they want to keep acquiring people and so if they are the bad guy jerks it will cost them severely in this case the fact that they have kept Minecraft everywhere is huge for getting this deal through and so that's why in the end they weren't going to tear up any contracts I think the fact I think the fact that the judge isn't super knowledgeable about the industry I think that hurts Microsoft it because it's that's why they wanted more days to teach her that's why they wanted five days instead of two because it's been nice listening to the judge actually stop this both lawyers and be like so how does this work explain this to Sarah Bond game is Game Pass real that sounds unbelievable like she was she was like holy Game Pass is a thing that sounds great yeah but the thing the funniest part is doesn't that just go to show you I think I was talking about this earlier before we had the switch doesn't that show you what a terrible job that the FTC lawyer is doing though like really if this if this FTC lawyer was at even remotely decent at his job all he'd have to do for this judge right is sound smart without actually being smart like that certain YouTuber that talks in circles and doesn't say anything like all this FTC lawyer has to do is sound intelligent and then the judge might be like oh yeah you're making some great arguments he could be making the stupidest arguments ever but because he sounds smart that might be enough and that's my thing is I think it could get blocked because of that but at the same time I've been hearing this FDC lawyer and he sounds like an idiot so I have no idea how this is like he he sounds like he doesn't actually understand the industry which I think just hurts your case in the end because you keep trying to do I'm not talking about he's an industry knowledge I'm not even referring to his industry anymore it's going to be stuff that you can't push back so quickly on with actual facts because the judge will see that and just be like well why didn't why don't you know this better you feel he feels unprepared in a way because he keeps trying to go in directions and immediately getting smacked down and it's not just an idiot thing it's a you don't sound prepared and you don't sound like you have an actual case I know but he doesn't even sound well read like shut up like when he said like when he was like he he just when I heard him say the words when I heard him say the words like do you promise oh my God oh my God you sound like he was trying to sound like he's he's putting pressure on the witness but he just came across like a dick and it's nothing it's not what this case is about even that's not what this case is about like it's not about keeping on Sony it's about does this I know consumers that's right that's what I mean like this he's not even good at sounding smart like if he if he was very painful if he was at least if he was at least well versed enough to sound really intelligent he could sway the judge who doesn't know anything about the industry but this guy's not even right well versed enough to sound smart to fall to bamboozle the judge like the judge has twice been like oh my God shut up yeah twice I know how that judge feels um the crazy thing is with the Call of Duty cut off at the end when when he came in are you gonna put it on cloud when they cut them off you heard it on the on the audio you could hear like a oh like oh that's not good right and what's peculiar about that question is okay why are PlayStation's Cloud because before this was even a case in front of the judge Microsoft wanted to talk about their existing cloud gaming agreements with Nvidia with um whatever they're called you destroyed all of those other ones who destroyed Jupiter right and the FTC were like no no no no no no they're not important they're they're they're ambiguous they've got lots of questions around them we shouldn't we shouldn't talk about them they're not relevant so if if those Cloud agreements aren't relevant why would a cloud agreement with Sony be relevant that's right I don't I don't understand the question um either way it's done EU approved it on those on those terms so um the last person to come in was there you go Google stadia so um this is the former product lead for stadia um uh which is a guy called Dove zimring cool name cool name so the FTC spent a large amount of time asking ximring to discuss all of the it was details of stadia and zooming was quite proud of it right you know yeah we could do 4K it didn't exist anywhere else in Cloud but fundamentally stadia failed because didn't have enough games and consumers were not interested in cloud gaming um what's super interesting about this is this is the ftc's witness and this is the really crazy bit the FTC Microsoft lawyer was like uh you know they talked about stadia they talked about competing and then asked the Zynga question this is the fdc's witness so stadia competed with consoles including Xbox and yes was the answer but wait if Cloud Gaming's a separate Market just kicked you in the face I don't know if that's too late to get into the cat appeal but that Google themselves saying yes we were competing with Xbox immediately hurts the entire CMA case so I imagine the decent Market yeah how it's amazing it's its own Market but Google's looking at like no Google's looking at it like no we were competing with consoles so Google themselves saying that under oath in court in the US if there's any way they can bring that up to the yeah the tribunal my God that just comes well that appeals coming soon right so um but hey um I mean we also I mean if we didn't already know why stadia failed we found more reasons why Stadium had a horrendous business I mean we again we already knew like they knew we were games to be made they were a Linux company that understood Linux so they made their stuff work best there and that means you need to have bespoke versions of games made which is unbelievably expensive as in not just that 20 million bucks for Red Dead to be ported we had said years ago Google didn't quite comprehend the amount of money you have to lose and the numbers get a foot to get the foot in the door in gaming Microsoft people don't realize how much money Microsoft had to lose on original Xbox they lost so much money like and that was just to get a foot in the door that wasn't to become the market leader that was just to get a foot in the door and once Google realized it they were like uh yeah ciao for now we're out of here like we don't want to do that it's all in all it was absolutely fascinating and also kind of crazy to hear something hilarious insane I I loved the peak behind the curtain of of of what the games industry is like I also liked hearing directly from some of these public space people's just real talk yeah yeah they they're totally just paying people to keep stuff off our console blah blah blah now what's happening next next week the trial continues Monday nothing's going down a couple of Nvidia guys we've got some other folks I think we've got an economist and Tuesdays Tuesday's the big day with Satya Barbie Karthik and the Nintendo Bobby going up Bobby's going on you know what Bobby's gonna do don't you you know what Bobby's gonna do that's what we're gonna do he's gonna make the dealings with Sony look so gross and horrific if Sony allows him because they keep getting all their sealed and it's infuriating oh he's gonna find a way to make those deals look so bad and they were trying to screw over Microsoft and oh man Bobby's gonna go all you know the other big one on Tuesday is executive Steve singer of Nintendo called by Microsoft that's going to be a very interesting way you compete with Microsoft that's probably what yeah that is gonna be yeah we've heard that there's a Jim Ryan pre-recorded video deposition you don't get to watch it know it well there were some filings made to the core that suggests that some parts of that deposition might be sealed so we don't know yeah they were saying they went so when they had a long break yesterday um well they didn't have a long break we didn't hear for a while after the lunch break is because they're talking about was some of or all of Jim's testimony or depositions going to be sealed we don't know but either way the hearing is going to resume again Tuesday morning 8 30 a.m PT um that's 11 30 Eastern standards uh Jesse of course will be on hand side um and that's that's all the News That's all the news that's the whole look we've just covered two days of court case really guys I'm spewing I'm spewing I'm on a somewhat tight timeline because I could have gone on for so much longer well we've still got to do name and Gaming Community questions there's not many Community questions Community questions there's barely any left that's fine but we can jump to name a game in the end the most important thing was the most important thing out of all of this was that I knew about Indiana Jones two years ago that's the most important thing that came out of all of this Fair it's fair yep my sources aren't 100 all of the time but sixty percent of the time they work every time yeah I I wonder I think a man joke there yeah I wonder now though okay let's play this out three days in court next week and they win so FTC don't get their preliminary injunction Microsoft could close the deal in the usante good one thank you for reminding us oh no we didn't no that's true um but yeah like they win they win FTC don't get their preliminary injunction there's been lots of talk about closing Over The cma's veto I wonder I know they've got the cat appeal the problem with the cat appeal is it's after the GU lie 18th [Music] renegotiation end of the deal three billion dollar payout to Activision date I wonder if some of the conversations they'll have with the UK is look we're going through the appeal process but you guys aren't moving fast enough it's going to cost us three billion dollars so we're just giving you a heads up that we have now the ability to close this deal with every other country but the UK yep so we're going to and we'll go through the appeal process and if we have to be paying fines we'll pay fines but this is how we're going to do it I wonder if that's just a conversation that Microsoft will just be very plain and clear like we respect you guys but the facts and the law are on our side we've heard directly from our competitors that they compete with us we've heard directly from cloud companies that tried and failed that yeah we were competing with Xbox we we we're going to close the deal I wonder if that's a thing that's going to happen and they'll just but you know as always with these things Microsoft is big and they do not want to get on the wrong side of regulators because it you know that's the point where they don't have much choice they they're being backed into a corner now where they've tried to be Mr Nice Guy and there are certain parties being idiots uh there's Super Chat Mark hot with a 10 super show FTC knows nothing or care about gaming or Sony they trying to go after big Tech U.S Congress questions Lena Khan about protecting a Japanese company over two US companies yeah when you saw that clip we saw that clip um my only assumption there is because it is odd that the FTC which is a U.S um a Japanese company it is a little bit odd it's it's a crusade against large companies big Tech that's right now chaosante brings up something I did want to talk about and we forgot the price increases yes interesting timing of that isn't it well I don't think it is I think it's part of this whole APK thing they wanted to make sure this isn't about the acquisition because they had said that that's right before like they had set in filings if these these prices will eventually increase and if they do it's not because of this deal it's because of inflation and see I don't like that see I I personally think there should be more pushback to that well I think because I've read an article from one of the team here that's pretty good about going into some of the details on that so it should hopefully land on Xbox I know but I don't like the idea that because Microsoft is trying to win this case because one of the arguments this CMA made I assume the FTC has made and a lot of others have made well you could increase prices with ABK so what does Microsoft do to get around that they increase prices before ABK yeah maybe well it's against the rest of the market to not have raised the prices already because they're not empowered yeah I know that that's happening on it Game Pass is still in growth mode right they're only at 30 million or so Subs I would argue it's still in growth mode when you're in growth mode you don't up the price so for them to up the price now just to help their case is shitty like imagine they've wanted to read about that they wanted to raise the price for a while because in you know inflation around the world is a real thing their main competitor did it and had no issues so at that point once you see Sony upped everything and no one cared you're just like and people people because Sony can do whatever they want and no one cares that's it's a different argument the inflation argument's because they're a trillion dollar company so whatever no it's not they're a trillion dollar company that has to keep making more it's the byproduct of how shitty capitalism is it doesn't matter if you're in share market and all that doesn't matter if you're making money it doesn't matter if you're profitable it matters if you're more profitable than you were before that matters I think from a consumer point of view the only real big downside is look it costs us more money and it's a frustrating thing to see one-on-one press release they're talking about how we've had the biggest growth most players ever we've made a billion dollars in Game Pass PC blah blah blah a billion dollars most of us would would never see that kind of money ever in our lives right most of us none of us none of us all of us combine you know the Empire is growing my friend but yeah but it is a thing it is um but yes Microsoft I don't think it didn't it didn't sit well with me not in the U.S not in the U.S yeah again just like Sony as well like it's they just meant they met Sony because they can because it will get them more money they're gonna have they did it now but why not in the US if it's about inflation and it's about all these other things why not in the US because that's the most strongest Sony didn't do it that's right so it's not a bad information because Sony didn't do it here they only did it where Sony did and Sony didn't do it here they did the Chinese excuse was inflation as well and that was too yeah but Xbox Xbox can have whatever excuse they are we know they raise their prices to either match or be just below Sony because they could because they'll make more money they're a capitalist company I think I think it's more about winning this case I think it was more about the case there too but also they're about to sell Starfield they know they're going to sell way more consoles they didn't up the price of this Series S so it's just the series X has gone up well the one terabyte one the one terabyte one is their price increase yes sneakily that's their price increase even that the 50 bucks probably isn't that far off of what like it it's probably about 20 bucks 30 bucks you know less than what this is the SSD classes there's no way knowing they're paying that much more for that SSD this minute 10 or 20 bucks in the bulk in the bulk that no I could jump on Bloody AliExpress and day less than that they're not getting a dog SSD they need one that actually works one of the main things you'll learn if you're a tech nerd like me is memory and ssds are not equal they're not anywhere close to equal that's why you can put in wow I've got this incredibly powerful one that goes into the PS5 or they put this super fast one in the PS5 but it actually sucks in most things it would be used for it sucks at writing it's dog slow the Xbox one is really fast I writing and reading it's a solid 2 to 3.5 gigabytes at all time but in the in the amount Microsoft is getting them wholesale it wouldn't have needed 50 bucks you don't know that you don't know the bomb it might be something they're getting they're they are doubling their capacity and you know that costs money they're going from something pretty small in 512 that's not that expensive keeps the bomb down to something that's more standard in one which means that chip has to be designed a different way it needs more cooling around it like the series s gets hot as so I wouldn't be surprised if there's a difference on that I know yeah there's there this might be a hardware refresh where it's a different sock where it's a different cooling inside we don't I had heard about that possibly happening quite a while even if the parts are serious is that even if the parts are the same the r d that goes into creating that needs to be paid off so in the end oh it's not a shitty price increase when you are technically getting more as a customer it's a probably about the least they would do to still try and make some money and then they do their sales and it's cheaper and they're not losing money like you can't look at it like oh it's just 50 bucks for the SSD it's like no there's probably a lot more that went into this revision still doesn't sit well it shouldn't say well we always want our stuff to cost the cheapest it can we don't want companies to suck but their companies free consoles for everyone their companies actually just free I'm not saying free I'm just saying the timing of all these the Optics of all these the impetus for all of this doesn't sit well it's trifold I don't think they're good they're going to sell way more con they I think we all agreed they were building into the cloud that was a good excuse to have their numbers be down during this case it's they they get some future proofing for cloud their numbers look bad for this case then also for now they up these prices before the case ends looks good for this case but they also not only get their numbers to look better quarter over quarter and year over year they're about to sell what could be the game of the generation if it hits in Starfield and they've got a new Forza after six years all of it matters like yeah it all comes together I think you know just from a pure consumer point of view it feels a little bit yeah I'm struggling to pay to pick my house and then you know but like it doesn't affect me and this is the thing and this is this is the difference from you know all of the big Publications and perhaps us is that you know like we still live in a world where we understand that you know stuff costs money and for the listeners and for the community out there if you want to get a game like we're lucky we we get game codes and stuff and we can just yeah they're great thanks you know but that's not always the case for everybody that's listening or watching they have to go out and decide where to spend it's the beauty of Game Pass but for anything else there's always that concern right what's it going to cost me to have this new toy um and it just feels like after a really great showcase where all the momentum's on their side they can kind of just suck up the bad news yeah yeah we're up in the prices to match everyone else that's the end and they'll just get they'll they'll close through it and they have um but yeah it is a thing uh anyway let's do name again Jesse I just sent you a message the the previous game died so we need a new uh game code please yes it didn't die it's still there you can just reconnect it it kicked me out and said that game is dead so weird all right let me do very strange but anyway chat thanks for hanging out so far uh all 300 plus if you're watching do us favor hit that like button if you haven't we're about to play name again which is where we take the name of a game and we replace the words with synonyms most of the time of those words and Nick and I will play for some patrons to compete let's hit the button one's been [Music] we're back who am I playing for as a patreon it's dark um Clan barbecue yes I think I've seen him in the kitchen yes he's almost always in the chat well I'm playing for you today buddy puppet that's what I'm playing for Technic puppet yourself Nick was right this oh my God it is always chat if you want to possibly be up for a chance of winning a game code by us acting as your respective Champions all you need to do is be a member of the Xbox series patreon which you can do really simply by visiting patreon.com forward slash XBox era and depending upon what tier you select you can get t-shirts and other cool merch and all sorts of fun stuff so it's definitely worth doing plus you get super secret access I gotta win this game quick because I got a footy game to get to so all right Jesse what's the what's the topic theme this week games that have courtrooms in them oh it's funny I love courtroom films but I don't know if I love courtroom I love courtrooms how good is Primal Fear Ed Norton and um yeah oh Mate A Few Good Robert Danny Jr the judge was great 12 Angry Men yep classic time to kill oh man A Time to Kill man A Time to Kill oh that guy that film hits hard yeah that's so good actually maybe because we still haven't settled on our movies for um the next movie podcast I watched Spider-Man by the way so we can do Spider-Man I watched across the spider-verse I have thoughts come out it's since come out hasn't it so we'll do we'll do it across the spider verse and like I don't know maybe we do A Time to Kill yeah yeah I'm up for that as a classic why not yeah anyway okay let's go let's do this all right number one is one word but it it's a compound word so I'm giving you two but the answer is one okay the question for number one is games that have a courtroom in them not about they don't have to be about law they just have a courtroom in them at some point first one is post hyphen shindig host eostt hyphen shindig Nick was right after party doesn't even have to be that you understand it's Gotta I've never played this game so I don't know I'm basing my answers purely on the words you've never played any of these games based on the words works just fine as long as you get it you get it you don't have to understand that I had a courtroom gotta end this quickly I got a footy game to go to I can't toy with you anymore I gotta go I gotta go gotta do what I feel like going on some tangents do you feel like I said I gotta go I can't I said I can't toy with John anymore oh no I can't hear Nick anymore what's going on that's weird that's weird let's go okay what's the up I see you guys laughing what happened guys you want to make Nick stick around start slapping down those super chats people because he won't be able to go all right come on we're talking about Mario Odyssey Melbourne coffee you know what to do number two instruments of strafe calling decision instruments of strife Nick oh no why did I Buzz sick Gears of War judgment correct wait I didn't even get to answer you said why did I Buzz I know but I had did you know that that's something that's shouldn't say something like oh no I didn't I didn't say I give up I didn't say anything like that that's not right [Music] let's see that's not that's like come to a judge's decision there's no point for John take next point away back to zero zero longer game one nil that should just be you whine like a no you wind like a little child it should be one nil it should just stay one nil you literally said you have no idea what it is I was about to clear your buzzer so it could be treated as if you had not buzzed and then you then but then John got it too quick all right we're at zero zero what why okay fine Nick is now at negative one whatever man it's one nil objection sustained you promise were you gonna get Gears Award judgment be honest with me I probably would have made I've got the Gears of War ones before one to nothing John all right why I why I was upset at myself with hitting the space bar was because I didn't give myself time to even think about it before pushing the space bar all right we're gonna put up a poll in chat however long it takes start a pull while that goes it's 1-1 if they say no take a point away the next one is one word that word is conclusion oh a game one word one word inclusion like I know what a conclusion is and I'm sure John does too I just can't think of the game that's got that name I mean checkout immediately how did someone say Ace Attorney it's only one where to meet John's at 90 on the yes so 47 votes Nick we're gonna give Joe on the point second uh I already said the word it's got to be judgment correct okay that game is on Xbox it's the stupid one that's not got an e in it it confused me every time because I write a judge with an e there's judgment conclusion the conclusion of the case the Judgment of the what is your conclusion all right two to one John [Music] you don't say no the Chatsworth I know okay you know we'll let John get the four before you get the three drag this out next one is two words toad Snippets and I'm clearing the buzzers toad Snippets neither of you played as in a frog tight Snippets neither of you probably played this or might not have ever even heard of it toad Snippets and it's a two-word game yes two words it's a two-word game two-word game frog Snippets I mean don't Snippets this go roka's already gotten it is this a real game it's a real well-known game for nerds indie games I I do not know this game you've got to base it you've got to base it on the wood I don't know frog pieces I want to take a question a quick guess John uh no I have no idea like Ron I I was immediately thinking Nintendo with toad but obviously that's a synonym for another word frog frog fractions fractions or facts again I had to base it off the words Jesse was saying Snippets Rock fractions wow really weird game equations yeah that would have been better yeah I didn't want that one to be easy how was that too easy but we've never heard of the game people have heard of the game you guys okay sure like six people all right next maybe I'm not gonna be faster maybe I'm gonna just keep thinking words I would love to hurry up but then this guy Nick keeps yelling at me about things and making I keep thinking about all the times where it's been like four in the morning and I've been like dunk and there's been a sleepy hat I've got to go there's only one thing there's only one thing on Earth that matters to me more than video games and it's Collingwood so hurry up let me lose next game angels serration two serration s-e-r-r-a-t-i-o-m Angels serratials serration yep we're in the hard part is there a sequel oh oh oh there's no court in there okay I was about to say a game and then I'm like wait there's no court no I thought it was that's what I was thinking I was thinking Heavenly swords hey there was no Sequel and B there was no courtroom in Heavenly sword I played Heavenly sword all right um Angels Angels like Angel apostrophe s duration two Angels an apostrophe s implies ownership wait is this a this is a game you would know Nick Heaven's sword incorrect the game is Saints Row too if you don't know what serration means [Music] I think I was confusing it with serrated yeah sounds like that's why I said that's why oh dear so seration literally is it's about a saw it's about the row of toothed edges argue with me when it is a literal dictionary synonym from Merriam-Webster all right next one in the uh in the interest of time get through these pretty quick let me uh look this one is ordinance in sequence and sequence not in ordinance and oh and okay yeah see that's why I had to quickly switch back to have a look to see the words ordinance and put them in private chat if you guys want okay it is again with the court in it yes and I'm running out so you guys gotta start getting these right I know a TV I can think of a TV show but was there a game of this TV show well I know the TV show you're talking about yeah sick I've got nothing to lose because I don't know if there was a game so I buzzed first thanks for the clue correct is there a video game of war and Order 20 of them really on what console um foreign foreign order video like this Law and Order Criminal Intent there's a lot of them yes okay holy wow man my mind is blind I did not know that that was so funny bro you were like oh there's a TV show I was like well if he knows that and that's his guess that's why I'm like there's a TV show with this but I don't know there's a video again let's go next one is really long it is phenomenon versus hat hyphen website 2 Fortune of multiple hyphen bodies you prick uh here it's in it's in private chat read it versus hat website yeah I put it in the chat put it in our private chat phenomenon versus hat hyphen website 2 Fortune of multiple hyphen bodies Nick Marvel vs Capcom 2. clash of uh Marvel vs Capcom 2 clash of Heroes Clash of what is it starting the timer Marvel vs Capcom 2 oh my God what's the other part of it four three two one all right do you have any idea what it is John Can you steal this you know what this game is uh Marvel first is Capcom 2 what's that um the timer I've only got three more I can't remember the tagline the fate of Two Worlds no one gets away again that was funny I've got three more technically John's was the score right now what is this I've only ever known it as Marvel vs Capcom 2 I never bothered with the rest all right do everyone's buzzed out move you all right next one is flaming hyphen bird correct Colin excellent advocate please post this in the chat flaming but correct excellent oh um uh again I'm gonna screw up on the second part uh Phoenix Wright Ace Attorney correct nice I didn't go for a specific one I just went for the main the main name yeah that's a good one as well flaming Birds I was like really three yeah Phoenix the Flaming bird is what gave me Phoenix right but then I'm excellent Advocate I'm like because again I have not played this game okay the next one's they're quite fun I play Modern one is maybe the worst I've ever done it is nobleman Truman triple these nuts okay don't overthink the triple Deez Nuts just like triple D nobleman Truman triple these nuts Nick for the tie Duke Nukem 3D correct wow I'm sorry about the Truman one please don't yell at me internet wow holy that's that's good that's one of your best it's the nobleman that gave I'm like a Duke a Juke is a nobleman well played cool just don't I mean I didn't even understand the Truman part I don't get that he's the president who okayed using them oh is he I don't know I got it from nobleman and tripled these nuts okay I said like I win that was three for me yeah you're tied at three I already had three minutes this is for the win cheated okay stories of Simeon atoll put it in the chat put it in the truck and see it please this one too um oh white stories that's the wrong word I mean got it it's uh it's Ace Attorney stories of Simeon natal is that story's right like mechanical [Music] uh tile of my correct Tails yeah sounds like isn't it secrets of Monkey Island Legend of Monkey Island Tales of Monkey Island 2009 yeah as soon as I heard Simeon atoll I'm like oh Monkey Island but then I went to say secrets I'm like wait stories aren't Secrets hold on yeah exactly and the only reason I got that primarily was Simeon monkey but then a toll there's a there's a island in Sea of Thieves called the something at all and that's the only reason no I knew when atoll was an island the stories is what screwed me up because I only know secret of Monkey Island so Tales of Monkey Island chapter four the trial and execution of guy breast were technically a beautiful name that's the part of that game that had the courtroom because it had sections to it that came out over time didn't it yeah the overall game is called the Tales of Monkey I only knew secrets of Monkey Island I didn't know here we go twice well applied q-tang are there any more or is that all of them no that was the last one that made it four to three John he wins wow good game Nick good game we've just got the community questions to go so uh whilst I'm whilst you're finding those Q10 congratulations on the win one of the many perks of being a patreon supporter or Xbox zero chat if you want to support Xbox here at patreon.com forward slash XBox here and you can uh show us all the love and let us do all the cool stuffs for you guys including winning games it's always fun Nick the last few Community questions before you dash out for the football yeah yeah okay hit us up Community questions hi them G so yeah don't expect uh timestamps anytime soon hi them G if you gents invite Florian Mueller or maybe Richard Hogue I would love to ask one of those two like uh what if MMS bought two of the big publisher Studio at the same time like a two birds and one stone or something and see what they say your gents take and that would be a litigation Nightmare and John's muted yeah I was filling up my pipe trying to do it unnewisily sorry uh I've spoken to both Mr Hogue and Florian Mueller uh to see if we could get one of them on uh Mr Hogue uh is obviously still going through some extended recovery and we wish him all the very best in getting there um Florian uh we're a bit out of his time zone for for a live show but we could look to do some sort of um interview middle of the day show at some point soon um to talk about things so it's something we we would like to do but you know we've got to respect people's availability and time and our own availability in time yeah quite right quite right P.S Nick in Australia do they have Outback steak where you live and have you ever been there before too and is it an Australian restaurant just curious I actually don't think so believe it or not maybe I'm wrong I don't think so let me look it up I'm gonna rush for time let me look at the steak oh yeah we do we do we do have our Pet's Steakhouse it is an American Channel we do have it it came is that we do have it the first Outback Steakhouse was opened in Tampa Florida in 1988 wow oh okay apparently we have it in you oh it's in New South Wales and Queensland which is why I don't have it because it's not here in Victoria it was American made okay um there just eat brother happy FTC weekend gentlemen no question from me enjoy your week no well thanks very much you enjoy your week okay uh last two questions already wow uh Diego Nick redeemed on Indie yes my question comes from that FTC lawyer does he think does he seriously think Microsoft's making an exclusive new IP is foreclosure or crash or on that note do you think Microsoft will take non-cod on Case by case also when this deal is done one definition or another what do you think this means for Microsoft's relationships going forward who are fire forged allies and who are in need of repair irreparable uh I think again my my inclination I'm gonna stick to my guns my inclination is that outside of cod everything else goes exclusive that's what I still think um and I also still think they're going to try and find a way to make Cod exclusive that's just what I personally believe I I think and I hope and yeah I'm gonna say I hope I hope Sony is so stubborn and prideful and too prideful you know that they refuse to sign the deal I might the 1910 we're sorry governments but Sony doesn't want we're sorry community of Call of Duty fans but Sony said no because they insisted that we still give them all of the benefits they have now and we just wanted to be an equal playing field and they said you saw Jim's emails nothing that I need nothing we can do they'll be fine I love it I'd love it I'd absolutely love to see that happen yeah I want to see Microsoft had their turn as the yeah Nintendo's done it I want to see Microsoft have their turn I want to see it sadly we'll see what happens uh what do you what do you think it means for their relationships well if they get a B cut and start to legitimately become bigger in the console space um like they won't have to repair relationships like places will be grudgingly have to be like well they've got ABK like they're pretty big now we can't avoid them right yeah it's like it's gonna be some of it might be begrudging I'm not reading that Super Chat oh 419 in the chat what a legend he says not only did Nick disrespect me by canceling my Xbox here appearance this week what but yeah one Australian did you redo it was a two dollar Super Chat because that's all I needed to fit what I needed to say if I needed more I would have put more I didn't need more I base my money not on how much I can afford I base it on how much I need to type if I needed to type ten dollars I would have done ten dollars so about it I can only apologize I can only apologize that you were disrespected class was on I had we had to I because Rand was originally going to be on I'd organize for jazz then Rand and then class was like well hey let's get on this week and I'm like oh my god I've been working for a year and a half to get them on I can't just turn around and be like well Randy's on guys sorry I can't get you one yeah so I apologize to Rand end oh okay so rand's not not giving me the full truth the apologies were made no he's technically saying the truth I canceled his Xbox error appearance I did did you were you feeling disrespectful at the time no no not at all they ran if you I wish now I had to go I wish now I had three minutes my cousin's gonna be here in three minutes so that we can go and I've got one last question left okay I've still gotta get dressed I'm not going to the footy like this uh could I have macca's on the way as well cap cook hello gentlemen so it is confirmed and by the way by the way by the way Rand you know I thought Rand would actually for once go into bat and be like well Jazz you know we give Nick a lot of crap yeah he got yeah he got your jizz two nil he got you they were still like oh but but but trying to make excuses mate just own it I got the wheel the one making yourself oh that was great isn't it he can't help himself by his own hello gentlemen so it is confirmed Khan will continue to be on Playstation good for them is though what happens if it becomes two years between new Call of Duty releases wouldn't that cut Sony PlayStation annual revenue significantly since it's the number one Cod platform yes this would happen for Microsoft Xbox as well for that year but they can justify restructure of release after purchase and they can afford it can PlayStation Thrive without the annual Cod Revenue hasn't the sentiment been that Activision cannot keep up with the annual release Cadence of cod with how much Manpower they have been throwing at the franchise some food for thought have a great weekend look remember I don't think this is the issue people think it is Call Of Duty Modern Warfare 2019 just kept on selling for like three years it just kept on going uh what I think changes if they switch to a two or three year Cadence what I think happens is we get less stupid Call of Duties and we just stick to Modern Warfare because they know the Modern Warfare is the best than the one that sells the most and they've got warzone yeah to talk about the coffers they just said they're gonna stop uh supporting and shut down the service of War Zone one because yeah 2023 . I I don't I know what you're getting at cap cool I don't but given how Modern Warfare sells I don't think it's as much of an issue personally but one Raptor said something in the chat and as our executive producer it gets up on screen before you go to a Collingwood game Nick you have to fit in that's such a myth Collingwood supporters are not Toothless are they all beautiful beautiful people this is the typical typical Collingwood support then I hate calling it well mind you that's not going to be the case because you're not going to get to the game on Time beautiful teeth you're not going to get to the game on Time mostly Greek like all the Greeks went for Collingwood and Richmond when they came here there's a lot of Greeks but yes that's it so all right um what else is there that's it that's it you've done it chat thanks for hanging right on 11 30 too it's been a great week um we've really appreciated everyone hanging out in the chat today uh we hope you have a wonderful rest of your weekend wherever you are we appreciate class making his time for us it was very good uh and thank you Rand for stepping aside to allow yeah thanks a great Indie team I apologize to Rand for canceling on him because I've been telling rent maybe next week we'll see maybe we can do the Xbox one no I don't think you can next week actually I don't think you can by the way we'll organize we'll organize it as always keep your eyes on Xbox serial.com Jesse will be uh live streaming the annotations from coffee with Cabeza during the trial days um have we got anything else hitting Xbox zero.com this week yes I'm doing two reviews one is fist origin Shadow torch which hits on the 27th on Game Pass so we'll have a review ready for this cool and um it's a Metro Advantage you probably like it Nick it's not too long the other one I can't say I do like some fists cool the other one we can't say yeah always fun Snapchat we love you guys and we'll see you next time ciao for now this podcast is brought to you by patreon executive producer torn Raptor [Music] thank you [Music] thank you foreign [Music] [Music] foreign [Music] foreign [Music] [Music] foreign [Music]

Channel: XboxEra

Views: 287,506

Keywords: xboxera, xbox series x, xbox, xbox series s, rumor mill, xbox game pass, Name A Game

Id: qhMvn-6GIhc

Length: 226min 42sec (13602 seconds)

Published: Sun Jun 25 2023