The Peculiar Interrogation of the Chief of Police

this video was brought to you by pds debt jenny in this video we're going to show how incompetence and negligence can build up to a criminal level and how our examples habit of letting things slide ends up sliding him right into court on april 4th 2018 james hansey police chief of buckeye lake ohio was brought in for questioning by internal affairs at first it seems like a routine matter involving an accidental discharge in a private residence but as the questioning continues more and more examples of laziness and possible corruption are brought to light i want to go grab something it's a little warm right here it is it feels better in here handsy is brought into the interrogation room and as he waits he rubs his hands together in what might be nervousness or an attempt to rid himself of the lingering cold from outside all right jimmy um these are your garrity rights okay until you're familiar with them but if you want to read those over and uh for you let me know if you have any questions about anything that's so good while reading over the paperwork would be advisable for most people in this situation in hanzi's case it feels like he's trying to buy time by this point he should know exactly what those papers say as well as the meaning it's cold here too so four four four four you're 12.58 i appreciate it's bigger lower than it makes a lot easier yeah i kind of figured you guys are this year it never is it doesn't it never ends never stops hi jimmy um i guess first let's just start off with do you have any questions right off the top of your head that you want to ask she gave me a paper yesterday that said something about public records village property inaccurate reports okay okay um you know anything about that stuff about the inaccurate reports of city council um we'll get to those i'll tell you i'll try to go chronologically that way it makes more sense to i'll stand to hear that um look just tell me about what happened during the accidental shooting obviously i've gotten stories a couple different you know people told me but you know you're the guy that accidentally discharged your weapon so i can't wait to hear from you man we jeffrey megan and i were on our way back from uh lancaster we had b-dubs we were coming down 79 and we were in the area like i like a state i may be a village and my telephone rang it was from darlena whit hover i've known the family since well i was a firefighter with uh her brother terry for ever and she's on the phone screaming and staying here her aunt she found her aunt in the middle of the road and that two guys had broken her aunt's house and was holding her gunpoint she was able to escape but the gunman shot the guy one guy he was leaning in the floor bleeding to death and the gunman was still on the right in their house so we're right there between both entrances the talismans the main entrance and the second entrance i tell jeff go there because it's right over here m section so as we're there i call steve ritter literally this is what we got get down in the in section meet with us as we pull up i'm dialing the sheriff's office i call the sheriff's office um tell them exactly what's going on they say you want emergency traffic yes so you call them i call the sheriff's office okay um we're staying here just trying to decide what's going on and she keeps saying he's dying he's in my house dying he's in my house dying she was very physically upset um [Music] both of them were really upset i had no belief believe to doubt them um [Music] i wasn't even thinking of being on technically light duty right had no gun with me and you know was there someone possibly being in that house dying you guys have done the same thing you know went in we had three people here and we've been trained i told ritter give me your hand again we're making one around the side of the trailer to see if there was a door in the back i said go get your rifle because we don't know what he's got give me your handgun same identical handgun and i've got and we went in pepper three remains first one in the door went to the right um because it's a double wide right before the events that he is describing handsy had a finger amputated in this situation the most he should have been doing was desk duty there were other people with the proper training that could have gone in his place he has not had nearly enough time to adjust to life without that finger much less practicing how it would affect how he holds and uses a weapon we'll learn more about what happened next after a quick word from today's sponsor how many of you wish there was a better solution to paying off your debt today's sponsor pds debt has customized zero percent interest options for anyone struggling with credit cards personal loans medical bills collections or any other type of debt with pds your debts are rolled into one zero percent interest payment and there is no minimum credit score required bad and fair credit scores are accepted this allows you to pay off your debt in a fraction of the time while saving a ton in interest and fees the only requirement to qualify is a minimum of five thousand dollars worth of debt pds debt is offering free credit reports and debt analysis to all of my viewers just for completing their quick debt assessment form at pdsdead.com strange you will receive a full breakdown of the interest you shouldn't be paying and custom options for you to become debt free that's p d s d e t dot com slash strange i mean a single wide went in and i went to the left and i held the whole back of the trailer and the trailer is really dark and the only lights that's on is there flashlights in a a tv in the very back room um i'm standing here low ready left hand and also something flashed i thought someone was coming up and when i i hit a corner and put running around when the floor go get your finger on the trigger or something when you went up i had yeah yeah because well because i was coming up to protect myself right and i just hit that counter and it just powered off just simple as that we cleared the house no one was there it was a t the tv and the doors cracked about that big um we talked i talked to the woman and the son didn't know that she had an onset of dimensions what he told us told us the other day that she told him trump was in her bedroom never had never been to that house before i know her but i knew only knew her from mcdonald's not personally talking to her or anything i didn't know that she was having an issue which after everything was found out was it was found out she had a uti urinary tract infection for ever and never told her kids and that was what was she seen a police movie prior to going to bed that night so you know i checked the house to make sure everything was fine that we didn't hurt the electric didn't hurt the water you know from her end set her and her son down and said listen we had an accidental discharge um sorry about that everything in the house is fine and his exact question is i don't give a [ __ ] as long as my mom's okay i said what about a doctor's if she's hallucinating or something like that we need to get him to take care of her let's get her to the hospital he said no she goes into the doctors in the morning i said then you come and get a copy of our report so your doctor can have that to use to see what kind of medicine you get it on and he he said that would be fine or i would have pink slipped her that night but with her he's like i'm staying here she's going to doctors in the morning she argued a little bit with him no i'm not mom yes you are you've got a doctor's appointment and i and i told him i said dave you come and get a copy of this report or have your doctor you know get something from your doctor we'll fax a copy of the report over to you and show that she's hallucinating or something so she can get help okay and we went back to the office all three of us wrote up our statements wrote up the use of force where we accidentally i had the accidental discharge and went from there i called the mayor did you do a call record at that time or a state or a report at that time because when i went over and talked to you you didn't have one yet it was in the in the computer yes okay jack from should have faxed it to you we had a cr number right yes see our number and the square cr number was was filled out and everything okay it hadn't been typed in yet but it was put in the book and it was it was hand written now okay you said you notified dispatch right yes okay did ritter also notified dispatch or did he uh just come right to the scene with you guys and help clear the trailer you know i don't know if he also known as fight dispatch because we didn't have a walking on i didn't have a walking either jeff i do know when i was standing there when she said 99 traffic he got on the radio and asked her and said but you know four five eight nine on traffic okay all right so we pull a tape from there it's gonna have you calling dispatch yes okay yes it was ritter marked down he marked this patch too and said hey you know what's going on over here at the trailer park and everything else so he actually marked um so you guys get over there you have your external discharge talk to people everything's fine with them now at some point hebrew came over right yes okay were they called to come over i don't know i don't know that because again i didn't hear anything on walking i don't know sometimes when we got something like that they just drift over right and we drift over to them sure good mutual aid yeah um was there any conversation about not telling them about the actual district i sure was okay what was the was that your call yes okay what was the rationale there ritter likes to tell things and i s and for the the integrity of the case of the accidental shooting river you don't have to tell everybody that we had an accidental shooting let's get this investigated first let's get it looked at you know save the integrity of the case right here before anybody you know it's 1700 people know sure and that was the only reason but no reason to hide anything how can you hide an accidental discharge makes it tough i just go bang real loud yeah and you got to spend shell we've got to seattle i mean so far his story is plausible and the proper steps seem to have been taken unless there is evidence that contradicts his statement he had no reason not to believe that there was potentially armed suspect in the trailer which accounts for his finger being on the trigger too soon and even the most coordinated of people sometimes clip themselves on furniture or other objects in unfamiliar locations especially when adrenaline is high if this was the only thing they had against him it probably would have been wrapped up quickly without much trouble okay yeah i sure did i don't i mean because he likes to tell you know and we there's some things that happens in-house just like here you guys have things that happen in the house you're not supposed to tell anybody until things are looked at you know i did exactly what i was supposed to do i called the mayor i called the mayor six times and she never called me back she called ritter instead of calling my phone she does have a lot because she had the other day she's standing ritter's phone goes off call from peggy wells he's talking to her i'm like i walk up and say why aren't you calling me i'm the chief right that's true yeah you guys got some communication barriers between you and the mayor you would say from from years she's been on council for years and and yes she never liked the police department she's actually picking it against the police the fire department she don't like them she had a big meeting with randy thorpe and well billy was still there and wanted to see about bringing them in and get rid of us and billy and them guys told him you can't afford us right you know uh and but when she took over mary and she took me in on january 19th i told her i said all i want to do is my job yeah i want to work with you i have no heart feelings about nothing all right yeah and that's that you know that's that but the other thing that got brought up by peggy uh was some of the hours that were logged in and then that was also a concern with some of the people we brought in brought that up as well some of the hours that you actually worked and uh you know not actually being at work that was a common theme everybody we talked to right now you weren't actually at work doing anything um and a couple i guess a couple of them mentioned a computer that you have at home that your excuse was that you had to go home because you had some information on the computer at home and [ __ ] network my computer at home is set up the same way the computer at the house i mean at the office okay and if i was at my house doing stuff and writing you go to my house right now and i can show you the stuff that i've done um changing policies and changing things i've had permission from our mayor claire take carol to go there okay have you had permission from this mayor to go there no when i haven't okay all right um if i wish i'd run my foot my phone in the times that they're probably talking about is i burnt my foot right heel really bad clear to the bone and i had to have a special boot and it hurt to walk in it and i would come in the mornings i would get the mail like i supposed to i would check phone recorders and do everything else and then i would go to the house and do what i had to do you know and but i always had my walker right there and they knew this well i think part of it too was they they said they came over you know a couple times and you were just wearing shorts and a t-shirt watching cops while you're on duty yeah and that was the you know and then i want to check the um the records you you had them logged out as hours that day you know but my concerns if you're at home that day you know and that's true let's say that's true what he's saying you know if you're just sitting around watching cops when you're supposed to be at work that could be an issue right obviously you're the chief of police you wouldn't want one of your guys doing that here is where we start to see problems it's one thing to take a medical leave or to get permission to work from home however kansey should have gotten permission from the current mayor and not assume that he could continue doing something just because a previous mayor allowed him to do so also the hours counted should only have been those where he was actively working and not on any breaks he might have been taking there seems to have been some friction between him and the mayor small town politics can be difficult to navigate when you don't know all the parties involved it's possible it could be completely personal and she with the help from others is trying to fabricate a case for firing him it's equally possible her animosity stems from a legitimate frustration over his incompetence and dishonesty yeah also i mean you gotta understand from you know our perspective looking at numbers and looking at everything else that you know are brought to us as a concern we have to try to figure out why or justify why that's happening right so that's why i'm asking you because i want you to justify to me why that is a reoccurring thing though from everybody we've talked to it's a reoccurring issue that yeah well jenny goes home a lot and you know he'll leave and he'll just stay home but it's a literally it's a reoccurring thing everybody said the same thing why do you think that is jimmy i i didn't would go home a lot but i would not i would be in blue jeans or my bdu pants and the shirt that always said police and i would be doing the stuff that i was allowed to do on the computer for the mayor and then i would go out and go get cards tag numbers and stuff with the jump cards and i would do my old leg and or write it up well i wouldn't do the old leg at the off at the house because i couldn't i could only do the office but i would write the jump card stuff up okay i mean i just because if they come home and see me i'm in a t-shirt that says police and i'm not wearing my full uniform with the bags and all this everything else doesn't mean that i'm cheating the systems and not working i'm doing a lot of things in the background that speaking of that junk cards i want to ask you about that too what are your procedures for jumping cars jacking cars yeah let's say you get a car and an impound nobody comes and gets it what do you what what is your procedure to get rid of that vehicle run the thing through the state of ohio they come back and tell us if there's a lien on it and then you send that person or if there's a lean on you send that person 10 day notice or if there's no meet up you send that person the owner 10-day notice and then if they don't collect it or they we get it back they've got 10 days to pay the towing or anything like that if not then i go get a title from the bmv and then we gather how many other cars we got up get three beds and then people come out look at the you know like junkyards or private people or whatever they look at all the cars all at once and give you three beds and um the highest bidder gets them okay and they get on they get them all intact the way they're supposed to be okay um you ever take any batteries out and sold the batteries no no and the reason i'm asking in this setting jimmy is this is a setting where under gary you can't be charged with what we're talking about we can't talk about this criminally right okay but there's if that comes up criminally you know there's going to be some issues probably with with stealing okay so um there's been those allegations and a little more than just allegations very very specific things that i've checked out that not making a lot of sense okay um one of them especially being a water pump that was taken off of a truck for a randy and randy gave the water pump to his brother gary and randy had your permission to take the water pump off of the truck that was in the impound lot so think about that before you answer me jimmy because i want you to be really honest with me man [Applause] my goal here dude i i respect you i really do genuinely like you i want to make sure that you come out of this thing you know okay whether that's okay with your job okay without your job you know but what i don't want to see is something that you know you get charged for or go to jail for right you know what i'm saying if anyone was taken off them cars the village already owned them and they had permission from the mayor to take anything i personally have never taken anything off the cars out of the cars anything now randy and mark dimick has yes but they've always had permission and we have never done anything until the vehicles were owned by the village sure and they were going to the junkyard they were getting loaded up that day or the next day and going to the junkyard to be crushed this should be easy to check if records have been correctly kept the accusation could potentially be coming from someone who doesn't have all the information and is just making assumptions however if hansi is lying or falsifying paperwork then it is a very serious offense so it's all the same pile of money right i mean if one card goes it goes or it goes are they jumping it out are they checking for all the equipment are they making sure that if they can pull the engine or a water pump or anything off of that that the junkyard will do that or you sell them you just sell them at the car i've seen it when i've taken them there they've ran the forks through the forklift through the wood the windows picked it up put it in this thing put it down yeah and crush everything like a sandwich yep but if i didn't even know about a water pump to gary um but if it was taken battery water pump um i i i will tell you i knew a jack was taken um when it was scissor jacks but it was already up on the trailer trump was would lock and rain he's like oh we got a jack all right and but the village owned them vehicles there was permission by clay carroll and nothing was taken until that stuff was taken was the village owned it okay so when the village owned it let's say that you guys did everything properly the village owned it did you take any batteries then after they owned it did the mayor say hey you can take these i'm trying to i'm trying to you know explain to my for myself in my head why i got two people telling me the same thing now two different people one you know that i would say is completely on your side one that says maybe not completely on your side and they're both done with the same thing so i'm trying to i'm trying to figure that out why in my head that would be the case so is there a is there a circumstance or an instance where you did take it take a battery or two after um the mayor cleared it i've never taken a battery never never okay okay never all right well i needed to ask you about that because like i said i've had a couple of them here all right um so you don't know anything about randy taking the water pump no okay because randy's saying he had your permission to do it not the mayor so he had your permission well he probably asked me hey i'm going to get something of one of these cars and it may have been you know it may have been a water pump but i don't remember but but no one took anything until the village owned the vehicles and they were going to the scrap yard okay all right um matter of fact i got taped yeah they took a set of tires off once for um a vehicle there's good tires that would go to the junkyard we put it up on the thing they lifted up and took the tires off because it would have fit one of the village work vehicles oh nice so you know these things like it was things like that jimmy have you ever taken anything from the vehicles that the mayor said you could take any of the vehicles that you were going to impound no okay all right um going back to now the um the actual shooting that actually i might call an actual discharge it wasn't i mean you shot the ground right essentially um you knew that you were not on duty right i knew i was on light duty okay you weren't even on light you according to your doctor's excuse you weren't on light duty until the 12th you know i had the doctor's excuse with me i've got the doctor's excuse um it doesn't say that you can return until the 12th and this accident this incident happened on the 10th but you were not to return to work until the 12th okay the 12th was a monday yes all right and this happened on a saturday yes i could have uh i could return to duty on monday yes on monday so that means you weren't on dude you had you were on duty at all right that's why you have a gun with you i assumed you had your police id probably but you didn't have your firearm right okay that's because you were not on duty correct no i don't i don't feel that way i feel that i'm in the village i'm on duty even though the doctor's saying you're not allowed to be on duty until the 12th well the doctor said you returned to duty that's a return to work right okay i was physically working to get paid i'm well i got paid through sick time but physically showing up and doing the work but i was i considered myself on duty because i'm in the village i live in the village i'm the chief of police so i'm 24 7. so yeah i considered myself on duty okay so if one of your officers acted the same way you did in the same manner you would have a problem with that then at all if they were not due to come back to work for two more days and they took a call in the village they took a call even though i was clear to come back for two more days would you per say do you have a problem with that if it was the same situation that i was putting in sure cause i was saying no i would not okay and why is that because there was intimate risk of death he was there he had plenty enough people to take care of what the situation was and i believe he has the what would i want to use you want to use probably duty to do something right yeah and i assume that's where you're going with yeah okay yes i do i do i would not have a problem with that at all i mean the accidental discharge was very unfortunate and a bad timing but you know no i wouldn't have a problem with that at all because because of the intimate danger and it was just the way she was saying it you know just like he's done and he's dying please help please help please help okay um who's responsible for your auxiliary hours jeffrey mayton okay and who's responsible for the are you his boss yes okay so are you also responsible for the hours to go to city council you're tested you're turning those into city council right as a document as the end of the month report you mean yeah the other month report where you've got all the hours listed for everybody that worked uh all the calls were taken all that stuff yeah we get the calls and everything out of the computer system okay and jeff would estimate the hours how is he estimating the hours i'm confused on that part um i worked 80 hours a week i mean 80 hours a week or two weeks every two weeks that's 160 months so he put 160 he would take what he was supposed to work divide that by two that's what he would get just down the line like that okay that's for the full-timers right the paid yes for the paid people and jeffer madem was in charge of all the paid the paid people to make sure that all of their numbers were accurate well we've turned in them on the in the uh paper slip right but who was ultimately responsible for that to make sure those numbers are correct numbers where estimations they were never correct not not meant to be correct that's you guys are paid by the hour right how do you get paid by the hour at an estimate by the hour how does that work because we have a time clock we gotta turn stuff i mean we literally have a time clock see we don't right which is crazy but it keeps track of our hours we used to we used to have a time clock and i don't for some reason why it went out but if you don't work if if i estimate you worked 20 hours but you only were 15 hours am i not cheating a village out of five hours or your police department with your limited budget are you cheating yourselves out of hours if you do it that way no because our hours were yes was not estimated the hours worked was by our time sheets okay and then it was verified with mary over here okay how will mary know how much she worked oh she would see us i mean you would write your hours down right i mean you know like if you go out there to right now i'll sit here with you you'll see six a.m on my timesheet but you won't have a time ending okay because when i would before i leave and go home i would write okay let's say i'm up four today i write four p.m the amount of hours and you come over here but the the hours yes you don't do any kind of trip sheets or anything then right actually the chief we mean trip she's like a long trip lock this system is very inefficient and easily abused even if everyone is currently being 100 honest there is no way to deny any accusations that might be made out of malice and there is nothing to prevent someone from coming along in the future in taking advantage in any job but especially those in law enforcement accountability must be maintained at all times which makes sense you're the chief police so you're just putting in your time your hours and that's it yeah all right um so who is ultimately responsible for making sure those hours are correct are you talking on the the sheet that i'll talk about the sheets that you guys turn into mary who is responsible for those numbers that go over there ultimately me but i didn't do their time sheets they do each officer does their own timesheet sure like if you youtube work for me you do your timesheet you do your timesheet and then on monday mornings and i come into work when it was supposed to be turned in i'd look right all right i know your day's off right and i'm gonna know if you're um you had to work over or something i'm gonna know that and i just verified through there and then i signed it so you know when somebody has to work over or comes in for somebody else they notify you so you know about it yeah okay all right so then you're ultimately responsible for making sure the numbers are accurate when they go to marry who i i assume mary does some other report as well or did at the time i have no clue we just turn in our time sheets too but you make a report for city council or for village accounts i'm sorry if i keep calling city council i'm just used to this you make a report for village council right the end of the month they would get a report yes along with the fire department and every street department in the analyst right and that report is done by hopefully we're making okay so remain does the report he does report up and i would assume since you're the guy in charge ultimately and you're the one responsible for numbers ultimately you look at that report no you don't look at the report that remains doing no he he would come in or on like on a friday when i'm off on fridays and he knows monday is the council meeting he would do it up and then he would take it over and give it to valerie there's a plenty of times i would never see that report okay so so nobody looks at what remains doing as far as going something like that no because there were just estimated numbers of you know he could put me down for 160 hours a month i'm talking about okay i see where you're going with i'm sorry um let's go back let's say the auxiliaries who keeps track of their numbers then i got where paid guys are or maybe he's in charge of the paid guys again so remains also in charge of the authorities okay so when those numbers go over do you check their numbers too to make sure that they're accurate because you said like you said you know who's coming to go on your police department well you know he'd put the hours down for them they were uh some of them were 16 hours a week a month someone worked more someone worked less in fact a lot of them worked less i have no clue but you know but you know what it was coming and going that's the whole thing i'm trying to i want to get at you know who's going to go in the department and there are people like schilling is it schilling schiller i know jason jason silly i talked to lots of people they said he only comes during taser training that's it and he's listed for 16 hours a month correct every single month correct because frank foster our mayor said he did our radar he did our taser and he did something what else did he do radar cager i want to say self-defense the mayor said he could he saved us so much money without having to form out their training that he would give you the 16 hours every month gotcha that was fostered so your old mayor frank foster is that two years ago so your mayor two years ago said that was okay yes so you guys continue to put 16 hours on his month the 134th turned into village council yes even though he was network he was not working 16 hours he wasn't physically working 16 hours that's right but he would come out every once in a while they said that they said he could come out every now and then um but he wasn't coming out 16 hours a month was he no no so when you're taking a report and it's just being generated by the police department and it's going over to village council as him having 16 hours a month that's not accurate it may not be 16 hours you may i believe it is accurate because the mayor frank foster said giving his we will trading this 16 hours a month if he continues to train us like that and that's the way we did it i understand what you're saying i do i get it but you know a guy like that's invaluable you know but you want that guy to actually work when you're presenting those numbers to the village council the numbers don't match what is actually going on the way handsy's voice raises in pitch shows that he is aware that his answers aren't holding water as a police chief he should be on top of these issues and know exactly who is responsible for every step of these procedures as well as the rationalization of how the payment for the work hours is determined you know so if you're putting 16 hours down it looks like that guy's been there for 16 hours that month he put in at least 16 hours of time right if you wanted to look at it that way yes i don't know i mean i really don't know how else to look at it jenny when it comes to that because again yeah valuable guy you want to keep him around you want to keep him happy but he's not really he's not putting the numbers in that you are saying he's putting in does that make sense i see the number side of things okay i see your number side of things but also on this side of the tracks the mayor said do this because he trains us like this you know one month we'd have our taser and then it would be like a month and a half two months we'd we'd have to do our radar and then the other so i see where you're saying number y16 but i'm doing what the mayor said to do okay so let's say the mayor didn't say to do that let's say the mayor's did not tell you to do that all right let's say you that's that doesn't have anything to do with it is that still an accurate number if the mayor doesn't say that you can do it if you put a 16 on there does he work 16 hours a month i wouldn't do it i know but is that accurate is that accurate he works let me say it this way is it accurate he works he comes out to buckeye lake and physically works 16 hours a month no okay that's what i wanted to get at okay now vicki glover was the last time she worked for you guys oh i know it's been a while been two years over two years would it be accurate that she worked on october of 2017 no no but you got 16 hours for that what that month too on the report you guys turned into village council how's that because you know you're on the department exactly she's not you know no one took her off off the sheet no one took her off the sheet but somebody filled up that she worked for 16 hours jeff just 16 every month and you don't have your own problem with that this is a gross oversight and also begs the question where is the money going are these people continuing to accept payment for jobs they aren't doing or someone skimming the money as a chief of police certainly no problem with that that might do not only yes we've got bartow he works a lot i understand um but not all the time um well what's the other name here um bear tendril tedra does not work 16 hours a month but it's on there for 16 hours a month every month that she's been there she's got 16 hours a month i call her she says no that's not accurate i call the guy she rides with hoss jeff box jeff boss jeff says no she does not work 16 hours a month yeah you guys put 16 hours a month on that she again you understand that's a criminal charge that could be a criminal charge to do all this there's no monetary value there's no monetary value you're making it public you're making a public record you're falsifying a public document because it's going over the village council you see what i'm saying so you're falsifying a document that goes over there i don't know why i don't get it i really don't understand it you know but i mean this is the place to explain it jimmy if you're going to i mean this is this is where it gets explained well sure i know this is where it gets explained jeff did them and probably i should have protect them but you know that's my bad i'm sorry about that but but jeff did them so who's ultimately responsible for those hours you are that's what we just said right i'm responsible for them okay and if it's something that you know you screwed up with and you should have more oversight then just say that like you just did i don't you know you're right i probably should have but you know you delegate someone something to someone and you have faith in that person and evidently i shouldn't have had faith in that person well here's the thing i delegate things to him all the time constantly because i'm a stupid i'm a supervisor but what i also do on the back end is i go and check to make sure they're done not that i don't trust them but you know being a supervisor you have to make sure and that's fine and that's what i should have done yeah and let's let's the biggest thing is and especially in our job is accountability we all have to be accountable ultimately whatever i screw up i use my supervisor right it goes on him he actually screws up if i screw up you know and you're you're the department head right i mean everything under you falls on your shoulders correct yeah and you know when i would delegate things to andy and andy would do it and it'd be done right and i probably and i shouldn't even use the word probably i expected the same thing out of jeff from mayton sure and you know and i thought well you know i've known jeff for a long time he's not a screw-up he's doing what he's supposed to do and you're right i should have said let me have that report because i honestly never seen the report he would either do it on friday or even coming on monday when i was working and he would ship it right off the valerie and valerie would print it and give it to the other people give it to the council okay but you're right i should have had more should have i was doing this right you know but i had you know andy did a hell of a job for me and i didn't have any problems and i got into that blind side you'd want to say so when you go to computing auxiliary hours you don't there's no system there right there was a system and wrong i think ron did away with it they had a time they had oh you've achieved though four years so four years you've got no system in place to track those hours right right okay and and we have in the last probably three months or long or not as long there is an auxiliary says reserve hours now on this big book they come in and write write their time supposed to especially but nobody does it according to everybody i talked to yeah no i mean if one of the guys axillaries comes out and slides out and rides with whoever at night and they don't i don't hear them on the radio or they don't stop by my house i don't know they worked right okay um let's go to these uh checks that were cashed for the insurance company now i talked to the insurance company about those checks and uh they had some pretty big issues with them all right that may be something that i'm gonna have to turn over to somebody else to to investigate criminally if it gets to that point i may have to do that i don't know what's there the insurance checks that when you were transported to the hospital you were supposed to pay you weren't supposed to catch them and you cashed four of them oh lord you got to be kidding me cj the problem with the problem with an internal investigation is once it starts rolling it starts opening the door to all kinds of other stuff that comes in it just goes to show that you can get away with something like this for years but once an investigation actually takes place they will dig up every infraction ever committed and throw it at you all at once and while those things must be addressed it shouldn't have been allowed to get to this point in the first place and i you know i have a duty now to at least address it and try to figure out what's going on in this setting again you're under guaranteed okay i can't use anything you say criminally period okay i understand so all right i want you to understand that you know before you before this is funny these checks i honestly wholeheartedly with my life believe they were my aflac checks because i talked to john curtis you can call him and ask him i got him in my phone he says you've got a check coming and you're going to have checks coming for your um follow-up visits i just got a check and you can run out to my truck and give you the keys i got 3 100 out there i just got an aflac check for this okay i honestly wholeheartedly one million percent believe them checks were mine this started pissed me off when i found out they weren't i made arrangements and they were taking money out of my payroll every month i didn't fight the system because i honestly guys i honestly believed there were my checks so did you get any aflac checks during that time that you were getting those checks yes okay so what do you did you wonder like hey wait a minute why is affleck sending me another check no because he told me that i have money coming from follow-ups just like a few minutes ago i go to the hospital i've been to the hospital since february 4th every day for three hours i turned in everything he just told me he said get everything else you need because you've got follow-up money coming from your affleck accidental insurance okay that's what i thought those checks were have you been able to recognize those checks now when they come so that you don't catch them is there yes something that you can say hey i can't cash these checks anymore matter of fact i got another check and i said who did this belong to i took it to the to the village they said it was me so i cashed that check that guys was 1 000 [ __ ] million percent a mistake on my part but it was not out to steal anything from anybody i've never stolen anything from anybody and i never would and never will pansy is visibly upset at this accusation and it seems like it was a miscommunication about the checks it also sounds like the problem was already being addressed and he was paying the money back and there should be witnesses that can verify that these conversations took place okay that check that check stuff and i even we even talked to this the lady with mayor carroll and we got it all up sent up them taking money out of my my uh checking account every month i call the lady this is my bank numbers my rally number they're taking money out evidently they're paid off because they don't take out anymore okay so you guys have made arrangements to get it taken care of yeah that was arrangements taken care of or every month that money came out is it still coming out or you gotta pay no it's gotta be paid off because they haven't been taking their money out okay all right um guys that that upsets me but you got to understand that i understand that and you know jimmy i don't want this to be an adversarial thing man you know i want this to be just all out there and again out of respect for you and the job you've done for so long i want to give you opportunities here and that's it i don't know i don't want to force your hand on anything no i don't want to give you advice all i want to do is try to find out everything i like you guys i don't have nothing to hide um there was somebody mentioned um a suicide scene where 140 came up missing too and they said that you had access to the money and that you mentioned that the dead guy wasn't going to miss the money you recall anything about that no okay oh no nothing at all nothing at all okay you guys get a lot of suicides out there not a whole lot yes i'm 17. you know about how many last year you know the last suicide i was almost with andy and a guy had shot himself in a bed in a bunk bed yep that's the answer i'm talking about yeah so if you recall that you caught some money being exchanged or being taken from the scene and he took everything because i couldn't couldn't stand the smell and i do believe his family came and got everything okay the deceased family did yeah okay yeah all right um log sheets who's who's responsible for keeping the guy's log sheets guys and gals work out there their road log sheets they write it out during the night and put it in the box there are three months from last year completely missing road logs or are you talking about both road logs and and actually city council the reports that you guys in the city council those are also missing now i know peggy said something about them they're all missing the whole whole month like three months worth you know i think it was april and uh july april july and november yeah and yes yeah because i was looking for him yesterday okay yeah any idea what happened to those i talked to jeffrey mayton because he gathers them up puts him in a big envelope he does the the monthly report copies it shoves it into you know with the road logs flips it over and writes road logs and stats and then the month of the year and then he takes the other report over to valerie i asked him what he done with them he has no clue what he'd done with them why are you allowing them to leave the office in the first place i know that everybody's mentioned everybody's got stuff at home why is anybody got anything at home why does jennifer made have any any paperwork at home any files or anything else the only thing he would have at home would be his um qualifications for us and there were his copies and then when uh peggy was asking me about the qualifications i didn't know jeff already had already already put them all together and they were in the cabinet right by his desk so there was let me ask you this jimmy and again this has got to stay here with this stuff did you guys ever kind of cheat your way through the qualifications because i looked at your qualifications and you know if you've shot shot and shot people in this one round you know throughout three different guns in a couple of different years and then you went to try to qualify this time and couldn't hit anything something jumps out right there and just for me as being an investigator and then when i talked to everybody they said they've never they don't they don't watch you qualify no one's seen you qualified besides remain i qualified before everybody because i was told that i have to watch them okay in case i have to testify for it yes they did do well and remake wasn't your trainer now what were those 100 accurate the scores that vermeedom gave you yes okay jeffrey mayton will not pass you if you didn't okay he'll make you matter of fact i'll give you a scenario with andy qualifications seem like a rather stupid thing to lie about given the length of his career it shouldn't be difficult for him to maintain it is possible especially considering the lax nature of the department that it was handled in an informal manner that wouldn't hold up in most other forces paperwork is clearly not their strong suit andy wanted jeff to say hey i did my hours with when andy got in trouble with my muskina county he got work he had to work at the dive team and he said just tell him that i was here and worked jeff said absolutely not okay i am not doing that jeff what and other people claim hours it never happened i think it's just muscle not muscle memory i just think jeff thinks that you know in 16 hours um he wouldn't know if someone came out and worked um like during the during the day when he's off or during the night weekend when he's off i think he just thinks it's the honor system and i'm i'm gonna give you 16 hours and he's not 100 sure if they did it or not i don't think it was to deceive anybody it's not to jimmy would you say that everybody got 16 hours in just based on what you know the guys that i have now i'm talking about let's think of all of 17. let's just take 17 and 10 to right now do you think that everybody really got their 16 hours in if they didn't get to 16 they got close to it okay but they're you know but you you would say that's an accurate statement and that not everyone got their 16 hours in i would say it's accurate they were close but gosh may not have got to 16. okay some of them may have got more than 16 and you know they only got wrote down but that's fair to say though right that you're gonna get 16 all the time and it's also fair to say that you're in charge of that ultimately it's your department and your responsibility to make sure those numbers are accurate then their numbers were never ever in the whole world ever meant to be accurate that was just a summary of what we've done okay the only thing awkward in that that whole thing was the very front page that was accuracy and it wasn't accurate because you guys missed ritter's numbers on almost every month what do you mean like ritter's numbers that he had your call volume is actually way bigger than you you guys claim it is you guys have more calls and did more things than you guys claimed because you didn't affect the writers numbers in all of writer's call records all his calls all his stats even as hours worked nobody calculated so ritter's not putting his stuff in the computer that and that would be the problem there with call volume what do you mean by stuff in the computer he's not tapping his is his stuff in his crs and call records in okay so you guys go off of that from the call logs so you take the call logs you put in the computer and then remaining gets those numbers off of the computer yeah he goes in there you know and it's generated from the computer so if that call number is low and it's rare ritter's not put his his stuff in brother's name's not even on there oh my writer's name is not even on the list of anything that's been done go grab one of those packets for me yeah um because we have gravity ritter's name is not actually even on the list of auxiliary officers or part-time officer full-time loss this thing's like a lot of it so no so we wrote it in and put down the stats that he got and your numbers actually rose instead of being down here they actually rose a lot so you guys you guys aren't getting credit for a lot of stuff you're doing because his numbers aren't being calculated in that so you know i don't think your village council is getting an accurate number really of anything they're not getting an accurate number of how many people are coming out to work their hours or their call volume hansey appears genuinely surprised at this information the incompetence is just sad at this point and isn't even benefiting them in a way where it would make sense for this to be deliberate steve ritter's name is not on that report yeah i'll show you when he brings it back over here just not signing it on there yet when you open it up you've got all these call logs so you know his call logs are on there all his hours are on the call logs that he did and everybody he picked up was on there now what i did too is i went back and looked at all the call logs and they're they're guys that and gals that have zero call logs none but yet they got 16 hours listed and they're not on one call off auxiliary they're auxiliaries they're not on any call those are not on anybody else's call log either they didn't pick up anybody they didn't uh take anybody back they didn't do a slash mark and then put their name on it nothing they're supposed to usually put their name on it like if let's say kendra wrote with with haws he would put his name on it and he should put bear's name on there yep cedric some of them do most of them don't ritter's pretty good about putting another name on there if you have somebody right with them and so it was a haas yeah but a lot of people don't i mean they don't want it all so when i when i look at it and you think about it from a village council point of view if i'm looking at something like that and i want to see who's out i see that this guy has 16 hours listed this month so i go back through all of the records and there's not one mention over there there's not one blog there's not any number there's not there's not anything filled out that says he was there at all so how do i verify that well if richard ritter causes the doing doing that the only other person would be verbati because no one comes out works with me because they all work day shift so i can't i can't get it yeah i mean you see a problem with the the way things are i i see things needs to be changed sure majorly yeah and i don't have a problem changing that stuff majorly but i had no clue that steve ritter is not on that list well for instance see january here we actually wrote in ritter in jackson because jackson actually wrote glitter i think that uh one day that month so we wrote his stats in there and his or his hours in there anyway you know and then andy davis picked up uh bartow and bartlett got seven hours that day but barton didn't get 16 hours in that month now there's times here that bartow is our bailiff okay and he would do the beta there would be no call wall for him is there any record of that sure does he sign into something or do it no no no anything that's written down no he comes in and he would be the bailiff all right um see vicky glover's still on when is this one 17. that's january 17 she was part of me yeah half a year at least see this should have been updated he goes in the computer and gets this every month because he has to change that from month to month january february and then new year would come in and put the what do you see your total calls for service at 93 that's not counting uh ritters see if that number is off then steve ritter's not putting his compute his crs in our computer system because this is generated from our computer system gotcha so that number's off then steve's not doing what he's supposed to do and he's hiding his cr somewhere gotcha because i'm not finding him because i see him in the book yeah but i don't go in and check every one of them in the computer but you're right ritter's name may own this right it's not all a lot of them you know so the reports are just generated like that and then they're turning to city county or a village council like that so and there's you know i never even thought think of that yeah there's a lot of that a lot of um wow were there any times jimmy that you claim some hours didn't actually work no there's hours that i work that i don't put down on my time sheet so you're working extra hours and not cleaning yes this iphone would ring constantly and i'd have to go out i'd have to go out i never put eight hours all the hours down because i know we're short of money and i don't want to work myself out of a job you can ask any mayor that yeah um what's the most people you guys have had out at one time two two three at any time any given day usually two okay i would sit i would work six to four and then someone coming up from noon to ten okay and they would come out at noon to give me that four hours to go in the office and see what i stuff that i had to do okay all right based on this conversation alone several people are guilty of negligence these errors should have been caught long before now if anyone involved had been doing their job properly ultimately the responsibility does fall on handsy since he is the chief but others bear investigation as well so um is there any time that you would have three or four people working at once no no that would be nice right it would be so on april 25th 2017 you have four people listed as working at the same time who you've got davis verbatim you and ritter now also on that day and i've been told by two people you and vermeiden went four-wheeling that day over in perry state park perry state forest which we've called perry state forest we've also called dispatch you got the the call runs and everything else and who marked in who marked out all that stuff you guys aren't anywhere on there you and vermeedon are nowhere on there on the call logs all right see are nothing zero what's it what day was it april 25th 2017. it was on a tuesday ritter actually got called into work to cover for either you or her maid and one of the two he was not on his regular scheduled days yeah okay do you remember that day do you remember going forward a little bit for me yeah okay yeah it was on there you've been foreign several places sure that was on a tuesday and you remember going to perry state uh forest we've been there several times you remember going to muskegon first and then they now have they're not open then you went over to there yeah yes yeah that's the day right yeah okay that's the day that you went on tuesday the 25th i think it was okay then ritter worked for vernet and i took the day off okay so you do remember that day then yeah okay so you took a day off without remaining oh probably you sit down like i did okay so you sick time that day i'm supposed to yeah so you use sick time that day on the 25th to go out four wheels so you weren't sick no well i shouldn't say sick time is pto time okay what is your pto time explain it personal time off okay what do you have to do a personal time off you just get that yeah we our taste ups don't say um sick time it says pto and then we get vacation you cure so much and i mean if you wanted a day off you just say hey i'm gonna take this day off and just like that day right remaining had to have said hey this do you want to go there and i'm like yeah get someone to work for me gotcha call ritter in okay guys what happened that day then had to be okay so he called who called ritter n you or him i think you know what i can't tell you that i don't remember okay but you know ritter was called into color or somebody shift yeah okay on a tuesday would be jeff or mayton by himself right so bernie would have had to take a day a personal date off and you would have to take a personal day off at that point yeah okay so when you take a personal day off how do you how do you notate that you took a personal day off when you guys turn on your time sheets be put sit down there and then the amount of hours you took okay how many hours is no refreshment over here did you take a sick time or just take a personal problem it's pto time okay that's considered the same thing as six times so you don't actually have sick time you have to take pto time right and you have to accrue that time or how does that work okay all right so you would have to just say pto time across the time sheet or something first yeah or whatever you put on there yeah that would be for how many hours well we both work 10-hour shifts every 10 hours okay all right since we took the whole day off gotcha all right but you do recall calling men for that particular day you guys going forward on that particular day yes because we went to the one place and they were closed and that was was that muskingum was all right about that there was some other zanesville so was it somewhere in i thought it was muskingum somewhere or that's the information i had and then they were closed and then you get the parity we went to perry different part of perry and they hadn't opened up it was the next day they opened up so but the one trail that we did go to was already open i got you okay and then you had to go to that trail so that was on make sure i got my paper right here that was on the 25th right that's your time sheet right sick days and paid time off vary from place to place in some businesses they are considered separate and in others they are lumped together interchangeably most places do not care if you are actually sick or not if you take a sick day as long as you have that time allotted to you in an investigation such as this some might see it as a sign of dishonesty 12 hours 686p yeah you see the problem i'm having with that that should that shouldn't have been i didn't even finish this week right that's because somebody grabbed and made a copy of it because they knew you were out four-wheeling when you were supposed to be at work that's why that's there yeah and because they were concerned that you were taking time off and doing things and claiming time for work yeah and that's why there's a copy of that you probably did actually finish that time sheet but that's a copy of the of the time sheet up until that point i think we do have the finished one and we do have a finished one yeah so that's that's your handwriting yeah you claimed 12 hours that day yeah when you weren't there well i can tell you this if you go out there look right now steve's isn't done for this week yeah and you know what i just whipped it out and didn't even think about taking that day off that wasn't taking that day off on and trying to rip someone off you know i just should have do it like i do it now which is fill it out as i go better but that day here someone may have taken and pulled the copy off and i know who it was steve ritter but that was not done on purpose and now given their 12 hours back but that was not done to steal anything from anybody okay but you see the problem that the issues were raised jenny are legitimate issues i can see it because if they're coming to your house and you're sitting around i'm not saying it's true i'm saying they're reporting if you're sitting around watching tv when you're on duty they feel like you're stealing money from the from the village if you're going out and riding four wheelers on a day you're supposed to be at work and then you clean time off too that's a problem man well i didn't see that being a problem that wasn't done on purpose okay i can tell you that this perfect say on that same day and out of respect for you jimmy i'm giving you i'm playing everything on the table but i'm not i'm gonna hold anything back right now here's the one that was turned in of yours and i'm looking for her for me you are past part one right here 425 and remate was with you and her maiden claimed six hours why would he pay him six hours when he's supposed to work on tuesday he works two noon to ten no i do so that should i don't even know why that was put there that was noon that should have been noon to 10 instead of ford again and it had been 10 hours what time did you guys get back from that trip oh hell i don't remember was it dark no no no maybe he tried to come in later i don't know but he put down numbers too on that day that he wasn't at work the writer had to come in because the two of you are both gone and the dispatch traffic had ritter on there not you guys yeah and obviously here 4 11. if you're being honest with me that you know you guys were out there on the 25th yeah you know so that's the problem jimmy and you don't want to turn this stuff over to mayor wells and the village council they're probably gonna have an issue well you know what this was not done on purpose i probably should do my timesheet every day that i get done and i didn't that right there the 25th was not done on purpose but you know and i can understand it looks terrible but jimmy you just told me earlier that you do it like that that you make sure that you don't put that ending on there until you're actually done i just started doing that okay i got you because of all this issue of them saying timesheet this time she that trying to cheat this right and peggy is very this is jimmy have you ever seen this before this is a couple years of people thinking that you're doing stuff that you shouldn't be doing a couple years since 2014 that's how long that is that's a lot that's what that's what's going to go over to those guys man that's and obviously there are issues there now obviously there are some issues whether you did it on purpose or not there are issues there that are very serious like what issues are very serious like if i did that if i left and i i came back here and i claimed that i worked that day i'd get charged with theft in office probably i don't get fired i get fired like pretty quickly here right all right so i don't know what they're gonna do there i don't know their procedures frankly i don't care ansi's incompetence has the potential to cost him greatly he is negligent and lazy but so far it doesn't sound like these are deliberate criminal acts however that doesn't matter in the long run as his errors add up over time and impact not only the police department but the village itself at the very least he needs to be fired so that they can get a chief who will handle their responsibilities correctly um because that's that's between you and them my job was to find out what happened with with everything yeah i did not do the 25th of april or this was it this year no that's right 17 on purpose you know yeah probably i was like a days ago doing the time sheets every day but i know how she is so we we have tightened it up very much because i know how particular she is yeah whatever happens in this investigation man i hope you guys tighten it up i really do i mean whether you're there whether you decide to leave or what happens well i i'm sure he's going to fire me i hope to god you guys get a [ __ ] straightened up though you know and i will be the first one to look both you in the eyes and say yeah we need to tighten some things up i have no problem with that have no problem with getting guidance that how to do that okay but to say i blatantly ripped off this black i like police department is bull i put 34 years of my life out there i gave them people more than anything i lost a marriage over this police department okay i've lost girlfriends over this police department because i spent more time there than i would with them you know just because someone comes to my house and they see me in blue jeans and a t-shirt that says police and i got 27 on my side doesn't mean that i ain't working doesn't mean that i don't have something in the mix going on you know mayor foster mayor apparel knew every time i would be working out of my house but jimmy your computer like you said the computer at your house has the same things the computer does at uh at work in fact oleg you're not running at your house i hope you're running you know at work why because it's more peaceful for one thing the phone's not ringing 300 000 times then charms on the door is not ringing on and off be bomb you got to walk out through the other side of the office it's more peaceful and you can get more stuff done steve ritter don't come in and stand at your desk and do this for 45 minutes you know you understand that and and trying to get things done andy don't come and wouldn't come in and do all this and you're trying to get something done it's like seven being pulled 17 different ways yeah like you're you you stretch armstrong yeah it's impossible to do i understand that hell it's impossible to be in your position a lot of times it's hard yeah and for i can tell you exactly and you just look at me and tell me it's none of my business i don't care that stuff coming up there's from steve ritter steve ritter wants my job i'll tell you what i'll be completely 100 honestly because i i don't [ __ ] and i'm not bullshitting it now that did not come from steve ritter some of it had two of them none of it did none of that come from steve ritter nothing in that book came from steve ritter no hey let me tell you let me just say this i'm gonna i'm gonna you know conclude i'm gonna end the whole thing on this jimmy whatever you do whatever you decide you know i want you to understand and know that we respect you you know we've known you for a long time i hope things work out for you i really do um you know i'm sorry that i you know even got pulled into this thing because it's unpleasant it's not pleasant for me to have to investigate you okay i took no joy in this believing but i wish you luck man whatever you do whatever you decide i hope you you know succeed in it and if it's this and you stay here hope to succeed if you decide to take off you know i hope you find something good for you if you get fired i'll help you find something good for you all right i once understand there's no there's no animosity here there's no heart feelings no matter what i hope you're doing the same way there isn't i understand what you guys had to go through i understand what you guys are doing but the mistakes that were made and there was mistakes made but none of it was done to rip off anybody discredit anybody get any extra free money or what pat anything or anything like that the auxiliary hours and for mating doing them i should have overseen it but you know when you delegate something i probably should have just make sure it was right or i should just did it myself but when you have so many things going on you delegate to this gentleman absolutely you know and you you guys are good friends i'm sure but you believe in him i do yeah and i believed in vermin my problem here mine i should have probably just made sure that it was done right but i have no no doubt in him that he because he's done sure stuff like that before i guess just for future reference jimmy i trust them but verify everything they do when you delegate something it is always your obligation to go back and make sure that it was done correctly because you aren't delegating the responsibility just the grunt work to free yourself up so you can focus on other things for a time handsy knows that he isn't going to come out of this with his job and seems to accept that fact well and that's what i should have done i mean that just keeps me because since i've got some vicarious liability and all this stuff you know with him or with the other detective you know i got to make sure that i'm doing the things they're doing things right so that doesn't come back on me you know ultimately you're the head of the police department you're the you're the top fish over there you know what but i'm sure like you know what i'm saying you are you know and so ultimately who's it come down to i know i know exactly as unfortunate as it is you know it's going to come down to you oh i know and it's going to come down when you guys give her a report it's going to come down and she's going to let me go but you know what i'm giving her i literally don't want to take it there's no surprises all right and that's all that's the respect that i want to show you is i'm not i'm not pulling punches here i'm not hiding anything i'm showing you i'm showing you my entire hand i'm laying out for you so that you yourself if there's a decision to be made you understand these are the cards that are being played okay right exactly and i've given you that respect to say here's my whole hand this is it and i've been 150 million percent honest with you gentlemen i appreciate that you know i didn't have nothing to hide you know just like this just whatever date that was in my hours was down there i didn't i come in here without the hype because i didn't even realize that and i should have done it day by day like i am now i didn't even realize that to be truthful with you the end of the week you got so much stuff coming up the second week i know but you can't estimate man you can't go back to that that kind of thing you say you're estimating your hours you know with verbatim uh estimating the hours and you estimate the hours and then the estimates for city are for uh the auxiliaries and then you're giving that as an official document into village councils making a public record no it's accurate yeah now i see where she's going with this letter of accuracy of reports now i see what she'd come up with this public records request or documents or something like that and i agree i should have been did a little bit more due diligence when jeff was making out the reports yes i should have now jamal how long have you been up okay like your total years of service 33 lot of time do you feel in any way that the village owes you anything we as as in like all the time of service that you've given to the village of the village of buckeye lake do you feel that they owe you anything um in this matter here are we talking well or anything i think it's come to a point where you know you kind of get into this complacent this is how it's been done this is what we do you know you mentioned i take a lot of phone calls i do a lot of work outside of your actual hours i do too i do the facebook page i do a lot of other things i don't necessarily feel like you know the city owes me anything but you know there may be times where you said well okay i worked eight hours today but i did two hours outside at work you know because you probably did but you didn't actually log those hours in uniform at the desk or anything right i mean in instances like that i mean do you feel like it's a wash when things like that happen no no okay and you don't feel like the village owes you anything for all the service you've done and well okay you know i i worked this much yeah they had you know i gave them an hour over here it's not a big deal you know i'm basically getting it back you don't feel like that happens you know i i like to get paid for what i work um like i said i didn't turn in some hours because i knew i'd work myself out of a job and that's what it's always been give you an example the reason why right before mary left in november i asked no december i asked if we could get a window tint meter for 48 no you don't have the money seriously ah 48 bucks 48 dollars so that's the way we've always been in that village from day one i started they don't give us nothing we buy our own paper we buy our own uniform they give us uniform allowance but we buy our own boots and we buy our own guns and our belts and stuff that whatever the uniform allowance won't cover you know that reminds me of something though jimmy i got to ask you before you take off here you threw away a bunch of property the other day yeah no it was boxes and stuff like that okay uh one of them was one of our uniform shirts yes i didn't see that yeah why did you throw away our shirt it was it had been in the back of the property room forever so some of the stuff you throw away was that property or just boxes because we found some some dried up weed and all that stuff too out there you understand you got to get quarter horse and throw that stuff out right right that was just dirt okay that was just the dirt that i just want to make sure that you know because i know that yeah procedurally there's you guys do a lot of stuff procedurally that makes no sense to us it makes no procedural sense to the detective because he is obviously helped to higher standards where he works there are stricter protocols in fast food restaurants than there are in hanzi's department but i want to make sure that you because that will get you in trouble that'll get you out of trouble like really fast yeah that was just dirt okay so you don't heard away anything from no that was not meant to be in there they just didn't have you know instruction work for anything all right yeah there is there's a bunch of stuff already boxed up that says um however it says re um yeah destroyed uh um what we did you get rid of that stuff nope okay how do you get rid of stuff mark gardner okay and that's what we were waiting for was mark gardner perfect okay but we had three coats and we had all this stuff um the only thing we threw away was empty boxes because we would take all this stuff that was in boxes we had three big totes and we'd write on a yellow piece of paper what it was put it all in there and then after that tote was flow we put tote number one put the the illegal people are in it and put the lid on it we did i think two of them two or three of them the only thing we threw away was empty boxes the potassium shirts and um i think it was a was it a planter i think so yeah just dirt yeah yeah that we'd already cut all the stuff off of that and weighed it and it is actually still in there right i suppose so you can hear that's been frozen oh my god right like i said jimmy i just want to see more trouble because or something like that because that was just a big red flag i didn't really have too much to do with what we're talking about right now i was like oh you know i don't want you to do it for a second excuse me for just one second okay welcome back to the the ap real quick uh that was curiosity's sake it was uh for mayton went in first then you and then ritter um now did you guys have any type of police identifiers or anything as the two people going in first for mcniel police so he just did a verbal warning yes please you guys didn't have any uniform any throw overs or anything any type of identifier that said that you were police in case a resident whether it's a badge or you know we have the the veterans just say police for and i didn't you did not okay yeah is there any reason why you didn't have printer going first because he is you know he was in uniform correct he was working through that night he had the rifle okay and he had a flashlight okay this is why just the tactics thing i mean yeah if you know it it has been a defense used in court cases throughout the country if an uniformed officer with no police identifiers enters first and gets shot and killed that person has made that defense that it's been i thought it was an intruder right so you know just a tactics type thing just moving forward and you had a uniformed officer with you and you know just just trying to clarify you know well why not just have him go first because at least you have your first line of yeah he's an officer he's in uniform you should know it when you see him um so i was just trying to clarify and you think you're good you're making a good point there i mean it was just went down some damn fast that it was yeah it it seems like it and and i don't fault yet i don't you know sergeant smith doesn't either i mean if in the heat of the moment you feel that you had a duty to respond and you guys were that close and you were able to great now did you necessarily go about it the right way maybe maybe not maybe there's a better way maybe you could have just held the trailer call the county whatever um for your safety the last thing we want in this county is another officer killed oh you're not gonna get it right you know i mean you guys didn't have vests you didn't have identifiers you weren't fully completely equipped because what if you know what if you didn't shoot a shootout and ritter's gun jams he doesn't have his sidearm on him you know same with any of you it's just you know it's bad tactics there's other ways to go about it but there's no right way i mean no one says this is exactly how you do a written rule there's not there's not and and we said we don't fault you for that uh exigent circumstances being what they are you're going off what you know seems like a pretty legit thing i mean hey i gotta go in there and save some lives you know that's what we're built to do it's just how we are so i i get that i understand that you know so um but if anything learning lesson if anything so my lord you're right yeah having pounded coffee in water yeah you know we're talking about vests we've asked for vessel for so long they were ill-prepared to face an armed home invader but given the known facts at the time it might have been overlooked if hansey hadn't been involved while he wasn't supposed to be working yeah i mean it's it's it's just one of those things there's still departments in the state that you know if you get one donated you get one donated if you get a hand me down you can hand me down if you don't get one well you want to go into work you know without one may or may not so you know i understand that it's definitely throughout the state throughout the country it's definitely an issue hey jenny yep i got a thing in here once i just want to read this i spoke with randy from the street farm today randy said terry small got in trouble that terry was caught by jimmy carrying a battery and terry told randy knew or tilt uh told terry to tell him that randy knew jimmy then confronted randy and randy said he didn't know anything about it but jimmy did nothing about it you remember that oh i thought terry was walking across the parking lot yeah and i asked him about the battery and he said randy um randy said he could have it okay and it was a battery an old battery went to a silent and then when i asked randy randy said that no he did not tell small to have it okay okay randy didn't want any confrontation between just and wanted terry smallmouth to come back and so did mark dimmick was underneath he was underneath mark demick at that time okay so that's why nothing was done because he didn't want any conflict just tell terry he's not allowed back in the street department right but if you see this book jenny like i said this is a book basically about jimmy that's fine all right i mean jimmy carl uh asked me to come in love and say the funeral of me and go to took a cruise with a funeral three twenty calls said he was going home for the day at 3 20. so you're home for the day it's literally day by day for years of you going home are you not coming in or you saying you were somewhere that they said that you weren't at i'm just saying this is what this guy's saying over and over and over and over again that is andy davis that's right that's andy davis but remember this is andy davis but it's also former employees that i've talked to saying the same things it's also current employees i'm saying you know they're saying the same things just honestly jimmy do you think that you're doing a great job over there from let's say 2015 on do you think that you're doing the job that you should be doing yes i do okay why do you think so because i get things done and just because i'm not in uniform every day of the week doesn't mean that i'm not doing something for that police department i look for grants for cars i look for grants for equipment i look i mean if you look for grains for generators for the police department okay selector goes out when the lecture goes out we're done our department's done next door has a generator just can't just tie into it they wouldn't tie us into it so i look for grants and stuff like that today i read was been reading the new dui laws and getting up on the new unclassified misdemeanors on your dus's and stuff like that getting ready to print that stuff out you know what i don't really want to go here with this but i'm going through anyway because again it's out of respect for you but you know we have quite a few officers too so they went to your house because you were threatening suicide what three officers told us that the three that were there um three they said that you you know you wanted you wanted to kill yourself because of the insurance checks you recall it you recall that and the reason i'm telling you this jimmy i don't even care the answer this this job will stress you to the hell out this job will get to you this job will take you you know they'll just take you to a point where you're not snapped i used to jimmy i'm just telling you because again it's out of respect for you if the job's getting you this bad maybe you don't ask about it for a while and say is this what i want to do no you know what the insurance checking it wasn't an insurance it was about my insurance on my house that flooded my uh washroom i said you know what i said i'm just freaking sick and tired of life yeah and everybody at that point overreacted but you do remember that then yeah but but i didn't actually say i'm gonna kill myself and well you know no i said i am [ __ ] my bad boys where i'm [ __ ] sick and tired of life because every time i turn around i get [ __ ] apparently you scared enough people that they were it scared jeff for making as we were scared it did it scared the [ __ ] out of them yeah i know it did so and he knows he knows there's three reasons well let me use this hand three reasons that i would never hurt myself first of all is my son i love that boy more than anything and there's two little girls on never that pisses me off ansi becomes very emotional about the accusation of him being suicidal there is a high rate of suicide among police officers and it is something that absolutely must be taken seriously when suspected on the other hand people often make comments during times of stress and frustration that can be misinterpreted even when that person has no intention whatsoever to harm himself well so i've been to this job jimmy it's meant to show you that life is valuable man and you spend most of your life just being pissed off with the world or doing something that's affecting your health maybe you gotta look at it and just say hey i don't wanna do all this crap you know maybe at some point you just say i gotta make my life easier and i'm not saying i quit i'm saying find a way to make your life easier you know it's fine these guys want to write all this stuff down maybe i should have been keeping a book on andy davis maybe i should have been keeping it at y'all you should have been doing what you should have been doing is being the chief of police and saying you know what you're not doing your job right you know here's your writer for this here's your tag but to do that you've got to be a supervisor to do that you've got to be an [ __ ] sometimes and to do that you've got to be on top of [ __ ] yeah and jimmy i love your death man i respect you but you didn't do that no i think we can all agree on that right you didn't do that so you know that that's an issue that's something that regardless of what you do from here on out you've got to look at this time and say yeah you're right i could have done things a lot differently i could have done things a lot better you know but at the end of the day i'll be the first one to tell you i could have done things different could have done things a lot better you're damn you're damn right but you know when you're that close of an apartment you know and i can tell you let me tell you this where this stands from and you can believe me or you can't believe me the day wrong small retired ron smalls andy's father-in-law okay yeah andy married ron's daughter rhonda all right when ron was retiring ron wanted to retire and then he wanted to come back three days a week and then i worked the rest of the week i worked with him in three days but i finished it out he wanted to be the chief of police he wanted to keep a sick time and he wanted to keep his vacations five weeks a year mayor baker said no i don't know what happened between them but one day i come in the office and ron said if i would retire today who would you put in your place i said well i said i probably put in andy he said good because if you assist her i wasn't retired by retiring as of friday all right so you promoted andy to sergeant because of that no okay he said andy's your new sergeant i've already worked it out with mayor baker you're going to start him out at this amount of money okay i didn't know i was putting on a sergeant or anything else i thought maybe just come on full time as as a patrolman but okay rob already worked everything out so that was in 2013 2014 i reach the point where i can retire with ohio police and fire okay i asked the mayor which is a new mayor clay carroll i'm to the point where i can retire it's not going to do me a real a lot of good to work can i retire and can i come back i said this is what i'll do i'll give you my sick time and i'll give you my vacation and i'll start at zero i said then you won't have to find someone you already know i can do the job he said let me kick it around two days later he called me and said yes you can it's all right went to the retirement board and i retired knowing ron was going to be madder than hell ron's a very vindictive man ron is a very greedy man and nothing in this world matters anything other than money to that man okay so i said let me be the one to tell him i think i can tell him in an easy way that will not piss him off boy was i wrong he told me every name of the book in the dollar general parking lot he said this was his favorite words was bullfuck he left he called one of our may or council members just toward them a new ass that he was friends with barry herron um and then two weeks later he calls the mayor carol and tells mayor carroll that i'm worthless and i do nothing and i've never done anything threw me under the bus this is another illustration of small town politics there are so many connections between people it is difficult to keep the stories and motives straight people get vindictive and will gang up to ruin an individual this makes it all the more difficult to accurately determine when someone is at fault and to what extent so this little book that we have here is from his son-in-law because andy is the same damn way there ain't nothing in this world that means more to andy davis than money you know so this is driven from that guys you could say all this is a bunch of horse [ __ ] you could now he's full of [ __ ] tell that fat ass to go back to buckeye lake that's the 110 truth gary and i would take a polygraph exam 1400 times over and it would come out the same that i'm telling you the truth i've told you the truth all day today and i appreciate that jerry i have nothing to hide you know yeah you bring things up should have been tightened up you're right i appreciate that i hope you tell me or wales that i don't have any training as being a big supervisor because every time we ask to go to training we don't get it it gets you not they denied 48 dollar window tent you think you're gonna give me 320 to go to no i understand that we've got a deputy chief he'll do the same thing you know we're trying to get things and little tiny things and he just he likes to poo poo on everything like that but we i think we get to extend believe me but you know just like the the david he says i was i was working i put downs working but i was forward i didn't do that on purpose that is 100 000 typo you know encouraging me i mean i'm not angry at you guys i'll be angry at you guys there's nothing you guys got drugged in the middle of it was supposed to have been an accidental shooting right and then i don't know how all this came about i gotta go confirm something real quick with these guys and uh outside make sure that we're good we're good to go yeah i think that's why i want to check once because i got more thing okay we're gonna let you go in a minute man hold on a second jackie's sheriff's here to take me to jail with me i don't think so no no no i wasn't made aware that's the case so no no and like we said this is all under guarantee so this is a completely different different circumstance you know i appreciate did you guys show me some of these things i really do well like gary said we just want to be up front and honest because we're not trying to be shady we're not trying to be connected and i don't think you guys have been we're just trying to put everything out there and just be open and we're trying to be the unbiased party that i mean we're on the west side of the county we're the child as it is you know so it's a little bit easier for them to ask somebody who is still within the county just a different agency so that's the same things you're good man no there's no tricks jimmy we don't want to put all the deputy waiting for ya no no no no you're not going to jail all right this is again this internal investigation nothing that we talked about to be used and you know gary i i appreciate you more than you think because you've showed me a few things that i should tighten up and i need to tighten up and you showed me that i put a little bit more faith in people that maybe i shouldn't have just because they're friends and we go out and eat dinner and everything yeah doesn't mean they're going to do exactly what they're supposed to do absolutely not but you can you got to separate business yeah from friendship it just does that you know that's hard because when you all work together right now you know we all work together we're all very tight but at the same time i get you know i get my butt kicked in sometimes too when i do something stupid i don't want to lose my job i have 34 years in i have a lot left in me to go i do know there needs to be things to be tightened up and if i get the chance they'll be tired of you know nuns i gotcha i know you're going with that but you know i've been 100 honest with you guys because i came in here like jeff not want to take the cvsa that was bullheadedness that wasn't because i don't believe in him my attorney says he doesn't believe in them either sure it's it's unproven science and so there are things down there that are that are really good aspects i think too there's a lot of pre-interview stuff that are really really good did i take a cbsa i'm gonna give you one handsy is saying he'll do better if given the chance but his words are meaningless whatever her reasoning the mayor now has plenty of legitimate cause to terminate him and he knows this at best the only option he has is to take a low-paying job somewhere until he qualifies for retirement okay i'm not going to give you one because i believe you i mean i do i believe what you're saying i'm not i'm not dying i'm not so i don't i don't have to give you one you know i didn't come out here and stay out there and i'll show you i'm nervous because gary i have nothing to hide yeah not a thing to hide from you and again jimmy like i said man it's uh it's a you know it's a respect thing for me i respect the the time you put in the job you've done everything else like that so you know i just wanted to give you all the information so you you're aware of what we've got going on and i was meticulous that's why it's taken a long time to get to you because i want to talk to everybody because i didn't want you to come in here and me only have half the half of knowledge okay i want to make sure that you're the best [ __ ] possible so that's the way you have to do it i hope we can i hope we can leave his friends here and no matter what happens we're going to leave his friends understand that uh you know i want to do as fair as possible okay you did what she was asked to do and you can't do a half-assed job no i can't because then i'll get my my ass kicked too okay but you you did enlighten me on things that needs to be tightened up yeah you enlighten me you're right about that identifier you know it's just when something goes down that fast you don't think of that yeah i was thinking almost dying you know but jimmy i said no tricks pulled there man not at all so you know we're i think we're done you're ready to go then you know you're free to go am i allowed to have a copy of this when everything's done yeah you got a copy of everything you're gonna copy uh i don't know about the book you'll get a copy of uh at least your interview i'll give everything to the mayor and i don't want to share exactly because we you know we don't we typically do in-house stuff and also um i don't know if there's a public records request that has to be made for buckeye lake i'm not really sure how it's going to work you know because it's kind of funny i treated andy davis and annie would sit for hours and talk about business or he would meet his real estate people okay you shouldn't know what that should happen exactly you shouldn't exactly you know you're exactly right that's where it backs up to being a supervisor and being ahead of the department you want to be responsible so you gotta cut that the bad thing is is i done exactly what past chief has done and and the reason is cam the straw that broke the camel's back was this that's said to have 28 okay ron's at the office ron never shows up ron's on the phone getting a load for his semi from texas back to ohio i'd about get my ass kicked if it wasn't for tommy lucas coming in i had tased the guy no effect no effect we were going toe to toe and i tried to tase him again my taser broke went for tommy lucas coming in and laying down on the guy the guy was going to sit aside knocked him back back was on a set of steps and tommy come around the corner and just laid down on the guy and just laid there guy knocked it knocked the breath out of him we flipped him over the cuff ron never left that office because he was getting him a load another way to do business so i went to the mayor and said this is it i you know what i followed in that man's footsteps and that sucks i agree unfortunately yep and i see that you can't be friends with jay here and have jay do some your delegation work and not checking right yeah everything's got to be checked and rechecked sometimes check three times but i probably will not get the chance to do that because i guarantee you she's going to let me go i don't know i hope not that's on her yeah to her anything i can't suggest you anything all i can say is we know that there are some deficiencies that need to be tightened up no matter what she told jeff for mayton that you guys recommended immediate termination for him we didn't recommend anything during religion we said for here she asked us what would done here for that stuff and i said that would have been insubordination and that's termination here if you're in subordinate here you're terminated especially during a internal investigation you just can't do it it says right even you know that gary writes to you right same thing i mean you can't you cannot do that things are wrapping up the detectives are making it clear at this point that there aren't any criminal charges and that their job is really only to make a report this makes handsy a little overconfident just because this isn't a criminal investigation doesn't mean he will be able to avoid one altogether so um anything that she does that's completely on her right whatever her powers are that's between her absolutely zero to do with me you know anytime she's asking me a question what should i do about this i told her contact the solicitor all right because that's the only advice i can really give her contact the solicitor do it that way and and that's you know then you're covered yeah we didn't level in that game yeah that's really training yes that's a game that you know they won't play that game that's for them to play not for us you know we're the impartial gatherers of the information and that's it now i'll do a report i'll do a statement up and that'll be the information that i was told and that's it you know it's not an opinion it's not you know right my opinion to you you know is i try to give you some advice it's not really my opinion i guess i guess it is but that's to you you know from a police officer a police officer supervised for the supervisor you know that things could definitely be tightened up and i see that now i see that 100 right i see that and i agree with you and i and i'll probably start tightening them up tomorrow you know just do what you got to do jump through the hoops and see where you fall i mean you know i just i want you to leave here feeling like you had all the information and you do you have all the information i have everything all right the questioning is over and hansey is allowed to leave it ended on a positive note and he most likely thinks that this is the last he will ever hear about these accusations on may 8 2018 hansey was removed from office by the village council mayor peggy a wells filed 22 administrative counts against hansi following an internal affairs investigation conducted by the pataskala division of police and in the course of their investigation it was discovered that hansi abused his access to the law enforcement automated database system which is a fifth degree felony if convicted hansi could be sentenced to a prison term of six to twelve months and be fined up to twenty five hundred dollars

Channel: Stranger Stories

Views: 1,090,566

Keywords: true crime, crime psychology, stranger stories, full interrogation, police interrogations, jcs, jcs inspired, crime, psychology, police, footage, true crime documentary, forensic psychology, crime documentary, documentary, investigation, criminal psychology, interrogation, short documentary, interrogation of chief of police, chief of police interrogation, james hanzey crime, james hanzey, police interrogation, interrogation of a cop, cop caught, police caught, police chief

Id: sL2HBGe9ZjM

Length: 111min 13sec (6673 seconds)

Published: Mon Feb 21 2022