The Future is Real-time | Unreal Engine 5, Blender, & the shifting landscape of motion graphics.

[Music] yo what's going on guys I'm like from Oh box and in this video we're gonna be talking about the revolution that is real-time rendering in motion graphics so real-time rendering has been going on for a long time in video games and it's now making a major push into motion graphics visual effects and post-production so today I have with me Johnathan winbush he posts tutorials on YouTube of Unreal Engine 4 so there's a lot of really cool insights that we're gonna get from Jonathan so Jonathan thank you so much for joining us today yeah thank you for having me I appreciate it you know without going through this trailer frame by frame I mean the first thing that comes to mind to me is it looks really great but it does remind me of some stuff that they had posted about a year ago running on an unreal unreal engine for which you know I don't know how many of the improvements are mostly film or video games but it didn't seem like the the one from a couple years ago from quick soul really made as big of a splash as this one so I did see a question on Twitter from a well-known artist who had said you know how does this thing run on a PS 5 but cinema 4d can't and he actually didn't know why so I did some research and you can correct me if I'm wrong but one of the things that I found is that the way a video game engine renders things is it kind of like cheats its way to make it look real whereas something like cinema 4d or blender will use like actual physical properties of you know like ray tracing to actually physically produce the image more accurately is that true kind of true like I know you're asking before about cinema 4d and blender being physically based unreal is actually physically based as well but there's used PBR textures and it's a vast improvements for this rate tracing technology but the reason in particular that the Unruh with the Unreal Engine 5 trailer ran so smoothly is because unlike the PlayStation 5 and an Xbox serie X the new consoles that are coming out the SSD drive in there are way beyond anything that we have available to us right now and so what I was reading was a big part of that demo being able to place us is because of the SSD technology that's available in that was built specifically for the PlayStation 5 but that's not to say that Unreal Engine 4 in this current state it still runs pretty fast like I'm using it for motion graphics now and the big difference is when you optimize your scene and Unreal Engine you can actually pull a lot out of it and another thing is I think that the decoding and unreal is fairly newer than like your cinema 40 like I know the court code in cinema 40 dates back maybe decades and so you're getting bottleneck by that as well and so it's the same thing with like Autodesk with Mario 3d max I mean those programs date back several decades and it's not like they actually took that code every relative from scratch to work on current day Hardware it's like they update it but it's you know it's still at the at the core that code is like decades year old another artist that I saw had posted a blender guru image you know he followed it tutorial film abundant guru and the guy that the artist is by the way like a fantastic artist so I guess he worked in another 3d program and he was he was learning blender and the render came out and it looks like completely photorealistic it looks absolutely amazing and it looked like a relatively simple render and I asked I said you know what was your system running and how long did it take to render that and he came back with like it's like an eighth GPU system with like two minutes per frame to render and you know I'm looking at the image and undoubtably it looks completely real but then I look at the qixels stuff and that also looks real is it worth it like is that even feasible for a regular person to download blender a free program with a single GPU to make something that looks that good when you have something like Unreal Engine that you could run that with a single GPU and have it look pretty good and it's rendering 60 frames per second potentially or 20 frames per second yeah me personally I think everybody should jump into unreal at some point like if you're if you're working in blender there's no reason why you can't take that same file bring it into unreal for rendering because like you said I mean it looks pretty good from out of unreal like if you would put the images side by side 90 percent of the time you wouldn't be able to tell which one was blender which one was unreal and so I honestly don't know like what the coding is like inside a blender I know they do have like their real-time render engine and blender I have no type of experience in and I have no experience with it I'm a cinema 4d artist but from what I've heard still unreal engine runs a lot faster and just throwing just on fidelity alone like you were saying with the quick slow stuff I think it looks pretty good like I mean just the stuff that I've been seen a lot of artists that I follow on art station you had never know that their stuff was rendered in unreal it looks that photo real like it made a lot of it looks pretty insane and like you say it's running at 60 fps so it's better smooth the more I'm learning about this it's like blender is easy right you could you could make a doughnut in you know two hours from scratch and the render will look like a doughnut you know it'd look really good but you know I'm thinking about doing animation and in the very little minor minor work that I've done is that I found that okay that it takes you know a minute to render this frame which is fine I've got a minute but now I'm rendering 25 frames per second 24 frames per second for you know a minute with their content and I notice there's flickering or weird aliasing problems where's unreal it's like oh just assuming you optimized the scene assuming you have the hardware that could run it you could be running let's say even if it's three frames per second you know you could see those types of things so those types of imperfections it seems like the turnaround time on an Unreal Engine scene you know it must be changing things so much for architects you know particular some filmmakers like it just seems you know why even use blender it you know I'm just trying to justify it and I can't find a way last year I'm SIGGRAPH the one guy I can't think of his name he's from capacity I don't know if you're familiar with that company but they they're actually like the leaders in cinema 4d to unreal like they're the first ones that I've seen actually do it and they were showing a case study on a project that they worked on for rocket League so what he said was they did other animations and everything is cinema 4d and even some texturing as well then they brought it into unreal and they were able to render it out from there and then a client came back with notes and they were able within like minutes to be able to take those notes play back in real time for the client to see like right there on a spot and they were able to make adjustments right there on a fly like it's pretty crazy and then you just render it out and you're good to go I mean just like in my experience working in TV like I was telling me before I do a lot of CG explainer videos and I came up against that same scenario that you did like I started off in octane it then moved on to rid ship but I would spend a whole night rendering like a 15-second scene wake up in the morning to composite in After Effects and find like fireflies or flickering or something wasn't right and then it's like at the total client like a I have to you know go back and make these changes or fixes real quick I won't have it to this afternoon and I'm running like three computers here and then I don't know if you saw my talked or I see for the alive I did all that in unreal engine that the title sequence that I worked on from Mac so on yeah look it looks awesome by the way thank you but it's like I was um Mathias over there the one that brought me onto the project he's like how long did this take you and I was like once I had my scenes built out I rendered the whole thing in literally like half a day and that gave me the flexibility to be more creative with it and so like I'm used to you know you build your scene render it next day compositing After Effects and then you build another scene like it's just me here by myself is so with unreal eyes able to take like all four scenes written ramada once and then kind of it gave me the flexibility to play around and you know get more creative and throw more stuff at it and then you have just render it out and be good to go it's like I didn't have to worry about rendering overnight and worrying about getting like Firefly flickers or anything of that nature and that machine only had 120 atti that I rendered it on I've heard that use case now I think you're the third person this week I've talked to who has had a case where somebody who's running in incident and Unreal Engine is able to provide dailies or revisions or whatever it is type of work that you do and at a rate that's way faster than if doing it in a different program yeah um that's a getting the curse not a Clank now they want unlimited revision yeah it's like oh you could play back that fast okay so you know you still want to space it out a little bit and not get their secret sauce away I mean one thing one thing that a hundred percent this this introduces is of course now with Mandalorian and I I attended an event in LA it's actually not in LA it was in Palm Springs called HPA and they're using like those LED walls that are connected up to the motion of the camera yeah yeah that updates the background kind of perspective wise and they were doing basically a talk on it and I mean that would be impossible to do in camera perspective changing with an LED back wall in something that wasn't real time so it definitely seems like all of the cheat codes that a game engine needs to make something look real yeah are starting to pile up to the point where it's almost getting to the point where it's indistinguishable from you know those standalone programs so at some point it will you know it'll be 99.9 percent of the way there right and I think we're getting there and with photogrammetry and these mega scans is it seems like that really helped close the gap it's suddenly you know to get something that looks real if you're starting out with something that is real then now we're just talking about you know just the render settings but basically in the way light operates in the scene which is crazy cuz I was um I was probably like one of the first persons to our first people to use mega skins like as soon as they made it available I signed up for it immediately because like I was telling you I do a lot of stuff for Discovery Channel which I'm doing a lot of CG explainer for outdoor stuff is so autos from photogrammetry like the grounds and the rocks and the tree stumps and all that stuff that really up my game a lot just in terms of how my stuff looked visually but I came into that same thing that always run into with the long render times so I don't want to keep coming back to that chair they put out before but once I saw them using the same assets that I'm using the cinema 4d and unreal and they're basically talking about like hey we're playing this back at real time I mean that just blew my mind because I knew how long it took to render that stuff in cinema 4d I guess the one thing that something like cinema 4d has or blender has is just the wealth of tutorials and lessons and experts and I think fundamentally the tools are easier to get started with then unreal you did share with me some some links to some lessons and I know some people in the film industry right now are working on some some lessons and you know one of the things that people don't really know about epic games is that they've hired so many people from ILM and other huge visual effects houses on their technology team and I think that's why we're starting to see so much now support and features for filmmakers it's like both the technologies now there and you know the people are there to make it happen and connect the dots so as somebody getting started today like let's say someone like me for example I've used a little bit of cinema 4d a little bit of blender would you say that it's important to learn all of them or would you say you know start with with cinema 4d start with Unreal Engine what would you think that somebody starting out should use yeah I would say start with your friend of Minos I mean there's no reason why you can't just poke around in unreal there's no reason why you can't because there's a lot of tools that are already in the marketplace but you always want to enter be in the end everything is gonna have to be built inside an outside project anyway is so your scenes that you're gonna be building they're gonna be built in blender they're gonna be built in cinema 4d and you're going to be taking your assets from those programs and bringing them into unreal so unreal it's like the final destination but you still have to be able to build your assets and other applications as well so it's still really good to have a good fundamental basis and a 3d program so whether it's cinema Maya 3d max blender it doesn't matter you still have to start off in this pro and those programs and bring those into unreal at some point so to me blood that that makes blender really interesting because again there are just so many tutorials on it and really the output that you get on blender is really great so I would imagine a world eventually where you know computer hardware then matches the software and things aren't taking days to render but definitely having that real time it's just in a thing epic actually sees the potential in blender last year I know epic games actually invested a lot of money into the blender community though I think they see that foundation there's because you know blenders free and real is free and so you know that's just gonna attract the channel artists to those two software's in general so made a ton of sense that Epic Games would say like hey we want to support your initiatives - and be able to really push this program even further because eventually those blender artists are going to start using unreal as well so I guess back to the photogrammetry thing just one last comments on that and I know that the quick Soleri is like expanded significantly but one of the there's something there's a little there's a particularly get from photogrammetry and it's a really good look but it it's not very diverse I feel like a lot of the stuff that comes out of of quick soul and these photogrammetry type mega scans is they all have us particularly to them and I can't pinpoint it where did you know what you know what I mean it's almost like everything kind of like starts looking the same yeah as I say it almost reminds me of this probably shows my age back but um when everybody was using shine and After Effects when that became like the new hot thing and everybody put the you know what I'm a right chopped code shouldn't the plug-in I don't know oh really I've only been using After Effects for maybe five years I would just go for mechanical engineering and I had this like idea for a video when I was in school and the way I had to make it was I had to learn After Effects so it's like the only reason why I learned After Effects and so no I don't know what what what shine is so trapcode they actually got bought out by red giant so they're the ones that make particular yeah you're familiar particular right that I am yeah okay so they had another program before that called shine and basically any type of volumetric light that you see coming from behind like letters or anything of that nature that was all done with this plug-in cars shine and everybody in the Hollywood was basically throwing his plugin on it to the point where it's just getting oversaturated like every movie trailer and every movie sequence had this shine plug-in and you could tell it has like a protector a particular look to it so it kind of reminds me of that it's like now everybody has access to make it scans everything is looking the same because everybody's just kind of throwing all these asses together throw some real good then they make lighting on them and then it's like yeah I call it a day you know no one's really put in like their own spin to it yeah you know part of it might be just a variety issue in the sense that you know when you're walking through the desert it's like no to rock looks the same none of them are totally the same like when you look far out when you look out into the distance you know there's a tonality to the entire environment you know whether it's the Red Rocks or whatever but individually there they're different and it might be that you know I don't know what it is but they all have a particularly I'm not saying it's bad I'm just saying it's like identifiable no especially with the PlayStation trailer like that they don't everything had that same hue of just reddish tan and it's obviously up to the artist to decide and figure out and put it together but to me like more isn't always just better and it seems like in that trailer they were trying to push the more aspect right yeah but it is a game or potentially a game in a running on a console whereas I think rebirth probably is a little bit more interesting it just felt more realistic maybe the the artists use more reference images that were you know it just felt more real or something but everything else that uses photogrammetry I just feel like it falls under that same category yeah I can't pinpoint it notice that a lot with the quitzel they like the stuff that quick so puts out themselves it always seems like they set like a bar that's over and beyond where like like a lot of other people are doing like you're saying the rebirth film it looked real because they were actually in Iceland shoot and all that stuff for their Magus Guinness library but while they were shooting that stuff they also took a ton of reference photos so that when they were building that cinematic title sequence we're not title sequence but that cinematic sequence they were able to actually go back and look at all the pictures they took in Iceland they kind of get that tonality to it so it felt that much more rich but the PlayStation 5 revealed that kind of felt more like it felt like uncharted or like Tomb Raider so and that's the type of audience that they're pretending to so I can see why they kind of went with that because uncharted enumerator of huge franchises so you're given that community something that it's really familiar with you know so I can see why they went with that for their demo but I mean it was still really impressive as somebody that plays a lot of video games everything that I saw in there I was really taken aback but I'm just excited to see how how I how I could utilize that tool simply but it seems like Unreal Engine 4 is gonna get me like 99% of the way there too right now yeah that technology's here now like you don't have to wait a year for it I feel like Unreal Engine 4 is already pretty good in itself yeah I agree I'm definitely gonna start learning it and I'm gonna be checking out your channel as well so anybody who wants to watch you should definitely go check out Jonathan's channel on YouTube you kind of how many videos you have up now maybe oh it's over a hundred and fifty yet this yeah you do a lot of unreal engine and cinema 4d type videos and that type of like concert visual type stuff you that was a great video yeah yeah I am I listened to a lot of I guess you could say like chill hop or synth wave type music when I'm working during the day on YouTube and the you ever look at this their stations like I'm trying to think like DJ cut man or game chops or choke ow they usually have like a loop that's playing with their music because it's more about the music that they have to have some visual there because it's YouTube de Soto usually take this like a 30-second loop and how about playing with the music so that kind of gave me the idea for that it's like oh you know that would be kind of cool to show people how to do that but not have to wait to render overnight be able to do that in unreal so they could just start cranking those out yeah I mean theoretically they could just create the the level and just hit play and just have it happen in real time yeah I mean suits now yeah I don't know if you seen that childish gambino concert he throw out in the desert no I didn't mean him it was um yeah I'll send you a link to it they actually did a case study on it but yet they had a giant dome out in the middle of the desert and everything there was rain at Unreal Engine so his concert graphics were able to change on a fly and they were kind of a way to interact with them and stuff like that I mean it's really crazy what they did like we've said you know a couple times so far it seems like real time is just the gap is shrunk is down to basically I don't want to say imperceivable difference but the gap has shrunk into a point where you know media Hollywood are using it as a tool obviously video games have been using it for a while and so not only can it replace or substitute some of the long form long render time applications but then it opens the door to something like the child just Gambino concert and you know many more interactive films imagine I mean obviously when they make a film like The Lion King they're not decorating the entire set per se maybe just where the cameras looking but you could have a film that you could actually walk around in and play in and something that's that's interesting with film this will be the last comment because this is like so off-topic now is you know with music and movies you can kind of like stringer that same emotional response that you got like everybody will remember where they were that feeling of being in the movie theater when they watch that it's their favorite movie maybe from the 90s whatever and I'm in games also can do that music can do that but imagine being able to then put on a VR headset and like enter that world and re-enter that world over time and being able to you know see in an experience that world it'll in a way that's completely different all in real time at a fidelity that is believable it's exciting and the James Cameron said he's been doing it now for the avatar movies he said that he's actually been working in VR with the real time I don't know if it's unreal but he was saying that's how he's setting up his shots for avatar like they have the world's built out so he could just that one like HTC vive it kind of walk around the world and set up all the camera angles that he wants to be able to play them back in visualize that in real time so that's how he's been shooting like Avatar 2 & 3 yeah that's kind of what they did with with the Lion King one of the other interesting aspects of this as well as adding in the camera shake from a real camera yeah you know you're actually moving the dynamic camera around and you know all of this new technology all of these new new things are of course gonna result in people having to learn these new stuff so the barrier to entry is still high even though it's free to learn and be able to do this but at least it's attainable for everyone but I guess the last comment I'll ask or the last question is if Unreal Engine becomes a not only a serious contender but like the main contender for this type of stuff will we see these third-party renderers adopt us or there would have to be like it's a whole infrastructure whole a whole new graphics engine to do a real-time renderer for maybe blender or cinema 4d or something like that do you see these companies making this this shift over or yeah if it's a too late funny enough a toy to people to make octane they're actually working on an octane growth timer in their engine right now you know actually you could use octane inside of Unreal Engine it's been available for about a year now I'm not sure how fast it runs because I haven't used octane in years so I haven't tried it and unreal yet but obviously are not obviously but I've heard that it's pretty good and what the recent update to I want to say octane twenty twenty point one I heard it's even better now and then the guys over at redshift they talked about it maybe a few months ago but they're working on rich ship RT which is rich of real-time so I think it's only inevitable that everybody starts aiming for that real-time bar the question is you know will they be able to match it match what they're doing elsewhere because it seems like a lot of the a lot of the the tech is the engine side of you know again culling or or level of detail models is that possible with the 3d render or will that will that require fundamental changes to the way cinema 4d or blender work I don't know yeah we'll see I mean there's a company out there called you render not sure if you've seen that render engine they've been plugging away at it for a couple of years now it's for cinema 4d it's still in beta and so it's not production ready yet but their host Bill is their render engine is real time so what you see is what you get and I know the other day they put out a tweet saying that they've added sss subsurface scattering to it so i mean that that render ingenuous looking pretty promising it that like i tried the demo last year and it was good but it wasn't you know it wasn't ready and it's nowhere near what Unreal Engine could do but I mean there's a lot of promise here for what's to come well it's really exciting I for one I'm gonna learn Unreal Engine and if you're trying to learn Unreal Engine you should definitely check out Jonathan's channel and follow him on Twitter so he's posting interesting stuff over there so well thank you so much for for stopping by to Chad and I probably sound like an idiot because I don't know anything about this stuff but you definitely know your way around this so I really appreciate every day I might sound like I know what I'm talking about but I'm still learning as well so we're all that nice to be all yeah all right cool well do you have anything that you want to plug yeah so um yeah like you were saying if you can't go to youtube and follow me youtube.com slash Jonathan Bush I'm doing a lot of cinema4d to Unreal Engine tutorials at the moment and then I'm also working on a training course for beginners with the guys over at McGrath comm called trading the unreal a motion graphics guide to Unreal Engine and so I'm going to be giving kind of like a breakdown of under all engine how you can navigate it easily and then I'll show later in the later chapters how you can integrate this stuff from cinema 40 into Unreal Engine is so I would say even people that have other 3d backgrounds could probably still benefit from it but that's something that I'm currently working on and then I'm going to be putting out some articles with the guys over at school of motion as well so there's some stuff to check out for as well well I'm definitely gonna be checking out your channel to check out some of the Unreal Engine videos I could definitely use some tutorials on that and if you're watching this video you should also check out the link down in the description just check out Jonathan's channel Jonathan thank you so much for hopping on and kind of walking through this with me and I think things are gonna start getting pretty interesting around here yeah it's about the e crazy [Music] [Applause] [Music]

Channel: MOBOX Graphics

Views: 17,185

Keywords: mobox, after effects, tutorial, vfx, motion graphics, after effects tutorial, motion graphics tutorial, ue5, ue4 tutorial, unreal engine 5, unreal engine 4, winbush, realtime rendeirng, real time rendering, realtime motion graphics, unreal engine vs blender, unreal engine vs cinema 4d, blender, cinema 4d

Id: dWGZokwmhl8

Length: 27min 46sec (1666 seconds)

Published: Wed Jun 10 2020