Survivorman | Bigfoot | British Columbia | Director's Commentary | Les Stroud | Todd Standing

welcome everybody you know what time it is so cheers ah it's director's commentary time in case you misread the title how about we just get right into it this is i believe the second or last time that i went out with todd stanning to shoot a bigfoot film more on him and that situation in a minute here we go let's just kick it off love this opening [Music] such a beautiful opening it's going to turn down but i'm going to leave it running this opening i worked with well my editors worked on it but as far as the actual footage but those were graphic holes left by the graphic designer guy named mike stanley he just he's really the best there is and this opening of his it's just beautiful it's all his idea everything just like wow you killed it dude here we go radium springs unbelievably beautiful there's british columbia where's that stunning landscape in western canada since the first days of exploration the stories of a big hairy ape living here have endured uh what am i looking for disclaimer yeah disclaimer uh it's a director's commentary yes i'm going to talk a lot get over it you want to watch the film without me talking uh go over to the other playlist it says survivorman bigfoot it's there right now you can watch the whole episode in fact maybe you should go do that go watch the whole episode then come back and watch this maybe on another night here we go they're not considered a myth by the local residents lots of jokes can be made about the loch ness monster unicorns and even ogopogo when you're filming a place like cannon in the mountains so why do i see cancers about susquehanna you can't live just stick to survive so beautiful i have no claim of seeing anything so why research a myth where all myths are rooted in some kind of meaning i'm not a bigfoot researcher i'm not even really a sasquatch enthusiast i'm just an outdoor adventurer and survival instructor and i've had my own experiences that have left me with questions and can you get that through your head so many of you that just really wanted me to stay doing what building shelters constantly want to see me build another shelter start another fire but the fire bow or a different method of fire starting i love doing that absolutely adore it and i've done it so many times for so many episodes uh but this was an offshoot and uh man just let me have my fun would you and i want to try and get the answers to those questions but along the way i've been asked a lot of questions now why didn't you do this why didn't you do that why don't you have cameras up on the apples why don't you have other cameras buried why don't you use this scent or that all right well that's what i'm doing it's going for broke it's as i call it the shotgun approach let's put everything out there and see what we got interesting yeah i forgot about it i'm watching this episode i haven't seen it in so long that it's going to be like oh yeah i forgot i did this and i think i think this is the episode where technologically speaking put a ton of stuff out so i could really get into that question right now let's watch it a bit more and then i'll get into why the technology why not the technology when it comes to trying to prove or disprove the legend of sasquatch the skeptics and the advocates alike must be willing to look at whatever evidence exists without blinders on they must be willing to accept if found to be indisputable certain pieces of evidence as fact of course it's just what those facts are that matter so ruling out human hoaxing and wildlife is imperative the problem for bigfoot advocates is that there is yet to be indisputable evidence there is yet to be found a smoking gun the problem for the skeptic is that the eyewitness accounts are increasing every year it's going to take forensic study to uncover the truth that's an interesting dilemma isn't it for the enthusiasts they don't have that smoking gun and for the skeptic there's so much anecdotal reference including before this became famous that it becomes hard to refute it all as widespread delusion widespread panic good band so we're left in this dilemma caught in the middle and that's all i do that's all i was doing really uh is saying okay let's let's just run that middle line between i need some proof and i hear what you're saying about your experience because it's right in the middle there's a crazy place to be what i really want to try this time is sort of going for broke and so i'm going to start by putting a camera right in here and have it pointing out all right let's get started i remember you know doing all this it's really nothing but a lens it doesn't make any sound that's the beauty of it but it also doesn't record anything it's got to be tethered to a recording unit and i've got to bury that because see and stop so this is one of those uh things within doing a documentary series like when you when you film a documentary series no matter what the subject matter is you want to really dig deep into that subject matter and hit these incredible points but along the way sometimes it takes some just a bit of inertia it takes takes a bit to get going and if you have a device if you will like say okay on this one we're going to explore all the technology it can be a little nervy because well what what are we going to do what are we going to do but before you know it you've got a pile of things you can do and when you start dealing with cameras you can get into all the technology i'm not a techie guys a techie guy guys i never have been a techie guy when i do music i love working with recording engineers i don't want i don't want to work pro tools on the logic audio don't like it uh and when i'm a filmmaker you know i i love to point the lens and make sure it's it's lit well and beautifully focused and all that but the technology behind a lot of the camera stuff i don't geek out on it i'm i'm more about the results and so when you have all of this techy stuff you can have a lot of fun with it work with a lot of people but you know you're going to get story results no matter what because the story is the process of trying to get to the cool eliminating all sounds and lights on hidden cameras will go a long way towards achieving a successful stealth approach that hatchet there that's actually a less drought designed camilla's hatchet um actually that one was more designed by rick the guy worked with the camillus and it's um it's funky looking but it's it's not a wooden hatchet it's it's uh it's too too i don't know what it is awkward maybe uh works well but it's a little awkward on the hands too uh as you can tell i don't really do much with i don't do anything with camillus anymore um yeah i should stop right there leave that subject matter alone okay so this is real simple it's set on motion detect so it will not record unless something moves in front of it and it can record at night in the dark it'll switch to infrared light on its own with because it's got little sensors what i want to do is just bury this whole thing so i've got the plastic container and hopefully if it has a light or it makes a sound well that won't be seen by anything that's the point i'll leave that little lens up there in the stump pointing this way the idea being that a sasquatch comes from the outer bush because he smells all the stuff going on down there with everything that we're setting up and walks right past this camera it's a long shot but it's worth it let's stir it up a little bit here and i'm going to put i've got to put something odd something different unique that wouldn't normally be up there so i have pure beaver caster scent [Music] this stuff stinks i'm going to put it in front of my first camera [Music] let's put the scent so this was an area that uh oh i've got a phone call i'll get right back to you [Music] okay i'm back and actually it's two days later so that phone call went on for a long time and then i had to go down to toronto after that because i'm actually the uh the host of a new podcast called uh deadly disasters and we did a six part series there's apparently another hundred to do but uh we're starting with the six part series where i host uh i just simply narrate uh this uh podcast about the deadliest disasters of uh in history sort of thing really interesting stuff anyway that's what i went to toronto for and now i am back here and ready to resume where i left off when that oh so rude phone call came in so let's put you there there you go and wardrobe change i'm in my pjs but most importantly drink change i was enjoying a lovely i can't remember if it was a barolo or coterone but now oh yeah shall we resume i believe we shall okay let's see where were you last i think you were somewhere right here pure beaver caster scent this stuff stinks okay so how do i make sure my editor can hear all this uh hopefully he can all right i'm right here we go i'm at 5 23. of course that doesn't help you luke never mind you can figure it out you're good at that i'm going to put it in front of my first camera have you ever smelled i always remember the scene from jeremiah johnson okay let's put a little bit of this time anything living here will be used to the smells so the idea is to change things up a bit and promote some curiosity right so that's a thing got it all over my fingers stuff that you'll hear uh bigfoot researchers talk about all the time is is that oh they all disagree i suppose at some point but in any event uh if such a species is out there you know it follows that they may be with their intelligence quite curious and so if you create a disturbance out in the forest it's something that may make them curious to come in and check out got to remember this was during a time where my own experience with the subject matter was still growing and the concept of putting out all kinds of technical uh bits of equipment to try to capture said species on camera seemed like a very realistic concept my opinion's changed since then but let's keep watching all right so that should stink up the place a bit and see if it gets any reaction for me bigfoot filmmaker doug highchick and i discussed this confuse and conquer idea where i'll set up nearly 30 different stations including pheromone chips audio recorders various cameras shotgun approaches dna collection traps but will all of this be enough to capture an image of something reported to be the most elusive being on the planet so here's the thought pheromone chip has some sort of strange and crazy attractant the apple as a kind of offering or bait musical instrument just because just you never know maybe someone won't play with it who knows i have no idea down below the audio recorder buried in the ground and then one step below that i've got a dna trap this is really about confusion here one thing i've avoided here is using an ir camera a camera with an infrared light so there's no constant beam or anything like that and i don't know will the apple actually bring something in with a pheromone chip drive something crazy when it gets here whatever it might be be it deer or elk or bear will it knock the musical instruments i don't the musical instrument i don't know but i've got recording device catching whatever sound is going to happen here but no camera however i've got a dna trap just set below here so if anything is going to happen to step on that area i'll get some dna ah the elusive dna did you know that if you research it enough you'll find that the concept of capturing sasquatch dna has been well not the concept but just actually doing it has been going on for a long time there it researched some of the stuff that jeff meldrum might speak about i mean there's a lot of stories of people gathering dna uh and even getting it actually david politis is really good with this and even getting information back you know where they say hey uh some university does a blind test on it and says you know what this seems to be you know 95 you know some sort of ape species or hominid uh and five percent something else kind of thing so so that's not going to happen if it's dna that's been gathered that comes from a bear or a moose or something like that and so where are these studies why doesn't anybody take it seriously well why doesn't anybody take the whole darn subject matter seriously this is the thing is that well i could go on and on for this one have there been sasquatch that had been killed apparently yes and more than one a number have there been sasquatch has there been dna gathered and tested and come back as we don't know what it is kind of answer quite a few times actually i mentioned guy uh the name of doug highcheck in there so doug was one of the first uh in this field uh when it comes to filmmaking about the subject matter so he did he was responsible for monster quest really nice guy great i thought monster quest was actually really well done now when i say for its time i don't mean that in an insulting way it's just that at that time what was necessary he did and he did really well we've gone on from them with new technology and so on and i will never forget the story that doug told me when we started uh going on this i said well what got you into it in the first place why why are you so into this and he told me this story and doug forgive me if i get it wrong but i'll just it's so i'm paraphrasing the whole story but he told me the story where he had gone up to i believe it was quebec northern quebec i believe it was a flying fishing trip and they landed in this remote spot in the middle of northern quebec so it's not like he went to you know topanga canyon or yosemite or some park where there might be hoaxers about kind of thing no he's in the middle of northern quebec canada and for for all you americans that's a long way north it's basically sub-arctic uh and he uh landed goes out in the beach and up there you gotta understand there are beaches that go on for miles up there oh they're beautiful i've walked them myself i've followed caribou tracks doug didn't follow caribou tracks he found massive as in you know the 19 to 22 inch range human footprints with a gate that that spanned you know six seven feet in distance between steps and he followed it for what i believe was one to two miles those tracks just walked along the beach and at some point he said he's following and following and then he got the most disturbing hair on the back of the neck creepy feeling that he could ever imagine and it was like everything in his body said turn around now don't keep going and and he did and that's what spurred him on to begin exploring and doing as i said some great film work uh well worth watching monster quest um uh on the subject matter so doug there you go hopefully i got the story right and still very proud of knowing you and still still very uh happy to say you did some of the best work there was so okay i'll leave that and i'm gonna press play again here but before i do that i think i'm going to run up and get my uh bluetooth speakers so my editor luke can hear this so he can cut this all together right now he's going to cut it right now and then and then when he uncuts it i'll be sitting right here again but this time with the bluetooth speaker ready luke cut and uncut wasn't that just magical got the bluetooth speaker let's put on some better sound and by the way speaking of sound if you are hearing strange kind of sound out here right now it's because there's a thunderstorm going on all around me so you're hearing rain and you probably hear some thunder as well okay let me see but what's it going to do there we go convince anyone there you go dna from an unknown primate species has already been gathered in washington state and largely ignored see i didn't lie ignored perhaps a combination of gathered evidence can be scrutinized scientifically so for this station i've done quite a number of things got the apple pheromone chip and this time i've set up a camera hopefully if something does get excited over either the apple or the pheromone chip the camera will catch it this time there's an absence of proven consistent methods so i'm setting each station up a little different from the last a camera here an audio recorder there with bait without bait something's got to work each time what i really want to do is just get a little bit closer to something authentic something that just might work at the very least if it brings in a wolf or a fox or a grizzly then i know it's working and this is one of those times where i'm taking the next step let's see how he likes this little guy perfect call that my grouse cam let's put this guy here now i've still got to bury the recorder if it is just an eight i'll be an intelligent one and sooner or later we should be able to outwit it unless of course it's smarter than us all right so the significance of this particular setup is that i've got the grouse up there with a camera set all ready to go the wire runs all the way down the hill and the recorder's down there but look at this look at this see that behind me that was one of the first sasquatch structures that i was ever shown oh getting into the sasquatch sasquatch structure forgot all about that um so but i'll interrupt right now go on the uh the technology side of this it's as i said i'm just kind of throwing everything at the wall at this point right and uh i said something there i said if it is a an ape you know we should be able to capture footage that sort of thing i will jump ahead of this whole game and say the truth to me is if all it was or is is an ape really really really smart ape and that's what i think certain researchers uh rest in peace uh john binder gabe john bindernagel thinks i think jeff meldrum who believes very strongly as gigantopithecus uh i think we'd have one in a zoo absolutely there'd be a few stuffed around the world too so we have to give it more than that and that's why in many ways i think all of this technology is a bit of folly because uh i don't think they're anything that's that intelligent and that well adapted to the wilderness is going to be fooled by a stuffed grouse with a camera in its chest that's what i think now but you never know so i basically just violated their main area let's see how they like that maybe they'll take it all out on the grass and that interesting i forgot i said that so i said violated their main area lots of stories in history of well there's a cabin here in ontario i'm in ontario canada right now and um that has been destroyed it's become famous and of course the owner as far as i've heard is that the owner charges you like 10 000 bucks if you want to go visit this cabin kind of thing i don't know i could be wrong about that but i've heard that uh so but you know they've done everything they can and i guess rocks have been thrown at it while people stayed there and then it gets destroyed but not by a bear kind of thing so i guess if this species is exists and is in nature well look at it this way there's all kinds of humans aren't there so if they're roughly speaking or somewhere between 30 and 130 000 of these things hiding out in nature responsible for all of this anecdotal reverence they're going to have different personalities aren't they and that's where i think we get the different stories from uh past indigenous cultures first nations and that is some of them are quite friendly and helpful even with communication and others are are uh not maybe not necessarily malevolent but uh dangerous and there have been you know killings and kidnappings kind of thing if you're watching this right now and you got this far then you're probably into it so i don't need to say this but if you're watching it and you're like i think this is all a bunch of crap well you should probably stop watching actually but uh just for your sake just understand that a lot of these things i reference and talk about we're not talking about one or two things here we're talking about thousands of anecdotes tens of thousands of anecdotal references by hundreds of cultures and and tens of thousands of people okay so get over it it's not talking about the boogeyman or one thing or santa claus we're talking about something that as a phenomenon is widespread and also around the world so i don't know why i felt like saying that right now but i did so here we go let's keep watching i wonder whose music that is it's vital for me it's either peter or ian events in the area that i can even if i think i already know what it is or isn't and casting tracks is a big part of sasquatch researchers methodology all this is here is hairspray it helps to lock things in place there hydrocal is an inexpensive and easy substance to work with for casting tracks i'm actually going to uh be doing a full instructional piece on how to properly cast tracks i don't really do it here it's not that difficult but there are tricks to it in fact i have a friend of mine who is a potter who's really good at it as well he has some tricks that that only an artist can really know so i'm going to be doing an instructional piece on how to cast tracks in the wild on the hopes that one day you may have a big ass human footprint or human-like footprint somewhere way out in the wilderness that's not a hoax let's keep going here for a few hours we're good to go [Music] but are they sasquatch tracks it's too easy to make mistakes and even easier to make wishful assumptions just washing off these casted bear tracks to get a better look at them they really are massive oh look at that that's huge there's my hand hang on [Music] you know what i just realized i don't have that track anymore i wonder where that went because i was looking for it i have this one so this is grizzly bear check that out so and i think i casted this at the same spot in fact i can see it in behind on the sand this track so i still have them i don't know where that little one went that's really disappointing huh nobody stole it but what's this one here oh just purported to be an actual bigfoot track how about that eh this is a famous one uh that i received from dr jeff meldrum look at the size of that i know if you're not into this you're going that's just fake maybe it is but what if it isn't that's a grizzly bear track now this one here is the one that's really important to me now watch this look at that now doesn't that look like a bigfoot track the reason being is that what has happened here is the bear walks in his own tracks and it can create a bit of an optical illusion and look like a bigfoot track see here's where he stepped once but then he followed it by stepping again here put them all together and look at that but if that got messed up if that got messed up by rain that people can be fooled by tracks when they see them and they say no it was huge it was you know what's up 14 15 inches long and it ends up looking like that so and and if it gets muddy or something else steps in it and smudges it or rain uh anything like that and smudges it and it could shape it into a track that you think is a massive human track because of the bear's morphology but that is much different than that see what i'm saying one two three it's part of my job to push the bigfoot enthusiasts and researchers out of their own comfort zones for years most of them have sat on what they believe and claim to be real evidence and proof of the existence of bigfoot and though i enter their areas of research with respect for their methods i bring with me my own set of challenges to their notions todd stanning considered to be one of the most controversial researchers in the field of study has no issue with accepting any challenge i throw at him oh it's a taunt i didn't i wasn't sure if he was in this one or not oh yeah i was gonna i was gonna talk about him wasn't i let's watch it a little bit and then i and then i will including returning to places of todd and i terror just heading out into the bush here spend some time in an area that todd is no stranger to that's a spot where he had one of his most significant and horrifying experiences heading out to the rock where he was surrounded by sasquatch and all he had really was a little camera and some flares and he has been back there since and here we go so this is todd's original footage [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] [Music] and that was right here right here by this so that footage interesting i i don't i'm not sure if uh todd has put that out there or not um working with them we're able to use it for this series well could it be fake of course could be fake anything could be faked i guess you have to come back to what is somebody willing to do to fake and hoax these situations what's the motivation you know did did roger patterson have motivation to fake his famous film from what was it was it 67 67 i think uh yeah sure because he was trying to make a film he had motivation just todd standing at motivation yeah he'd like to be known as the the sasquatch guru guy he's got motivation but what drives someone to even get to that point if that is the situation there has to be some kind of experience happening i've had so many crazy experiences out there that's why i just still find the phenomenon interesting and do these films and now do these directors commentaries so we can talk about and go a little go next level talk a little bit further but that particular stuff with todd i mean you can hear the bleeping out of all the swearing i have a hard time calling fake on that because i do hear a real true sense of desperation in his voice there the constant swearing for example uh i think if he was faking it he wouldn't he wouldn't put in swearing you know what i'm saying like i think if somebody was faking something like that to be like ah yeah get out of here yeah which he did but then there's a lot of like you know he's swearing to himself a lot we had to bleep it all out uh and you could hear the fear in there or it's just really good acting right uh he at the time what he said there was that he was down to a fl he had a flare it was his last flare and that's what he's doing he's waving around this flare uh the growling could that have been dubbed in of course it could have been uh could it have been grizzly bears yes it could have been um so not sure what to do with it to be honest with you i know that so many of you get so upset when when the todd standing thing comes in i am not here to defend him not at all okay he may i've said this before he may very well have duped me and if he did good on him very few people could pull one over on me but if he did good on him uh but and i know people like to call him fraud standing and so on the reality with him is that he's in my opinion a challenging individual to communicate with to get along with this bothers a lot of people the last thing that anyone wants is for someone who's challenging to become cozy with so to speak to be right about something and to be in possession of some amazing footage nobody wants that you know i've said this before everybody's fearful that if you look at some of the clips he puts out there if they're if they're real they blow away everything else they truly do so people i think want them to be fake why why wouldn't they want them to be real because then they meet him they have their personality challenges of dealing with him whatever they might be and they say no no he's got to be he's got to be lying right so i'm someone who's been able to get along with most people and people know me like yeah right stroud just in terms of people i meet new people and in terms of if if i for example if i meet somebody and they're you know ego maniacal narcissist but i need them for something i know how to get along with them other people be like i have no time for that person whatsoever but i might need something from them i might want to get into a certain area if they happen to be sasquatch researchers uh believe me it's a field full of freaks honestly uh and so if i meet a particular sasquatch researcher and they're a freak and they're really difficult and to speak with and hang out with yeah but you know what if they're willing to just be open with me and get me into their area i'm willing to be incredibly open with them and say oh just just show me man i'm not here to judge uh and that's the thing uh whenever i go to so well that's a thing that i had to do with uh a person such as todd stanning was not judge him uh just say hey man show me what you got and that's how i ended up spending that time and i think many of you like stroud you just lost your credibility because of fraud standing well screw you you know what the reality is uh what do you got for me oh nothing well he's got a lot and even if he's lying i don't care i'm willing to go in and find out and at the end of three extended journeys with him out there i'm here to say that i can't say whether or not he's an absolute fraudulent liar or completely honest and telling the truth and just desperate to get the word out there and i can say that because i've had a lot of time with him you haven't you're just looking at a clip watching a few online speeches he might have given maybe one of his films and saying i don't like that guy and his stuff's all fake well you're making a judgment call knowing nothing so there you go there's my little thing on todd i'll say it again maybe in upcoming videos if i when we have him again when i do another one with him but uh i will say this uh i cannot verify anything he has or anything he says what i can say is that i also cannot disprove anything that he says or anything that he has uh and i will the only other point of defense i might make on his for him is to say that uh he's boots on the ground and you're not he spends weeks out there probably months he's obsessed with the situation obsessed with the phenomenon good on him you're not so who knows who knows in the end uh so that film footage there i don't know if it's real it's pretty freaking scary if it's faked though i guess uh he had time on his hands i don't really know and since that night todd has not ever returned to this rock at night this is it this is the first time and we're gonna sit it out here for number of hours and just uh see what happens and i don't know if it's a good thing or a bad thing but it's a full moon at the time of todd's encounter he had an older version cameron with a weak nightlight and the flare that was short-lived this time i don't want to make the same mistake now if only todd could have had a light like i do it would have made a big difference for him this infrared light that you're watching me with right now is just the onboard infrared with the camera if i turn on the extra one this is the mid-level it's really bright but look how far all of a sudden you can see behind me there's todd you can see up in the bush now if we bring into it this massive infrared light i still have that let me show you how this looks here you are with a regular camera light right here here it is with the mid-level and here it is with the spotlight and all of that's infrared what a difference so you can't see it with your naked eye it's important to understand that only the camera can see this imagery to the human eye it's still pitch black so if you're going to head out there you know go out with the best equipment you can afford because you don't want to come back and say i couldn't get the shot that's just embarrassing now it's argued in some circles that certain creatures potentially sasquatch can see the infrared lights i mean i can see these red lights right now that are making this todd doesn't agree with that he just feels that when they're off in the distance and you're shooting that infrared light they cannot see it and so the potential is there to get one caught on film because just like any biological being they're out in the dark they have their night vision but infrared is something different altogether even though recently it's been proved that caribou can see ultraviolet light but that's the other end of the spectrum that's a different thing altogether so we're going to sit here for a few hours i guess in some ways hope we don't get the same reaction todd got those years ago maybe something a little more gentle which is what we got stay tuned no yes did you hear that yeah that's not just the growl but you're throwing it something sounds like something was thrown something small nothing big there's another one yeah definitely that's something this is exactly how it started so this is where i will stop someone like todd and say so you see he said so we started hearing hearing something landing around us let's say like little pebbles kind of thing that could be acorns falling off a tree i mean there's so many things that it could be hang on let me just move you in a bit it looks like uh this rain is making you fog up how's that is that better that's a little a little misty right there on the lens i wonder what that's all about anyway what was i saying oh yeah it sounded like these little pebbles sort of thing landing around us which could be twigs it could be nothing this is where i will criticize someone like a todd stanton because his reaction is something's being thrown at us okay uh no not not yet not too soon to say now he said oh no i'm an expert i know this no i want better proof than that is still nothing's moving if something big made a sound we would hear it if something small made it sound we might miss it we gave a hoop before we came in given one hoop here it could be stuff just falling off the trees but already we've heard two little things up in behind me on this side of me sound like little little things being thrown that's what it sounds like out here that doesn't mean it is sitting out in the dark the nearby rapids drawn out much of the sounds this night yeah so that's one of the problems you can even hear the rapids are so loud we weren't far from the the creek so and it's just super loud in there but this little landing beside us uh again could be a caterpillar falling off the tree for all i know was something small physically tossed in our direction or did a little toad jump on a dry leaf assumptions can be dangerously misleading [Music] a few small things perhaps twigs fell from the trees close to where todd and i waited in the bush last night but that was all however i'm frustrated by todd's reaction to the same event or non-event depending on how you look at it his quote the next morning was that they threw rocks at us to me this is a gross misrepresentation of the reality normally i shoot todd or any other researcher down when i sense that bit of overzealousness but i let this one go and proceeded to head up to the top of the mountain my helicopter spend the night in what todd considers to be his greatest spot a sasquatch action yeah so that's what happened uh late we went down and um you know this isn't a survivor episode so i'm not alone with all of this he's got the crew in that so we went down and talked to the crew and while we were telling them what you know what what happened uh and i said if i remember correctly i don't think i'll ever forget this i said to i think it was my buddy max cameraman max atwood and i said you know what uh no it sounded like they were like little things were being tossed towards us you know or falling from the trees or something like that no that's not what i said here's what i said i said uh we heard a couple of sounds but it was nothing very significant and that's when he interrupted me and said said uh well i think it was pretty insignificant they were throwing rocks at us that's significant and i just kind of he said that to max and i just kind of let it go so okay that's exactly as i said there that's the kind of overzealousness that when you get involved with various sasquatch researchers that you start to experience it's like you know what i'll let you say it and i'm not going to challenge you on it because i want to keep working with you but you know it's kind of like duly noted you're exaggerating kind of thing we'll continue oh man you know what it's so sorry about the foggy lens here but it's so humid right now that that's what's happening so whatever mostly we're watching the show so sorry the true ruggedness of the mountains are winning death we can't find a single spot to land the helicopter yeah can't even get up there and climb this is actually the fun part of it all you know when you just start going up into the atv and putting boots on the ground and hiking up and i used to do that as a landscape survey or a lot it follows me for a short distance outside of rocky mountain house alberta i used to uh go in by atv and snowmobile and then finally boots and just to get up to do some land survey points way up in the mountains i love it or i choose to take a different route up the mountain than todd's so that my experience of being alone in what is claimed to be prolific bigfoot territory may be enhanced and let's remember todd claims it to be prolific bigfoot territory so yeah we split up we're uh far enough apart that we could probably hear each other whistle but can't see each other i guess i better bring you with me there is no traveling fast in the wilderness especially straight up hill the best thing is to think like an animal move slow just lumber along break often keep a nice even slow pace and that way if you do need to get out of something fast later you don't have to rely just on adrenaline you can have adrenaline and some reserve strength so i'm gonna go up this mountain a little bit at a time man was it ever steep um but i've done i found that out too even just working continuing to work with search and rescue operations uh down in the southern u.s you know it's not about being tough it's not about being strong and fast it's about endurance and going step by step by step and you do that you can climb a mountain i was part of a crew that found a 70 year old man uh had been lost for 19 days and that's how he ended up on the top of a mountainous area just a little step a little step just kept going he was 70 years old and he just kept going and that's the thing if you go slow and gentle you can go a very long ways wow it's gonna be a long day that shot is where i have to still climb up to bigfoot simply point to a print in the ground and demand an answer and that's reasonable skeptics say show me the body and that's also reasonable whatever it is it's a fact what it's a fact of is the unknown and even in the name of science we should at least be seeking an answer for it and that'll take effort including climbing mountains this was a heck of a time my cameras remain on and hidden and who knows what image they'll capture whatever it is it'll be evidence pointing to one conclusion or another i'm prepared to spend a couple of nights on the top of this mountain including one alone as an attempt to peek over to one side of the skeptical fence i normally sit upon well i made it all the way to the top to where we were last year as a fire pit oh yeah in terms of pure survival i forgot that uh this was i had been there before with todd in filming another episode up to the top but we uh and yeah we stayed overnight and we came back and that's why i said look i want to go up there but this time i want to stay there alone and it's pretty what it really what truthfully and factually is is heavy grisly territory but uh i wanted to stay there alone and no i did not have a gun with me uh i'm not i'm i probably had bear spray well uh this was so this is the night of todd going up there with me and then he'll leave later but if i wanted to be a sort of an elusive secretive species existing up here and let's say i caught salmon and ate out caught elk and ate elk deer small mammals picked a lot of roots eight pine needles and grasses and sedges and berries this is the place to do it no matter how much i lament the loss of prime beautiful and pristine habitat and i and i do the fact is there's also a lot of incredibly beautiful places and vast reaching areas where anything could survive this is one of those places you can't sit on the couch this location may be one of the most beautiful spots i've ever sat in my entire life it was just incredible it was the there was a valley this way and a valley that way and i was sitting right at the at the corner of it it was it was and there was no development only boots on the ground will make you realize just how big beautiful and vast the north american forests truly are up there is where todd calls the forbidden zone the area where he refused to go down here is his spot up there is their spot is what he said but uh he's agreed with me that this year we can push the envelope and push into that territory just know that something like that is an arbitrary decision to make todd just arbitrarily decided oh i'm going to leave you that area and his belief system and connection to uh this phenomenon is to say hey you know i'm going to leave you alone in that area so it's as i say it's a kind of an arbitrary philosophical perspective to take someone else might think that's just silly someone else might think it's very respectful i don't know but i thought well let's let's break that barrier this time so i'm not gonna wait for him i'll take a little hike up there now a year ago i went easy on todd and his claims of bigfoot activity this time i'm pushing the envelope yeah i want proof boy that's beautiful up there yep so in this one and todd knew that this was more about leaving me alone to do my thing [Music] i'm at the top of a mountain in british columbia where a year earlier i heard something banging rocks together only feet from where i slept okay so i just heard the strangest sound it was like um someone taking a a couple of rocks and just banging them together really fast could have been an animal easily and then just like a sound something substantial just in the bush and we're talking about maybe 20 feet away from me but either way what i just heard was loud distinct i don't know what time it is but it's uh pre-dawn and i'm just gonna lie here and see what else happens yeah so that's what happened before this time todd will join me up here for a night and tomorrow night i'll stay alone sometimes i look back on this stuff and go what the heck was i thinking he said he doesn't go past this lock huh gotta cross the street sooner or later this was the higher ground on the mountain that todd had reserved for what he believes as a group of sasquatch he has refused to go here for fear of getting them angry or scaring him off so my act he believes would be an act of defiance to them by crossing the arbitrary barrier he himself established this time todd is good with my methods he said try anything after all he spent many years trying to convince the public of what he knows to be real and it's not working you know and my my thought is if i push the envelope and these things actually exist and they can kill me i'm taking a heck of a chance what if they don't exist at all well then i'm like well fine i'm just going to go do this because what's it matter they don't exist right so that's where i get into this whole sort of i'm just going to do it and see what happens and hope they like me if they exist boy this is really fogging up well sorry guys i can't do much about this fog ring that's happening but it's a director's commentary so chill out todd finally arrived about 40 minutes behind me and we proceeded to look at his new methods to try to catch dna evidence of a species known as giganopithecus it's fairly ingenious too using natural burrs glued to branches to catch hair for dna testing again how obsessed you have to be that he climbed the mountain before this week or whatever before or i don't i don't know when and glued burrs to trees to catch hair samples of sasquatch dna yeah that's all i'm gonna say all it takes is one oh those are hairs dude there's still one in there look at that those are definitely hairs yeah i can see it short very short the collecting of dna remains is one of the most controversial aspects of the phenomenon known as sasquatch on several occasions dna has been gathered and claimed by official university labs to be some kind of human ape hybrid later todd would test this small bit of hair and it turns out to be 95 human dna five percent unknown actually and i'll just say that he did if i remember correctly sent the hair in and um the university sent back the results and he showed me the paperwork on it so you see that's what happens is people are trying to do these dna testings and um but what do you do with that how do you convince anybody of anything and it's just i don't know it's one of those things where i expose as people always say until there's a dead body laying there they're just not going to believe it so i brought up a couple of the infrared trail cams so set them up todd is feeling frustrated with the rest of the world's progress and accepting the existence of what he believes is giganopithecus and this was before todd then tried to i don't know if he tried to sue the bc government or something like that but he tried to take them to court to get sasquatch listed on the endangered species list or something like that he did anyway but it it got thrown out because they're just not going to take that seriously a bipedal ape and so for the first time he's allowing me to put out cameras and audio devices in an effort to collect evidence these are combined with his usual methods of putting apples on the tree as gifts to entice something the apples are stuck well onto the tree at about 15 and 7 foot reaches with the hopes of ruling out sheep or bears unwilling to climb with the bait firmly in place we'll wait out the night about a hundred yards higher on the mountain with stories ranging from friendship to even fatal abductions all pointing to bigfoot it's only my strong sense of skepticism and my comfort level in the wilderness that enables me to be out here at all what i mean by that is what i was just saying earlier it's like well i mean if they don't exist what have i got to lose you know uh well your life man there's grizzlies out there i understand that but i'm also really really comfortable in the wilderness and really really comfortable dealing with wildlife and animals including bears so on the it doesn't exist side of things i'm good with whatever animals might be uh curious of me up there including uh grizzlies and and and cougars and black bears and what have you i'll know how to deal with that and if it does exist well i guess i'm trusting that they won't kill me most of what i expect to happen is nothing even that is an answer what's becoming more and more difficult for me as time and the research carries on is determining exactly what answer it is i'm looking for all right so yeah see this was at that phase where i'm still trying to figure this stuff out you know i'm just like this is getting weird you know and i think that's what was going on in my mind throughout filming this entire documentary series was this is getting weird and i really need to get to the bottom of a few things and stop and well not stop because i wasn't doing it to begin with but just avoid the zealousness of various researchers who are so zoned in on it sort of things go yeah okay well yeah but you know i want to know the truth behind it where's the proof where's the fact so and okay it takes me going out there fine i'll go out there and i'll experience it my whole life's like that so i've got a couple of things set up for the night just really in it's all in preparation of potential interaction with uh something that a lot of people claim it's called sasquatch bigfoot i've actually packed my stuff my gps satellite locator i've got my knife and bearbangers and things like that and my boots are in my sleeping bag and that harkens back to a story i heard of a trapper that was actually picked up sleeping bag and all and carried off and um kidnapped by a family of sasquatch this happened in 1924 but he didn't tell his story really in full so many years later and even swore the story uh before a judge as having been true he was kidnapped and held for a couple of days uh in a cave with a family sasquatch but because there had been activity happening a couple of nights before that that's what he did he had stuff with him inside his bag and he had also uh he well actually his backpack got picked up too so that so the sasquatch picked up him and his backpack and carried him for two or three hours off into the wilderness so according to his story me i got all my stuff with me yeah you do what you got to do last night was uneventful so my first order of the day is to head 100 yards down the mountain so last night was uneventful that's right if i remember correctly not much happened uh but i believe we went down to look at the the apples and see if anything took the apples that we stuck on the tree can't be dude i'm doing right there i'm breathing through my mouth that's something i do if i get legitimately nervous in the wilderness and i think like there's a there's a bear coming close or something like that i start i start breathing through my mouth i don't know why i do that i don't even know why i'm telling you that but i have to see this with my own eyes it's cause i was nervous when i saw this well the let me show you the disappointing part first camera fell that was only one of two alternatives i never not noticed the camera fell down but it doesn't when i just saw that shot of it now i realize it doesn't look like it fell down it looked like it was turned and then laying down so i know that i didn't get any shots because of that but either todd is indeed a masterful skillful hoaxer or something came in and took these apples pushed over the camera went up about 15 feet in the tree and took all the apples huh i don't know what to think anymore so todd slept about 75 yards away from me uh is it possible that he got up in the middle of the night and went over to the tree climbed the tree and took the apples off the room away climbed back down went back to his thing and slept yes that's possible because at some point i did fall asleep i was asleep but it's not really probable because he was still close enough that if he'd gotten up and made all that kind of a ruckus i would have likely heard him but again maybe he's an amazing hoaxer and he knew how to do that with such stealth that i didn't wake up but he wouldn't have known whether or not i was sleeping you know he would have had to guess is less asleep kind of thing and he would have had to not fall asleep himself maybe set a little a little alarm and go down and get rid of those apples but something took the apples overnight and something knocked the camera over and i believe when we look at the footage there's nothing of the camera even falling over so and i've got to spend my night out here alone the camera's not over if they didn't pick up that camera before they took these apples ah there's no way they picked up that camera first this is him being excited thinking that he got we got something on the camera when they went to get the apples but again he made a definitive statement there's no way they picked up the camera first they went in other words he's saying they went for the apples first it's gonna be on the camera but it's like hey don't don't make definitive statements of something you don't truly know i think we've got task watch footage on there i don't know i do i feel it see what i mean i think we have sasquatch footage on there i know i do i feel it right um sorry the card just died on this little camera i'm going to put another card in uh which i will do so right now i'm going to let this run while i put another ah there we go put another card in oh it's hot uh okay luke let her run now i'm nervous todd is clearly excited this is a man who's had to put up with a lot of controversy over the years a lot of a lot of claims of hoaxing and fraud and i've had a lot of people say look he's frauding you he's hoaxing you the hope and i suppose todd's dream is that that camera got shots before it fell over honestly this is the most significant experience i've had because the plausibility of todd going down there doing that is pretty low to be honest with you so taught to leave not too long from now we'll get another apple up on that tree put out some some power bars and then i'm here for the night alone and we'll see what happens i'll certainly be keeping my eyes and ears open i don't think tonight's gonna be night i'm gonna sleep a lot the camera images proved nothing either way it was likely knocked over by this little culprit a pica a kind of rodent but knowing this doesn't answer the question of what took the apples 15 feet up the tree [Music] after helping me put apples and chocolate bars back up in the tree todd will leave me alone on the mountaintop which at the very least will rule out any chance of him hoaxing me if something happens tonight [Music] when we first came on the site here i met it here long before todd did and i found these depressions in the ground that are pretty hard to explain uh other than potentially grizzly bear i think but a very big grizzly bear at that this track stood out you can see the indentations in the ground here are very heavy now it's potential that it was simply a rock that was here and the rock eventually came out of the ground this is a heavy heavy stamp in the ground and you know maybe this is now where suggestion can be very powerful but i can see the toe prints and todd came later and saw it and he thought of course knowing todd he absolutely said it's a big footprint and that's that's the danger being so absorbed in the subject matter on the other hand that's the benefit of being so absorbed in the subject matter if you go out looking for grizzly you'll find grizzly if you go out looking for elk you'll find out if you go out looking for sasquatch still think we had some of the best music going ironically the greatest argument is not between the skeptics and the believers it's among the bigfoot advocates themselves no one can agree on what it is that we are all trying to find here in radium springs british columbia todd stanley believes they are the long hidden offspring of a species of humanoid called giganopithecus he may be right and even though his own evidence is considered dubious and faked by many people we can't throw the baby out with the bathwater because whether todd is telling the truth or not the fact remains there are thousands of other people making the very same claim i think that's my point all along often is yeah i know so and so might be uh challenging i know so and so i don't know you know many people different individuals in this might be lying or faking or hoaxing but i just don't like to throw the baby out with the bathwater because i don't like to limit my possibilities you have to be of two minds out here the job at hand what is that filmmaker documentarian but i'm also a survival instructor and i know how dangerous it is out here and how one wrong step one missed beat could leave me in a very precarious situation just as it is when i'm out doing pure survival and i'm not on the hunt for bigfoot i've got to take real care make every step count monitor my food i don't know if i'm going to even make it down off this mountain so i've got to hold on to the food that i've got very little just be careful with it same thing for the water most importantly got to stay warm at night if nothing happens out here tonight that's what i'll say tomorrow morning nothing happened i thought i was going to be saying that this morning i truly thought i'd go down see all those apples on the tree and go well you know todd claims there's a couple of wood knocks sure whatever but instead i went down and all those apples were gone i can't explain that maybe a bird but i haven't seen any ravens or any of the sword come around at all anything that has been here has been little songbirds and one greyjay it's not going to carry off those three apples so what did and so now you know i want to remind that when it comes to the uh camera that camera is really sensitive i mean it dust would set off the trigger and so if i remember correctly later we looked at the footage and it was just nothing there was no footage camera was fine didn't malfunction at all and where's the footage you know if something knocked it over even it was what do they call them pikas you know or a squirrel of sorts uh knocked it over you get the tail and you get you know i've caught so much wildlife on trail cams there's always something you know the little claws little things going on and instead it's knocked over and there's no footage of that that's what's weird and the apples are gone and remember i had to stand on his shoulders to get up to put the apple in where i did now maybe he's an amazing climber and he just climbed up that tree and and took the apples off but i don't know if the camera fell over before the apples were taken then maybe an owl swooped in or an animal a little creature scroll did climb up and take the apples because the camera's now falling down so this time i make sure camera ain't going to fall what took the apples last night what banged rocks together here last year what has left suspicious looking tracks and hard packed ground maybe tonight i'll find out all right this is about halfway between where i am where the apples are you know that black shirt has been with me for about 20 years and as many or more adventures someone says oh yeah it's the same silly black shirt i wear wherever whenever i go in the wilderness now you get your favorites right what i've done is i've picked a sort of place of cover here and put up my second camera it should be filming me right now for now i've changed the card in the camera that was on the apples put up the apple two power bars move the camera bit so it's secure now and it won't fall over put a camera in here both are running now i'll come down later tonight do a couple of hoops maybe a wood knock and i'll leave my audio recorder somewhere around here as well just buried and hidden um for sound oh yeah and you know what i forgot the audio recorder so to this day it's still up there uh unfortunately that's litter i got to go back at some point and pick it up who knows what'll be on it but yeah i did forget it to get it the next day when i left after everything that's about to happen happens maybe that's understandable based on how the night turned out and then uh and then i gotta i gotta sit through the night on the top of this mountain i'm here to get the right bit of footage that might blow the lid off of this phenomenon or by my persistent search and coming up with nothing proving more that there is nothing out here in the first place all right apple's still in its place camera set up hopefully we'll work audio recorders in turned on go back up and tend my fire in this way being alone the top of the mountain i become the bait as the sun sets it's always the the most nervy part of any kind of time in the wilderness is as the sun setting because you know at that point okay now it's going to get dark and everything changes in the dark the whole idea about the fire is simple apparently sasquatch feel more comfortable because they can see you and you can't really see them so whenever i say apparently it's because i've had so many conversations and that's what different people say to me that they think they know but they think they know a lot of times nice big fire is when activity happens people say oh something came around it was standing on the edge in the darkness and it came in close or whatever and uh the um the fire seems to do the trick i'm staying outside tonight just because i want to i want to have a good clear view but um in other locations i'll stay inside a tent and see how that works as my night continues things get weird i see large strange lights over a distant mountain hovering in the sky if it was a jet it would have been five times bigger than the concorde four massive lights sat still and unmoving by the time i set up my camera they were gone i shrugged it off and tried to get some sleep here's a weird thing about that so yeah this was the first time i had any experience whatsoever that you might want to say oh it was a ufo you know but i saw these massive lights in the sky and they weren't moving it's kind of so big that you just wonder like does everybody seeing this kind of thing although i was out in the middle of nowhere but it seemed like they were so big that anybody from you know a town that was 50 70 miles away would still see them and they were there for almost 20 minutes so why didn't i film them i'm a filmmaker i'm a cameraman i should have filmed them do you know what didn't occur to me that's the weirdest thing i just sat there watching them and it never occurred to me to go and film them it was really weird why wouldn't i you know i i wouldn't that be amazing to get that on on camera i mean so putting some conjecture in there i mean it was like i was kind of hypnotized was too strong but certainly i was just zoned out finally when i went to go get the camera and i come back and they're gone strange strange strange maybe it's just an absolutely normal thing that um you know there's an explanation for it that's very in the real world uh but i don't have it all i know is i saw these big huge four round lights in the sky that were far away but massive who knows oh man i just had the most insane dream i fell asleep and uh fire got cold and i dreamt that a sad squatch came and was sitting on top of me and not letting me get up and it became super vivid just for that moment you know in between dream and awake where you think it's real i lit a big fire so to explain that well let me see if i explain it we've all had vivid dreams but this went beyond that it felt like a big set of buttocks holding me down while my head was completely engulfed inside the mummy sleeping bag i struggled to get my upper arm free and to pull my head out from the back at this point wide awake and still feeling trapped and the second i did get my face out of the bag the feeling disappeared perhaps just a quincean dream i can't dispute that but it sure didn't feel like one next morning things get even stranger so what i'm saying there is that i was lying on my left side and it felt like down around here there was somebody like imagine like your big brother sitting on you you can kind of feel buttocks sort of on you holding you in now i often sleep in my sleeping bag with it right over my head it's just a quirky thing that i do and i think it goes back to my childhood and so i was in the bag right and and kind of like this and trapped and my right arm was actually like i couldn't bring my right arm up and and i got more and more awake so it went from dreamscape to lucid dream to i'm awake and i still can't move when i finally wriggled myself so that i could do this with my sleeping bag it was like this it was like and it was gone right it was just i did that and the feeling left all i'm doing right now is telling you a true story as far as my brain can remember it i'm not even going to try to explain it because i can't oh boy well everything's gone the apple's gone power bars are gone yeah now i'd put uh power bars up there as well so there's apples and you know little travel power bars all right well turn around and look at the camera hope it's still up right and it is let's check the camera out all right everything's gone let's be clear here the camera was well positioned and it's still upright it's set to motion capture its dust would set it off if anything went up that tree a mouse or a squirrel or if an owl came in the odds of not getting it on that camera are are uh very slim okay let's see how many clips we've got here clips huh all right so there's nine clips on this camera and this time the apples were taken the camera did not fall over when i get below we'll find out who the culprit is [Music] probably still to this day craziest night i ever had out in the wilderness was that night the lights the feeling of being sat upon waking up to find out that that everything was taken off the tree let's watch the let's watch the footage let's establish the efficiency of the trail cams their motion triggered with about a half second delay but they're very sensitive here are a series of shots from the base of the mountain where they were set off by something quickly going through the field of vision even dust particles will trigger it to record now for some reason with nothing showing as having just run through the screen here is a recorded image of the apple in its place throughout the night in this first clip i've highlighted the apple with a light circle now did you see that the apple was well stuck on a branch pointing up and away from the ground so gravitational pull shouldn't have pulled it off but in the second clip it just disappears it just vanishes along with three chocolate bars i put on the other branches and nothing was caught on film no wind nothing nudging it the apples there the apple's gone you'd be hard-pressed to convince me that it just fell off or a bird knocked it off and it all happened so quickly that the camera didn't catch it no something else happened let's look at the two clips again in real time there's nothing to indicate what set off the camera into recording now there do you see that at the bottom so a little story about this that's the sound of the end of the gopro that was over there filming me for the other angle so let's just leave that off for now just me and you over here damn you go pro uh actually gopro battery okay so where was i um uh where the heck was i uh what was that oh let's watch it again in real time okay watch this this time watch now here it is blown up in real time and here it is in slow motion now let's freeze frame on the culprit what is that whatever it is it has to be big enough to make a large tree shake but here's the real rub that spot where you see it pop up is at least six feet high off the ground right see what i'm saying and the thing about it is i never saw that little thing in the bottom of the screen which conjecture has been that it looks kind of like the cone head of a large ape uh-huh that's what i'm saying i never saw that and one day uh when the edits being done on this show i believe it was graham uh one of my editors who who said oh les what do you want to do about you know that little that little thing that bumped you know bumped into the screen there you know showed up on the screen and i went what are you talking about what little thing because i mean i looked at this on the card but i never really noticed we're just looking down on a little laptop kind of thing those you know the the head that what head that popped up come here look so i went look and that's when we saw that so it was like seven eight months later that he showed me this and i knew that the apple had disappeared but that he showed me that that tree shook and it's you can see it's a substantial tree and a little thing in fact if i'm looking at you right now you can see it just comes up like that right just like that just like my knuckles are doing in similar shape too right and man we were all like whoa we're in the edit suite going oh man what is that right so i thought well we have to we have to show this in the show and uh let's see where else this goes i think this is the end [Music] the skeptic would say the apple somehow simply fell off its perch even though it was well stuck onto a branch and it triggered the camera but fell out of view once on the ground something came and took every last piece of it the missing chocolate bars well we'll have to ignore that for now the creature at the bottom left of the screen was either sheep on its hind legs the top of a grizzly bear who has no ears and left me alone just 100 yards away while i slept [Music] my dream of being sat on was just a coincidental dream the lights in the sky a very large gem the advocates would say it's bigfoot [Music] all right that's where we'll leave it so that night on the mountain i'll never forget as long as i live because i have things that happen there that i as you've heard now heard that i just can't really explain uh and i i challenge you to try to explain it to me uh and i think you'd probably potentially come up with some stuff that already has answers like no that's not the case or no that's not the case what i'd probably say uh and but i think that night on the mountain changed me it made me think there's something else going on here and i need to dig in deeper and it was all because of going up there that night and staying up there by myself and experiencing these weird things i mean it was kind of a you know triple play there right the uh the the lights in the sky the strange feeling of being sat on and then everything disappearing and only to find out seven months later that there's also a little tiny image caught on that camera uh just kind of put me in a different place saying okay i gotta i remember thinking okay i have to rethink what what i'm doing here and how i'm trying to research this phenomenon so it was a very important film in the series of survivor man bigfoot and uh thanks for joining me again for another director's commentary i will uh i will see you for another one soon you

Channel: Survivorman - Les Stroud

Views: 771,208

Keywords: Survivorman TV Series, Les Stroud, Survivorman, Survivorman Les Stroud, Survivorman TV Show, Survivorman TV, BIGFOOT, SASQUATCH, SURVIVORMAN BIGFOOT, TODD STANDING, BRITISH COLUMBIA, RADIUM SPRINGS

Id: V--ScK5hAts

Length: 87min 54sec (5274 seconds)

Published: Fri Jul 23 2021