>> Stephen: WELL,
CONGRATULATIONS ON THE PULITZER PRIZE. >> THANK YOU. I'M A LITTLE DAZED ABOUT IT. I'M RELIEVED THE STORY GOT OUT. WHEN I LOFT TALKED TO YOU I WAS
STILL VERY MUCH EMBATTLED AND CRANKOUTH STORIES. >> Stephen: RIGHT, THE LAST
TIME WE TALKED I THINK YOU WERE ABOUT TO PUT OUT THE ARTICLE
ABOUT WHAT HARVEY WEINSTEIN AND HIS LAWYER DID TO SUPPRESS
STORIES. >> WANT FORMER MASAD AGENTS ON
MY TAIL. THAT WAS EXCITING. >> Stephen: WAS THAT SORT OF
INVOLVED IN THE "CATCH AND KILL" SORT OF A "PULP MEDIA" CATCH THE
STORY AND NEVER PRINT IT? >> THE LINK BETWEEN THE
WEINSTEIN STORIES I WAS WORKING ON THE TRUMP STORIES I HAVE
BROKEN SINCE IS VERY DIRECT, IN THE SAME THEY WERE USING THE
SAME INTERMEDIARIES-- A.M.I. BEING ONE, THAT PUBLISHING "THE
NATIONAL ENQUIRER." >> Stephen: WHICH IS THE
OPPOSITE OF THE FIRST AMENDMENT. <i>( LAUGHTER )
IT'S THE FREEDOM-- IT'S THE</i> FREEDOM OF NOT SPEECH. >> IT'S AN INTERESTING
PHENOMENON, WIELDED BY A SURPRISING NUMBER OF POWERFUL
PEOPLE THAT I THINK IT'S GOOD PEOPLE KNOW ABOUT. THERE COULD BE SERIOUS
RAMIFICATIONS IN TERMS OF ELECTION LAWS, BECAUSE THESE
WERE SECRET PAYMENTS TO KEEP STORIES QUIET DURING AN
ELECTION. >> Stephen: YOU ALSO GOT
ANOTHER BIG HONOR THIS WEEK. IT'S NOT JUST THE PULITZER. YOU WERE ALSO HONORED BY TAIRA
BANKS WHO SAID OF YOU, "THE MAN HAS LIPS. THE MAN HAS SMIZE. THE MAN SHOULD BE ON "CYCLE 25." THE MAN IS RONAN FARROW AND HE
IS BOTH BRILLIANT AND BEAUTIFUL. GET HIS BOOK." <i>( APPLAUSE ).</i> >> SURE. >> Stephen: YOU DO HAVE-- YOU
DO HAVE EXCELLENT, EXCELLENT LIP GAME. WHAT IS YOUR EMOLLIENT? DO YOU GO BLIFTEX? ARE WE TAKING SHEA BUTTER? >> ALL I CAN SAY IS I OWE MY
SMIZE TO THE BRAVE SOURCES WHO SPOKE. >> Stephen: NOBLE, EVEN WHEN
YOU'RE BEING SILLY. NOW, LET'S TALK ABOUT YOUR
LATEST-- BY THE WAY, I'M ABOUT TO TALK ABOUT THIS BOOK. WHEN DO YOU HAVE TIME TO DO
THIS? HOW DO YOU-- HOW DO YOU HAVE
TIME TO DO THESE ARTICLES WHICH HAVE TO BE TIME SPENCIVE BECAUSE
THEY'RIVELY RESEARCHED. THEY'RE SHORT. THEY'RE "NEW YORKER" ARTICLES. AND YOU'RE WRITING A NEW BOOK
"WAR ON PEACE: THE END OF DIPLOMACY AND THE DECLINE OF
AMERICAN INFLUENCE." WHEN DID YOU WRITE THIS? >> NOT A LOT OF SLEEP IN MY
LIFE, STEPHEN IN THE LAST THREE YEARS. ARIANA HUFFINGTON IS MAD AT ME. SHE'S GOT HER PRO-SLEEP
MOVEMENT. I'M TOLERATING IT NOW. LOOK, THERE WERE NIGHTS WHEN I
WAS WORKING ON THE STORY UNTIL 2:00 A.M. AT "THE NEW YORKER"
AND THEN GOING HOME AND TYPING UNTIL MY FINGERS BLED AND
TURNING IN A DRAFT OF A BOOK CHAPTER AT 10 A.M., AND THEN
COLLAPSING. IT'S NOT A HEALTHY LIFESTYLE. I WOULDN'T RECOMMEND IT WHILE
BEING ON THE RUN FROM FORMER MASAD AGENTS, BUT IT'S DONE NOW,
AND I'M VERY GRATEFUL FOR THAT. >> Stephen: WHAT IS THE WAR ON
PEACE? >> AMERICA IS UNDERGOING A
TRANSFORMATION RIGHT NOW. WE ARE DISMISSING OUR DIPLOMATS
AND OUR PEACEMAKERS AND NEGOTIATORS IN DROVES. AND ALL AROUND THE WORLD,
INSTEAD, WE'RE DOING THE WORK THAT THOSE NEGOTIATORS ONCE DID
THROUGH THE PENTAGON AND THE C.I.A. AND WHAT THAT MEANS IS, IN
EFFECT, IN CONFLICT AFTER CONFLICT, WE ARE BECOME A NATION
THAT SHOOTS FIRST AND ASKS QUESTIONS LATER, OR NOT AT ALL
IN SOME CASES. >> Stephen: SO, OKAY, WHAT
DOES THAT MEAN? HOW DOES THE DECLINE OF THE
STATE DEPARTMENT CREATE THE DECLINE OF AMERICAN INFLUENCE? BECAUSE A LOT OF PEOPLE BELIEVE
THAT AMERICAN INFLUENCE IS BECAUSE WE CAN PROJECT POWER,
THAT WE HAVE A MILITARY THAT IS BIGGER THAN THE NEXT NINE
MILITARIES COMBINED? AND WE CAN PARK ANY AIRCRAFT
CARRIER OFF THE SHORE OF ANY COUNTRY, RUSSIA AND CHINA
INCLUDED, AND SHUT DOWN THEIR AIR SPACE IN A DAY. >> AND THAT'S NOT UNTRUE. AND YONGE THERE'S A SANE PERSON
IN THIS BOOK OR ELSEWHERE THAT SAYS, YOU KNOW, WE SHOULDN'T
HAVE SIGNIFICANT MILITARY MIGHT. THE QUESTION IS OF THE BALANCE
BETWEEN THESE TWO PARTS OF OUR GOVERNMENT. AND, YOU KNOW, I TELL THE STORY
OF-- I WAS A JUNIOR STATE DEPARTMENT OFFICIAL IN
AFGHANISTAN. AND I SAW WHEN THE OBAMA
ADMINISTRATION REVIEWED WHAT THE HELL DO WE DO IN AFGHANISTAN? AND MY BOSS AT THE TIME, RICHARD
HOLBROOKE, WHO YOU KNEW -- >> Stephen: YES. >> THIS LARGER-THAN-LIFE VETERAN
DIPLOMAT WHO MADE PIECE IN BOSNIA, SPENT HIS LAST DAYS
DECRYING WHAT HE SAID WAS OVERTAKEN BY MILITARY THINKING. AND THERE ARE SENIOR OBAMA
ADMINISTRATION OFFICIALS SAYING WE WERE SNOWED BY A CULTURE OF
CELEBRITY GENERALS AND THE DIPLOMATS NEVER GOT INTO THE
ROOM. AND WHAT THAT MEANS IS YOU HAVE
A VERY SKEWED APPROACH TO PROBLEMS. INSTEAD OF A SYSTEM WHERE OUR
PEACEMAKERS AND NEGOTIATORS SPARE OUR BRAVE SERVICE MEN AND
WOMEN FROM GOING HEAD-LONG INTO CONFLICTS, THE FIRST SOLUTION IS
MILITARY. AND THAT'S A PROBLEM ALL OVER
THE WORLD. >> Stephen: BACK IN THE--
DENNIS KUCINICH, HAD CALLED FOR THE DEVELOPMENT OR CREATION OF
THE DEPARTMENT OF PEACE. AND WILLIE NELSON WAS A FAN OF
KUCINICH'S, AND I HAD RICHARD HOLBROOKE AND WILLY ON THE SAME
NIGHT-- HE WAS NO, A PEACE BETWEEN ME AND WILLY BECAUSE WE
HAD COMPETING ICE CREAM FLAVORS. AFTER SHOW THE WAS OVER AND THEY
SANG "ON THE ROAD AGAIN," HE SAID WHY DON'T YOU CREATE A
DEPARTMENT OF PEACE? DON'T WE NEED ONE? AND HOLBROOKE, WHO IS A VERY
TALL MAN, LOOKED DOWN AT WILLY AND SAID, "BILLY, WE HAVE ONE. IT'S CALLED THE STATE
DEPARTMENT, BUT IT HAS TO BULATIONED AS SUCH." <i>( APPLAUSE ).</i> >> THANK YOU FOR APPLAUDING
THAT. >> Stephen: HE'S A GREAT MAN
AND BELIEVED IN PEACE AND BELIEVED IN DIPLOMACY. >> IT'S A MISUNDERSTOOD
PROFESSION. I'M GLAWD RAISED THAT. >> Stephen: WHAT DO PEOPLE NOT
UNDERSTAND ABOUT THE STATE DEPARTMENT? BECAUSE I'M FASCINATED BY THESE
PEOPLE WHO DEDICATE THEIR LIVES TO THIS. >> SO OFTEN ON THE CAMPAIGN
TRAIL IT'S POLITICALLY EXPEDIENT TO JUST DENIGRATE OUR DIPLOMATS,
AND THERE'S THE IMAGE OF THE DUSTY BUREAUCRAT WHO DOESN'T GET
ANYTHING DONE. I WORKED AT THE STATE
DEPARTMENT, AND IT HAS PROBLEMS AND NEEDS REFORM. BUT WHAT'S HAPPENING NOW IS
WE'RE JUST THROWING IT OUT. WE'RE NOT REFORMING IT. AND I THINK WHAT UNDERPINS THAT,
STEPHEN, IS WE DO ALLOW THE DENIGRATION OF, THAT CONSIST OF
A LOT OF BRAVE PEOPLE WHO COULD MAKE A LOT MORE MONEY IN THE
PRIVATE SECTOR AND TAKE THEIR FAMILIES, AND MOVE THEM AROUND
THE WORLD, IN THE MOST DANGEROUS PLACES IN THE WORLD, AND THEY
DON'T GET WELCOMED HOME WITH TICKER TAPE PARADES. I THINK THERE IS A FUNDAMENTAL
LACK OF UNDERSTANDING OF JUST HOW IMPORTANT THESE PEOPLE ARE
AND HOW IMPORTANT WHAT THEY DO IS IN KEEPING US SAFE. >> Stephen: YOU TALKED TO
TILLERSON-- YOU TALKED TO EVERY FORMER SECRETARY OF STATE. WHAT DOES TILLERSON HAVE TO SAY
ABOUT WHAT SOME WOULD CALL THE DISMANTLING OF THE APPARATUS IN
THE STATE DEPARTMENT? >> HE'S MORE CANDID HERE-- AND
I'M VERY GRATEFUL TO HIM FOR THIS-- THAN HE HAS BEEN BEFORE
ON THE RECORD. IT'S ONE OF HIS LAST INTERVIEWS
IN HIS JOB. HE PUTS A LOT OF BLAMES TO THE
WHITE HOUSE. HE SAYS THEY WERE CUMBERSOME AND
IGNORED PIZ PLEAS TO FILL THE UNFILLED ROLES IN THE STATE
DEPARTMENT. WE HAVE ALL THESE EMBASSIES THAT
ARE JUST EMPTY NOW. AND HE ALSO SAID WHAT I THOUGHT
WAS A REALLY STARTLING THING IS THAT HE'S INEXPERIENCED. HE TALKED ABOUT DEFENDING THE
30% CUT IN THE STATE DEPARTMENT BUDGET IN HIS FIRST MONTHS ON
THE JOB AND JUST NOT KNOWING BETTER. THAT HE THOUGHT YOU COULD GO OUT
ON THE HILL AND SAY, "NO THANKS, I DON'T WANT MONEY," AND ASSUME
CONGRESS WILL GIVE YOU MORE. IT TURNS OUT CONGRESS DID TRY TO
ROLL BACK THESE CUTS AND NOT ACCEPT THESE CUTS. EVERY OTHER LIVING SECRETARY OF
STATE EXPRESSED SOME DEGREE OF ASTONISHMENT TO THAT DEGREE. >> Stephen: DID YOU TALK TO
POMPEO? >> POMPEO IS A QUESTION MARK IN
THIS BOOK. HE'S MORE HAWKISH THAN REX
TILLERSON. WE KNOW HE'S IN LOCKSTEP WITH
THE PRESIDENT ON THE IRAN DEAL. TILLERSON PUSHED BACK ON TRUMP'S
EFFORTS TO GET OUT OF THE IRAN DEAL. ALL EVIDENCES POINT TO HE WILL
BE MUCH MORE OF AN EXECUTIONER. SOME SEE HIM AS HAVING AN
OPPORTUNITY TO REVERSE THE NOSEDIVE THE STATE DEPARTMENT IS
IN. >> Stephen: WELL, THANKS FOR
WRITING THIS BOOK. PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW ABOUT THE
STATE DEPARTMENT AND WHAT'S HAPPENED TO AMERICAN DIPLOMACY. "WAR ON PEACE" IS AVAILABLE NOW. RONAN FARROW, EVERYBODY! WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK WITH A
PERFORMANCE BY GRACE VANDERWAAL. THANKS, MAN.
Are they dating or what???
Does he dye his hair? It doesn’t look right.
I can see why Lovett likes him so much
Ronan Farrow is Friend of the Pod #1.