Predator Realizes He's Going To Prison For Life

when a young Mennonite woman was found dead in Arizona he has it he has it let's go the police were desperate to discover why someone would take her several hours away from her home in New Mexico only to shoot her dead and dump her body little did they know that as they worked with the Mennonite Community to solve this terrible crime authorities would end up discovering a decade's worth of unsolved crimes all leading back to one depraved man get your hands up step away from them on February 22nd 2020 Cynthia Schultz was pleasantly spending her morning collecting firewood for her camp at the Sunset Crater national park around 20 miles from Flagstaff Arizona while out Cynthia spotted a woman lying face down in the dirt thinking something might be wrong she called out to the woman however when she didn't respond Cynthia had a horrifying Revelation the woman was dead Cynthia alerted the authorities and soon the area was swarmed with police trying to get to the bottom of this tragedy look checked her and okay Regent as a rigor mortis she's real stiff cold it was immediately clear to the detectives that this case was a homicide as the victim had a gunshot wound to the head and her hands were bound together with a duct tape as they inspected the body closer they noticed that the victim was wearing very modest and traditional clothes which made them suspect she might be a Mennonite Mennonites are a Christian denomination that practice a conservative lifestyle dedicating themselves to their religion and only using technology that's strictly necessary such as basic phones through forensic comparisons the police were able to identify the mysterious victim as 27 year old Sasha Krauss a Mennonite woman who had gone missing from New Mexico on January 18th over a month before she was discovered while police may have finally been able to give their victim a name it was now time to uncover her horrific story and find out that truth about how she ended up murdered in a national park nearly 300 miles from her home through interviews and investigation the police were able to determine that Sasha was a Sunday school teacher who had worked and lived on the lamp and light compound a Mennonite community in Farmington New Mexico on the night of her disappearance Sasha was making a quick late night stop by the Sunday School to finish an errand when she failed to come home that night Sasha's roommates alerted the community and the police were soon involved unfortunately the case had hit a dead end fairly soon after beginning and it seemed like Sasha had simply vanished Into Thin Air however not only did authorities now have Sasha's body they were also able to recover her phone a key piece of evidence that could likely Point them in the direction of their killer through phone records the police were able to deduce that Sasha hadn't just vanished she'd been kidnapped as her kidnapper drove her to Arizona Sasha's phone could be seen pinging off of Select phone towers before it died throughout her entire trip to Arizona there was only one other device pinging off of those same towers and it belonged to a man named Mark gooch Mark Gooch was an Airman working at Luke Air Force Base in Arizona and at first glance it appeared he had nothing in common with Sasha outside of his cell phone records nevertheless Lauren Nagel the lead detective on the case traveled to Luke Air Force Base and sat down with Mark for questioning detective Nagel introduces herself as detective Jones as she got married at some point between this interview and her appearance in court then um having a phone call right all right so I'm detective Jones I'm at the sheriff's office um I'm sure you're wondering what I want to chat with you about or so I'm about to fill you in um we just gotta go through some procedural stuff first the interview takes place in an interrogation room on Luke Air Force Base and is an ideal setup according to the Reed technique a popular method of interrogation there's no barrier between detective Nagel and Mark allowing her to observe all of his movements and non-verbal communication the walls appear to be bare which is intentional to minimize distractions it's also helpful that there's only one detective present which can make the interview feel less threatening additionally Marcus seated near the door which helps send the message that he's able to leave at any time this may make him less defensive and more likely to talk it can also help prevent any false imprisonment claims later detective Nagel and Mark speak briefly about his responsibilities as a mechanic in the Air Force before the detective asks about Mark's life back home so what'd you do before Air Force son I worked for the decent camping shop for about a year and did construction as well and grew up for dairy farms so oh yeah that's pretty cool do you have siblings yes ma'am six oh wow really yep okay big family tell me about them like how many brothers sisters uh three brothers and three sisters okay got it and where are they at now all over the country all over yes ma'am are you the youngest yes ma'am okay who would you say you're closest with I don't know we kind of got separated pretty good after and everybody started moving out so you're not close with any of them though I timed with them on the phone here and there but I'm probably the closest I've made my brother back in Wisconsin yo gotcha which brother is that it's Sam Sam Mark comes across as a polite well-mannered Airman but as we'll see over the course of the interview this is just a facade so what do you do on your time off um play my computer sometimes play some games you go hacking as much as possible but work on my car I like a lot too in here and try to stay just try to stay active cool do you like go to church or anything like that no man the church closed down oh that's close too coronavirus gotcha is that something that you did before it closed yes ma'am oh okay yes we know the attend church quite a bit okay if you don't mind me asking about that what kind of religion did you grow up in I grew up in a Christian uh Christian I guess the religion I guess is how you call it the Christianity is how it was raised oh okay any like specific denomination of Christianity no mainly they're called Mennonites they're Amish I'm not sure not really tell me about that but basically draw dark colored vehicles flip phones when you have internet stuff like that so it was pretty it was pretty uh sheltered it's pretty sheltered difficult I got it with this admission the police now have another unexpected link between Mark and Sasha they're both Mennonites when the detective brings up the topic of religion Mark starts to Fumble with his words indicating that the topic of religion may be something Mark doesn't want to talk about in that last six months have you traveled out of state anywhere yes ma'am when I came down here I drove my car from Wisconsin down here oh okay so you drive from Wisconsin to Phoenix correct anywhere else uh pretty much all stay Arizona I try to try to do as much hiking as possible Mark doesn't know it yet but he's just been caught in his first lie the first of many using words like pretty much mostly and similar sentiments are qualifiers and often throw up a red flag to detectives these words usually indicate half truths or that there's something the individual may not wish to disclose in this case mark saying that he pretty much stays in Arizona isn't true at all and he's hiding something very big he also uses filler sounds such as uh to delay answering so he has time to think about his response again you're probably wondering you know why I'm here so I'm a detective I'm with Coconino County Sheriff's Office okay and I am working a homicide investigation okay um this there was a girl named Sasha Kraus that was killed did you hear about that case I've seen it in the news yes ma'am tell me tell me what you know about the case uh it's basically the news report she was from in Mexico right and she left home I left home one evening and they found her in northern Arizona like Flagstaff area correct right right so that's the case that I'm working any idea now why I'd want to talk to you at all probably because I was probably traveling up in New Mexico area probably yeah that's exactly it as the detective reveals why she's here interviewing him Mark begins to show more and more signs that he may be hiding something when asked what he knows about Sasha krause's murder Mark vaguely says that they found her this is a soft way to describe something as violent as a homicide and they found her in northern Arizona when suspects shy away from using realistic words such as murdered or killed this can be a red flag for possible deception as they're minimizing the crime additionally Mark uses the qualifier probably three times in eight seconds probably because I was probably traveling up in New Mexico area probably so we've got these things called license plate readers okay and your vehicle hit a license plate reader in that in that area so tell me tell me about that you were traveling then you I'm a little confused because at first you said you hadn't tried but now did you go to New Mexico yes ma'am your vehicle was picked up on that License Plate Reader in the general area um on the same day actually that she went missing and so what I'm doing at this point is I gotta talk to everybody as you can imagine that's my job anybody who's in the area anybody who could have seen something despite the fact that Mark appears to be intentionally lying detective Nagel does a great job of calling him out for it while also remaining non-judgmental she does this in order to keep mark from feeling threatened and ending the interview while also not letting him get comfortable in any of the lies he tells the more someone repeats a lie the more confident they will become she also keeps them calm by not telling him the whole truth about why she's there although she's telling Mark that she's just interviewing everyone who got picked up on a certain License Plate Reader we know that Mark is actually her number one suspect and that he was found through phone records this is just one example of the ways detectives can lie during interviews in order to get a suspect to tell them the truth so why were you in New Mexico that day I was planning on going so I was checking on Mennonite churches I traveled up to Flagstaff Mark takes a big pause after he says he traveled followed by his foot twitching and then he says to Flagstaff I traveled up to Flagstaff this is something called a Cadence switch which is essentially A disruption in the flow and inflection of speech in an interrogation this can be seen as an indication of something being left out of a story is the speaker paused and changed their speech pattern I was hoping that ski resort was still open yeah they were closed due to coronavirus starting up and um so I figured I'd go check out on the night church up in that area so I knew some people from Wisconsin that used to live there and I wanted to go just attend this minute because I've really been missing that social life yeah I used to having my own churches is there any reason why you didn't tell me when I asked you if you've traveled you didn't mention that to me is there a reason you didn't I'm sorry my memory just I don't know as loud as it used to be entirely day I'm sorry for failing down today but okay I was not trying to hide or withhold information okay thanks once again Mark is caught in a lie while explaining why he was in New Mexico he mentions that he was wanting to go skiing however the ski resort he drove to the Arizona Snowbowl Ski Resort in Flagstaff was closed due to covid-19 restrictions in actuality the snowball didn't close for covet until March well after mark would have been there on January 18th as he says this he have shrugs with his right shoulder it's barely perceptible but lines up when he says I don't know internally he does know and is just making excuses but he's not confident in his memory excuse Mark is also sitting with his leg crossed in a way that creates a barrier between himself and the detective he switch to this guarded position after he was asked about traveling when questioned about why he didn't mention this trip earlier Mark's military formality helps him appear more truthful than he's actually being he refers to detective Nagel as ma'am and immediately apologizes for not mentioning the trip because he was tired unfortunately for Mark no matter how polite he is this Omission is definitely a sign that he has a reason to keep this trip a secret and the detective has certainly picked up on that dude do you remember that day then when he went to New Mexico foreign [Music] so what time about did you leave here at Luke Air Force Base uh probably left fairly early in the morning okay and then what time did you say I was in the area I I don't I have to go grab my I've got like the charts the paper okay what time well oops again let's we'll go through the day so when you say fairly early what does that mean to you I probably about seven okay seven minutes when I left to head up there stopped in Flagstaff for a while just got some uh I just stopped got some fuel I believe this is one of the last fully truthful statements Mark says while recounting his trip to New Mexico while he may think he's being sneaky with his lies detective Nagel knows a lot more than she's Lighting on and is ready to catch every lie Mark throws her way did you go anywhere else while you're in Flagstaff no no long way up uh yeah pretty much straight driving had a really pretty snow cat Mountain up there yeah that time so you stopped in Flagstaff you got gas and then you think that you drove directly to the church in Farmington I stopped in Farmington I had to get some fuel watch how the detective suddenly starts kicking her foot since this discussion is about the scene of the crime she likely feels a lot of pressure with these questions trying to make sure she gets his story and also has what she needs to confront him later with all of his deceptive Behavior already she's likely fairly certain that he is the person she's looking for and these are really the high-stakes questions about two o'clock in the afternoon I had swung by the church as a chapter of sign and see what kind of services was and they or anything I think it was just Sunday and Sunday evening at this point in the investigation detective Nagel has spent a lot of time at Sasha's Church looking for any sign of what happened to her on January 18th in her entire time there the detective has never seen any sign even somewhat similar to the one Mark is claiming to have checked did you like talk to anybody while you were there no no there was no one at the church and I didn't want to bother anybody did you like it I don't know is it a church that like like what you grew up in or different it was it looked fairly similar but it's just it's not really the same so I'll just I'm a little disappointed with the whole whole long drive and everything I didn't really see is working out long term and make it there yeah that is a long drive it'd be way too far to drive every weekend so I and so I got I talked to my friend you wanted to go hiking uh on Sunday and I really wanted to make it for that I work with him in the shop and who's that friend uh his name's carefully Mark claims that he made plans with kefley to go hiking the following day however according to kepley himself the two actually went to a swap meet also known as a flea market from what I'm understanding it doesn't sound like you were there very long no no and then where did you go after that trying to remember if I was going to go look for a hike or was that did I head straight back I think I started once he called me about the hike on Sunday I think I started heading back he called you correct while you were over there correct okay according to Mark kepley called him to discuss plans however the phone records disagree with Mark Mark and carefully only texted that day and in fact the only person that Mark spoke to on the phone was his brother Sam not only did Mark and Sam call but they actually called each other six times for a total of nearly two and a half hours which is longer than the two had talked on the phone for the last six months combined on the way back home did you stop anywhere I don't know I made a phoenix found a full-time camera I'd have to check okay so so am I understand it correctly you you don't remember stopping anymore no one is that fair to say yes okay do you remember what time you got back here in a home it was fairly light it was probably probably eight or nine o'clock yeah yep Mark makes a lot of lip and mouth movements here known as micro Expressions one of the biggest indicators of deception and hiding something is a movement called disappearing lips which Mark demonstrates once again Mark's account of the trip contradicts his phone records while he might say that he went straight home from New Mexico the records actually show him stopping in Sunset Crater national park for several hours with Mark having officially told his story about where he was on the day of Sasha's murder detective Nagel is noticing more and more red flags Mark consistently lies hesitates and supposedly struggles to recall information when he is asked about stops he made times and what he was doing at specific points throughout his trip when a suspect has a memory of extremes meaning their memory is either too good or too bad this is seen as a red flag to detectives just over two months have passed since January 18th so it doesn't make sense that Mark is struggling so much to recall basic information about his trip given that this trip was pretty out of the ordinary for him the trip should actually stick out in his mind even more what do you think should happen to the person that did that to Sasha 's like what do you get down there but if we caught the person who killed her what what should happen to them well you should probably uh probably love the law deal with him or maybe the 99 Community has has a way of doing things differently in the read technique this line of questioning is known as the punishment question and it can be a good indicator of deception individuals who give vague answers are more likely to be deceptive than those who answer with strong definitive punishments Mark pauses for an incredibly long time after being asked what he thinks should happen to Sasha's killer and he eventually settles on I don't know this is the exact type of vague answer that sets off alarm bells for detectives when it comes to the punishment question after a few more questions detective Nagel tells Mark that she's going to step out for just a few minutes to review her notes after letting Mark stew for 10 minutes detective Nagel comes back in and gets ready to really take Mark's story apart and figure out what exactly it is that he's lying about on the way back what time did you come back through the gate it was dark possibly eight or nine are probably later in that I'm not sure so if what's like a reasonable time frame so like you're saying around eight or nine like what's the latest you think you possibly came through that gate um probably could have been one or two eight or nine to one or two is probably the probably the most time frame that I can think of because it was dark what I came through it's kind of a big time frame there though 8 P.M to 2 A.M is pretty different I understand okay so you want to stick with that yes ma'am now that detective Nagel has informed mark his story doesn't add up it's likely that he's going to respond with even less specifics than he was before hence his six hour time span if Mark is adamant that he got home at 8pm but then video footage shows otherwise it will reflect badly on his credibility on the other hand if he admits that it was 2 A.M when he got home then there's a large chunk of time that's completely unaccounted for between Mark leaving the church and arriving home while Mark might be trying to avoid getting caught in a lie by avoiding specifics in actuality this just makes him even more suspicious so what if I told you that the time that you came in the gate that morning was 6 53 in the morning hmm but not guess it was that late that's a long time yes ma'am so how do you explain that I stopped and slept in the car on the way back I had trouble staying awake trying to stop and sleep multiple times but couldn't go to sleep it was cold okay I'm gonna drive back okay now Mark has to scramble to fill in the gaps that detective Nagel is pointing out Mark claimed he left at seven in the morning on January 18th and according to the detective's records he didn't get home until nearly that same time the following morning not only is this around 10 hours after the original time Mark gave for when he got home but it's almost five hours after the revised time he gave it's also highly suspicious that he has never mentioned this supposed nap he took in his car on the way home and it definitely comes across that Mark is doing anything he can to try and cover up his lies have you gone to Flagstaff any more than that one time no no except when I possibly when I came down from Wisconsin Duluth I remember which route I took come in okay so after that this New Mexico trip you have not gone back up to Flagstaff again is that right mark saying not to my knowledge doesn't make sense here because how could he travel somewhere without his knowledge this is a selective memory statement but in this situation it also just doesn't even fit with the statement and he would have been better off going with I'm not sure or I don't think so or some other selective memory statement he must be starting to really feel some anxiety about this because his thought processes are less logical and his word choices aren't great so I know that I know that you went back up to Flagstaff a couple days later um can I and I've got a couple different ways to confirm that like your gay checkouts and and evidence that you were up in Flagstaff so did you go back to Flagstaff for some reason a couple days later um possibly went for a drive wanted to go I don't remember when asked about going to Flagstaff again Mark hesitates for a long time before answering significant delays can be a red flag for deception some questions require thought so it would make sense for someone to stop and think before answering however it doesn't take this much thought to remember if you recently went to a town two hours away from where you live meaning that Mark's hesitation just comes off as suspicious clearly Mark isn't going to be truthful about what he was really up to on January 18th so detective Nagel changes gears and starts asking Mark Moore about his Mennonite connection to Sasha earlier when we were talking you mentioned how when you're not born into the better night church we use that word Outsider like you're kind of an outsider compared to like people who are born in um Sasha was like that too her family's not was not born to Mennonite Church um so I'm wondering if you're willing to kind of tell me I noticed you seemed I just saw a little bit of an emotion in you when I when we talked about that is there something that happened to you in the Mennonite church that upsets you not really it's just the way of life and I didn't really I didn't really like and I was happy to be out of it I'm not bearing such a church by stating not really he's denying anything happen to him but not strongly by using a qualifying statement instead of just saying no it suggests that there is something but he doesn't want to talk about it okay smart what I do for a living is talk to people understood and I I just feel like I can read people I know I don't know you I'm not going to even pretend I do but I just there's something there and you can is it just something you don't want to talk about something that happened that made you I guess leave the church no no I pretty much love to search with my parents decided to leave okay Mark uses another qualifier but what is more interesting are his lip movements it seems like his lip movements are his fidgeting behaviors but he's probably had some training about not showing anxiety both in the homie grew up in as well as in the military so he doesn't have a lot of the bigger non-verbal cues that we look for yet these lip movements which continue to return to the disappearing lips make it clear that he's withholding information it's almost like he's trying to hold in whatever it is he really wants to say while Mark may be playing it cool the detective knows he's hiding something before this interview even began detective Nagel was able to go through Mark's text messages and saw some concerning things regarding his views on Mennonites in a text conversation Mark and Sam are told by their brother Jacob a Virginia state trooper that he had just given two Mennonites a speeding ticket Mark and Sam are both Overjoyed to hear this and Mark even says that he hopes that Jacob treated the Mennonites like Sam makes a point of calling the Mennonites cultists giving some insight into how he and his brothers feel about the religion in another conversation between just Mark and Sam Mark tells Sam that his surveillance on the Arizona Mennonites that morning was boring the use of the word surveillance was incredibly alarming to authorities include them into the fact that he may have been planning some kind of attack on the community for quite a while we have a detective talking to Sam right now okay in Wisconsin okay and so I want you to know that for this main reason Sam's telling us and stuff and you're talking to me and I want to just make sure you know what what both you guys are telling us lines up and what I what I know a little bit about from what Sam said is sounds like something's going on here as far as like maybe you have hard feelings against the Mennonite church or maybe like a grudge or something like that so let me just right you're trying to you're talking the same right now huh so it sounds like I need to get a lawyer because you're trying to pin something on me well I read you your rights at the beginning of this yes ma'am um and I'd like to see it louder now you would like to speak with the lawyer yes ma'am okay so I'm not going to ask you any more questions then I am going to have you sit here for a few minutes and then I'm going to kind of explain to you what else is going on today okay yes ma'am okay you go without water correct all right detective Nagel is using a bit of the prisoners dilemma technique pinning one suspect against the other we see him do a big Anchor Point movement immediately after and his illustrators don't line up with his words as soon as the detective leaves the room Mark un barriers his legs detective Nagel's comments clearly struck a nerve with Mark and for the first time we see him change his reaction and become Stern he clearly doesn't like that his brother is also being interviewed perhaps Mark has good reason to fear that Sam will say too much to the cops as while Sam refused to answer the majority of questions during his brief interview he did say one thing that caught detective's attention not only did Sam claim that Mark had a grudge against Mennonites but when asked if he knew why the cops were questioning him Sam ominously replied no but that he knew his brother and how he is giving police even more reason to be suspicious of Mark with his interview concluded Mark was served several search warrants for his phone apartment and car all of which proved to be very enlightening to the authorities the first thing investigators noticed when looking at Mark's car was how spotless it was upon further inspection they were able to recover a receipt that showed Mark had gotten his car heavily detailed on February 23rd the day after it was announced to the public that Sasha's body had been found Additionally the police also discovered some black Nitro gloves in the car alongside some suspicious stains now the detectives are finally able to scour Mark's phone more inconsistencies begin to pop up according to his deletion records Marca deleted several files and documents from his Google account early in the morning of January 19th after returning home from his New Mexico trip he also deleted several texts with Sam where he discussed getting his car detailed stating that he wanted the detailers to clean the interior really well with several concerning if somewhat circumstantial things found in Mark's phone and car they had enough to detain him however police still didn't have enough evidence to actually connect Mark to Sasha's killing never mind justify an arrest and guarantee a conviction there was still the puzzling question of why as there was no clear motive why mark would have killed Sasha investigators soon began interviewing and interrogating the people closest to him in the hopes that they could shed some light on the case first they started with Alex golub Mark's good friend from basic training for the most part Alex said that Mark seemed completely normal throughout their friendship however there was one odd moment Alex mentioned that really stuck out to detectives has Mark ever talked about killing people to you no ma'am uh just the text that we we did have um we were gonna go spec ops together and we were kind of looking at attack B and he mentioned in one of the texts that um something like it would he'd be happy to get paid yeah exactly but I was just like oh I mean that's a kind of like your future it's just a weird thing to say so I was like oh this is huge fan also you know it's it's the enemy so I mean I'm not I don't really take it as like he's wanting to kill innocence it's more like the enemy okay these are exactly what you're referring to probably yeah the highlighted conversation between you guys yes ma'am is that what you're you were just talking about let's go attack B together yes ma'am do you have the one uh where it says he yes yes versus I would like to get paid to kill people and I don't have the next page but um from what I recall of that conversation you guys like you didn't say whoa man that's weird or you know you guys kind of just went on I think I just typed his name and all caps because that's what I I would always say okay if he said something just like strange while Alex laughed off Mark's comment there's no denying that it's concerning this text from Mark implies that he may have been harboring these sorts of morbid desires long before targeting Sasha it was all it was about respect too like one guy in our sister's class he had his feet up on the desk one day and uh Gooch was like oh you should probably get here you know get your feet off the desk and the the other dude made you know a snarky comment like oh you're telling me what to do kind of thing now yeah and I could tell that Gooch got pretty pretty mad at that I was like calm down okay from Alex's story about Mark we can see some indications that Mark May struggle with anger control the story is also indicative of excessive rigidity people who are very rigid when it comes to social rules May often get into confrontations with others because they can't cope with seeing any rule-breaking behaviors they deem inappropriate while this might seem contradictory at first given the accusations against Mark he may feel that the rules don't apply to him this is a trait typically found in individuals with anti-social personality disorder how do you remember Mark reacting to stress just stiff as a board very very disciplined never you know never screamed back never lost his cool kind of thing okay uh you'd see like you'd see his face get red but I thought he was just embarrassed Alex describes Mark as stiff as a board and mentions his face turning red these traits in conjunction with how we saw Mark acting during his interview could be signs that he's emotionally cut off this is another trait that's common among individuals with anti-social personality disorder and is tied to their overall lack of empathy while these few indicators certainly aren't enough to give Mark a full diagnosis they can give us some insight into how he might think as investigators question those around Mark they learned something very interesting that could blow this case wide open according to Kemper kepley Mark's best friend at Luke Air Force Base markets secretly kept a gun on base for several months however he'd recently given the gun to another friend to store off base detectives were quick to track this gun down and bring it in for testing which showed that it was the same caliber as the bullet that killed Sasha however while the police were in possession of Mark's gun the case took a turn none of the investigators were expecting I got a text just a few minutes ago from Sam Gooch that said Mark Gooch had said that I could help him out with his possessions the detective is fine with Kemper working with Sam to get some of Mark's belongings however he does have one request he starts asking about the gun that's what we want to know about [Applause] and don't like provide him any information that you know about the gun you can help them we're asking you not to do that within a week of this call with Kemper detectives were notified that Sam had reached out to Jeremiah Levesque the last person who had Mark's gun before it was given to the police while working with Jeremiah the police listened in on a phone call between him and Sam where Sam made plans to travel across state lines to Arizona in order to dispose of Mark's gun before the police could get it in the call Sam told Jeremiah considering what's going on if you're comfortable I would say get rid of the gun any way you deem fit um if not I will deal with it whenever I get there Jeremiah Was then able to arrange a meet-up point with Sam where they plan to trade Mark's gun however unbeknownst to Sam Jeremiah had been given a replica gun by the police and officers were going to be covertly hidden around the Meetup site waiting to make their arrest hey call it in my phone [Applause] Target is getting back in his car let's go go go let's get out of the car get off the car step out now get your hands up step away from the car step towards me turn away from me now get on your knees get on your knees put your hands behind your head passenger get out of the car passenger in the back get out of the car sting operation successful and Sam Gooch arrested it was time for the detectives to find out why Sam was so set on disposing of Mark's gun detective Troy short was sent in to interrogate Sam and he was immediately met with resistance you want to start from the beginning and kind of I believe you think I know more than I do and uh so explain what that means you know what I mean if I know more than you do help me understand that I don't think this is going to be the conversation for men and I do you want to tell me about tonight yes sir okay if you want to tell me why you guys can eat halfway across the country to pick up a gun yes sir okay do you understand why you're here in the room yes sir here's the deal say am I a part of me even feels bad right now because like I told you back in Wisconsin that you weren't a focus you weren't a suspect and now because of some bad choices you're in some serious trouble not as serious as Mark by any means you know what I mean he's in some serious serious trouble and I try to explain that to you back there is anything you can do to help yourself right now or help yourself out of this mess or as much I would like to I frankly do not believe you have my best interest in mind okay and I do not think discussing this with you would be helpful while Sam may be refusing to give the detective the answers he's looking for he has yet to actually invoke his Miranda rights whether or not Sam knows this refusing to answer a line of questioning is not enough to stop an interrogation and get a lawyer we can see that Sam is being very cautious and how he responds to detective short when he pauses to take a sip of water after being asked a question it's likely that he was doing this as a stalling tactic to allow himself time to carefully pick his words Sam appears to have some prior knowledge about interrogations as he is correct that the detective doesn't have the suspect's best interests in mind he appears reluctant to speak as he likely doesn't want to incriminate himself or his brother further by saying the wrong thing why did he call you for this extensive period of time on that specific day specific to the day that he's under arrest for murder you know what I mean extensive amount of phone calls that day for elaborate amount of time completely outside the norm of your guys's normal communication process why are you in Arizona why did you fly halfway across the country why did you obtain a new phone with a new phone number to do this why are you here picking up a gun that you know belongs to Mark if you don't know what he did then why would you do that you know what the election did okay I understand that so you know he allegedly worked with somebody correct okay so why are you picking up a gun that belonged to him specifically when I told you when I interviewed you back in Wisconsin do you know Mark has some guns and you're like nope I don't think he's allowed to have more babies you know what I mean yes sir so what's the deal I would like to collect all of our suggestions as possible if that gun is his possession I would like to collect that as well Sam refuses to tell the detective why he tried to dispose of Mark's gun but there are a few possible explanations Mark claimed that Sam was his closest brother it's possible that he called Sam and used their close relationship to convince Sam he had to get rid of the gun not because Mark killed someone but because police thought he did it's more than evident that Sam has a distrust of law enforcement so it would make sense for Mark to Prey Upon This Feeling in order to persuade his brother that if Sam didn't dispose of this weapon the police were going to frame Mark for something he didn't do his attender prosecution I mean there's two felonies in there like this is a big deal I don't think so what is next in this process the next part you go into jail okay the way I see it talking and discussing this with you you won't only use it against me to make these charges stick um and to further commit Mark since Sam clearly understands how his words could be used against him it's all that he's still agreeing to sit here rather than asking for an attorney or outright refusing to respond it's possible that his curiosity got the better of him and he wants to find out how much the detectives know about Mark's crime it's also possible that Sam is afraid and feels that if he at least agrees to sit in the interrogation room he may be able to dodge the consequences of having helped mark with Sam's interview at a stalemate the detectives are forced to look elsewhere for information throughout their entire investigation the one thing they haven't been able to deduce clearly is motive was this just a random killing or was there something more at play here while it's clear that Mark had some sort of grudge against Mennonites it made no sense that someone with no prior criminal history would suddenly plan an elaborate murder six hours away from their home and Target someone they'd never even heard of before at least that's what detective Nagel thought until she spoke with some Mennonites from Wisconsin and discovered that Mark's past wasn't quite as clean as it seemed in a phone interview with Mark's former Pastor James Luke Martin detective Nagel learned that no one at Mark's former church was surprised to learn that he'd now been arrested in connection with such a heinous crime as Mark had a reputation for taking revenge on others Market also allegedly been involved in several robberies at the church when the church tried to punish him for his involvement his parents stepped in and decided to leave the church for being too critical of Mark however this was not the end of Mark's criminal activities while living with his sister in Pennsylvania Mark was accused of stealing money from the local Mennonites soon after everyone who accused Mark of stealing money discovered that their car suspiciously stopped working after investigating further these Mennonites found that sand had been placed into the oil pans of their cars causing their engines to stop working while those affected weren't able to prove it was Mark who put the sand there it doesn't seem like a coincidence given his interest in mechanics and apparent taste for Revenge detective Nagel then spoke to Jonathan Martin the son of Mark's Pastor Who provided further examples of Mark getting caught stealing Jonathan even said that when he was angry mark would prowl around the Mennonite Community to see what he could find after speaking with Jonathan's son detective Nagel learned that Mark had allegedly robbed the Martin's Family Store however charges were never pressed due to the fact that the store security camera had its memory card stolen so there was never visual proof of Mark being the one who robbed the storm while there may not have been any evidence of Mark's involvement at the time of the robbery detective Nagel was able to actually find the security footage from that robbery on Mark's own phone and it showed a man with Mark's height and build robbing the storm in one of the photos a car that looked suspiciously like Marx could be seen in the background with these photos detective Nagel had what appeared to be tangible proof that these accusations against Mark weren't just hearsay eventually the detective got a hold of Jared Ulrich a man who claimed to be Mark's partner in crime in the past Jared openly confessed to detective Nagel about all the robberies he'd allegedly committed with Mark and he described in detail how Mark would try to frame other people in the community for their crimes there definitely seem to be evidence that Jared may have been telling the truth as a series of texts were found on Mark's phone all of which had been recently deleted in these texts Mark talked to Sam about Jared never understanding the real cost of getting caught Mark then asks Sam to remotely wipe Jared's phone something that he also asked Sam to do to his own phone after he fell under suspicion for Sasha's murder while all of this information against Mark was damning enough there was still one more disturbing truth to learn through many more interviews detective Nagel was eventually put in contact with Andrew and Galen headings a pair of brothers who were close with Mark during his time in Wisconsin Andrew recounted a time where he had confronted Mark for stealing and during their conversation Mark was soaked cold and bitter that Andrew said he feared for his life Galen had an even more disturbing Revelation for detective Nagel as he told her about Mark's alleged inappropriate actions towards women according to Galen Mark confessed to him that he'd allegedly assaulted a young girl his sister was babysitting when he was around 10 to 13 years old however this claim has never been publicly proven and there's no evidence of it being true still with this information it became clear that Mark always had the capacity to harm others and allegedly had many times in the past Mark's motive in harming Sasha was also more evident than ever all the unfounded anger and resentment he had towards the Mennonite Community had been steadily growing over the years and as it did Mark took his revenge against them further and further up to this point charges had never been pressed against Mark and he felt like he could outsmart anyone even the police with this misplaced confidence Mark decided to see if he could get away with the ultimate crime murder it appears that Mark had gone to the men and I community that day in search of a victim and tragically Sasha was in the wrong place at the wrong time Mark grabbed her from her car late at night and no one saw a thing still that didn't prevent him from getting caught unfortunately for him while no one had previously pressed any charges for his theft the State of Arizona was more than happy to charge Mark for Sasha's murder and put him on trial Mark's trial began on September 24 2021. in January of 2022 the jury found Mark guilty on charges of kidnapping and first-degree murder earning him a life sentence for his help in covering up Mark's crimes Sam Gooch pleaded guilty and received three years probation with both Sam and Mark dealt with Sasha Krauss and her family finally received the Justice they deserve

Channel: EXPLORE WITH US

Views: 4,010,532

Keywords: documentary, true crime documentary, educational, psychology, law, analysis

Id: YBBTfy29WKI

Length: 49min 6sec (2946 seconds)

Published: Sun May 07 2023