- I put my bones into them.
I make them gorgeous ladies, all of them. And I never mess with ugly ducklings. But I put my bones in
them so I teach them, I put it in and I bring
the best out of them. So they've all been great. Every one of them. But I didn't have a gang of them. You can't imagine from 63
all the way up to today? I can't be mad about nothing. - All right, Virgil,
Virgil, where are you from? Where'd you grow up? - I grew up in Fresno, California. - And tell me about your childhood. You had both your parents growing up? - Both of my parents
was around growing up. - Good childhood? - Great childhood - No, no terrible traumas or
abuse or anything like that. - None at all. What kind of role models
did you have as a kid? - Role models I had as a kid, if you go all the way back to childhood it was just little guys that
come up that I knew from kids. As remember my fathers my uncles
and people of that nature. But as I got older, often to high school it was pimps, players, Macs that I kinda was looking up
to as far as in my teen hood, you know? - And this was in Fresno. - Fresno, yeah. - What is the difference
between a pimp and a mac? - Difference between a pimp and a mac, a pimp is wanting to start
out from the bottom floor from the beginning. You start out being a player. You grow into be a pimp
because other guys just got prostitutes on the street. That's what everybody is
kinda affiliated with. And a Mac is one that really have got his game all the way together. He's the top pimp of everything,
when you become a Mac. Actually they call them a Mac daddy. But I don't even like the
word daddy I use the word Mac. That's why when you go all
the way back to the movie the Mac in the film, I know
you're kind of familiar with that, right? That's why the name it the Mac. Cause when you're pimping,
you have an elevated to being a Mac yet. - Understood. At what age were you when
you first got into it? - I was like 17, 16, 17. - And then you said you
had like role models? - Yeah, I had role models, I had an older girl that liked to me, was trying to take me out
of my home when I was a kid. She was a prostitute. She come to my mother and
asked her because she had, my mother told her no. So the girl and myself kinda
mess around for a lot of years. She used to give me money in there. You know, as a young kid
I didn't know anything about the game. You know, I just knew what she did. And she likened me all
those years, you know? So that's kinda how I
got my feet wet initially until I graduate and look
into the big giant players riding down the streets in
the brand new cars and stuff. - I've heard this from several pimps that, the girls sometimes choose you. - Oh yeah, no doubt. Rather than you, you intimidating them. And the classic idea of
you coerced or forced or whatever them into doing it. The girls come to you and
say, please do this for me. - Well, actually it's like
a trend back in the day. Nobody had any money. So, you know, where we all come from I don't care what they
say or how they see it. We didn't come from no whole lot of money. So anything for us getting
money a little easy for the woman, giving it to you, we're going to jump on that. Especially if women liked us. And I was one that all the women liked it. So that's kind of how I got my feet wet. - Yeah. And then you're, you
would have how many girls? - At what time? I used
to stay with six, seven deep consistently when I
was like 21, 22 years old. I was like six or seven deep, you know? But I was just really getting my feet wet just doing things that I
was taught as a youngster. See when I got into the life, I was like very, very young. And I had older players that
like 20 years older than me that took to me because I acted older. They liked how I carried myself and they kind of took me under their wing and just really fed me the
game from a professional way. So that's kind of how I've
got into the life, you know? So all the older
gentlemens, players, pimps, you know he called the pimps players, macs all that back in the day. But all the those wanted me to be better than what they there were. Out of all the youngsters coming up, they told me I was going to be the best. I don't know what they was
looking at, what they saw. I didn't have no
experience in life hauling. But I followed the steps of
what they said years ago. - What are the qualities
a pimp needs to, to excel? - You got to have personal style. You have to have your tools in order. You have to spread your wings like Batman. You know, you got to have a, if you don't know much you can't do much. Big game is played smooth out of sight. And the last thing if you don't
have a knowledge of really how this game go which a lot
of guys was getting taught by older players. Older players had more experience. So they would weave all
the young players out and shoot them to the left
and tell them something that I see a lot of players
is standing on today but really it was just something
to get them out of the way because they didn't see it. They were going to mess up the game. They didn't want to tell
them they wasn't ready. So they shot him to the
left and say all I do is drop the P, nothing else. I come up with some of
the most majors players in the country. I was there when we and the Ward brothers used to kick across the
table, sit around and kick it. Those my personal
friends, come to my house. I ride with them and everything. They all looked up to me
as a gentleman of leisure because I always handle my business. If you run out of game, you're going to run out of money. So you have to be taught right in this game in order to take this game to the next level and elevate your game. So most guys, I don't care what they say. Like my mother told me years ago, you only have one hole
to crawl into even a rat got more than that. So you have to know something
a little more than just sending a woman to the track,
which that's my major thing. I had women that I sent
to the track all my life. I just stopped it recently
because I elevated my game, took it to another level. I have people guessing say,
can't nobody do it like that. Whoo, whoo, whoo and say different things. But they all, all I do is dress and rest and ride. That's all I ever done. They try to say, I'm doing
this and I'm doing that. I'm not doing none of that. I'm with the basic,
and I'm winning with it and I'm keep on rocking
with the same program I'm having all these years. Knowledge is power. If you don't, like I
say, you don't know much. You can't do much. You have to know something extra. Your women going to respect it. The world gonna respect it. Everybody's going to respect it when you're standing on top. I done went to prison
and ain't lost nothing. Got a house built from penitentiary. I bought hotels, I done bought wedding chapels in Vegas. And it's all on knowledge
on what you know. Sure, I set my money from this and that but you have to know what you do. Money and a fool will soon
part with the quickness. I've been down for 57 years
straight on top of my game. I got a record of never be broke. Never have and never will. And all the guys that gave the game to me, they was proud of me because it's just like your
father and your mother. They be great, but they want
you to be better than they are. I never take my mother's
and father's position because they, my mother and father but as far as position,
I would pass them up. And that's what I did with my friends. I stayed on top for years. I'm still on top handling my
business because of knowledge. What I was told back in the day - Who was the most important
parent or a role model you had as a kid? Mom, dad, or somebody else? - My parents as a kid, because they taught me a lot of things. I still remember things
my mother taught me when I was three or four years old. She told me one time I went to the refrigerator early in the morning, excuse me. She said, boy, get on in there. You ain't going to come in my kitchen don't wash your hand. I said, I took a bath
and wash them last night. She said, you don't done
everything while you were asleep. You don't know what you'd don't done. I never forgot that. That still stay with me till today. So all the older guys, even the winos. And everybody that was older than me I learned something from all of them. They might not be no winners themself, but the things they taught me stuck to me and I use it all the
way till today. And it works. - What qualities do you
look for in a female? - I look for a female that's
dedicated to their man. The one is qualified enough
to listen to the instructions, their guidance and the
one that's down by law. Those are the ones I look for
because you got a lot of women that's really... they're headstrong nowadays, you know. You got to really be about to
really make them understand what's going on. Cause they'll try to tell you something. If you ain't sharp
enough to tell them that. So you really gotta be
about your business. If you don't, if you lay off,
it ain't going to pay off. So you gotta be down and
dirty about your business. They can really respect you as their man. - And when one your girls
gets a little headstrong or gets out of line- - You check them. You don't never stop. You don't never stop being a man. And that's what they're going to respect. - And the prison time that
you did, what was that for? - I did prison time for drugs. And what happened was I did
a friend of mine a favor. I was on top of the world. That was 30 years ago. I had 20 cars, five houses,
million dollar for jury every mink coat that you can that you can even imagine. Money stacked up this high. They stripped me and took everything sent me to the penitentiary. It cost me everything. And all I was doing was
dress and rest and ride. Doing friend's favors. Sometimes favors will cost you, because if you fall off your game,
your game gonna fall off you. It's going to charge you. So I caught a drug case. Everybody thought I was dealing drugs. I don't deal no drugs. And ain't never dealt none. But that's what they think. Because anytime you're
doing things above level they gonna give you a perception of what they think because
they haven't been shelving up, go to the next level and
think that your brain and your mindset can give you a bigger playing field to play on. Instead of them spreading
their mindset on what the so you're only going to be big as the one that's then
taught you the game. I learned mine from giants. All the way from the rooter to the tooter. I learned it from giants. I stuck by the strip and it works. I add onto what I know. I was smart in school. I took the school and
turn it into the game. That's what makes me wait - Did you have sex with the girls? Sure, I had sex with my girls. Got babies by a couple of them. - How many kids do you have?
- I got eight kids. - I've heard the Bishop talk
about stealing sometimes. The girls sometimes
they'll steal from Johns. Is that ever a part of the game where the girls will rob guys? - Well, the girls,
- Johns See, when the girls started flat backing all these years, they flat back, they called it flat backing. So they can only get so
much money flat backing, but somebody come through
with great big money and they learn how to steal
it. They gone take it. And that just how it was. If a Mark put himself in that
position, she going to get it. - That's part of the game. - That's part of the game. My girls used to get so much money and then holla, they
didn't know how to steal. I thought they was the police
bringing so much money home. I got to question them. I thought she didn't know
how to steal, but see they think so much about their self. They wanna impress they man so much. They don't want to give them the real. So they would learn how to
steal from other prostitutes. They don't think I know it but as long as the money was
coming, it was good with me. - A lot of people outside your, this world think pimps
are always intimidating and forcing girls to do this. - It's by choice. It's not about force. I don't know no players, no pimps no mac that forces a
woman to go get his money. That's a black eye when
it come to the game. You don't do that. All you do is talk. Because a woman going to
be a prostitute anyway. Some of them, they just don't have no man and no guidance. You have to have a man. See a man thinks from his mind
a woman thing from his heart all she knew was I had
to go get the money. The man got to know
what to do next with it. And that's what his
woman going to respect. If you jack off everything you get, pretty soon that woman
going to go to somebody else and know what to do. - I'm sure you've seen some crazy things in all your years of doing this. - I've seen some awful,
crazy things in my life. You know? But one thing I can say. I always stuck by the rules of the game. I always played fair. I played straight. Never with no bullshit with me. And I still stick by that. - So the laws have changed since back in the eighties,
seventies, whenever. There's much stricter penalties now. - Yeah, laws have changed, yeah. They'll give you shit, 60 to 80 years when they used to give you three years. - So that's changed the
way you guys do business, right? - Well, me, myself, I changed all together because I elevated my whole life. The average person couldn't even begin to comprehend the way my game go because they haven't
elevated to that point. They haven't been taught that. So I don't be upset at them
because they don't understand. It's a lot of haters now. Because they don't understand
how the next men are doing it. The next man are doing because he's doing things above average. Like I said, big game
is played out of sight. - Yeah. So I think what a lot
of people don't understand about pimping is it has such a wide range from the top to the bottom. - Aint no doubt. - You're the top of the food chain, - That's right.
- But down here on skid row there's the bottom of the food chain. - That's right
- And they look very different and they behave very different and they, the girls would look very different. Everything's different. - I had guys that had
prostitutes for years and they was never able to buy a car. Him and a prostitute, both was walking. They couldn't elevate. I've been driving brand new since 1963. I even had 20 cars and
I'm still riding brand new out all these years
because your dress code, your houses, your
furniture, you have to live in a first class way to
be a first-class guy. Just can't talk with, you got to walk it. And a lot of people just be blowing wind and they scream it but they don't mean it. Deep down inside they don't mean it. I'm serious about what I do. And I know what it takes to win. - What kind of cars have
you driven over the years? - Well, I started out
driving brand new Cadillacs. I rode them every year. Then after so many years
went by like 20 30 years, squares started driving Cadillacs. So you couldn't tell
them from the players. So I had to take it to the next level. I jumped to Mercedes, Corvettes. After that, then I brought it
to the Golden Spirit Zimmer. I rode that until they took it from- That's one of the cars they took from me. They took all my cars and everything. So I had the Rolls Royce, the Golden Spirit Zimmerman, the Corvette the Benz and it was 20 other cars. I mean 17 other cars, 16 or
17 other cars they'd taken. So what I'm saying is I
always like to be on top. You always want to drive something nobody else can reach. That's show you what your game is at. You know, and that's
what players reach for to congregate, come together. And everybody floss what they been doing. It tells a lot about your game you know. if you can't come in and
stand up to the plate, then you'd just be weeded out. You want to be weeded in. You
don't want to be weeding out. So right now I'm driving Rolls Royces. I got Rolls Royces, Bentleys. I got Mercedes, got Range Rovers. I got it. Got it all. You know, because that's
what the game is all about. That's what tells a lot about
you walking to the homes. They so fabulous and beautiful, swimming pools, lakes and you know, this is a big giant players live for. It ain't about the fame. It's about your name. The man makes everything that's happened. Man makes money. Money don't make man. So you got to stand up to what you represent and that's how I came up. And it was a I'm standing up
till today, all these years. - All right, Virgil. Thank you much, thank you
for sharing your story. - All right. Thank you man.
