♪♪ >> Stephen: HEY, EVERYBODY,
WELCOME BACK TO A LATE SHOW, LET'S TALK TO A BAND LEADER, JON
BATISTE. WHAT IS GOING ON, HOW HAS YOUR
DAY BEEN? >> Jon: IT'S BEEN GOOD, YOU
KNOW, IT'S RAINING A LITTLE BIT OUT THERE BUT I GOT SOME HOOPS
IN RIGHT BEFORE. >> Stephen: HOW YOU CAN
POSSIBLY, AREN'T YOU EVER AFRAID YOU'RE GOING TO JAM A FINGER AND
THEN THAT'S IT, CURTAIN, BACK TO. >> I ALWAYS PLAY WITH MYSELF,
THAT IS WHY. >> Stephen: OH, NOBODY PASSES
TO YOU. >> Stephen: NO, YOU KNOW, JUST
SHOOTING, JUST PRACTICING GETS ME SO HAPPY. IT IS NICE, TO CONCENTRATE. >> Stephen: ST LIKE A
MEDITATION. >> Jon: YH. >> Stephen: I DO THE SAME
THING, DO I THIS MEDITATION WHERE I CLOSE MY EYES AND I
DON'T GET UP FOR EIGHT HOURS. IT IS JUST, OH-- DELIGHTFUL. >> Jon: YOU GET EIGHT, I
DIDN'T IMAGINE THAT YOU GOT EIGHT IN. >> Stephen: I DID, LAST NIGHT
WHEN I WOKE UP AT 5, SOMETHING LIKE, THAT YOU KNOW, GENERALIZED
ANXIETY, JON. >> Jon: OH YEAH, YEAH, I MEAN
YOU DON'T HAVE TOO MUCH ON YOUR PLATE. >> Stephen: COULD YOU PLAY A
LITTLE SOMETHING THAT MAYBE WOULD RELIEVE MY GENERALIZED
ANXIETY, COULD I ASK THAT OF YOU, MY FRIEND. >> Jon: OH, OF COURSE. ♪
>> Jon: YOU SEE THAT ALWAYS LIFTS ME. >> Stephen: THE FIRST SIX
MONTHS OF THE SHOW WHEN WE WERE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW THO DO,
I'M NOT SURE HOW WE'RE GOING TO LIKE HIT THIS CLEANLY EVERY
NIGHT, JON WOULD FINISH EVERY SHOW WITH THAT SONG. AND EVERY SHOW I WOULD SING IT
WITH HIM AND EVERY NIGHT IT MADE ME FEEL BETTER. LIKE THAT WAS, THAT WAS LIKE A
LIFE RAFT STO ME AT THE END OF EVERY NIGHT. AND TO HEAR THE AUDIENCE SING
ALONG WITH IT MADE ALL THE DIFFERENCE IN THE WORLD, I WILL
BE GRATEFUL FOREVER THAT YOU GAVE THAT TO ALL OF US AT THE
END OF EVERY SHOW. THANK YOU. >> Jon: OH MY GOODNESS. I LOVE THAT. >> Stephen: JON BATISTE,
EVERYBODY, THE HONOR IS ALL OURS. JOINING ME NOW ■SAN AUTHOR,
CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST AND NIECE OF PRESIDENT TRUMP WHO HAS
WRITTEN A BOOK ABOUT THEIR FAMILY CALLED "TOO MUCH AND
NEVER ENOUGH" PLEASE WELCOME MARY TRUMP. MARY, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR
BEING HERE. >> OH, IT'S SUCH A PLEASURE,
STEPHEN, THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME. >> Stephen: NOW BEFORE WE GET
STARTED, HAVE YOU SEEN MY SHOW? BECAUSE I TALK ABOUT YOUR UNCLE
A LOT. >> I HAVE INDEED SEEN YOUR SHOW. > Stephen: OKAY, GOOD. THEN ARE YOU, DO YOU ENJO I IT? ARE YOU OKAY WITH MY SHOW? >> I THINK IT'S AMAZING,
ACTUALLY. >> Stephen: I NEVER THOUGHT I
WOULD HEAR THAT, A TRUMP ENJOYS MY SHOW. THANK YOU SO MUCH. I WAS DEFINITELY FISHING BUT
THANK YOU VERY MUCH. OKAY. NOW YOU'VE GOT A Ph.D IN
PSYCHOLOGY. >> YEAH. >> Stephen: IS THERE ANY IDEA
THAT THE LAST FOUR YEARS ARE SOME SORT OF FEVER DREAM THAT WE
ARE ALL JUST GOING TO WAKE UP FROM? >> I HOPE THAT'S THE CASE EVERY
DAY. BUT UNFORTUNATELY, I DON'T THINK
SO, SORRY. SO YEAH, WE HAVE OUR WORK CUT
OUT FROM US, I'M AFRAID. >> Stephen: YOUR BOOK ABOUT
YOUR UNCLE, YOUR GRANDFATHER, YOUR FATHER AND THE ENTIRE
FAMILY IS CALLED "TOO MUCH AND NEVER ENOUGH." WHAT DOES THAT TITLE REFER TO? >> WHEN I STARTED FORM LATING
THIS BOOK IT WAS REALLY IMPORTANT TO ME TO LOOK BACK. AND TRY TO MAKE SENSE OF HOW WE
GOT TO WHERE WE ARE TODAY. AND IN LOOKING AT THE DYNAMICS
THAT EXISTED BETWEEN DONALD AND HIS FATHER, MY DAD AND HIS
FATHER AND DONALD AND MY FATHER, I SAW SOME PATTERNS. AND I CAME TO THE CONCLUSION
THAT THEY HAD HAD AN EXTREMELY DIFFICULT-- CHILDHOOD, IN THE
CONTEXT OF CHILD ABUSE THERE ARE TWO WAYS IT CAN FUNCTION. EITHER YOU GET TOO MUCH OF
SOMETHING, TOO MUCH ENCROACHMENT, TOO MUCH NEGATIVE
ATTENTION, TOO. UNREALISTIC EXPECT AND THAT IS
WHAT MY FATHER AS THE OLDEST SON, NAME SAKE AND HEIR APPARENT
SUFFERED FROM MY GRANDFATHER. AND THEN ON THE OTHER END OF THE
SPECTRUM THERE IS THE NOT ENOUGH. NOT ENOUGH ATTENTION. NOT ENOUGH MIRRORING, NOT ENOUGH
AFFECTION, NOT ENOUGH LOVE. SO IT STARTED FROM THERE. BUT THEN IN SPEAKING OF MY
FAMILY AS BE ENTITY, YOU KNOW, AND AS MY GRANDFATHER AS THE
HEAD OF IT WHO SEEMED TO BE ONLY INTERESTED IN MONEY, THESE ARE
PEOPLE WHO HAD TOO MUCH OF THAT BECAUSE IT DOESN'T SEEM TO HAVE
DONE THEM MUCH GOOD. AND BECAUSE OF THE VAST WEALTH
THEY PO TES-- POSSESSED STRKS ALMOST AS IF, CERTAINLY FOR
DONALD, HE DIDN'T HAVE TO TRY VERY HARD. AND THE OTHER PROBLEM IS WHEN
MONEY IS THE ONLY CURRENCY IN YOUR FAMILY, THERE'S NEVER
ENOUGH OF IT. BECAUSE IT CAN NEVER TAKE THE
PLACE OF THINGS THAT REALLY MATTER LIKE LOVE AND AFFECTION. >> Stephen: YOU GET THAT SENSE
FROM THE PRESIDENT, AND AGAIN I DON'T KNOW THE MAN, I HAVE MET
HIM A FEW TIMES AND I HAVE STUDIED HIS BEHAVIOR. BUT IS HE ALWAYS SEEKING
VALIDATION. AND NO MATTER WHAT IT IS, WHEN
HE OPENS THE WRAPPER OF IT, IT IS ALWAYS EMPTY, NEVER
SATISFYING FOR HIM, WHETHER ST THE PRESIDENCY HIMSELF OR A
MILITARY PARADE OR THE PRAISE FROM EVERY PERSON HE MEETS. HOW AS SOMEONE WHO HAS STUDIED
CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGY AND CHILDHOOD TRAUMA, HOW WOULD YOU,
I DON'T WANT TO SAY TREAT BUT HOW WOULD YOU ADDRESS SOMEONE
LIKE THAT, IS THERE ANYTHING THAT COULD BE DONE FOR THE
PRESIDENT TO GIVE HIM SOME SORT OF SOLACE WHICH IN SOME WAYS
WOULD BE BETTER FOR THE REST OF IT? >> IT IS AN OLD-- AND I HATE
SAYING IT BUT I THINK THE ANSWER IS NO. PARTIALLY BECAUSE IT'S EXTREMELY
DIFFICULT TO HELP SOMEBODY WHO IS NOT AWARE HE NEEDS HELP. I THINK AT THIS POINT IT IS
LIKE, IT WOULD BE IMPOSSIBLE FOR DONALD TO ADMIT TO ANY KIND OF
WEAKNESS OR INCAPACITY THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED. YOU HE ALSO UNFORTUNATELY SEEMS
TO BE SURROUNDED BY PEOPLE WHO ARE PERFECTLY HAPPY HAVING HIM
BEHAVE THE WAY HE BEHAVESES NOW, FOR WHATEVER THEIR AGENDAS MAY
BE. THEY'RE NOT THAT INTERESTED IN
MAKING DONALD A BETTER PERSON. >> I SPOKE TO AMBASSADOR BOLTON
A FEW WEEKS AGO WHO SAID THAT HE HAD NEVER SEEN A HEAD OF STATE
WHO WAS SO EASILY MANIPULATED BY OTHER HEADS OF STATE, BY STRONG
MEN WHO PLAYED HIM, LIKE YOU SAID, LIKE A FIDDLE. IS THERE SOMETHING ABOUT YOUR
UNCLE, THE MAKEUP OF HIS PERSONALITY THAT MAKES HIM
MANIPULATABLE. >> SURE, AND THAT IS ALSO
SOMETHING THAT IS-- FROM MY GRANDFATHER, BECAUSE DONALD
REALIZE THE AT A FAIRLY YOUNG AGE THAT THE ONLY WAY TO SUCCEED
WHERE MY FATHER FAILED WAS TO BE THE KIND OF PERSON MY
GRANDFATHER NEEDED HIM TO BE. THE PILLAR, THE TOUGH GUY,
SOMEBODY WHO WOULD NEVER ADMIT OR NEVER ADMIT BEING WRONG. HE BASICALLY FIND OURSELVES NOW
WITH A PERSON WHO JUST NEEDS TO HAVE THE THINGS HE HAS TO
BELIEVE ABOUT HIMSELF. HE'S THE GREATEST, THE BEST,
REPEATED OR TOLD HIM BY SOMEBODY ELSE IN ORDER TO MAKE HIM MALL
EEBL. AND I THINK I WRITE IN THE BOOK
THAT THAT IS ONE OF THE THINGS MY GRANDFATHER DOES-- DID. HE MADE DONALD EMINENTLY USEFUL
TO SMARTER, MORE POWERFUL MEN. AND THAT IS ANG EXTREMELY
DANGEROUS SITUATION FOR US TO BE IN CONSIDERING THE POWER THAT
DONALD HAS. >> Stephen: WHEN YOU SAY THAT
YOUR FATHER FAILED, I ASSUME YOU MEAN IN THE EYES OF YOUR
GRANDFATHER. AND IN WHAT WAYS, WHAT IS THAT
QUOTE UNQUOTE FAILURE IN THE EYES OF YOUR GRANDFATHER THAT
YOUR UNCLE, DONALD TRUMP SAW. LIKE WHAT WAS THE THING THAT HE
DIDN'T DO FOR HIS FAMILY THAT DONALD TRUMP HAD TO STEP UP AND
OVERCOME IN HIS OWN LIFE, OUT OF FEAR I ASSUME. >> YEAH, ABSOLUTELY. I THINK FEAR IS THE MOST
POWERFUL FACTOR THAT RUNS THROUGHOUT THE FAMILY. >> Stephen: I THINK THAT IS
SOMETHING THE PRESIDENT USES, HE IS USING IT NOW, FALLING BACK ON
THE CRUTCH OF FEAR SAYING THAT JOE BIDEN IS GOING TO ELIMINATE
THE SUBURBS. >> YEAH. WHICH I GUESS IS A THING THAT WE
DIDN'T KNOW EXISTED. >> Stephen: YOU DID NOT KNOW,
EXACTLY. >> YEAH. BUT YES, FEAR AND FEAR OF HUM IL
YAITION BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY HUM IL YAITION IS A WEAPON QUITE
FREQUENTLY AS WELL. SO BECAUSE DONALD TRUMP HAD,
BEING SEVEN AND A HALF YEARS YOUNGER THAN MY DAD, HE WAS ABLE
TO SEE WHAT HE SHOULD NOT DO IF HE WANTED TO AVOID THE KINDS OF
PUNISHMENT MY GRANDFATHER SUBJECTED MY DAD TO. PIE DAD WHO HAD EVERY INTENTION
OF FULFILLING HIS ROLE AS HEIR APPARENT AND TAKING OVER PIE
GRANDFATHER'S BUSINESS ALSO HAPPENED TO BE A VERY KIND,
GENEROUS PERSON. HE DARED HAVE INTEREST OUTSIDE
OF BUSINESS. HE LOVED BOATS AND FISHING AND
WATER-SKIING AND FLYING, OBVIOUSLY. HIS FRIENDS ADORED HIM. SO BECAUSE MY GRANDFATHER DIDN'T
VALUE ANY OF THAT, AND BELIEVED THAT THAT JUST TOOK AWAY FROM MY
DAD'S, WHAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN MY DAD'S SOLE PURPOSE WHICH WAS
WORKING AT TRUMP MANAGEMENT, DONALD LEARNED THE LESSON THAT
IF YOU WANT TO SURVIVE AND SUCCEED IN THIS FAMILY, YOU
SHOULDN'T BE KIND, YOU SHOULDN'T BE GENEROUS, AND YOU SHOULDN'T
CARE ABOUT ANYTHING ELSE, AND YOU CERTAINLY SHOULDN'T BE
INTERESTED IN WHETHER OR NOT PEOPLE LOVED YOU. >> Stephen: WE HAVE TO TAKE A
QUICK BREAK, BUT STICK AROUND, EVERYBODY, WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK
WITH MORE MARY TRUMP. ♪♪
