This is Loose Canon, where we examine different versions of the same character in various pop culture... iterations. So, last time we started with a character that is very linearly owned by a single, carefully-controlled corporate entity and not very old. I put the second episode up to a vote and here were your three choices. And you went with the obvious one. So... Hades, the Greek God of the dead. "They want to name me Pluto?! What kind of name is that? That's the name for God? What is that? I wouldn't name my dog Pluto." Why Hades of all the Greek gods? Well first off he's one of the most common in pop culture adaptations, but he also often has the most liberties taken. If you took a middle school English class in the Western world, you probably have at least a passing knowledge of Greek Mythology. But let's run through a quick refresher where Mr. Hades is concerned. Ok, so the three Lord God patriarchs of the Greek Pantheon are the brothers three: Zeus, Poseidon, and Hades. Zeus rules the heaven and the earth, Poseidon the sea, and Hades the underworld and the dead people. Now, Zeus and Poseidon are massive pricks. Hades, by comparison, is the nice one. Aside from the occasional kidnapping, he mostly keeps to himself. In the mythology, his role was usually the bearer of some kind of quest object or dead love interest of the hero. His name, Hades, also became synonymous with the underworld itself. So it's like if my apartment was called "Lindsay." Hi, I'm Lindsay. Welcome to... Lindsay. The most famous story of Hades from the mythology, hell, one of the most famous stories from Greek Mythology, period, is the abduction of Persephone. In the Homeric version, he makes a deal with brother Zeus for him to abduct Zeus's daughter and his niece Persephone. ...They're gods, so that makes it okay. Persephone's mother Demeter is the goddess of harvest and fertility, and basically goes on a strike and blights the Earth until Hades gives her her daughter back. Which he does, but only after she eats the fruit of the underworld, which for some reason means she has to spend half the year in the underworld, during which time Demeter gets sad, and that's why we have winter. So yeah, kidnapping a young girl and forcing her to marry you is kind of a dick thing to do, but again, compared to his bros, he's still... less shitty. So yes, there is our mythological Hades crash-course. But since he's been around for so long, he has had a good thousand or so years to incorporate a lot of... fanon that later made its way into pop culture portrayals. You know, fanon. It's like... ideas that get accepted by fans based on conjecture, or... nothing, and sometimes even gets incorporated into the thing itself. Stuff like Irene Adler being this big,
important thing in Sherlock's life, or where the Klingon head bumps came from, or the fact that Starscream's repaint models are called Seekers, or basically every My Little Pony meme. So while Hades is far from the only Greek God to show up in pop culture a lot, his portrayal over the years is among the most... fanon-influenced, we'll say. So today, we're going to look at how Hades, at one point revered as one of the most powerful of the gods, got fanon'd. So let's get started with one of my favorites, the Disney version. ♫ "No, I will not go!" ♫ "No!" [Hades laughs evilly] What- what Disney version did you think I was talking about? So here, in the adolescence of both film and animation as medium, we have our fabulous red rubber pants opera-singing Hades. This one has some more obvious influences than the Greek god himself. "Could it be... Satan?!" Well yes, church lady, but some perhaps less obvious than that. The Satanified version of Hades is highly influenced by a Greek God, just not the one for which he is named. In this case we're talking about Pan. The little horns, the pointy goatee, these are elements associated with Pan, whose aesthetic later got rolled up into Christian artistic depictions of Satan. But a solid popularization for this look comes from Mephistopheles, who is not Satan, but close enough. One look need no further than Gounod's Faust, by which this cartoon is probably more heavily influenced than by anything. The God Hades also isn't really associated with fire like he is here. He is associated with wealth, metals, minerals, precious gems, which we kind of see here...? ♫ "I give you this diamond, behold its size." ♫ I guess this counts. I already did an episode about the goddess of spring a couple years ago, so we won't go into too much depth on this one other than besides the aesthetic influences. It's pretty much a strangely Demeter-less version of the abduction of Persephone by way of Faust. So, -1 eating the fruit of the underworld, +1 Satan-Hades lets her go 'cause she asks. ♫ "Tell me what can I do?" ♫ ♫ "Let me return to my world up above." ♫ ♫ "Very well, I let you go." ♫ Quite reasonable of you, Satan-Hades. Next. "This is the story of a time long ago, a time of myth and legend, when the ancient gods were petty and cruel." And when CGI just wasn't there yet. It was the mid-90s and there was a big resurgence of interest in the whole Greek thing. Hades was a recurring character on Hercules: The Legendary Journeys, and its vastly superior spin-off, Xena: Warrior Princess. There's an episode of Hercules: The Legendary Journeys that takes on the Persephone story and actually does feature both Persephone and Demeter. So it starts out familiar enough, Hades pops out of the underworld and... [horses whinnying]
[thunder claps] "Hades!" [Lindsay as Persephone] "Your hat is ridiculous!" [Persephone screams] "He took Persephone, but why?" "Because he hates me." Oh... kay. "You know I can't eat the food of the other side.
I'll be stuck here forever." "Would that be so bad?" Nope, turns out Demeter was wrong, and this was actually a semi-consensual kidnapping. "That was a pretty wild chariot ride." Stupid sexy Hades. "Why does it have to be like this?" Stupid irresistible sexy Hades. "Hades, don't be a voyeur." What the- ew. Why? Nev- no, never mind.
This is not stupid sexy Hades. Oh but don't worry, he's in Xena, too. I feel like at some point this actor saw and really liked James Woods' interpretation of Hades from the Disney movie. "Where is she?" "Gabrielle? Well, if she's dead, she didn't come to me." "I saw her die, she had to come to you." "Why would I lie to you?" [Lindsay as a Disney-style Hades] "Hey, come on, Xena, babe, let's cut a deal." But towards the end of the series, Xena starts pulling a God of War and starts killing gods because she can and because motherhood. No, seriously, the name of this episode is "Motherhood." "If we wish to kill Eve, we have to go through Xena. And as a mother, she'll be more dangerous than ever." Oh, but it gets better. Here's why we're killing off gods. "It was said by the archangel Michael." "Michael?" "He said that Eve would prepare the way for
the rule of the God of love." Eh.... yup! [Hades screaming in pain] Bye, Hades! "No!" Shit, now who's gonna run the underworld? Next. "My boy, my little Hercules." [Hades, sarcastically] "How sentimental. You know I haven't been this choked up since I got a hunk of moussaka caught in my throat. Hah?" So while John Musker and Ron Clements were developing this studio mandate of a film, they arbitrarily decided that Hades was going to be the villain in story because death equals scary, despite Hercules rarely interacting with the Lord of the Dead in the mythology and certainly never in an arch-nemesis sort of way. So despite Hades as your villain making no sense in a Hercules story, because that's usually Hera, who was a doting mother in this movie, Hades is our antagonist because he wants to be in charge of Olympus, and originally he was going to be like this dark, slow-moving, broody, like, Chernabog-y type, and then James Woods showed up. "For some weird reason I came in and, [low voice] he was Hades, the lord of the underworld, [normal voice] and I guess everybody came in going [gravely voice] Hello, I'm Hades! [normal voice] You know? Then I came in going, 'hey Hades, how you doing? Nice to see ya. Nice face.' Yeah, and for some reason, I just was feeling kind of silly that day." And his version of Hades manifests as this sort of huckster used-car salesman type. And the subsequent interpretation of this character, while yes, I know, "not accurate," is still honestly way too good for this movie. "People are gonna get hurt, aren't they?" "Nahhh... I mean, you know, it's a possibility, it happens. It's war, but, what can I tell you?" As a character, this version of Hades is great. But as a plot device he was not very strong. "I'm about to rearrange the cosmos." So all that is good about the character is pretty much directly attributable to Woods and lead animator Nick Ranieri. "Anyway, see, ladies, I was at this party and
I lost track of-" "We know." "Yeah I know... you know." And this, in large part, and by Woods' own admission, is because almost every line he does in
the film is ad-libbed. "Meg, Meg, talk to me, you know? Schmooze, uh-" [Hades screaming] Speaking of "hell yes," did I mention that this had an animated series spin-off? "Yeah, and we're not employees, we're cast members!" [Medusa groans] Which you cannot find anywhere unless you're like bittorrenting or watching it on YouTube. And it's funny that in 50+ episodes Persephone never shows up, but she is in the movie. Riiiight... there. This uh, Sarah Brightman-looking motherf*cker. And aside from Danny Devito and Rip Torn, it features the entirely the same voice cast, including James Woods, who loves being Hades and does it at every opportunity which is not enough. It is never enough! "Everyone goes to orientation on their first day." [Medusa scoffs] "Orientation?" "I run a professional organization." The animated series takes place basically during the Danny Devito training montage in the movie. And yes, in the animated series, Hades is well aware that Hercules is alive and not dead. And no, this is never addressed as a continuity issue.
It just... it just is. In the show, Hades' bid to take over Olympus appears to be a constant thing rather than a ticking clock. Well, ticking planet-driven push that only Hercules is prophesied to stop. No Persephone, but Hades does have a crush on Aphrodite, which is great. [Hades laughs nervously] "Hephaestus!" And she is great because she has her own theme song. ♫ "Aphrodite, Aphrodite, Aphrodite...! ♫ ♫ The goddess of love!" ♫ There are a lot of great moments in this
show, unlike the animation, which is not great, at all. It's terrible. He even has a song in one episode. "Come on ladies, sing along with Hades!" ♫ "I got a penthouse on Spark Avenue ♫ ♫ I'd like you to see." ♫ Okay, yeah, this is why Hades has no villain
song in the movie. ♫ "In my town (in his town) ♫ I'm number one." "Not in my book, you ain't!" Though one of the best episodes is the one where Hades teams up with Jafar. Apparently Hercules happens more-or-less at the same time as Aladdin. "Once the most powerful sorcerer in the world!" "Good for you, you big scary booger-head, you!" It features such gems as Hades and Jafar bonding over their respective adolescent nemeses, "Jerk-ules actually carries the sun out of here and Zeus wins again. This kid is driving me meshuga." Giving each other villainy advice, [Jafar laughing evilly] "What's with the laughing? What is that? Who does that help, huh?" "It punctuates my evil. It's a flourish." And then they stage like a Wolverine vs Hulk comic book battle between Hercules and Aladdin. "Well, what if Aladdin and Hercules were to have some sort of terrible misunderstanding?" And then of course they team up. "Ok, don't panic, heroes burst in all the time down here." I could go on and on about the show because there are a lot of episodes. And because there are a lot of episodes there definitely some that drag, but I definitely prefer the show to the movie. Except the animation. "You idiots! What is that, cherry? Gimmie a taste of that. Mm, nice." Disney Hades. You can find a more accurate Hades, but you will be loathe to find a more fun one. [Hades] "Um, guys? Olympus would be that way." Next. "Free at last!" [Lindsay groans, imitating Justice League Hades] Man, I'd feel bad for any Hades that follows
James Woods, but this guy is among the lamest. Which is a shame because it's John Rhys-Davies and he's cool. Hades from Justice League and Justice League Unlimited, in case you ever wondered what would happen if Mephistopheles was crossed with Fabio. And also... this. You know, let's dig a little deeper with the whole Satan thing. Of all the underworld gods that were pre-Christian, why did the Satan thing stick to Hades the most? "Now you see his true face." I mean, Osiris is another well-known God of the dead, and he doesn't have the Satan connotation, so why Hades? At its core, it really is a translation issue. The Bible, written in Hebrew, used the word... this, to refer to the abode of the dead. In practice, this is divorced from the Greek idea of Hades, but when it was translated into ancient Greek, this word is translated to this word, meaning Hades. And remember, the god's name, same as the place, Welcome to Lindsay. All of this would eventually be wrapped up into this unified idea of the Christian hell through a series of translations. The modern English word Hades popped up around when the modern English did, and specifically to refer to the place where Jesus went after the crucifixion. In the King James version, the Greek word Hades is translated into Hell, death, and, well, Hades, depending on which verse we're talking about and which book we're talking about. Despite a resurgence in interest in classical mythology around the enlightenment-era that has lasted all the way up to... well, now, I think we can safely say now this conflation of Bible Hades the place and God Hades the guy has more-or-less stuck. Anyway, Justice League. This version was always kind of the exemplar for lame, lazy, Devil-Hades. And once again he's trying to overthrow Zeus because reasons, and also... "Tormenting Faust's pathetic soul." You gotta be f*cking kidding me. So Hades intends to give Olympus to the Titans. "Hades tricked my mother into opening the gates of Olympus to the invading Titans." Where have we heard this before...? "Boom! Badda-boom, boom, boom!" And Hippolyta had a thing with him at one point. And he is possibly Diana's maybe dad. "My mother sculpted me from clay and
breathed life into me." "Your mother and I sculpted you together." ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ "He's gone?" "What did you ever see him?" Well, did you see his tongue? Just think, this is the kind of boring bad guy the Disney version would have been if James Woods hadn't made one of the best decisions of his or anyone's career. [Hades laughing evilly] "Bow to me, mortals!" Next. "You are here for a favor?" "I am." "Perhaps then you can enlighten me as to why you think I would remove your bands." Hmm. Hades, you look different. "Where are my manners?" This version's aesthetic is such an outlier, I'm not really sure what to say about it. But obviously more than anything it looks like Bacchus than Hades. So obviously this version does not fall in the same continuity with Justice League. And believe it or not, Hades, who is voiced by and appears to be modeled on Oliver Platt, is not the central antagonist, but Ares, weirdly voiced by Alfred Molina. "I shall never be able to repay your gesture." You know, Doc Oc? Hades here is basically just a glorified cameo. And... well, points for- points for different. Next. "We have visitors." So now we make it to the film version of Percy Jackson and the Sorcerer's Stone. I mean the Lightning Thief. God, this movie. "Would you prefer that I looked like...this?" This interpretation being sort of aging rock star, and accompanied by an extremely bitter and confusing Persephone who is played by Rosario Dawson. [Hades, distantly] "Don't ignore me!" "Or WHAT? What will you do?!" Ehh... mm... okay. Hades almost does the 'I'm going to take over Olympus' thing. "I am going to be king of the gods." But then... What huh? "The only thing I look forward to is my allotted time away from this hellhole. A war of the gods would put an end to that,
and I'd be alone... with only him." Okay. Like I said, glorified cameo. Next. "You are specs of dust beneath our fingernails. Your very breath is a gift from Olympus. You have insulted powers beyond your comprehension." "Who are you?" "I am Hades." Ah, we saved the very worst for last! [screaming internally] So, unlike the 1981 film for which this remake is presumably named, in which the antagonist was mostly Poseidon, which makes SENSE seeing as Poseidon is a god of the sea and the kraken is a sea beast. "And from his own flesh, Hades gave birth to an unspeakable horror... the Kraken." Here, Hades is played by Ray Fiennes as a sort of Voldemort by way of Terl from Battlefield Earth. "I will unleash the Kraken." Oh, are you going to give Draco an awkward hug now? This version of Hades is also a touch derivative. "Finally, some range from you." "How long has it been?" Hmm, where have we seen this before? "How sentimental." It also basically has the same ending as
the Disney movie. Hades is... banished? Inconvenienced? It's not clear, but it does involve being thrown down a hole. He's in the sequel, too, but he's less bad in that one. I don't know. Moving on. "Release the kraken!" The interesting contrast with Hades the
character, the idea, whatever, is how much changes from iteration to iteration while at the same time still being borrowed. That Satan-y undertone that keeps popping up, for instance, despite the fact that it's never really there in the mythology. Or even up to the fact that, after the Disney movie came out, pop culture Hadeses just kept wanting to take over Olympus. There is no official Hades handbook, but those intertwined influences are still there. And I think the older your character is, the more of that you're going to see, even if people do get sort of butthurt about it being inaccurate. Which, let me remind you, is not a barometer for enjoyability. Again, this one was among the least accurate. "This one is different, he's honest and he's sweet-" "Please..." "He would never do anything to hurt me-" "He's a guy!" Next Loose Canon, which I promise I'll do sooner than in three months, we're going to do a lady, based on these suggestions that I got on Twitter/the ones I was actually interested in doing. Here are your three options. You can find a link to vote below, which is on my website chezapocalypse.com and if you want to give me suggestions/talk about it, follow me on Twitter, and we will see you next time.
