Is your dentist ripping you off? Hidden camera investigation (CBC Marketplace)

this week on marketplace we drill down on dentists are you getting what's good for you or what might be good for your dentist one mo twenty dentists no consensus some of it I find quite frightening dentist dollars at disagreement shouldn't all the dentists have seen that if there was a neat [Music] we're off to the dentist for a checkup and to do some checking of our own not just at one dentist we're visiting 20 of them in Toronto and Vancouver our researcher Theresa is going to show them her teeth a set of x-rays and ask what work needs to be done she's got a hidden camera to put you in the chair for every exam think these high-priced experts will be on the same page I don't see anything that requires any immediate attention okay this the cleaning makes you wonder who's right as we're about to find out there's nothing black and white when it comes to your pearly whites [Music] for a little word-of-mouth we haul this dentist chair out onto the street it's a lot less painful than going to the actual dentist you've got a little dentist chair over here absolutely gonna put a little bit on you how does it feel to be back in the dentist chair feels weird that reminds me I should probably go do you like going to the dentist no but it's necessary evil we hear a lot about that dreaded dental check-up some of it kind of questionable I had one little thing to fix and then over the next eight months I was there free while every other month every time I would go at these fillings replaced until every filling in my mouth was replaced I don't think he needed that retrospectively you know hmm time to probe what goes on at the dentist a little deeper first though we send Theresa to check in with two experts both dentist profs here at the University of Toronto dr. Dorothy Macomb specialty is restorative dentistry her colleague dr. Laura Tam is co-director of the Faculty's comprehensive care program we ask them both to have a good look around and come up with some kind of baseline I'm going to have a quick look our experts poke and prod mesial of that molar is a four measure pocket make careful notes she has a 1:7 that's a bridge fix bridge abutment together they figure out a treatment plan the good news is that you have no decay at all our experts agree that Theresa has no cavities whatsoever they say she should get several cleanings to fight gum disease so we mark that on our tooth and they say she should probably get a crown I would get the periodontal gum problems under control and then consider doing the crown the bill for the cleanings will be about 500 bucks Theresa adds in that crown the cost will be between 1800 and $2,000 geez where's the tooth fairy when you need her armed with the expert info and a fresh set of x-rays we're ready to start dialing for dentists we pick a mix of small offices and big group practices and throw in a few we've identified through our research hello I'm calling to book an appointment about three out of every four Canadians have gone to the dentist in the past 12 months okay here we go at our very first appointment just one day after her visit with our experts at the U of T Theresa gets a very different diagnosis what weapon attitude here's one quick note to reduce the bite and remember our experts recommend a couple of cleanings and maybe a crown doctor gun Jan gol agrees but says Theresa also needs a root canal then a filling to top it off and she recommends a night guard because Theresa may be clenching her teeth the cost for things our experts don't even mention about $1,100 and listen to this goal says Teresa suffering severe bone loss will definitely lose a tooth eventually need implants quite the prognosis but get this during a free 11 minute consult doctor Gunjan goal never looks inside Teresa's mouth not once her office tells us that's company policy it's a whole other story at Teresa's second appointment later that day within minutes dr. Ammon preached Oprah is also talking about a possible root canal but on a different tooth altogether and then suddenly she starts talking cosmetics Chopra spends the next 10 minutes pushing Teresa to consider veneers ultra thin porcelain bonded to the front of the teeth 6 in total a complete smile makeover plus a root canal and crown she also spots three cavities recommends a couple of past metal on lays oh and some whitening on the lower teeth the total cost for all that more than eighty six hundred dollars we asked to talk to dr. Chopra but don't hear back perfect smiles are all the rage in Hollywood of course part of the magic of moviemaking but it's not just in Tinseltown cosmetic dentistry is in every town these days the use of veneers so common some critics call it a venereal disease to learn more we head from the red carpet to Red Deer Alberta we track down a dentist who've got something to confess dr. Michael Luke made a lot of money on makeovers maybe that's why his office is filled with all kinds of pricy paraphernalia I understand you bought a famous tooth about a year ago no John Lennon's tooth you've got John Lennon's tooth his tooth it was given to to his housekeeper from John Lennon how much did you pay for I was over thirty thousand thirty thousand dollars for John Lennon's tooth yeah but I was offered more right away now he's written a book called confessions of a former cosmetic dentist targeting a certain kind of dentist cosmetic dentists that are that are a little too focused on just the option of using veneers for is it as a cure-all I just want to show you some of our hidden cameras that we shot we show Zook the dentist you just saw dr. Amman preach Oprah she talked about veneers a lot she definitely was using a sales technique there you have concerns about veneers my concern is mostly that the cost is huge the teeth are often mutilated in the process and then once they're done patient is is stuck with that treatment and a half to have it redone over the period of their lifetime zooks got a warning if your dentist recommends expensive treatments he says some dentists have high overhead and big debts to match we have a business we're independent now we could easily go bankrupt if we don't do enough work as we're in Zuke's office a mother and daughter arrive in search of a second opinion you won't believe what their first dentist told them she needed crowns on every single tooth except three of them and our most surprising dental check-up ahead [Music] we're testing what happens when you go to the dentist how do you know the work they want to do is the work you need done that's what Angela Drock and her daughter Cassie are asking today - so tooth look really good so it's a little bit of a mystery wave got so much sensitivity they've come to dr. Michaels ook for a second opinion on what to do about Cassie's sensitive teeth just listen to what another dentist told them what did the first dentist say who saw Cassie Cassie basically had enamel wass extensive manemma loss on all of her teeth except for three of her teeth and had mentioned that the only alternative to fix the problem is going to be either full caps so I guess a crowns or or implants she needed crowns on every single tooth except three of them yes that's a lot yes it is but when Zoop takes a look he sees it pretty differently we talked about the idea of making a fluoride tray or bleaching tray and using a toothpaste to reduce the sensitivity that's it at a cost of about $200 the other dentist price tag 18,000 minimum what do you think about that that you could have two such different treatment recommendations it's a little unnerving it's a lot of money and most people when you have a medical dental plan they only cover a percentage or up to a certain dollar value per year I mean I personally don't have $18,000 - minimum - just drop and according to Zook this kind of variation is common and perfectly acceptable between different dentists unfortunately going to find all kinds of different stories so it's not that they're they're basically trying to tell you something different to make more money but they have different ideas and different training and the way they see things differently but it's extremely variable exactly what we're finding as we test dental treatment plans our researcher Theresa is out another Toronto dentist ding 20 dentists in all remember our experts at the University of Toronto say all she needs are a few cleanings and maybe a crown but so far we've heard a range of other treatments and a whole bunch of other teeth targeted this isn't the first time marketplaces looked at dentists 15 years ago we did a similar story checking up or cashing in back then of all the dentists we tested the highest estimate came from this dentist dr. Salim Kimani of Surrey British Columbia he wanted nine thousand three hundred and thirty seven dollars for work on 17 teeth as we reported back then this wasn't the first time Kimani had been questioned about his treatment estimates so we decided to pay him another visit when we get into the chair our camera stops recording we just get audio sure enough he's got all kinds of recommendations our experts never mentioned a root canal on a tooth that hasn't been targeted yet and the same six veneers another dentist has already recommended $50.00 the bottom line for this treatment plan nearly 12,000 dollars just like last time dr. Salim Kimani gives the highest estimate of anyone we visit we ask him for an interview but never hear back our next visit raises another question about dental insurance Vancouver area dentist dr. Eleanor song G says Theresa needs three fillings on three different teeth it's not clear which teeth because Sanji won't give her a treatment plan he wants to see Teresa's insurance information first what's up with that for answers we meet up with an expert who deciphers all those dental codes assigned to treatments dr. Rick Byers was a dentist for more than four decades now he works as a consultant investigating insurance abuse by dentists it's pretty easy to abuse dental plans one way he says dentists see what your insurance covers and suddenly you need that treatment joke we make is that in some cases they're not treating the patient to treating the dental plan treating the plan in other words they're reading up on the plan finding out what it covers and making sure you need those services that doesn't sound right well Shelley isn't right but it happens case in point Byers shows us a file he's been working on you brought a couple of slides in with you tell me about these teeth this youngster is about 11 years old and these are bicuspids it's none of her baby teeth required filling but now at 11 years of age after just growing in four teeth all four need fillings what's the likelihood that an 11 year old with new teeth that have just come in would need four fillings it's zero probability is zero it's a clear case he says of a dentist putting his own financial interests ahead of a patient's best interests [Music] the next five dentistry visits say close to what our experts recommend one mentions a cavity on Teresa's wisdom tooth another says she needs a night guard no big deal says dr. Dorothy McComb yes I would have to say those are relatively innocuous differences so we'll target that one also three four we're back at the U of T showing our expert the results of our test Macomb doesn't know which dentist recommended what treatment we keep it anonymous for the most part she's not too concerned about the differences we're uncovering in treatment plans says it's a matter of interpretation unfortunately in dentistry more than in medicine things are not absolutely black-and-white there's a lot of shades of grey and it depends very much on the dentist personal experience ironically there aren't too many shades of grey when we visit the next handful of dentists they seem to pretty much agree with our experts treatment recommendations but then we encounter dr. Joe Rudi Chi near Toronto he wants to do little fillings on teeth three four and thirty five which we've already marked you and then on four four so we'll add a sticker there and four seven that's already marked what's going on there some new fillings being recommended these are Bondage restorations and it's meant to be protective shouldn't all the dentists have seen that if there was a neat gray I would agree that you you know if worn out of twenty is the only ones saying it it raises some issues our next dentist raises some issues from a comb to big ones I would say it's it is it has puzzled me though the thing that's so puzzling Vancouver area dentist dr. Hossein Sarafan suggests replacing both bridges in Theresa's mouth the cost more than $7,000 and the most invasive treatment recommended he's the only dentist proposing such a radical move did you see any evidence of that bridges we don't usually replace unless there's a real real overt reason for it I'm not sure what the problem was that the dentist saw with that in fact other dentists we test even complement Teresa's bridge work bridges both look like they're in great shape one we try repeatedly to set up an interview with dr. Sarah fan no luck so many treatments also different retired dentist dr. Rick Byers can't get over our test results some of it I found quite frightening I mean they based on the information you showed me it was actually quite scary the invasive procedures like root canal and bridge replacement would be offered frightening but it's variation that experts like McComb say is why dentistry is as much an art as it is a science it's a little unnerving I I agree that that's that's how it comes across what and it is true that it is hard to explain I've spent many years trying to fathom why there's so much variation as we zip around this chart we hear teeth may have been targeted for reasons you wouldn't expect like this treatment may have been suggested because of where and when the dentist was trained this treatment the dentist's approach may be more aggressive than wait-and-see there's a lot of variation here is that fair to a patient they have to approach you perhaps a little bit like you might approach you know buying a used car you have to you have to have your critical judgment in place and you certainly have to suppress the notion that doctor knows best [Music] after the break we look for answers we're just trying to figure out why there's such variation among treatment plans for dentists [Music] we test 20 dentists in Toronto and Vancouver the treatments they recommend target 19 teeth and yet our experts only recommended cleaning and maybe one crown the cost for these differences of opinion from as low as a hundred and forty-four dollars to nearly 12,000 so what's our tester Theresa make of her twenty checkups to be honest Erica I'm confused there was such a variety of responses everything from just getting a cleaning to getting my bridges replaced and even though that kind of variation is apparently standard practice none of the major groups representing dentists in this country wants to talk about it Hyatt Erica Johnson calling from we try the Canadian Dental Association the Ontario Dental Association the BC Dental Association even the Ontario and BC dental colleges none of them will answer our questions on camera maybe they'll answer yours why not shoot an email to the Canadian Dental Association at reception at CDA - ad C dot CA meantime Theresa says she's taking away a valuable lesson from all these different treatment plans ask questions I did discover that there are dentists out there who will recommend things that I might not necessarily need something to chew on the next time you're asked to put your money where your mouth is [Music] for tips on how to check your checkup go to our website plus read tales from the dentist's chair and share your own

Channel: CBC News

Views: 1,547,589

Rating: 4.7294097 out of 5

Keywords: CBC News, CBCNews, CBC broadcasting media, public broadcasting news, Canadian News, Canadian Broadcasting Corportation (TV network), CBC News Network

Id: ixo0V6rNqi0

Length: 21min 25sec (1285 seconds)

Published: Mon Jun 15 2015

Reddit Comments

[u/Cobra_Khan]

My wife went to a dentist (in a mall) that said she had 4 cavities that needed to be filled.

We sought a second opinion. He said she had the start of 1 but it doesn't need to be filled yet.

Needless to say we have a new dentist, then the old one tried to charge us to hand over HER OWN dental records.

[u/xuxjafavi]

I like my dentist. He's honest and cares.

Hopefully he's not the last one... he's getting up there in age...

[u/lavendermacarons]

When I called around to book an appointment with a new dentist, almost all of them wanted to know how much our dental insurance covers.

Go in and, surprise surprise, the dental work they said we needed came to just over the amount insurance pays for the year.

Fucken scammers.

[u/rahtin]

My wisdom teeth grew in perfectly, lots of room, they're not decaying. I've had 2 dentists try to pull them because they know it will be easy money.

[u/Pedropeller]

I went to my dentist, who is a great guy I've known for decades. I needed two crowns because of broken teeth. One would cost $1200, the other $1600. I said I'll think about it. I ended up seeing a different dentist and it cost me about $5000!

Dental work should be covered by our so-called excellent medical.

OK, he was in Mexico, and it took five weeks. I came back with a helluva tan and incredible memories, and a little more Spanish. The actual dental work cost $340 CAD. My next dental visit will be in Mexico, too.

[u/BronzeLogic]

So how many of us are wondering now if the work we've had done was necessary?

[u/creeldeel]

Report fraudulent dentists to their governing boards, they have an ethical responsibility to provide accurate care.

[u/tarnok]

Fucking dentists.

[u/fillets]

Mine asked if I wanted to do home whitening. Did the mould free of charge so I just had to pay for the gel. And they try to get everything within the insurance.

Generally I find the "corporate" places to be worse.