How does China's education system work?

[Music] hello and welcome to dialogue nearly 12 million chinese high school students took part in this year's national college entrance examination commonly known as the god call from june the 7th to the 8th as one of the hardest exams in the world with great pressure on the students the gold coast has been the subject of a wide discussion over education in china how does china's education system work what are some of the problems and what changes could we see in the future to find out i'm joined today by david moser associate professor at capital normal university beijing flora liu founder of joy view education and professor lee jin zhao from beijing foreign studies university that's our topic i'm shuchin dhul [Music] welcome to the show well first of all to all my guests probably except for david you know have you taken the gold call i will start with the flora you know what's your experience you know like and how is it different from this guy called let's say yes i have experienced galco back in 2009 i would say it's not the best experience in my life i think um 20 pounds in my senior year of high school due to lack of course and just way too much pressure we were told by teachers and parents that we only have this shot and this would change our destiny as someone who's from a working class family i cherish this opportunity so badly and because uh it is a fair path forward in society right so i remember everyone in my classroom was desperately holding fast to this one chance in their lifetime and trying everything humanly possible um so previously when i took gaocao more than a decade ago students were required to pick either a science track or a liberal arts track in high school directing them towards a particular subject major at university right now under the new reforms i was told that students will still um be required to take chinese math and english as their three compulsory subjects and they also need to choose one between physics and history and choose um two subjects from the remaining four chemistry biology politics and geography i also heard there are changes in some area for example there are two chances to take the english exams each year if the student does not do well in march they have a second chance in june which seems less scary compared with only one chance like before so professor lee it's getting easier or less pressure i think it's getting easier compared to my year i took it in 1983 and i took it in xinjiang in retrospect the process was really full of anxiety but the result was exhilarating because for the first time in in the history of my middle school we after the the national exam i was in the class of liberal arts and 10 out of 50 students managed to get into the first tier universities so that was a huge success from our personal and school's perspective and at that time it was very competitive so i think uh the the rate of uh enrollment among all the attendees of the national exam was about uh 20 but now the enrollment rate among all the attendees of the national exam is about 90 80 80 percent uh then uh during kovid's pandemic the rate went up to 90 so but of course the anxiety nowadays is everybody wants to get into the top tier uh the best universities okay it's a bit different from previously you know you want to get into the university whatever university probably so david you know as a long-time you know china observer how do you introduce like a god how do you see this evolution or involvement or changes of a gold cow yeah well i i sort of first came in contact with my students in the 1980s not not 1983 but around 1986 or seven so i think it was probably about the same as professor lee's experience um you know some of my foreign friends uh think of the the the chinese educational system as sort of very static traditional tradition tradition-bound but i have to say in my what my god what is it like more than 30 years here's watching the changes in the gao cow i think the educational system and especially the gao cow is one of the most dynamic and influx areas of the the economy of the country they're always since i've been here they revised the gauchos so many times the ratios between the english and the math and in the past decade or two even more uh it's just amazing how much the experience has changed from the 1980s until now it's it's incredible well as we said uh there are always you know a lot of controversy a lot of discussion to say the least about uh you know gold call every year but for this year you know one of the controversies probably or you know topic mostly talked about is the essay based on the dream of a red timber so professor lee you know like what what's your interpretation you know what message is this sending out to the education to what we need to teach our kids or how we teach our kids you know by asking some sort of like asking students to read this traditional chinese classics the red chamber here i if i if i recall correctly the question based on the red chamber is about the naming of a garden right of this noble family so i think the the purpose of the title is to ask the students to use their imagination to be very creative uh and to talk about the concept of uh naming and i think from my perspective i think that the question is very phenomenological so you mean it because a meaning is very important so how do you name a place will be very definitive of the nature of that place so i personally think that question actually is very creative if you compare the creativity of the the level of wild imagination of this topic to right now we we have seen some of the topics from the entrance the college exam from france i i took a look at their philosophy exam questions mine their questions are very very wide very very creative such as do you think art can generate social change so i think compared to their questions ours are still within the framework of understanding classics and giving your own interpretation in connection with uh some social phenomena from the present flora you know in the chinese context if you read the chinese for example language chinese language-based like the internet to all the media you know a whole discussion about this topic uh i say here uh the dream of a red chamber some people will say oh obviously that requires at least you you have read this piece of a classic and then and you can probably do your essay over there so that's something for a lot of students yeah so in when i was a high school student i did read hong kong that the book you mentioned so if i were to take the test very luckily i could easily write an essay about that but i understand not all people have time to read that because the schedule in high school is just so intense and people just don't have extra time to read extra readings so um so i would say uh have having students to write an essay or answer answering questions based on the chinese classical literature can be both a good and bad thing good in a sense that we it shows that we cherish our traditional culture we value um the chinese classics but it's also very unfair because students just don't have so much time especially in rural area i don't think students have access to um the quality education to walk them through the assets of the books yeah so no wonder that there's heated discussions on the internet because to some people it's just too hard and um and also even if people like me who can answer the question what practical value does it bring does it help me to become a more civic minded citizen of the globe does it help me to make more money does it help me to help my community not necessarily right so when we when we take a look at gao cal we also need to ask is it that useful to to prepare or for for the gao cow is it a waste of time for so many students just to read so many stuff and practice all those um all those math questions what value does it bring to the society well david you know like either uh commenting on this particular topic you know based on this uh dream of red timber or in general the choice of topics choice of topics to write an essay for the students who join these exams you know like what's your take of that how it's controversial always controversial some people uh for it some people are strong against you know what can we make out of these choices uh well um actually it's funny because i'm just now starting to try to read dream of the red chamber because i think after 30 years maybe my chinese is sort of good enough so i sympathize with the with the students because it's very difficult indeed i think even for a native chinese i think that the task it seems like the challenge is that the to to give the students a task that's that's so in a certain way constricting it's a very small domain the idea is to see how challenge the students creativity how can they come up with something something new or interesting or eye-catching with such a with such a topic i remember a few years ago maybe as much as 10 years ago some student actually wrote filled out the essay wrote the essay in uh tiago when the ancient chinese the original form of chinese the oracle bone style of calligraphy and there was a controversy at the time is this creative or is this cheating you know is it just a gimmick or does this actually show the students you know ability and i think i think the people who design the test are faced with a pr a problem of how do we with so many people participating you know millions of people taking this test how do we how do we allow certain very rare individuals to to to sort of uh arise from the from the masses to come up with a very brilliant uh you know original it's a challenge and i don't know if don't ask me uh i'm just really starting to read dream of red chamber so the chinese language right novel right right yes you know let's compare you know the chinese practice probably with other countries like where you are from uh david you know in the u.s correct me if i'm wrong you know emphasis seems to be not only about you know the test scores to get into university but also about probably extra curriculum activities like sports music arts and even community activities you know uh so how do you think the chinese universities for the admittance for the students probably to narrow when they focus on the scores i i think that in the past that has been a problem i mean uh people compare the the uh the gaucho with the the old uh uh could you the imperial exam system um you're faced with a problem which is way too many candidates millions of candidates and only a few slots for for each student so um in the past i think there was this problem that was a very rigid test with very unreasonably difficult uh you know exams now as professor lee i think it was pointed out or maybe it was score i can't remember that up to that are you're having now a 90 participation rate and many more educational resources many more colleges and many more options and i think that the gauhau is opened up uh you know for that reason in the united states it's very different we don't have a sort of a a one-pass test that everyone has to take but in the united states uh and this is might be of interest to young people you know listening there's a lot of emphasis on your statement of purpose in other words the right the the document that you submit saying why you want to attend this university and what you want to do with your time there is looked upon as very important and maybe of similar importance to the gao cow because you could have a very good resume and a very good grade performance but are you creative can you think can you reason can you can you make a study plan for the next four years and you know i think in the west we look at that how how will the student perform if they come here but then we have many fewer students to to be evaluating so it's much easier in our system uh so flora i know your company joy of your education basically that's part of your job right and you helped advertisement [Laughter] like how important is it um yeah so as someone who have already uh taken the gaucho and who is now helping hundreds of chinese students go to the top universities in uk and us i think i can share some of my perspectives um a very short answer i think the the u.s college admission system admits a human being while the chinese system right now as far as i can see is admit a perfect score so there is a difference but we all know that the student is more than the scores right it's a student is more than the test scores he or she gets there's so much more about a student about their personality that their life story that the struggles they've been through um the inspirations right and how they serve the community and how they contributed in a classroom and to their family there's so much more than just the score um very interestingly in the past two years student coveted 19 a lot of the standardized task centers have been shut down so students um cannot take sat act or toefl um but a lot of my students uh regardless when they have not the chance to take the sat or act they still got into grade schools how did it happen because they shared their life story because they through the personal statements or supplemental assays they showed you the u.s colleges where uk colleges what kind of person they are what kind of person they aspire to be what kind of value they can bring to this world so in short i i think the chinese university admissions system could in a way you know learn from the us college admission system admit a student a human being not just a test score professor lee what's your response you are from this chinese university here yeah i i partially agree but again as mr moser has pointed out because of the sheer size and because chinese college entrance exam is centralized and standardized so it's hard to have individual or independent enrollment i mean university or college based independent enrollment colleges universities in china are trying to bring in more criteria to enroll students and talents and they also have specific programs for enrolling talents from countryside but still it's really hard to get rid of this centralized and standardized scores because i think these scores can make some parents more feel safe and confident that their kids can get into first year or second tier universities without much corruption or black tourism or without much favoritism so and of course i'm talking about this from the perspective of winners i think that the college entrance exam in china can help a student to develop their true grit to develop their perseverance whether they succeed or not if they can go through this rigorous process of exam they can nail a lot of many other obstacles in their life but i agree with flora that we should really not just focus on the scores we should bring in more comprehensive criteria to enroll a student into college follow-up question professor lee you know there are there are discussions on the internet let's say you know people say oh the chinese government all the society is paying uh you know increasing attention to the fitness or the sporty uh you know factor uh for the chinese students ah you know sport is somehow becoming a main subject uh you know probably chinese math and uh and the sports instead of english as a main subject for the uh you know high schools in china uh is that the trend or is that somehow likely uh the rumor went on for a while but now the policy is still having three core scores uh chinese math and english and i think the emphasis of sports is necessary it's not over emphasis it's proper emphasis because a survey conducted in 2019 showed that 60 percent of elementary and secondary students were taking in putting a lot of time in a private tutoring and 70 over 78 percent of the students have the problem of getting sick easily or not having enough sleep or not spending much time outdoor spending too much time indoor so i think it's a very good reminder that students should not just strengthen their mind but also their physique david obviously in the u.s i mean sports a big thing you know either in the high school or in the university i mean there's a clear difference between the chinese education and the us education probably in that respect yes but but they we don't have the problem in the united states of the extreme you know almost crushing academic burden of these tests uh so students i mean i think chinese kids and adults if given the chance and given less pressure academic pressure would in fact move towards sports i mean people love to exercise they love to play game you know football baseball basketball whatever and in the united states it takes its natural course of course we have certain uh we call them nerds or bookworms or something like like me who never really did uh college or high school you know sports at all but i s but i did exercise i ran i did things so it's not a problem we have to deal with the problem with china is that there's so much pressure on the kids you know to pass these these not just the gaucho but but all the tests and these cram courses that they that they have to go through and taking piano lessons and violin lessons that they don't have the time you know to to actually you know exercise so but some i've heard some people say some chinese people my chinese friends say oh great now they're going to have an athletic requirement that means the kids will have equal pressure like you know oh we're going to do jump rope so you can bet the parents will hire jump roping tutors and have them spin after hours glasses jumping rope so they can get better at jumping rope and so it's kind of a sickness chinese need to let the kids have some room to breathe for heaven's sake i mean that's a problem here but with so much pressure to succeed what can you do right uh flora related development you know last year we know the chinese government implemented this new policy strong jian or double reduction uh policy aiming to put a limit on how much extracurricular work students are allowed to do which has basically shut down many you know tutoring schools so a year on do you think this regulation is helping ease the stress levels in chinese students um i think in a way it does ease the stress uh on children but it does not ease the stress on parents because when the when the supply is cut the demand is still here right people still need to take dow cal and people still need to take the the jungkook the middle school the high school entrance examinations and parents all know that only 50 of the chance their kid can go to a distant high school rather than going to a vocational school so parents are so anxious and they can't find outside school tutors so guess who is helping them for free so i've been busy helping my relatives with friends children for free ever since last october i was exhausted the reason why i had to help them because they were so afraid that their kid would end up in a vocational school and let me just share with you one story i'm just adding on to what professor lee just mentioned so a couple of days ago a very anxious mom approached me her daughter is in sixth grade and she she's been having nightmares recently afraid that her daughter would end up in a vocational school i say what's so bad about a vocational school right and she said you know what if she goes to a vocational school that means she has no freedom she has to work two shifts in a factory with no air conditioning and she needs to try so hard to control her bladders because she's only given twice a day to go to the toilet and each time five minutes maximum and i was laughing so hard i hope this is not isolated the case i hope not all moms are so anxious like this mom but this does say something about people's stereotype a vocational education even if they graduate from from a vocational school even a top one if we don't have the strong effective labor labor law protecting the rights of the skillful labels neighbors and if there's no respect from the society level towards those skillful labor vocational school is still not a sexy idea people would still work so hard and trying everything they can to send their kids to a great high school to a great college and exhausted their friends who can speak english professor lee you mentioned about you know part of the chinese reform you know vocational training schools probably more of them will come out and you know more cases probably will join there uh say part of the reason is like technical schools cannot fulfill the government's target of training skilled skilled workforce according to this you know rather drastic reform 50 of the middle school graduates will enroll in technical schools rather than academic high schools which prepare students to go to the college so traditionally however people still prefer you know universities or colleges to vocational education schools at least the parents do probably how can we increase this social acceptance of vocational schools education is okay in the society that's acceptable that's something you can be proud of yeah actually the moe the ministry of education has emphasized has launched this law which is called vocational educational law and in this new law it makes very clear that we need to give enough credit and we need to pay enough emphasis on vocational education in the past vocational education students were enrolled or were promoted only after the their entrance into a senior high school or their entrance into college so it gives you the implication that only those kids who do not have quote unquote a bright future uh would choose vocational school or polytechnic school as a secondary choice but now the reform has made it clear that the vocational school or polytechnic school will have governments more investment more educational investment and they will be more aligned with the top-notch technological development in china with uh the cutting-edge enterprises in china so these kids will be after they finish school they can get right into these enterprises and these cutting-edge industries and they can have a more decent level of income and living and more importantly they can still have the opportunity of participating in uh college examination but in the past they would not have this opportunity so it means that they are given both uh much more emphasized in more much more emphasis in terms of their social status and also they are given equal opportunity of entering college if they want to further pursue their postgraduate education or post high school education right well with that we come to the end of today's show many thanks to our guests you can also find us on the cgt app on youtube i'm shooting thank you for being with us see you next time [Music]

Channel: CGTN

Views: 21,525

Keywords: CGTN, News, China, Education, gaokao, Students, National College Entrance Examination, Asia, Education system

Id: 4my1XsvcXpI

Length: 29min 1sec (1741 seconds)

Published: Fri Jun 24 2022