Dick Cavett: Brief Encounters

hello welcome to Socrates in the city did you know that you were at a Socrates in the city event did you care be honest you didn't care this is an exciting evening because mr. dick cavett is gonna be here yeah I don't know about you but I get very excited when I think about dick and if he weren't caught in traffic on 44th Street and 6th Avenue I'd be in a great mood right now I know you're wondering is he kidding is he kidding I'm not I'm kidding he's he's back here he's right back here I am I'm thrilled that that he consented to come again to Socrates in the city he's been here a bunch of times but every time it's so awful but I know he won't come back but he comes back again and again and again it really is a thrill for me that that you're here and that he's here and let me say this tonight's a particularly special evening because of the tree-lighting don't you think I just I was actually worried that none of you would get here because of the traffic so thank you for planning ahead and taking the subway or whatever you did to get here thank you and if you're late I hate you did you hear that this is the last year that they're gonna do that DeBlasio is shutting that down did you hear about that yeah what were his words I wrote it down he said yeah he called he wants to put an end to the murder of these innocent Giants those were his words yeah he's shutting it all down folks well in this case I mean he has he has a point just not on that subject you know what I'm saying yeah anyway look this is it's a dream come true for me to interview a legend I think if dick has a legend along the lines of I don't know Johnny Appleseed Pecos Bill that level that level of legend but it's true to get to talk to him he's a TV legend he's an icon he is certainly for me a friend I'm glad to say at this point a friend an idol a friend and I just found out this is gonna freak you out he's he's my biological father yeah but but he's everywhere he goes he's getting awards and this is important he got an award from the Abington theater there's a bunch of folks here from the Abington theater right thank you for coming dick starred in a play Hellman V McCarthy which tells the really beautiful painful please please the beautiful painful story of the feud between Lillian Hellman and Mary McCarthy incredible and in this play dick played himself just so you understand the level of greatness and legend we're now talking about he gets to play he doesn't even have to do anything except pretend he's 34 years younger you know that's that's that that was the role basically so he gets to play himself and the only one I can think of that I know of who ever got to play himself was like Babe Ruth I think in the in the pride of the Yankees he remember that he got to play the dick is at this level he gets to play himself everywhere he goes he gets awards and so anyway the Aventine theater gave him this wonderful award it was a wonderful event and for me the highlight of it was they got someone to sing a song a tribute to dick and I thought I wonder if we can get that woman to come here and to sing that wonderful song and we couldn't we couldn't we couldn't and it's and then at one point I thought oh I'll I'll find someone to sing and I rewrote the lyrics rather rather dramatically so I had the lyrics ready to go but we couldn't get anybody to sing it we couldn't we couldn't even get a piano unfortunately and I I wish I wish we'd been able to find a piano but I would have sight would have sung it myself if we could but then you need to get a piano player and you know that's not gonna happen you know them you know what I'm saying it's just not going happen but let me be honest with you if it were to happen it would probably go something like this not exactly like this but something like this roughly roughly he's talked with Groucho and Lucille Ball with Evel Knievel and Simon Wiesenthal he's delightful he's the lovely he's Dick Cavett thank you he's closed with Bob Hope and with Mel Torme with William F Buckley and with Bob Boulais he's delightful he's the lovely he's Dick Cavett he has interviewed Ingmar Bergman and Alfred Hitchcock and David Lean not to mention Truman Capote and Orson Welles and orson bean he had Hepburn and Abba [Music] and Michael Caine and George McGovern and Mickey Spillane he's delightful he's the lovely he's Dick Cavett and that guy who died from the heart attack and Woody Allen and Roberta Flack he's delightful here's to love me [Music] you could hear Jacques Cousteau and Marcel Marceau on his show and John and Yoko and oh my how he got dissed when he landed on Nixon's enemies list so I ask you friends what's not to like he's had Bella Abzug and Dick Van Dyke he's delightful he's too lovely is delirious he's a darling is it is Easter luxe he's adorable [Music] [Applause] thank you [Applause] thank you ladies and gentlemen Dick Cavett [Applause] [Music] [Applause] hey thanks hi this is Bob joined the Peace Corps ho Thank You Eric I cried and all I could think of is I made you get a nasty letter from G gordon Liddy saying you didn't mention him and the stuff he don't fake you did he was in a previous draft actually anyway the trick is to get on stage before the applause ends and I think we did it we did it so I sit here ladies and gentlemen Dick Cavett oh yeah I you made it you beat the traffic yeah there's no traffic in this part of town because of the demonstrations going on downtown on the night of the Christmas tree isn't that Oh their demonstration wonderful yeah in New York yeah it was I was not aware of that they're demonstrating against you and me that's what everything funny staff well dick my first question is how can we get this marvelous product the book is it out there are they selling it out there I hope they're out there and my friend Calvin Trillin oom I know you all read in The New Yorker it was a classmate of mine but by one year and every author will sympathize with his long threatened book that will be called an anthology of authors atrocity stories about publishers someone's written a book your wife probably put you through the years and then you got good reviews and they're known well the book there's so much in this book it's like the last one it's a collection of if those of you for those of you who don't know dick writes a column why do they call it a blog I don't know it's a column it's an ugly word yeah and column is too deeper the way some people write them but I don't know cuz it isn't in a column on line is it let's think of a better term isn't it how about mini masterpiece oh my goodness and not even that many wonderful ok we'll stick with that but if so it's a collection of columns and they are gosh they're wonderful so I thought let me just start with the first one I was when I went through it I thought it's so beautiful the first the first two lines in the book you criticize Humphrey Bogart for getting the Shakespearean quote wrong and I thought that is just so like you and I hope he can take that criticized I didn't take any nerve he's dead he didn't it's a I think what I once saw Bogart plane I was 12 years old I think Hollywood in a cab with my father and an mg convertible as we were stopped at a light here was faced this way stopped here and there was bogey and I I don't think I'd ever seen that huge a star before in my life and I can still feel the impact and a bit of trivia on the hood be and be in nice little ceramic cubes and years later I told Lauren Bacall this story on the show and I said I can't figure out how it said B&B I knew one of them would be Bogart and then I said and the gods touched me has been Betty and bogey and she said you're so goddamn smart did anyone hear that over there well you know women talk that way I would never part of what you might you've said this a couple of times you said this on Larry King when Elizabeth Taylor died and you said it on Charlie Rose about three years ago you referred to the stars of that era whatever that era is before this era as redwoods yes you know who I did that this will resemble a plug almost I'm sorry Eric but it depends for the day there's a don't apologize if it's a good product plug away okay thank you for there's a there five box sets of the cabbage shows out on and they're available in Amazon but this isn't a plug and there I think I haven't forgotten how much they are I think I get about four dollars if you run out and buy one but one of them is called Hollywood greats and I was on a radio show and I said look at this I'm just looking at the box now Katharine Hepburn Betty Davis Fred Astaire Groucho Marx Alfred Hitchcock Orson Welles Kirk Douglas Frank Capra and Marlon Brando and Robert Mitchum and that occurred to me then he said I would I said who who are their counterparts today it's as if these were redwoods and now we have elm trees now that's unforgivable because we have many great actors and stars but there is something larger about those people somehow I don't know what it is we've got to figure it out that we could spend the rest of the evening well yeah do you think they they didn't allow as much access I mean I was trying to figure out what it was myself yeah I don't know Betty Davis addressed this question on a show of moments it said you know they say you shouldn't you should just be realistic and remind people of people they know on the screen but she said I like a little bigness a little bigger than life and because Betty Davis said it in that great voice and inflection the audience applauded you don't have that was enough that was the night or you've heard this I'm sorry but it was going so well we had Betty Davis for 90 minutes she had a lot of lifting done temporary and yellow glasses she looked sad yeah there was temporary lifting I had it in Forrest Gump but that's another story and I suddenly I thought I'm sitting here with Betty Davis how'd I get so lucky Betty why did you do this tonight you don't like this sort of thing and she said well you're a gentleman Richard and I know that I'm in good hands and I said so how'd you lose your virginity baby right yeah I've seen it the whole point is it's on that box of DVDs called Howard right right right right will you be signing those DVDs tonight oh I don't know if there are any DVDs here tonight they're not but I'm gonna be signing them well if you from home everyone write your name on a piece of paper well okay so so yes the columns are delightful and I guess I wanted to ask you it's a sort of inside baseball since I'm a writer how did it happen that The Times approached you and said would you like to write a column because you've written comedy for all the greats so you're a writer but you're you're thought of as a comedy writer you wrote those two books with Christopher Porterfield yeah sort of talking about your life but the idea of writing a column for The Times today I guess what I start four years ago five years ago at least yeah yeah who came up with that idea how did that happen you know I wish I could take credit for it or give somebody else credit for it all I remember that as we say in the trade it came over the transom somebody somebody's you've had a offers for this and that and the times thinks you might want to write a column and I thought oh it scared me give me a chill just now and they want to a week mmm but in fact my immediate reaction to that I confess was that's easy I write fast I always upset the older writers on the comedy show still in The Tonight Show staffs that I was on because I wrote my stuff and got it in before they ever have finished you know we hate people like not to do this in a good way yeah I said okay I'll do it and I wrote to that week and I wrote to easily the next week and then I wrote the first one for the third week and I thought that's it I'm out finish I have nothing more to say I wrote Basil Rathbone his ghost story column and I couldn't think of anything else that had happened in my life now hundreds of columns later I'm still empty I'm working on one about Mike Nichols god we've lost a lot of good people this year the now's not a good time to bring up that Dick Cheney is still alive so I so I was debating backstage whether I could get that past year tonight York myself you could you could I'm on HuffPost live immortalizes a little squib from a show I did on their David Frost had just died and it says Cavett asked about death of David Frost why is it never Dick Cheney and you know these children are all here by the way so be careful that's we're gonna stop right there that's enough glad for them where was we people are gonna wonder when you're telling the truth so I'm lying now if so okay so they they said to you would you like to write something and then you said what no now I only want to do it once a month how did it cuz you dude about whatever you three weeks or dribbled down to finally doing one and every two week one every two weeks I don't know who these geniuses are who write a column every day mostly in the sports world but they're you know they're people who turn out a column and hey there was a drunk on the New York Post who used to write columns on TV every day except the ones where it said is ill and you knew that he was facedown on a sidewalk somewhere but yeah just kidding they give you but who and I never know what you're telling the truth all right so then it's an some other drunk okay well whatever it doesn't matter no idea well but but so you were allowed to write it basically as often as you want and that's I'm assuming because it's online if it were in the paper you'd you'd need to stick to a schedule I suppose so yeah and also it's amazing how many people say I never see your column I heard I heard you on mark Simone and he said you got to read dicks column it's great and I look through the paper and I never find it do you know the six letter word online no sometimes you you uh okay so you can write herself as you wanna whose idea was it to put it to collect them and put them in books whose idea was that someone at that hole to my publisher someone obviously very tasteful and astute not in marketing well they had a choice is printing me or Bill Buckley's old columns and I guess they decided Buckley Buckley was a piece of work did I write over something he said uh no I wanted to ask my we're only about Buckley he's on my list which I think I left in the green room you had him on a number of times did you not yes you were friends I believe you swam together at one point with Eric please sorry it's admit it these are adults you know yeah we swam together once yes really were pulled through the water Bill Buckley his wonderful wife Pat my late wife and I and somebody had forgotten who had hold of my ankles were pulled through the water by a gift I'd been given of a thing that pulls you through the water with a motor on it and I thought it was it a boat well what do you cook what do you call something that pulls you through the water dick it was an engine with a back thing on it made by the back thing company in fact if you're gonna pick it apart this story right right well we're just dying to know what it was I want one really I think it was called a putt putt all right clears it up doesn't it it was a putt putt let's say it was a putt putt sure but my first encounter with Bill Buckley was sophomore English class at Yale professor Cecil Y Lang said you might all want to go over to the law school tonight the man I consider the most dangerous man in the world is lecturing there and I went over to see the most dangerous man in the world who wouldn't and and it was William F Buckley Jr and he was eccentric and strange and who was it used to do him but I going yeah everybody I think yeah and he was very funny and he had he had phrases that I hoped I'd remember like the mental spastics who read the nation that was a good impression and we a lot of us remember the name yeah fade to black first week of my show nervous as hell daytime ABC Bill Buckley and I was afraid of him but it was going all right until he said I said something I'm not familiar with that and he said you don't seem to be familiar with anything you know I naturally thought you son of a [ __ ] this is my first week of doing this show I'm responsible for 90 minutes of live television I'm worried and you scared me and I just feel awful and the audience went ooh when he did it but I got him back want to hear that like make it quick unfortunately we're out of time dick I'm so sorry I hate that about Lots the thing with live TV heartbreak it's a heartbreak we're done you know here you can't say we have a message when it gets rough and then regroup oh sure I can but well anyway and we're back so dick if you had just you had a Buckley anecdote verbling just beneath the surface you ya forgot in a burst fog on another show he said as Oscar Wilde said hypocrisy is the compliment advice pays to virtue and F and the whole audience Allah what yeah and I went what but a woman had given me a book of French citizen and I had been reading it a week before a thing worth worthy of your miracle book days before I had read that quote in it and it was not Oscar Wilde it was La Rochefoucauld yes it's gonna say was that LaRoche Foucault yeah isn't it amazing that's amazing that's amazing when you know if you don't know who said the quote nine times out of ten its LaRoche Foucault it's true I don't know how that is but that's true right he's right behind Shakespeare just ahead yes yeah and I got Buckley back on oh and I happened to bring it up and I said build you know you're very astringent with your guests in many ways you like things to be accurate you challenge them on facts yes where is this going and I said well it's going to you last you can say you son of a [ __ ] no no I I saved that and told his wife to call him that so I let him around to it and I said that quote you gave I think I have it exact that Sealy poco see it oh no mas que la vie so um they live LT how does that go in English [Laughter] oh yes hypocrisy and so on so I knew you'd want to know that bill that you because I like to go on people's shows and not mislead their audience that I knew you'd want to and he said thank you I come here to be educated that a really great response and you were is that for him or and I know that you became no one I but you you you were friendly you were with very much for many years he was a lot of fun and very witty of course and famous for when some woman I used to know her names for some crazy reason a Rodian saying cancel my subscription to your magazine mr. Buckley yes and he wrote back cancel your own damn subscription actually now now I'm going to correct you oh it wasn't I know the exact quote he said cancel your own GD description except he spoke it out yes it was even worse than damn but it infinitely better wanted that syllable as a comedy writer you know sometimes just a syllable and better rhythm has better punch and reading deeper rhythm it so Ambika trochaic in fact I think gesundheit I think I think they published this is true I think they published a collection of his columns with that title I'm not kidding maybe somebody really review online they can tell us I don't know speaking of William F Buckley I wanted to ask you something that has nothing to do with him I think we dog blood bad no this is something I don't think I've ever asked you this before how was it dick that you transitioned from you were a writer you did some stand-up how did you get on TV who suggested it or were you fighting for that and it finally happened or did somebody come to you with the idea I have no idea and I'd love to know that as you can see the people who've been to those places that coach you on how to go and television and play your book tell them to say is a very good question you can see them all say it once I didn't know I couldn't reconstruct it I've told the story about guts silly taking him on a log to Jack fire and find him coming from the men's room and he hired me as a writer after a day or something but how did I get into talk television I never wanted it I mean I've never dreamed of it wait year what was it 67 68 when did you get the morning show 68 Achtung sexy in your language and your mother's language yeah yes my mother the kraut a German person of German origin and I I did a pilot agent called and said they've got this pilot idea you have to fly out to California and it's called the star and the story and the idea was to get a movie star until his her life in five half hours throughout the week we got the great Van Johnson he was delightful van you were born in than ever and they plotting Lee to old man Johnson's life for five half hour episodes it was sent to ABC and they hated it and I was told that someone in the room said but let's not lose track of that kid who was the host he might be the one we should try our daytime talk show idea with or on and that was ma and I did it the very first show scared to death 90 minutes how am I gonna get through this how do you do this now date time what what time during the day it was a you know I'm not actually sure it's been referred to as my morning show and my midday show I think it was something like 11:30 why because it's such I'm inai I can't put myself back to remember what was on in those years but today of course that it's completely different okay you know late-night shows and daytime shows different audiences I think it was different then as well but not maybe not as different you're no Jerry Springer sir I'm friends with Jerry Springer and you're no Jerry Springer who says yeah I actually never aspired to be Jerry Springer but but he is as people say on talk shows when they're afraid they might say something bad he's a dear friend of mine and they never are I can't I actually can't think of anyone in the culture there are a lot of people in the culture that I think are bad influences I can't think of anyone worse than Jerry Springer and I just had to get that out so that's why I always say when you're smiling but okay so you did how long did you do the daytime show for ABC never promoted it protests came from people who accidentally discovered it a middle aired a mostly housewives yeah I used to see letters copied to me to ABC why the hell don't you promote this show I only heard found it by accident I hate to think of losing it and the audience began to build without any help from the network and then it ended and then I was sitting in a theater in London and a woman and the row behind me tapped my shoulder and said congratulations and I thought she meant forgetting tickets to this hit slave London and she I said you mean something else and she said well you're replacing Joey bishop Joey Bishop was the late-night host in on ABC and in fact I was no one had been polite enough to tell me and obviously if it hadn't been for that woman I never would have and and what happened to Joey Joey as someone what do you know other than the Dean Martin roasts that he used to do remember what happened to him he was a very good comic marvelous stand-up comic with a slow face and a fast mind interesting combination and not a very nice man in fact two writers I worked for him for a week and that awkward interval between Jack Barnes Johnny Carson when everybody in show business hosted the Tonight Show fizzle we know about that in your book right it was called I called it the stock company period for everybody from Mort Sahl the Groucho to one of the Gabor - Donald O'Connor hosted the Tonight Show fat Jack Leonard everybody fat Jack Leonard oh yes how many people here remember fat jack Leonard I'm just checking yeah feel free to tell this yes I thought he was hilarious he was a lovely man he never came to the show without bringing cufflinks or tie clips or presents for people on the staff and just a nice guy a so-called insult comedian or whatever but he was so nice and he had certain stock lines and I wanted to hear them every time and he did them every time one of them was once you put your glasses on backwards and walk into yourself I didn't think I was gonna get a fat Jannard impression tonight or you were at any point in the rest of my life you know you haven't learned to aim high thank you yeah that's true all things are possible another time so I I thought how do I write for him he's a guest host for a week and Telstar Telstar and what a huge word that was back the first big satellite had gone up that day and I gave him a line I thought he probably wouldn't use and at the end of his monologue I said you might want to close with this line they're gonna be a party after the show and then we're gonna all go up on the roof and shoot down til star this killed me yes I don't know why and the only other thing I can remember giving him was why don't I give him a fresh version of some of his stock lines and I gave him why don't you walk into a parking meter and violate yourself that's yours that's yours no that's excellent except today they don't know they don't have that the thing that says violation oaks laughs yes yes well okay and I want to ask you also you you have a tremendous theater background you've always been interested I'm guessing there are a lot of people here who know that and a lot of people here who have no idea about that I mean you did Rocky Horror you've done a few things but you're you're a man of the theater and you have been since Yale pretty much No well actually since Nebraska well by some anomaly no no Braska is not a time by the way oh you really over in Nebraska in eighth grade I had Lula be more Lula be more was a lovely ancient Vierge who taught miss more acting and there was the drama to special class and one day I was called out of class to the principal's office because out of nowhere suddenly an equity summer theater in a barn like the oldest summer stock theater huge dairy barn opened and lasted for several seasons New York actors got off the train in Nebraska and couldn't figure out what had happened to them because they couldn't see any tall buildings and they could see the sky forever and and they wanted a young man who might be able to do an English accent and Miss Moore had discovered that I could and I starred with a company of brilliant actors in the Winslow boy how old were you I was this was three years ago 14 yeah you I think I remember that you were like 14 Nicolette yeah I was I was that I was whatever you are in junior high is what I was yeah and there's a good joke there I came up with it whatever you are in junior high I think Ronnie is 14 in the play mm-hmm but I remember standing in the wings opening night and I was the first one to enter alone and I thought I can't do this something some supernatural power has got to be invoked to get me through this evening I have every third line in this play but I did get feel it I love doing it and that was my first acting then it'll plays at Yale and then they knew you before that did you ever have the desire to act was this just something they sprang on you I I took the drama class in junior high thinking I might want to be an actor probably in Lincoln for the rest of my life in the hayloft summer theatre because I never dreamed of going I dreamed of going east but I never thought it was could be a reality and when a family friend my parents have all been school teachers from Omaha had had a fellowship to Yale said dick should apply to Yale this is his senior year and I didn't know what he was talking about probably didn't know what apply to Yale man but I did and the envelope came and I thought well I know the first words will be we regret there was a summer day I was home alone opened the thing congratulations he will be in the class of 1958 and I remember it was I don't know if he PIFAN E is the right word but Eric will tell you I thought it's not but go ahead they won't know the difference go ahead they won't know right this spells the rest of my life in some way had it said we regret yes you would have looked silly talking to an empty chair tonight I can look silly right now even though you do you I didn't I didn't mention this earlier but we met the day that I graduated from Yale I was the class day speaker and the celebrity speaker was to cam it little dickie cab you were 48 years old at the time good guy and the next year you turn 49 if you turn for you do you remember that you remember that yes and it's amazing at 94 yeah all right right but you did you do but you did you when you were at Yale you did you did theater did you not or was that I did see a teraz it sometimes called in the Midwest yeah yeah I always broke me crazy when people said theater yeah I did and but freshman year I didn't my parents reminded me that when I got on the train the Challenger I think it was in Lincoln's railway station the night I left home for Yale that I had said what if I can't do the work and my dad said you'll be all right but I didn't know whether he knew they had and so freshman year I was scared or jealous I just didn't think that I could would you don't let it pass oh he you are he less I was I was trying to be genteel you you were quite genteel nobody knows what you meant but I thought I just I was so scared that to the hatred it instilled in my roommates if a philosophy paper was assigned freshman year on can we isolate a given element in knowledge whatever the hell that means I went home and wrote that paper without even going to the dining hall for lunch and typed it clean and paper clipped it and put it in my drawer so it would be ready eight days later when it was due and that's how I was freshman year I was afraid I'd flunk out but as luck would have it my Bronxville anti-semitic roommate flunked out for me and but I didn't dare do a play because I would talk to guys who were in plays and they'd say God we were up till 4:00 a.m. with a lighting rehearsal and I got classes at 8:00 and up but after that I made the Dean's List that year and I never did again but I was in a lot of shadows Cyrano The Great Gatsby the crucible god knows what all did you did you know before you went to Yale that you wanted to be in show business yeah I didn't want to be in anything else my poor father fearful of my ever not ever making a dollar and he was obsessed with money as were almost all his contemporary teacher friends who had been through the depression he taught school remembers telling me he got the job desperate for a job teaching English in Comstock Nebraska I'm sure a lot of you who've been there hold your applause for $600 hmm raised to 700 the next year and ever and anon he would say your mother and I would have to decide whether we could spend a dime for a movie or we should buy bread or lettuce or something with it so he was always oh so he had said you know where they got a great dental school at the University of Nebraska and they have a pretty good law school and you know you got to think about you know this show business stuff it's pretty dicey and but I knew I was never gonna be a dentist I love dentists I don't mean but I just knew that Yale I knew from talking this benefactor this teacher Frank Rice who got me into Yale got me to apply and I got in had said you know the great thing about New Haven is not the weather but the Shubert theater what's that it's what's called a tryout theater all the Broadway shows on their way to New York start at the Schubert almost all some in Boston then the Schubert and for the next four years I saw everybody in the Golden Age what I think it was the last of the Golden Age of American theater the Lunt's and no coward and Rhett Frederic March and of just every Helen Hayes and Judith Anderson all these legends of my life from theater arts magazine and there I was looking at them with nothing but air between me and them and I went backstage frequently and walked into their dressing rooms ok toting that hold on a second now hold on right there you have you have a knack a thing for being backstage so if anybody's ever wondering where you are if they can't find you your backstage someplace typically right and look at Rick Harrison's dressing room he's probably in there that was when did that start and what gave you the the sense the hoods but to think that you could get backstage because you know I was a student at Yale and I wasn't wandering around backstage at the Schubert I don't know how do what put that idea into your head I don't know that was an idea it seemed more like a compulsion I just thought here I go backstage you just couldn't help yourself no heart taking me there and just invite the heart wants what it wants right you just spent right a little voice was say sure who's gonna walk into Judy holidays dressing room are you oops here's her door and there I was and hello and I walked into Judy Garland's dressing room at the Palace in New York while I was a Yale you just walked into it well I went backstage to see if I could get in and I said to the guy I'm a friend of Judy's and he said okay and that's different and if you're backstage and there's a backstage doorman and say how's it going pop is he's always called pop and say he thinks you're supposed to be there and then I I went down a little hall it was dark it's the Radio City Music Hall no it wasn't it was a palace better the Palace Theater in the lyric of one of her songs and a figure in a housecoat was walking ahead of me and it was a little broader than I thought Judy Garland was so I didn't think it was Judy Garland but it was and I followed her into a dressing room and she wheeled about and Margaret whiting the singer was in there and her face was kind of a pudding favorite weddings are Judy's Margaret weddings are Judy's no Judy Miss Judy she had taken all her splendid makeup off and she had just come up I was probably the only straight man and her audience at the palace that night and you're not that straight let's be honest it's a New York crowd it's okay well this is the night it comes out right right but she I spoke to her and she kept trying to figure out who I was and my and I will admit that my voice has always been distinctive even when I was a kid yeah I have this feeling at puberty it went up because I had always had a low voice and in fact talked from the back of a room that other people were talking and everybody turned around when I said something and it was strange for me so my voice seemed to get me and people see me intrigued by it but at one point I said stayed just to touch too long perhaps and she said what is this an interview the [ __ ] yes exactly I excused myself and years later on television I was able to say I don't know anything else to say about my next guest except Miss Judy Garland bang and she didn't you didn't remind her of this incident I should have I wonder if I did I don't know well you reminded all the other greats of when you'd met them years earlier I often did yeah but this sounds strange but if you want to know who where to meet famous people when you were born in when I was and remember World War two Lincoln Nebraska was the place to be eating I met Basil Rathbone Bob Hope Spike Jonze Charles Laughton Charles boy hardwick agnes moorehead dane clark henry fonda all came to do shows in lincoln but I couldn't believe that Bob Hope was going to be in Lincoln and the ad said Bob Hope and I quickly looked for that dreadful line a film and and found not a film I thought but I couldn't remember my friend Lyle Burke and I went we got good seats and five vaudeville acts came on and the curtain went down and I didn't know from information we thought it was over luckily we came back and they voice said and now the star of our show Bob Hope and Bob Hope glided on to the stage and Lyle said my god there he is and I just got the chills now ran around backstage hope came down the stairs at the end I said fine show Bob he said hey thanks son and I told all my friends the next day about chatting with Bob Hope tonight and years later on the Kent Kinney of this I think it's my jacket I run around to look in the wings to see if Bob Hope actually showed up because he was supposed to be my next guest and there he was and he came out on to thanks for the memory of course I told him this story and they said fine show Bob he said thanks son he said hey was that you what a man in your in your book it's it's a collection of I would say spectacular celebrity anecdotes and stories with childhood stories which are almost all of them I think all of them there's a there's a beautiful innocence to them most people don't know that side of you you're very sweet innocent but when you're not being nasty or putting people down you're very sweet yeah and it's that kind of innocence I thought but you ever you ever think about that do you feel that American life is well that American life is different and if so why what was it about that time because those those columns and I know all these people will read them because they're gonna buy the book and get you to sign it later obviously that's why they're here right but I run out now but don't leave now but honestly there's there's a there's a beautiful innocence in them what do you think there's also guilt isn't there it was a different time I don't know that it was a better time except we didn't have a lot of the horrors that we have now it seemed but yeah I grew up in a cliched neighborhood street with elm trees and people's had dogs and everybody did it seemed and you left your house open when you went on vacation for two weeks and neighbors came in and watered the plants and you didn't lock up and surely that's a different world I don't know why it's so different now but there's also guilt and the fact that I really realized there are two pieces in the book in which I commit crimes that were punishable had the I needed killing I read the story and you know what let it go we're better off without them you promise not to bring well they're gonna read it in the book anyway but she didn't suffer somebody believes this just leave it at that okay let that barrel um well okay here's a question that three years ago Charlie Rose asked of you I'm typically not a fan of his way of questioning he usually says things like but no that is what but he asked you a question three years ago when you came out with your last bringing any bills right when you came out with your last collection about how TV has changed and what was it well he asked two questions I think I've asked you the first question of the time would you would you diera think now that you'd like to do a show something like the show that you did and that we've all admired you on does that go through your head and what's different about TV today what was it I mean so many people rave about your show your show was was unique notice I didn't modify it unique you can't modify thank you for that but but so many people say there was nothing like your show and I and I think that's true but the question is part of that has to do with you there's not another you and you bring a number of gifts but but there is something it seems to me about TV then perhaps that can't be duplicated now or door would you agree with that do you think that things are just disassembling it it's different now late-night talk shows have evolved somehow and in fact by the way there was an article in The New Yorker must be a year and a half ago now that I discovered by sheer shock and accident Dick Cavett and late night television a piece that was not the title that was the subtitle and I learned in that article about how it's changed that late night tuck as distinct from when it was Jack Paar and Johnny Carson is not a cash cow anymore it may be on the way out event before too long and that the stunning fact was that because there were so few things in those days we were just out of the CBS NBC ABC that was your choice three channels time I had in the in the time that I was canceled finally and for the last time by ABC more viewers than Letterman or Leno or anybody else could have in recent years because it's a television who's just you can see anything you want that's a startling fact to me well and then there's the other thing which people say to me you never notice nobody gets more than seven minutes now on a talk show and I used to do 90 minutes and find it much easier than doing seven minutes I didn't always do 90 minutes obviously but all all those shows that I had one guest were a lark I'd loved it they could loosen the guest up if they were nervous and then see them get better and then see them get more comfortable and then have them say afterwards how you got me to talk about that one thing I'll never know you made me too comfortable but I don't do you watch TV for different reasons now I don't know I don't watch anything on television regularly I mean religiously I I since I know all the talk show people I watch them frequently but well the breath of guests that you had obviously in that song earlier I had to go through in order to get all those rhymes I had to go through every one of your guests and I couldn't get over the breath I mean from Evel Knievel to William F Buckley and Simon Wiesenthal I mean it on and on I was marveling and marveling and marveling at how you would go from show biz personality to some kind of you know cultural genius it it doesn't seem to me that we have folks like that except for Charlie Rose but Charlie Rose doesn't do comedy or stick I mean it's very serious yeah you did both and I think that's what I love most about your show and about you is that you've got that breadth of interest I mean that you're as happy talking to Groucho about nothing or anything as talking to somebody really serious that seems to me him to have gone out of TV well like you as it as you like you I'm stunned at my guest list when I look back at it my god Daniel Ellsberg at Fratton I had him the murderer captain Geoffrey McDonald I thought you meant Norman Mailer is he here no check carefully the Mafia Don Columbo oh I didn't know you had him yeah exactly The Rime I was looking for I can't believe it really what would you rhyme with Columbo Cousteau Marcel Marceau oh that was a good triple rhyme dang I'm furious that I did you not have jacques-yves cousteau and your lyric I did yeah here's a thing for language people only and the rest will be bored stiff by it he told me on a show about an island they had discovered in the Caribbean and he said watch for it here it comes it was a whale graveyard they'd never seen anything like it one whole side of this island and he said the literal is literally littered with their bones now wait a minute because we're not gonna have transcripts of this so say that the Li TT o RAL did he literally he had no idea that he had said anything remarkable and that's the funniest part that's the best holy cow got it just I love that I just did have Marcel Marceau on obviously was a talk show so he didn't mind his way through it no no I did have Iman but I'm keeping it quiet my wife just went oh that's very encouraging but how does that work I mean the fact that they gave you the freedom to talk to people who were I don't remember when was your ABC show on there wasn't late late night was it where was actually was it was it was 11 or 11:30 lapis it Carson strangely enough the Tonight Show when I first heard of it and watched Jack Paar on it started at 11:15 isn't that it's forgotten fact Jack so hated that 15 minutes because it was only carried by half of the affiliates so he blew his monologue on half the country he protested and finally they dropped it and started at 11:30 but yeah I did 11:30 to 1 the traditional one up opposite Johnny and at another point among Johnny myself and Merv Griffin so you could switch all around and see different types of shows but when I look at that guest list I forgotten so many this is kind of interesting well why don't you be the judge I was sitting there beside Johnny Carson one of the times I was cancelled and Johnny would always perhaps as a fellow Nebraska and having me on ever after a counselor want to come on Monday Richard yeah and it's true he would have you right yeah and I would go on The Tonight Show he brought me out first even though had other illustrious guests and he was so easy with me that his staff would say I wish you were on every he's a different man when you're on somebody pointed out Johnny's only leans back in the back of his chair when Cavett is on we had a great friendship and but he would say if this next one doesn't work it's Armed Forces Radio for Richard he would mm-hmm but you really were friends I mean that's yeah it's remarkable it's one thing to meet the greats but to be friends with Johnny Carson of all the opaque personalities yeah he's not somebody that made a lot of friends or are we getting that wrong no Johnny was as awkward socially as almost Richard Nixon dude no no Nixon took the prize for that and criminality but are you gonna plot a lot of Nixon you gotta be careful a man's here you gotta be careful yeah well we're talking about Johnny said one night waving the dock to bring the band down a little during a commercial break because he liked them to play loud so he wouldn't have to talk to the guests during the breaks not a bad idea by the way you blow stuff that way Richard do you ever forget who you had on and I said this is during the 12:30 long break so we could talk well sure there's so many and he said no no I mean that night and he was not literally but figures really sweating a little and I saw that he was worried and I said well I suppose and he said well the reason I asked I went home the other night he had an Irish dorm and he had told me about and he said my doorman said that so who do you have on the show tonight mr. Carson and I said well we had the usual four we had dem Jesus and he said I couldn't think of any of the four yes it was an hour earlier and I had to go upstairs I had a drink I finally came up with JP Morgan was one of the guests but he was worried he drank a lot when I worked with him he had a wife on the ledge now and then he had lots of tension like a wire about to snap and he'd be in his dressing room when I took the material down for that night and his underwear shirt saying these things are killing me which they did his Paul miles if we want to thank a tobacco company and pull himself together come into the wings hated to have to say that all of the guests before him I knew to always ask him about a card slide or something which relaxed him and then he'd stand there damp out the cigarette ban played and he'd go out and be the happiest he ever was for in the latter years one hour a day formerly 90-minute he told me once Richard the biggest mistake I ever made was cutting back to an hour he realized how much he hated it that was his decision yeah he demanded that and then he was sorry and four days a week but oh I made him feel better I wanted to and I had something luckily to do it with I said oh god yes yeah I know I know exactly what you mean as I came home one night from one of my one-person shows and people in the apartment said and said hey they cut the show go and I said fine they said who was it and I said my god they sat right there was it was it somebody I mentioned earlier it was an obscure name so gets me off the hook a little Lucille Ball oh well no wonder yeah Wow I could not bring it into consciousness but it started the evolving of my theory that I think most actors know and would understand that's not you out there you never you completely even in a track show and the you that does the show stays at the theater you go home and you come back you put that mask on again and you do it and the one that went home can't be expected to remember it very odd but are you you now I know these people don't allow these people don't know me but I'm much taller when I go home yeah four five inches how do you do that I have no idea oh my god mast ordinary that's a side of you I hadn't seen right the tall side well we're it's it's so frustrating talking to you because all I can think of is that it has to come to an end you are oh I'm sorry you are as good oh yes I'm sorry I know please you were doing so well can I tell one story about a great comedian and I'm a phrase that everybody must know it whenever I write a column during their people Groucho Marx tell us about Groucho Marx tell more about Groucho Marx and I've written a lot about Groucho and I can never quite believe that I met not only Stan Laurel for an afternoon and there's a cop a piece about that in the book that made people cry you got a book out and Wow you really know how to hurt a guy and this is Groucho and the seance it's fun to tell you some people know what I'm about to say somebody well yeah but it's so good it's a good Jackie Leonard it's better the boys were in vaudeville the brothers the four brothers and they were huge stars making 2,000 a week in the Depression when my father was making 80 cents the day or something and so people wanted to meet them and people would come backstage and a woman came back and said mr. Marx are you interested in the supernatural buyer for any reason he said well I am in fact I've been reading about dr. Ryan and some other thing he said well there's going to be a seance here in Minneapolis perhaps vaudeville tour here's the address but I don't know quite how to say I said I know what you're going to say you know I'm an idiot on stage but I can be respectful and be a normal person and no one would know him because the rest - was painted on man so nobody ignorant but he went it was in a huge home and there were black drapes and one or two candles and the devoted and the believers were sitting out front reverently and I think her name was ina Eva Fey if not that was a famous seance trance medium and she looked he said like Margaret Dumont in the Groucho and the Marx Brothers movie and her gown and she stood and said at certain point of incantation I am in touch with the Otherworld I am in touch with the other world does anyone does that it wasn't have a question and a familiar voice said what is the capital of North Dakota well he said I escaped with my life we have to have time for you to sign all the books that these fine people are going to purchase any minute before we do that let me ask a final question shoot what's capital in North Dakota no not that question I've never wanted to know somebody said Bismarck yeah somebody was right but you do a lot of things now you write this column I I know that you're busy we don't see enough of you those of us who are here who know your work it's just a joy to see you out there you're as wonderful a guest as you are a host which is saying tons and I think the question would be and in fact is what would you like to do you you you have you're cursed with so many talents you could do almost everything most people here don't know you were a champion gymnast that's true so you've got a few other than you know the pommel horse what would you like to do what are the sorts of things you'd like to write would you like to write a play would you like to be Knapp I'm just curious do you do you think about this so you just let it ride and you yeah thumbs up I've actually thought of calling you at times it's saying what should I do that I haven't done because your and I promised god I would never use this word awesome writer how do we get the yes sorry thanks I didn't catch that what I wish I can't believe what thank you dick and some of my products are also available out there but i know i'm i am a writer but i have no idea of what that has to do with what i would think you ought to be doing but i think you're a guy who seems to know what he wants to do and you do phenomenal things and you do them so well that's why but go ahead and you know you're not bad-looking I tried to time that move in his mouth was full of water that's right let me give you a that will make it worth coming tonight either I dare you oh I don't think you can do it go ahead I did a show on PBS recently called dick Cavett's Watergate did anyone catch that yes yeah this sounds immodest but it's one of the best things I've ever been connected with it's a brilliant hour about the great unindicted co-conspirator and criminal streak President Richard Milhous Nixon and his criminal vice president and as Bob Woodward Carl Bernstein says on the show the day after the landslide election that Nixon tape which should be now we're back and we got this great landslide and we can do wonderful things for the country it's how can we screw this son of a [ __ ] who didn't follow said will ruin this guy's auto business tech Tom put time on that and you know so and and and they foul mouth wretched personality president who sprang from the womb screaming I want to be President and then blew it is is in this thing in a bit somebody pointed out a guy who knew my tapes called said do you realize how much Watergate you've got you had all of the baddies on the show two people not myself put together this wonderful hour some people have watched it two or three times go home not in this sentence and dick Cavett's Watergate you will find it and you will really love it and actually it is terrific but it is true that somebody is cutting together a number of shows like that is is that correct Dick Cavett the mother Dick Cavett Watergate for a time I thought he must be my best friend in the world and we love that haven't we yeah that's just the kind of guy he was yeah he stayed in my house in Montauk one night and it was kind of an accident we were doing a documentary out there and I went to get his wife from the motel they were checked into and bring her over to stay at the house so I left him alone in it my late wife called phones picked up and she here and she says darling and he says his ain't darlin [Applause] she said may I ask he said it's the only three-time heavyweight champion of the world and I'm lying in your bed and I'm watching your TV and she said well mr. Ali knowing I will put a plaque on that bed which is more than she ever did for me oh gosh dagnabbit we've got to stop listen you're going to be we're gonna we're gonna sneak backstage while they set up a book signing table there's if you buy a book there'll be a line sneaking back to Broadway and right there and up here and you get to shake the hand of the man who slept in the same bed as Muhammad Ali and any question unfortunately not we've already gone over time but who has since you were so obnoxious about it we'll take your question my first impression of Oscar Levant really was that he was dead by the time I did talk shows and since I'd already had a man died while I was taping the show in front of the audience I thought bringing Oscar back would be too much but I met him backstage on the old part a night show the night he said I just saw a Frank Sinatra movie that was so bad I went out and made a citizen's arrest of the cashier that sounds just like Oscar Levin yeah it's amazing in all seriousness we're out of time it kills me I think I'd like to get a TV show just so I can have you on all the time and we can continue this conversation this as far as I'm concerned has been a delight thank you dick thank you nothing to say here slowly then these are your people yeah thank you

Channel: Socrates in the City

Views: 16,763

Keywords: dick cavett, the dick cavett show, eric metaxas sitc, sitc eric metaxas, the eric metaxas show, socrates in the city, socrates, sitc, dick cavett and eric metaxas, brief encounters

Id: xvdd58H_KGw

Length: 76min 25sec (4585 seconds)

Published: Wed Dec 04 2019