Depression vs. Narcissistic Self-Negativity | Dr. Elsa Ronningstam

you know I think and I've seen people fall into extreme Despair and I think it was like a narcissistically driven despair because a huge crisis happened in their life like either it was a financial loss a personal loss of a like a person loss and um it absolutely blew the lid off of you know these people and my concern was always oh they're going to go to a clinician and the clinician is going to diagnose this as something that doesn't have any notion of narcissism in the diagnosis and so they may not get the help they need to get I'm sure and my concern was also at the time that they could be suicidal so can you just talk a little bit about the relationship between um depression and narcissism the problem with the concept depression is that it's very very broadly used and we have to differentiate between somebody who has major depressive disorder which is a neurobiochemical conditions and which does respond to TMS ECT ketamine treatment and the medication and when people recover from a major depressive episode they feel like themselves again so their character their personality hasn't really changed but there has been something changing in their whole experience and so on and that differs from people who struggle with them serious life experience a loss tragedy of something and feel depressed they feel down low sad negative pessimistic angry but there may or there may not be anybody on any biochemical aspects to that and they may or may not respond to medication but there it is a matter of processing those really difficult feelings did NPD or pathological narcissist there we have another type of sort of more organized self-negativity which has to do with avoidance very critical negative attitudes blaming others feeling stuck or refusing to do things and and but blaming it on or label it as depression I have seen a colleagues have also seen numerous or patients who have been in treatment for depression with medication or TMS or whatever and it hasn't helped because it is what we call characterological there is an investment in in negativity that is called depression or my field as depression but it Source certain purposes about controlling things it could they are avoiding by saying that I am depressed nobody can expect me to work I am entitled to specific attention or my family has to pay for me because I can't work because I am depressed and etc etc and then there is a really important part of treatment to explore motives for self-negativity motives for advantages secondary gains too basically yes and and patience and we could engage the patient's own motivation and sense of agency that this is something they are involved moved in as opposite to when you get a neurobiochemical depressed condition and also to to encourage patients to talk about them life events disappointments and losses Etc that they in one or another way integrate in in their own way of looking at themselves in negative terms

Channel: BorderlinerNotes

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Length: 4min 51sec (291 seconds)

Published: Tue Apr 04 2023