WHY DID GUILLIMAN TAKE OVER AS LORD COMMANDER? WAS IT THE RIGHT DECISION?

hey everyone ro here before we begin today our next week's special has finally arrived and will begin on monday as we kick off our chapter war like our traitor legion war before we will pit the loyal chapters against each other and you will vote to see who is the strongest which chapter is the imperium's best hope however with that said on to today today we discuss why robute gilman was made lord commander and we ask in hindsight was it still the right decision general spoiler warning to begin as the events we're discussing today are from across the warhammer 40k universe so you have been warned but with that said let's just jump straight in so the history of the imperium tells us that robute gilliman will be appointed the lord commander in the aftermath of the heresy assuming the title from his brother rogel dorner now rogel was given the title during the heresy in order to be able to marshal the imperium's defense of terror as the emperor's praetorian we know he was on the throne world when the conflict broke out and he was one of the primarks who clearly had the emperor's complete trust so it made sense for dorne to assume such a position whilst the emperor was indisposed upon the throne which okay makes it sound like he was on the toilet but you get my understanding so the question is why did rabute then assume the role after the heresy in place of his brother rogel well before we begin as of yet we don't actually have a true answer within the law once the siege is over ending the heresy series and we move into the scouring then we'll finally get to see the events first hand finding out the true motives and rationale behind many decisions ones that will guide the imperium's future so as confident as we might be until then we're really left to our opinions and best assumptions now what we have seen within the law is that quite clearly rogel himself believed that gilman was the best man for the job or at least we're certainly given that impression within the novel master of mankind by aaron dempsky bowden we get a glimpse of dawn having a fairly vocal debate with malcador and the talons of the emperor and during it we hear dawn utterly line you quote my own brother at me rebutta is not here oblivion knight would that he were in his absence i am lord commander of the imperium now for me this isn't dawn stating he's only the lord commander in robute's absence as a fact it's more him giving his opinion that he feels his brother is the better man for such a position or at least he concedes if robute were here then there would at least be a discussion about it it's pretty clear rogel holds his brother in high regard in virtually every novel throughout the siege of terror it feels like there's a line from rogel praising gilman never doubting his brother is on the way that he will reach terror and well this respect very much appears to be reciprocated gilman had roger as one of his favored dauntless few which we saw from the novel know no fear by dan abnet the brothers he knew if he fought beside he could win any war he refers to them as the dauntless few the ones he can most truly depend upon to do what they were made to do dawn and his legion are one and within dark imperium plague wars by guy haley we hear giliman utter lord rogel dawn and i for example both inherited his capacity for strategy and contingency planning but in combination our talents were unique dawn was a greater builder than i ever was and i a far better administrator so even from these two brief comments it's clear gilman also holds rogel in very high esteem and perhaps it's that last remark that gives us the most logical answer the one most people would naturally assume and i a far better administrator gilman is renowned as most likely the best administrator amongst the primarks all the primarks were generals beyond our comprehension as he himself stated in that quote many excelled particularly in strategy and contingency rogul being won but gilman's particular talent was in the outside the battlefield arena the want for a better expression larger picture the empire building aspect the infrastructure there's a reason gilman had ultramar and his brothers did not and it's not because he's the best military general it's because he thinks beyond the battle while many of his brothers concentrated on the completion of a campaign conquering a world before moving on to their next orders which many could do faster than gilman gilman ensured that every world he left behind was ready and able to contribute to the imperium he ensured that garrisons were left supply lines created that each new system became embedded within the 500 worlds of ultramar that seamlessly the operations and relations adapted not only for the fervent of his crusade but for the betterment of the people and thus the imperium and as such whereas other brothers would have to wait for resupply or reinforcement gilliman was able to prosecute multiple campaigns seamlessly quite simply gilman excelled at the day-to-day stuff he knew how to run an empire now it's a common mistake to think gilman was the only primark to have his own territory because he wasn't many of his other brothers controlled more than just their homeworld rogueldorn actually being one the difference is none rivaled ultramar in size and gilman just did that particular aspect better perturbo was most likely gilliman's mirror in his brothers for the administration talent however as we know he wasn't exactly an option after the heresy so with all that in mind it would make logical sense for gilman to be the lord commander you can completely understand given rogel's respect for him and gilman's particular talent area why rogel would possibly concede his position to rebutta there is also the circumstances to be considered the repercussions of the siege quite simply rogel was a broken man now don't get me wrong here i'm not saying rogal had suddenly become useless because he had not he's still a primark he was still a demigod amongst demigods but from everything we currently know we know he becomes overwhelmed with grief at the emperor's internment to the golden throne his feelings whether rightly or wrongly of failure we've seen throughout the siege of terror series that rogel is feeling the weight of the imperium on his shoulders and it is weighing on him more and more as the siege continues rogel feels responsible for not only the imperium but for their father's survival and in that with the emperor becoming broken silent rogel will feel he failed rogueldorn himself will find his brother sanguinius dead he will find the emperor's broken body he will carry him from the vengeful spirit listen to his last words and place him within the golden throne and rogueldorn will feel responsible for all of it and this isn't like his brothers this isn't gilman feeling the pressure in the current timeline this isn't lionel johnson and russ's grief when they make it back to the throne world because he was the praetorian he was the one withdrawn from the crusade to fortify terror it was his duty to protect his father his emperor and he will feel like he failed that he failed him that he failed humanity while rogel will still have all the talents he always had and go on to give the imperium many victories it's undoubted his mindset is going to be dramatically altered in the heresy's aftermath he is very much in a sense broken and for me this will be symbolically represented by the iron cage incident the conflict against perturbo where the imperial fists will almost be entirely wiped out as always opinions are mixed on dawn's true intentions here but it certainly appears his grief and rage against his traitor brother led him to make a decision he quite possibly wouldn't have made before for me in really taking into account just how much dawn is expected to be affected by the heresy's outcome i genuinely expect him to relinquish the position of lord commander out of his sense of failure out of his feelings of guilt rogel will feel his failed and that he doesn't deserve to be in that position when you combine that with the respect he has for his brother gilman it's logical to assume he'd hand it over to robute or at least relinquish the position with the understanding that robute would be his successor and considering i don't expect the lion to still be around to object i think all the other brothers left jagatai korax vulcan and russ would have no issues with it with none of them wanting the position themselves it would be unanimous now side note i don't think gilliman will reveal he's been messing around trying to build his own imperium which was why he was late because then i'd think rather than make him lord commander there's a good chance rogal might just take his head off but i digress that to me is the most logical reason for gilman to ultimately assume the lord commander position now the alternative is when rogel brings his father's mangled body before the golden throne as malcador's final strength imbues the emperor enough to utter his final instructions maybe the emperor simply tells dawn that gilman is the one to become lord commander he is the one best suited for the role we know the emperor has foreseen the future a time when long-lost heroes return which undoubtedly would have been gilman returning in the current timeline he could make a decision based off of that that making gillaman lord commander is a step towards that final fight back against chaos considering one of the descriptions the emperor used in his and gilliman's reunion was my greatest son it wouldn't surprise me if this was the direction the narrative went personally i don't see why the emperor would feel the need for dawn to step down as i think dawn would be more than capable of the role despite his feelings of guilt during the siege i think he did a fantastic job and the emperor would most likely know that dawn would give it to gilliman anyway so i don't think he would feel the need to give him an order however the possibility is there so with rogel handing over the position to his brother gilleman given what we know ten thousand years later was it the right decision well this is a full-on discussion in itself regardless of the decay and state of it the fact is the imperium survived for the next ten thousand years so it'd be hard to argue that gilman wasn't the best choice he implemented his codex astartes and the imperium held off every threat that arose admittedly it could be argued that abaddon was playing the long game and actually was having a victory with each and every black crusade but hey the imperium was doing all right until kadie's destruction although the sons of dawn did have to implement the last war protocol to save it bringing back all their successors to essentially reinstall the legion so there is that argument personally i think the abolishment of the legions was probably a mistake one that gilman himself has privately considered and we know dawn most certainly wouldn't have done that so it could be argued that perhaps the imperium would have been better off under rogel there certainly would have been a better chance of truly wiping out the traitor legions or aberdeen with the legions however there is also the prospect of a legion turning traitor which could have been a death sentence for the imperium i find it highly unlikely but hey you can never say never i think it could be a good what if conversation one day what if rogel remained lord commander maybe we'll get around to that one after next week overall i think the big problem was rogel's state of mind had he been the praetorian of old well the argument could be a strong one regardless with hindsight with what we know of history the job that he is doing now robute gilman was and is lord commander of the entire imperium and as long as the imperium continues to survive he's proven to be the best decision but as always everyone what do you think why do you think the imperium turned to robute gilliman to be the lord commander why did rogel step down from the position was it a simple fact that he knew gilman was better suited or did rogel's state of mind play a larger role was it rogel's feelings of failure the traumatic events of the heresy that truly led him to make the decision and in light of gilman revealing the codex astartes did rogel come to think he'd made a mistake as always leave your thoughts in the comments below i love to read them huge thank you to all my subscribers your support truly means a lot to me it really does if you're new please consider subscribing to help the channel grow and if you enjoyed this particular vid then why not drop a like on it too but with that said i am off and i'll see you all again real soon

Channel: Wolf Lord Rho

Views: 36,993

Keywords: ultramarines, imperial fists, roboute guilliman, rogal dorn, space marines, primaris, emperor of mankind, warhammer 40k, primarchs

Id: 3EaTVdN_yRY

Length: 18min 28sec (1108 seconds)

Published: Fri Jul 15 2022