Tuning Hemi engine timing and where to start

okay so i made a video for tuning timing on gm vehicles and i figured i should make a similar one for the dodge now uh what this is going to be is this is going to be based on my personal 5th gen 2019 ram um so we're going to go to the stock file first and we're going to go over a few things now as you get older and older vehicles a lot of this stuff on these tables is going to disappear so keep that in mind uh park throttle base this is regular driving around um now when you driving down the road or idling you get on it your vehicle is going to travel through this area here and in most parts of the country cut across here closer to sea level it's going to be up higher cams things like that it's going to be up higher boost it'll be way higher than 93. one of the first things that i do on these is we get rid of the negative timing um typically you'll never be in this cell um i just i personally i just get rid of it it gets in the way and when you're trying to do multiplication on the table um in large sections uh the multiplication of negative uh cells will actually have an opposite effect because of the negative okay so one of the other things is you got this bump here don't really want that bump there it doesn't really need to be there um so basically i go like this here kind of create a flat one let's let's take a look here let's see if we can do this [Music] we're into a flat section there most vehicles here we're gonna give about three degrees of timing three degrees timing there we're going to copy this section here so from there uh there's still some bumps in here we're gonna grab the whole table we're gonna do a little bit of smoothing okay this right here is gonna be a decent timing table now where the one of the most important places is where your cruise by versus where your air charge is so you need to log air charge to figure out where cruising is to figure out where you're at wide open throttle um and things like that so one of the things is is that typically the area where you cruise let's say 2000 rpms by let's say 30. you're gonna want to be anywhere from one to four degrees higher here than stock because that's where you're going to get your best fuel mileage um through logging is going to be the best and pretty much the only way to figure out where the best mileage is uh basically set it at 26 here drive down the highway at 70 see your mileages set it at 20 do the same thing set at 28 blah blah blah and go back and forth because what you're doing is you're trying to find the best fuel economy there because that's the max based timing on the dyno is the only way that you're going to find the maximum the best timing for max horsepower typically on 5 7 hemi trucks it's between 19 and about 22 and a half degrees so these numbers are actually kind of low here uh but you know it's something that you have to play with yourself so what we're going to do next is i'm going to show you the part throttle spark table for my personal 5th gen heming is that okay so yeah this yes this is my personal fifth gen hemi um so this um i actually do have to make some changes here a little bit um but let me see if i can pull this side by side here i've been working on my hemi here trying to get this dialed in recently runs and drives great gets great gas mileage um you can kind of see the differences between the two i really this is kind of really the way the best way to see it you see how nice and smooth this is here well we want this to match this but uh the part throttle table the most important area is here um one of the things to keep in mind is dodge will actually reference part throttle and wide open throttle table when you get on it and try to average between the two but that's something that we'll go and do more later next i get decent gas mileage on this table but i'm going to be making some changes on it after i seen kind of where it was i didn't realize that it was kind of crappy wide open throttle so you can see here we're at wide open throttle between the two um you can see we are roughly in some places two to three degrees higher um you can see how there's this this difference here uh what ended up happening is that a friend of mine used the vehicle and uh he drives a lot harder than i do and um i like to run my tunes hot because i don't beat on my vehicles very often and ended up putting a hole in the pistons so we ended up actually removing some timing um when we put the new motor in the in just in case someone else drives vehicle okay so let me let me reopen let me open a different file here okay we're gonna open up the file that it made the most file on the on the dyno now the dyno had 30 it had 37 zones on the dyno so it made right around 300 horse so this is what made the most power on the dyno now one of the things that need to keep in mind is this crap here needs to go away and um i'm not exactly sure why i didn't have it gone um so this isn't zero here this was before this was like a year ago so this is before i was zeroing this out this area here needs to get repaired because this this orange should be pretty pretty consistent here um you know what i mean it should be a when you get on it it's going to come across here in the part of the country i'm in it's going to go straight across here okay so it's just going to be going 16 to like 22 degrees out of nowhere um so we don't want that okay this is what we i mean it's kind of good that that file is like that so i can show you uh that just means that i'm going to do some more tuning on my truck tonight you want it to be smooth that's what you need you need it to be smooth um now the thing is is one of the other things is you're going to need to or here you know what let me uh go back to this quick here um hemis did i close my other one here we go barometric pressure is very important on hemis okay so after you get your wide open throttle and your part throttle timings tuned where you want it the next thing is you want to go to barometric pressure here okay yep this is the older file okay so this file pulls timing based on barometric pressure okay well the higher up you are the lower your very much pressure is here the lower closer sea level the higher the number is here okay the higher up you are the more timing your engine can take so this none of this makes sense why this is here without here it means because the vehicle is set to sea level from the factory okay so what i end up doing here is i actually have it at two degrees uh and then from here i have it take two degrees away so now part of the country i'm in is actually right around here okay so i'm at 75 to 65 okay so what we're gonna do is we're going to make the zero section the basically these three this is the part of the country i'm in we're gonna make this zero okay and we're going to make this negative one so my timing tables are going to be for where i live okay now if i go up higher in the mountains it's going to add timing to compensate and if i go closer to sea level it's going to take timing away it's very important to do this at least in my opinion that way if you're driving in different areas of the country pulling a trailer things like that your timing can be adjusted for that now if you are pulling a trailer are a little bit different the problem is is putting a trailer on adds more load more load means it's easier for spark so if it's a vehicle that sees a lot of mountains and it's got a trailer you're going to want to probably honestly you're probably going to pull a little bit of timing away you rather pull a little bit timing and save your motor keep that in mind you can make modifications based on engine coolant temperature things like that there's a lot that you can do one of the big things people do on hemis is they take the nox sensors and they desensitize them okay stay away from this at least until i make the the video i'm going to make a video on descending nox sensors why to do it how to do it things like that until i make that video stay stay away from this don't just don't just do it because some forms said to do it you need to do it for the right reasons and you need to know why and how things are that way one of the next things you need to do is i'm going to close these out i'm going to open up the scanner i'm going to attempt to kind of explain the pids a little bit more on the scanner for uh the hemis now the hemi the file that i'm going to bring up probably isn't going to be a hemi unfortunately but i'm just gonna basically pick a uh a random a random file that i have well you know what i might be able to get a heavy on here so let me let me let me try so let's do date modified okay let's try to find my hellcat and these are going to be hellcats in here so let's let's just find a random hellcat file okay at least i think it's a hellcat because october was when i had my hellcat so we need to pick a different layout let's try this layout okay hellcat okay um and i'm here we go so what we have here is my spark table obviously is set up for ram so it's not populating correctly okay but you're to go to graph layouts and you're going to create a graph you're going to create a graph for spark which is your regular table okay you've got and you're going to create one for for wide open throttle as well you're going to create a table and a right open throttle now the information you're going to need of course i shut down the software you're going to go to the table if you're going to go to the table that your spark table is you're going to grab your rpms that are on the top and you're going to populate the data here all you do is right click and click copy column copy column header whatever put that in here then you're going to need your rows which for my vehicles air charge grams and you're going to copy the data there and paste in there you're going to want to have engine speed and air charge in here and in here so that way you can populate it you're going to do the same for spark spark wide open throttle vital throttle now when these populate correctly and this isn't because this is this logs for my hellcat and this layout is for my ram okay um you got your rpm up here and you have your air charge so based on whatever the air charge you're driving around is and your rpm the timing will populate okay same with and retired right of the throttle uh which will help you know where to pull timing things like that obviously this tune kind of this log kind of stuck because i was just cruising at 75 down the highway okay but with the proper timing things you get a little bit of knock there right there with the proper timing um an engine can get really really good gas mileage you can make really good power things like that so you can see here i'm guessing that would get different changes in elevation based on the kpa you can see my kpa keeps going up and down trying to find a steady kpa it's okay let's just say 64 to 67 so 30 degrees of timing at 75 1500 rpms uh my hellcat got 30 to 32 miles per gallon uh and it took me a while to get this figured out you got to add timing take timing away go for a lot of drives but in the end it's super worth it and you can see my field trims here pretty decent um if you have any questions or anything like that please message me subscribe if you need me to go in more depth on things let me know i know i lose track at points so and just end up rambling ran end up rambling rambling there you go

Channel: RecklessMotorsportsUSA

Views: 23,791

Keywords: hemi, tuning, timing, hptuners, diablo, 1320, goat, Hptuners, ls swap, 4160e, ls1, ls2, ls3, ls7, Holley, summit, goat rope, hp academy

Id: 8g_WZV5EguU

Length: 14min 9sec (849 seconds)

Published: Sun Sep 13 2020